1628 Paper Battery As Powerful As an AA And Activated by Water

[@pikotech1]

As you know by now mate, I often have additional questions and suggestions after each video, but I have to say, well done Rob! Fantastic video. It had everything: Time for the theory, real world example in practice, along with instruction as to how to replicate! Probably one of your best right there!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

oh wow cheers mate - and yes you do make good suggestions - I often take them on board - I am glad you liked this one

[@kendo695]

@@ThinkingandTinkering Very cool, disposable battery probably should be banned, as well.

[@Derederi]

​@@ThinkingandTinkering YT asks for premium to watch your video better than 360p But the ads are full HD. This platform is a fascist distopia.

[@bfernb4388]

You are quickly becoming my favorite person on KZbin (masses of people are wasting the best invention, information on the internet!) You can learn or do anything now if you use creativity and your brain. Thank you for your contributions

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

Wow, thanks! and I agree it's all about using your creativity!

[@comicmania2008]

Not bad, loved the video, thanks! In the RAF around 1979, there were batteries in survival equipment /kits (such as life raft kits), that had batteries that you submerged into the ocean (seawater). We were told that these were used to run a flashing distress beacon, and used saltwater as an electrolyte. Not very powerful, of course, but it could save your life by alerting search aircraft to where you were!

[@Wavy_Gravy]

See that's the kind of tech i like, Something to make your worst day a little more survivable.

[@AaronWood5887]

Outstanding presentation Robert as we should be more aware of the ways we can store energy in a safe manner without destroying the world we live in. Please keep up the good work and thank you.

[@xxEndermelonxx]

If I'm understanding it correctly, someone could in theory insulate each side with a biodegradable wax or wax paper, roll it tightly, and somehow activate the electrolyte when ready use, would have an AA battery for 2 hours that's entirely biodegradable and cheap? I like it. Sounds like it would be invaluable to underdeveloped countries

[@xxEndermelonxx]

Pardon my atrocious grammar lol

[@zeabobql3923]

The definition of a battery is two dissimilar metals immersed in a conductive medium. So really it's pretty open ended.

[@david2ljdavid2lj56]

@@zeabobql3923 a container consisting of one or more cells, in which chemical energy is converted into electricity and used as a source of power. That's the definition I found.

[@ivanolsen8596]

@@xxEndermelonxx Dont worry about the grammar, its the content that counts!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I like the way you are thinking there mate

[@ronniepirtlejr2606]

The Disposable batteries probably wouldn't be so popular if, they didn't hold such a high amount of mAh per charge versus the rechargeable batteries. Most "small" rechargeable batteries do not have a high mAh per charge. They are superior in mAh per lifetime of the cell. Great video Robert! You are a encyclopedia of knowledge & a inspiration to us all!👍

[@angelusmendez5084]

Reminds me of the so called stone paper made with 70% Calcium carbonate and 30% HDPE. It immediately made me think about its applications for battery making

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

nice heads up mate - I will look into that!

[@xavieraeby9563]

Thanks for reviewing our work mate. Keep up the good work.

[@daviddouglas4200]

Bob , Many years ago at sea we had lifejackets fitted with small lights . The battery powering these only came to life when immersed in sea water..........

[@nlabanok]

Thank you for sharing, a very nice find on this newly published paper. There are literally hundreds of avenues of optimization on the foundation this paper describes.... application-specific / form factor avenues, processing, materials / recipe...cheers!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

oh yeah mate - and it is open source - which I like!

[@richardseelye9938]

Thank you for another fantastic presentation that I get to play with.

[@kazparzyxzpenualt8111]

" one of the reasons I love paper" Thanks for this excellent how to! Thank you very much indeed!

[@thomasking5970]

"Water-activated" batteries have been around for literally decades; they see use in radiosonds (weather balloons) and sonobouys. Nice DIY project. 🙂

[@MikeGrayM70]

I love these home-made battery videos! I never get tired of them. Especially the ones made from cheap, easy to find materials. One of these days, I want to build a home made battery that can charge my phone, and be recharged with solar or some other novel device.

[@erichfeit7779]

Thank you for keeping us up-to-date, as you normally do! Erich from New Zealand

[@glenhill9884]

Great little video. I just finished making a blog article on this topic including that paper and now I've found the vid! Cool. I linked it in my blog.

[@kenvater2843]

any and all of these open source articles are fantastic, saving the world and ourselves one paper at a time. More power to you Rob

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I agree mate they are awesome and cheers

[@docsharp87]

Great video! I really loved that you edited the instructions over the video. I try and take notes when I watch and having it all written out is so helpful. Much appreciated Rob.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I did wonder about doing that mate - so nice to get feedback on that - cheers

[@kokeskokeskokes]

This is very useful to me, thank you.

[@martinlicht1969]

You're right on about amazing paper. I visited a paper mill years ago and it was beyond belief what goes into paper production. The mill is a multiple story building and blocks long. They grow there own special trees and do great job being good to environment. Sad that we live in a world lead by pervayors of completely false history; the true origin of paper battery being but one example in a mountain of deception. Greed will protect the AA battery, and unlikely heroes will make the scene rescuing us claiming undeserved credit for things that have been around for 100s of years.

[@Barskor1]

They should go back to hemp for the base material rather than wood.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I come across it time and again mate

[@paddy2661]

So true , the cover-ups are endless to keep 7.4b rolling out.. Great video Rob love them ❤ Have you tried freezing a dead AA or 9v battery for a week in freezer in a snap sealed bag ? To bring it back to life ..

[@joohop]

Great Video Earthling Bless Up

[@lonelymacan]

First, thanks for great video Robert. Second, I like the point that you made about Standford. 😁 I share your experience on that. Third, keep up the good work. People like you are what made your your nation, continent and human kind great.

[@nwflboy007powell8]

I agree paper batteries have been around for a long, long time. I built one for a school project back in 1974. We utilized paper in a plastic bottle, mine was D cell size.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

wow - nice

[@MrJaylassiter]

Watched this one and was so interested I allmost forgot to like. Great video.

[@e7yu]

Think you for the link. I downloaded my copy. And hope to make this one day. 👍😎

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

it will be fun if you do mate

[@solarhope]

A great little battery Rob :-) Whatever happened to your paper battery you was making some years ago? I can remember you had a pile of paper cells that you had made and taken days to assemble.

[@zylascope]

I wonder how a battery would be constructed that uses this research, that could replace AAs and still be easy to recycle?

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

it is still ongoing mate - getting stuff into production is quite a challenge - far more than folks think

[@aarondingus3548]

Another incredible video that blew my mind. Thank you!

[@zylascope]

Thanks Robert. I'll be trying that one.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

it is a good one mate

[@Killianwsh]

Great stuff! Thanks Rob!

[@overbuiltautomotive1299]

Robert great video sir ..The issue i have with off the shelf rechargeable NIMH batterys like AAA and so forth is the lower voltage in some cases hurts performance of what its running but thats that

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

yeah indeed mate - but sometimes you get what you get!

[@overbuiltautomotive1299]

@@ThinkingandTinkering yes sir reBob ye do.and all the pissin and moaning about it changes nothing it seems 🤐

[@andygozzo72]

there are, or at least WERE nickel zinc batteries with a 1.6v terminal voltage, i'm using some in a digital camera which doesnt like nicads/nimhs due to the low voltage, but eats normal alkaline ones pretty quickly , i got 4 of them some years back , unfortunately 2 have since failed after only a few charge cycles, gone 'open' maybe this is an issue with them? limited shelf life? i have no idea as yet if theyre still available, i hope so as would like to get a few more, you have to use a charger designed for them as nicad/nimh type is not advisable as simple types will overcharge them (may be possible to mod them), 'smart' ones likely to reject them as 'bad'

[@overbuiltautomotive1299]

@@andygozzo72 cool ill look into it thanks

[@breaking_bear]

There's a paper about making a battery out of paper. This paper inspired us to make paper batteries. Paper is recyclable and biodegradable. Both the premise and the physical structure of this project have alot in common, strangely enough.

[@wickedprotos1937]

Robert, you are an amazing inventor.!!!

[@ArcanusLibero]

Excellent demonstration. Thanks for your efforts.

[@derghiarrinde]

Amazing. Thank you!

[@asificam1]

I use NiMH cells because they are very leak resistant so I can leave them unattended and not worry much about my devices having leaking battery issues... also their incredible cold weather performance and insane power density compared to other AA cells are also nice to have. But this is still interesting since paper is a wonderful material and NiMH batteries are typically not very cheap to make or flexible... things that paper batteries are good at... though NiMH total cost to own is still cheap since the Japanese made cells are rated to go for 2000 cycles. But still, paper batteries like you show being water activated might be really really good at emergency batteries that are shelf stable until activated by getting them wet.

[@lorenbush8876]

Thanks Robert that's really interesting.

[@simongross3122]

Absolutely brilliant. Thanks for sharing it.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@TrimTab87]

Amazing! I always feel empowered to experiment after hearing from you. Do you have a forum your listeners can share results to?

[@bacilluscereus1299]

If not, set one up yourself. Or use a shared google spreadsheet.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I believe there is a discord - ask angelus about it - he is in the comments and usually comments in the first few

[@TheMarcusrobbins]

This was fantastic! You rock!

[@TheMan1510]

This is awesome! Thank you, Robert :-)

[@voltrevolt8731]

Paper is truly one of the most underrated and amazing substances human beings have come up with...

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

absolutely agree with that mate

[@dennisclapp7527]

Thanks Robert

[@HighWealder]

Great. Just as aside, I am curious to know if you could get a current from using say aluminium beer cans and scrap iron immersed in seawater ? I don't have any testing equipment myself.

[@maxkennedy5073]

Interesting, few plastic tubes of different battery sizes with conductive ends, slight change in the morphology, few mL of electrolyte, push in a pre-rolled dry cell, pop the top on and presto your own AA battery or whatever. Remove roll when dead, more electrolyte another roll and on your way. Take the old paper, put in an electrolysis cell recover the zinc and away you go again. Very nice, bugger off disposables.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

that would work mate

[@Buzzhumma]

You could use baking or waxed paper to hold the roll together.

[@wmffgeorge1589]

Where are you with your old paper pouch batterys? I don't recall a conclusion to that production. I struggle to remember with what chemistry, but I always fancied making long Peper batery rolls, housing the cells in pipes and those in 45 gallon barrels. Haven't gotten round to it yet.

[@nathant97]

Good video, would like to see a longer, broken down, step by step way to make the battery. Ether way, definitely something to try out!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

length of a video is always a bit of a balancing act mate - but I think I got all the info in and the paper does do a good job of the step by step

[@teltwosheds2972]

Fascinating thank you

[@iami9307]

I’ve been waiting for you to do that with your conductive ink

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I am reluctant to do that as it would mean you would think you had to buy the ink - the in would work well but I also want folks to see they don't need the ink if they don't want it

[@gaiustesla9324]

so simple and yet so awesome!

[@salilsahani2721]

Thank you :)

[@n8rtotplayz647]

Great stuff, as always!

[@briansmithenergy248]

Respect and gratitude

[@simonwatson5299]

What a great little battery!!! Biodegradable too!!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I agree mate

[@agritech802]

That's brilliant Robert, thanks for sharing 👍

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

glad you liked it mate

[@herbetone]

Great find, it would be great if the industries move with this concept, many thanks Robert.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

indeed mate

[@mrpants8976]

It might be possible to roll up the paper into a tube or stack multiple sheets of paper with sort of insulation between them to increase the voltage, though I am a little concerned of arching with a load of paper in a area

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

did you know paper is actually a fire retardant?

[@lemix69]

Wow! That's neet! I'm going to download the paper and give it a try. I build my own battery packs for E-bikes, so I'm wondering if this will ever progress to rechargeable batteries that could run an e-bike. Well, thanks again for another excellent video and head scratcher! 😎👍

[@islandsedition]

Would there an efficient/effective way to reclaim the zinc? Presumably the rest of the materials are totally compostable, but I imagine an accumulation of zinc in any one place might not be so good?

[@themartianway]

Very simple, burn the batteries in a furness to separate from the zinc.

[@islandsedition]

@@themartianway true. And I guess technically any carbon goes back to the trees, but I was thinking in a way that preserves the biomass.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I suppose you could leach it

[@chrishayes5755]

always enjoy your battery making videos, well done sir

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

Thank you kindly

[@zenmanproject]

To turn it into a AA form factor, I assume you would roll it up. Would it short circuit if you rolled it up? Would another piece of paper on top stop that from happening?

[@Alkimi]

You're a modern Merlin. Thanks for the straightforward explanation, as always.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

wow - cheers mate

[@William_Hada]

Brilliant, got to make one now! Thanks for sharing.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

awesome mate - let me know how you get on - cheers

[@chrisswhite77]

Dear Mr. Smith, i have seen that you use the extension cord fully on. I can ask you to take it all out because like this can be a problem, it is a coil on a(at least) 2000W consumer. I have burned one because of that.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

it's unlikely mate - very unlikely - I say this after 10 years of using it this way

[@joelaichner3025]

Always Quality stuff !

[@keithking1985]

Thanks Rob.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

cheers mate

[@Palmit_]

Great vid, again. thank you, my tuppence (two pence) worth.. Whilst rechargeable AA's remain pegged at 1.2 volts, 1.5 volts like Alkaline will continue to dominate. Rechargeables are fine for remote controls with slow, infrequent draw. Things like passive infra-red detectors on LED lighting units, RFID/ electronic keypad locks (which auctuate via a motor), wildlife cameras etc.. etc.. the voltage needs to be quick for optimal performace. despite being the same current in most cases.

[@jochenschrey2909]

?? You 'll find rechargeable delivering way higher currents than disposables but they self discharge faster. For occasional light use disposables seem more convenient.

[@Palmit_]

@@jochenschrey2909 we are at odds lol. not intentionally. i find with 1.2v the mah (rechargeable) generally, is greater at first. But slowly gets less and less as discharge occurs. The 1.5v mah tends to be almost constant. i speak from my experience and not from any kind of scientific standpoint.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I think there will be quite a few reasons for disposables being popular but I get your point mate

[@jochenschrey2909]

@@Palmit_ ?? once again. "mAh" = capacity, for example number of flashes you 'll get from a charge. I was talking current, "A", formexample recycle speed of the flash gun, performance during quick recharges, like a 4/6/8 minute RC car race

[@andygozzo72]

there used to be, dunno if still made, nickel zinc cells with 1.6v terminal voltage, i'm using 2 in a digital camera as it eats even good alkalines and doesnt work for long if at all with nicad/nimh, i got 4 of these nickel zinc things from maplin(uk), when on offer, probably 10 years ago, maybe more, and only started using them last 2 or 3 years or so, 2 failed fairly quickly after a few charge cycles, so maybe their shelf life isnt good.?? last 2 still working, so far, hope they are still made so i can get some more! i also have 4 AAA size ones, as yet not used

[@BearerOfLightSonOfGod]

Thank you for the video and history lesson

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

glad you liked it mate

[@WileHeCoyote]

Wouldn't it be lovely if someone made a rebuildable AA battery sleeve, little stainless thing with a thick graphite rod in the middle to wrap your paper around!

[@josephalan2232]

OK.. That was cool.. Thank you..!

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

Glad you liked it!

[@aserta]

I haven't bought disposable AA or AAA in ages. I use rechargeable ones and downgrade them as they grow old (ex: from flashlight to radio, from radio to remote etc), finally packing them up with other batteries to a send them once a few years to a local battery recycler handler.

[@Buzzhumma]

Can't wait to see what you to come up with as an improvement Rob. Hmmmm all things being considered it may be a bit of a challenge . Best thought i have is using already used office paper or finding industries that use large amounts of paper like news print. Not so sure news paper would be strong enough although after being painted it might be fine!

[@wandamaddox7824]

Finally gets to the point at 2:23

[@venkateshks6664]

bloody brilliant as usual

[@jbb3141]

This might be great for a long-term storage method to use as an emergency recharge of a cell phone as long as you had a simple voltage regulator.

[@andygozzo72]

high power zener such as a 1N5338 5v1 5w in parallel will clamp it ...

[@Hyxtryx]

You'd need a lot of them. At least 35 I'd say, of the size he made, connected in combinations of series and parallel, to charge a cell phone just once. Good luck getting all the connections to remain solid.

[@GEOsustainable]

Yep, if this catches on, we will completely exhaust the element Zinc. Still a great experiment, but just as you said, this is nothing new. Where do we take this? The resulting battery size to compete with a AA would be as big as car to power that clock for a standard year. I am 1000% with you on the battery in the landfill problem. Oh, can you explain how zinc becomes biodegradable, please? I could make a fortune growing zinc.

[@UnifiedInfo]

You can extract it from your own blood🤓

[@emel60]

Excellent video and ingeniously simple technique! Could you please do a video on decomposition of polymers by microwaving, where the by products are pure hydrogen and multiwalled carbon nanotubes?

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I can look at it for sure

[@emel60]

@@ThinkingandTinkering Thank you very much Mr. Murray-Smith! Below I am providing the original article name which I came upon a couple of years back. I figure it would be a interesting and important knowledge to spread. I believe this would be the most cost effective way to produce H2 gas, but I leave it up to you! "Microwave-initiated Catalytic Deconstruction of Plastic 2 Waste into Hydrogen and High-Value Carbons"

[@MaximusMuleti]

This is mind blowing!! I've got to imagine if you put a layer of insulation on top of a shower, you could roll it up and slide it into a sleeve, thereby condensing it. If you were to run these in parallel, I also imagine you'd get significantly longer life out of them too

[@robb4044]

Great vid. Very informative.

[@AdricM]

One could argue that paper batteries go all the way back tot he first ones. (well after the bagdad ones) The Volta Pile was paper between copper and zinc disks.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

I thought that too - but I thought I might be stretching it a bit there lol

[@andygozzo72]

@@ThinkingandTinkering many years ago when i was little i made 'batteries' from stacks of 2p coin-paper-10p coin, one on top of another, with salt water electrolyte 😉 powered leds ok, cant remember if i tried a small radio or not , with modern high brightness leds it'd be much better

[@Warriorking.1963]

What a cool experiment! One question, and maybe I'm really stupid here, but where do you purchase things like zinc powder? This was a terrific video, and I was genuinely blown away with the size of the battery market.

[@RyanLebeck-td5ft]

Has this enhanced the efforts on your battery? I find your method could be improved by these mixtures due to hemp having a higher potential surface area than pressed paper.

[@IN-FINITE_WISDOM]

Hi! Long time viewer with a question regarding this video. Do you think it would be possible to treat the carbon black with Dilute solution of potassium premeganate to make Nano particles of manganese dioxide. As for catalyst. (Somthing you taught me on magnesium battery video)

[@leestephens7281]

I find all your stuff real interesting, always watching it at work, i would be interested in any you have or could do on hydrocarbonization,

[@sydneyhunt6681]

Great video as always 👍 👌

[@johnmyers379]

Hey I got an idea if u put phosphorus between the cathode and diode. maybe change the top layer to a screen not a paper add low a/c current like 3.5v

[@atrumluminarium]

I wonder if layering another paper on top of it and rolling it up improves the performance

[@feelincrispy7053]

Ha, this is a gem of YT recommendation. I like this guy haha

[@CaptApril123]

Doable at home, not necessarily easy. Great video.

[@PickledHam]

seems like I remember making a battery about 40 years ago in the 9th grade science fair. Forget the details, seems like I used a paper towel, a copper penny, a nail then soaked in lemon juice. it was enough to power a calculator.

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

two nails in a lemon make a battery

[@8ank3r]

I have got to make one of these.

[@jdsr7423]

That's awesome 😎

[@ThinkingandTinkering]

Glad you think so!

[@keithwaterhouse2845]

If these can run in series and are rechargeable I'm thinking plying and gluing to the back of solar panels to supply 24/7 power without the bulky Li ion box.

[@philipdoyle1851]

Brilliant!

[@SumNumber]

A multilayered stack of those wired in parallel might be good for a bit. :O)

[@firatriaulia6576]

Sorry, I want to ask. what can we use collector ink for and where to use it?

[@Joao-bq6ic]

Hi Robert! I've managed to replicate the battery setup and achieved a voltage of 1.42V on the potentiostat. Could we discuss the paper further? Greetings from Brazil!

[@CNCmachiningisfun]

This looks good on paper - - - and on your voltmeter too :) .

[@garyweber7139]

How about making a few hundred and stack them in parallel and series, see if they can be scaled up for lighting or a fan. What about the paper density and composition, also it's thickness and the coating thickness and some of the ratios of the various chemical components. When you stated common table salt, is that non-iodized? Also did you use distilled water? I'm curious what is the weight of the end product and it's scalability?

[@andygozzo72]

i suppose seriesing and parallelling possible, but practicality may be an issue, instead of parallelling, larger flat area, maybe?,

[@Xero1of1]

I'm curious... would you be able to stack these paper batteries together using whatever parallel/series connection you need to power an 18V cordless drill? Is it stackable? Will the higher voltage and current alight the battery? If it does catch fire, will be a big fire? Little fire? No fire? How does it work in cold temperatures (freezing) or hot temperatures (inside an oven)? Can it handle inrush current? Can they be recharged? Or can they be modified in some way to make them rechargeable? It would be an interesting video if you could tackle all these questions...

[@andygozzo72]

doubt it'd have enough current capability, as its a variation of the standard zinc carbon type, which have poor current driving ability, voltage wouldnt be a problem, within limits, as you could connect as many in series as physically possible....charging, very unlikely as zinc carbons cant be, inrush current? not sure what you mean, except peak current capability? as said, current very poor....

[@vintasalo]

Can it be recharged with water or is the zinc creating a galvanic effect

[@andygozzo72]

the zinc get eaten away as its 'working' as with all zinc carbon cells,