2004 Olympics EF FX

[@matthewhines9787]

Gah! Watching Cheng Fei guts me every time! Just...everything we wanted in a floor routine, only to screw up EF twice.

[@mrparts]

I found it funny that while she never got an Olympic medal in her main event- the floor exercise, she ended up getting an Olympic medal in the event that no one thought she had any chance : beam. 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@allandiasx]

If only floor's EF was like the Team finals. Still hurts!@@mrparts

[@saragrant9749]

Her and Dos Santos both had Olympic champion potential… but inconsistency just seemed to derail them both. Cheng still became a legend though with her eponymous vault!!

[@matthewhines9787]

@@mrparts Well...she shouldn't have IMO. That was Pavs bronze. I also find it amazing that she fell on the easiest tumbling pass in her routine while the other 3 main passes were flawless. She fell on the pass that no one thought she'd ever have issues with.

[@matthewhines9787]

@@saragrant9749 My problem with dos santos is that I'd never have credited her with a laidout position in the first pass. Kennedy Baker at Florida had a more stretched position. As a judge I'd either have to give her a stretched position credit but deduct her form so much it woulddn't make a difference, OR call her second pass a repeated skill and take those deductions along with the execution ones. Had she done the passes she did in Anaheim, she could've stayed in-bounds and won. I adore Catalina, but her routine only won because it was relatively stylish and the skills were performed with mechanical precision.

[@ChainChomp2]

Actually a pretty rare video; never seen this version of NBC's broadcast of the 2004 FX EF before, all we've really had on KZbin for years was the women's AA.

[@poshbo]

Shannon Miller's commentary is much better than Elfie's; Miller is less sensationalist and more technical and tries to actually explain the scoring system

[@Exodus004]

@@poshbo She's my favorite commentator ever

[@fishtail1129]

I wish Dos Santos would have learned to absorb landings! She had so much power but was always so bouncy. Simone was a lot like that especially early in her career, but her difficulty made it not as big of a deal. In the 10.0 era one step OOB was catastrophic.

[@dawnbaswell1853]

Yes, but Simone's form is way better The brazilians

[@ChainChomp2]

She did control them but only "most of the time", sadly it wasn't *enough* of the time or when it mattered most. Meanwhile in the 2008 final she did the opposite; did well to control her first two and most difficult elements, but lost control on landing her third and fourth. At the very least she has the World gold from the year before Athens and did well enough to inspire gymnasts like Andrade.

[@poshbo]

Dos Santos would have benefitted from better routine composition, such as using punch fronts or jumps and leaps to help with her landings and get CV. Even without going OOB, all the small shuffle steps added up

[@thesovgc]

Sofronie and Kozich had my favorite routines. Kate's was also great.

[@alissonsouza8907]

Daiane com um nível de dificuldade absurdo ❤

[@dawnbaswell1853]

Yes but ugly form

[@kaybay5210]

@@dawnbaswell1853 her form was not bad except for her first pass which was ok. her main problem was the landings

[@saragrant9749]

She would have benefited from the open scoring system with the crazy difficulty she had.

[@HilaryFindlay-k4i]

Patricia morenos opening tuble is amaaazing

[@saragrant9749]

Only medal for Spain on the women’s side to date, am I right?

[@HilaryFindlay-k4i]

@@saragrant9749 you are correct!

[@saragrant9749]

@@HilaryFindlay-k4i I really hope that changes eventually. I remember Spain having some great gymnasts- Patricia and Elena Gomez in particular- but haven’t seen much in a while. I’m assuming it’s probably a lack of funding and infrastructure that has limited their opportunities.

[@MarcosGuedes-yp2kv]

And the intro of her music is also a sample of a Salsa song, a very popular musical genre in Spain.

[@saragrant9749]

This scoring system was complete rubbish. Super clean tumbling was completely ignored in favor of only dance elements. As a result you had a gold medal for clean dance and some of the worst tumbling form I’d seen in a long time. Thank goodness that system is long gone and BOTH are valued equally.

[@dawnbaswell1853]

Agree

[@poshbo]

I disagree, this COP did value big tumbling, it's just that very few gymnasts were doing big tumbling back then. Four super E tumbling runs would have been enough to get 10 SV, with no need for any tricky dance elements. Biles would have easily gotten there. And once an element was credited, the execution deductions weren't actually that harsh, certainly less harsh than today. The tough part was that compared to the 2000 COP, it suddenly became much harder to get to 10 with more regular tumbling, so the overwhelming majority of gymnasts (who didn't have huge tumbling) had to do the hard dance elements, which they were mostly not used to. In many way this was quite a fair COP, you could get to 10 with big tumbling or dance, or both, there actually was room for variety. But the hard cap of 10 would have prevented somebody from doing big tumbling and hard dance and overall pushing the difficulty like the could today

[@saragrant9749]

@@poshbo only to you. Countless individuals- coaches, athletes, fans and even most judges did not find this code at all well constructed or thought out. It was not in any way sensible or logical in design. It is EXACTLY why the open ended system was created, and good riddance to it.

[@poshbo]

@@saragrant9749 no, read my comment. I didn't say I prefer this COP to the open ended one. I just disagree with your opinion that in the COP tumbling didn't matter and it was only about dance, that's clearly not the case. Like I said, if gymnasts were all doing super E level tumbling backin 2004 then nobody would have needed the tricky dance. The COP would have rewarded the big tumbling and would not have penalised execution too much, you only need to look at the somewhat sloppy tumbling by Ponor and Dos Santos (in QF) go see that once a tumbling element was credited, the deductions weren't that harsh. But the hard cap of 10 SV didn't promote further pushing to difficulty and innovation

[@marcuscoyle792]

Lolll all the tuck jumps and tour jetes

[@mrparts]

Those tuck jumps and the cat leaps of that cycle were so awkward .

[@poshbo]

It's interesting how much dance elements have evolved since then; these days almost all floor workers can perform D+ spins which would have made it much easier to get a 10 SV.

[@Rodriigoreis]

Cheng Fei deserved the gold. Overscored the Catalina Ponor

[@saragrant9749]

Unfortunately Cheng stepped out of bounds. I absolutely agree that Ponor was way overscored though- especially with her abismal twisting form.

[@randomedits7325]

unfortunately other than the triple twist ponors routine had minimal errors and the triple would have only endured 0.05

[@saragrant9749]

@@randomedits7325Pbnor had god awful tumbling form but clean dance- an extreme highlight of the travesty of that scoring system. Only her last tumble was pretty much clean. You’ll notice in the future her tumbling form started getting hammered as it should have been. Her beam was where she shined with clean form.

[@poshbo]

​​@@saragrant9749 Actually her double twisting tuck jump was a bit questionable but she covered it up with choreo. Her tumbling form wasn't that bad here. Later in her career her triple twist form deteriorated though and became costly

[@singsongeric]

Such a messy EF, most of the girls didn't achieve a 10.0SV and just about everyone performed worse than they did in qualification.

[@kaybay5210]

Daiane

[@jsully7712]

who is the male commentator lmfaoooo he has 0 clue what’s going on

[@ChainChomp2]

Paul Sunderland (he's named at 15:08, but at first I thought it was someone else). The only other time I recall him commentating gymnastics was the 2009 American Cup with Tim and Elfie. In fairness this was a play-by-play role and he's better known for commentating basketball on ESPN or winning Olympic gold in men's volleyball with the US team in 1984; his Wikipedia article doesn't even mention gymnastics commentary.

[@ash3878]

Daiane underscored

[@o_wojtyla_barros]

how was the geades counted?

[@artur3363]

❤❤❤

[@thiagomelo7425]

catalina ponor is one of the luckiest gymnasts, how can she win gold on both floor and beam with such poor technique and tumbling. she must be very thankful to the old cold of points

[@robertmoura4314]

Eu pensei, por anos, que Fei Cheng foi injustiçada, mas não, porque hoje vejo os erros que lhe tiraram a medalha.

[@MarcosGuedes-yp2kv]

Essa série fraca sem dificuldades da Catalina Ponor não ganharia ouro nos dias atuais. Esse código de pontuação de 2004 era uma vergonha

[@robertmoura4314]

@@MarcosGuedes-yp2kv Eu considero essa final foi catastrófica. Daiane dos Santos e Fei Cheng poderiam ser melhores como as demais competidoras.

[@MarcosGuedes-yp2kv]

@@robertmoura4314 mano, o Brasil parou nesse dia pra assistir a Daiane! Me lembro até hoje. Uma pena que ela decepcionou e saiu do tablado, naquela época a execução valia muito mais do que a dificuldade

[@robertmoura4314]

@@MarcosGuedes-yp2kv Também me lembro, tinha meus 16 anos na época. Realmente, foi muita decepção, porque se esperava muito dela, uma vez que era a atual campeã mundial.

[@jordansparks6113]

Romanians clearly payed off the judges. How do routines with way more difficult tumbling passes and better landings lose to Ponor? They’ve been doing it for years. They make obvious errors in the past yet still got 10’s from 3 judges in the 80’s and 90’s also. Interesting to see how little Romanians have won in every single gymnastics apparatus event in the new scoring system in the last 14 or so years. 🤔

[@catalinasimonacihodaru8241]

Hai ale noastre .Hai romania

[@JavasioMcShine]

Mohini was robbed -_-

[@turbojon8117]

LOL all you have to do is watch her feet to see that the Gogean, Popa, and tuck jump double were not fully rotated.

[@jordansparks6113]

Bjardwaj was way better than Ponor. Clearly judging was fishy. Some dodgy scoring for sure. I feel like as long as Ponor didn’t fall or go out of bounds , she was decided winner before this started, and not even her teammate would have won either.

[@turbojon8117]

Not a fan of Ponor's routine, but use your eyes and ears. Bhardwaj had at least three dance elements that were noticeably under rotated, and Shannon Miller flat out stated that missed dance elements and connections can account for a lower start value. Sofronie would have been closer if she had started from 10 and been a tad sharper on her dance elements.

[@amyg4115]

Why was Mohini scored so low?

[@mrparts]

Low start value

[@matthewhines9787]

On her best day on floor, which happened to be qualifications, she only had a 9.9 start value. She was always coming up short on her dance skills, but randomly on qualification day, she made her Gogean leap and the double twisting tuck jump skills. Call it adrenaline or whatever, but that routine just seemed sharper and the dance skills were rotated just an extra 1/4 turn than they were at trials or in this EF. Even she said she thought it was funny that she made finals in floor because she thought it was her weakest going in because the dance skills were usually not steady or balanced.

[@dawnbaswell1853]

Because we weren't as respected back then as we are now. They got low balled back then

[@dawnbaswell1853]

And the romanians were overscored back then

[@ChainChomp2]

Her exercise was only credited with a 9.7 SV. I remember reading a comment on a video of her exercise from the now-removed ciciginastica channel that doing a 2.5 punch front would've been a more reliable way to earn the bonus tenths for a D connection rather than attempting a Popa+double tuck jump, which she rarely completed properly, so in a way her exercise's very construction had doomed it from the start.