12. Ella White - First Class Passenger

[@josephconnor2310]

Its great that your wife contributed so spiritedly to this episode!

[@TerressaZook]

These stories are all so fascinating ❣️

[@WitnessTitanic]

Agreed!

[@cherylbreeze3230]

I found this podcast a couple of weeks ago and 'binge listened' to it when I had the time. It's a great podcast, I'm just disappointed that I have to wait a week for new episodes now I've caught up.

[@WitnessTitanic]

So happy to have you onboard!

[@KoolDog570]

Thank you James, for bringing Ms White to the stand. Her testimony is invaluable, because she reported everything she saw, including the lighting of cigarettes! On an occasion like that! She's the first to testify that the ship broke in two....and she was absolutely correct. Can't wait to see who else you have waiting in the wings to testify..... especially about what was seen in those final horrific minutes.....

[@WitnessTitanic]

Thanks so much! She was a fun character to bring into the podcast :)

[@beckybest1515]

Another great episode. Congrats to Katie for her excellent performance. As for Ella....you and I see her a bit differently. As an...umm...much older woman....I see her as a privileged, spoiled, rather arrogant person who was just pissed off and wanted to make her grievances heard and give herself airs. Given that, she did offer some excellent first-hand information and some food for thought. All that said - my heart really broke hard when you told about her hens and roosters.

[@WitnessTitanic]

Yes! She *sounds like* a classic first class woman as we would depict them today... spoiled, arrogant, etc. However it's worth noting that Katie and I put a lot of that into her voice. Katie could have performed the same words but from a very scared, traumatized perspective. Where she's hard on the crewmen because she felt her life and Marie's life were in danger. But we went with this portrayal because most women of the disaster have a very sad point of view. They lost their husband, they lost their possessions, they lost their children... Ella gives us an opportunity to meet a first class woman who certain existed (even if it wasn't Ella's take). Just fun stuff to think about :)

[@beckybest1515]

@@WitnessTitanic I could tell that Katie was doing a fine impression of first-class!! Ella certainly would have seen things differently than the women who lost husbands and friends and, likely, all their belongings without the means to replace even a dress or basic pair of shoes. Personally, I like her complaints about the smokers. My Daddy started farming when he was 6 and his dad tied him to the seat to keep him from falling off. He started smoking when he was 10 and smoked all his life - right up until about five minutes before he died. (Bear with me.) Lifelong smokers will grab a cigarette as soon as the opportunity arises. I can see these men, in the lifeboat as it is being lowered, lighting up and then going about their business (whatever that was). Just like Daddy would light up and then go right back to shoveling wheat.

[@WitnessTitanic]

I love this perspective! Very true. Smoking has always been seen as a bad habit but in 1912 especially. So I understand both sides.

[@adamgenard3188]

I'd have to agree with this sentiment. After hearing yet another fantastic episode and further researching the person, this woman strikes me as an entitled arrogant elitist who probably never worked a day in her life (maybe it's due to your wife's excellent portrayal). The fact she doesn't seem to bat an eyelash at the loss of her male servant really says everything about her character. Definitely very different than how a 3rd class woman would have testified. Part of what makes Titanic history endlessly fascinating, this glimpse into society of the day. Shame that Margaret Brown, a 1st class passenger with many accounts and actions proving her selflessness, didn't testify. I suspect her testimony would also be very different.

[@brycetomecek5065]

Excellent podcast as usual. Really looking forward to the Jack Thayer episode if you have that in the works. If all else fails, I would love to be on this podcast.

[@WitnessTitanic]

Jack Thayer will no doubt make an appearance! Are you an expert? Would the 1912 inquiries call you in to testify? :)

[@RankinBullard]

Really loving this podcast! I've been following THG since 2016 and Titanic has always been my favorite movie. On the topic of the movie including easter eggs and deep cuts, I wish James Cameron added a small moment of one of the officers/crew telling the women they'll need a pass to get back on board later! Is there something you wish was added or shown in the movie that happened that night?

[@WitnessTitanic]

Thanks for the kind comment! Yes! I wish the movie (or any depiction of the disaster) included events that took place on Carpathia! Its such a dramatic voyage back to NYC... it's very interesting but most movies end once the ship is gone. Which I understand, but there's more to the story as always.

[@ljpadilla564]

Love this Pod Cast Keep it up Please1!

[@WitnessTitanic]

Will do!

[@madwomanofdonnellyst]

There were various people with the “unsinkable” moniker, but Mrs White being at the average age of life expectancy at the time of the sinking, surviving, and then living for many decades beyond is quite something.

[@WitnessTitanic]

Agreed! Though I should have mentioned that life expectancy in 1912 was probably unfairly lowered due to the high infant mortality rate. So people in their 50's in 1912 weren't on death's door or anything.

[@sallykohorst8803]

Thanks so much as she was quite a lady. About the Californian i still dont understand why when they saw rockets they would at least call and see what is going on? I would be curious and then they could helped some i am sure. Well love your podcast and cant wait to hear the next one.

[@brycetomecek5065]

Sailor here: It’s the major cardinal sin of the sea for them to not to have at least looked or investigated. Regardless if they could have made a difference or not, the fact that they saw something weird and did nothing is the major failure by them. You always go look, you always ask, and you always respond to distress calls. If it turns out to be an elaborate prank, lawyers can settle out the costs in court after the fact, but you always go look and ask.

[@WitnessTitanic]

Agreed. It was a historic lack of initiative. The officers were waiting for the Captain to tell them to investigate and the Captain was waiting for the officers to tell him it was worth investigating.

[@RMSthomasFRANCE]

Wow, Mrs. White has quite a character! Wasn't she slightly impulsive? Twisting your ankle, I admit, is not pleasant. Am I the only one who thinks she's exaggerating about staying locked up in her cabin for four days, instead of enjoying the wonderful amenities of the most beautiful liner in the world? Most of the passengers were partying, and Mrs. White, who was injured, decided to stay in her corner and worry about her chickens? Ahaha, that made me laugh! She certainly had her qualities, but I don't think I would have put up with her whims for long if I had been around her. However, she has the merit, because of her strong personality, of having been able to force the dictates of the time to be one of the rare ladies to testify. Thank you for this beautiful episode and congratulations to your wife who plays the role to perfection! 🤩

[@WitnessTitanic]

Thanks so much! Yes she certainly could have at least had some stewards carry her on to the promenade for some fresh air, no?

[@danielkarmy4893]

By the way, how on earth doesn't the whole world know about the actions of the Countess of Rothes?! I had no idea either. One can't help but feel compelled by the spirit of Ella White - and every other woman and girl who was aboard that ship - to implore that her story be given the coverage that is so well-merited! (That's no criticism of yourselves by the way, more a thank you for making me and others aware of a remarkable woman. And the equally remarkable Ella White, of course!)

[@WitnessTitanic]

Well said! My wife was equally impressed by Ella and the Countess.

[@danielkarmy4893]

All we can do in this modern world - which still is not all that close to true equality but at least is moving in that direction - is to see and acknowledge the absolutely scandalous caste system the old world used to consider perfectly acceptable (and that's exactly what it was, based only upon sex assigned at birth), and shake our heads at both that system and the many millions of men who permitted, and in many cases revelled, in it, and do our best now to put it right. On the subject of the same-sex relationship: here in England, in our family we had two great-aunties, named Ethel and Lily, who lived together in a tiny cottage in Colchester for about 60 years; nobody bothered to ask them 'the question', but everybody knew they were companions at the very least. Of course, my great-grandfather used to say, they were in love. Companionship was normal at the time - but in their case, it may well have allowed them to live as they wished to live, free from condescension and outright homophobia. In a way, I can only wish my own lived experiences had been that pleasant.

[@WitnessTitanic]

You are correct on both accounts. Sounds like Ethel and Lily had it figured out (at least as figured out as they were able to for the time). Companionship is a wonderful thing, regardless of the nature of it all.

[@danielkarmy4893]

@@WitnessTitanic Exactly! Thanks for all you do to bring these amazing stories, from amazing humans, back to life!

[@beckybest1515]

Oh - why would the lifeboat seats be so high that she couldn't sit on them?

[@WitnessTitanic]

It's a great question. I've always wanted to sit in a replica to understand people's issues. I can't imagine a scenario where I would prefer to stand even if I had to hop up onto a high seat... who knows

[@beckybest1515]

@@WitnessTitanic you need to do that - I want to know! Maybe Ella was a short person like I am. ??

[@JeffreyLWhitledge]

15:05 “Captain Smith came down the stairway and ordered us all to put on our life preservers…” 26:40 She wouldn’t recognize Captain Smith because she hasn’t seen him until this moment. I’m so confused.

[@WitnessTitanic]

OH MAN! Thats a HUGE oversight by me!!! How did I not pick up on that! The later comment just came to me and I thought “man I’m so smart. I should be a detective or something…” Good catch! I have edited it out of the episode.