1923 Gibson "Lloyd Loar" F-5 Mandolin-HOLY GRAIL ALERT! The Stradivarius of the Mandolin

Storied Sounds, Episode 5
Ever wonder what six figures+ sounds like? Wonder no more! This one lives up to the hype in every way; Reed might have even shed a little tear in his car on the way to returning this gorgeous specimen to its generous owner. You really have to play something like this to truly get it, but this video will get you as close as possible.
Demo is Huckleberry's Hope, written by Reed Jones and recorded by Audie Blaylock and Redline ft. Ronnie McCoury. Find it here:
open.spotify.com/album/40Jq8J...
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Thanks to Quist for the backing track used in the intro.

[@tomellis1857]

I replaced a broken pearl tuner button on this mandolin about 30 yrs ago. Its a great sounding mandolin

[@reedj112]

Tom, it really is! And you would know...

[@mandograssable]

Wayne Henderson made me a copy of the Loar in 1978. He had taken a Loar apart before and got all the measurements. He made a few mandolins in the beginning and even put The Gibson on the headstock with an original Gibson tailpiece cover. He even put the Gibson stickers on them for the inside and signed Loars signature and it looked identical. My Henderson with the Gibson headstock is the last one with Gibson on it. He did put a sticker inside of mine saying it is a copy of a Gibson made by Wayne Henderson. The rest of the mandolins he made he put his name on. I have played 4 Loars in my career and my mandolin sounds as good or better than any of them. It has the chunkiest chop you have ever heard. I have had people come all the way across a field at a festival and say what kind of mandolin are you playing? Don't get me wrong, I love Loars, but I love mine just as well and it only cost me 750 dollars in 1978. The Loar in this video looks and sounds great.

[@flatlander6734]

Immediately before watching this, I watched a video interview of Bill Monroe, who stated that he bought the Loar in Florida in 1941. Not 1945.

[@waltmarchant5255]

Really enjoyed this video. In my experience, the Loar mandolins cannot be appreciated unless you are fortunate enough to play one. I had the opportunity in 1977 & 1978 to play one of these instruments, when I was studying classical mandolin, and playing in the Baltimore mandolin Orchestra. The first time my mandolin teacher handed me his mandolin to use for my lesson, it was a religious experience. That instrument seemed to play itself. He bought his Gibson F5 new in 1924 (or 1923). He played it for more than 50 years before I was able to touch it. It was perfect every in imaginable way. I'll never forget the tone, or ease with which it was played. All these years later, that experience feels like it was yesterday. Your description of the Lloyd Loar F5 is a fitting tribute. It really is the Stradivarius of mandolins. Thank you.

[@reedj112]

Thanks for sharing your experience and for watching!

[@ACOUSTIC_4LOVE]

Man those Loar ‘ Mandolins seem to all have the same beautiful tone- some bit louder/ more punch, but everyone incredible. David Apollon’ I believe acquired his Loar’ F-5 before Monroe? Great historical run-down on the Mandolin and Gibson’s early history. Austin Clark’ in Boise Idaho builds incredible F-5s. I played one of his at his shop- A Monster. I love my Elk horn’ F-5 Fern- and I didn’t have to sell the house!

[@deblane401]

The Verzi was invented by The Verzi Brothers. Loar worked for them before Gibson and her bought the rights to the Virzi disk,

[@davidsims1329]

That is a sweet sounding mandolin

[@robertshorthill4153]

Man, I've got to invent a time machine to take me back to 1924 so I can pick up a dozen or so of those F- 5 mandos, bring 'em back to present day and assure my retirement fund. A time machine would probably be outta the picture these days, alas. Too bad, so sad. I can see why that Loar in the case could bring 6+ figures. Man, she's a beauty.

[@peterjames2580]

Wonderful! Thanks do much for the sharing this mandolin. I have played only one Loar F-5 but they are a treasure!

[@adamzimmerman9459]

great video, what a wonderful instrument, thanks for posting these

[@darylcrisp1863]

awesome story, content, and playing. thank you for your time and effort to bring these swell cool episodes to us. loved the Gibson L00(1st episode)!!

[@reedj112]

Thanks so much!

[@b.k.nicholsonanddesperado7359]

Nice job! Appreciate the comments about Loars/musicians needing or not needing to have one, yet still acknowledging the differences. That one is special!

[@reedj112]

Thanks, B.K.! There are a well of differences, some subtle and other less subtle, that make that one special.

[@user-fz2jk1vm1s]

Play more! This was your chance to show what the thing could do. Thanks.

[@johndenniston5092]

Great description of high end instruments such as that particular Loar. I found your presentation and playing to be excellant!

[@reedj112]

Very much appreciated, John! I've got some more videos coming soon!

[@Heavydutyrocknroll]

Man I'm so glad to have found your channel thanks to the video you did with Russ Carson. That is a fine example of a Lloyd Lost thank you for sharing that with us!

[@reedj112]

Thanks, Jeremy! That video with @81crowe was a blast! Thanks for watching!

[@JacobHeadMusic]

Such a great presentation and demonstration. You definitely have to appreciate the history behind one of those.

[@reedj112]

Many thanks, Jacob! I love when the history of an instrument, especially one of this caliber, is so well documented.

[@Mason_Wright]

I honestly didn’t know that much about Loar’s. Now I do!

[@fractuss]

Nice shirt.

[@GregRearranger]

I was lucky enough to play Grisman's Loar at Merlefest in the late 90's or early 2000's. I was a stage manager and he thought I was a musician....he handed it to me and I strummed it - he immediately knew I was not a mando player, but I have the story forever :)

[@f5mando]

Great review, Reed, and I really dig the Huckleberry's Hope. -Ronnie nailed it, but you played the melody on mando! *Peg head overlay on the Loar F-5 was not ebony, rather dyed pear wood. The adjustable bridge and truss rod were also Loar era innovations, the latter of which facilitated a narrower neck profile.

[@reedj112]

Thanks, and you are absolutely right! Not sure what I was thinking with misspeak concerning the peghead overlay! Good catch.

[@robertshorthill4153]

Reed, tell us all the story about how Bill Monroe sent his Loar back to Gibson for re- fret job and got it back re-finished as well, which pissed him off. And what he did to it consequentially.

[@reedj112]

That's quite the piece of bluegrass folk"loar"... www.mandolincafe.com/news/publish/mandolins_001107.shtml

[@robertshorthill4153]

I worked at Waverly for 21 months. We made the best tuner machines in the world. Stew Mac sold them. Mando tuners cost mid three figures, but they went a on most, if not all very high end instruments. Us poor folks have to settle(?) for Grovers.

[@joeprevitera1048]

Clarification: The F4's had the same scale, not a shorter scale as you say. In fact, the F4 has a shorter neck than the F5 .... causing the F4 bridge to be located about two frets closer to the tailpiece. This was a big deal.

[@reedj112]

Sorry for the misspeak. Just substitute the word scale for neck, and everything else I said makes perfect sense! "Which has a massive impact on it tonally." Good catch!

[@joeprevitera1048]

@@reedj112 ..... Yes sir. Us Loar types are anal at times! LOL!

[@reedj112]

@@joeprevitera1048 As you should be! We need that!

[@joeprevitera1048]

@@reedj112 Great presentation ....... thank you!

[@grasser82]

Man you should bring this fine mandolin the the banjothon in Knoxville Tennessee i think probably half of these that exist in the world show up there every year and plus all the wonderful banjos and some super nice old guitars

[@reedj112]

I believe this mandolin typically makes the journey to Banjothon, just not in my possession!

[@grasser82]

@@reedj112 oh ok cool deal

[@Life-of-Bluegrass_Music]

Sounds ok

[@GIBKEL]

I got a 29’ L5. It needed work and it also had to be reawakened. I haven’t hear a flat-top do this but you can hear it as you play it more. Ever played a Vivitone? I’m pondering it.. I’m sick I tell you, sick!

[@JMcBillz]

nice shirt, don't trash the nati!

[@donmacrostie7628]

What’s the serial number of that April 25th? Thank you. I own 73010.

[@donmacrostie7628]

The back on 73010 looks just like the one you show. It also has incredible power and tone.

[@reedj112]

​@@donmacrostie7628 It is 73013. Perhaps the same log?

[@donmacrostie7628]

Yes, I’m sure you’re right about being from the same log. Not all April 25ths have the same back. Thanks for sharing the serial #. That batch had about 13 F-5’s in it, consecutively numbered from 73002 to 73014, and I’m trying to learn as much about the batch as I can. I know where about half the batch is. Nice video on those instruments. Joe is correct about scale length and neck length.

[@Vader99ify]

Although it was 1945 when Bill first made his appearance on the Grand Ole Opry, he started calling it bluegrass in 1939. To most bluegrass enthusiast, it is considered bluegrass music being invented in that year not 1945. Btw, you can play that thing pretty well!

[@reedj112]

Thanks, Doug! Monroe actually made his Opry debut in 1939, and it is generally accepted that though his act was called "Bill Monroe and His Blue Grass Boys," the pattern on which the music that we now call "bluegrass" wasn't established until the addition of the so-called Scruggs-style banjo in 1945. This configuration with Lester Flatt, Earl Scruggs, Howard Watts, Chubby Wise, and Monroe are commonly referred to as the original bluegrass band, and they helped establish bluegrass as its own unique part of what was then known as "hillbilly music." People like the Stanley Brothers started their career emulating this iteration of Monroe's music (of course with their own spin), and when Flatt and Scruggs left Monroe in 1948 to form their own own band, the die was basically cast. Obviously, nailing down the origins of something like a musical genre can be quite complicated and there's more to bluegrass and its history than one man and one moment; but bluegrass is set apart from many other genres by it's (sometimes strict) adherence to the basic template that was made in 1945. Thanks for the comment and for watching!

[@Vader99ify]

@@reedj112 Very nice reply. I was talking about when Monroe started calling the music "bluegrass music", not when he started calling his band "Bill Monroe and his bluegrass boys" because that was in 1945 like you stated, but in fact was calling his style of music "bluegrass music" all the way back in 1939 when he was the Monroe Brothers. Which is why most enthusiast say it was 1939 when it was invented not 1945 when it was part of his actual band name.

[@reedj112]

Thanks for engaging, I love talking musicology and history! Apparently we are approaching this from different angles! I'm saying that regardless of what Monroe called his music prior to 1945, what would come to be called "bluegrass" follows the 1945 pattern, not the 1939 iteration of his music. Monroe himself even followed that pattern (three-finger (Scruggs-style) banjo rather the way Stringbean played in the previous version of the band) from then out. The recordings from his earlier sessions under only his name in 1941 didn't even have a banjo, and you'd be hard-pressed to find any traditional bluegrass enthusiast that doesn't identify that instrument with the genre. The earlier music he played, whether under his own name or with his brother, Charlie, is certainly a step in the evolution of what became bluegrass, but no one really played that style and called it bluegrass after that, including Monroe himself. Nearly everyone I know in our music today refers to the 1945 band as "the original bluegrass band" and follows that template, and I think that impact is more important than what Mr. Monroe was calling his music in 1939 when defining a genre. Regardless, I'm asserting that this type of mandolin is also widely regarded as a major part of the evolution of that music, as well.

[@Vader99ify]

@@reedj112 I can clearly see now that we were both saying the same thing just in different angles like you said. Awesome conversation engagement! Thanks! This conversation has convinced me to sub!

[@fractuss]

My friend up the road builds a mandolin based on a Loar called "Red Diamond:, they are fantastic, check them out.

[@reedj112]

I've familiar with Don's mandolins, they are among the finest! I think Don commented on this video below, he would definitely qualify as an expert on all things F-5 and Loar.

[@fractuss]

@@reedj112 Ah yes, I see that now.

[@brianeversole3849]

I love the history, the rarity, the sound, the innovation, the mojo. I get why folks will pay a large sum. But to pretend that there is some sort of magic sound that cant be replicated is just silly.

[@CapnBubbaa]

Is this a Virzi Model F5?

[@reedj112]

No Virzi!

[@ponchlove2393]

You ever hear of john e. Hutto..????

[@reedj112]

Sure! I've played several Huttos!

[@michaellange6598]

played a bruno triple string mandochello once and a 1917 f-5 gibson should have bought both

[@marklozano8388]

get on with it!

[@notanotherstep]

Anyone else notice the “off the ranch”intro music

[@ponchlove2393]

I would put a. Hutto mandolin right up with a loar....!!!!!!

[@talon1623]

Lloyd Loar did not invent the Virzi. The Virzi brothers invented it.

[@gabanjoman]

Nice job on the history of the Mandolin but Bill Monroe did not invent Bluegrass, he has been given credit for that , but " bluegrass" started when America did in the hills of Appalachia thanks for the Mandolin though

[@reedj112]

Thanks for watching! I'm very comfortable with the assertions I made about Monroe and the inception of the distinct branch of hillbilly (as it was called at the time) and string band music that came to be known as Bluegrass. It's obviously a complex story with roots in the "ancient tones" Monroe spoke and sang of, but what would be called bluegrass, as it is traditionally defined, started in 1945 with the addition of Earl Scruggs to Monroe's band. Similar to Monroe and bluegrass, Scruggs didn't "invent" three finger playing, but he absolutely provided the template that was followed and later expanded. So for the scope of a video that was focused on a specific instrument and not about the cultural history and complex forces that created a musical genre, I'll stand by those statements.

[@bretwiley6675]

You’re video is entirely dialogue. I wanna see you play it..... somebody play it. As a player? Show us.

[@reedj112]

Go to 10:35!

[@tylerrexjackson366]

Patience is a virtue, finish the video first

[@jimsmirh2406]

Bill Monroe actually got his F5 from Lloyd Loar in 1923 not 1945.

[@reedj112]

Thanks for watching, Jim! Monroe's mandolin was signed on July 9, 1923 by Lloyd Loar. He picked it up used much later.