120 Film is Now Cheaper! || Opinion

[@rickardgrangarden4136]

Meh, it only seems to be a temporary sale from Kosmo Foto’s web page (I won’t post the link for spam reasons): “ Andrew Church, Kodak Alaris’s EMEA business manager, told Kosmo Foto: “There is no general price drop but we are running some end of year promotions on some 120 films. These films have been reduced to our distributor customers by approximately the amount shown in the table”

[@MakersTeleMark]

I can't confirm the factory guesses about equipment upgrades, except for Fuji not making anything, but I think you might have nailed it. I do think you have missed a segment where all the kids are realizing that they don't want a brick of a medium format camera and are fine with a point and shoot or an instax. This price reduction will only help us out, not the majority of the people shooting film these days. I'm not complaining one bit. Funny that I didn't see a Portra 400 reduction on your list. They know the market.

[@aengusmacnaughton1375]

Don't forget that there are *A LOT* of 'non-professional' medium-format (120/620) cameras out there -- both vintage and even new (Holga, etc.) -- so the market for general-purpose medium-format film (say Kodak Gold 200) may be a bit larger than the more professional (and expensive) medium-format stocks.

[@BenGibsSr]

Lomo announced 120 price decreases on Oct 18th. Kodak Alaris is simply reacting to that. Reasons are simple. Back orders are likely cleared, they both likely have inventory and Christmas is the best season to liquidate it. It really isn't anymore complicated than that. We will see what happens from there as it sells out and prices re-adjust to the cost to replenish. It won't likely go away as you pointed out for the reasons you stated.

[@MakersTeleMark]

Lomo is Kodak film, at least in 100, 400, 800.

[@EddyTheChump]

It’s funny, i gave up on 35mm because you cant unsee how good a 6x7 negative looks. Even 645 is a really noticeable jump. The cameras are more of a commitment though and generally more expensive end to end. Film will survive as long as the casual audience is there. Every store i know in UK outsells 35mm compared to 120 by a very large margin. I use 120 only pretty much but I’m the exception not the rule. The price drop is good for me but until portra doesn’t cost £22 a roll in 120, people who are casual are not going to be tempted. Everyone seems to hate gold 200 in 120 for some reason, despite it being very good as an entry point. Film photography has 2 audiences really, the casual point and shoot fun 35mm users who tend to be younger and are very price conscious and pros, who can afford to pay £22 for 10 shots because it’s a legit expense so it doesn’t matter anyway. One of those two is much more numerous and essential to films future. Anything that encourages them to shoot 120 is probably a good idea.

[@johnkaplun9619]

Idk what's going on in the UK Portra 400 in 120 is like $11 a roll here in the US.

[@EddyTheChump]

@@johnkaplun9619 its been like this for at least a year. From what I’ve heard, Ilford is much more expensive in the US than it is here, so maybe it’s an import export thing.

[@johnkaplun9619]

@@EddyTheChumpIlford has always been cheaper here than Kodak. HP5 is $7.79 US for a 36exp roll at midwest photo right now.

[@photos4045]

The price reduction is great, I will shoot more 120 than before because of that. I love the 35 mm but the 120 will always be king. Please continue making your videos as long as you can, I appreciate them!

[@sky_004]

The real problem of 120 film is the current prices of medium format CAMERAS. The second hand market is insane, getting any acceptable quality medium format setup is prohibitevly expensive for any normal person. No new users, no growth of demand for film.

[@Blackmind0]

i have a yashica 124mat g, a mamiya 645 1000s and a pentacon six tl, ...all in top condition and they were cheap..and they make good pics....no need for hassi or pentax 67...

[@areallyrealisticguyd4333]

TLR's are the only "consumer" level cameras available but even then most times they still require a CLA to be used regularly. Holga's are trash toy cameras that'll waste more film than its worth. And nobody repairs old folding bellows type cameras from the 30's to 60's. so as a consumer you're stuck paying hundreds for a professional medium format camera that you don't even know if you'll like and spend $100 on a pro pack of film then another $150 just to get it all developed. it's just not worth the hassle compared to 35mm

[@vipEmpire_]

Film + developing + scanning rapidly outpaces the one-time cost of a decent medium format camera. Of which, those are usually $50-100. Also, large format cameras aren't much more expensive either. Can get a 4x5 for $100-150, and a decent lens for $50-100.

[@sky_004]

@@Blackmind0 They were cheap - when? When did you buy those cameras? In the past 10 years, the price of a Pentacon Six has gone up by ~400%. It's cool that you can afford them, but a lot of people can't anymore.

[@Blackmind0]

​@@sky_004..i bought the pentacon for € 290,-- and the mamiya for € 499,--.... both this year in february.....the yashica i have since 2005..

[@Superbustr]

I wish Kodak would release P3200 in 120.

[@VariTimo]

Kodak also seems to have lowered the prices of consumer films in 35mm too. At least in Germany it’s almost back to where it was before the price hike.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

I have seen cases here and there. No official statement so far.

[@TheChosenOne_]

Which stores in germany?

[@NonExistChannel]

Hast du eine Quelle? :D

[@moritz_moments]

Zumindest Kodak Gold 3x wieder für 21€@@NonExistChannel

[@KoenRH2803]

@@TheChosenOne_I’d like to know this too

[@michaeldimmitt2188]

Thank you Nico! Keep up the good work, and take care of you. You are the only you we have!

[@LuisHernandez-rf6ru]

I remember when Kodak launched Kodak Gold 120 saying it was the cheapest medium format color film. The problem is that the "cheapest MF film" little by little increased in price until it was at Kodak Ektar or Kodak Portra prices. Now the prices are going down, and it will be around €50 again. And we consumers have to say "ohh woww"?????, no, because the only thing they have done is set more logical prices, they are not making any special. It's like on Black Friday, when you find a super offer that really isn't, because that price already existed a week before, what happened is that in that week they increased the prices so that on Black Friday you would think it was a super offer.

[@garymorrison277]

When you take annual inflation into it, the same roll of film priced form say 1993 compared to todays price is more or less the same. £6 (I'm in the UK) for the 36 exp roll of Kodak Gold, which would be the same as £15.07 today in 2023.

[@wotajared]

In Sweden recently Gold 200 120 hit about 70€, ironically above more than fresh still in stock Portra 160 in a local dealer! A comment about 1:38 that someone pointed to me is that 120 has the PITA of backing paper, Ilford mentioned in some source that the backing was more expensive than the own film and those who remember, there were issues with ink imprinting. Wish 220 would come back in limited batches, but it also has the same problem just with leader/trailer paper. Good overview of the industry and (post)covid shocks. The Kodak situation is positively ironic, when a decade ago they were scrambling to downsize everything. I decide to move towards Medium format long ago, as you say, Medium format has its own larger size characteristics. I think that I am going crazy as plan a long trip to asia with it, stocking up in "older prices". As someone else said, let's hope Fuji get back sometime. They are investing but just on Instax.

[@rickardgrangarden4136]

Yeah, I’ll probably stock up on that nicely priced Portra 160, and only buy Gold if it actually becomes cheaper than that.

[@Uwe_Ludolf]

Isn't it more interesting to buy from the Eurozone with the weak SEK? The mother company of my work is in Sweden, I thought they at work that some things we always purchased at Sweden are much more expensive for us.

[@Blackmind0]

i bought two days ago some packages ( 10 - so 50 films for my fridge) of kodak gold 120 in EU shops and amazon for € 47,-- to 49,--

[@chrismclean4458]

We have fresh fuji e6 in stock 35mm and 120 in NZ at the lab i use

[@chrisloomis1489]

Good news ; I have Roll Film backs , 6x6 , 6x7 , 6x9 and 6x12 for my 4x5 , and the ROLLEI'S also require this film. I love the real estate of 8x10 , but the lenses and cost is so huge.

[@jamesjacocks6221]

Eastman Kodak is seeking to maximize its profit (natch) and is continuing on its short term strategy where price slowly drives away customers while couping big profits for EK. I suggest that users consider alternatives, supporting the film market but not the harpys. Color negative users have a problem.

[@jeraldjoyce2995]

ive been running a spreadsheet based off of my lab's development prices. The price cut on TMAX-100 and gold 200 is huge. The cost is literally a dollar per shot in 6x4.5, which is astonishing relative to the quality of 120. 35mm may be cheaper per shot, but the overall cost is far greater than 120. Also it takes forever to shoot a full roll.

[@DashTrippn]

Some camera company needs to make a cheap 6x7 or 6.45 rangefinder. The majority of people who want to shoot 120 want to shoot 6x7 or 6.45 but it's just too expensive for most film shooters. But a sub $500 rangefinder with a decent lens and a few metal parts here and there to make it feel like a camera and not a toy (cough cough hola) would make the 120 film market explode and breathe some new life into the 120 film scene. It wouldn't even need to have a built-in light meter or a rangefinder. Just a cold shoe for a keks or a doomo made meter would work fine and scale focusing is fine just as long as the lens isn't plastic garbage. This is just a total pipe dream but I would be over the moon if something like that came out today.

[@vipEmpire_]

Mamiya Press? Graflex XL? Koni Omega? I'm pretty sure all of those are sub $500 and quite durable, considering they were designed for press work, all with rangefinders, good lenses, and different film backs.

[@DashTrippn]

As sold and reliable as those cameras are they're bulky and not really in the form factor most people want to throw in a bag and take out shooting or on vacation. What I'm talking about is a mamiya 7 or Fuji gf670w or gw670 style body with the stuff I said there's a reason those cameras are so expensive and the ones you mentioned are more niche and easier to get ahold of. But I would still totally recommend those cameras to anyone trying to get into 6x7 and MF in general without breaking the bank.

[@vipEmpire_]

@@DashTrippn I knew you would say something like that. All you said you wanted was a medium format rangefinder, and I suggested those, but of course size and weight is a factor. However, that's an argument that can be argued for any film format; 35mm or large format. 35mm SLRs typically never reach the absurd prices of Leica rangefinders, while 4x5 monorails are typically dirt cheap in comparison to extremely finely crafted folding field cameras. The class of compact but high quality cameras are usually at the top of desirability, no matter the format. Also, be glad that you at least *do* have some options to choose from, lest some influencer suddenly drive up the prices of those press cameras and suddenly they go from $100 to $500.

[@customerbf]

What about the social media driven fad factor? I have seen a lot of talk about the high prices and suspect folks have been migrating back to digital. Could Kodak be trying to address a trend and keep folks in film?

[@MrFlyby34]

Thanks for sharing, I was wondering if there is any news about Fuji Velvia 50?

[@areallyrealisticguyd4333]

there is no consumer market for 120. Holga's are toy cameras that waste more film than they're worth, no one repairs old bellows style folding cameras, and the entire second hand market is just professional level MF cameras that are a huge investment.

[@philwoodall9023]

The point is you can repair bellows folding cameras yourself. Although not optimal, lighter fuel will unclog most shutters, and decent (i.e. non Agfa) bellows can normally be fixed with tape or black goo. Bellows can be bought (or made with a little practice) and the cameras can produce great results. An Agfa Isolette III with new bellows is a great camera and an Iskra can produce amazing pictures.

[@brineb58]

I am just so happy that I can actually buy film today!!! IO still shoot a few rolls weekly of either 35mm or 120 ... totally based on my mood!!!I shoot 4x5 when the mood hits me!!

[@LoFiAxolotl]

Wish T-Max 400 would've went down as much as gold or t100 too... but that's pretty awesome! I'm down to 4 rolls and was thinking about ordering from Lomo.... but guess it's back to T-Max and Portra

[@maxwellwellmax878]

have not seen prices drop yet, hopefully soon.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

It usually takes a bit for retailers to get the discounts.

[@Der_Marc]

Amazing News. Thanks for sharing. I hope the new prices also are available in Germany.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Nordfoto already had some prices changed.

[@Der_Marc]

Never bought there! I will check it out ❤

[@housemusic325]

This announcement is 2 weeks old and I don’t see any changes in price in France. I guess some people are making good money out of this.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Its already happened in Germany, but it takes a bit of time to make it to other markets. It hasn’t changed in Finland either. But my source shared it with me on Wednesday.

[@MichaelZieschang]

Mh, shooting b/w on Ilford products only and reducing color on film these days in general .. my stack of 35mm Kodak Gold is still quite comfortable.

[@angelfoto4795]

Do you think that 220 film will go back?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Sadly not.

[@djpooyen]

someone is already making 220 film I think

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

@@djpooyen reflx is. But from an official manufacturer I don’t think we will see it. Thats what I meant to say above.

[@1989Goodspeed]

Brilliant news!

[@user-ti9zc1xv2b]

Nah, price will increase 30% in feb

[@carlosroldan7909]

Totalmente de acuerdo. Si formar a una nueva generación de trabajadores cuesta dinero, actualizar las líneas lentas significa también una inversión muy fuerte y que se pueda amortizar a corto plazo. Si eso conlleva una bajada de precios....bienvenida sea. Veremos cómo se aplican es España. Gracias Nico, buenas noticias al fin y al cabo!

[@minisla]

Not to mention the cost of posting and receiving your developed negatives. Becoming unrealistic when it comes to shooting film. Just thinking about it today. Where have you seen a sale on film. Not like most consumables. Camera stores generally add another 25% on top of what the RRP is . Nobody seems to mention that aspect. Even my source of purchase prices are on the up regularly. My days of shooting this format are numbered. Have about 12 rolls left that could well be it for my hobby...

[@warrendean8402]

any drop for Ektar 100 120 my favorite ?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Doesnt seem like it.

[@RadovanFaltus]

Nico, how about Fujifilm 120, such as Provia? It has been my first choice, do you consider Fujifilm as negligibly affecting the film market?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Sadly all I know about Fuji is nothing at all. Wish I could say something positive or not.

[@RadovanFaltus]

Fuji and Pentax seem to have language barrier in common that is preventing all interesting leaks.@@NicosPhotographyShow

[@MakersTeleMark]

@@RadovanFaltus Fuji being silent is actually accurate, because they have nothing, and nothing to say. So I respect their admission.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Pentax leaks more than Fuji, but not as much as to do much about it.

[@MakersTeleMark]

@@NicosPhotographyShow Fuji film should be shut down for false advertising.

[@MarcS4R]

i think they realised they can not milk the cow forever

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Could be. Time will say where it all goes. I just hope we dont run out of film.

[@hmuz8388]

And here s me having fun with the GW690iii and the decrease of price will make it even more fun

[@samherbert647]

I'm almost with you with my GSW680iii, I doubt i'll see the price drop in the UK for a long time

[@256k_]

i also argue that a lot of people who are shooting film now with the huge rise of P&S film cameras is shooting 35mm because 120 film is too professional and most dont have light meters or can be easily carried.

[@areallyrealisticguyd4333]

medium format cameras are simply getting outpriced for consumers versus being able to pick up a cheap p&s from a garage sale or a prosumer Canon slr from the 90's. TLR's are maybe the cheapest option for beginners but they almost always need a CLA and that's more investment than some people are willing to pay on top of 120 film prices.

[@aristoioannidis7490]

Great news Nico! I made it clear to my stockists in Melbourne Australia to pass on every reduction in full.

[@Blackmind0]

i bought last week kodak a few packs gold 120 for € 47,-- 5 rolls..... hope will go more down...

[@zKMotion]

Good, hoping for portra 400 or 800 to be a tad cheaper

[@user-ti9zc1xv2b]

Cheaper!? Ready for another 30% raise in 2024 💀?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

I sadly have heard a rumour about that....

[@VariTimo]

@@NicosPhotographyShowA rumor from where?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Someone I trust, hope its wrong.

[@user-ti9zc1xv2b]

​@@NicosPhotographyShow I work for a EU distributor, it's going to rise in 2024 across the board, by a whole lot. Don't understand how people keep getting fooled by Kodak...

[@Arturo.H.M]

Color film photography is dead, nobody knows it, but it's. It will not be because Kodak Rochester but because Alaris.

[@Adrian-wd4rn]

Because film bubble about to go bye bye. Less people are shooting film now, less people are buying film now.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Market is still growing, just shifted users to a younger demographic.

[@linjicakonikon7666]

Not less frames per roll...FEWER frames per roll.

[@Adrian-wd4rn]

You only use 3 periods if you're making a statement but removing the middle part of that statement to shorten it. Learn proper grammar. Thanks!

[@zarmindrow5831]

Fuji is like honey badger. Fuji don't care. Fuji don't give a shit.

[@DeeB1345]

120 is a hard sell. Think about how many fewer cameras there are. Then, of those cameras. How many have light meters? I love my GSW 690. But I have to want to shoot it. With scanning as good as it is now the resolution is less of a big deal also.

[@linjicakonikon7666]

Not less cameras...FEWER cameras! C'mon people, learn proper grammer.

[@markuslarjomaa3122]

@@linjicakonikon7666 It’s GRAMMAR btw.

[@DeeB1345]

@@linjicakonikon7666 ok, fixed it.

[@museonfilm8919]

😉@@markuslarjomaa3122

[@linjicakonikon7666]

Im going to dust off the Fuji 6x9 and Linhof 6x17 and burn through some film in 2024.

[@davidkachel]

Making excuses for Kodak's infamous greed has been going on for many decades, In the late 80's the excuse was, "Oh, Kodak has to charge so much more because the price of silver has gone up." When the price of silver came back down, Kodak's prices did not, and they never have. Kodak are experts at shooting themselves in the foot. This is the first time I can recall them EVER lowering prices and i am in my 70's! No cause for concern. As soon as they think they can get away with it, those prices will shoot right back up.

[@chesslover8829]

Kodak's name is synonymous with greed and incompetence.

[@samgregg]

Kodak alaris is a greedy company, Eastman Kodak however, the actual manufacturer is barely profitable. Yes, Kodak will shoot themselves in the foot at every turn, but Eastman did genuinely have to raise prices originally to not stop film production altogether.

[@davidkachel]

@@chesslover8829 I would modify that by saying that their unsurpassed greed has resulted in unsurpassed BUSINESS incompetence. But their products are/were of unsurpassed quality. They allowed their greed to blind them to the future of their own business. Instead of modifying their business model, making digital AND analog tools and materials FOR PHOTOGRAPHERS (their base expertise), they decided to make low-end inkjet OFFICE printers and other nonsense, ignoring serious photographers completely. The new movie camera was idiocy on a galactic scale. That market was dead before digital imaging ever arrived. They were trying to revive an already dead sub-market, within a larger dying market. Whoever at Kodak came up with that idea is almost certainly the same guy who came up with "New Coke" and "Hey fellas, waddya say we fire Steve Jobs?"!!!

[@EinyelThewild]

Una vergüenza los precios de la película hoy en día. Todavía me acuerdo hace 4 años comprando un pack de 5 rollos de kodak Portra 120 por 43€. A día de hoy 92€...

[@meherbaba-re5xp]

🥰🥰❤❤😍😍

[@NonExistChannel]

It doesn't make sense why 120 film is now cheaper than 35. It's like expecting 4x5" being as cheap as 120. You are getting larger negatives and that is what you are paying for.

[@tim31415]

Please, PLEASE stop this nonsense about film being expensive! Film is cheaper now than it has ever been, even during heyday of the '70's and '80's. Any price reduction is certainly a good thing, but you can buy a roll of film for less than the price of a cup of coffee.

[@museonfilm8919]

Maybe Kodak should put themselves and us out of our combined misery. It's obvious that the film photography market is dwindling to the point of not being profitable for them. They should throw in the towel completely, and make room for a company that really does care - Harman/Ilford anyone?

[@TheChosenOne_]

Maybe I misunderstood but are you suggesting the price drop is only temporary and specifically to take load off the 135 machine during the performance increase maintenance and then back to regular?

[@TheChosenOne_]

What’s the official reasoning for the price difference if the film area is the same between 135 and 120? Just the finishing?

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

Probably the finishing and demand.

[@NicosPhotographyShow]

The film inside a roll is probably less than 20% of the price. (thats my guess)