26 - H&N vs JSB: The Ultimate Airgun Pellet Face-off

[@paultowns9880]

Another great video. i find the Barracuda 8 accurate in most of my rifles . JSB pellets always seem to give good results over the chronograph.

[@southernexposure123]

Thank you for the video. I started stressing over accuracy and solved my major problem. I was still not happy with my groups today, but now I'm not as unhappy after you measured your results. I'm confident I can do a few things to decrease my group size. Thanks again.

[@hftshooter]

Excellent! 😀👍

[@jasonfreeman2555]

A great in-depth video pal.The last time I bought JSB Exacts they were terrible.So I purchased some AADF and Barracuda 8's and I must say I find them brilliant and very much like for like for grouping.Last night at the range I was getting groupings from a 14 shot magazine within a 5p at both 25 &30yrds.Not bad for a newbie to shooting lol.I can understand the popularity with the 8's especially with the price of them.I'll certainly be getting some more.

[@fxpeter22]

Jeff, I need to buy you a coffee. The amount of effort and detail you put into these videos is exceptional. I may not always be in alignment with some of your methods, but I could never criticise your enthusiasm which is commendable and adds greatly to this hobby. I also recently tested the Barracuda 8’s and found that they felt tighter in the barrel which I think contributes to the slower speed. I measured the head sizes which were very consistent at 4.51 (as stated). Like you I agree that the material used is possible a slightly harder alloy. The head size of the JSB Exacts was also measured and was below the stated size (4.52) and variable from 4.44 to 4.48, disappointing to say the least. Keep up the good work. 🙂

[@hftshooter]

Thanks Peter, that's really very generous of you and much appreciated. 😀👍

[@CrackshotTom]

Probably 99% of the national UK benchrest shooters are using barracuda ft's. They're brilliant!

[@jameshoward9700]

Good job! I've found the BFTs a very consistent pellet through my Weihrauch (97, 98, 100) and FX (Crown) barrels. The 98 and 97 still shoot JSBs better, but the 100 and FX prefer the BFT. The BFT is just a more consistent pellet (as your solid weighing protocol shows). Oh, and the B8s aren't as consistent as the BFTs because they're cheaper. The extra QC inspection that BFTs go through is very expensive! That said, the Daystate shot B8s well. The only pellet I've found that edges the BTF in blustery, outdoor conditions is the QYS Streamlined Heavy, which is almost identical, but very slightly more consistent. But good work fella and proof that consistency testing is the key, not "absolute accuracy in 4 out of 5 and let's forget about the 5th!"

[@hftshooter]

Thanks for sharing. 🙂👍

[@johnrichardson4583]

A lot of work for you, greatly apprecated.

[@hftshooter]

Thanks John. 🙂👍

[@BionicRusty]

Nice video, buddy. Very interesting. I was lucky enough to grab a tin of the 8’s out of the first batch release and they shot really well in my HW100. So I bought a sleeve that were a new batch and they don’t group well at all. A real shame. I’m continually pellet testing, including barrel cleaning and 20 pellet ‘seasoning’ of each pellet but always come back to the QYS Domed. I’m over 20,000 shots in with them, now. As for Exacts, I’ve bought 4 tins at separate times over the past 12 months and every tin was below par. The most noticeable thing was the finish of the skirt but also, the weight. They were pretty light. I’ve read time and time again that QYS lose stability past 30 yards but with my experience of bench testing with them (outdoor range but no wind) disproves that to myself. 40mm, 5 shot groups at 65 yards is good enough for me in sub12. Keep up the great work, my friend, and please, do no more than chuckle at the moronic comments. I honestly wouldn’t give them the satisfaction of response. Hopefully I’ll get to meet you on the circuit, one day. It’ll be a pleasure. 🤝

[@hftshooter]

Thanks. As I mentioned in the vid I've heard lots of bad reports and seen some shocking photos of poor contents in JSB tins. I guess I must just have been lucky with the ones that I've bought. I tried the QYS streamlined heavies a while back and they didn't seem to work for me.

[@malcolmbunny]

I have been using the Barracuda FT's through my S400 for 2 years now. Very small groups.

[@ctom4103]

Very well done video thanks very much. Detailed description also. I think you were just as lucky getting a blustery day to test as you would have been if it was still etc as it shows they were all similar in the wind. Those FTs are a very good pellet indeed. I find there is a difference in performance between 4.50 and 4.51 in different rifles also so you haven’t finished testing yet! I also found the JSB in all my rifles produced more velocity than any other makes in the same weight. Another thing I found was the JSB seems to prefer a very fouled barrel-at least 50 shots of the same pellet but in my experience the H&N preferred clean and groups get larger as the lead builds. More testing 😂😂 Keep up the good work- very enjoyable/interesting viewing.

[@hftshooter]

Thanks for the feedback. 😀👍

[@jameshoward9700]

Yes! And perhaps explains the slightly looser first group with B8s in each gun.

[@dm1126]

Thanks for all that effort much appreciated I am more than jealous here in NZ we are lucky to get a decent selection and some stores only have a few brands or just pellets they sell to use in the rifles they sell Cheers Mate

[@hftshooter]

Thanks mate. Bummer about the pellets, but on the plus side you do have some epic country to shoot in. 😀👍

[@tripplebeards3427]

They changed the actual design of the JSB’s few years back. My groups opened up with the new style. If you turn them over, you can see the difference inside the rear hollowpoint cavity. I believe the company was bought out and they change the molds about a half a decade ago.

[@hftshooter]

Yes I've noticed that the newer ones are shallower. I'll have to do a test sometime to see if it makes any difference. 👍

[@johnhouston6142]

Great video Jeff, I enjoyed that.. 👍🤘👌

[@hftshooter]

Thanks 👍

[@jake-nr9tq]

I did a "pellet shootout" last Christmas morning with my .22 Benjamin Marauder (unregulated). I compared FX 16 grains to H&N 15.8 grains to AA 16 grains; plus JSB's 15.89. It was a tie between the FX's and JSB's. The AA's 16 grains and H&N's 15.89 size shot terrible. Quarter size groups compared to dime size groups at 60 yards.

[@Steve_7867]

Tried all sorts in my 98 and S400 and both just about prefer H&N FTT 4.52 over JSB 7.9 and 8.4, o nly just though. Still a lot of other pellets I haven't tried but experience tells me I won't get any better pellet performance.

[@hftshooter]

Thanks for all the comments. 🙂👍

[@Bengaltaz]

Wow that’s crazy how you dump and handle them like that I try to not rattle them in the tin they get touched once when I load my magazines and that’s it

[@hftshooter]

I didn't think I was that harsh with my pellet handling. I think they're a bit more resilient than you give them credit for, but whatever works for you is great. 🙂👍

[@andythemad01]

Another great video. What head size do you shoot on the JSBs in the HW97?

[@hftshooter]

Thanks Andy. I shoot mainly 4.52 but it's not head size fussy and have shot 4.50 without issue. I just buy what's available at the cheapest price.

[@roddavis2876]

I found, in conjunction with others, the sweet speed fo H&N Baracuda FT's is 730fps, in both my huma regulated BSA R10 Mk 2 and my HFT500, might be worth turning power up very slightly to get 730fps.

[@hftshooter]

I must admit that having shot a rifle with a power adjuster I know that small power changes can have a dramatic effect on accuracy. 🙂👍

[@patrickpirelli7897]

It's because the lead is harder yep my HW95 won't shoot them H+Ns but loves the JSB

[@ThinkingMan482]

You get roughly the same amount of lead in each tin. That's why the heavier pellets have fewer in the tin.

[@hftshooter]

Hadn't considered that, but other brands still have 500 heavy pellets in a tin?

[@philipbooth9755]

H and N use a harder alloy and thicker skirts, which equates to much less deformation, but slower down the barrel.

[@hftshooter]

Thanks Philip, that must explain the lower chrono readings.

[@calchedz]

My barracuda 18s were faster on the chrono than jsb 16grains in my .22 pcp

[@Steve-Cross]

H&N are harder than JSB. Less chance of deformed skirts with H&N pellets. I use Barracuda 8 pellets in my HW110 in .177. I find them more accurate and consistent than JSB Exact. Although it also likes the JSB heavies. My HW 97 in .22 loves JSB Hades. My Daystate Wolverine prefers Rangemaster Sovereigns, and QYS streamline, 8.48gr. To be fair, they are the only two pellets I have tried, but to be honest, I don’t think I could improve on the accuracy, with any other pellet.

[@hftshooter]

Hi Steve, thanks for your comment. I've heard it suggested before that the rangemaster sovereigns are good in the wolverine, I'll have to give them a try.

[@markhomer5704]

H&N have taken over from JSB, the quality of JSB has gone down the pan over the last few years, use mostly Baracuda 8s / Baracuda FT / Baracuda Lights or one of several QYS pellets.. Both brands are superior now ( sales figures from my local RFDs substantiate this) BTW, if you wanna save yer self a few bob, buy the "lights" as opposed too the FT's, a quid cheaper per tin ( in some cases more cheaper) they are exactly the same.. Some say the only difference is the FT's are hand sorted, hence being a bit more expensive, I don't buy into all that.. Checked all my tins ( of both) no difference as far as damaged skirts ect.. Couldn't find any in either.. It was and excellent vid BTW.. Very interesting..

[@biker5719]

At what Joules you shot all these pellets? At what Joules your air rifle shoot the pellets?

[@hftshooter]

If you convert the Ft.lb figures I show in the video to Joules you get: JSB Exact - 14.93J, H&N 8 - 14.45J, H&N FT - 14.94J

[@biker5719]

​@@hftshooter I was asking how much Joules of energy is transferred to the pellet when fired from your gun. That value will not change right? If that is constant whatever pellet is used we can calculate the velocity using the Kinetic energy equation and multiply that velocity by mass of the pellet to get momentum.

[@jeffmccall8013]

@@biker5719 I gave you the information you asked for. The energy dissipated to the pellet (Joules or Foot Pounds) will change dependent upon the weight of the pellet and the muzzle velocity. It is unlikely that either of these will be constant in an air rifle. I used a chronograph to measure muzzle velocity and used the manufacturers stated pellet weight to calculate the energy in Foot Pounds, as shown in the spreadsheets on the video. To respond to your question I simply converted the average Foot Pound figures to Joules. The information I provided is correct.

[@biker5719]

@@jeffmccall8013 See a pellet cannot gain more energy than the energy provided by the gun right? If so the energy dissipated into the pellet becomes the kinetic energy of the pellet. A heavier object and a lighter object can have same kinetic energy eventhough their velocity are different. A 4 Kilogram object moving at 1 metre per second and 1 Kg object moving at 4 metre per second has same kinetic energy of 2 Joules eventhough they have different velocity. If so energy provided by the gun is constant and different pellet depending on mass attain different velocity but all have same kinetic energy and different momenta.

[@ponytrap12]

what head size are the FT's? 4.50 or 4.51? ..you can't get the 4.51's for love nor money atm

[@hftshooter]

Mine are 4.50, but very tight in the breach.

[@ThinkingMan482]

JSB weighs each tin to be sure there are more than 500 pellets in each tin. It's likely that the average weight is under 8.44 gr each. When I've weighed them there tend to be more that are under weight than over weight.

[@hftshooter]

I guess it depends upon how they mix up the pellets from the bins before packaging them. I will be doing a JSB pellet video soon, so will have to check that one out. 🙂👍

[@neiledwards8931]

H&N thumbs up 👍

[@hftshooter]

Yes, those Bara' FTs are a surprise.

[@keith6930]

After the hype, I expected a better grouping with the Baracuda 8, a bit like yours, hit or miss with groupings when compared to other pellets? I did try a 8.44gr pellet test but shot so bad wil need to do again

[@ThinkingMan482]

The higher chrono speed of the JSB 8.44 seems to confirm they are lighter.

[@hftshooter]

👍

[@PLAYU72]

I think that in HN factory, the quality control is made whith hw barrels... well, really dont think that, really I know. HN FTT in 451 work faultless in the mayority weihrauch barrels.

[@hftshooter]

I've seen a video tour of the H&N factory. They do test with a selection of different rifles but it wasn't clear in the video which models they were.

[@michealmckeown8681]

QYS simple save loads of time mucking around

[@hftshooter]

I've never got any qys pellets to work in any of my rifles and I've tried a few.

[@hr4669]

Bracuda 8 is the same like RWS Superdome. Superdome is ribbed.

[@hftshooter]

Those pellets are both made by different manufacturers so will be subtly different.

[@hr4669]

@@hftshooter Realy subtly différent...

[@roddavis2876]

The high shot was your 3rd not 4th

[@hftshooter]

Ok, thanks.

[@davemartin2068]

Your audio is very hollow. You need to wear a microphone. Dave

[@hftshooter]

Thanks Dave. Do you know how expensive those lapel mics are?

[@donpeer4477]

Everyone knows that pellet guns are picky about ammo (some more than others). What you've done here is comparing apple with oranges with pears. Frankly, I expected more from a professional level shooter. You should have put all the pellets through one rifle, then switched guns and repeated the test, then again, for the third rifle. So, I guess I'll have to wait until the comparison is redone. :(

[@hftshooter]

Hi Don, thanks for your comment. Firstly, let me say I'm in no way a professional level shooter. I've only been shooting air rifles a little over 2 years. I guess I regard myself as just completing my beginner phase. Secondly, if you check back at around 27:42 you'll hear me explain that I was doing exactly as you suggested. I shot all the pellets through one rifle at a time, shooting the HW97 first, then the S400 and finally the Wolverine. Apologies if I didn't make that clear enough.

[@donpeer4477]

@@hftshooter I did hear that in the video. Then the rain came and the next thing I know is you're shooting another rifle. I didn't see where you'd finished with one and switched rifles. I guess you had to cut that part to keep the video length down?

[@hftshooter]

Exactly that Don, I set my phone to record, start shooting and jabbering away and get lost in the moment. When I came to edit I didn't think anyone would want to spend an hour watching me shoot, so I just kept the 97 in and added a quick bit of the other two.

[@BionicRusty]

@@donpeer4477They say that ‘there’s always one’, and sure enough, here you are. This chap has never professed to being of professional level. In fact he has been sure to make clear that he is still learning himself, as are we all. What he HAS done is offer some really good advice that, if you think it could be built on, then feel free and crack on. It would be great if you could take the time to film, learn to edit and load it onto your channel so that we can all benefit. This way, your time would be better spent, rather than slating someone who obviously wants to help. Try and find any other channel that is primarily dedicated to HFT shooting that offers as good advice as this chap. He should be thanked and encouraged, not shot down with childish, whataboutery comments.

[@donpeer4477]

And there you are,@@BionicRusty. Stirring up the shite. If you'd read my discussion with @hftshooter you'd have seen that I simply had a question about the add flow of things and he answered, which Thumbed Up.

[@robnelson840]

Accupell FT great alternative to JSB better price and pre-lubed with Napier pellet lube. If you shop round they are a better price than JSB. Why do they put foam insert in top but not the bottom, they will only bang on the bottom of the tin in transport??

[@hftshooter]

I haven't heard about those before, must give them a try. Thanks. 👍

[@robnelson840]

@@hftshooter under Webley accupell FT looking at the tin I think they may be made by H&N 4.52 cal 8.64grain ready lubed, I only plink but JSB's were getting a bit dear so swapped to H&N FTT Remington express compact break barrel loves them but SMK XS38 didn't so started looking for a pellet both would shoot with some accuracy and they work well through both guns as well as RWS superdomes, can't understand it as both H&N FTT and Accupell FT are same weight and use 4.52 head size??

[@jizzmonkey9679]

​@robnelson840 they are H&N FTT's, shoot well in my hw80 and TX200's and shite in my rm8,

[@robnelson840]

@@jizzmonkey9679 I’m getting a little better accuracy out of them and a few more feet per second as well