£15K - No Compromise Lotus or Usable Honda ? Which Should You Choose

[@Number27]

Full Frankenlise playlist: kzbin.info/aero/PL-JmG4958QS9df4fvjAl5S8mOwQ_WObz3

[@stuf3804]

Nice to hear two sports cars being driven without the chavvy tasteless pops and bangs modern cars produce

[@MLC...]

Those pops ans bangs of modern cars completely puts me off. Right on sir!

[@alanwayte432]

Shame about the dubious shirt John McCririck look alike is wearing

[@aldfort5781]

I owned an S2000 some years ago. The suspension is fully adjustable and much benefit can be gained by setting it up carefully. The car is also amazingly sensitive to the rubber it sits on and to tyre pressures. All 3 things have to be right. The engine is amazing and it's jekyll and hyde character is one of it's best features IMHO.

[@simplevoicereviewssvr6418]

Yesss Jekyll and Hyde ...... Dr Jekyll a nice smooth economy, Mr Hyde VTEC 💪👹

[@fhowland]

How is the suspension adjustable?

[@hashiru86]

@@fhowland I guess what he means is the geometry of the suspension. Camber,caster, Toe in/out

[@giovannigallo8429]

Great video Jack. Owned an S1 many years ago and also own an early S2000. Both superb cars, which require a little tweaking to get them right. Just like the S1, the S2000 prices are moving upwards, massive following in the US where prices are at record levels!!

[@seancain7305]

Same here Jack... always wanted a S1 Elise, couldn't back in the launch days, but I hoovered up everything about them. Fast forward, glad to have owned many a S1 / S2, Elise / Exige / 2-Eleven - even an Evora too & driven most of the current range. But when the dust settles, its the S1 Elise which can never be sold :-)

[@zackmac5917]

Exige vs Elise S2, which do you prefer? In terms of comfort too!

[@nickviolin1389]

I tried an S2000 back I the day, didn't really bond with it. Tried an S1 Elise a couple of years later and "got it" straight away. Bought one 20 years ago, still having great fun with it. Have driven mine to Italy, to Scotland and Wales multiple times, taken my wife on holiday and to go camping. It's as practical as you need it to be, and perfectly comfortable (OK, earplugs really help to reduce the NVH). I still wouldn't swap it for an S2000.

[@Yanmak13]

In my opinion, investing in sound on the S2000, I would do it on the induction side, not exhaust. Nothing too nice can be expected to come out of the back, but air being sucked into an N/A at such high RPM that's pure music! 2 great cars. I've owned an S2000 and loved it. Was close to buying an S2 Elise, but never happened.

[@gaccutler9526]

I had an ATR, and found a gizmo at the front that restricted the air until the VTEC came in, and a 2nd flap opened which provided a suitable increse in engine sounds. Once this item was removed from the intake, the engine sounded better at all revs, and the dip in torque before the VTEC came in disappeared, so better all round - you approached the VTEC zone without a disappointing dip in performance. I think the box was a marketing exercise, making the arrival of the VTEC more impressive. I much preferred without. Maybe there's something similar on the S2000?

[@stephenc6955]

3 minutes and 7 seconds, that's the average interval between rain clouds in the UK.

[@BlatentlyFakeName]

Driving anything right after an Elise makes it feel like and unresponsive jelly mobile.

[@benbuchanan672]

Another engaging, informative and entertaining video delivered with charisma. I think your comments are fair, but I sold my 111S after less than a year. It was so competent it was boring. The S2000 I now have excites and rewards more than I found the Elise did. A lot of people criticise the steering but it’s well weighted and responsive. Maybe it lacks feedback but the car is (front) mid engined so it just goes where you point it! I’ve lowered my seat rails by 24mm and addressed the noise. I think it is now the complete roadster with THAT engine! 👍🏻

[@grinnders]

If you flip the cross members forward first on the S1 Roof you reduce the pressure on the buttress Allen key rotated spigots.

[@Number27]

Makes sense.. thanks for the tip!

[@gpajic1987]

'Backyard Special' lower seat rails for factory seat lowering, 20mm. Makes a huge difference!

[@Steven-p4j]

You and Jayemm, are my two favourite UK car channels.

[@wardv3492]

On my Elise S2, I changed the 10 year old bridgestone potenza's for new yokohama a052. Felt like a new car, incredible difference. Get rid of those old toyo's and you'll love your elise even more!

[@nickmatthews4939]

It's good to see both of you working together. I ♥️ watching both of your channels. A big 👍🏻s up for this content.

[@knutarneaakra6013]

Had a elise some years ago.drove her 200 km every day comuting to work. Great motor but in wintertime and lot of snow she was not the best car for the work. Miss my little red wite and gold jubileum 46 elise. Good to know that she got a great new owner taking care of her.

[@ono3869]

The Honda S2K can be driven to work/home on Mondays-Fridays, on the track on Saturdays and the golf course on Sundays. My clubs fit in the trunk (carry bag, not stand bag 😉).

[@TheOklep]

But IMO that defeats the point of sportscars. Because if you drive it everyday, you just get used to it. You will not get THAT smile after shor time. Petrolhead should have two cars, if it is possible. Then you will have THAT smile everytime you step inside your weekend toy from your boring daily

[@KD88RET]

Change the bushes at the rear cable mechanism for bearings, huge improvement.

[@robinkirke1702]

Hi Jack, and others. Am not sure why anyone or anybody desires more noise. I can't help thinking about the time when i did. I was seven years old, and put cardboard in the spokes of my bicycle, attached with a clothes peg.

[@davidsherley2652]

Hi Robin - the noise is not really about the noise. It’s one of many sensory experiences (G forces pushing you into your seat, feeling the road through your hands on the steering wheel & in your butt through the seat, seeing the scenery wiz past) of your connection to a performance oriented car. I have a GT3 exhaust on my ‘90 911. Yes, of course it’s loud. But my 911 is no longer a daily driver. Its in line with the traditional distinction between the profane (daily experience) and sacred (special occasion experience). Using an older performance car as a daily driver loses its fun factor very quickly; but using it as a special occasion back roads or track toy is a magical experience that never wears thin.

[@RallyeRacin9]

JayEmm is overrated. Number 27 is underrated.

[@Number27]

Very kind buddy but James' channel is fab!!

[@benclinch6056]

Completely agree. James is too big for his booties. His review of the Emira was the final straw. Can’t bare listening to his wandering waffle rants.

[@mmmmmmmmmmmmmmm420]

I don't think anything short of a redesigned crankshaft or harmonic balance shafts will stop the S2000 engine from sounding thrashy. I put a few thousand miles on a new one at the turn of the century and very soon grew tired of its need to be revved. I also didn't like how it wanted to change ends when not being asked to.

[@kipsome45]

I drove one in the early noughties and was struck by how much vibration and harshness there was when giving it the beans. I also agree about the thrashiness, but in fairness, it’s one of those cars, like many others, that sounds better from the outside than from within; I thought it sounded pretty sweet in Jack’s drive-by shots. I know they also had a reputation for biting if not treated with respect: fortunately I didn’t get to discover that first hand.

[@fhowland]

Agreed. Overrated car

[@GentielioGaming]

I did have a 2004 Honda S2000 and also after that a Opel speedster (VX220 in the UK) not the turbo version. And while it was a bit down in power when you reved it compared to the S2000, the Opel speedster was a more exciting drive at lower speeds. In the US they had a S2000 with a 2.2 engine witch reved (only) to 8000 rpm but had more usable power on the road.

[@hashiru86]

which one was more fun to drive?

[@GentielioGaming]

@@hashiru86 Opel speedster overall but it was a bit down in power. The S2000 was more fun if you drove it hard witch you can't do in traffic.

[@Wiggs1979]

Interesting choice for a comparison. Another Honda S2000 owner here - had mine for 16 years and it's currently sat at around 150k miles. It's been my daily driver for most of that time - not great in snow though! Having driven it on track and at the 'ring, I'd say it's a best suited as a road car, in standard form at least. Not driven an Elise, would love to take one out on track as I feel that's where it's really at home. I'd imagine a mildly modified mk3 MR2 could be a better comparison.

[@Number27]

Thanks Daniel.. it was always an oddball comparison but thought it might be fun! Thanks for watching!

[@petrjerabek7641]

thanks for this comparison Jack. I did something similar just for fun with a friend of mine who has the S2000 and i drove it for a while on a nice twisty B-road after i hopped out of my S2 Elise 111R. And the important bit is, it seems every Honda S2000 drives sligthly differently depending on mods - seems James's is more stock car and from what you say drives a bit different than what my experience was. My friend's got suspension done by a rally specialist - Protlum (race/rally suspension specialist in Czech Republic) and diff changed for a clutch/plate type, it has sports intake and few other things. The car was fantastic. I suprisingly didnt mind the weight too much, i didnt mind the electric steering too much and it suprised me and i thoroughly enjoyed the gearbox. I think the gearbox is phenomenal on these Hondas. And reving the engine to 9k and managing the shift well before it hits limiter is something i would never be bored of. The Toyota 2ZZ engine in my Elise is also a great revvy engine, i can do 8300 revs, but Honda is i have to say, better. But then...it is heavier and there isnt this special feel of lightness and fantastic steering which the Elise has. No, i wouldn't swap my car for Honda S2000. But i really like Honda S2000, i have to say...

[@edd90k]

funny you mention seat height. My s2000 has literally got these mods: big brakes lower seat rails HKS exhaust Intake retrimmed interior Lighter wheels + wider tyres and I absolutely love it. Would be interesting to see if you feel different about it.

[@joshlaurence9718]

A ‘ back yard special ‘ lower seat rail is what is needed for them . Lowers the base of the seat around 25mm . Then a UK 44mm back box mod and decat to release a more vocal exhaust noise . I think james has ITB’s to go on … which will sound amazing but in reality probably only gain 10bhp and quite possible make it run / idle rubbish .

[@davidsherley2652]

Josh - I think the success of ITBs depends on how skillfully the mapping is done on the engine management system. A 10HP gain with ITBs sounds a little light to me (my frame of reference is with a ‘90 Porsche 911). In addition to HP increase, ITBs also give a noticeable increase in throttle response.

[@joshlaurence9718]

Hi David , don’t get me wrong I hope james gets some good gains. I’m just going on the in-depth research I done on itb’s when I was looking to do it on my 2nd S2k . It’s a mine field of getting the exact manifold / exhaust dimensions/ trumpet lengths . But this is you tube and it will make good content for his channel I guess . Oh @jack … I have a Elise s3 … best of both worlds , easy to live with ( air conditioning / better gear change / easier roof than a s1 ) and still so rewarding to drive . It’s awesome 👍🏼

[@TS-mo6pn]

I think this is exactly what we should expect from a head-to-head of these two cars. Different design philosophy, different target audience. I see the Elise as more of a purist sports car with fewer compromises and not as comfy to take on a long drive. The S2000 is, as you said, a sports car that would be fine as a daily driver (think of it as equal parts non-turbo Esprit and Honda Civic). As an S2000 owner, my only (minor) issue is the lack of feel from the steering wheel. Would I like to have an Elise in my garage? Sure, but in addition to not as a replacement. And, btw, you've barely scratched the surface with S2000 performance enhancement.

[@chrismartin5870]

K series was\is a very light engine. See kingK article 're how to safeguard the engine.

[@mhk211071]

Check the exhaust baffles re the flat spot Jack, could also be the VVC mech but would have thought you'd have noticed the flat spot more if so. Those tyres need changing as the S1 Elise is incredibly sensitive to tyres (as you already know)

[@VirtualGuth]

I can still remember the experience of wedging myself into an Elise at an auto show many years ago - I say that somewhat endearingly as I'm a relatively small guy. However, I'm guessing that someone Jay's size would genuinely struggle getting in and out of an Elise. But it's clear that the Elise is special and I totally understand the attraction that yourself and many others have for this car. Of course that's how I feel about my S2000. The thing is, my attraction to the S2000 is based on my own particular needs and preferences. I would assume that the same goes for anyone else when it comes to cars. To me the only thing that really matters is how much enjoyment I myself get out of the car, or how much enjoyment my wife and I both get when we're out driving about together. (She doesn't care at all for my motorcycle, so the S2000 makes for a wonderful compromise.) Plus, as I do my own work on my vehicles, I also truly appreciate just how easy the S2000 is to work on and how little work is actually needed other than basic maintenance. That's not to imply that the Elise is hard to work on or that it requires anything more than basic maintenance, I'm just not nearly as familiar with these cars in that regard. The reality is that my curiosity is piqued by almost any 2-seat roadster with a manual transmission. To be honest, I personally feel incredibly fortunate to own a S2000. That said, I don't have too many quibbles with your thoughts on these cars as they would seem to accurately reflect your opinions. I can totally understand how the Elise might hold greater appeal to yourself and others. For that matter, I can also understand why the Mazda MX-5 has so many fans. But at the end of the day, in my mind what matters the most is that any given car actually meets the needs of the owner and that they truly enjoy driving the car as well as the overall ownership experience. Whatever your preference, the time to enjoy cars like these is now. In just a few more decades, all of this will be moot when we have nothing but EV's left out on the roads. What is interesting is that I discovered your channel when the KZbin algorithm popped up the Alfa Romeo 1750 GTV video that you made a while back. I love looking at cars like the GTV even though I'll never own one. For that matter, the same could be said for the Lotus Elise, but I still admire them greatly. For what it's worth, I don't think that the sounds made by either the S2000 or the Elise can hold a candle to that particular GTV. Good stuff!

[@drew699]

Great vid, Jack. Pleased you are now getting to really enjoy the Elise. They are truly such clever & special little cars. A shower cap for the Elise is such a great accessory - if only to make the cockpit secure when leaving it on a trip out, regardless of whether it’s raining or not & it is so much quicker than the proper hood. Ive rarely ever put the hood up on my S1 & same with my Caterham 7. Both are meant to be driven with the hood down. Enjoy.

[@Rhowhat]

Having had an S2000, I wouldn't have considered using it at a daily driver. I regret selling it but it made sense as I didn't use it enough.

[@simonangell6067]

I have had an S1 elise 111s for almost 19 years and wouldn't change it for anything. They really are sensational things. I used it as a daily for years but I did start to get fed up with it in the winter having to scraping ice from the inside of the windscreen!!! Other than that it has never caused any issues apart from a couple of wheel bearings and a failed lambda sensor. The roof is a nightmare but once you get the hang of it... yeah its still a nightmare!!!

[@Number27]

Glad you enjoyed the video and great to hear that you still have your Elise after all that time!

[@simonangell6067]

@@Number27 yep loving the videos. Especially the elise ones. 👍

[@simonangell6067]

Oh by the way... If you are looking for tyres go for the Yokohama ad08rs. Just put some on mine and they transform it.

[@snappedbydan]

You should try a 2zz MR2 roadster. 950kg, 190hp, comfortable and cool, mid engine, superb handling.

[@KD88RET]

Only if you're a hairdresser. 😂

[@Number27]

I didn't know MR2's were so light! thanks for watching!

[@snappedbydan]

@@KD88RET Come on that's not very grown up! They're proper drivers cars mate

[@snappedbydan]

@@Number27 some say they are a baby Elise ;)

[@kieranmz4614]

What do you think of the 1zz standard engine? Good enough for b roads?

[@wesleycardinal8869]

A nice review thanks. I have a mate who's had an S1, a Seven ( put a 'busa engine in it), an S2 Elise - I think he put a K20 in that, a GT40 ( replica ) and he says his favourite is the S1. I've had a Westfield seven ( self built ) and currently '97 S1 Elise. From my experience the Elise is quicker through the corners than the westie, but no two sevens are the same, and they are great drivers cars. The original ethos of the Elise was fun at fifty - meaning fifty miles per hour, in other words real world performance. You don't need to lose your licence to experience the fun of an Elise, and I think that's the word I would use to describe the Elise - fun. And in the spirit of fun, keep the rock hard Toyos as long as they're legal ;)

[@benchantry2092]

I've got all day long for Jack... can't stand that jm guy... jeessss

[@mickeyhartsell6096]

You think an S2000 sits high, try sitting in a Miata...my wife thinks our S2000 is too low and hard to get out of..

[@GregSRX7]

Thanks for the review Jack. I've owned a '93 Mazda RX7 for 24 years. 5 years ago I bought a 2007 S2000.....Glad I got it before the prices went crazy! What a great car, fun, easy to work on, and reasonably priced parts. I've restored a '67 XKE roadster, and an Austin Healey 3000....they were classics, but I had to always carry a tool kit! The Honda is a keeper!!

[@reidduff6985]

S2000 owner here and longtime fan of your channel. Fair review for a normal driver, but you failed (at least on camera) to drive the S anywhere close to reveal its true character. It comes alive at 8-10/10ths, staying in vtec and challenging the chassis. My personal S2000 has the same Ohlins suspension, but and intake header and exhaust with a piggy back ecu which broadens the power band and makes the car much more enjoyable in daily driving. A Recaro Pole Position lowers the driver to the floor and is still very easy for egress. So some of your complaints are easily addressed. That said the car definitely has its faults and will never be a lightweight. Which is why I’m trying to find a caterham to add to my garage. Keep up the great content. Cheers!

[@Number27]

Thank you buddy and agree I could have drive it harder but the conditions did not allow that!

[@reidduff6985]

@@Number27 certainly! British weather/public roads really limit you getting the most enjoyment out of the S it would seem. You should try a few laps at a track day in one, they are extremely rewarding and you may be pleasantly surprised.

[@ArneHulstein]

After driving quite a few cars, I have just bought an S2 111S Elise. Gave me a huge grin. Bigger than most other cars. Looking forward to getting better acquainted with it.

[@peaktraveller]

As always it depend upon what you want from a car. The Honda NSX blew away the myth that "supercars" had to be fragile, uncomfortable, had blind spots galore and only came into their own on that rare occasion when all the stars aligned. Similarly the Honda S2K allows owners to enjoy having a fun driving machine when you rev its nuts off and yet a fun, reliable daily driver. The Elise is brilliant and yet it is flawed in so many ways. I am very familar with both and I would pick the S2K over the Elise as a long term ownership prospect. If I wanted a pure track car then it would be the Elise and as Number 27 himself says in the intro above - it is not very practical. Sports cars are not practical but you need to be able to live with them.

[@TheOklep]

If you need only one car, S2K or MX5 ND. They are the best compromises. But as second car, nothing beats Elise. That shock feeling you get when you sit there after week driving your daily... It is like you entered into car Narnia. You cant get that feeling in s2k

[@hakonhalldorsson6673]

@@TheOklep Exactly. My daily is a 1998 Subaru Forester with a retrofitted 165hp NA 2.0 engine. Manual, of course, but the effect of going to the Lotus is just like you said. Other worldly and an adventure even before you turn the key :)

[@markonmotoring]

My Friend has an S2 Elise and he said the roof was much easier to use that the earlier cars. He also toured Europe a few times in various cars he owned, Ferrari 348tb, Porche Boxter S etc .. he said you wanted cars like the Boxter to get to the Alps but once you arrived you wished you were in the Elise.

[@stewal6835]

I Bought one of thes new in 2000: I Agree with everything you said. I Remember taking it back because of a rattle from the gearbox on overrun: they took me out in another to prove they all did it - apparently there was so little sound proofing and the gearbox being behind your head meant you hear everything that in a normal car you wouldn't.!

[@billbrock85]

Great video, Jack! Just discovered it. I’ve owned my 2004 Silverstone S-2000 with original factory hardtop since July of 2012 and STILL absolutely love it! I refer to it as my James Bond Car!!!

[@1183newman]

K-series is lovely, torque and light weight. Only downside is you are checking the temperature gauge and looking at the expansion tank an awful lot. In the elise i always used to shift first to second when shifting up or down regardless. Trying to get second from any other gear really upset the gearbox.

[@lonewarrior1543]

Jack...you seriously deserve way more subs....but one thing not lacking is perseverance....you will get the million one day...

[@Number27]

Hey thanks man!! I hope you're right!

[@organiccold]

Loved the video Jack. But please take the foot from the clutch, my OCD was killing me hahah

[@Michael_Lorenson]

OMG, you too? You seriously think you need to critique this, as if Jack doesn't know how to operate a clutch? I'm guessing he already has a mother.

[@zzhughesd]

I’m no fan of s2000. Being in car trade. Had 3/5. Lotus each and every charm me. Owned two Exige S personally. And after six months longed for them back

[@paulie2476]

Exige vs Elise are completely different platforms.

[@cooperbrown1]

I've owned a '08 240 Exige S and currently have a '06 S2000. The Exige is an amazing car to drive and look at but not very practical. The Exige is a naked interior with very little creature comfort. The S2000 is a much more user friendly and comfortable car that offers the same kind of thrill and similar handling. Just my opinion.

[@malcolmscott4150]

Elise is art on wheels - S2000 is a car I have driven and the engine transmission is flawless with rear drive chassis that felt snappy so I’d prefer a GT86/BRZ I think but Elise always top of list any series or engine 👍 😍

[@stuartsmith5308]

My favourite two presenters in one video. WOW. Please do more Dynamic Duo videos please guys.

[@stephenc6955]

Now that you've shown your true affection, Fred feels like a stepchild.

[@2702simmo]

I really want an Elise now!! What have you done 😂

[@ryanmccormick2150]

The S2000 looks massive parked next to the Elise! Cracking review Jack and nice to see you working with Jay again……… If had to choose I’d take the S2000 having said that I’ve never driven an Elise but owning a Honda is 99.9 percent of the time hassle free and I love that about them 👍

[@Number27]

Yep, the Honda is superbly built and designed!

[@ryanmccormick2150]

@@Number27 yeah Honda are definitely good cars I had a civic type R way back in 2005, I put 97k miles on it in just over 3 years and most of that was with the engine screaming 😂😂😂 not one thing ever went wrong with it!

[@paulschofield271]

Had two Elises and one S2000. The Elise makes the S2000 feel numb and uncommunicative. The S2000 is very good, but the Elise is a masterpiece.

[@Number27]

I completely agree!!

[@randmacct636]

Mx5 nc. Bbr super200 or 225 if power is inadequate

[@davidorama6690]

My last sports car was an NC. Very nice little car with the heart of the NA.

[@chrispayze]

I've had an S2000 for 14 years and agree with your 'downsides'. They are all easily fixable though (apart from the steering feel!). A cold air intake will release the noise, and it's excellent with the S2000! For a speak peak of what it sounds like (but not quite as good), just remove the air box lid. You can lower the seat base without buying an aftermarket seat using a Backyard Special seat rail. The gear stick 'slop' is easily sorted with a couple of bushes and springs, and is easily accessed. 20 minute job. Finally, steering feel can be improved a tiny bit with solid steering rack bushes. I wouldn't bother though, it's not worth the effort. Nice comparison video. I really must get in an Elise sometime soon though... 😁

[@Number27]

Glad you enjoyed the video and thanks for the tips on the S2000, will pass them on to James!

[@chrispayze]

@@Number27 With the ITBs it'll sound epic! I'm jealous!

[@pgr3290]

Caterham channel: can an Elise ever match a Seven? No it can't, too heavy and too practical nothing quite like a bathtub on wheels that weighs 550kg lol

[@LOTPOR0402]

Practical ,that's what most people want ,little less performance and more protection

[@Number27]

Ha, brilliant!! Though from my experience the Caterham is more raw and gives even more feedback..BUT it does not turn as naturally and effortlessly as an Elise does..

[@SevenSmiles]

I have both and the Elise is only a little more practical. I almost always choose to drive the 7, only preferring the Elise if it's really wet. BTW push the roof rails forward to slacken the hood before using the allen key.

[@steveluck9541]

I prefer my elbows inside a car whilst driving. I’ve sat in a seven there’s zero protection in a side impact. I’ll stick to the Elise with its deep wide chassis and door bars thanks.

[@paulriggers1558]

sold a s2000 at my work - drank oil like i drink beer - ended up knocking the crank out- absolute fortune + awkward job. only drove nice between 7 - 9k, not for me. elise with a vvc should be seamless til limiter. have u ever serviced it? - its been stood for ages- good service with decent plugs should sort did a training course for those engines, very ingenious completely variable vvc mechanism. included a driving section on last day, how did they think us mechanics would drive them anything other than flat out everywhere beats me, the stink of hot brakes + melted rubber was drifting into the classroom all afternoon. put some decent rubber on before it needs another chassis repair [plus it will make u smile more]

[@rallyekev]

As an alternative to the S2000 I would suggest an SW20 MR2 Turbo t-bar rev3 onward. It’s similar weight, similar power but you don’t need to thrash them to get a move on. They’re easily modified for a bit more power and reliable with it.

[@grahamnutt8958]

Great to see you and JayEmm in a vid together. No doubt he had a run in the Frankenlise (you don't have to confirm nor deny that as I know he loves a Lotus). Having owned a Rover Metro gta with a K series engine and, many years later, borrowed a 214Si..... Those engines seem to burn up huge amounts of oil; almost on a par with a 70's Leyland motor. Keep an eye on that, Jack. Spent enough money already, right?

[@bobmcl2406]

I have heard the criticism that the S2000 sacrifices low and mid-range for that 7000-9000 show. But after the novelty wears off, many owners just don't want to have to work that hard all the rime. Is that anything you noticed?

[@peejayem4700]

the engine doesn’t sacrifice low and mid-range - that’s the benefit of vtec. Over 85% of its peak torque is available less than 3,000 rpm. I’m not suggesting it’s a torque monster - but for a 2L n/a engine that is nearing a quarter of a century old it’s still quite impressive. Also it’s not a chore to work the engine that revs so freely.

[@VirtualGuth]

I own a S2000 and love the car's personality. While you don't have to work hard at it all of the time, you are definitely rewarded for doing so. In my experience, the car doesn't provide the same experience if you're short-shifting it under 6K RPM. While you can cruise around in these cars all day without ever engaging VTEC, I don't find this to be nearly as fun. My wife on the other hand would be very content with this. I think a lot of it comes down to how comfortable a person is with a higher revving engine. As someone who has been riding motorcycles since I was a kid, I personally find driving a car with an engine that was designed to constantly be exposed to the upper end of its RPM range to be a blissful experience, especially when mated with such a wonderful gearbox. In my opinion these things make for an incredibly involving driving experience, but the reality is that not everyone wants to be quite so involved. There are also those who simply can't wrap their minds around the fact that the engines in these cars are capable of enduring the treatment they are on a regular basis for many hundreds of thousands of miles when properly maintained. The thought that they are going to destroy the car is just too much for them. So I can understand how some drivers might not enjoy the S2000 as much as I and others do. The reality is that no single car is going to appeal to every single driver. The real key is understanding yourself and then choosing the car that best fits your own preferences and needs.

[@simonphillips5208]

Was just watching James in an Elise. As I said to him, adore the cars but when I went to test one I couldn't really get in or out. Around about 6 feet tall but, it scuppered my plans.

[@gaccutler9526]

No mention of the brilliant low-down torque (say from 2k, peak just over 3k and flat until 5k+) of the KSeries (I have one in my Elise S2 and well as my 1973 MG MIdget); this makes the car easy to hussle along roads without the need to change up and down (indulge in changes if you want...). The VTEC, OTOH, is wanting for torque below 5k... max higher than 5k. Of course, it's a pleasure (and maybe a necessity to overtake the average turbo Diesel) to rev... when you're in the mood.

[@parrotraiser6541]

Lotus are clearly determined to maintain Britain's traditional 1950s standards of convenience in soft top installation and removal. (Which oddly was a regression; raising and lowering the top on an MG TD was as easy as that on the S2000.

[@scottireland5414]

No contest in practically. My daily driver of twenty years, S2000, has a trunk that has enough space for going back and forth to the boat, and I even have a bike rack that fits very well.

[@MrMargaretScratcher]

You should borrow an AZ-1 as an interesting comparison with the Lotus

[@gpajic1987]

Airbox lid off sound is incredible, no need for exhaust

[@okgo8315]

I did that on my 911 (a long time ago), sounded great but rain filled the centre barrel straight thru the carb .......split the barrel from top to bottom👎🇬🇧

[@gpajic1987]

@@okgo8315 oh no 😞 I don't think it can get water in it unless I drove in to a lake though, as it would get water through the same part either way without an extended snorkel

[@okgo8315]

@@gpajic1987 ... snorkel eh.... good idea for an old 911🤣🤣👍🇬🇧

[@gpajic1987]

@@okgo8315 it's the opposite when people put them on a s2000 🤣 goes down and creates risk of water getting in

[@Thegowfer65]

How did you find the driving position of the S2000? I felt I was sitting bolt upright so wasn’t for me. Engine note of a 986 Boxster far superior. I had an S1 a number of years ago and whilst great to drive it felt like a bag of spanners.

[@davidsherley2652]

I agree with you 100% about Porsche George. We have a ‘90 911 and a ‘00 Boxster in my family. I’ve never taken the opportunity to drive an S1, but Porsche is playing in an entirely different ball game from Honda. I don’t think Honda really understands the ethos of a European sports car. The S2000 looks really cool, but it drives like a truck in comparison to any Porsche.

[@eze8970]

Thanks Jack, pleasant surprise collaboration! Perhaps compare Fred to the S1, similar for their day?

[@nelsonclub7722]

My Girlfriend has the Elise S1MMC - 85K every day driver - this is her 2nd as I may have crashed her 1st - it was not my fault it never is.

[@bravedave8512]

I own number 232... what number is yours? Obviously it's an early one :)

[@nelsonclub7722]

@@bravedave8512 I would have to check - its an 'R' reg - she has just had it wrapped in Fuschia having had the bodywork repaired sanded down first and the silver wheels anodised in gloss black - she bought it 4 yrs ago for 5,500 so if nothing else it was a good investment!!

[@bravedave8512]

@@nelsonclub7722 Wow, fuschia! I'd love to see that! And yeah, 5,500 is a great deal - those days are gone :)

[@nelsonclub7722]

@@bravedave8512 Email me at [e-mail] I will send a pic - prices are going up now on all Lotus's still time to get one and make money on them though - James at JGM Sports - buys and sells them - he literally has zero stock at present - he knew of Janes car through someone else and offered her 12 on the spot without even seeing it - she of course said no!!! the biggest issue is of course the head and any previous dings, dents and bashes where the clamshell body may not have been put back together properly - all good though - especially now its 'Under New Management' as it were

[@okgo8315]

For the Elise flat spot you could try a standard air intake system, surely that would work correctly? Same for the S2000, which i thought sounds fine👍🇬🇧

[@Pillokun]

As a purist, when it comes to fun while driving or riding I pick the one car which makes me feel the most. I dont need to drive really fast but it needs to be light, not obstruct my field of view and let me be one with the machine. Elise hits all my points so to speak.

[@ratcat7668]

Two years ago I had a good friend who had an S2000 in yellow. I owned my Red S2 Elise at the time. We got along like a house on fire, sadly he is gone now.

[@bojack3827]

Great comparison video. Thanks for doing it!

[@Number27]

Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for watching!

[@martinhogg5337]

Fun comparison, and interesting conclusions! Keep up the good work!

[@MrMairu555]

14:00 After a couple of minutes of [justified] criticism, he bumps the rev limiter at 9k and once again it's all smiles! 🤣🤣🤣

[@sholehan]

Owned many MX-5s and other cheaper sportscars. Been this > < close to buying an S2000 on a number of occasions but never made the jump. I do now own an early Series 2 Elise though! I always wanted an S1 but the improvements in the first years make them much more usable than a S1. Its still a K so not fat and heavy like the later Toyota engines. (The later short roof is so, so much better than the S1 roof, but no soft-top, electric or otherwise, will beat the MX-5 for speed and ease of use!). Nice little comparison. Elise is nothing like a Go-kart - it has a much more complex balance, beautiful ride once up to speed, so much feel!

[@jehl1963]

I don't know if it's the lack of footwell space of the FrankenElise, or just a bad habit -- but you need to get your left foot away from the clutch when you're not shifting. Once I noticed this, I couldn't look away. (cringe)

[@Michael_Lorenson]

OMG, seriously? This man has decades of driving experience, but you feel the need to critique where he rests his left foot between shifts? Seriously? Get a life.

[@jehl1963]

@@Michael_Lorenson Hey, Number 27 is welcome to replace his clutch as often as he likes. No offense intended

[@ganz7ful]

145bhp - I love it. Proper sports engine - none of this 300+ sillyness

[@matthewboville6599]

I've got best of both. Elise with the insane Honda motor conversion.. it's outstanding

[@grimson]

An S2000 is a very small car. Next time you see one on the road, compare it to everything else out there. Now look at the thumbnail. Incredible how tiny the Elise is.

[@davidroush1224]

My wife's MINI dwarfs the Elise beside it in our garage. Both are great fun, Bought the MINI first and thought it a great car/good handler. Then I got the Elise and the MINI feels floaty. Enjoy both, but the Elise is on another level and every drive brings a smile.

[@DJSvenNo1]

Nice channel crossover 👍

[@rhettcorcoran2879]

Excellent review, my choice would be the Lotus, I did look at the Honda a few years ago but it really didn't do it for me, I bought a TVR Griffith instead!

[@garrytalbot3456]

And of course if you want a really light car there’s a Caterham 7. Try a really quick version to spoil yourself.

[@drew699]

There is truly no substitute for a quick Caterham.

[@chaybinks7884]

Atom?

[@TheOklep]

Caterham is amazing, but totally different feel as you sit on rear axle and engine is in front.

[@ridgmont61]

It would be good fun to squeeze the S2000 engine into the Elise to have that handling with that engine would be something very special indeed.

[@benbuchanan672]

Lots of people have done the Civic Type R engine as a swap. Best of both worlds?

[@adrianbennett3761]

The very light weight would mask the lack of torque in the S2000 engine. Sounds like a perfect marriage to me.

[@Henders72]

Great review as always. I’ll equate it to my own comparison several years ago, I had a VX220 turbo and my wife had a Boxster 986, Boxster to jump in every day, VX for a weekend blast, every drive an event. If you can only have one car you’d pick the S2000, if you can run a daily and a weekend car you’d pick the Elise, IMO you struggle in the winter as you can’t defrost the windows properly and the roof will at some stage leak. Both great cars👍🏻

[@Number27]

Always wondered how a VX would drive!!

[@Henders72]

@@Number27 I think you need to find out👍🏻

[@mgjohn8534]

More enjoyable car content from #27. Thanks. Elise S2 in family fleet. The Rover K-Series is one of the easiest engines to work on. Serial K-Series Lover family. Bought first new K-Series in 1993 ( Rover Metro ), new MG ZS 1.8 K-Series in 2003, Rover 25 ( 1.4 K-Series ) and several MG ZT 1.8Ts. ( Turbocharged version of the K-Series. ). The Elise is never a daily driver for me although my son used it that way before he got married and became a father. It is a fun car and can be a serious track car straight out of the box. All the other K-Series cars are far more civilised and a nicer place to be than the Elise but not as much fun. Still nice to drive them all though. The Elise is not a difficult car to work on for any "Do it yourself" owner who is not afraid to pick up a spanner or wrench. All the above cars in the wider family fleet still in daily use ( CV-19 Constraints allowing ) giving reliable service. The Elise now in its eleventh year of family ownership. I occasionally drive my younger son's Rover 25. Now approaching its twentieth birthday. The K-Series is one of those engines which does effectively punch well above its weight. Never more so than the 1.4 in the Rover 25. Very impressive performer that little engine. Drove it today.. The last new Honda I bought revved to well over 9000 rpm. However, it only had two wheels. Honda do make fine engines. Ask that young F1 Guy, Max Verstappen.

[@matthewnicholas6365]

It's not the power people hate about the K Series, it's the head gasket. Had a mechanic friend that worked at Rover when the MGF came along and he was always moaning about them failing when they were new.

[@TheMrrigma]

Honda K20a in an Elise S1 for the best of both worlds. The car is usable :-)

[@stephenoverstreet9898]

So awesome that you two collaborated on this video. Is there a corollary coming to James’s channel as well?

[@Number27]

Not right now but perhaps in the future!!

[@Ladco77]

You have to drive an S2000 like you're mad at it. VTEC doesn't engage until over 6000 RPM under full throttle. Keep it in VTEC and it's a beast.

[@Number27]

Ha.. it was hard to push it too much in the rain!

[@BlatentlyFakeName]

That is the problem, you have to keep it there or it has no torque. The Elise has a very linear power curve and a very responsive throttle.

[@TassieLorenzo]

@@BlatentlyFakeName Because the engine was optimised for maximum high rpm power at any cost. The Honda K20 and K24 engines are more balanced between torque and power if it's what you prefer, they have the benefit of cam phasing and aren't as oversquare (indeed the K24 is undersquare at 1.13 stroke:bore so it's more similar to the Rover K series 1.8 at 1.11 stroke:bore). The S2000 2.0L was also redesigned as a 2.2L with more torque for the North American market IIRC. :)

[@barryphillips7327]

The Honda S2000 is in my opinion a very Very good sports car which can be used everyday, take you to work, and behave properly in traffic ( some cars with performance camshafts Weber sidedraught carbs can be a Real pain in traffic And Suck fuel at an alarming rate ) the S2000 in traffic will drive nicely and with good economy, and Japanese Reliability which Honda cars in general are known for!! Up to 6000--6500rpm the S2000 engine drives normally but above that there is a third camshaft which changes valve lift etc giving the extra power up to 9000rpm!! The S2000 is a FAR better car than ANY MX5, and out of the two cars here i know which i would have!!!!!!!!!!!! 3min to get the roof up in a DOWNPOUR would seem like FOREVER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@drew699]

You genuinely don’t need the hood up if it’s raining unless it’s truly chucking it down. The rain just flies over. Similar to a Caterham but you can have a tonneau on a 7.

[@GdaySport]

Tell Jay to make his S2000 handle better, he needs to add some lightness!

[@Number27]

Ha! lighter wheels already.. maybe he'll do more. thanks for watching!

[@malcolmhardwick4258]

In Uk by time you got the roof off it will start raining again !

[@keithgilbert477]

Best Elise S1 review ever.

[@Number27]

Ah Awesome you think so!! Thanks 🙏

[@mckav2358]

Hi Jack, really enjoyed youre review of these 2 ..."sports" cars & i genuinely believe you gave a brilliant unbiased an opinion as possible. Youre review was excellent Maybe Honda in ITS totally "UN biased" manufacturing template wanted the car to be "all things" & not purely a sports car, as is the Lotus, as doing so would not = sales (unfortunate cos it DID = its demise) Yes, makes "me" wonder just what a S2000 type R might have looked like? hopefully totally insane!!!

[@oliabid-price4517]

There is one other car that handles like the Elise - a Smart Roadster. Automated clutch actuation and gearshift issues aside, they really do handle like a go kart. And only 900kg.

[@pkracing9095]

You should try a basic early 1.8 MX5 NC - undervalued and underrated. They have that lightweight feel, have brilliant steering and are completely useable as a daily driver. You’re welcome to try mine👍🏻

[@jeanhendrickx5928]

I own a "deep purple" Lotus Elise 118 hp. I adore it. It is 24 years old, but I will never sell it.