2015 Personality Lecture 16: Conscientiousness I - Industriousness & Disgust

University of Toronto PSY230
Course Information: jordanbpeterson.com/Psy230H
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March 10, 2015
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[@Aaronisification]

58:15 - “ not that my daughter has genocidal tendencies...” redacts: “ although she probably does because she’s HUMAN.” Very humbling statement

[@lukejones4104]

O io*0*0ii900i0i0io00 pool

[@roddydykes7053]

Yeah no one laughed at that rebuttal lol

[@user-oy4vu3ck3u]

That's because all humans have capacity for good and evil acts. We all need to remain aware of that. Milgram has a very famous experiment that's shows this

[@jacksonfamilyaccount7768]

23 mins in and I've had x2 epiphanies. Thank you.

[@davidsayers2102]

An academic actually struggling with hard ideas without just spouting the usual sterile answers and solutions.....wow

[@spaticus2718]

David you don't follow academia.

[@HibaAlMasri]

Dr. Peterson, thank you for your channel. It is very helpful, interesting, and thought provoking. Thank you for sharing your knowledge with the public from all walks of life.

[@sherlockholmeslives.1605]

Lol! Are Jordan Peterson's students really clever enough to understand this stuff?!

[@stevesheldon8616]

We are so privileged to have these lectures. The best teachers never stop learning and searching, and this particular lecture shows a master who is excited about something he figured out with a graduate student that very morning! Thank you so much, Dr. Peterson.

[@RJKYEG]

I think he's performing a classical conditioning experiment on himself with Coke Zero.

[@ArjeeBoii]

55:20 onwards IS GOLD

[@HYEOL]

Jordan is anxious about being anxious about being anxious

[@phoenixzappa7366]

Aren't we all?

[@neethy1836]

profound

[@kellyberry4173]

Amen....everyday.

[@Leopar525]

Hahahaha

[@shadows-xn3ed]

He’s changed so much over the years

[@yisraelgollub3230]

Anybody notice the switch from cans to bottles? Side point: each one of his life-changing lectures yields yet another gem of counsel that propels you towards your future successes and towards actualizing your greatest potentiality.

[@johndimorro7068]

wow this man is amazing.

[@phoenixzappa7366]

It's called education

[@picardoi8742]

John Dimorro he is just giving you the executive point forn summary and that is impressive the scope of it... imagine if you took each point and studied it like this man wouldve done... that is how you can become very usefully wise in life

[@Bodyknowledge77]

I'm currently 8:00 minutes in and this HIGHLY resonates with me especially relating to the past week+ or so. Multiple layers of stressors. Present combined with past. This was serendipitously timely. Thanks

[@roman14032]

this isnt serendipitous,think about it, there will never be a time when talk wont be "timely" every single day of your life will have "stressors" that will be relevant

[@kevinstaples7393]

I love you Mr Peterson. 9th grade drop out. I've been listening to these lectures when I go to bed. (For some reason). I wake up to piss and you're talking & im still learning about myself. Keep up the good work. P.s. I never knew something so complex & boring could be so simple & exciting. Ty

[@andrewmckeown6786]

Students clapping after a lecture

[@amirmohsenahanchi134]

Im in awe after watching each of his lectures. Also him chugging the coke at the end is the funniest thing ever :))

[@erglelergle8476]

What a great final 15 minutes!

[@tray1813]

Thank you Dr. Peterson. I have a truly, severely autistic child. I want to understand my child. You are helping me.

[@ylmonkeyU2]

Thank you! 1:09:30 Living in truth and compassion!

[@melk.3485]

1:01:15 how a person's place in a dominance hierarchy can influence neuro-chemistry and increase the likelihood of them being traumatised and experiencing primal/general stress response (and ptsd) 1:06:04 what to do about it...?

[@kellyberry4173]

Thank you Dr. You always help me. Brilliant.

[@ricklee9473]

I'd buy him a case of that stuff , if he would just keep talking . You can tell he really struggles for meaning and tangents of conventional theory to convey ideas , he wants to give us tools as simple as a hammer , but enjoys showing how the hammer was made. Great lecture here!!

[@matlhatsesets2089]

If you travel the world and you get to live within different groups of personality types then his lectures make complete sense. Having lived in Azerbaijan, I understand why the people are so highly conscientious, and why it works so well there. Phenomenal lecture.

[@baseljamal8907]

55:20 The rest is gold...

[@josht5710]

Are these lectures sponsored by Coke?

[@jsnellink1990]

It would be so awesome if at the end of the lecture he would look straight in the camera after taking a sip and say something like " Whoever you are, Whatever you do, think of good ice cold Coca-Cola."

[@XanatharEye]

You WOULD be.

[@KidWithTheHat]

There's another video where he says "I have to drink this instead of coffee. I hate this actually."

[@EnEvighet7]

Coke is PC now, so our Political Incorrect Professor will have to stop drinking it. Juice is still ok. Drink juice.

[@LouStoriale]

Canada is sponsored by Coke.

[@XanatharEye]

It seems so incongruous to see Jordan take a big pull of that commercial soda.

[@Vstrum]

“Take a big pull of that commercial soda” wow look guys, an *intellectual*

[@norevelation]

If you associate with the disgusting, your status falls. . .

[@AnithaS-yj3cq]

Sir you are looking so good! Today

[@daneumurianpiano7822]

Re: status and contamination, think of Jesus and the lepers, and of Philip Yancey's book _Soul Survivor_ which talks about Dr. Paul Brand's work with people who had leprosy.

[@hennyzhi2261]

30:00 It sounds like your talking about part of Aristotles virtues of the mean. Certain vices are comparable due to a deficiency or excess of a virtue that is between both. Courage is between cowardice and rashness. In your case, proper proximity is between openness and contientiousness.

[@andrewwillard5773]

I enjoyed these lectures

[@klareellis]

I scored in the bottom 3 percent for conscientiouness. I am not orderly at all....basically I am a slob but, I am Highly industrious. To me, industriouness equates to being able to "figure" things out as it pertains to survival.

[@DS-vu5yo]

I don’t know if you figured out industriousness yet- but I would predict that MEANING is the key. Industrious people are only motivated to do things that have an extrinsic meaning. Run an arbitrary task that they have a reason to believe has meaning and is non-trivial. Like “hey, we’re looking for ideas to get homeless people into a productive self-sustaining life’s. Can you help us come out with ideas?” That- I’d bet- will generate a difference in output for industrious people vs non-industrious people.

[@Leopar525]

What a BOSS !!!!

[@faddsticks7318]

Denial of Death is by Ernest Becker

[@rustygrill]

I love how at an hour even, he gets to the meat... Betcha he's got a timer...

[@nefwaenre]

Absolute truth in there, Professor! i HATE my job. But im forced to do it. No belief system can stabilize my emotions. My condition is disastrous, i think im in the bottom of the hierarchy. But i can't die cuz i fear death.

[@Queef_Storm]

still alive?

[@amanuelamanuel]

chugging it like a pro

[@Leopar525]

Clapping at the Coke drinking 😂

[@danrich7640]

An hour or so in, I started to feel my ears burning.

[@CarterColeisInfamous]

1:00:23 is this counter like the corum sensing in bioluminescent bacteria when concentrations of some protein are high enough

[@outsidethesquares]

The conundrum of compassion?

[@monjier]

I wonder if industriousness might relate to confidence and maybe your track record of wins you've had in the past. Example, if a lobster starts winning, they might become more industrious. Whenever I take a massive L, my industriousness lowers. Whenever I gain achievements or perceived achievements, my industriousness goes through the roof to the point where I can sustain 100 hr work weeks, but when I'm stressed or when I take a loss in some area, I can barely maintain a productive 20 hr work week. I know this because I get paid salary regardless of productive hours worked.

[@Ant3_14]

I have idea about extremes and how they might fuel authoritarianism. Being super sensitive in one value means that perceived danger of someone breaking it is much higher. That leads to feeling obligated to defend values and it's importance is so high that freedom can be sacrificed for greater good. When Russia invaded Ukraine (again) despite that I live 100's of kilometers from that I wanted to do something and was mentally ready for sacrifice of my resources. Wanted to start learning hacking and help anonymous a bit. Feeling danger can unlock strong drive and can make authoritarianism look like preferable option in some circumstances.

[@jasp9661]

Bro absolutely destroyed that bottle of soda at the end

[@Catraverick]

It seems to me that if you are high in trait conscientiousness the wall surrounding paradise is the thickness of a pool cue.

[@RukaSubCh]

24.01 Can disgust disrupt hierarchies?

[@daneumurianpiano7822]

What does the Grand Design (Hawking) of evolution say about the Grand Designer?

[@47RokuW]

It’s like sending a Volcano eruption going down upon eruption👍🏾😭

[@ElDrom_Belle]

1.03.53 had me laughing. That's a scary but funny thought

[@CarterColeisInfamous]

55:00 did you run those experiments?

[@ep1phany62]

I wonder where Che Guevara ranks on the trait system? I always thought he had quite a contradictory character.

[@jayjaychadoy9226]

Peace making Canadian

[@the.warmistress]

Is the distribution of high status and low status people in the social hierarchy pretty well stable across time and cultures? is it always a pyramid-like shape? what purpose do the people at the bottom serve to the people at the top and vice versa?

[@phoenixzappa7366]

Aliens did it

[@picardoi8742]

Tanya Gates if its true for animals, its true for humans

[@ricklee9473]

Top not only eat first, they pick what they want to eat , and someone else prepares it, and serves it to them . Lower level will always exist, and get larger.

[@jawg22]

At 1:00:00 he says that the "lobster hierarchy counter" is about as ancient as the reticular activation system, but isn't the RAS exclusive to vertebrates?

[@ryrez4478]

MusicTheoryAdvanced can both be around same age and be two different species

[@scottj5585]

I think industrious people didn't change the scale because there was no fulfilment in the experiment hence not as much motivation did you offer to pay them ?

[@caroline-holm]

I have a couple of questions. If the root of orderliness is disgust, could the root of industriousness not be willpower? And secondly (unrelated), they seem almost opposite but as the personality traits are mutually exclusive, what would a person high in openness and also high in conscientiousness be like?

[@mpcc2022]

What is will power?

[@reesaspieces86]

I scored almost equally high in openness and conscientiousness (and their respective facets). For example, I am open to experience: I love to travel all over the world and have spent years living abroad. But I’m also high in orderliness: you’d better believe that I will have my tickets and hotel booked months in advance with a detailed itinerary. On the political compass test (since openness correlates with liberalism and conscientiousness correlates with conservatism) I fall in the libertarian right quadrant. Meaning: anti-authoritarian, socially liberal, and fiscally conservative.

[@reesaspieces86]

Also (I’m at the end of the video now) I also scored fairly high on agreeableness. So I’m guessing that my compassion mediates my disgust response.

[@o_-_o]

As I am watching the trends like SJW it seems there is not a big difference among left or right authoritarianism. The left also try to force some kind of "tradition" with the difference that it is not rooted in the past (more like in a ever malleable narrative) but just as good tool for "instrumental ruling" to get a hop on top of the dominance hierarchy.

[@o_-_o]

After I have seen "Lecture 20 Conscientiousness - Industriousness, Orderliness & Disgust" I must realize this problem has much deeper dimensions and my original post is quite shallow.

[@murraymcgregor7829]

@@o_-_o Well to admit being wrong is most noble and encourages further cooperative communication. I am having a similar problem. I feel like I should watch all his lectures first until I start communicating what I think is a good interpretation of the cognitive framework and tools he is providing us with.

[@tytygreenrich9407]

Why is it that whenever I try to watch it Jordan Peterson video I get four commercials within the first two minutes, but when I watch anything else, I can go a good two minutes without seeing a single commercial sometimes even three. That’s a 2:1 ratio roughly… weird

[@johnbockmann]

50:00 Relevant to Covid-19 and authoritarian regulations: correlation between prevalence of infectious diseases and authoritarian attitudes is 0.7!

[@johnbockmann]

@@-.-Rob-.-XY Well, the left made the authoritarian regulations, ostensibly due to a highly prevalent infectious disease. What do you mean?

[@johnbockmann]

@@-.-Rob-.-XY no, I don't think he did. What's the time stamp for that quote?

[@CarterColeisInfamous]

47:00 What about Hitlers methamphetamine use?

[@picardoi8742]

Carter Cole those were new drugs then, everyone did some meth or coke...later lsd.

[@The_Legend_0-0-7]

I bet everyone gets so deep into it they forget to like

[@JasmineDaisy111]

1:08:40

[@meriemcullen8510]

20:50

[@beegpink-johnson6344]

34:00

[@artemis12061966]

Instead of good and evil, how about , life affirming and non life affirming....?

[@bertvsrob]

hmm, im low and moderately low in all the political related traits mentioned around 35:34.. what does that make me >

[@cbalan777]

Perhaps you are closer to the center? Are you more artistic? Or more focused on hard work?

[@mariuskuyler7763]

Does anyone know what word he says at exactly 17:33? "That would be a ???? idea" ??

[@cbalan777]

Piagetian. He's referring to the psychologist Jean Piaget.

[@mariuskuyler7763]

@@cbalan777 Thank you kind sir. You are a gentleman, and a scholar.

[@cbalan777]

@@mariuskuyler7763 You're welcome.

[@RahellOmer]

I was wondering what caused Jordan to correlate disgust with Islam.

[@reesaspieces86]

Because Islamists *murder* people based on their disgust with them? Stoning women, throwing homosexuals off of buildings, blowing up people and symbols of both Western capitalism and democracy, etc.

[@cicakmirko901]

He drink huge amount of soda back in the day

[@joshschandoney5045]

wishing i had an image for this hierarchy from good person to motor skills. I am guessing its sort of like Maslow's hierarchy but it cant be exactly that right? am not enrolled in the class, just an autodidact that is very interested in this material. I ordered the book maps of meaning(i know different course) also tried searching google images i just cant find it and its bugging me just a little. can anyone direct me to a resource for this image. Is there an official name for the pyramid? Is its prof. Peterson's work? If not a citation could be very helpful too.

[@tiberl1163]

Hello. You can find the lecture with the map in one of his recent lecture from 2017 or 2018,and you can take a screenshot of it.

[@BritneyGrills]

At any point are we going to finish watching crumb? I could just watch it now but it wouldnt be the same without Peterson pointing various things out during the film.

[@CarterColeisInfamous]

30:16 horseshoe theory

[@ZombieCorp999]

I am curious of culture when people start blowing up.

[@TheJojoaruba52]

The problem with Christianity is that you are asked to be fluid in the dominance hierarchies. The dominance hierarchies ruin churches.

[@angelo-001]

Careless Prostitution, unlike Careful Prostitution

[@gemmaluisa1974]

I'm pretty confused I'm very open sexually, I worked as an escort for a couple of years,I'm very low on conscientiousness very disorganised,not terribly hygienic I'm pretty understanding of people's weaknesses and flaws,I've dated bisexual guys although I'm a straight female ,I studied fashion and am very creative,but I love tradition and am pretty patriotic and am anti immigration,support the military and have been accused of being right wing but then I live in East London which is centre of leftist liberal mentality ,I am definitely an odd one out in this area and it frustrates me living in such an extremist lefty area where there is high anti government sentiment and the words fascist and anarchy are pretty common, spoken by middle class university educated arty types feel like I have a dirty secret that I don't think like them. I get confused what I am since I've moved here I always thought I was a liberal but I'm definitely not

[@johndimorro7068]

how does that fit into your personality type? do you know your personality type? excellent and open comment, thank you for your input :)

[@aCynicalPie]

I don't think the personality theory should be taken as an absolute rule. It's more like a loose categorization that tends to hold true over a large number of scenarios. Also, here's another idea: that right now in the world of 2015/2016 one of the major reasons to be anti-immigration is due to fear of terrorism, rather than disgust/contamination. Fear and anxiety would scale with neuroticism, not conscientiousness. People who are very agreeable would also tend to be pro-immigration since they value inclusiveness above all else. My point being: maybe you have high neuroticism and/or low agreeableness and that's where your values are coming from here.

[@phoenixzappa7366]

That's wife material right there

[@TheSodiumazide]

missluisagemma in another lecture he mentions that intelligence and openness mediates the disgust response. as you get smarter your sensitivity to disgust goes down. So it's not that you are less conscientious or less disgust sensitive it's just that your intelligence mediates that and reduces its impact. It seems that this system means that if you can explain something you are it less disgusted by it

[@gemmaluisa1974]

Scotty Nguyen's 80s Mullet haha yes that sounded pretty awful ☺

[@vojtechnology]

The God himself, our Lord and saviour.

[@hrvad]

Jordan, how about you investigate industriousness with an experiment that measures abstracted HUNGER. Imagine you REALLY want some thing, like you're really hungry for it, like huuuuunnngry for it. Wouldn't that motivate a person so strongly that they defy their pain, the discomfort of going out of their comfort zone and do today what others won't do, so that tomorrow they CAN do and enjoy what others can't? Just a thought.

[@nickjames205]

Sleep food Dylan Peterson

[@merryarttoonesakamarysusan559]

Drinking poison..maybe thats why he is so hyper...

[@AnithaS-yj3cq]

Sir hitler waz a pure vegeterian

[@juansenaranjo]

Was Jordan charging for product placement back then already? He sure seems to be posing for the camera, and the theatrics of “ahhh !” Are come what peculiar.

[@Queenb-qq5le]

U walk by faith & not by sight now! All that rubbish don't mean a Hill of beans in the Kingdom of God!!

[@brisk22]

I miss this Jordan peterson. Such a real person in this video. You're too angry and oriented too far right now. Seems like you're detached from who you were. Looking down on everyone now from this high place your fame has brought you. No longer the genuine person many grew to admire.

[@picktwo6069]

meh. being against people thinking it's a good idea to chop their cocks off isn't too crazy.