2002 Ford Thunderbird | Retro Review

Still easy to find nice, low mileage, one owner examples. Get em before they soar.
Show 2107 | Original Airdate 10-17-2001
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[@peterjamieson2441]

Kinda scary to realise that the revision of the classic....is now itself a classic

[@bluruckuscrx8124]

It needs at least another 20 years to be an actual classic

[@adampetten5349]

Tales one back to Gustav Graves and Mr. KIL!...with invisible Vanquish to boot!

[@ptingz9307]

2002 aint classic, but the car itself does

[@interstate366]

The first time I saw one of these was at the Outer Banks in North Carolina not long after they came out. It had the top down and was driven by a 50ish-year-old woman with a Janet Reno haircut who was smoking a Virginia Slim. Every time I see one now that’s who I imagine owning it.

[@aidaaliten8817]

20

[@LaytonKnightt]

Christ, that’s an image.

[@matthewbowen5841]

I have definitely seen more 60+ men driving them over the years, and my mental association also includes Adrianna La Cerva from the Sopranos, but I would say Ford probably meant your Thelma Reno type as a target demographic.

[@devinbiz]

Sounds like the target demographic

[@GS-zc4sk]

Safe to assume it was painted sea spray green?

[@viccionetti5907]

I bought a 2004 silver bird w/hardtop in 2006 with 9500 miles on it and paid 60% of original list. I still own it, now with 85,000 miles and get compliments or thumbs up nearly every time I drive it. Is it a sports car? Nope. A cruiser? Hell yes. Big power? No. But it’s still a V8 when you put your foot down, and on nice days, especially those summer nights…putting the top down still feels great!

[@jimlubinski4731]

I also have a 2004 silver bird w/hardtop that I bought new. Aside from some reliability issues over the years (probably the Jaguar influence), I'm very happy with it. As you said, it's a cruiser. Mine just crossed 80k miles and I also get lots of compliments and thumbs-up.

[@IVR02]

I work for an estate sale company, and we had one of these turn up (in black, no less!) at a sale a few years ago. The guy who bought it was an older gentleman, and he ended up becoming a frequent customer. He always shows up with the Bird when it's nice out, to the point where we've dubbed him Thunderbird Joe. As for when the weather doesn't welcome the Thunderbird, he turns up in an equally nice Town Car from the same era.

[@WitchyWhale]

I don't care what people say about the 00's T-Bird it is a favourite of mine. It was a childhood dream car, I had the Barbie version of this T-Bird growing up. It brings back memories.

[@aidaaliten8817]

14

[@theoddfurry141]

They’re really nice looking cars fr, I’d love one of these if i wanted a car for cruising and cruising only

[@anthonyfrench3169]

I still remember seeing these for the first time when I worked at my local Ford dealership it was amazing to see it in person.

[@anibalbabilonia1867]

What killed the t-bird was the high price mark ups the dealer where asking for on top of the sticker price!

[@jhomrich89]

Kinda what killed the viper in later years, and many other great automotive ideas something has to change at the greedy dealers

[@anibalbabilonia1867]

@@jhomrich89 I agree! And they’re continuing doing it with the new junk Bronco!

[@SP84Fanatic]

In terms of price, if this picked up where the Mustang convertible topped out, this might have had a chance.

[@bertram46]

What an ignorant comment but it's all supply and demand like anything else in business you're not giving them accolades when they sell a car that's not selling below invoice and losing money

[@pieswimmer1]

​@@bertram46 dealer shill spotted

[@nebelwerfer199]

I saw one of these the other day. Seemed like the auto industry was so much more promising back then. Now it's depressing.

[@ouch1011]

Most of the retro styled cars like this (think PT Cruiser, HHR, SSR, Mustang) we’re absolutely awful cars. I’d rather have the auto industry work on building a good car rather than a horrible one with semi-cool styling.

[@matthewbowen5841]

We are staring down a future full of nothing but compliance cars.

[@nebelwerfer199]

@@ouch1011 PT Cruiser and HHR and SSR were so lame I agree. But T-Bird, Solstice and others were nice.

[@BelAir1603]

Nice car, I always loved it. I think it aged well

[@aidaaliten8817]

16

[@marioiacolucci]

I have a picture of me sitting in one from the auto show

[@gregoryjohnson9733]

I liked this Tbird when it came out. See a few out there today and still look new.

[@irieite100]

Ford blew it by using the modern looking dashboard from the LS in this thing. It clashed with the retro exterior styling.

[@pwnranger3496]

The irony is that dash is the most dated thing about the car

[@bobmarvin6783]

@Bad Drivers of AZ & NV I thing Pwn Ranger meant today in 2022 a retro thunderbird in good condition still looks great but the dash today in 2022 is what looks the most dated about it, the exterior styling could be brought out as a fun retro right now by Ford, but not the dash.

[@bobmarvin6783]

Maybe if they could have styled and produced a better interior without increase in the MSRP, but it was already priced pretty high. 42k miles on ours, still love it.

[@pwnranger3496]

@@bobmarvin6783 yeah what Bob said. That radio looks so out of place, and there could have been a few extra flourishes to spruce the interior up more

[@GS-zc4sk]

I 🤬 hate the whole thing.

[@bobross9321]

I've been wanting one of these for quite a while and finally bought an '04 in January while snowbirding in Florida. Got a great deal at a Ford dealership with 48,000 miles! Love everything about it!!!! They did bump up the hp in 2003 to 280 horses.

[@RajaReign78]

I don’t care what anyone says I wanted one of these from the moment I saw it and I still do. 🤷🏼‍♀️

[@TRC19999]

I remember this car. It had a great exterior that led way to the retro 2005 Mustang. But the interior was straight out of a 90s escort.

[@aidaaliten8817]

22

[@brianlee9233]

Agreed. I want to see the Thunderbird make a return with the Mach-E's ignition sound and NOT THAT STUPID TRI-TONE CRAP!

[@adamn7516]

@@aidaaliten8817 Is there a point to your repeated comments with nothing but a number in them?

[@brianlee9233]

@@adamn7516 Did you hear what I just said, Adam?

[@RetroCarsForever]

I own one of these, just like this (blue on blue), wife's choice! As a sports car its awful, as a comfy stylish cruiser its aces!

[@1983jblack]

They were never meant to be a sports car. Even in the '50s, it was initially thought to be a sports car, but become more than that and introduced "Personal Luxury Coupe" to our vocabulary. These were meant to be cruisers and nothing more

[@RetroCarsForever]

@@1983jblack Exactly! But for whatever reason everyone wanted this car to be sporty, and were crestfallen when it drove like a two-door Lincoln Town Car.

[@matthewbowen5841]

@@RetroCarsForever I think the expectation was that, since it was basically a 2 door convertible LS, it would drive like one. The LS was meh, and has aged like milk, but it did drive very well for its time, especially considering it came from Lincoln. The TBird was true to its roots and exactly what a TBird always was and always should have been (minus the Supercoupe curveballs in the 80s and 90s). But the press expected an LS-like driving experience.

[@patricksmith1550]

I'll never understand why they didnt put the 32 valve 4.6 engine in this car. It was not only in the mustang cobra, but it was in the Lincoln Mark whatever too, so it was perfectly compatible with an automatic trans.

[@Stj209]

Probably because the demographic this car was made for was 60+ , so this tiny v8 was fast enough and cheaper to produce. That 32v would have made this thing fast as hell though!

[@morecowbell69]

Because it's a throwback to 1950's Thunderbirds with 292 ci engines, and not much over 200 horsepower.

[@diversedad7954]

I would say most of the older customers do you like this quiet little V8 that probably gets quite a bit better fuel mileage than that Cobra engine but that would have been awesome!

[@fxggyearth18]

i got my dads 2002 thunderbird, very nostalgic and i love it

[@Matt_Dagostino]

Apperently a hot take, but I actually like the interior. It's simple and effective, and the body colored accents compliment the interior nicely

[@buhrrito]

One of my middle school teachers had this car. She was a large lady, bless her heart. I thought this was the coolest car. I still want one.

[@4HBirtcher]

To the people who don’t like this car please understand this! This is ford’s terrific creation bringing 21st century technology joining Lincoln with the retro 50s look so don’t need to be making negative comments on the car or will be reported by KZbin!

[@reallyrandomrides1296]

I can kind of picture John Davis owning this as his personal car, both back in 2002 as well as today in 2022. Either white or seafoam blue.

[@hunterscott7592]

Just bought a 2005 in Black for $5k, I love it and still think it looks cool and retro

[@hakeemsd70m]

How did you ever find an '05 T-bird for just $5K? 😮 That's pretty sweet! 😃

[@hunterscott7592]

@@hakeemsd70m it’s got a lot of miles, but engine was rebuilt at some point. For some reason, there are a lot of these for sale in Southern California right now, most from 8k - 15k

[@CalvinHikes]

It's funny how at the time the T-bird was universally liked. But very quickly, retrospectively was considered an awful car.

[@sj6292]

We've had ours 22 years now and still love it.

[@jimmyj5035]

If Ford would've given it the same Engine as the Mustang GT of the same year they'd STILL Be Making Them Today!

[@razvandobos9759]

This car needs a massive revival. And it will have the same aesthetic as the Jaguar XK and Aston Martin.

[@AnEverydayGamer]

maybe a better retro design. never really got around to liking this generation's

[@kevlosent6375]

This car still sucks

[@Zecrid.]

It's really funny how these have not depreciated in price at all lol Whenever they go on sale you usually see them ask for above 20K even with some milage

[@frankcoffey]

This Thunderbird, Plymouth Prowler, and the Chevy SSR were all good looking and could have sold well but they were not priced correctly. They still look good enough to convert to EV some day.

[@frankcoffey]

@Bad Drivers of AZ & NV True, and they must be fairly good cars I see a lot of them still on the road.

[@cavalierliberty6838]

The ssr is interesting. Too bad it was a flop. Car people hated it since it was a truck. Truck people hated it for the tonneau and convertible top.

[@devinbiz]

I think the pricing was actually quite spot on. At first, the dealer markups to capture the initial demand, I think hurt sales later on, and it was more of a cute novelty vanity purchase. People wanting to relive the nostalgia of the original. The same that bought the first New Beetles, and a few years later were ditching the New Beetle, for a Jetta or Passat.

[@manthony225]

Chevy should have offered a fixed roof SSR at a lower price

[@alanolson6913]

I own a black’02. Don’t know how ‘rare’ it is but I also have the ‘bra’ with a Thunderbird logo - never have seen one anywhere (like at car shows I attend or even in any of the brochures I have). It just turned 22,000 miles. I don’t drive it in bad weather. When I was a boy my uncle and aunt owned a black ‘56 and I promised myself that one day I’d own one (ok , so it’s not a ‘56 but I’m content and that’s what matters). I belong to a Thunderbird club. Some in other clubs have say , in my hearing, that these aren’t ‘ real’ Thunderbirds. I frankly don’t care what they say or think.

[@jeffshadow2407]

The same people who say the last Cougar isn't a real Cougar.

[@PHOENIXRISING7700]

Hard to believe this video is from 20 years ago the Thunderbird from (2002-05) are rare

[@apexgt4]

I’m glad this is uploaded in better quality 👍

[@mattuw82]

They should have made a sport version of this.

[@matthewbowen5841]

Anyone else remember the Lincoln Mark X concept version of this? It was HOTTTTT.

[@jamesbyun8571]

Great looking car. Too bad it was let down by the cheap interior and mediocre drivetrain.

[@SantanKGhey1234]

horribly ugly car

[@aaryeshg.6526]

What I find funny is that the Jaguar XK8 had a similar engine (4.0L instead of 3.9L) but makes close to 300 hp. And Jag quickly came out years later with an XKR which had a ZF 6 speed auto and 4.2L Supercharged V8. This T bird was stuck with just one engine and transmission. The only saving grace really is the exterior design which looks fab.

[@anthonyrowland9072]

they raised it to 280hp in the later models but just using the 290hp 4.0 from the beginning would've made since and upgrade it the 300hp 4.2 later since they were all the same engine family. the sluggishness off the line was probably just in the tune to not dare spin a tire for the 50+ year old buyers. the car was made to be a tire burner but could've been made significantly sportier for literally $0 from the factory.

[@williammckinney7765]

This car is 90% about style, 9% about a removable top, and 1% everything else. And I'm okay with that.

[@reallyrandomrides1296]

The retro inspired Thunderbird was not the hit Ford and John Davis predicted, though I think if it was introduced now, it might have done better, with a bit more time since the last Thunderbirds were sold in 1997. Although now it would probably be made into an electric or hybrid crossover like the Mustang Mach E. The exterior looks ok, maybe a bit of a refresh, more modern door handles but leave the rest retro looking, and make the interior more retro looking but with modern conveniences and reliability.

[@Porsche996driver]

These things just got parked in senior’s garages lol. I’ve always wanted to see one of these warmed over, with a revised front grill, nice wheels, suspension, etc. Never saw it.

[@GeeEm1313]

Yeah. The front looks like a fish. They shouldn't have released it with that grill.

[@Romiman1]

Gorgous! There is and was no better looking Ford since about 45 years! Sad, that it's gone.

[@BigBoss1292]

The hardtop with the port window still looks gorgeous in my opinion

[@emilianocruz11]

The final years for the Ford thunderbird have the same jaguar v8 and lincoln ls 3.9 v8 and love the sound of this car and was very special for me since 2003n

[@jameswalsh9637]

have one haven’t been able to drive it as much as i’d like love the review mine is black on black 36000 miles 2003

[@TheCarCrazyGuy]

Imagine this car with a Coyote engine and a 10 speed auto or 6 speed manual.

[@Mane_ea]

Mustang convert

[@marioiacolucci]

History repeats itself this is one example right here

[@robertstone9988]

This car with the 4.6 32 valve v8 from the mach 1 and mk8 would have made this car

[@aidaaliten8817]

19

[@dohc1067]

A work of art 🎨 in exterior styling by Ford, but the pricing got crazy. I haven't seen one of these in years.

[@hakeemsd70m]

I still occasionally see these 00's T-birds around the Ohio Valley. Saw a burgundy red one crusing in downtown Cincinnati this past August. An ageless beauty.

[@ohioyodertoter6827]

Nothing like the super coupe I still have mine and other than some issues getting parts for it I love it still I’ve had it since 94 👍

[@aidaaliten8817]

8

[@shinobusensui9395]

I had the previous generation, I thought that one was better in looks and had a better drivetrain. I wish i bought the supercharged version when I had a chance

[@Hotlog69]

More like, how high do you have to be to buy one!?

[@KarlBean-pb9zf]

Bought my 2003 in 2016,but now it needs some repair. Unfortunately Ford has declared many parts “ obsolete “. Good luck on finding the parts to fix a problem! Not easy combing junkyards and the Internet,but good luck!

[@dave_riots]

My great grandpa bought one of these new in 2004 and owned it over a period of 10k miles. He said it was the worst car he'd ever driven, and traded it in for an Avalon.

[@gustavoayala7176]

I've never been a fan of that bodystyle Tbird, I own a 1997 Tbird and I think the 90s body style looked cooler than the "newer retro Tbirds".

[@aidaaliten8817]

4

[@codycrawford2385]

We had a 1997 LX C/S beautiful car

[@Niterider73]

This car was way too expensive when it came out. Especially with the bland cheap plastic interior of the time. Not to mention 252 horsepower was nothing to write home about. Minimum this car should have had the 280 horsepower dual overhead cam engine out of the Mark viii Or at least an updated version of it. And this car at the very most with all the options should then around the $30,000 price range. I think this was a classic example of Ford trying to get the most money out of the least amount of quality put into a retro product. It was such a letdown whatever it came out. Last but not least I think Emmanuel transmission should have been offered. I don't think you would have sold a ton but it would have been a nice addition for a fun cruiser.

[@robertstone9988]

Agree a option for a more performance bird with the 4.6 32 valve v8 would have been nice and its not like they didnt use it in any thing else it's in the mach 1, murader, mk8, and navigator. Thats not counting the cobra version of it in the 97-01 cobra mustang. I always wondered why ford used the 3.9 or the 4.6 sohc at all? All gt mustangs should have had the 32 valve dohc v8. The cobra could have used the 32 valve 5.4 that was in the cobra R. Could you imagine in my time line a 5.4 32 valve dohc super charged terminator cobra?

[@aidaaliten8817]

24

[@bghoody5665]

Ford counted on those nostalgia feels to overcome frugal sensibleness. But a quick view through the car complaints website shows the 2002 as the worst T-Bird model year. Even an appearance in Die Another Day driven by Halle Berry couldn't help.

[@robertstone9988]

@@bghoody5665 I worked at a Ford dealership in like 2008 through 2015 or so and we had one of those used on our lot and I'd have to take the convertible top down and put it up every day and it's such a pain in the ass to use and it makes no sense because the same year Mustang convertible super easy top Mazda Miata super easy to use a Ford ownd Mazda at the time. the latches at the top of the windshield to let the top go were just piece of shit complicated if I remember right. It was a piss poor luxury car and it even worse sports car. It really kind of needed to be just one or the other or give it an option to be sporty and an option to be cruiser and let the person ordering the car decide

[@taurussho86]

Cars aren't making that power today

[@jhomrich89]

An old neighbor of mine still has hers, except hers is a 2003, and drives it only on nice days and ironically it's the same color as the one as tested here.

[@youngestson6537]

Very different from my 66Tbird. A lot has changed.

[@ricepony33]

Future Classic

[@aidaaliten8817]

23

[@kowalski5599]

I remember seeing a few of these back in the day. I didn't know they used that Lincoln LS drivetrain, I liked the look of those cars when new but they have a -horrible- track record. Ford should have used their regular 4.6 V8, there was no reason not to.

[@dodge1515]

I used to think these were Chryslers when I was little. lol

[@tonysdiecastcustoms]

Definitely a beautiful Ride 👍👊😎

[@TimeisReel]

I thought they were going to be a huge hit. I still think they are kinda... Cool

[@aidaaliten8817]

10

[@e30m3steaz]

Im about to buy one. last classic i bought and till own is an E30 M3. This will be an investor class car and people will be kicking themselves for not getting them while they are "the most overrated sportscar" which was literally the top of the youtube search list. i remember when knowone wanted an e30 m3 also. made for a great time to buy

[@taurussho86]

Thunderbird needs to come back and make it spot alongside 4 door muscle cars. Have a 2 door version too.

[@1983jblack]

They tried a four door version in 1967. T-Birds were meant to be 2 doors only

[@taurussho86]

@@1983jblack hey, change the formula. This rendition didn't go well. Look at the Chargers and Challengers... They were 2 door also.

[@mikedaleiden7725]

A car originally designed in the 1950s as a 2 seat Corvette competitor....wow did those cars go in opposite directions!!!!!

[@darrenhall7990]

They should have put a 4.6 Cobra motor in it with a T56.

[@aidaaliten8817]

6

[@Retiredmco]

John Davis is iconic!

[@mysticstarhf9265]

These were nice cars. I still wonder why they had poor sales.

[@jimmoritz553]

I’ve had mine 20 years. Blue white top. 11,000 miles and love every minute.

[@hakeemsd70m]

I believe it's because of the high MSRP coupled with dealer markups which lead to poor sales. They are gorgeous cars, and have become quite collectible since their debut of now two decades past.

[@brianfleitas1829]

Never understood why they just didn't use the 4.6 SOHC from the Mustang. It made more power, more Torque, and was far cheaper than the Jag V8.

[@RegM86]

2002 vehicle is now a retro review. Darn I’m getting old!

[@SP84Fanatic]

Thunderbird would be a perfect name for an electric car from Ford these days. It would likely adorn an SUV or crossover, given current market trends, but I wouldn't be surprised if Ford dusts off the name for a new electric vehicle in the future, but maybe with only a few nods to nostalgia, instead of the overt ones in this model.

[@dodgeguyz]

It was a nice car but lacked the proper power train!

[@devinbiz]

Another attempt could be a success, on a Mustang platform, sharper creases, less of a bloated look, a more practical trunk for it size, maybe either an eco boost V6, or just a flat out V8

[@jehb8945]

This thing needed either a 4.64 valve or the upcoming 4.63 valve for the 05 Mustang with an even 300 horsepower and considering it's out of Ford's parts been it would have been a cheaper engine than the 3.9 L unit.

[@andrenj1970]

They didn’t fly off… so they killed it;)

[@PhillyDee215]

MAKE AMERICA 🇺🇸 V8 AGAIN😎

[@aidaaliten8817]

17

[@SaiyanABlazeNinja]

5:16 why is Shia Labeouf showcasing a 2002 Ford Thunderbird to me

[@rightlanehog3151]

A Retro Review of a retro car.

[@alitheretrokid]

Crazy that in 2022 money the loaded t bird would cost $62,000. Now a nice used one can be had for $10,000.

[@OP941nine]

Ford's biggest mistake with the tbird was to put the Lincoln ls's power train on it

[@damilolaakanni]

My guess is that they wanted the Thunderbird to be a soft riding convertible to compete with the Lexus SC, although they never sold it as a Lincoln. Which is why they didn't use the 4.6 from the Mustang GT, and never sold it with a manual transmission.

[@blackericdenice]

I wonder is this guy going to out live Scotty Kilmer.

[@MitchGrooms]

Scotty is alive, there were rumors he passed.

[@aidaaliten8817]

12

[@ouch1011]

It’s too bad that they put this on the bloated LS/S-Type platform. The fact that it barely manages a sub 8-second 0-60 with a 250hp V8 shows how heavy and lethargic it is. I’ve driven a few of these and the driving experience is substantially less cool than the look. You really would have to be completely uninterested in the driving experience to have shelled out the money to get one of these when new.

[@4allu568]

Always in Convertible mode.🌞

[@TimJoseph08031990]

Doug DeMuro did review this car. Ford could have improved the interior, replacing some of the plastic switches with chrome ones to have that retro look.

[@LMacNeill]

This would've been a *LOT* more popular if Ford had priced it a bit more competitively. $40K+ with options is just too much (in 2002) for what really amounts to a weekend toy, or maybe a commuter car for a lawyer or doctor (although they'd probably by a Porsche or a Benz or a BMW). It just really didn't have a good target market, so it kind of floundered with no real buyers. Shame, too, because it was really a cool cruiser.

[@petulantfrenzy5532]

Ah, back when Ford was a CAR company.

[@jtckentucky3481]

Plenty of room in the trunk for a bag of cocaine apparently

[@ericschultz1073]

That’s crazy. They got a car with issues right from the start😢

[@betterdeadthanred839]

If this car had a better interior and 4.6 V8 it would've been a home run for Ford. In typical Ford manner they decided to go cheap and maximize profit. You can't dip into your parts bin when you're trying to retro mod legendary car like Thunderbird. People expected bigger wow factor....interior is definitely the biggest fail....it did not match otherwise pretty good looking exterior....

[@mikefordguy3364]

These cars have issues like all cars. I bought one new in 2003. Got 7k off MSRP. I still have it sitting in my garage beside a 2010 GT500. I enjoy both cars but for obvious different reasons. I drive a 1968 Galaxie 500 convertible from 1985 until 2017 when I sold to Hans and some guy's from Sweden. Now that Galaxie was the best of both the Shelby and and the t bird!

[@shinobusensui9395]

When did they add the Galaxie or this to Forza?

[@arevee9429]

Thank God they no longer use the annoying guitar music in the background. Who thought that was a good idea?

[@jasonz7788]

Awesome thanks

[@southernpimp5252]

Crazy to think this aired one month after 9/11.

[@KenanTurkiye]

flag is false man flag is false

[@scottkemp3154]

Ford needs to bring this car back naysayers complain to much

[@aidaaliten8817]

21

[@ic1815]

Lmao excellent fit and finish @ 2:13 there Ford… wow 😂

[@swanblake]

They really missed the mark with this on pricing. DOA because Ford got greedy

[@aidaaliten8817]

18

[@15DudeAwesome]

These are collector cars now

[@billyfoster3223]

I'd rather have this car than a front drive anything!😁

[@noseefood1943]

I’ve never seen this car on the road

[@matthewrichards4757]

3.9 lt automatic only slow as shit and over priced.... These motor week dudes just love everything they review don't they?

[@qmto]

Just waiting for ford to bring back the T bird as some awful crossover. It’s only a matter of time.

[@brianlee9233]

Nope, I'm waiting for this to come back with the Mach-E's chime.

[@BruceTheSillyGoose]

i suspect this is a city-only car, i don't believe it'd handle the bumpy rough country roads where i live. still i would love to test drive one. never see them anyplace south of king county here, that is where the money lives.

[@Thunderbirdelan]

I bought one few weeks back in peirce County it's a fun car

[@BruceTheSillyGoose]

@@Thunderbirdelan how does it ride over bumpy rough pavement?

[@Thunderbirdelan]

@BruceTheSillyGoose oh dude this thing floats unless your flying then it can hit them a little harsh but just crusing around its smooth not as smooth as my 86 now that bird is smooth smooth

[@BruceTheSillyGoose]

@@Thunderbirdelan ok, i remember riding in an '86 back in 1986 and it was Cadillac-smooth.

[@Thunderbirdelan]

@BruceTheSillyGoose yes my 86 has suspension mods as well such as gas shocks and polyurethane bushings

[@nickn815]

They were too expensive and that’s a big reason why they didn’t sell well