11. WIT - ft Special Guest Steve Wohlberg: Exploring The Trinity/Godhead Robert Veith & Marlou Smith

[@edenoutpost]

"It is not safe to catch the spirit from another. We want the Holy Spirit, which is Jesus Christ." - 9LtMs, Lt 66, 1894, par. 18 - EGW

[@edenoutpost]

Galatians 4:6 (KJVS) "And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth THE SPIRIT OF HIS SON into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father."

[@Rey-hb2hg]

AMEN!!!!!!!

[@neildube1897]

What an epiphany! As a lifelong floundering Christian, so many things are now being clarified by following the SDA message. Concering the fact that the Bible is vague on some topics, but exhaustively clear on others was only clarified with this show: The Spirit made me realize that when we prepare for a trip, we pack two essential things. Our authority to visit another place (salvation) and our luggage (thoughts and questions to be answered later). I pray that if I am lucky enough to have Heavenly communion with the Godhead, that all questions and doubts will be erased. Keep on inspiring SDA!

[@godstruth7859]

@@neildube1897 brother in Christ follow only JESUS Christ for it is the Holy Spirit that teaches us all truth not men There will be and now is happening that well respected preachers are going to turn against Christ with their false doctrine We must pray before we read scripture and to anyone preaching .Satan is always there to corrupt the simple truth of the word of God. We are heading for what the Bible calls the time of trouble. Study the scripture for yourself and love it for this is your security in the Lord Keep the faith of Christ and obey his commandment and the Lord will guide you through all things. Be blessed and welcome to the Lord Jesus Christ. John 16:13-15 King James Version 13 Howbeit when he, the Spirit of truth, is come, he will guide you into all truth: for he shall not speak of himself; but whatsoever he shall hear, that shall he speak: and he will shew you things to come. 14 He shall glorify me: for he shall receive of mine, and shall shew it unto you. 15 All things that the Father hath are mine: therefore said I, that he shall take of mine, and shall shew it unto you.

[@TheGateKeeper001]

I agree that it is "so clear". The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ it is His representative 13 MR 313.3 1895, "Christ has left His Holy Spirit to be His Representative in the world" LT 84 Oct. 22, 1895. "We want the Holy Spirit which is Jesus Christ" LT 66, April 10, 1894. We could go on, but when we utilize Isaiah 28:10, the chain of truth scripture it makes the not so plain scriptures plain, "I will not leave your comfortless, I will come to you".

[@duhulsfantmaiubeste3173]

The Holy Spirit testifying Jesus Christ, Jesus Christ doesn't testify Himself!

[@tracijohnson6236]

Amen!

[@TheGateKeeper001]

@@duhulsfantmaiubeste3173 He is talking about Himself when He referred to the comforter.

[@TheGateKeeper001]

@@duhulsfantmaiubeste3173 Or Jesus the human (second Adam) needs to leave so that Jesus the omnipresent can be everywhere at the same time taking up residence in the hearts that will open the door to Him.

[@TheGateKeeper001]

The question isn't is there a Holy Spirit, its who is the Holy Spirit? Lets not complicate things, Jesus refereed to His Father as Father, God referred to His Son as His Son, John 20:21-23 say's that Jesus Breathed on them His Holy Spirit.

[@qhazwel]

I might have missed this point: but, we cannot assume that the Angels were always confused about Jesus. It was Lucifer who led these very wise angels to believe things that were untrue about Jesus this is why it was necessary for God the father to clarify his position. This is why he is The Great Deceiver. If he can deceive Angels he can deceive us.

[@robinpatterson9193]

The Trinity/Trinity Doctrine originated with the Catholic Church! If we go by the Bible and the Bible alone “trinity” is not in the Bible! So why would we adopt this word as a Bible believer! Godhead yes is Biblical ! Why should we try and be like the world! There are mysteries we are told we should not try and figure out! We are too obey the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus!

[@beataq5011]

John 5:26 KJVS - For as the Father hath life in himself; so hath he given to the Son to have life in himself;

[@marie-simonne8612]

Our pioneers were very vocal about the Trinity destroying the atonement. This is still true today. If Jesus had had eternity like the Father, He could never have died on the cross: and this is what our pioneers discovered when they began to study the sanctuary. This is what made us a people set apart. Now we are no different from any other church. In the Peace Council (Zechariah 6:13), there are 2; at creation, there are 2; on the throne, there are 2 again, and at the end time (Revelation 22). From beginning to end, there are only two. I have a hard time believing that our theologians could accept this Catholic belief as ours. This belief-the Trinity-brings us into ecumenism. In the end time, who we really worship will come back to haunt Adventists. The seal of the angel will never be placed on anyone who does not believe in the first commandment.

[@Oscar-hj7fp]

You have spoken as a true pioneer, sadly our leaders accepted the false trinity and enshrined it in 1980, keep spreading the truth sister!

[@wally8224]

Amen. The Atonement by J.H. Waggoner is worth the read.

[@justinstrauss5936]

I am the resurrection, and the life” (John 11:25). He who had said, “I lay down my life, that I might take it again” (John 10:17), came forth from the grave to life that was in Himself. Humanity died; divinity did not die. In His divinity, Christ possessed the power to break the bonds of death. He declares that He has life in Himself to quicken whom He will. . 1SM 301.1

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

Hello sister, I wanted to leave this comment with you just to try and show you that the Doctrine of the Godhead (The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit) is biblical, and can be found in both the old and New Testament. Starting with the Old Testament you can see this immediately in Genesis 1. The word God is translated from the word Elohim, and this is a plural word for the Lord God (meaning at least more than 1). Within the first verse we see that God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth, and we also see that the “Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Right here we see God, and the Spirit of God already. Moving down to verse 26 (the 6th day of creation), we see God (Elohim) say “let US make man in OUR image.” There are multiple plural words being used here, but one singular image. In verse 27 it says “so God (Elohim) created man in His own image, in the image of God (Elohim) created He him; male and female he created them.” Big difference from the “let us make man in our image,” it says He (singular) created them in His (singular) own image (singular). So we already see this trend that God (Elohim) has one image, but multiple are present in this process of creation, yet there is also one who is specifically doing the creation. Just to repeat, there is One who created Adam and Eve, but in the verse before it says us (more than one), our (more than one), image (just one, singular). The one who created us Jesus Christ as found in Isaiah 9:6, John 1:1-3, Hebrews 8-12. Another thing to note is that many will say that Elohim is used to describe 1 in numerical value, but in the Hebrew language there is a singular word for God, that being El (used in verses like Deuteronomy 32:15, Nehemiah 9:17 Job 3:4, Isaiah 44:8, and 52 other verses). Also note that when in the Bible it says one, it doesn’t always mean numerically 1 (Genesis 2:24 and John 10:30 for example). Moving past the creation story, you can go to Genesis 6:3 where it says “and the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man…” In the Tower of Babel, it also says in Genesis 11:7 “let US go down, and confuse their language..” In Psalm 51:11 it says “cast me not away from thy presence; And take not thy Holy Spirit from me.” In Exodus 31:3, Isaiah 11:2, and Ezekiel 36:27 as well as many other verses in the Old Testament alone speak about the Spirit of God. In the New Testament you can see all three members of the Godhead in the baptism of Jesus. As Jesus comes out of the water the heavens was opened unto him and “Spirit of God descended like a dove (and this isn’t the first time the Holy Spirit came upon someone in a literal form as seen in Acts 2:3-4), and a voice from heaven (God the Father) saying This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased with.” In the great commission in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus says “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” In these two passages there are 3 mentioned, in one verse each play a role in testifying that Jesus is God, and in the other Jesus tells His disciples to baptize in the name of these 3. In John 14:25 Jesus says “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” The Holy Spirit comes from the Father, and He plays the role of helping all followers of Christ throughout the ages. This same helper that Jesus promises is the Spirit of Truth that he mentioned in John 14:16-17. The Holy Spirit (who Jesus sends from the Father) also testifies of Jesus (John 15:26). This makes things even more evident that the Bible teaches about the Godhead because when you look at what was just said, Jesus says that once He goes to the Father, He will send the spirit of truth / the comforter / the Holy Spirit which comes from the Father, and the Holy Spirit will testify to us of Jesus. In the next chapter, in John 16:7-11, Jesus tells us just how important it is that He leaves so the Holy Spirit is sent to us, and what the Holy Spirit does. In verse 7 and 8 it says “It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.” Notice also that Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a he, and says the role that it plays in all of our lives. Jesus being the Word that was there since the beginning (John 1:1-3) and spoke all things into creation (Genesis 1:1-24) was very direct and intentional with His words (Luke 4:32, John 7:46, John 8:58). If Jesus wanted to make a clear distinction that the Holy Spirit wasn’t a person and just a spirit then He would have made that distinction when He spoke in John 14, 15, and 16. There are many other verses that speak on the Holy Spirit as well, such as Ephesians 1:13-14, Romans 8:26, 1 Peter 1:12, 2 Peter 1:21, and many more. I hope this response was enough to answer all four questions you asked, but I just want to reiterate that while we serve one God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one (and this isn’t a new concept as shown in Genesis 2:24, John 17:21-22, Galatians 3:28, and 1 Corinthians 12:12). Also if the Holy Spirit wasn’t God-much less a being-then how could it make sense that the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31-32, Mark 3:28-29, and Luke 12:10). The only one we can blaspheme is God (Luke 5:20-21, John 10:33-36, Matthew 26:63-65). If then Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a separate entity from Himself and the Father, says that He comes in the place of Jesus, refers to Him (the Holy Spirit) as a He, and the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve Him (who convicts the world of sin, and of judgment, and of righteousness, and testifies of Jesus), then is it really unreasonable or unbiblical to say that the Holy Spirit is a real person in Heaven alongside the Father and the Son (especially since you can find so many scriptures speaking about him)? While we can never understand just what exactly the Holy Spirit is, or how he works (John 3:5-8). I mentioned John 3:5-8 because the word wind is translated from the word pneuma which is also translated and used to say spirit, angel, God, Christ’s spirit, the Holy Spirit. We can’t understand how He works, but we can feel His effect even as we feel the wind.I hope you have found these scriptures a blessing, and proof that the Bible does teach about the Godhead, and this isn’t a false doctrine but the truth. May the love of God, the grace of Jesus, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you sister.

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

also to show that sister White also wrote about this I’ll leave a few quotes from her. The Father can not be described by the things of earth. The Father is all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, and is invisible to mortal sight. The Son is all the fullness of the Godhead manifested. The word of God declares Him to be “the express image of His person.” “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” Here is shown the personality of the Father. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 1 The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fullness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a personal Saviour. There are three living persons of the heavenly trio. In the name of these three powers,-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will cooperate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 2 The prince of the power of evil can only be held in check by the power of God in the third person of the Godhead, the Holy Spirit. SpTA10 37.1 SpTA10 37 Evil had been accumulating for centuries, and could only be restrained and resisted by the mighty power of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fulness of divine power. Another spirit must be met; for the essence of evil was working in all ways, and the submission of man to this satanic captivity was amazing. SpTA10 25.2 There are many other quotes in which the Holy Spirit is referred to as a he, as an individual, and other things of that nature. While we cannot understand fully the Holy Spirit, or how the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are three separate entities, yet one God, the Bible still teaches it and should not be called a doctrine of apostasy. I pray this will be a blessing to you

[@Virtuouswomaninchrist]

Waiting and praying for all: Presenters, viewers; everyone. 😊💪👍🙏

[@getwetter22]

What a wonderful topic and guest speaker. Thanks guys Maranatha

[@cathyhouseholder3729]

Very good and clear message. Thank you for sharing and teaching about the Trinity. Three distinct entities, one in unity and purpose.

[@hubertyoung1938]

So, why did Jesus say what He said in John 17: 3? And this is life eternal, that they may know Thee the only true God and Jesus Christ whom Thou hast sent?

[@patsda6405]

God the Father is the one true God in the sense that He is the source of all life including the life of His Son. But Jesus is God because He was begotten of the Father, Genesis 1 says everything after its kind. Humans beget humans, cats beget cats, divinity begets divinity.

[@jovaniaumutoni8836]

Robert & Marlou, we are so happy for your ministry. I have been watching what's up prof from day 1, and now I have added your program, I enjoy it. God bless you to allow Him use you for reaching to people's hearts. Am watching from a country called Rwanda(East Africa).

[@WinsomeWitnessing]

the book "the story of redemption" by Ellen G White also gives a good rendition of what happened in heaven in the first 2 chapters

[@dikvis7]

Her version....

[@Oscar-hj7fp]

The truth was given by God to the pioneers, sister White stated the truth given to them was the absolute truth given by God and it was to last to the end. We compare them to what happened after 1915 and we can clearly see the change! Will you believe them or the new theologians, leaders and organization? It is your choice, study sisters and brothers and you will be led to the truth as God gave it, not as men think it is, blessings to all.

[@wally8224]

Revelation 14:13 And I heard a voice from heaven saying unto me, Write, Blessed are the dead which die in the Lord from henceforth: Yea, saith the Spirit, that they may rest from their labours; and their works do follow them.

[@VeraUgljesa]

Our pioneer came fro many denominations Like Christian connecton, Methodist, Baptist, Presbyterian and other denominations They worshipped on Sunday and ate unclean food. They believed in anti trinity as well until we came from darkness into marvellous light I don’t believe what our pioneers believed nor what out theologian say My authority is the Bible and the Spirit of Prophecy In my Bible it says that Jesus is God and that Holy Spirit is a person and God

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

Hello brother, I wanted to leave this comment with you just to try and show you that the Doctrine of the Godhead (The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit) is biblical, and can be found in both the old and New Testament. Starting with the Old Testament you can see this immediately in Genesis 1. The word God is translated from the word Elohim, and this is a plural word for the Lord God (meaning at least more than 1). Within the first verse we see that God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth, and we also see that the “Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Right here we see God, and the Spirit of God already. Moving down to verse 26 (the 6th day of creation), we see God (Elohim) say “let US make man in OUR image.” There are multiple plural words being used here, but one singular image. In verse 27 it says “so God (Elohim) created man in His own image, in the image of God (Elohim) created He him; male and female he created them.” Big difference from the “let us make man in our image,” it says He (singular) created them in His (singular) own image (singular). So we already see this trend that God (Elohim) has one image, but multiple are present in this process of creation, yet there is also one who is specifically doing the creation. Just to repeat, there is One who created Adam and Eve, but in the verse before it says us (more than one), our (more than one), image (just one, singular). The one who created us Jesus Christ as found in Isaiah 9:6, John 1:1-3, Hebrews 8-12. Another thing to note is that many will say that Elohim is used to describe 1 in numerical value, but in the Hebrew language there is a singular word for God, that being El (used in verses like Deuteronomy 32:15, Nehemiah 9:17 Job 3:4, Isaiah 44:8, and 52 other verses). Also note that when in the Bible it says one, it doesn’t always mean numerically 1 (Genesis 2:24 and John 10:30 for example). Moving past the creation story, you can go to Genesis 6:3 where it says “and the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man…” In the Tower of Babel, it also says in Genesis 11:7 “let US go down, and confuse their language..” In Psalm 51:11 it says “cast me not away from thy presence; And take not thy Holy Spirit from me.” In Exodus 31:3, Isaiah 11:2, and Ezekiel 36:27 as well as many other verses in the Old Testament alone speak about the Spirit of God. In the New Testament you can see all three members of the Godhead in the baptism of Jesus. As Jesus comes out of the water the heavens was opened unto him and “Spirit of God descended like a dove (and this isn’t the first time the Holy Spirit came upon someone in a literal form as seen in Acts 2:3-4), and a voice from heaven (God the Father) saying This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased with.” In the great commission in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus says “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” In these two passages there are 3 mentioned, in one verse each play a role in testifying that Jesus is God, and in the other Jesus tells His disciples to baptize in the name of these 3. In John 14:25 Jesus says “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” The Holy Spirit comes from the Father, and He plays the role of helping all followers of Christ throughout the ages. This same helper that Jesus promises is the Spirit of Truth that he mentioned in John 14:16-17. The Holy Spirit (who Jesus sends from the Father) also testifies of Jesus (John 15:26). This makes things even more evident that the Bible teaches about the Godhead because when you look at what was just said, Jesus says that once He goes to the Father, He will send the spirit of truth / the comforter / the Holy Spirit which comes from the Father, and the Holy Spirit will testify to us of Jesus. In the next chapter, in John 16:7-11, Jesus tells us just how important it is that He leaves so the Holy Spirit is sent to us, and what the Holy Spirit does. In verse 7 and 8 it says “It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.” Notice also that Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a he, and says the role that it plays in all of our lives. Jesus being the Word that was there since the beginning (John 1:1-3) and spoke all things into creation (Genesis 1:1-24) was very direct and intentional with His words (Luke 4:32, John 7:46, John 8:58). If Jesus wanted to make a clear distinction that the Holy Spirit wasn’t a person and just a spirit then He would have made that distinction when He spoke in John 14, 15, and 16. There are many other verses that speak on the Holy Spirit as well, such as Ephesians 1:13-14, Romans 8:26, 1 Peter 1:12, 2 Peter 1:21, and many more. I hope this response was enough to answer all four questions you asked, but I just want to reiterate that while we serve one God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one (and this isn’t a new concept as shown in Genesis 2:24, John 17:21-22, Galatians 3:28, and 1 Corinthians 12:12). Also if the Holy Spirit wasn’t God-much less a being-then how could it make sense that the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31-32, Mark 3:28-29, and Luke 12:10). The only one we can blaspheme is God (Luke 5:20-21, John 10:33-36, Matthew 26:63-65). If then Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a separate entity from Himself and the Father, says that He comes in the place of Jesus, refers to Him (the Holy Spirit) as a He, and the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve Him (who convicts the world of sin, and of judgment, and of righteousness, and testifies of Jesus), then is it really unreasonable or unbiblical to say that the Holy Spirit is a real person in Heaven alongside the Father and the Son (especially since you can find so many scriptures speaking about him)? While we can never understand just what exactly the Holy Spirit is, or how he works (John 3:5-8). I mentioned John 3:5-8 because the word wind is translated from the word pneuma which is also translated and used to say spirit, angel, God, Christ’s spirit, the Holy Spirit. We can’t understand how He works, but we can feel His effect even as we feel the wind.I hope you have found these scriptures a blessing, and proof that the Bible does teach about the Godhead, and this isn’t a false doctrine but the truth. May the love of God, the grace of Jesus, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you brother.

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

also to show that sister White also wrote about this I’ll leave a few quotes from her. The Father can not be described by the things of earth. The Father is all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, and is invisible to mortal sight. The Son is all the fullness of the Godhead manifested. The word of God declares Him to be “the express image of His person.” “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” Here is shown the personality of the Father. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 1 The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fullness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a personal Saviour. There are three living persons of the heavenly trio. In the name of these three powers,-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will cooperate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 2 The prince of the power of evil can only be held in check by the power of God in the third person of the Godhead, the Holy Spirit. SpTA10 37.1 SpTA10 37 Evil had been accumulating for centuries, and could only be restrained and resisted by the mighty power of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fulness of divine power. Another spirit must be met; for the essence of evil was working in all ways, and the submission of man to this satanic captivity was amazing. SpTA10 25.2 There are many other quotes in which the Holy Spirit is referred to as a he, as an individual, and other things of that nature. While we cannot understand fully the Holy Spirit, or how the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are three separate entities, yet one God, the Bible still teaches it and should not be called a doctrine of apostasy. I pray this will be a blessing to you

[@marcgoldstone5018]

Brilliant study there brother..God bless you mate... I'm actually gonna take snap shots of your study here

[@susienorlin1780]

This was so awesome 🤩 Praise God ❤

[@kandeeemm9857]

The impartation of the Spirit is the impartation of the life of Christ.. DA 805

[@janetmeany1110]

I dont think with our human minds we can ever truly understand the God head but accept it as God explained it, the best we can. We dont want to study to our own destruction because alot of things just have to be accepted by faith. Enjoyed this discussion.

[@UhlinHendricks]

Looking forward to seeing this presentation. 👍🙏

[@VeraUgljesa]

“Angels that were loyal and true sought to reconcile this mighty, rebellious angel to the will of his creator. They justified the act of God in conferring honour upon Christ, and with forcible reasoning sought to convince Lucifer that no honour was his(Jesus’s ) now than when the Father had proclaimed the honour which he had conferred upon His Son” The Story of Redemption page 15 Angels knew that Jesus was their creator and that Read on This continues the conversation of good angels to Lucifer “They (good angels)clearly set forth that Christ was the son of God existing with Him before the Angels were created” In conclusion the answer to the question weather Angels knew that Jesus was their creator and that they also knew that Jesus existed with the father before they were created

[@pilgrim5217]

Thank you brothers for this wonderful discussion! 🙏🏻🌷

[@richeanx]

It seems to me that it is being advocated that William Miller and his baptist understanding of the Trinity was correct. If that is the case then so must Ellen White’s Methodist understanding be correct, (as these two believed in the same Nicaean/Catholic Trinity) but why then would sister White change her view from Trinitarian to anti Trinitarian then back to Trinitarian if she had the truth from the very beginning?

[@marie-simonne8612]

Your argument is the one Trinitarians don't want to hear. How could you be a Trinitarian to begin with, then become anti-Trinitarian after long hours of study with the pioneers and being approved by God, and then toward the end of her life Mrs. White suddenly become a Trinitarian again?

[@kajunox]

Wonderful video. Love this Bible topics.

[@richeanx]

I cannot understand why is it so important to so many Trinitarians, that Jesus not be our comforter/advocate and our wisdom.

[@DP-go8xt]

I don't know of a single trinitarian that doesn't believe Jesus is our comforter/advocate (John 14:16), advocate (1 John 2:1) and wisdom (Proverbs 8). The Holy Spirit is "another Comforter." John 14:16

[@Eric-fq5wx]

​​@@DP-go8xtread the next verse john 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. The "another comforter" jesus is refering to is dwelling with them in the flesh and shall be in them in spirit.

[@DP-go8xt]

@@Eric-fq5wx We're on the same page as far as the next verse is concerned. "Before this the Spirit had been in the world; from the very beginning of the work of redemption He[the Holy Spirit] had been moving upon men’s hearts. But while Christ was on earth, the disciples had desired no other helper. Not until they were deprived of His [Jesus'] presence would they feel their need of the Spirit, and then He[the Holy Spirit] would come." DA 669.1. Jesus, the comforter/advocate. The Holy Spirit, "another" comforter/advocate. The original post is a false claim is all I was pointing out.

[@rsankern6444]

As a non trinitarian I enjoy hearing us speak of unity, or at least not division. I don’t argue with my friends about their understanding of certain texts, it is a beautiful feeling to truly believe something and feel respected for it. I find there too often misrepresentation and misunderstanding.

[@williamhartweg6935]

Spirit of Prophecy says:" "thought and feelings are evil, they can betray you "! Knowing ist the best part!

[@rsankern6444]

@@williamhartweg6935 I think most Adventists can cite a quote about how feelings can betray. Feeling respected from your brethren, even if they disagree, is in fact a good feeling. Feeling is not always evil. One can state the reasons for why they disagree, and leave the person not feeling attacked, or misrepresented. It’s a gift to really understand what someone is trying to say. I am happy that there are these type of forums if people can use them appropriately.

[@edenoutpost]

"And the Son of God declares concerning Himself: “The Lord possessed Me in the beginning of His way, before His works of old. I was set up from everlasting.... When He appointed the foundations of the earth: then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him: and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him.” Proverbs 8:22-30." - Patriarchs and Prophets, p. 34.1 - EGW

[@edenoutpost]

"This FACT the angels would obscure, that CHRIST WAS THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD, and they came to consider that they were not to consult Christ. One angel began the controversy and carried it on until there was rebellion in the heavenly courts among the angels. They were lifted up because of their beauty." - 25LtMs, Lt 42, 1910, par. 3 - EGW

[@scottjohnson1367]

"As you empty the heart of self, you must accept the righteousness of Christ. Lay hold of it by faith; for you must have the MIND and SPIRIT of CHRIST, that you may work the works of Christ. If you open the door of the heart, JESUS will supply the vacuum by the gift of HIS Spirit, and then you can be a living preacher in your home, in the church, and in the world." RH February 23, 1892, par. 5

[@ellyess7203]

Alleluia! Jesus is Lord and Saviour and God is the Three in One, the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit. In these three ways God speaks to me, guides me, comforts me and is always with me, especially when I need him. Praise God! Amen.

[@rsankern6444]

It seems that if one identifies as a non trinitarian they are attacked for diminishing Jesus, or that they believe he is not God, or equal to God. Adam and Eve were made in the image of God. Eve came out from Adam, “bone of my bone”. This does not make her less than Adam; men and women are equal. Eve is just as much of the man(kind) as Adam; Christ is just as much of the God(kind) as his Father. Adam and Eve are one flesh; the Father and Son are one Spirit. This is not a difficult concept. John 14:20-23 is very clear that the Father and Son dwell in us by their Spirit. Every Adventist non trinitarian believes in the full divinity of Christ. I think it would be helpful to stop saying what other people think, because it is often a misrepresentation of what they actually think. This is not helpful to the body of Christ, at all. People see these arguments and divisions from the outside, and inside the church, and it discourages them, and pushes them away. I have struggled myself, not because of my beliefs, but because of how I’ve been treated in the church for my sincerity in belief. I can rant and go on, my point is to just be kind, and don’t misrepresent people.

[@wally8224]

Amen, thank you for the share.

[@Whitespike77]

You have been treated similarly to how the Arians were treated when the little horn power uprooted three kingdoms to make way for itself, resulting in the removal of the "daily" (Daniel 8). This scenario will repeat in the end times when the "daily" is once again taken away (Daniel 12:11). God bless.

[@Jasho-Beam]

Sure you are free to believe whatever you wish but you aren't able to call yourself an Adventist if you refuse accept what we bribe and to be part of our faith.

[@gnaass1951]

Thank you so much for your commentary.

[@anetaangelova3573]

Because it is true. Adventist nontrinitarians diminish Christ. If you say you believe in the full divinity of Christ, which means He is a true God, why then you say there is ONLY ONE TRUE God - the Father? By saying that Christ was born in eternity you practically declare He CANNOT be a TRUE God because He had not life in Himself, He was depending on the Father for life. That diminishes Christ immediately. Adam and Eva were both creatures, you cannot compare God with a creature. Eva did not receive her life from Adam, but from God. God means LIFEGIVER. God cannot receive life, because God is the reason for life.

[@paulnyakxx]

This video is the clearest evidence that the trinity is indeed a false doctrine

[@gnaass1951]

Amen

[@love_myfam]

Wonderful! Looking forward to this new episode! Blessings to Clash of Minds and White Horse Media Ministries!

[@ardellakoskinen5359]

Great presentation! Thank you!

[@AdannaG]

‘We have nothing to fear for the future, except as we shall forget the way the Lord has led us, and His teaching in our past history’ (Testimonies to Ministers, p. 31). “As one line of reasoning goes, either the pioneers were wrong and the present church is right, or the pioneers were right and the present Seventh-day Adventist church has apostatized from biblical truth” (Jerry Moon, ‘The Trinity’, page 190).

[@barbarabrandl2724]

There is no Trinity in the Bible.

[@christinanicks]

It’s correct that there is not the word Trinity in the Bible, and therefor we should always use the word Godhead to avoid confusion and this term *IS* found in the Bible

[@judymay903]

Well, yes there is, buuuut, the Bible does not used the word ‘trinity’ to describe the 3 entities of the Godhead. At baptism’s pastors repeat the saying “I baptize you in the name of the Father, and the Son, and the Holy Spirit”. ‘Trinity ‘is a modern day terminology to describe the 3 in one, as in the marriage, the 2 become one & with God in our lives, that is even 3 in one!!

[@kingmufasa8929]

Only God, Jesus and Holy Spirit

[@Eric-fq5wx]

Trinitarians always like to shift the issue to the word trinity. But to us non trinitarians the word is not the issue. The trinity DOCTRINE is not found in scripture but the idea of one God is and he has an only begotten son who inherited his divinity from his father. The son did have a beginning described in proverbs 8 and that is affirmed by ellen white in patriarchs and prophets page 34. There is an evil spirit that is denying this truth that is plain in scripture.

[@Purcella13]

Let US create man in OUR image

[@thouartjo]

If you want to know the truth, ask God. Dont ask others because they might be wrong. His Spirit will guide you to the truth. We need to stand on our own feet spiritually so many people defer their spirtitual judgement to someone else who they trust rather than growing and developing their own spiritual maturity. Get to know God he's a real Father and he sent his real Son to die for us.

[@John17.17]

So true.. Sister White gives warning upon warning that we should study the Bible for ourselves and form our own opinions under the guidance of the Holy Spirit. It it so important that we go to God and ask Him what is truth. After all, He has promised in His Word that He will guide in all truth.

[@sirleyfv]

The Holy Trinity, central dogma of Catholicism. How could I believe the most important dogma of the beast?

[@janejanis9199]

The only way for us to be fully united with each other, is to be fully united to God in His Truth.

[@saraha7006]

What a blessing this message truly is. How Wonderful it was to hear Steve’s explanations/analogies in such a way that we can even explain it on a level that to our children can & will understand. It has always been hard for me to articulate in a way that everyone can understand the meaning of the godheads being three separate entities/persons because our earthly minds Can only Articulate it in terms of a persons to explain the distinct 3 different/ separate people/ person’s that are our godhead the Farther, the Son and the Holly Spirit they 3 distinct persons/ people but united as one. Now I can explain it in more simple terms and what each separate person is and represents. You really have explained it so well and the conversation and references have really been a blessing to me and my children, thank you.

[@patsda6405]

This might just blow your mind. It did mine. I notice a lot of SDAs will use the words Godhead and trinity interchangeably. If the word Godhead is another word for trinity, Romans 1:20 says we can understand the Godhead by the visible things God has made. In Genesis 1 God said let us make man in our image...and he created them male and female. He didn't make three people, he made two, and they weren't created at the same time and in the same way. That was intentional. I think the creation of Adam and Eve represents God the Father and the Son of God. I think Adam represents the Father and Eve represents Jesus. Jesus literally came from the Father (begotten). Eve came from Adam. Although Jesus got life from the Father, all things were created through Jesus, and we get eternal life from him. Although Eve came from Adam, ever since, man/human life comes from women. Jesus has two natures: divine (God) and human. Eve (and all women) can be called man and woman. The head of Jesus is God. The head of the woman (wife) is the man (husband). God likes to use symbolism.

[@tracijohnson6236]

Then it’s 3 gods?

[@scottjohnson1367]

@@patsda6405 Amen! everything that is created, said, and done is a divine picture. It is amazing how many pictures and examples He gives if we just look for them.

[@denverpikes24]

Robert you got the tv look great❤❤❤your new set, and enjoy seeing your growth as a program.🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉

[@deannaskerry8356]

I desire the Holy Spirit

[@gnaass1951]

Desiring the Holy Spirit is the pinnacle of all desires, but please know and understand that the Desire for the Holy Spirit is one and the same as Desiring The Spirit of Christ. As in, Christ should be, "The Desire of Ages"

[@TheGateKeeper001]

No not many in her writings, she said that the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ.

[@duhulsfantmaiubeste3173]

Check what happened in 1915 , 1955-1957 , 😊

[@nirvaansinghtheartist]

The church needs to prayerfully study selected messages book 1,2 and 3

[@nabarde_afkar]

This was a great bible study. it was a great companion to the other episode you had on this topic. God bless you

[@Rich4Truth]

The fact is, that if you were to read the Bible objectively…that is, without ANY pre-conceived ideas, you would not arrive at a trinity. It’s an implanted idea. It’s something that has to be taught. I’ve been a Seventh Day Adventist since 1959, and I have studied both sides of this issue thoroughly. I didn’t just study one side, or allow myself to be taught one side, so that I could throw stones at the other side. Without even really knowing fully what the other side actually believes, or how they got there. Which is what most trinitarians do today, including yourselves. In fact you don’t even fully understand your own side of the argument. Which is why you have to bring in a guest speaker. None of these ideas are your own. They’re not Wahlburg’s either. Ellen White saw this crises coming, and she wrote about it. Dr. Kellogg was a prideful man, and when his pantheistic ideas were shot down, he didn’t just go away. He modified it a little bit and said “ah, I’ve found the problem.” That’s when he incorporated the idea of 3 gods. A trinity.(They don’t tell you this, but you can find it if you search) The idea didn’t originate with him either by the way. Ellen White then condemned this line of thinking also. If time permits I’ll show you that quote. Pr. Wahlburg would have us believe that the pioneers were just a group of non-trinitarians, whose beliefs evolved. Especially Ellen White’s beliefs. That she later, and we later, became more enlightened on the topic and became trinitarians. But the fact is, that the pioneers, almost every single one of them, including EGW were trinitarians to start with. Ellen White had been a Methodist. (Trinitarian) This was their starting point. And this is what God led them away from. That is how they all became non-trinitarians. He would have us believe that she shifted a little bit near the end and became a trinitarian. No, that would have been a return to what she started out as, before she became a prophet. That would not have been a small shift. It would have been a complete 180 degree reversal, and a turning back to the very thing that she had been led away from! If this were the case it would have been front page news! She would have held a press conference and said, we have been wrong for the past 50 years. Instead she said this: The enemy of souls has sought to bring in the supposition that a great reformation was to take place among Seventh-day Adventists, and that this reformation would consist in giving up the doctrines which stand as the pillars of our faith, and engaging in a process of reorganization. Were this reformation to take place, what would result? The principles of truth that God in His wisdom has given to the remnant church, would be discarded. Our religion would be changed. The fundamental principles that have sustained the work for the last fifty years would be accounted as error. A new organization would be established. Books of a new order would be written. A system of intellectual philosophy would be introduced. {1SM 204.1} And this is exactly what has happened. The books of a new order began coming out soon after her death. But wait. Look at what she said in 1906. Eight years after she wrote Desire of Ages. Which is when they say she made her turn around, and became trinitarian: And now, after half a century of clear light from the Word as to what is truth, there are arising many false theories to unsettle minds. But the evidence given in our early experience has the same force that it had then. The truth is the same as it ever has been, and not a pin or a pillar can be moved from the structure of truth. That which was sought for out of the Word in 1844, 1845, and 1846 remains the truth today in every particular. 21LtMs, Lt 38, 1906, par. 3 saw Doug Batchelor giving a sermon about the trinity once. And he said that Proverbs 8 had absolutely nothing to do with the Son of God. And just now Pr. Wahlburg did something similar. But EGW had this to say about it. And the Son of God declares concerning Himself: “The Lord possessed Me in thebeginning of His way, before His works of old. I was set up from everlasting.... When He appointed the foundations of the earth: then I was by Him, as one brought up with Him: and I was daily His delight, rejoicing always before Him.” Proverbs 8:22-30. - {PP 34.1} Christ the Word, the Only Begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father,-one in nature, in character, and in purpose,-the ONLY BEING in all the universe that could enter into all the counsels and purposes of God. {GC 493.1} (Only two beings here) That does not mean there is no Holy Spirit. God has a Spirit. In fact God IS a Spirit. John 4:24

[@scottjohnson1367]

Amen! I did the same thing for 3 years - studied as if both sides could be true. I also didn't really know what the trinity teaching was except 'there are 3 in 1 and we can't understand'. After 3 years of very earnest study, there is absolutely NO WAY to see a trinity of any kind! All of scripture and EGW writings come alive with this understanding of a real and true Father and Son. Oh how I wish others could see!

[@liezlvanniekerk]

Amen, the true gospel that can save people's lives.

[@scottjohnson1367]

"To be converted daily is to renew the soul's life by receiving vital power from CHRIST, as the branch receives nourishment from the vine. The growth of every Christian is from within, not from without. It is only as the SPIRIT OF CHRIST dwells in the heart by faith that we can grow in grace and the knowledge of Christ. Only through the grace daily DRAWN FROM JESUS can the heart be kept. There can be no safety in extolling self; we must hide self IN JESUS. CHRIST abiding within, is the life of the soul. And we are to receive CHRIST through his WORD. It is the truth that sanctifies the soul. We should study the Scriptures, even upon our knees, with earnestness and sincerity. The love of Jesus in the heart will create a love for the searching of his word." RH February 16, 1892, par. 18

[@binadybudhi5234]

thank you elder Steve for the elaboration. Our knowledge is surely progressing.

[@Velias-hc6xk]

The first angel's message is about who is your God.

[@dwayner8645]

This was a very informative episode... thank you CoM..🙏🏿💕🙏🏿

[@Velias-hc6xk]

There will never be a Trinity God of the Bible, never. The Trinity is not the God of the Bible. The Trinity teaches three co-eternal persons. So when did the Father Jehovah become the Father of the Son Jesus and Jesus the Son of his Father? Trinity is a pagan god and will always be in any form. It's a scam. The Godhead is not a trinity.The Godhead is Godhead The Godhead is not three persons, co-eternal beings. The Trinity unites all Christian churches together. This can already be seen today.

[@davidking2376]

Amen! Not only that but, Sister White in her writings always referred to The Father, The Son & The Holy Spirit as The Heavenly Trio or The Godhead bodily.

[@Revelation18-4]

Don't lead people astray with false catholic doctrine.

[@tracijohnson6236]

So in PP ‘Why was Sin Permitted’. There was a mtg between FATHER and SON… where was the 3rd being? Why was he not present? In the entirety of this VERY detailed time in heaven, the Holy Spirit was absent🤔. Weird don’t you think??

[@edenoutpost]

The Lord is that Spirit .... The Spirit is of God and of Christ, so the Spirit is always present, not as another god being, but as the Spirit or life of the Father and the Spirit or life of the Son. The Spirit is the life, light, glory, grace, truth, power, energizing presence, etc. proceeding from God and His Son. God the Father sends the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, not someone else. Thus our fellowship is with the Father and the Son ... in Spirit and in truth. The Holy Spirit is a representative presence, a spiritual manifestation, which proceeds from God and His Son. Thus the Spirit is never "left out" but he/it is not another divine being/god, but rather the third person or omnipresence of the Godhead, Father and Son. The Father is all the fulness of the Godhead bodily and the Son is all the fulness of the Godhead manifested, for the Son is clearly OF THE FATHER, a literal divine only begotten Son. The Father is the Source of all being. God always has been.

[@Garflick347]

So which is it: the scriptures and the scriptures alone which is the Godhead or tradition of the Catholic Church which is the trinity: they are not the same, the terms are not interchangeable.

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

Hello brother, I wanted to leave this comment with you just to try and show you that the Doctrine of the Godhead (The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit) is biblical, and can be found in both the old and New Testament. Starting with the Old Testament you can see this immediately in Genesis 1. The word God is translated from the word Elohim, and this is a plural word for the Lord God (meaning at least more than 1). Within the first verse we see that God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth, and we also see that the “Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Right here we see God, and the Spirit of God already. Moving down to verse 26 (the 6th day of creation), we see God (Elohim) say “let US make man in OUR image.” There are multiple plural words being used here, but one singular image. In verse 27 it says “so God (Elohim) created man in His own image, in the image of God (Elohim) created He him; male and female he created them.” Big difference from the “let us make man in our image,” it says He (singular) created them in His (singular) own image (singular). So we already see this trend that God (Elohim) has one image, but multiple are present in this process of creation, yet there is also one who is specifically doing the creation. Just to repeat, there is One who created Adam and Eve, but in the verse before it says us (more than one), our (more than one), image (just one, singular). The one who created us Jesus Christ as found in Isaiah 9:6, John 1:1-3, Hebrews 8-12. Another thing to note is that many will say that Elohim is used to describe 1 in numerical value, but in the Hebrew language there is a singular word for God, that being El (used in verses like Deuteronomy 32:15, Nehemiah 9:17 Job 3:4, Isaiah 44:8, and 52 other verses). Also note that when in the Bible it says one, it doesn’t always mean numerically 1 (Genesis 2:24 and John 10:30 for example). Moving past the creation story, you can go to Genesis 6:3 where it says “and the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man…” In the Tower of Babel, it also says in Genesis 11:7 “let US go down, and confuse their language..” In Psalm 51:11 it says “cast me not away from thy presence; And take not thy Holy Spirit from me.” In Exodus 31:3, Isaiah 11:2, and Ezekiel 36:27 as well as many other verses in the Old Testament alone speak about the Spirit of God. In the New Testament you can see all three members of the Godhead in the baptism of Jesus. As Jesus comes out of the water the heavens was opened unto him and “Spirit of God descended like a dove (and this isn’t the first time the Holy Spirit came upon someone in a literal form as seen in Acts 2:3-4), and a voice from heaven (God the Father) saying This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased with.” In the great commission in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus says “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” In these two passages there are 3 mentioned, in one verse each play a role in testifying that Jesus is God, and in the other Jesus tells His disciples to baptize in the name of these 3. In John 14:25 Jesus says “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” The Holy Spirit comes from the Father, and He plays the role of helping all followers of Christ throughout the ages. This same helper that Jesus promises is the Spirit of Truth that he mentioned in John 14:16-17. The Holy Spirit (who Jesus sends from the Father) also testifies of Jesus (John 15:26). This makes things even more evident that the Bible teaches about the Godhead because when you look at what was just said, Jesus says that once He goes to the Father, He will send the spirit of truth / the comforter / the Holy Spirit which comes from the Father, and the Holy Spirit will testify to us of Jesus. In the next chapter, in John 16:7-11, Jesus tells us just how important it is that He leaves so the Holy Spirit is sent to us, and what the Holy Spirit does. In verse 7 and 8 it says “It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.” Notice also that Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a he, and says the role that it plays in all of our lives. Jesus being the Word that was there since the beginning (John 1:1-3) and spoke all things into creation (Genesis 1:1-24) was very direct and intentional with His words (Luke 4:32, John 7:46, John 8:58). If Jesus wanted to make a clear distinction that the Holy Spirit wasn’t a person and just a spirit then He would have made that distinction when He spoke in John 14, 15, and 16. There are many other verses that speak on the Holy Spirit as well, such as Ephesians 1:13-14, Romans 8:26, 1 Peter 1:12, 2 Peter 1:21, and many more. I hope this response was enough to answer all four questions you asked, but I just want to reiterate that while we serve one God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one (and this isn’t a new concept as shown in Genesis 2:24, John 17:21-22, Galatians 3:28, and 1 Corinthians 12:12). Also if the Holy Spirit wasn’t God-much less a being-then how could it make sense that the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31-32, Mark 3:28-29, and Luke 12:10). The only one we can blaspheme is God (Luke 5:20-21, John 10:33-36, Matthew 26:63-65). If then Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a separate entity from Himself and the Father, says that He comes in the place of Jesus, refers to Him (the Holy Spirit) as a He, and the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve Him (who convicts the world of sin, and of judgment, and of righteousness, and testifies of Jesus), then is it really unreasonable or unbiblical to say that the Holy Spirit is a real person in Heaven alongside the Father and the Son (especially since you can find so many scriptures speaking about him)? While we can never understand just what exactly the Holy Spirit is, or how he works (John 3:5-8). I mentioned John 3:5-8 because the word wind is translated from the word pneuma which is also translated and used to say spirit, angel, God, Christ’s spirit, the Holy Spirit. We can’t understand how He works, but we can feel His effect even as we feel the wind.I hope you have found these scriptures a blessing, and proof that the Bible does teach about the Godhead, and this isn’t a false doctrine but the truth. May the love of God, the grace of Jesus, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you brother.

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

also to show that sister White also wrote about this I’ll leave a few quotes from her. The Father can not be described by the things of earth. The Father is all the fullness of the Godhead bodily, and is invisible to mortal sight. The Son is all the fullness of the Godhead manifested. The word of God declares Him to be “the express image of His person.” “God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life.” Here is shown the personality of the Father. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 1 The Comforter that Christ promised to send after He ascended to heaven, is the Spirit in all the fullness of the Godhead, making manifest the power of divine grace to all who receive and believe in Christ as a personal Saviour. There are three living persons of the heavenly trio. In the name of these three powers,-the Father, the Son, and the Holy Ghost, those who receive Christ by living faith are baptized, and these powers will cooperate with the obedient subjects of heaven in their efforts to live the new life in Christ. BTS March 1, 1906, par. 2 The prince of the power of evil can only be held in check by the power of God in the third person of the Godhead, the Holy Spirit. SpTA10 37.1 SpTA10 37 Evil had been accumulating for centuries, and could only be restrained and resisted by the mighty power of the Holy Spirit, the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fulness of divine power. Another spirit must be met; for the essence of evil was working in all ways, and the submission of man to this satanic captivity was amazing. SpTA10 25.2 There are many other quotes in which the Holy Spirit is referred to as a he, as an individual, and other things of that nature. While we cannot understand fully the Holy Spirit, or how the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are three separate entities, yet one God, the Bible still teaches it and should not be called a doctrine of apostasy. I pray this will be a blessing to you

[@pat8398]

​@@HectorRivera-h3s Hello, The plural used in Genesis 1 designates the Father and the Son. The spirit that moves above the void is the spirit of God which his Son inherited through his begetting. The spirit is not a person but the creative and influential thought of the Father which the Son, Jesus, also inherited because He is God by descent. The spirit is the though of God given to Jesus and that he breathes to humanity. - Actes 2;32 "It is this Jesus that God resurrected; we are all witnesses to it.33 Raised up at the right hand of God, he received from the Father the promised Holy Spirit, and he poured it out, as you see and hear." It is Jesus himself, not another person. Ellen White is clear about this : "Encumbered with humanity, Christ could not be personally in all places; therefore it was advantageous for them that He should leave them, go to His Father, and send the Holy Spirit to be His successor on earth. The Holy Spirit is Himself, stripped of human personality, and independent of it. He was going to represent himself as the Omnipresent, everywhere present by His Holy Spirit". (Manuscript Releases, vol. 14, p.23)

[@gnaass1951]

Repeating what you have already said above does not make it true

[@Garflick347]

@@HectorRivera-h3s you will notice two very striking things about those who teach the trinity: 1) They all admit that the term trinity is not scripture, and then they use the words “but the concept is there.” Thus denying Holy Scripture and bowing to Roman Catholic tradition. Secondly, if you remove the word trinity you can substitute any Roman Catholic heresy in its place and claim to have a valid argument. The acceptance of one false teaching is preparatory to accepting all her false teachings. And yet those who exposed the trinity don’t see the trap. It is the Bible and the Bible alone. God gave us the concept of the Godhead, anything else, regardless how it packaged, is a lie. It is why we need to know and understand the pillars that form the foundation of our faith. The Lords prophet, Mrs White, warned us this would happen. Thus we have no excuse if we allow ourselves to be led astray.

[@Robert-n3x]

God bless u my brother this is good Ps Steve God bless u for the explanation Is deep and understanding

[@davidhannan2023]

Love the new set 👍😃

[@AnonEeMouse]

"Let them study the seventeenth of John, and learn how to pray and how to live the prayer of Christ. He is the Comforter." RH, January 27, 1903}

[@wally8224]

In the counsel between the Father and Son, where was the Holy Spirit?

[@edenoutpost]

The Spirit is the light, life and glory that surrounds the Father and the Son on the throne of the universe. It is the water of life, the oil that sanctifies, the fire that cleanses, the wind that blows away the chaff. There is one Spirit, as there is one God of whom are all things (God the Father) and one Lord by whom are all things (God's only begotten Son). The Spirit is the representative presence, the omnipresence, of God and His Son. God sends the Spirit of His Son into our hearts, crying Abba, Father. We want the Holy Spirit, which is Jesus Christ-the omnipresence of the Spirit of Christ, called the Comforter.

[@FrancoisVanNIEKERK-e3r]

Pastor: “So, you don’t believe in the trinity?” Me: “I believe Scripture.” Pastor: “So, you don’t believe in what the denomination teaches about God?” I grew up assuming whatever the denomination teaches is what the Bible teaches. Sadly, I have discovered this is not the case. I am praying that all my beloved brothers and sisters in my denomination will choose the Bible at all costs-especially regarding the most important topic: identifying the God we worship.

[@ellyess7203]

My Dad said, 'The wise old owl sat in the Oak The more he heard the less he spoke The less he spoke The more he heard Why can't we be like that old bird?' My Dad was wise. A man of few words. I loved him so much. His life was not easy. Neither was he treated fairly. Thank you God, for my Dad.

[@tracijohnson6236]

In PP the Father called together the entire host of heaven to clarify that His Son was equal to Him…. Why not equal to ‘them’??? Seems like someone was missing at this VERY important gathering….

[@ZJesusIsTheWay]

Thank you❤

[@curbweasel]

Please pray for my friend Scott who suffers from mental health affliction and addiction.I have been praying that God would deliver, heal and save my friend. Scott is a kind soul that needs God's mercies. Please cry out to God with me for my friend and for me.

[@AnonEeMouse]

And for us also is the promise of His presence, "Lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world." Matthew 28:20. - {MH 107.1} Today no curious multitudes flock to the desert places to see and hear the Christ. His voice is not heard in the busy streets. No cry sounds from the wayside, "Jesus of Nazareth passeth by." Luke 18:37. Yet this word is true today, Christ walks unseen through our streets. With messages of mercy He comes to our homes. With all who are seeking to minister in His name, He waits to co-operate. He is in the midst off us, to heal and to bless, if we will receive Him. - {MH 107.2}

[@BirdieBird77]

That’s so interesting that Steve mentioned that still sm voice that talked to him! I was a brand new SDA Christian -very young 19 yrs old. I started working at a SDA hospital and thought it would be like heaven. Boy, were my eyes opened!! So and so we’re sleeping with so and so. People were talking about other people in the church. I thought to myself, “This is a joke!” I need to forget about this Christianity thing!! But God spoke to me at that very moment in an auditable thought voice and said clear as day! “DO NOT LOOK AT THESE PEOPLE! LOOK AT ME!” That was it. I did and have been an Adventist for almost 50 years!!

[@heibro]

That was awesome

[@nikkisantos7365]

Wow! just watched this episode now! This was your best one up to now! I like your interviews with different people, but this is especially good because of all the bickering and disunity in the church on this topic. I hope you will take other "hot" topics in our church and present them in this way :) - Topics like womans' ordination, LGBT in the church, meetings of our leaders with 'the man of sin', the demoting of our Prophet; Ellen White (promoting not mentioning her in sermons) and holding back tithes because of apostacy of our leaders. You present topics in a constructive, bible-based way. Thank you. PS: Was lovely meeting (and hugging) your mom and dad and also Martin here in Holland:) ( God Bless yoou both Abundantly - from an ex-South African living in Holland

[@Henry04u2]

Yes, The Pioneers we all from different Back grounds and beliefs. But, They Settled on the "Fundamental PRINCIPLES", not beliefs... Beliefs, aka 'Dogmas', are used as hammers against those who refuse to bend the knee to error...

[@lc5346]

I’m going to turn on my tv and watch. Love the three presenting! God bless all of you 🙏

[@patsda6405]

Edit: I had to put these into two comment boxes. Please read this. I know it's long but it's mostly quotes from the bible and SOP. Especially check out the kicker at the end. This great controversy is about Satan being jealous of Christ and wanting His position. He does this by disputing the sonship of Christ.“There had been no change in the position or authority of Christ. Lucifer’s envy and misrepresentation and his claims to equality with Christ had made necessary a statement of the true position of the Son of God; but this had been the same from the beginning.” (Patriarchs and Prophets, chapter 1) “Christ was the only begotten Son of God, and Lucifer, that glorious angel, got up a warfare over the matter,” (Ms 86, 1910). (I know they didn't mention it in this video, but if Jesus is just a metaphorical son, then Lucifer does have every right to Christ's position because Lucifer too can be the metaphorical son.) I'm a non-trinitarian and I believe Jesus is the Son of God. He is begotten of the Father (John 3:16) therefore He is God too. And we know everything after its kind (Genesis 1). Humans beget humans, cats beget cats, divinity begets divinity. EGW tells us that it was the Father who was speaking to Jesus at creation when he said "Let us make man in our image...." (PP Chp 1). Trinitarians say the holy spirit was there at creation but it was just the Father and Son. "The Sovereign of the universe was not alone in His work of beneficence. He had an associate-a co-worker who could appreciate His purposes, and could share His joy in giving happiness to created beings. “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. The same was in the beginning with God.” John 1:1, 2. Christ, the Word, the only begotten of God, was one with the eternal Father-one in nature, in character, in purpose-the ONLY BEING that could enter into ALL the counsels and purposes of God. The Father and the Son engaged in the mighty, wondrous work they had contemplated-of creating the world." (The story of Redemption, pg 20). "After the earth was created, and the beasts upon it, the Father and Son carried out their purpose, which was designed before the fall of Satan, to make man in their own image. They had wrought together in the creation of the earth and every living thing upon it." (SOP, Vol 1, pg 24) (That's why God made only Adam and Eve and not a third person.) "I saw a throne, and on it sat the Father and the Son. I gazed on Jesus’ countenance and admired His lovely person. The Father’s person I could not behold, for a cloud of glorious light covered Him. I asked Jesus if His Father had a form like Himself. He said He had, but I could not behold it, for said He, “If you should once behold the glory of His person, you would cease to exist.” EW, 55 (1882 edition). EGWW 157.1 Jesus does say God the Father is the one true God meaning the Father is the source of all life including the life of His son. I don't think non-trinitarians should be leaving the church. God says to wait to be kicked out. Trinitarians say the words "spirit of God" means the holy spirit, a literal person separate from the Father and Son. But doesn't the bible say God is a spirit? So isn't it redundant to say the spirit of God unless the word spirit here means something else like "breath" or "wind" or "mind". Also, doesn't the word "of" show possession? When the bible says "the spirit of (insert person's name)" isn't it usually referring to that person's mind? For example, in Gen 45:27 it says "the spirit of Jacob was revived." It's not referring to someone other than Jacob, but Jacob's mind. The holy spirit/ghost is the spirit of the Father and Son - their omnipresence. How you know which is being referred to depends on context. For example, Acts 20:28 is talking about Christ's spirit. "Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." Jesus is the one who purchased us with His own blood. Ephesians 2:18 "For through him (Jesus) we both have access by one Spirit unto the Father." Galatians 4:6 "And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father." 2 Corinthians 3:17 "Now the Lord is that Spirit: and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty." John 14:26 "But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you." John 16:7 "Nevertheless I tell you the truth; it is expedient for you that I (Jesus) go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you, but if I depart, I will send him unto you." Matthew 28:20..."lo, I am with you always, even unto the end of the world. Amen." John 14:18 "I (Jesus) will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you." (Christ is the Comforter. Christ is the Holy Ghost.) Romans 8:26 "Likewise the Spirit also helpeth our infirmities: for we know not what we should pray for as we ought: but the Spirit itself maketh intercession for us with groanings which cannot be uttered." John 14:6 "Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me." 1 Timothy 2:5 "For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;" (If the Holy Spirit is a separate person apart from the Father and Son, does that mean there are two ways to the Father and two intercessors?) “It is the SPIRIT that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing; the words that I speak unto you, they are SPIRIT, and they are life.” CHRIST is not here referring to his doctrine, BUT TO HIS PERSON, THE DIVINITY OF HIS CHARACTER. CUMBERED WITH HUMANITY, CHRIST COULD NOT BE IN EVERY PLACE PERSONALLY; therefore it was altogether for their advantage that He should leave them, GO TO HIS FATHER, AND SEND THE HOLY SPIRIT to be His successor on earth. THE HOLY SPIRIT IS HIMSELF DIVESTED OF THE PERSONALITY OF HUMANITY AND INDEPENDENT THEREOF. HE WOULD REPRESENT HIMSELF AS PRESENT IN ALL PLACES BY HIS HOLY SPIRIT, AS THE OMNIPRESENT. (Review & Herald, April 5, 1906) "Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fullness of divine power. It is the Spirit that makes effectual what has been wrought out by the world's Redeemer. It is by the Spirit that the heart is made pure. Through the Spirit the believer becomes a partaker of the divine nature. CHRIST HAS GIVEN HIS SPIRIT as a divine power to overcome all hereditary and cultivated tendencies to evil, and to impress His own character upon His church. (Desire of Ages, p. 671.2) (Many trinitarians quote only a portion of the above as proof that there’s a trinity. But EGW states Christ - His Spirit - is the third person.) I don't know any non-trinitarians who believe Jesus is not God. If there are, they're incorrect. Jesus is God. Jesus can still be God (divine/Godkind) and God the Father be the one true God (the source of all life including the life of his son) and Jesus have a beginning (begotten). Jesus is not eternally generated nor a created being. The bible is clear that he was begotten, born of the Father (John 3:16). To my knowledge, the bible doesn't explain how he was begotten/born. "A complete offering has been made; for “God so loved the world, that he gave his only-begotten Son,”-not a son by creation, as were the angels, nor a son by adoption, as is the forgiven sinner, but a Son begotten in the express image of the Father’s person..." (Signs of the Times, May 30, 1895, par. 3) Jesus had to pray to the Father and didn't know the hour because He was speaking from His human nature. He couldn't use his divinity otherwise the wicked could accuse Him on judgement day of having an advantage. They could say, that's why Jesus was able to overcome. The holy spirit is not talked about in PP chp 1, it's not talked about being there at creation and sharing a throne with the Father and Son, etc. It appears that if there's a hierarchy in heaven, the holy spirit would surely come after Jesus. However, the SOP says "Sin originated with him (Lucifer) who, next to Christ, had been most honored of God and was highest in power and glory among the inhabitants of heaven." (PP Chp. 1) "Lucifer in heaven, before his rebellion, was a high and exalted angel, next in honor to God's dear Son." (The Story of Redemption, Chp. 1 - first line). You said in Proverbs 8, wisdom is referred to as a female. I'm not sure what your point was in making this statement. Are you saying that because it's referred to as a female it can't be referring to Jesus? Jesus talks about how he wanted to gather his children like a hen (female chicken) gathers her chickens. (Matthew 23:37) You quoted EGW where she said there was never a time where Jesus was not in close fellowship with the Father, suggesting that this is proof that Jesus doesn't have a beginning. But Jesus can have a beginning and still have been in close fellowship with the Father. Jesus can have a beginning and never been apart from the Father after His birth/begetting. With regards to the comforter comment....Jesus often spoke in the third person. For example, Jesus referred to himself in the third person when he said "And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent." (John 17:23) Why would Jesus live as a man, be tempted as we are, just to send a different person to comfort us?

[@deborrastrom8559]

God gave US His Son To Save US in many ways. He gave us the Holy Spirit to come inside us to direct our thoughts & actions. He sends each of us Guardian angels if we stay in alignment with all the above. He has not left us here , without help to endure what we must be each purposed to do for others. Much of Christ's approach was healing/ peacefully reasoning & challanging the disrupters. ❤ All takes wisdom thst only can come from the God of Heaven & Earth ->who knows all & sees all. 🙏 pray without ceasing.

[@scottjohnson1367]

"Jesus was about to be removed from his disciples; but he assured them that although he should ascend to his Father, HIS Spirit and influence would be with them always, and with their successors even unto the end of the world. Christ could not have left his followers a more precious legacy than the assurance that HIS presence would be with them through all the dark and trying hours of life. When Satan seems ready to destroy the church of God, and bring his people to confusion, they should remember that One has promised to be with them who has said, “All power is given unto me in Heaven and on earth.” 6Red 56.1

[@johnnydo5658]

It's the three Angels messages, not the three Gods messages. Revelation 14: 10 Mentioned GOD, the LAMB and the Angels. Where is the 3rd God (Holy Spirit)

[@28heisenberger]

The trinity is not biblical 🙏🏻

[@TheaGrobler-ht6sh]

The Holy spirit is a part of God and Jesus that they share, it is Not a person's as the Adventist believe now. The Bible don't tell us that the Holy Spirit is a person. Trinity is something the Adventist believe, I grew up in the Adventist church, my pastor told me I am not welcome in church because I don't believe the Holy Spirit is a person. Do you think Jesus will deny anyone to come to church? That tells a lot of that pastor.

[@Edith82353]

Oh, du bist in großer Irrtum, behaptest etwas, wovon du keine Ahnung hast. Die Bibel- Gottes Wort sagt deutlich, es sind drei Gott Personen. Das ist nicht Adventisten Erfindung.

[@janetcomstock4589]

You know, our pastor was let go, for talking about the subject. He is one of the most humble people I know.

[@beataq5011]

That is very disturbing, because the coercion is not of God. How could people be prosecuted inside the church for not promoting doctrines that are not set as “Thus saith the Lord “ in the Bible. Doctrine of Trinity is a conclusion that some people made from scripture and shouldn’t be the reason to condemn or coerce.

[@edenoutpost]

Our pastor was also let go for sharing truth regarding God and His Son.

[@RelentlessHomesteading]

❤❤ @30m - speaking of how the Father convened to tell the Angelic host that Jesus was equal to the Father -- Goes to show us the AMAZING humility of Jesus. So different from Lucifer who was likely genuflecting his 'great power' over the other angels.

[@hubertyoung1938]

Yes. The early church " adapted" to Bible Truth, not man made traditions. Evening to evening is Bible truth, not tradition.

[@AnonEeMouse]

The core teaching of Rome is the trinity and the founders of the church rejected it for over a century. Do your own study on this and note carefully that EGW refused to even use the word. You will not find it in her writings even once.

[@ministryofhealing453]

Praise God for this beautiful message, reinforcing the fundamental beliefs of the Christian faith. "For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." (1 John 5:7). "The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen." (2 Corinthians 13:14.) In other words, the Godhead. Regarding the Holy Spirit, the 3rd member of the GodHead: "We need to realise that the Holy Spirit ... is as much a person as God is a person....The Holy Spirit has a personality, else He could not bear witness to our spirits and with our spirits that we are the children of God. He must also be a divine person, else He could not search out the secrets which lie hidden in the mind of God. The Holy Spirit is a free, working, independent agency. The God of heaven uses His Spirit as it pleases Him; and human minds, human judgment, and human methods can no more set boundaries to its working, or prescribe the channel through which it shall operate, than they can say to the wind, "I bid you to blow in a certain direction, and to conduct yourself in such and such a manner." From the beginning God has been working by His Holy Spirit through human instrumentalities for the accomplishment of His purpose in behalf of the fallen race.... The same power that sustained the patriarchs, that gave Caleb and Joshua faith and courage, and that made the work of the apostolic church effective, has upheld God's faithful children in every succeeding age. The Holy Spirit was the highest of all gifts that He Jesus could solicit from His Father for the exaltation of His people. The Spirit was to be given as a regenerating agent, and without this the sacrifice of Christ would have been of no avail. The power of evil had been strengthening for centuries, and the submission of men to this satanic captivity was amazing. Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fullness of divine power. The Holy Spirit is an effective helper in restoring the image of God in the human soul." FLB 52.

[@Velias-hc6xk]

"For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one." (1 John 5:7). Do you know that you are using a verse that was added to the Bible? And by doing so, you are supporting a lie. SDA Bible Commentary on 1 John 5:7. The passage given in the KJV is not in any Greek manuscript earlier than the 15th and 16th centuries. The disputed words entered the KJV through the Greek text of Erasmus (see Vol. V, p. 1 141). It is said that Erasmus offered to incorporate the disputed words into his Greek Testament if he was shown even one Greek MS (manuscript) that is contains. The Dublin Library produced such a MS (known as 34) and Erasmus included this passage in his text. It is now believed that the later editions of the Vulgate acquired this passage through an error caused by a scribe who inserted an exegetical marginal commentary into the biblical text he was copying. The disputed words have been widely used to support the doctrine of the Trinity, but with such overwhelming evidence against their authenticity, their support is worthless and should not be used. Nevertheless, they appeared in the "Catholic Commentary of the Vulgate on the Holy Scriptures", which admits these words: "It is now generally accepted that this passage, called the Comma Johanneum, is a gloss which crept into the text of the Old Latin and Vulgate in the early times, but it did not enter the Greek text until c 15th and 16th centuries.” (Thomas Nelson and Sons, 1951, p. 1186).” - (The Seventh-day Adventist Bible Commentary, vol. 7, p. 675). You are knowingly spreading lies, do you know that?

[@Velias-hc6xk]

"The grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the communion of the Holy Ghost, be with you all. Amen." (2 Corinthians 13:14.) Another verse much used by those who see the Holy Spirit as a third person. Do you really think that the third person God the Spirit came among them and they had fellowship with him? Have you ever been to a football or hockey game? In what spirit did the people gather there? Have you met a person with a hockey or football spirit? No absolutely not. Yet according to the pattern of Trinitarian thought, we might say, ``Yes, and they had wonderful fellowship with them''. All these sports fans came together with these spirits and not in this spirit where certain emotions are shown in the stadiums while cheering for a given team. What fruit does this sporting spirit bear? I'll leave that up to you. However, another explanation is offered to us. The Parakletos, or the only Comforter, is Christ himself, about whom the Apostle Paul writes, that we may have fellowship with him, as it is written: Mt 18:20: For wherever two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them." Or: Rev 2:1: "To the angel of the church in Ephesus write: These are the words of the one (Jesus) who holds the seven stars in his right hand, who walks in the midst of the seven golden candlesticks: Or: Jn 14:18: I will not leave you as orphans, I will come to you. And what fruit does this community bear? Jn 15:4: Abide in me and I in you. As a branch cannot bear fruit of itself unless it abides in the trunk, so neither can you unless you abide in me. Jn 15:8: In this my Father is glorified, when you bear much fruit; and you will be my disciples.” Ga 5:22: The fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, self-control. Eph 5:9: for the fruit of the Spirit consists in all goodness, righteousness, and truth. So how then? With whom were the Corinthians to have this fellowship? 1Jn 1:3: What we have seen and heard we declare to you, that you also may have fellowship with us; and our fellowship is with the Father and with his Son Jesus Christ. This is the unity. In this unity we are to have communion with Christ and his Father, which the Holy Scriptures mention, and not the Triune unity of three beings who are one God. We are to be of one spirit.

[@Velias-hc6xk]

Burdened with humanity, Christ could not be in every place in person; therefore it was entirely to their advantage that Christ should leave them, go to His Father, and send the Holy Spirit to be His representative on earth. This Holy Spirit is Himself (Christ), stripped of human personality and therefore independent. He (Christ) will present Himself as present in all places through His Holy Spirit, as the Omnipresent One. “However, the Comforter, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, [although you do not see him] he will teach you all things and remind you of everything I told you. But I'm telling you the truth. It is better for you that I leave. If I do not go, the Comforter will not come to you; but when I leave, I will send him to you. (Ellen G. White, British Present Truth, May 30, 1895 "Eternal Presence").

[@Velias-hc6xk]

I have a questions? How did Jesus become the son of God? And how did Jehovah become his Father?And when?

[@YahWho-is1tt]

@@Velias-hc6xk ... If I may offer this small addition: Erasmus produced several editions of the TR, the comparison of which will shed some light on this little "comma." Martin Luther's NT (in German, of course) was translated from the 2nd edition, while the KJV translators used the 4th. Somewhere in between those two Erasmus caved, which is quite possibly the reason for Ellen White's less than complimentary assessment of his character/spine. But the problem of placing so much confidence in this ONE VERSE is that, like ALL NINE of the supposed "proof texts" listed in supposed support of FB#2, the mere mention of Father, Son and Spirit in one verse tells NOTHING about a hypothetical TRIUNE God! Further "development" of doctrinal details, likewise speculative and highly problematic, makes for a confusing house of cards rather than strengthening the understanding of believers. If it were necessary for our salvation, God would tell us CLEARLY, PLAINLY, SIMPLY, in words even the simple-minded or child can "take to the bank." The faith-shaking effect of insisting that God's command of language, be it Hebrew, Greek, Aramaic or English, is so inept as to MISLEAD us with the very plain "only begotten Son" idea, so we now need the conjectural INTERPRETATIONS of "our modern Biblical scholars" to SET US STRAIGHT -- well, that is arrogant folly for which an answer will one day be demanded! Likewise, to claim that Mrs. White's understanding of God (with whom she dealt DIRECTLY for seven decades) could undergo a 180 degree flip-flop, at some point abandoning the unanimous NON-trinitarian beliefs of her own husband AND the rest of "the founders" of our faith, is to cast SERIOUS doubt upon the veracity of her inspiration being anything worthy of our consideration. This is, according to her own words, one of Satan's last large objectives. To join that effort is HORRIFYING!

[@bibleultimatetruth6658]

STOP BELIEVING IN SATAN'S LIE IT IS TIME TO BE AWAKE!

[@Velias-hc6xk]

Seventh day adventist does not teach the Godhead in the beliefs, but the trinity god and that is the difference. Official Beliefs 2. The Trinity There is one God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, a unity of three coeternal Persons. It is not Godhead The Catholic Church teaches the same thing. Just a little in different colors, but still three eternal persons, Trinity.

[@vickykuhrau9405]

This was very insightful. 👍

[@edenoutpost]

"Sin could be resisted and overcome only through the mighty agency of the third person of the Godhead, who would come with no modified energy, but in the fulness of divine power. It is the Spirit that makes effectual what has been wrought out by the world's Redeemer. It is by the Spirit that the heart is made pure. Through the Spirit the believer becomes a partaker of the divine nature. CHRIST HAS GIVEN HIS SPIRIT as a divine power to overcome all hereditary and cultivated tendencies to evil, and to impress his own character upon the church." - RH May 19, 1904, par. 3 - EGW

[@foxpaintingandrenovations6853]

Haskell also believes Christ was BORN in Heaven, pre-incarnate. Is that how you would define your “Trinity” elder Steve? “Christ was the firstborn in heaven; He was likewise the firstborn of God upon earth, and heir to the Father’s throne. Christ, the firstborn, though the Son of God, was clothed in humanity, and was made perfect through suffering. He took the form of man, and through eternity, He will remain a man.” (Stephen N. Haskell, The Story of the Seer of Patmos, pages 98, 99, 1905)

[@martathomas6820]

The Holy Spirit's throne is the throne of our hearts. He doesn't need a throne in heaven. He was sent here to dwell with/in us.

[@divergentone777]

Fantastic presentation! Thank you for interviewing Steve Wohburg, God has blessed him with true discernment. May God bless COM and WHM, and open doors for His servants to witness of Him. Amen

[@pitbull-love8810]

GBY! ❤️❤️

[@annettefellows8418]

Question...If you have a child are you always in close fellowship with them? That does not mean they were "alive" the whole time the parent was. It means they have a close relationship. It has nothing to do with whether Jesus had a beginning or not. It also doesn't mean that they spent every single moment together.

[@jasonstych1687]

We are the last Protestants.

[@Henry04u2]

As Dogs beget puppies, they are 'Dogs'; Cats beget Kittens, they are 'Cats'; Humans beget infant babies, They are Human. Our Heavenly Father beget His Son, Jesus Christ, who is Divine, Godhead, Holy,... before the Earth was made.... The Father passed His Godhead onto His Son Jesus Christ at His Baptism, and Proclaimed in Matthew 3:16-17 And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him: (17) And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Amen. ** Mark 1:10-11 And straightway coming up out of the water, he saw the heavens opened, and the Spirit like a dove descending upon him: (11) And there came a voice from heaven, saying, Thou art my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Amen. *** Luke 3:21-22 Now when all the people were baptized, it came to pass, that Jesus also being baptized, and praying, the heaven was opened, (22) And the Holy Ghost descended in a bodily shape like a dove upon him, and a voice came from heaven, which said, Thou art my beloved Son; in thee I am well pleased. Amen **** 2 Peter 1:17 For he received from God the Father honour and glory, when there came such a voice to him from the excellent glory, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased. Amen. May your eyes be opened to the Truth of the Sonship of our Lord Jesus Christ, Amen. DIVINITY is Godhead, Amen. ****** Caution: Trinity, triune, is Satan trying to gain worship to himself. Today's GCSDA's worship the same god of the Papacy. That is why there will be no pressure of a 'Sunday Law'....

[@YahWho-is1tt]

You mean we cannot trust the BRI to tell us TRUTH? Oh, my - what will we EVER do??? Surely we have a DIFFERENT understanding of "trinity" than the RCC - that's what so many SDA trinitarians claim, anyway. But why don't we consider this simple question: for DECADES the SDA church distanced itself from the TRINITY DOCTRINE. Not the WORD, but the DOCTRINE. The word has been OWNED by the RCC for CENTURIES now, and consequently it is associated in the eyes/minds of nearly the entirety of Christianity as THE MOST IMPORTANT, FUNDAMENTAL doctrine of all - and it is well defined in public view in places like Wikipedia, for all to see. So here's the question: Why, oh WHY did some SDA leaders come to the conclusion that it would be in ANY way beneficial for US to adopt the TERM yet somehow, ever so slightly, MODIFY the doctrine to make it miraculously TRUE and ACCEPTABLE? Why go there? That was FOOLISH and totally unnecessary, so WHY? (there IS a good answer, BTW!) So when "we" decided to "adopt" that term, reversing our stance to now become TRINITARIANS, did we also stand right up and make a big, bold policy statement about how OUR "version" of trinitarianism is THE CORRECT one, calling out the errors of all other versions? Of course we did NOT - for the purpose of our adopting the pagan doctrine was precisely so that WE WOULD FIT IN - and be accepted by the "big guys," rather than being viewed as second-class Christians! So what EXACTLY is different about "our" "version" that makes it better? Or is it, like one of our pioneers (Cottrell, if memory serves) described it: personal ideas of what it means to believe in the trinity can vary WIDELY - just as long as it is confessed that one believes in the trinity? Sadly, that is about all the deeper most SDAs have thought about it TO THIS DAY! Precious few have EVER studied it out for what it is, what it means, how it fails and how dangerous it is for the REAL gospel!

[@sarahoehninger3123]

Amen

[@annieedmund6755]

Thank you for the light you brought with your blessed guest about the Godhead. This was very helpful. And how can I get the book he wrote about The subject please? God bless your ministry 🙏🏾

[@Collette-k4n]

God bless you all.

[@bibleultimatetruth6658]

Let's say the Trinity is true then Matthew 1:20 (KJV) But while he thought on these things, behold, the angel of the Lord appeared unto him in a dream, saying, Joseph, thou son of David, fear not to take unto thee Mary thy wife: for that which is conceived in her is of the Holy Ghost. According to the trinity doctrine Jesus then must be the son of the holy ghost, and that makes the Father a lair because the Son of God was conceived by the holy ghost. That means that the Father is not really a Father and the Son that was born on earth was not the Son of God but the son of the one who is known as god the holy spirit. Meaning the trinity doctrine is a false and untrufull doctrine that gives all the glory to Satan as god the holy spirit, making God the Father and His Son liars

[@deanrobertson3415]

If you are willing, the Holy Spirit wants to dwell in your heart. If so He sets up His throne in your heart. Everyone in the universe has a heart where the Holy Spirit dwells. But Satan lost that and all those who are allowing in his steps

[@godwinkatemi5157]

AMEN TO PR Wohlberg

[@TomatoWisdom]

Trinitarian doctrine is false, not according to scripture! All praise, glory, and honor to YHWH Yeshua the Messiah! HalleluYah ❤

[@HectorRivera-h3s]

Hello sister, I wanted to leave this comment with you just to try and show you that the Doctrine of the Godhead (The Father, The Son, and the Holy Spirit) is biblical, and can be found in both the old and New Testament. Starting with the Old Testament you can see this immediately in Genesis 1. The word God is translated from the word Elohim, and this is a plural word for the Lord God (meaning at least more than 1). Within the first verse we see that God (Elohim) created the heaven and the earth, and we also see that the “Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.” Right here we see God, and the Spirit of God already. Moving down to verse 26 (the 6th day of creation), we see God (Elohim) say “let US make man in OUR image.” There are multiple plural words being used here, but one singular image. In verse 27 it says “so God (Elohim) created man in His own image, in the image of God (Elohim) created He him; male and female he created them.” Big difference from the “let us make man in our image,” it says He (singular) created them in His (singular) own image (singular). So we already see this trend that God (Elohim) has one image, but multiple are present in this process of creation, yet there is also one who is specifically doing the creation. Just to repeat, there is One who created Adam and Eve, but in the verse before it says us (more than one), our (more than one), image (just one, singular). The one who created us Jesus Christ as found in Isaiah 9:6, John 1:1-3, Hebrews 8-12. Another thing to note is that many will say that Elohim is used to describe 1 in numerical value, but in the Hebrew language there is a singular word for God, that being El (used in verses like Deuteronomy 32:15, Nehemiah 9:17 Job 3:4, Isaiah 44:8, and 52 other verses). Also note that when in the Bible it says one, it doesn’t always mean numerically 1 (Genesis 2:24 and John 10:30 for example). Moving past the creation story, you can go to Genesis 6:3 where it says “and the LORD said, My spirit shall not always strive with man…” In the Tower of Babel, it also says in Genesis 11:7 “let US go down, and confuse their language..” In Psalm 51:11 it says “cast me not away from thy presence; And take not thy Holy Spirit from me.” In Exodus 31:3, Isaiah 11:2, and Ezekiel 36:27 as well as many other verses in the Old Testament alone speak about the Spirit of God. In the New Testament you can see all three members of the Godhead in the baptism of Jesus. As Jesus comes out of the water the heavens was opened unto him and “Spirit of God descended like a dove (and this isn’t the first time the Holy Spirit came upon someone in a literal form as seen in Acts 2:3-4), and a voice from heaven (God the Father) saying This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased with.” In the great commission in Matthew 28:18-20 Jesus says “Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” In these two passages there are 3 mentioned, in one verse each play a role in testifying that Jesus is God, and in the other Jesus tells His disciples to baptize in the name of these 3. In John 14:25 Jesus says “But the Comforter, which is the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in My name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.” The Holy Spirit comes from the Father, and He plays the role of helping all followers of Christ throughout the ages. This same helper that Jesus promises is the Spirit of Truth that he mentioned in John 14:16-17. The Holy Spirit (who Jesus sends from the Father) also testifies of Jesus (John 15:26). This makes things even more evident that the Bible teaches about the Godhead because when you look at what was just said, Jesus says that once He goes to the Father, He will send the spirit of truth / the comforter / the Holy Spirit which comes from the Father, and the Holy Spirit will testify to us of Jesus. In the next chapter, in John 16:7-11, Jesus tells us just how important it is that He leaves so the Holy Spirit is sent to us, and what the Holy Spirit does. In verse 7 and 8 it says “It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you. And when he is come, he will reprove the world of sin, and of righteousness, and of judgment.” Notice also that Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a he, and says the role that it plays in all of our lives. Jesus being the Word that was there since the beginning (John 1:1-3) and spoke all things into creation (Genesis 1:1-24) was very direct and intentional with His words (Luke 4:32, John 7:46, John 8:58). If Jesus wanted to make a clear distinction that the Holy Spirit wasn’t a person and just a spirit then He would have made that distinction when He spoke in John 14, 15, and 16. There are many other verses that speak on the Holy Spirit as well, such as Ephesians 1:13-14, Romans 8:26, 1 Peter 1:12, 2 Peter 1:21, and many more. I hope this response was enough to answer all four questions you asked, but I just want to reiterate that while we serve one God, the Father, the Son, and the Holy Spirit are one (and this isn’t a new concept as shown in Genesis 2:24, John 17:21-22, Galatians 3:28, and 1 Corinthians 12:12). Also if the Holy Spirit wasn’t God-much less a being-then how could it make sense that the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve the Holy Spirit (Matthew 12:31-32, Mark 3:28-29, and Luke 12:10). The only one we can blaspheme is God (Luke 5:20-21, John 10:33-36, Matthew 26:63-65). If then Jesus refers to the Holy Spirit as a separate entity from Himself and the Father, says that He comes in the place of Jesus, refers to Him (the Holy Spirit) as a He, and the unpardonable sin is to blaspheme / grieve Him (who convicts the world of sin, and of judgment, and of righteousness, and testifies of Jesus), then is it really unreasonable or unbiblical to say that the Holy Spirit is a real person in Heaven alongside the Father and the Son (especially since you can find so many scriptures speaking about him)? While we can never understand just what exactly the Holy Spirit is, or how he works (John 3:5-8). I mentioned John 3:5-8 because the word wind is translated from the word pneuma which is also translated and used to say spirit, angel, God, Christ’s spirit, the Holy Spirit. We can’t understand how He works, but we can feel His effect even as we feel the wind.I hope you have found these scriptures a blessing, and proof that the Bible does teach about the Godhead, and this isn’t a false doctrine but the truth. May the love of God, the grace of Jesus, and the communion of the Holy Spirit be with you sister.

[@davidking2376]

@@HectorRivera-h3s She didn't say the Godhead is a false doctrine She said the trinity is a false doctrine. Trinity is not found anywhere in the Bible & its origin is a pagan believe that can't be changed. Sister White always referred to The Father, The Son & The Holy Spirit as the Heavenly Trio or The Godhead Bodily.

[@wilsongoncalves6688]

Muito bom. Ver filhos seguindo os passos dos pais.

[@southernyankee2300]

I myself, had in the past, wondered about whether the Holy Spirit was part of the Godhead as people brought up this issue. I finally prayed and studied it out and the Holy Spirit brought to my mind the point that the Holy Spirit could be grieved and more importantly, it can be blasphemed. Once I read those Bible verses noting that the Holy Spirit could be blasphemed, the question was forever settled in my mind.

[@Oscar-hj7fp]

You sure it was the spirit of God? Restudy as you cannot based such an important issue on one or two, of course the Spirit can be grieved and blaspheme! It is Jesus himself, who else could comfort us? Who could cry with us? Who knows our deepest grief? Jesus Who died for us is now in His Spirit calling us to stand for truth!

[@SDAPillarsofFaith]

Read "what" constitutes the blaspheming of the Holy Spirit for clearer understanding.

[@SDAPillarsofFaith]

The evil heart of unbelief will make falsehood appear as truth and truth as falsehood and will adhere to this position, whatever evidence may be produced. The terrible accusation against Christ, if perseveringly persisted in, places the guilty ones in a position where rays of light from heaven cannot reach them. They will continue to walk in the light of the sparks of their own kindling, until they will blaspheme the most sacred influences that ever came from heaven They enter upon a path that leads to the darkness of midnight. They think they are following sound reason, but they are following another leader. They have placed themselves under the control of a power which in their blindness they are wholly ignorant of. They have resisted the only Spirit that could lead them, enlighten them, save them. They are following in the path of guilt for which there can be no forgiveness, in this life or in the life to come. Not that any degree of guilt would exhaust the mercy of God, but because pride and persistent stubbornness lead them to do despite to the Spirit of God, to occupy a place where no manifestation of the Spirit can convince them of their error. text.egwwritings.org/read/14056.4972020?query=blaspheme%20spirit&highlight=1#14056.4972020

[@tracijohnson6236]

Does your spirit get grieved? Is it anything other than you or you thoughts?

[@edenoutpost]

The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Christ so of course He can be grieved and blasphemed. Christ in His humanity can forgive sins but when we grieve and drive away the Spirit of Christ nothing else can be done for us. Christ in you is the hope of glory and it is by His own divine Spirit that Christ dwells in us, not in His humanity but the divinity of His person. EGW states, "This refers to the omnipresence of the Spirit of Christ, called the Comforter." It is a spiritual manifestation: "That Christ should manifest Himself to them, and yet be invisible to the world, was a mystery to the disciples. They could not understand the words of Christ in their spiritual sense. They were thinking of the outward, visible manifestation. They could not take in the fact that they could have the presence of Christ with them, and yet He be unseen by the world. They did not understand the meaning of a spiritual manifestation." - RC, p. 129.2; TDG, 142.4 - EGW. The Holy Spirit comes IN all the fulness of the Godhead, while the Father IS and the Son IS all the fulness of the Godhead (Father - bodily. Son - manifested). The Holy Spirit, the one Spirit, proceeds from God and from Christ.

[@JacquiAbejar]

I like your new background.