1100 Swap Update. Well Done Lisle !! Honing And Chatting

[@chrisrust9045]

I bought a Lisle hone to break the glaze on a Chevy 454 thanks to your great experience with this company. I like to give my business to companies that offer this level customer service. Great videos. Keep 'em coming!

[@rustymustard7798]

Yeah, i used the janky plastic container sandblaster rig for about 5 minutes before i just built a plywood cabinet and brazed up a square tubing stand for it in a few hours from scraps i had on hand lol.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Haha... yeah.

[@adrianwall9130]

Hi Joel for my jet ski, I have been getting an engineering shop to do all the machine work, and I am very impressed with their work,. I have never had a problem with them, I have been using WSM performance parts, they seem to be good and the machine shop have measured and cleaned up to get all of the sharp edges off, , , well done once again thank you for your response and time doing these videos, cheers mate

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

I have had professionals do my engines several times in the past, and when I worked at a shop for Polaris and Yamaha we had all of our boring and machine work done professionally.... They do an amazing job and get it done quickly 👍 Parts I've sent out always come back looking better than new. The main reasons why I do it myself now is cost and because I have time and enjoy doing myself :) I have used lots of WSM parts in the past. Some of the parts that I got form Vintagejetski.com were from WSM, and I used some bearing kits, seals and gaskets from WSM. They make good products. I used Wiseco pistons in my 650 and 1100 engine just because they are forged, and because I experiment a LOT.... I'm more likely to damage a cast piston than the average person. In most cases, cast pistons are better and I've heard lots of people say great things about WSM pistons. I actually spent some time to day taking all the sharp edges off of my cylinders, chamfering everything to get it closer to going back together. Thanks for sharing stories about your build, I enjoy it.

[@philliphall5198]

There worth every penny and I dearly love mine Can’t beat this brand

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Agreed !

[@Jacobskibros]

Looking good! Have you looked at the modified hoods people do on these? I've seen the rise in the top middle flattened out and it looks kind of cool.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

I have seen that... I'm actually not a huge fan. Each to their own... some of them look better than others, but I like the most stock looking ski. I'm going to use the bulge thing on the top as a large air intake... there's already a pipe in there from when I bought it, but I think I'm going to change it up a little as I don't know what they did in there. There's actually a X2 where a guy did a total shave on the hood and nose of the ski and then put, I think, a Kawasaki KX125 seat on it and fibreglassed it in and everything.... It actually looks pretty cool. www.pwctoday.com/showthread.php?t=258580

[@jasonskibrothers2192]

That's great! Thank you for the time travel.

[@JetSkiBrothers]

Wow pretty cool that company took care of it.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Yeah, for sure. They didn't even ask for a proof of purchase. I was kinda blown away. I was afraid that I wouldn't get any help at all, but I was happy to be wrong.

[@JetSkiBrothers]

@@JoelArseneaultKZbin I am watching this video through again so I can really watch it, last time I kinda half watched it. Because life happens haha. But yeah I am really enjoying the video, great tech tip to not use oil when honing. It is interesting for me to see how that 1100 is coming along

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

@@JetSkiBrothers Haha... yeah, life tends to happen, even when you're not expecting or prepared for it. Sometimes I look at the 1100 and just see a big mess ... and other times I see a lot or progress 😂It depends on the day. As you know, with projects, there are a million things that you don't film, that most people don't care about and aren't that interesting, but they have to be done, haha. I spent all day yesterday cleaning out threads and wire brushing off studs, chamfering the ports. Funny / sad story ... I ordered wrist pin bearings, but because I'm used to ordering stuff for a twin.... I only ordered two ! It cost me $38 for shipping on two couplers and two bearings... 🤦‍♂️

[@januaryonenineteenseventy4195]

1200 RPM / bore diameter = Honing RPM & have the drill shaft parallel and not up at an angle as you are doing since it put forces in the angle you hold the shaft.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Thanks !

[@rickems8863]

Super stoked to see the 1100 cylinders all honed and ready for pistons. I guess it doesn't matter if you hone in a vertical or horizontal position? I assumed that you had to do it vertically to avoid the lower side from seeing additional material removal. Sure does loo like a great tool to have. More precise boring job with that over the spring loaded hone . Last boring video for a while? I've wanted one of those mini belt sanders for a long time . Looking at the HF electric one. Definitely looking forward to seeing you doing some fiberglass work . Are you completely redoing the exterior of the ski ? Paint ? and not gel coat ? What paint you going with? HF has decent sand blasters for 250-300 bucks . Maybe you only have Princess Auto up there A? can't wait to see what you get into next.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Hey RIck... Great comment(s) as always :) It's nice to have the cylinders ready to go. I chamfered all the ports today, off camera... can't film and see at the same time, haha. This is a great tool and did a good job of cleaning up by lathe boring job. :) I hope I don't have to do any more boring and honing too soon. Boring is usually done at a 45 or horizontal, except when an automated machine or semi automated one is used. The reason for this is that it is important to be able to maintain a steady speed and even, well timed strokes. Your bore is much more likely to have issues if you are boring from an awkward position and consistently putting an uneven pressure on the hone or honing one spot more than the rest. Honing horizontally isn't an issue for a few reasons. 1. The pressure from the weight is almost nothing relative to the pressure on the stones, and there are 4 points of contact to share the load so the bottom is never really loaded more (kinda) 2. Once I say this you will be like "oh yeah... that is complex" Due to the 4 points of contact and the fact that the power is input at one end, as soon as torque is applied to the hone, the forces on the inside of the cylinder are no longer up and down. The hone is trying to climb the cylinder wall, but on the far end of the hone it is 180º out of phase as the pressure from the input is actually causing an upward pressure. To answer your question, I could have just said " if you allow the weight of the drill, drive and hone to rest on the cylinder, the hone will kinda go crazy. You have to control the movement ... it's quite tiring. If you just allow the weight to sit on the hone it can / will chatter really bad and dance around, so it encourages you not to do that, haha. Also, if the hone gets loose it starts to do bad things. A spring loaded hone is more forgiving in this way, but if you get lazy with them and just leave the weight of the drill on it, it will act up too. I got my air tools on Amazon.ca ... They were really inexpensive and they work amazingly well... You do have to have a good air compressor tho. I'm kinda excited to do fibreglass work in a way, but not in others... I'm totally undecided on if I should totally refinish the ski now, or wait. I really want to totally redo the exterior, FG and epoxy paint, not gel coat. I should probably just do it now and get it over with, but I want to do everything all at once... I don't want to get it all painted and then decide that I should have fibreglassed in a mount for my fuel tank or something silly like that, and have to do a patch job on my freshly painted ski.... you know what I mean. I want to do flat black for the majority of the ski, some gloss black areas and then super bright lime green accents.... what do you think of that ? I still have to look into the logistics of legally changing the color ... I may just have to reregister it. As part of the REG process here we have to send in photos of what the ski looks like ...so I'm not sure about changing it. We have Princess Auto... no HF. The stand up booth they sell here is $400 and goes on sale now and then for $300. The last time it went on sale I didn't find out till the last day of the sale, none of the local stores had any and because of covid traveling to the closest spot to get one would have been a total nightmare. I have ordered and inexpensive one from a shady company... it appears to be a decent unit, but I'm not sure if the company is legit, lol... I decided to take my chances. Fingers crossed. I've ordered a different, more compact battery, that's why I removed the old tray. I've got lots of "little" FG things to do and that might turn into just redoing the whole ski 😂 Sorry for the novel of a comment. This always happens when I respond to you.

[@rickems8863]

@@JoelArseneaultKZbin novel , lol I appreciate you taking the time to reply in such a clear and concise way. Best wishes for the new blast cabinet. I hardly ever use mine . but when I do its great . I need to upgrade my lighting and air filtration on it . compressor is 90? gallon. I love the flat black / satin black idea with kawasaki? green , can't wait to see the design. Good explanation of the honing process. I do understand better now , except for the 180 out thing lol . Almost seems like it'd be impossible to get the hone in without adjustment first , unless there's some spring pressure. I'd do any major fiberglass work now for sure, kinda for my own personal benefit lol , but really, you'll make good content. add your own tips too . I find myself revisiting and refining old projects too , it's always worth it. Helps me to get farther along faster knowing that I'll be refining my first inclination of perfect at some point. After some time in use, you can always find something you'd do differently if you had to do it again. As always good content. I love following you and Jet Ski Brothers projects. or try to with Jacobs, always has 4 irons in the fire , lol , but hey , they all get worked on . Maybe it's part of his strategy, the analytics help him decide what videos will be more popular. Nahhh, probably personal preference projects, lol cheers. hope to see you again soon. Almost forgot about chamfering the ports. Files I assume. It's been so long since I've taken a file ir dremel to a port window. I'm both excited and nervous about multiple cylinder engines. Only ever ported small cc singles. At least there's room in these things , more than 50-70 cc mopeds lol. Any good sources for proven port maps? ever see Erikson machine and performance chanel ?

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

​@@rickems8863 Thanks for the response Rick. The 180 out thing is just because... picture the hone having a wheel on each end, the end closest to you, and the far end. The weight of the drill and hone (if you are not careful) are resting at the connection point at the end closest to you. The hone turns clockwise and is trying to walk to the right, up and around the bore. This causes an uneven pressure from the end closest to you and the other end. The other end will grab at the top of the cylinder and pull to the left at the same time the side closest to you is pilling to the right. If the hone gets too loose, the hone can actually "walk" the bore rather than slide on it. To picture this just imagine that you have a tiny wheel in a large cylinder... if it goes fast enough it car drive in a loop. The loose hone acts more like a wheel than a stone, grabs traction and causes a scarry vibration. If you have an old vacuum cleaner or power tools where the motor squeals, usually when turning it off, that is the same principal. Loose bearings or bushings will cause the shaft to walk around the hole rather than spin in it. I find it fascinating, lol. I guess I have a fear of letting people (and myself) down if I start into a painting project.... When the nice weather gets here, if the ski isn't ready to go, it will cause me to rush things. I have an idea of what I want to do, just not clear on how long it will take me. I did check today, and it seems that changing color is not an issue, I just have to reregister, and it's free. I did a bunch more stuff off camera today and kinda decided that I'm going to go strip the hull down completely, tomorrow. We will see what happens from there. I had to do some FG repairs to it last winter, but I didn't film much of it. They were almost all to the inside of the hull and the plan was to refinish the outside this year and paint the whole thing... but then I got a 1100 to swap :) Yeah, the JSB, especially Jacob always has lots on the go. I am an obsessive person and have a hard time switching gears. Once I set my sights on a particular thing... I go nuts on that one thing. Probably a good thing that I don't have a bunch of skis :) I think Jacob tries to do what he think will get views, to help Josh and for the sake of the audience... but in the end he does his own thing 👍 I actually have a nice Dremell end and long burrs so I can do all the chamfering with that. It's much easier in a 1100 than a 70cc haha. There were a few companies that made decent port templates... but I haven't been able to find anything at all for the 650 or 1100... For the 650 I made a port map, modified the map and reused it as a template. I've watched a few of the Mark's videos. He's very talented, obviously a smart guy and has a lot of experience. He may be a great guy, but it bothers me that he calls other people crap mechanics or machinists and draws a hard line sometimes. I've heard him say a few times that if you take an engine apart and there's too much glue, the mechanic doesn't know what they are doing and the same thing about milling heads... I think he's just trying to make a point .... but it's not a very nuanced view. There's always a good reason for doing something a different way, or even the wrong way, sometimes, and it doesn't mean you don't know better, or that you're stupid... not everyone has a machine shop and customers paying... more people have a "get-er-done" budget and tooks lol. I try to be diplomating and inform people without saying "this is the wrong way and if you do it you're an idiot" haha... In one video, he had grease on his hands, fingers, putting glue on crank cases talking about how to put glue on properly. I'm not saying this to pick on him... he clearly knows that he should have clean hands, and that having clean hands and clean surfaces is important .... but he also knows that in the end it probably won't matter.... and the same can be said for the use of a little extra glue... Know what I mean 😂 He does most or all of his videos in one take... that's impressive ... It also means, because of editing, I think about what I'm saying in my videos and if I say something stupid or something I shouldn't say... I will likely edit it out. I do enjoy his videos... I just don't like some of the attitude.

[@rickems8863]

@@JoelArseneaultKZbin totally get it now . looking forward to seeing the next installment of x2

[@JOMaMa..]

Awesome tutorial had to sub

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Thanks ! Much appreciated. I don't think I would consider this a true tutorial, but it has some helpful information.

[@bmxbarron]

Looking good man!! I have a real nice starter and bendix for ya, but I'm not sure if it'll make it to you because of the polar vortex going on, my stud is still sitting around somewhere in Arkansas.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

I think I have more than one bendix... I won't say no to the starter 😁 Shipping these days is hit or miss... sometimes it's no delay at all and other times it doesn't make any sense at all.

[@efijemuehphilip542]

Hi,thanks for this video. How much is the hone tool

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

$200 - 300 Canadian Dollars

[@kevindrury8390]

That's a lot of honing , good job. Bet you arm is sore sometimes.

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Yeah. Too much honing. Next time, I will probably just pay a shop to do it. It's about $80-90 per cylinder.

[@kevindrury8390]

@@JoelArseneaultKZbin cut it within 10 thousands and hone that out

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

@@kevindrury8390 Yes... that would be ideal. The reason why I did not do it that way is because my (poor) set up created a lot of chatter. I wanted to leave enough material behind so that I could hone out any imperfections.

[@johnkomosa4089]

Yep, 5 to 10 th over then hone. Wear a mask , that silicate is really bad for your lungs. That is one reason I use wd-40 to capt u re all the air born partials are really bad for you.

[@terrorofdemons1168]

How did it turn out? Did you do a compression test on it to see?

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

Hey there. It turned out pretty good. Not a professional job, but it will do. The compression test showed pretty high but I suspect a lot of this was due to the assembly lube sealing really well. I don't remember the number but it was higher than a stock engine. I actually fired the engine up for the first time yesterday, as I have been struggling to find a good CDI. I ended up purchasing a whole junk ski for parts and the ebox is mint.

[@terrorofdemons1168]

@@JoelArseneaultKZbin I just got the lisle 16000 and I will be doing a 50 Yamaha outboard. I will be trying the dry honing method also. I have a Kwik way boring bar and have it bored out where I will have to hone out .005 so thanks for doing the video it really helped me out. I’m going to try for a plateau hone using 3 grit sizes. Im trying to learn so we’ll see how it goes

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

@@terrorofdemons1168 Good luck. Sounds like you're well prepared and have done lots of research.

[@rmonaranjo6588]

Can be used with sunnen stones? They are similar

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

I'm not sure if the spacing on the racks is the same, and the lisle stones have small cut outs for the rack pins.

[@johnkomosa4089]

I would suspect they are not compatible.

[@TheTechGuider]

How much did you take those over

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

82mm. You can go larger with Wiseco, they sell up to 84mm, but apparently they recommend different sleeves.

[@TheTechGuider]

What was the bore before 82

[@JoelArseneaultYouTube]

@@TheTechGuider I bored them out on my lathe within 1mm .040" and then used the the rest of the way. This is generally not recommended, but you can do it if you take your time and are careful. If you take more than a few thousands of an inch, you want to check the bore often to make sure that you it is boring the same diameter into the whole cylinder and not just ruining your cylinder.

[@SOLDOZER]

Talks ways too much. I dont care about your life story.

[@loweredexpectations4927]

OMG... the Ice Man ! I miss you... make more raps ! Sorry that you feel that way about my video. Just want to let you know that there are other heater videos / channels out there that talk about my life 100% less than I do. Give David McLuckie a try... He hasn't talked about my life even once.