145a - Midway, pt.1 - Clash of the Titans - June 5, 1942

[@WorldWarTwo]

1. Check it out limited time Midway collectibles here: timeghost.tv/collectibles/ 2. For a discussion about the 'six minutes' and 'planes on deck' see below 3. This week there are three regular weekly episodes. Today's episode - an extra regular one - covers the Japanese attacks this week and the first day's action at the Battle of Midway. As many of you doubtless know, it is one of the most important battles of the 20th century and changes the entire nature and scope of the Pacific War. Now to the discussion of planes on deck and the infamous six minutes as refined in the book "Shattered Sword". This is what Indy and Markus who worked on the script for this together have to say: Markus: "I actually used Shattered Sword for the research after we received some comments regarding the same issue in the Sabaton History Midway episode. The problem is basically this: Older sources recite Fuchida's statement in his book "Midway: The Battle that doomed Japan", that the flight decks were full with bombers and fighters, just waiting to be unleashed, and that the Americans just hit them in those "fateful 5 minutes", when they presented the optimal target. But Shattered Sword disputes this claim, saying those 5 minutes aren't plausible, since it would take way longer anyways to launch and that the Americans could have attacked half an hour later and still inflicted as much damage as they did, because the Japanese counterstrike wasn't even close to being ready. Shattered Sword also claims that the planes were instead still in the closed-off hangars, as it was custom on Japanese carriers, unlike the Americans, who refueled and stored their planes directly on the flight decks. Following SS thesis I wrote in the research for Midway pt.1: "For the whole morning Kido Butai had found itself out of position, trying to find an opening to spot their flight decks. The relentless but so far hapless attacks of American aircrafts had paralyzed their offensive power, stifled by the constant need for defensive action." But Shattered Sword also admits that its own viewpoint is refuted by some eyewitness reports from American pilots, who claim seeing many Japanese aircraft being destroyed on the decks. So I don't think there is 100% proof here which statement is right. I personally side with Shattered Sword, but that doesn't mean that the eyewitness reports are false." Indy: "I did not include that sentence in the final script, mainly because I was already over 3,000 words, just pointing out that the torpedo bombers had disrupted the carrier formation, and inserting the planes on decks, myself not having read Shattered Sword. However, something else Markus also says: that book reaches its conclusion using ship data and not eyewitness reports, and I don't really want to disregard all eyewitness reports as unreliable. I cannot now say just which is correct, planes on deck or no, but either way, it does not affect the course of the battle. Wish I knew for sure, though. Markus: "In the end it comes down to what people understand as "full of planes". There were definitely some planes moved and stored on deck, but most likely not the full attack force that just needed five more minutes to launch. In the end it doesn't make a difference. Those planes are out of the fight either way. It's not like they expected to fight again."

[@Oxnate]

One thing that all the other documentaries I've seen on this agree on was that Yorktown was NOT in flames when the torpedo bombers arrived. The Japanese thought they had sunk two different carriers.

[@QuizmasterLaw]

Man who thought a superenciphered polyalphebetic code would be so easy to 鹽鹹

[@chuckwingo11]

It's interesting that you chose to address the controversy regarding whether or not the flight decks were "full" of planes, but not the other controversy regarding the Japanese CAP. Again using Shattered Sword as a source, the authors point out that while the torpedo bombers did indeed draw down the CAP, the Zero had a climb rate such that the Japanese had more than enough time to resume a high altitude cover. They contend that the presence of American fighter escorts and fatigue on the part of the Japanese pilots were responsible for the relatively poor performance. Those two quibbles you did an excellent job of condensing a complicate battle into a 20 minute episode. Looking forward to Part 2.

[@Yamato-tp2kf]

You forgot to mention about the USS Nautilus heroic attack against the kido butai, the B-26 that almost killed Admiral Nagumo, those two events were also very important

[@sse_weston4138]

Shattered Sword is an excellent source indeed for this battle, and to Indy's point there were eye witnesses in the book that describe Kido Butai as having flight decks full of aircraft, but likewise there are US pilots, such as Richard Best who's bomb spelled Akagi's slow burn, is a witness to the opposite of there being hardly any aircraft on Kido Butai's flight decks. In my view the two opposing witness accounts cancel each other out, with the only hard circumstantial evidence being Japanese carrier flight operations that simply would not mathematically allow for a strike to be ready in the ten to twenty minutes they had after launching. To be precise, those aircraft on their flight decks as seen by even Best were combat air patrol fighters and not a strike group.

[@dainironfoot5198]

Yamamoto wanted a decisive battle at Midway, and Yamamoto got a decisive battle at Midway.

[@JLAvey]

I'd say that Leyte was the decisive battle the Japanese sought. Either way, they forgot to be careful for what they wished.

[@f-35enjoyer59]

@@JLAvey Midway crippled the IJN’s offensive power, but Leyte (and the Phillipine Sea) crippled the IJN entirely.

[@tigertank06]

And if the Japanese had won, then what? Would that mean curtains for the Allies or would it just be delay on the inevitable?

[@f-35enjoyer59]

@@tigertank06 IMO, it would be a delay on the inevitable. Japan couldn’t replace its carriers as fast as the US could, although they would run rampant like they had after Pearl Harbor for another year until the Essex classes began coming in full force

[@paungabriel9360]

Even if the japanesse fought without making a mistake, the industrial might of the us would have defeated them in the end

[@sfs2040]

Last time I was this early, the IJN still had an elite carrier fleet.

[@billdozer969]

Lol

[@matanbaruch7728]

Nice

[@lucaszerafa178]

why does this comment say 2 days ago

[@rafaelhernandez3690]

@@lucaszerafa178 maybe it was up as a premier post. So you can comment and stuff but the video didn’t play till today.

[@randombrit4504]

@@lucaszerafa178 I mean, he *did* say he was quite early.

[@grandadmiralzaarin4962]

The truly funny thing is that the IJN actually predicted this exact scenario in a War Game before the battle, but it was deemed 'unrealistic' since the USN wouldn't know they were coming.

[@LupercusArchanus]

This is why the imput and initiative of junior officers is actually important.

[@hafeezuddin1367]

Wasnt this just a myth?

[@stephengoetsch349]

@@hafeezuddin1367 truth, not myth

[@hafeezuddin1367]

@@stephengoetsch349 history buff debunked it tho

[@michaelgreen1515]

@@hafeezuddin1367 have you checked his sources. Rule 1: if someone says they prove or debunk a theory don't just take a simple word for it. Check. Lawrence's ride to Cairo has been debunked it had been claimed to be for a long while but the clincher are his OWN notes; which are plain to read but were only found relatively recently... but don't take my word for it!

[@QuizmasterLaw]

"succesfully interrogated him" = beat the living shit out of him, insulted threatened stabbed and eventually pitched overboard. Mark Felton goes into this...

[@f-35enjoyer59]

I mean, it’s the Japanese, they’re not exactly known for their stellar treatment of POWs

[@stevekaczynski3793]

"Reasons not to regret Hiroshima" - No. 67...

[@QuizmasterLaw]

@@stevekaczynski3793 Yep. And every year for the rest of this life I am going to hear Russia and its proxy useful idiots trying to make us feel oh-so-guilty for daring to end Japanese imperialism.

[@Superlegend56]

Japanese were already brutal to pow's, but now after that 3 carrier disaster... it was honestly the worst time to become a pow

[@thecaveofthedead]

@@f-35enjoyer59 Yeah. They were grotesque. Much as this week a US military court ruled that evidence obtained by torturing a man for five years at Guantanamo Bay is legally admissable.

[@sc2starkey]

If Nagumo knew how much he'd appear in this great KZbin channel he would have put more effort into taking a good picture

[@interestingengineering291]

Hahaha

[@kevinobrien9271]

lol…good one ☝️

[@StephenLuke]

Yeah.

[@tinkhamm7251]

Hahahahaha

[@od1452]

The courage of all the Aircrews amazes me. You know the Air is hostile, the ocean is large and hostile and the only safe place is your carrier.. that might not be afloat when you run out of fuel.

[@coddpedo8946]

Have a look at the hiryū’s counter strike as well. Seven dive bombers put a carrier out of action

[@swaggery]

Imagine being the Japanese pilots seeing your last carrier's flight deck being destroyed. That would have hit right in the heart. Death by anti-aircraft fire, death by suicide dive bombing, or death by isolation in the ocean would be the three options I imagine.

[@kgfalcon9394]

@@swaggery Except an american pilot in the same situation would probably find the nearest friendly ship and either attempt a water landing or just bail out near it. Thus keeping the experienced aircrew, the Japanese were a different beast

[@jarradscarborough7915]

and depending on the ocean - if you ditch or bail you might freeze to death as well, not near midway certainly, but north atlantic? i would rather explode in the air than parachute and freeze

[@Wayne.J]

Japan lost 110 aircrew all up, most of from Hiryu and their attacks in Yorktown and Midway AA.

[@trapical]

14:10 The pilot's name was Richard H. Best He was the one who, on his own decision, left the original formation of bombers to instead target the Akagi (and his 2 wingmen were the only ones that accompanied him). Then on the bombing run itself, both of his wingman missed with their bombs, but Best hit his target. And not only that, but his lone bomb hit it's mark perfectly and single handedly took out the Japanese flagship. This single pilot, Richard Best, has credit for taking out the enemy flagship by himself and perhaps changed the outcome of the entire Pacific war.

[@richardvernon317]

Dick Best was the Squadron Commander of VB-6 and his force should have bombed Kaga, VS-6 led by the Enterprise CAG should have attacked Akagi, but he led his squadron onto Kaga as well and spoiled Best and his wingmen's dives onto that target. Thus Best changed course for Akagi.

[@petestorz172]

The near miss of one of the wingmen did serious damage to Akagi's steering.

[@Blazcowitz1943]

Its a shame he never got to fly again after this mission after his oxygen system malfunctioned and he suffered damage to his lungs. But what a hell of a last mission!

[@johnmattick3258]

Best is also credited with landing a bomb on Hiryū (His gunner James Francis Murray claimed to have seen the explosion through the smoke). This made him the first pilot to make two successful runs on Japanese carriers the same day. After his death he was heavily but unsuccessfully argued for the medal of honor due to the feat.

[@cnelsonlv99]

I'll go you one better... changing the outcome of the Pacific War very well may have changed the outcome of the European war as well! Japan became in many respects a non-factor after this battle, and Germany was now fighting a war by itself.

[@cwovictor3281]

I cannot recommend Montemayor's videos on Midway enough. They're some really detailed, in-depth mini-documentaries on the battle, roughly 50 minutes each. All illustrated for our viewing pleasure.

[@elektrotehnik94]

Can confirm, it's beyond whatever documentary on Midway you have ever seen.

[@taufiqutomo]

@@elektrotehnik94 I've never watched Drachinifel's video on it, though ...

[@chrisvickers7928]

Montemayor's Nagumo's dilemma is a minute by minute account of the time for his decisions complete with his 'fog of war'. What a difference it would have made if the crucial scout plane had taken off on time or had had a working radio.

[@Ardunafeth]

Yes Montemayor's video's are really good because he also goes into depth about the problems the Japanese had with their timings between their figher attack waves, loading ordnance and reloading ordnance and the delays the first (apparantly unsuccesful) American attack waves caused because of the trouble with doing evasive manauevers and launching planes at the same time.

[@ZER0ZER0SE7EN]

Montemayor has one video from the Japanese pov, and one from the American pov, each with fog of war. Indy didn't cover that the USN scouted the enemy fleet using the better system of sea-based aircraft, while the IJN relied more on the worse system of land-based aircraft. And how even though the US torpedo bombers scored no hits, it caused the IJN carriers to do radical evasive maneuvers that prevented launching or recovering aircraft during critical times. This changed the options and timing of preparing and launching aircraft to attack Midway again, attack USN carriers, or put up defensive fighters (cap). Decks had to be cleared to recover returning aircraft that would be low on fuel. Ditching aircraft loses more aircraft and pilots than combat. Why did Adm Nogumo order the IJN carriers to close on the USN carriers as soon as spotted, when his longer ranged aircraft could just reach/ but the USN aircraft did not have the range to counter attack? Did not mention Lcmd McClusky's decision to change his wrong heading to the right one. By chance his air group arrived at almost the same time, but from the opposite direction, as another from a different USN task force that launched much later, overwhelming two Japanese carriers .

[@justinmueller3141]

I know there is a lot to cover, but you left out how damage control was so effective in the Yorktown, that when the second strike from Hiryu hit the ship the pilots thought that they had hit another carrier, thus putting them in a more relaxed state than they should have been.

[@oldcremona]

He also repeats now-debunked ideas like the IJN decks being packed when the SBD’s attacked. I like Indy but I’m disappointed in this episode.

[@420JackG]

@@oldcremona the hangar decks were full, not the flight deck

[@BiggestCorvid]

@@oldcremona yup. The real problem was the hangars being packed with fuelled and fitted with aircraft, while the crew in their haste to refit for a naval target (instead of a second strike on midway) just stacked bombs all over the place.

[@PaperclipClips]

@@oldcremona Indy addresses that in the pinned comment above.

[@oldcremona]

@@PaperclipClips I saw that. I like Indy and he has a right to his opinion but I will defer to Jonathan Parshall as the ultimate source of well-researched information.

[@ilpazzo1257]

"This battle is decided in six minutes." And there I started hearing the solo...

[@maciejkamil]

When you want to surprise-attack, but you are surprise-attacked yourself:

[@pbmccain]

Nothing fucks up an ambush like ambushing it first.

[@leonardogomez8812]

Never knew the Uno reverse card was that old

[@Metathrom]

Surprised Pikachu face.

[@ritvikupadhyay7120]

You may have outsmarted me, but I outsmarted your outsmarting.

[@MrMarson123456]

they outsmarted the americans. but the americans outsmarted their outsmarting.

[@emisat8970]

And... so begins the sequence of events that leads to the two sides of my family coming together. I'm excited for these episodes!

[@EJ_Red]

Just wondering, by what you're saying do you mean your grandfather was doing fighting in the sea and met your grandmother while in a hospital? Or was it an American-Japanese thing?

[@emisat8970]

@@EJ_Red The latter. Both sides of my family did fight in the war, but not against each other. Japanese Grandpa (and several other relatives) fought in China, and American Grandpa was an engineer on the USS Hornet.

[@thomascrowley9122]

Grandfathers?

[@emisat8970]

@@thomascrowley9122 I don't understand what you're asking.

[@jakobtarrasericsson4295]

I think he wonders which is the paternal side and the maternal side who fought for Japan or USA

[@HistoryOfRevolutions]

"Not only must a warrior be strong with his bow, but he must have a heart full of pity for all living creatures" - Eiji Yoshikawa

[@nivlacyevips]

“Now watch this drive...”

[@Emanon...]

Nice quote. I have no idea what the hell it's supposed to mean. But it sounds nice...

[@fernandobiasi5013]

@@Emanon... basically even if your good at killing don't go around on a murder spree

[@Emanon...]

@@fernandobiasi5013 Didn't know that needed a quote, but alright... It's like having a beautiful quote saying "You shouldn't rape people". Pretty sure we're all in agreement there...

[@BHuang92]

As a Chinese-American, I find that quote hypocritical insulting!

[@James-bv4nu]

17:32 when the Hiryu torpedo bombers got to Yorktown in the second attack, Yorktown's fire had been put out, and it was no longer burning, leading the Japanese to conclude that they had hit a "second" carrier.

[@mjbull5156]

IJN: So at least we sunk the last two US Pacific fleet carriers, right?

[@rcgunner7086]

That's right. The Japanese thought that they had taken out a second carrier and had evened the odds. The Yorktown had excellent damage control and they corrected her list, put out the fires, and even get the flight deck back to limited operations.

[@mjbull5156]

@@rcgunner7086 The Japanese also thought Yorktown was lost at Coral Sea. All the USN carriers here are of the same class and therefore look similar. The IJN does not know what exactly are facing them.

[@wwoods66]

@@mjbull5156 Not quite. The Pacific Fleet had four carriers at the start of the battle. (Plus a fifth coming from the Atlantic, but the IJN wouldn't have known that.)

[@Rocketsong]

@@mjbull5156 Well, they do have big numbers painted on the decks, so I suspect at least a dive bomb attack ought to know which carrier they were attacking. Bu you are quite right, the Japanese were often wrong in their reporting on which carrier that had struck.

[@AlexSprok]

I am so addicted to this series.

[@bartink]

If you haven't given, think about it. It can be $3/month.

[@ericcarlson3746]

"Throughout history, some battles have been settled in a day, or sometimes even in mere hours. This battle is decided in six minutes" Indy's ability to dramatize and summarie the greatest moments is at peak here

[@d.e.b.b5788]

But he left out the one thing that made perhaps the greatest difference; that one Japanese search plane that went out late, and didn't discover the American carriers until it was too late. All the other search planes that went out on time found nothing. The ONE that was late, was the one that could have given them their advantage. One plane.

[@tcpratt1660]

Huge error, when the Hiryu's second wave attacked the "burning Yorktown" - per Walter Lord's "Incredible Victory": ...the Yorktown's damage control had put out all fires... ...repaired the flight deck... ...and got her up to 19 knots and able to begin flight operations right as the torpedo bombers came in... ...as evidenced by reports from the returning surviving torpedo bombers to Nagumo and Yamaguchi that a different carrier than Yorktown had been hit.

[@richardmalcolm1457]

Which almost certainly saved Enterprise and Hornet from attack, since Hiryu's pilots were misled into thinking they were on top of a different carrier. A little surprised to see Indy make this mistake.

[@steveguild871]

@@GoSlash27 And yet, here you are.

[@tcpratt1660]

I will have to reread "Incredible Victory" and first-read "Shattered Sword" (I own both books) to see if Lord took too much of Fuchida's "facts" as true about planes on the flight decks of the Japanese carriers - IIRC, Lord did use Fuchida as one of his Japanese sources, so it's very possible he didn't catch the reduction of Fuchida's reputation post-war. As for Indy, he and his staff don't make this kind of obvious error often, which make them more jarring when they do occur. (But as long as BuOrd and the Mark XIV torpedo will exist in history, "burning Yorktown" won't ever come close to being as bad.)

[@richardmalcolm1457]

@@tcpratt1660 "As for Indy, he and his staff don't make this kind of obvious error often." Agreed!

[@jmrodas9]

You are right, the Yorktown was damaged, but not burning, and could still operate.

[@ned821]

I've been keeping a tub of Ben & Jerry's just for this episode. Lets go!

[@JLAvey]

That's the spirit!

[@jarredmace1080]

A fellow man of culture I see.

[@billburken8981]

F ben & jerry's I'd rather eat low quality ice cream ( there no such thing as bad ice cream only better ice cream) than support them 2 liberal snow flakes.

[@ned821]

@@billburken8981 I think your getting confused. Snow flakes make snow cones, not ice cream

[@JLAvey]

Wow, can't even talk about ice cream without dragging politics into it. Well, I'd pick the cheap stuff over them too but that's on account that I don't feel like spending more than I have to on ice cream. Unless its banana ice cream.

[@ottovonbearsmark8876]

14:13 imagine being those 3 planes. Three planes changing the whole course of history. Churchill’s quote holds true in the pacific as well: never was so much owed to so few.

[@firingallcylinders2949]

Midway has got to be the most ironic name ever for a battle such as this one.

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

FDR : "my half of the football field. Trespassors will be shot. Survivors will be shot again".

[@gleisbauer25]

@@Duke_of_Lorraine „And with the prices of Ammo nowadays there will be no warning shots.“

[@bkjeong4302]

Not really, given that Japan was doomed the moment it tried to take on the US. The industrial and logistical disparity is way too much. Even by the end of 1942 the first ships of a new, much larger American fleet were seeing action.

[@Yamato-tp2kf]

@@bkjeong4302 That's the reason why Yamamoto wanted to defeat the US before 1943, because he knew that the US industry would start to be at full speed at that time

[@aaroncabatingan5238]

@@bkjeong4302 What are you arguing against? The comment was about the name of the battle, not hiw hopeless Japan's chances were in World War 2.

[@nicholasconder4703]

17:57. Actually, by the time Tomonaga arrived on the scene with the torpedo plants, Yorktown was not burning and was sailing at a respectable 24 knots. The damage control teams performed the Herculean task of dousing all the fires and making sufficient repairs that the Yorktown appeared to be completely undamaged. This is why the Japanese torpedo planes attacked Yorktown rather than hunt for the other American carriers.

[@DahvPlays]

3 episodes this week?! Oh we have been good, haven't we

[@Zen-sx5io]

Oh yes.

[@techshrek2827]

12:43 Those 3 planes breaking off. Dick Best with his two wingmen heading off to Akagi after the confusion with Kaga. Nice touch!

[@veladorer]

That's actually Incredible attention to the details, even tho it may go unnoticed.

[@techshrek2827]

@@veladorer True! its a good nod to the battle

[@Yamato-tp2kf]

That's because Macluski was leading the SBDs of Enterprise, and he's a fighter pilot normally, but Dick Best had the awareness to notice the error and strike the Akagi

[@mjbull5156]

McClusky had recently switched from torpedo bombers to dive bombers and messed up proper target priority doctrine, so Best improvised.

[@tmdblya]

Holy smokes, my dude. That was a THRILLING telling.

[@lhaviland8602]

Japanese: "Can we have a decisive battle?" Yamamoto: "We already have a decisive battle at home" Decisive battle at home:

[@gnexjeff]

A common misstatement and misunderstanding is that the Japanese carriers' decks were filled with aircraft. In reality, the rearming process was occurring in the hangar decks. The flight decks were kept clear to receive and relaunch the fighter CAPs. Photos taken during the attacks confirm this.

[@thomasgkourmpis4134]

You are absolutely correct. I suggest to everyone to read the book of Parshall and Tully Shattered Sword were all these myths are being debunked. The idea that the Japanese had their planes on the deck when they were attacked comes from Fujita who's memoirs have been discredited in Japan by the 1950s.

[@tacitdionysus3220]

@@thomasgkourmpis4134 Yes, I studied the same references and their arguments and evidence are quite compelling. Which made me wonder about Fujita's recollection. For several years I investigated large accidents, including a few in which several firefighters were killed or injured during major wildfires. One thing that always struck me was how the forensic evidence would often contradict the recollection of firefighters of the same part of the event. On closer study I found two things were happening: (i) our recollection is usually precise during the climax of any action, but events just before or after (when our attention is less focussed) tend to get muddled, and (ii) people often unconsciously construct a recollection that consists of what they wanted or expected to happen, based on a narrative indoctrinated during their training. In the case of Fujita, I suggest the full decks and the attacks have been become muddled together. He's not lying as such, it's just that the story his brain constructed of these dramatic events is how he unconsciously contrived to remember it. Clear forensic evidence, or the evidence of other multiple sources, often contradicts our memory (even though it seems so real and genuine).

[@AnthonyBrown12324]

Yes this was featured on WW2tv recently. Jack Best must get a mention hitting the Akagi and Hiryu probably sinking it almost single handed

[@hebl47]

This battle really makes you appreciate the importance of good intelligence. I wonder how the battle would have gone if USA had no idea about the attack. Or if the Japanese knew there were 3 carriers right from the start.

[@johnjones_1501]

Japan would have gotten Midway, and possibly a carrier Task Force, whomever happened to be in the area. They probably would have been able to follow up with attacks on the other two carriers. The Japanese knew America was building dozens of new carriers, cruisers, and battleships, so their next move would have probably been to launch carrier raids on the west coast, in order to destroy as many of these new warships, as they could, while they were still in dry dock, and Midway would have given them a forward operating base to do so.

[@Archer89201]

Japanese victory might prolong the war by maybe a year, American juggernaut once in fullsteam was impossible for the japanese to beat, they would be pumping carriers faster than japanese can be building destroyer escorts. Also even without the carrier fleet , American submarines would be wrecking the japanese merchant fleet starving them of resources

[@parshiwal887]

@@Archer89201 exactly, and we are not even discussing the Manhattan project

[@brucetucker4847]

@@johnjones_1501 No American capital ships (or anything heavier than a few light cruisers) were built on the west coast during World War 2. The important naval shipyards were all on the east coast, completely beyond the power of Japan to interfere with. In any case, the IJN lacked the logistical capability to send a fleet to the US mainland, the raid on Pearl taxed their ability to the utmost.

[@johnjones_1501]

@@brucetucker4847 I didn't know all the carriers were built on the east coast. I figured they would want to build half on the west coast and half on the east coast, because of how congressional politics normally work. That said why Pearl Harbor was a logistical strain, having Midway would have given the Japanese a forward operating base, and thus the very real capability to hit the Coast.

[@systemreset9410]

I'm sure most of the watchers of this channel have already seen that famous video about this battle by montemayor but still watched this with the same fascination.

[@jackgeigerscalamitoustail6838]

That was... one of the best, most exciting retellings of that battle... I have ever heard.

[@alvalankergaming]

This was an absolutely fantastic display of what happened at Midway, one of the best I've ever seen, and the "play by play" so well done, just a a great job all around.

[@WorldWarTwo]

Thank you for your kind comment. -TimeGhost Ambassador

[@jernmajoren]

Nagumo: "it's a... it's a.." Officer "yes?.. " Nagumo: "it's a trap!!!!..."

[@Trapster99]

Star Wars reference, I see what you did there!

[@Rocketsong]

The two key items that turned this into an American Victory, The outstanding airmanship of Richard Best, and the insight and decision making of Wade McClusky.

[@f430ferrari5]

The number one key item was IJN stupidity.

[@EddieF14]

You forgot about HYPO breaking the JN25 codes.

[@Rocketsong]

@@EddieF14 Breaking the Codes was why they were there. Victory vs. defeat turned on luck, skill, and the decisions of those two men. Hornet's airgroup went on the infamous flight to nowhere, Enterprise's group missed south, but McClusky was smart enough to follow Arashi back to the carriers. Best realized Akagi was not under attack and single-handedly put her out of action with his 1000 lb bomb.

[@thitran1362]

@@f430ferrari5 I mean what the IJN do in that situation exactly?

[@f430ferrari5]

@@thitran1362 the best way I can explain is to watch this vid from the US Naval War College. This vid provides the strength in vessels by the IJN over the US. It also provides and estimate of what each side thought the other had. If you or anybody else was in charge of the IJN force then pretty sure many can find a way for the IJN to be victorious here. A big hint is from the NWC in that they state had the IJN used their powerful Main Force then they would have won. For sure battleship shelling should have occurred. Had the IJN done this then this would have given the primary responsibility of Midway to the surface ships but the Carriers provide CAP. So more fighters and less bombers. So the IJN carriers would stay behind and the surface ships in the lead. Which body of vessels would the US planes go after now? Also if the IJN carriers planned to stay back it would have been much easier for the IJN to bring Zuikaku with them. That’s 75 additional planes. The additional carriers also with their 2 medium and 2 light carries would have allowed them to position their carriers in 3 sub groups which would support 3 separate lead surface ship groups. This only makes sense because the IJN didn’t have many options and they were running out of time anyhow. Why save anything for later anyhow? It’s do or die. The IJN knows they have a big edge. They have to hope their overwhelming vessel numbers confuses the US bombers as to what to attack. Attacking and shelling initially at night also effectively neutralizes the planes on Midway. It’s this type of direction the IJN should have taken. Code breaking is pretty irrelevant now. It only matters if the odds are fairly even.

[@jj63100]

IJN Lessons Learned: Sitting on 150,000 gallons of gasoline without a viable damage control organization is not a good plan.

[@noobster4779]

This would have been the exact same situation with the same results if a us carrier was caught like that.

[@andrewparker5096]

@@noobster4779 A US carrier WAS caught like that. Except it survived the first attack and only sunk after it got caught AGAIN. All this AFTER it was caught once BEFORE at Coral Sea and quickly repaired four weeks ago.

[@oldcremona]

@@noobster4779 Damage control philosophy and practices were drastically different in the two navies.

[@okancanarslan3730]

The whole Japanese army was based on "do or die" principle. They focused solely on speed, offense and knocking out the enemy at the cost of protection, personnel safety and damage control. They could not get the job done against U.S and they died!.

[@Littleman3240]

@@noobster4779 Yorktown was caught in that situation. It survived, was abandoned at Midway but didn't sink, and was only sunk by a submarine afterwards.

[@Damorann]

Indy brings history to life like few people can. The shock, the awe, the horror... You can feel it as he describes the battle moment by moment. This is how history must be taught. With a mix of grim realism and amazing storytelling.

[@WorldWarTwo]

Kind words. Thank you!

[@sk8tyrant]

When I was a kid, my dad and I would replay the battle with 1:2400 scale models. As Indy described the scenes I was transported back to those days.

[@billd.iniowa2263]

You were a very fortunate kid! To have a dad that wargamed, that would have been fantastic. All we ever did was go fishing. I hate fishing. But my Dad was from a different generation I suppose. And he did try. Thanx for the nice memories, I got a little smile right now. ;-)

[@profharveyherrera]

That must've been fantastic!

[@sk8tyrant]

If anyone is interested, use you're preferred search fu technique and look for ghq models. It's a niche hobby and always in peril.

[@billd.iniowa2263]

@@sk8tyrant I'd add check out a site called The Miniatures Page (TMP) They cover everything that is mini.

[@sk8tyrant]

@@billd.iniowa2263 Awesome, thank you for that. I still have all my dads minis as well as books on paint schemes, configurations etc.

[@mattfitzgerald7836]

I think that it was the constant diversion of KZbin ad breaks that prevented the Kido Butai from ever preparing and launching their second strike. :)

[@thejohnbeck]

Hilarious! Perhaps Nagumo should have used the skip button more quickly?

[@mattfitzgerald7836]

I found the constant ad spam to be particularly ironic, given Time Ghost's constant struggles with demonetisation and non promotion of its videos here. Perhaps KZbin is attempting to make up for years of neglect in one video ?

[@michaelgreen1515]

@@mattfitzgerald7836 lol I think so!

[@Chrischi3TutorialLPs]

Shoutout to the pilot of the B 26 that nearly landed a suicide attack on the bridge of the Akagi (Though its unknown wether hitting the Akagis bridge had actually been the pilots intent)

[@stevekaczynski3793]

Twin-engined? Were they involved? I know Forts attacked, and missed.

[@Yamato-tp2kf]

The B-26 that almost killed Admiral Nagumo

[@richardvernon317]

@@stevekaczynski3793 Yep, fitted out as torpedo bombers. The only US torpedo to hit anything Japanese in this battle and explode came off a radar equipped PBY in the opening US night attack against the Invasion fleet (The radar being a US copy of the British ASV Mk II set).

[@Chrischi3TutorialLPs]

@@stevekaczynski3793 Yes, they were. Its even mentioned in the video itself, though the near ramming of the Akagis bridge is left out.

[@mission101]

“Throughout history, some battles have been decided in a day, or sometimes even in mere hours. This battle is decided in 6 minutes”. Incredible statement, perfectly sums up Midway too

[@jliller]

Anyone interested in the Battle of Midway really must read "Shattered Sword: The Untold Story of the Battle of Midway" by Jonathan Parshall and Anthony Tully.

[@rare_kumiko]

And the writing team for this channel should read it as well...

[@Southsideindy]

@@rare_kumiko I've spoken to Markus Linke about this today because of comments such as yours. He did a bunch of the research for the two Midway extras. Here is what we say about the planes on/not on deck and Shattered Sword's conclusions: Markus: "I actually used Shattered Sword for the research after we received some comments regarding the same issue in the Sabaton History Midway episode. The problem is basically this: Older sources recite Fuchida's statement in his book "Midway: The Battle that doomed Japan", that the flight decks were full with bombers and fighters, just waiting to be unleashed, and that the Americans just hit them in those "fateful 5 minutes", when they presented the optimal target. But Shattered Sword disputes this claim, saying those 5 minutes aren't plausible, since it would take way longer anyways to launch and that the Americans could have attacked half an hour later and still inflicted as much damage as they did, because the Japanese counterstrike wasn't even close to being ready. Shattered Sword also claims that the planes were instead still in the closed-off hangars, as it was custom on Japanese carriers, unlike the Americans, who refueled and stored their planes directly on the flight decks. Following Shattered Sword's thesis I wrote in the research for Midway pt.1: "For the whole morning Kido Butai had found itself out of position, trying to find an opening to spot their flight decks. The relentless but so far hapless attacks of American aircrafts had paralyzed their offensive power, stifled by the constant need for defensive action." But Shattered Sword also admits that its own viewpoint is refuted by some eyewitness reports from American pilots, who claim seeing many Japanese aircraft being destroyed on the decks. So I don't think there is 100% proof here which statement is right. I personally side with Shattered Sword, but that doesn't mean that the eyewitness reports are false." Indy: "I did not include that sentence in the final script, mainly because I was already over 3,000 words, just pointing out that the torpedo bombers had disrupted the carrier formation, and inserting the planes on decks, myself not having read Shattered Sword. However, something else Markus also says: that book reaches its conclusion using ship data and not eyewitness reports. I cannot now say just which is correct, ships on deck or no, but either way, it does not affect the course of the battle. Wish I knew for sure, though."

[@hanstoli6289]

Thanks for the recommend.

[@bkjeong4302]

Shattered Sword is definitely the best source around for Midway, but for an overall view of the IJN I recommend Kaigun over the combinedfleet.com website (set up by the authors of Shattered Sword). While their grasp on how and why Midway played out the way it did is solid, their grasp on Japanese (and other) ship specs isn’t so good (the battleship comparison page contains a fair number of blatant errors, though none of them are relevant to Midway).

[@HDreamer]

@@Southsideindy It's always hard to decide what is true with these thing and eyewitness reports, especially in a stress situation like this are unreliable, but having watched Drachinifel's video on the topic (talking to one of the authors of Shattered Sword), I'd say it's save to assume that some planes were on Deck. Probably not full strike forces as suggested by Fuchida, but still some planes, filled with fuel.

[@thenaigamer2829]

The Kido Butai, the terror of the Pacific last day's

[@gmnotyet]

All good things come to an end.

[@2862WU]

In the words of Sun Tzu "know your enemy know yourself ". The Japanese clearly hadn't read the first part of that sentence.

[@stevekaczynski3793]

They didn't know their enemy - most propaganda they aimed at Allied personnel was weirdly off-base, much more than German propaganda efforts, for example.

[@billd.iniowa2263]

Do you think the Japanese would study a Chinese writer? I'm not too sure. That hate goes back a long ways...

[@brucetucker4847]

@@billd.iniowa2263 Yes, they just wouldn't admit it.

[@stevekaczynski3793]

@@billd.iniowa2263 Much of their culture was derived from there, and their writing system is partly composed of Chinese characters. At the same time they wanted their part of cutting up the Chinese pie (a late 19th century French cartoon of imperial powers cutting up China for themselves includes a samurai contemplating his own cut) and they considered Chinese people to be inferior. So, their attitude to China was mixed. Having said that, studying Chinese military writings might not be beyond the pale for them. The Japanese approach to war, certainly in WW2, owed little to Sun Tzu and a lot to trying to win through sheer elan.

[@QuizmasterLaw]

Their battle manual is Musashi iirc "Book of Five Rings". Unfortunately I read it and got nothing out of it. I must be stupid.

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

It was at this moment Tojo knew. He f*cked up.

[@fasdaVT]

What? you think the navy is going to tell an army general that the navy suffered a loss this big right away?

[@Duke_of_Lorraine]

@@fasdaVT they did tell the government (Tojo was the PM) and the Emperor, but otherwise completely censored the event. Even making sure the sailors who were part of the battle got sent on remote suicide missions to avoid any risk of informing the population. Indeed the army wouldn't learn about Midway for a while.

[@f-35enjoyer59]

@@fasdaVT Tojo was the Prime Minister, though he may have been in the army. I don’t know enough to tell

[@stevekaczynski3793]

@@Duke_of_Lorraine Navy crewmen returned to Japan were sequestered to stop them talking about events.

[@aaroncabatingan5238]

@@f-35enjoyer59 Tojo was a former general in the army before he got appointed as the Prime Minister.

[@cnelsonlv99]

I've been studying the Battle of Midway for more than 20 years, and even wrote a paper about it during my PhD studies. I have to say, you do a really good job of breaking down the events in a manner that is both thorough and fast-paced. Objective, detailed, and still entertaining. Thanks!

[@W1se0ldg33zer]

The only thing diverted by the Aleutian Island attack was fighter cover for Kido Butai. The Japanese basically assumed too much - cost them dearly.

[@DrydockDreamsGames]

The Aleutians weren't a diversion to begin with. The Midway operation was delayed by a day for logistic reasons, it had nothing to do with an actual plan to lure the Americans north. Unfortunately this video sort of perpetuates a few tropes that would be better left to rest by 2021 :( But noble effort nonetheless :)

[@OnionChoppingNinja]

"they assumed to much" Basically the Axis forces in a nutshell. Hitler assumed Britain would sue for peace when France was defeated, he assumed Russia would fall before winter. Japan assumed the Americans hadn't cracked their naval codes and where unaware of midway. How wrong they were.

[@f430ferrari5]

@@OnionChoppingNinja the code breaking didn’t matter. Had the IJN had the right battle plan they would have won. All they needed to do was use their surface ships and keep their carriers behind. The IJN could shell Midway with their battleships including Yamato. The IJN brought 11 battleships and actually 6 carriers. 2 small carriers were not used properly. They also had 17 cruisers and 49 destroyers. The US had 8 cruisers and 15 destroyers plus of course 3 carriers. The IJN could have brought Zuikaku also and the carriers could have been loaded differently. Better off with 2/3 fighter planes and 1/3 bombers.

[@f430ferrari5]

@@GoSlash27 no it doesn’t. Here is why. Battle of Coral Sea should have taught the IJN that trying to sink US carriers costs too many pilots and planes. Why does anybody want to engage in carrier vs carrier tactics when the odds are near even and we have more to lose if we lose one of ours. Yes? Also Wake Island the first battle should have told the IJN that using limited aerial bombing wasn’t going to work. Getting in too close with cruisers and destroyers doesn’t work either because you’re in enemy range. So the IJN had the hindsight necessary to not take the carrier lead attack approach. They should have used their surface ships. What the IJN could or could not have done from a “mental aspect” has to be put aside for now. This is about the importance of “code breaking.” I say again when one has such a large size advantage where you even know this then how good is code breaking. Prove to us here that if the US knew that the IJN was scheming a plan to lead with their surface ships and shell Midway with their battleships then what would the US do? Also any military planner has to factor the enemy may be out there. Yes? The irony is that we are told that the IJN wanted the US carriers to eventually show up anyhow to lure them into battle.

[@seanbryan4833]

@@f430ferrari5 But the primary goal of the Midway operation was to lure the American carriers into coming, not to present them with such overwhelming force that they would stay away. As for the Zuikaku, yes, they absolutely could have had it there if their doctrine had not been so inflexible that they wouldn't mix the remnants of two separate air groups to make a new one. Rigid thinking was a big reason behind many Japanese defeats.

[@sachinaraszkiewicz785]

I can't express properly how hyped I've been for this episode!

[@gmnotyet]

You have *GOT* to watch the series of 3 videos on Midway. FANTASTIC! -> kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJWbkKmFat-loNE

[@neptune3569]

Just you wait until the Stalingrad videos later this year

[@sachinaraszkiewicz785]

@@gmnotyet I have, twice, including once today! Amazing!

[@neptune3569]

@@gmnotyet It's pretty long

[@roymurphy4328]

I think I speak for everyone here when I say this was intense. Cant wait for part 2.

[@gunman47]

7:35 Ah the Aleutian Zero. I was just reading about it earlier. The Americans actually got a bit lucky here because Japanese pilots actually had orders to destroy any intact Zero fighter planes to prevent enemy capture, but they could not bear to do it in this case as they feared that their fellow airman in the crashed Aleutian Zero may have survived.

[@rlosable]

Yes, but the Americans also made some mistakes in repairing it, leading to a long standing believe that the Zero had issues with pulling negative Gs, when in fact it did not. That incorrect tactical advice probably cost quite a few American pilots their lives. Luck is a fickle mistress...

[@bartink]

@@rlosable I didn't know that. Interesting.

[@stevekaczynski3793]

@@rlosable Maybe although by mid-1942 enough Allied fighter pilots who had taken on Zeroes and survived knew there were some things you didn't do, like try to dogfight them. They were known to be lethally manoeuvrable.

[@minarchist1776]

When that Zero came down the pilot made the mistake of trying to land it on tundra. As a result the plane flipped tail over nose ending up on its back and appeared to be more heavily damaged than it actually was.

[@rlosable]

@@stevekaczynski3793 exactly, and some great intel was gained from that Zero, but also some bad...

[@blackpearl8439]

Have watched the film many times and yes, read the books, and this is so immersive and brings us right there! Great work and thank you for what you are doing

[@johnnysolami]

My grandfather was part of the VB-5 bombing squadron and served on the YorkTown. He remembered a torpedo hitting the side of the ship knocking him out. When he woke up on the deck and he saw motor oil on the surface of the water. Thank you so much for making this video.

[@williamst.romain7393]

Yorktown was no longer on fire by the time of the 2nd strike. I recommend Montemayor's video series on the battle. He does an excellent job covering all the details.

[@muhammadalviandi7998]

I dunno why, but when i watch this episode im holding my tears... Those brave souls...

[@thunderboltlightning6010]

12:04 It’s pretty much agreed upon by naval historians now, that at the time of American dive bombers’ arrival, the decks of Japanese carriers were near empty. Maybe half dozen of zeros at most was on deck. This is supported by witnesses accounts and documents on Japanese carrier operating procedures, refueling and rearming were normally done in hangar, not on deck.

[@HB-vi3om]

Regardless of whether there were planes on deck, hadn't they just done the sea/land/sea ordnance shuffle? Shouldn't a bunch of that (and cast iron avgas plumbing) made enough secondaries to spell doom?

[@jarradscarborough7915]

Flight deck: the flat surface on the top of the ship where aircraft can take off and land. Hangar deck: the area below deck to stow aircraft when not in use. as you say the planes were in the hangar - which is a deck

[@thunderboltlightning6010]

@@GoSlash27 Both the 1976 and 2019 Midway movie showed very few planes on flight deck at the time of American attack.

[@gunman47]

Oh boy we are in for such a good treat here! Thank you Indy & team!

[@VayleGW]

Nimitz: Hey Japan, I heard you like surprise attacks, so here, we surprise attack your surprise attack! oh, that's not what you meant?

[@TheIfifi]

A tragedy that most of the Torpedo bombers never got to realize just how a significant role their sacrifice played.

[@stevekaczynski3793]

Only one survivor from those shot down, and he survived strafing by Japanese planes.

[@CK-nh7sv]

@@GaldirEonai The sacrifice thing is actually true, though. No one had planned for it to happen but it did. The US had messed up their launches so that instead of one coordinated strike, the US attacks came over a long period of time and the slow torpedo bombers were easy prey for the Japanese. The dive bombers found the carriers through some incredible luck as they had gone to the wrong position initially and then managed to follow a Japanese ship trying to catch up with the carriers after taking care of an american submarine. When the dive bombers arrived at the carriers, the CAP wasn't there to stop them after dealing with other American attacks all morning. Thus the Americans managed to take Kaga, Soryu and Akagi out of action. Had they executed the originally planned, coordinated air strike, more torpedo bombers would have survived but the US propably wouldn't have dealt as much damage as they did. They failed their way to victory.

[@TheIfifi]

@@GaldirEonai It strikes me that lack of aircover was critical to the success of the dive bombers. It wasn't the 'plan' of the torpedo bombers sure, but it's impact in the battle was still critical.

[@chuckysmaria6466]

@@GaldirEonai Montemayor made a video that the sporadic attack of torpedo planes pined down any attempt to lauch the strike force.

[@oldcremona]

Jonathan Parshall has stated that the main effect the tragic and ill-fated torpedo attacks had was to “take time off the clock” for the Japanese counter-attack.

[@gabem3593]

That opening gave me chills. Beautifully delivered Indy!!

[@giusepperandone9586]

For anyone interested in another very nice and in depth explanation of the battle I highly recommend the 3 video series about Midway from Montemayor. They are just epic.

[@nl2126]

When i was listening to you i was like a sport fan in 1920 listening to a radio. And as the pressure rose higher and higher i felt chills on my back! Indi you became so good at this! I listen to you since ww1 and i can see the rise in your experience, dont ever stop on doing such greate content

[@Jersey2tall86]

Indy, I've probably seen several score if not more than a hundred of your WWI and WWII episodes. This is the best episode yet. Admittedly, the videos can sometimes get a little dry or sterile, but this one had me completely riveted. Not only that, I've seen many documentaries on the Battle of Midway (plus the Hollywood movies, of which the 1977 one with Charlton Heston and Henry Fonda as Nimitz I've always greatly enjoyed each time I've seen it), and it is one of my most favorite battles to read about and study, but this episode is just very, very well done, and I cannot wait 'til part two. Great work on this one.

[@timl.b.2095]

I recently watched another KZbinr's video "The Unsolved Disaster of Midway - The Flight to Nowhere." It details what the Hornet's air group did NOT accomplish on June 4. It seems well documented, and jibes with some of the other commenters here about this, e.g., DEspresso.

[@Tuning3434]

Military Aviation History. -Bernhard- -Lucas- Chris doesn't skip on sources. _keeps sipping his coffee, cause he needs it_

[@Analyst104]

This was a very good video. I'd never heard of the Hornets failure and the mutiny of several aircrew during the battle.

[@tyvernoverlord5363]

@@Analyst104 for decades VT-8’s tragic end was thought of a buying the dive bombers the gap needed to punch those 3 initial carrier kills in. With new light, it’s a whole other sort of uggly. But BuOrd producing and backing up continued slipshod Mk.14 and all the torpedo squadrons dropping said duds (those that managed to live long enough to drop said turds) was the FINAL insult to injury of the events that day. How EVERYONE at BuOrd managed to avoid court martial, firing squad, or worse is a COLLASSAL fowlup that will forever tarnish what was a great naval victory, and will forever paint a target on the record of BuOrd as an institution in American Arms Procurement that ACTIVELY got men killed.

[@stephengoetsch349]

I saw that KZbin also. Very good. Perhaps TimeGhost should mention it somehow. Just reaffirms my assessment that the Americans got lucky beyond their dreams. “6 minutes…” Amazing.

[@Analyst104]

@@stephengoetsch349 If you get a chance, this guys 3 part video has a very detailed analysis of the battle. kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJWbkKmFat-loNE

[@oskarrasmussen7137]

If anyone wants more details on Midway I can highly recomend Montemayor's "The Battle of Midway 1942: Told from the Japanese Perspective" videos. Here's the first: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJWbkKmFat-loNE

[@elektrotehnik94]

This ^^

[@marcusjhonsen6139]

++

[@jaegerbomb269]

May history never forget the name Enterprise.

[@carlosn894]

@Treasures of Distraction Its a Star Trek reference

[@jeeveey]

Damn shame the Enterprise was scrapped.

[@cristianvandenbosse8989]

@@jeeveey I would have loved to visit het

[@f-35enjoyer59]

@Treasures of Distraction also the fact she survived many bomb hits and the Japanese declared her sunk 6 times I believe, hence the nickname Grey Ghost. Also was in Star Trek I believe, but I know next to nothing about it

[@fasdaVT]

According to star trek it will still be a popular name of powerful ships well into the 23rd century

[@joshuadesautels]

17:58 Yorktown was NO LONGER burning by that point, hence why the Japanese second-wave pilots assumed this must be a different carrier.

[@christopherrasmussen8718]

I was stationed at PACOM, Pearl Harbor in the mid 80s. The Battle of Midway is memorialized in many ways. Epic paintings on the walls. Ceremonies, where I got to meet many veterans of the battle. I was a SEABEE and Midway is why we came into being. The Pacific war is epic. Many more epic battles at sea are left to fight.

[@jonreich9483]

This is the first naval battle my Zadie (great grandfather) would see action at. He was aboard one of the destroyers screening the American carriers.

[@Darkdaej]

I have a feeling that in precisely two years (+ 1 day) we're gonna have one heck of an episode

[@TeutonicEmperor1198]

Wait about the episode of two years and 17 days in the future

[@Darkdaej]

@@TeutonicEmperor1198 Yeah, some town named Carantan might have to do with it I hear.

[@principalityofbelka6310]

Maybe we'll hear something about a "Turkey Shoot" somewhere.

[@CK-nh7sv]

Just wait for all the confusion that'll happen in two years, one month and 15 days...

[@petestorz172]

"Turkey Shoot at the Utah, Omaha, Gold, Sword, and Juno Corral"? Those will be super-packed episodes!

[@Phoenix-ej2sh]

"The Japanese flight decks were packed with planes." - This accords neither with Japanese doctrine nor reports from American pilots and is generally considered by modern scholarship not to have been the case. Japanese carriers spotted their planes in the hangars, not on deck. "The Japanese fighters were pulled down to sea level by the attacking torpedo planes." - If you look at a timeline of the attack, the zeroes had plenty of time to get back up to altitude between the torpedo plane attacks and the arrival of the dive bombers. What they *did* accomplish was to deplete the meager ammunition supply of the zeros and to distract the CAP, which was not well organized or directed.

[@SlaghathortheGreat]

IIRC Japanese historians were suprised western historians believed the Japanese guy who made the claim about flight decks full planes.

[@bartink]

@@penultimateh766 Thank you for this. His critique comes off as needlessly harsh, especially when you consider that the longstanding historical view is presented and his correction comes from a more recent revision (right or not).

[@jasondouglas6755]

I noticed that too Dawn. I was going to point it out but you beat me to the punch.

[@masonke1]

@@bartink The "Recent Revision" is from 2005, 17 years ago

[@maciejkamil]

I hope that timeghost will address this. It's a serious thing.

[@matthewg.305]

This is amazing. The idea that six minutes can shape the entire momentum of a war is nothing short of incredible. It truly demonstrates the immense complexity, challenge, and role of chance in modern combat.

[@stevebarrett9357]

You folks at Time Ghost are absolutely amazing. I've read about Midway many times and am familiar with the outcome, yet here I was, riveted in my chair of finite knowledge, listening to Indy call the fight blow by blow. Bravo! Can't wait for part 2. : )

[@QuizmasterLaw]

Well, sure, 4 carriers are burning, but I'm sure highly trained damage control teams are hard at work quenching the flames

[@JohnJohn-pe5kr]

They are either abandoning their ships or are all dead.

[@yoseipilot]

@@JohnJohn-pe5kr It’s kinda possible to safe those ships (they have enough time), if they are experienced like Americans damage control, like USS Franklin happened.

[@Eastmarch2]

Yeah their damage control manuals were... lacking. It's interesting that Yorktown, already battered at Coral Sea took so many hits and still didn't sink until a sub hit her while IJN carriers took few hits and were lost.

[@brucetucker4847]

@@yoseipilot Franklin wouldn't have survived in 1942. American damage control greatly improved over the course of the war. And with the possible exception of Akagi there was no hope of saving those carriers, even if they'd had 1945 American damage control training - too many critical systems were knocked out, partly due to lack of redundancy. You can't fight fires if your water mains are all broken and your few portable pumps are destroyed.

[@brucetucker4847]

@@Eastmarch2 Armed and fueled aircraft were the main difference. If Yorktown had had half her strike group armed and fueled on deck or in the hangar when the Japanese attacked she would have suffered the same fate as Lexington.

[@albertjackinson]

Just like the retelling Battle of the Coral Sea, the whole team, but especially Indy, did a great job retelling the events! June 7th will definitely be interesting, but I also wonder what's happening elsewhere in the world. Oh well. We have to wait until tomorrow in eager anticipation!

[@benjamindover2601]

USA during ww2 "Ship printer go brrrrrrr"

[@Grondorn]

That's 1943 onwards to be exact. At this point, the Japanese enjoy a significant advantage.

[@tyvernoverlord5363]

300 ships to 7000 by August ‘45 We certainly had ship making down to an algorithm during the war...

[@peterteichroeb2445]

Amazing breakdown of the battle in this first part, thank you Indy and team. As a kid, I use to wake up Saturday mornings to watch cartoons, now, as an adult, I wake up Saturday mornings to watch Indy.

[@sk8tyrant]

It's amazing to me that arguably the most important single battle of the Pacific was decided by 6 minutes. You all do great work.

[@amcalabrese1]

When I was a kid in school my teacher referred to this as “The Miracle at Midway”.

[@stevekaczynski3793]

No land conflict of WW2 turned on such a small amount of time elapsing.

[@seneca983]

The attack on the Aleutians wasn't a diversion. I'll put a link to a video by Military History not Visualized in a comment below this.

[@seneca983]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/n3WqoHhqo5toma8

[@joseaca1010]

Nice bit of information

[@DrydockDreamsGames]

Right on the money

[@hanstoli6289]

A highly detailed video of midway is by Montemayor. Multiple parts.

[@histoky2010]

Don't worry guys Yamamoto is coming with his Battleships, it will turn the tide alone

[@bkjeong4302]

No they won’t because battleships are useless against carriers. Yamamoto will just call them off.

[@fasdaVT]

What will a hotel bring to a fight between warships?

[@nikitasimonsen1459]

@@bkjeong4302 whoosh

[@mjbull5156]

Spruance: "We did what we came to do. We are not sticking around to be caught with our pants down by a surface fleet."

[@mjbull5156]

@@bkjeong4302 Under normal circumstances, but the USN air wings are now severely undermanned by the losses incurred in this battle. The torpedo squadrons largely do not exist anymore except on paper, for instance.

[@Eienias]

now THAT was intense, indy's narration, the visuals, the battle. it honestly felt like i was watching a movie. fantastic. what a turning point!

[@thewidow7864]

"do not keep your aircraft full of fuel, bombs and torpedoes right under your deck" - Sun Tzu, probably

[@roguemjd]

I'm shocked that you didn't mention Nagumo's rearmament decision crisis, given that it's one of the huge "what-ifs" of WW2.

[@willyreeves319]

successfully interrogated - beaten and stabbed until he gave up intel then he was tied to a steel drum and tossed overboard. others were beaten unconscious and tossed overboard or hacked up with a fire ax. all this according to their log books.

[@Yora21]

Yorktown: "I didn't heard no bell!"

[@amarnathmohan1624]

Absolutely love these graphics! Great detail as well. You can see the three planes peel off from the attack at 12:46 who then attack Akagi around 14:25.

[@DrVictorVasconcelos]

I think most people don't understand the problem with being a military plane flying low. Speed is crucial to decide who gets behind whom, which decides who fires on whom, and whoever's high can get a boost of 10m/s² of gravity acceleration.

[@D4rkn3ss2000]

Last time I was this early, AF still had a water supply ^^

[@HootOwl513]

The Whole World Wonders if AF ever got the parts and technicians to fix their desalinators?

[@gunman47]

This might be a bit trivial, but on June 4 1942, Adolf Hitler pays a visit to Finnish Commander in Chief Carl Mannerheim, who is celebrating his 75th birthday, at Immola Airfield. What makes this meeting stand out is that this is the only known time where there is a voice recording (albeit clandestinely recorded) of Hitler speaking in his private conversational form rather than his usual public speaking style.

[@Kay2kGer]

ahh right mannerheims birthday. i just found this recording recently, but its a good ramble of hitler´s thoughts. also it makes it just special to hear his thoughts as the war is in the middle of it

[@Southsideindy]

If you think that's not going to be covered in this series, you are mistaken. There's a Mannerheim special soon.

[@gunman47]

@@Southsideindy Oh cool Indy, looking forward to it! 👍

[@minus100plus2]

Mark Felton did a video on this called, "Hitler's "Everyday" Voice." The Mannerheim conversation is in there, but, there's another clip of him speaking in his "normal" voice.

[@gunman47]

@@minus100plus2 Ah yes, I have seen that video from Mark Felton. In his video, he raised three examples of Hitler's voice, the first two are of those he is filmed speaking in public, while the third example is secretly recorded and hence considered more of a private setting.

[@stevenmoore4612]

Looks like Yamamoto got the uno reverse card this time around.

[@rayw7960]

Indy, you might to take a look at Parshall and Tully's "Shattered Sword" (2005), a revisionist history of Midway battle using many new Japanese sources, including the fact that Fuchida lied in his history of Midway, "Midway: The battle that doomed Japan" . See chapter 24 for overview of errors these lies caused in subsequent histories which were written concerning the Battle of Midway, supporting information found throughout the the preceding chapters. If the information in this work is correct, which I believe it is, it would significantly affect the information in this particular video. I do think your WW2 series on the whole is very well done.

[@Brandazzo22]

Bravo Indie! One of your best best performances! This excitement I got watching this video had my heart racing. I never thanked Time Ghost/WW1/WW2 for the million of videos I have watched the past two years. To show my appreciation, I finally joined your Patreon. You guys keeping doing what you do

[@demonicinqusition]

I'm sure the IJN can turn the around after their super-battleship Yamato arrives... right?

[@rare_kumiko]

I love your channel and I've been a Patreon supporter for a while, so no offense intended at all, but I was a bit disappointed by your coverage of the battle here, after the amazing one we had for Pearl Harbor. First, there were a couple of major mistakes. The Aleutians operation was NOT a diversion, and the decks of the Japanese aircraft were NOT full of planes, they were mostly in the hangar, with possibly a few CAP (Combat Air Patrol) fighters taking off or landing. They wouldn't be able to land and replenish CAP fighters if there were other planes on deck, as WW2 carriers did not have the ability to take off and land planes at the same time. They could either spot planes, launch them, or recover them. And at that point, they were quickly recovering and launching CAP planes. The Zeros also weren't pulled down by the torpedo bombers. Zeros can climb to dive bomber altitude in 5 minutes, they had plenty of time for that. The issue was that the Japanese "tunnel-visioned" on the torpedo bombers of VT-3 (VT-6 and VT-8 were long gone by the time the dive bombers arrived) and on Thatch's VF-3, sent all their CAP there (north-east), and the picket ships also missed the incoming dive bombers (it's possible that the lookouts were actually looking at the action near the carriers). The only thing the first two torpedo bomber squadrons achieved was keeping the carriers busy replenishing CAP fighters. Source for all my claims is Parshall and Tully's Shattered Sword. There are also a few other minor mistakes here and there, but less important. Then, I wish you had gone into more detail into a lot of things. For instance: - Hornet's flight to nowhere, Waldron's insubordination and how his squadron was wiped out. VT-6 also being wiped out, VT-3 doing just a bit better due to having some fighter support from Thatch's VF-3 (also, him successfully performing the Thatch weave for the first time!) - The dynamics of carrier operations. Why the Japanese carriers couldn't spot and launch an attack while under attack (as they had to service CAP aircraft, and at one point also recover Tomonaga's Midway strike). - Nagumo's dilemma, why it wasn't as clear cut with the information he had, and why he probably made the right choice with what he knew (only the wrong choice in hindsight). - How Nautilus drew destroyer Arashi away, then when it was going back Wade McClusky of Enterprise, almost about to return to base, saw it and decided to follow it to the rest of the Kidou Butai. - A bit more detail on the damage to Japanese carriers (how Hiryuu and Soryuu were quite weakly constructed and were almost destroyed by the bombs, while Kaga just got hit a lot, and Akagi burnt down from a single bomb hit due to the ordnance and fueled aircraft in the hangars). - Yorktown's damage control being much more effective, her having detected the Japanese strike with radar, and having time to get rid of anything explosive or flammable in the hangars. They also had a system to purge fuel lines with CO2. Just off the top of my head, there's probably a few other things.

[@mjbull5156]

"In the first six to twelve months of a war with the United States and Great Britain I will run wild and win victory upon victory. But then, if the war continues after that, I have no expectation of success." Isoroku Yamamoto Welcome to Month Seven, Admiral.

[@aaroncabatingan5238]

That was oddly prophetic.

[@patwiggins6969]

That's why Midway was so important. Cripple the Americans now or face a bitter defeat later. The assumption was that the Americans would surrender the Pacific after a Japanese victory at Midway and Japan would be free to concentrate on other issues without US interference

[@2Links]

@@GaldirEonai Yeah. The only problem is that the logic only works if you ignore all the lives that gamble will cost. A shame they did.

[@mjbull5156]

@@aaroncabatingan5238 Not really. Yamamoto knew his profession, and had few illusions about Japan's ability to compete with the US in a naval war of attrition.

[@Rocketsong]

@@GaldirEonai They could have gone with the "Northern Plan" instead. Japan already had experience defeating the Russians, and the old fields of Kamchatka could have fueled the empire just as easily.

[@rhtz23]

Indy knocked this episode out of the park. Great storytelling! And excellent work by the whole team with music, graphics, editing and more.

[@WorldWarTwo]

Thank you so much for the kind words! We really appreciate your support, and the attention you paid to all aspects of this production. Means a lot!

[@kjpmitch]

Thanks!

[@WorldWarTwo]

@Kieran Mitchell Thanks for watching

[@KaiserMattTygore927]

one of the most important battles of modern history.

[@natekaufman1982]

One of?

[@aronjanssonnordberg307]

@@natekaufman1982 It's probably the turning point in the Pacific Theatre (spoilers), so it's one of the most important ones, but there are other parts of the war that were just as decisive, like Stalingrad on the Eastern Front or El Amain in North Africa.

[@mikepette4422]

1942 the most important year had the most important battles

[@jamesfranken8676]

Just so everyone knows, the planes on the deck vs hangars argument is just that, an argument. Neither side has definitive proof, analytics seems to suggest hangars, multiple eyewitness reports suggest deck. But there really is no right vs wrong here, neither side has the smoking gun to prove their side right. So screeching about it not being right is a little lame, there are historians who would both agree and disagree with whatever view you take on the issue. And until I believe 2004-2005, decks was seen as the right answer to this question just because that’s what eyewitnesses had said.

[@emisat8970]

Finally the voice of reason.

[@bkjeong4302]

Eyewitness accounts in battle often tend to be rather unreliable. Just look at Samar where American eyewitness accounts often didn’t match up with American or Japanese logs and gave a hilariously false view of the battle for over half a century until someone cross-referenced everything. Or South Dakota’s massively inflated AA killcount at Santa Cruz when none of the other American ships or the Japanese records of plane losses suggest anything like that.

[@robert48044]

little bit passive aggressive, just so you know

[@Snp2024]

I say we make time machine and go back to midway with I phone . Let's start timemachine go fund me

[@robert48044]

@@Snp2024 Imagine if all of a sudden Time machines were feasible and affordable, there would be "plenty of explaining to do"

[@SlaghathortheGreat]

it felt like some of the information in this episode was pretty outdated when looking at the book about the battle of midway: shattered sword

[@Southsideindy]

I've spoken to Markus Linke about this today because of comments such as yours. He did a bunch of the research for the two Midway extras. Here is what we say about the planes on/not on deck and Shattered Sword's conclusions: Markus: "I actually used Shattered Sword for the research after we received some comments regarding the same issue in the Sabaton History Midway episode. The problem is basically this: Older sources recite Fuchida's statement in his book "Midway: The Battle that doomed Japan", that the flight decks were full with bombers and fighters, just waiting to be unleashed, and that the Americans just hit them in those "fateful 5 minutes", when they presented the optimal target. But Shattered Sword disputes this claim, saying those 5 minutes aren't plausible, since it would take way longer anyways to launch and that the Americans could have attacked half an hour later and still inflicted as much damage as they did, because the Japanese counterstrike wasn't even close to being ready. Shattered Sword also claims that the planes were instead still in the closed-off hangars, as it was custom on Japanese carriers, unlike the Americans, who refueled and stored their planes directly on the flight decks. Following Shattered Sword's thesis I wrote in the research for Midway pt.1: "For the whole morning Kido Butai had found itself out of position, trying to find an opening to spot their flight decks. The relentless but so far hapless attacks of American aircrafts had paralyzed their offensive power, stifled by the constant need for defensive action." But Shattered Sword also admits that its own viewpoint is refuted by some eyewitness reports from American pilots, who claim seeing many Japanese aircraft being destroyed on the decks. So I don't think there is 100% proof here which statement is right. I personally side with Shattered Sword, but that doesn't mean that the eyewitness reports are false." Indy: "I did not include that sentence in the final script, mainly because I was already over 3,000 words, just pointing out that the torpedo bombers had disrupted the carrier formation, and inserting the planes on decks, myself not having read Shattered Sword. However, something else Markus also says: that book reaches its conclusion using ship data and not eyewitness reports. I cannot now say just which is correct, ships on deck or no, but either way, it does not affect the course of the battle. Wish I knew for sure, though."

[@SlaghathortheGreat]

@@Southsideindy thank you guys for the answer, I honestly never expected to get a reply to any of my comments. I have been on a battle of Midway binge lately so I have a whole bunch of fresh information in my head but to put that in a video would probably a few hours and not the 20 minutes you guys have, and I can definitely see that you guys are way better in deciding how to tell what happend. I would however like to add that a piece of information that would explain why the japanes carriers where taken out of the fight so fast after one strike in comperison to the US carriers: most of the Japanes carries were build in the 1920's and had for instance cast iron water pipes for fire fighting, so after the bombs hit the crews didn't have any water to fight the fire's with as all the pipes nearby had burst. another problem was that most of the japanes crews had almost no damage control training only the specific damage control crew, I don't remember what carrier it was but after getting hit only one damage control officer remaind alive and had to try to basicly organize rescue efforts all by himself. Again thank you for the answer and have nice day, I always enjoy the content you guys put out.

[@OneLeatherBoot]

@@SlaghathortheGreat My understanding as well is that the design of the Japanese carriers didn't have the same degree of compartmentalised hangers like the US carriers. So once there was an explosion in one section, it was essentially free to spread throughout the hanger deck. Damage control on US ships throughout the war was exceptional, with many ripped apart ships able to remain afloat to be towed for repairs.

[@maygeror]

This video is not Indy's finest moment. Still I joined his army.

[@germanhernanburgosffrench-4471]

Midway has it all. It's the ambusher transformed into an ambushed. And it's certainly decisive. And it's huge and massive, full of brave men, mighty ships, powerful airplanes and great deeds. I just get fascinated by that battle. And I loved your your work. Great as always.

[@WorldWarTwo]

Thank you for watching as always, Germán. Please stay tuned

[@jeffbangle4710]

You might find this interesting - the Battle of Midway from the Japanese perspective: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eJWbkKmFat-loNE I believe it gives a more in-depth perspective of the Japanese decision making in this battle.

[@brettd2308]

That one is definitely worth a watch.

[@metalgearray6832]

Thanks, going to add that to my watchlist after this. I always find it more interesting to watch the “enemy’s” point of view as we always only hear about the victor.

[@nano9285]

@@metalgearray6832 Watch it, that is the best WW2 video there is in youtube period.

[@1Fracino]

That guy is brilliant, a great series of vids.

[@tropics8407]

Motemayor ! 👍👍 best KZbin series on Midway et al 👏👏