[4K] Train Stalling with Wheel Slips and Sand

[@Henry5623]

Doubtful this will ever reach the attention of any engineers who don’t already know this. But a trick I’ve used especially on transfer runs where I’ve had huge cuts to move and limited HP to move them with is simply to reverse back into the consist to intentionally run the slack in. Then roll forward around 5 MPH but maintaining notch 2 or 3 depending on the circumstances. What this allows you to do is get a percentage of the consist moving before the slack runs out which consequently allows you to use that momentum plus your units HP to help ‘jump start’ the rest of your train into motion. As long as you utilize common sense with the throttle and speed you won’t exert a shock load high enough to cause issues unless you already had a weak knuckle in consist and it’s a hell of a lot better to find it on a class track than out on the main anyway. -Over two decades working for UP.

[@iceclimberGD]

I didn't know that! Thanks for the info!

[@old56timer]

Have done that quite a few times. We called it taking slack. Depends on the situation your in sometimes we would cut power off and sand the hill.

[@sth475]

Would have to be very careful. The yards I mainly shunt in are on a 1% grade so can’t take slack.

[@hifijohn]

I just assumed they all did that.

[@Colonel_Blimp]

@@sth475 take a minimum reduction and shove back into the train to take slack.

[@BBCKT]

I found myself actually rooting for the locomotives. "You can do it!"

[@-.._.-_...-_.._-..__..._.-.-.-]

"I think I can. I think I can. I think I can. Choo choo!"

[@christophermichaelfuller5448]

@@-.._.-_...-_.._-..__..._.-.-.- You took my answer! lol

[@WangleLine]

same here lol

[@TheConjurersTower]

@@-.._.-_...-_.._-..__..._.-.-.- Maaaannn, that's takes me way back...

[@arcyone9394]

Me to was intense ooo jus a little more come on you got thes

[@BluesyBor]

I really like how the loco is bouncing up and down under such high stress. Around 180 tons of live machine moving like this gives an idea about the extreme forces involved.

[@rearspeaker6364]

that unit was doing the congo line!!!! they have been ballasted to 216 tons when converted to AC.

[@oooltra]

I don't care for it

[@TurboVisBits]

whats really amazing is the amount of traction steel on steel has and can move around that much.

[@velesoid]

@@oooltra nobody asked lol

[@jordanalexander615]

​@TurboVisBits yeah with enough weight the traction insane. Same thing for vehicles to under regular conditions. That's why big wide tires are so sketchy in rain. Get a narrow tire for more weight on the area touching down. For mud it's a bit different of course.

[@keenanmcbreen7073]

Listening to a locomotive wind up is just about the coolest shit in existence, even small locos, literally power incarnate.

[@iceclimberGD]

My thoughts exactly.

[@ostlandr]

Average person listening to a diesel at notch 8: WOW! Railfan listening to a SD45 at notch 8: (( needs cigarette and shower afterwards ))

[@LittleJinsoyun]

i must agree with this

[@garty2]

That, and jet powered aircraft

[@lsowner10]

You should hear gar turbine spool up on a frigate!

[@josephgrof4873]

What some people aren’t realizing is that 1804 is the only unit online. That unit pulled that whole train out of a stall on its own. Those locomotives get a lot of hate, but they’re tough. Out on NS’s Buchanan Branch, coal trains usually hit the top of the hill at 8-11mph. Every time I’ve seen an ACC on the hill, they crest at 14-18.

[@iceclimberGD]

Awesome! They're one of my favorite locomotives.

[@guyintheshado]

9975 and 9811 weren’t powered on?

[@msnpassjan2004]

Just wondering, how do know the other two units were not on and why were they not on ?

[@quarans08]

@@markgloverville probably the engine sound

[@iceclimberGD]

@@msnpassjan2004 They make a really distinctive sound when they're working hard. People were saying they're offline because moving from a stop like this would fry their traction motors. Could also be NS trying to save power.

[@tutekohe1361]

I once took the Train from Macchu Picchu in Peru. It is steep uphill nearly all the way and the track and train were very poorly maintained. It took maybe 40 minutes to release the brakes from standstill, so the Engineer rode the throttle at the stops to stop the train running back downhill. It was quite a feat for the passengers to embark and disembark with the train surging back and forth at the platforms! The train consistently used to run up to 6 hours late - every day.

[@iceclimberGD]

Holy cow that sounds intense

[@jaysonthetrainmasterprofil221]

Probably two locomotives at the back stalled out

[@old56timer]

This is when you find out how good the knuckles are in the head 15 or 20 cars are. If there are any weak ones, you'll find it. LOL.

[@tracypanavia4634]

Explain please, I'm really interested🙂

[@old56timer]

@@tracypanavia4634 On trains that have stopped on a decent grade say 0.80 percent and you are pretty much at max tonnage without helpers or distributed power (head end power only) It might to take all the power you have to get the train moving. I'm talking about say a coal train with three motors on the head end and 125 cars, that's almost 18.000 tons. The drawbar and knuckle stress are at its greatest. The further you get from the motors, the less trailing tons there is behind each car. I hope this makes some kind of sense to you. I'm not the best at trying to explain my thoughts. LOL.

[@tracypanavia4634]

@@old56timer ah yes! That makes a lot of sense, thank you. Never thought about the different loads before.

[@falcondragonslayer]

@@VD-zn1ed that’s why they are designed to move 6 inches before exerting force on the car. Without this mechanic, the solid iron couplings would shatter from the thousands of tons of weight

[@falcondragonslayer]

@@g0tsp33d yes they will. The couplings aren’t designed to have up to 12,000 tons or more. They would break easily

[@egeg-nr4qs]

What I find more interesting than the sand and the wheel spin is the suspension loading as the traction motors attempt to heave the train forward, and then fail. Watch as the connecting rods next to each axle force the truck frame to pitch up and down. Amazing shots! The HTC-R trucks shown here don't have the axles pushing directly on the cast shape of the trucks frame like older locomotives. Instead they each have a connecting rod below the frame that transfers those forces. The center axle's connecting rod is connected directly to the truck frame making it rigid. But the front & rear axles connecting rods are instead are attached to a pinned cross bar that allows the axle to steer with the radius of a curve. The front & rear crossbars are connected together inside the truck to ensure the 3 axle truck only steers in a radial pattern (If front axle steers left, the rear axle steers right). Also notice the HTC-R's secondary suspension which consists of the rubber bellows looking springs that connect the truck to the frame. All the weight rests on these rubber pads, and they twist/deflect considerably as the locomotive negotiates tight curves.

[@iceclimberGD]

Oh, cool! I hadn't noticed that!

[@matthewwilson5019]

@@iceclimberGD yea it was interesting to see the whole front move down each rock of the train

[@williesweetjr8713]

That was amazing to watch!

[@kenh9508]

The traction control on a modern AC locomotive is truly amazing.

[@brandon-fl]

"horn warning" is brilliant! Thanks.

[@mro4440]

My wife appreciates the warning.....

[@christopherdibble5872]

Still get a tear in my eye when I hear an old train in the night!

[@luann7517]

Great video! I am somewhat new to railfanning, and this is the first time I saw or even knew about engines having the ability to blow sand like that. Thanks for the education!

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks! Glad I could show you something new!

[@kishascape]

I’ve seen steamers do it but never saw it from a diesel electric before.

[@oaktadopbok665]

That's what one or more of the domes on old steam engines are for - storing sand for traction.

[@cdavid8139]

On snowy or icy days when we were the first job on duty to switch a yard we used to run engine light on the leads and drop sand without moving tonnage. Sort of 'pre-sanding'. I've also been in situations where the sanders are out on a locomotive and we would literally take bags of sand and spread it manually (short line railroading with older power)

[@raylrodr]

There's much to learn, Grasshopper.

[@kensherwood4866]

Beautifully captured, the measure of the pulling power in some way illustrated by how the loco lifts up on its bogies a measure too of the amount of traction on the rails and the wheel slip controls that it doesn't just spin the wheels all the time, impressive

[@cliffleigh7450]

A good demonstration of the AC traction at work. Very finely controlled wheelslip and trying to rock the train forward. The lead loco would be doing most of the work getting the train rolling while the other two tried to avoid cooking their DC traction motors.

[@kleetus92]

As an electrical engineer who does variable speed AC motor speed control, you have no idea the amount of math going on behind the scenes, in real time, by the traction inverters to make that motor spin with that level of torque and to tolerate the reverse rotation with forward rotation applied... I damn near crushed my mouse watching those wheels work!

[@kishascape]

@@kleetus92 no he does. Stop trying to show off.

[@kleetus92]

@@kishascape Lol... ok calm down keyboard warrior.

[@krakenwoodfloorservicemcma5975]

Nobody cares if you are an engineer. Go fix the space shuttle O-Rings that you clowns messed up.

[@philipnasadowski1060]

Modern AC inverters are insane. Even at low power levels. Servo drives are even crazier…

[@ZeroFoxtrotx]

Insane what these trains can do! I unload railcars with vehicles in them so I'm around them all the time. Super impressive what they can do.

[@MrEazyE357]

I don't know much about trains. However, there's a set of tracks near my house that I have to cross over pretty frequently and I can tell you one thing: They keep getting longer and longer as the years go by.

[@AethernaLuxen]

For my case, they get less frequent

[@mattt198654321]

If only the same could be said for me...

[@rmx4087]

And the rail cars themselves are longer as well.

[@ekulio]

@@AethernaLuxen rail companies are moving to less frequent longer trains and single-tracking a lot of lines. The rail companies have no incentives to improve infrastructure. IMO the government needs to buy out the right-of-ways and give rail the same love they give the interstate highways, but that sort of thing has no political momentum behind it because the average voter doesn't ever see the impact of our bad rail infrastructure the same way they would see if the highway was falling apart. Continuing the metaphor, imagine if the trucking companies had monopolies on all the highways...yikes.

[@AethernaLuxen]

@@ekulio No I mean, last year a train can be heard near my house twice a day. But now it almost never appears anymore

[@TowMater603]

It still amazes me that these things can even move with steel to steel contact and i cannot believe these things don't rollover while moving at speed. I am a truck driver and it takes almost nothing to roll a truck. crazy how things work. Like how a plane can fly but a human cannot. just amazing.

[@iceclimberGD]

Yeah, it really is a marvel of engineering.

[@Fekuchand_]

coefficient of friction of track's material and, railway engine's locomotive wheels is different. Same is the case with truck's tyre and the road. Truck driver use chain on there truck's wheels to increase friction in other words to increase coefficient of friction. On Icy road, muddy road, or road on which oil is spilt etc friction between vehicle's wheels and road is minimum, we need a balance between friction between road and wheel to maintain traction. Here loco pilot sprays sand to gain traction.

[@vainglory991]

Tanker truck driver here, I'm really curious about the surge from fluid containers

[@boathead22000]

@@vainglory991 Baffles

[@timc333]

The planes in Spain fall mainly in the rain .

[@rickbullock4331]

The amount of weight these engines can move is pretty amazing. A slight up grade full stop to start looks like an art in itself.👍👍

[@HBCertified]

thanks for showing sanding in action...just joined the rail industry so learning alot

[@deborahchesser7375]

Every time I look at the bogies on a train it reminds me of my Dad, 37 years at Timken Roller Bearing RR division, way to go Dad 👍🇺🇸

[@oaktadopbok665]

Yeah I remember the good old days of bronze bearing and oil pans. I've seen "hotboxes" burn down wooden boxcars in my day. I've seen them red-hot at night from a hundred yards away, streaming smoke along the rails for miles. Used to be you could alert the guys in the caboose by holding your nose and pointing at their train . Bye bye caboose you have been replace by trackside sensors.

[@deborahchesser7375]

@@oaktadopbok665 you been around trains for quite some time my friend here’s nothing like them.

[@jesse00pno]

YOU ARE THE GOAT for warning us headphone users about the imminent horn so we could turn down the volume!!!! My hearing and I cannot thank you enough for that simple little consideration that has caused me to block other YT filmmakers for NOT having that consideration. So, thank you! Again!

[@iceclimberGD]

You're welcome!! It scared the crap out of me when I had my volume up so I did that to save everyone else lol

[@andywomack3414]

I love the sound of EMD power under load.

[@harshaokin8064]

What gets me is the kinda torque those traction motors must make to get the WHEELS SLIPPING even under all that weight. Bloody hell, trains are fascinating!!!

[@zaphr89]

According to the data I found these new locomotives have a starting tractive effort of 203,000 lbf (903,000 N). The wheel diameter is 42" (107 cm) which yields a maximum torque of 355,000 foot pounds (482,000 Nm). Absolutely ridiculous amounts of torque. For comparison sake this is nearly a thousand times the torque of a Ford F150.

[@emmanuelsavage1271]

It was a great "I think I can moment!" Hearing the turbocharger winding up and the horn blast when the units started moving, as if to say, "I knew I could!"

[@46fd04]

Excellent throttle control by the Engineer. Fantastic!

[@randknu1]

With the introduction of ac traction came computer controlled traction systems, and modern ac locomotives are very good at detecting wheelslip. Using wheel creep technology. This looks like an older ac unit, 1st gen like an sd70mac. Slower to detect and correct a wheel slip than an sd70ace for example. And the ge's don't seem to be running at all. No sound or smoke.

[@jimmyg5408]

Think you’re right they weren’t making a lot of noise. Think the brake was still releasing at the start once fully released it seemed to lift pretty well if only the lead loco was pumping it would have taken a long time to release

[@jimmeh213]

It's an older unit but it still checks out

[@amtrak706]

The unit is actually a SD70ACC, which are rebuilt SD70s with modern AC traction electronics added. The wheelslip system is brand new.

[@UjjwalUpadhyay-xm2zq]

Pure wdg4 sounds in the beginning 🔥🔥

[@talis4646]

There is something majestic about seeing these beasts struggling to move that is impossible to describe, it's incredible thinking the amount of research humanity put into creating these machines and the fact everyday the logistics sector keeps the world moving at just the right pace for things to be considered "normal", so that industries may get their resources on time and packages be delivered at the right place at the expected/promised time. It's like there is an actual personal effort the engines are putting in place, kind of like when you try to start up your own car after the battery died, pushing and pushing until you get it moving *because you have to do it*, the world, your world, depends on it and you are putting each and every amount of force you can into it: these locomotives are doing that too, it makes them seem kind of alive rather than just some piece of machinery, in my personal opinion it's motivating... doing everyday what I have to do because the world needs me to do it and to not stop because I think it's too hard/heavy to do.

[@gbopemioyediran9384]

I love that point .... I always view machines as living things . Maybe it why I get attached to my cars emotionally. Lol

[@rangertrails2229]

These locomotive sounds never get old! I loved them as a kid and continue to love them! Awesome video!

[@toddlarmon3708]

I absolutely LOVE to watch a locomotive work. They are the coolest pieces of machinery ever created! Thanks for posting this awesome video.🙂

[@modelllichtsysteme]

The sound is amazing!

[@johncamp2567]

That was darn fascinating! It was interesting to the suspension system of the locomotive “bounce”. ‘Much like watching a driver stuck in snow. Very cool video!!

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks for watching, glad you liked it!

[@SIGINT007]

Excellent video showing the suspension loading and unloading as the traction management system puts power to the traction motor and then takes it away cyclically to prevent wheel spin. It seems though that this particular EMD system is maybe too restrictive as these guys can’t get any forward progress for a couple of minutes. It would have been nice to see what the GE wheels were doing.

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks! Pretty sure the GEs were isolated, they weren't doing anything.

[@thetrainshop]

The lurch and jerk technique has been an EMD staple since the Siemens powered MACs. Gonna be real, chief, it ain't great. Give me the equivalent AC GE and it'd had started with less drama. A lot more ear raping screech as the creep does it's thing, but no knuckle-testing lurches.

[@davegeisler7802]

Distributed power is your friend , especially a Locomotive shoving on the rear. Helps to save drawbars and knuckes. 👍

[@mikelowery5741]

Goes to sow you the tremendous weight trains can carry, and the amount of hp/tractive effort they need to have to be able to pull such a heavy train

[@PaulBradshaw-w7l]

Wheel slip control factors in a “ Lean into the load approach “ which works well and protects the drawgear . That load was most likely on a slight incline as the locos rolled back a little before traction came on. The Driver in this instance did a great job lifting that load off the mark.

[@NicolásGarmendia]

¡Impresionante! No tenía conocimiento de la arena para las ruedas y lo dificultoso que era comenzar el desplazamiento. ¡Excelente vídeo!

[@badlandskid]

Yo tambien

[@partybiscuit]

Wow. I'm from the UK and was blown away when I saw how long these huge trains were.

[@parrychapman7703]

I don't know if it is the audio or what, but I didn't hear those two trailing GE units pulling. The only unit I heard doing anything was the leading EMD. If so, that would make sense of why it had such a hard time getting things rolling.

[@iceclimberGD]

Yeah, I was sitting next to them for about an hour before they started moving and the GEs never went above idle. Thanks for watching!

[@adrianspeeder]

@@iceclimberGD Saves fuel.

[@slowpoke96Z28]

@@adrianspeeder wtf is the point of them being there if not to spread out power to the rails?

[@adrianspeeder]

@@slowpoke96Z28 To be used in locations determined by math where one unit isn't enough.

[@Arkyodoti]

Loved the "horn incoming" detailing

[@dschannel3781]

The thing that amaze me the most is the tiny coupler which pulls several tonnes of weight without breaking.

[@beeble2003]

Over 10,000 is not "several".

[@colt10mmsecurity68]

Reminds me of growing up in icy North Dakota in the 80’s, this is how I started my winter mornings going to school, but in my ‘72 Ford Pinto and with bald tires beyond belief!

[@Cnw8701]

I had a similar situation happen to me in Trainz 2019. I honestly didn't think a train could rock back and forth like that, because that's what mine did in the game!

[@iceclimberGD]

Cool to see they did that right!

[@marklythall8712]

What a magnificent sound, especially in the first 60 seconds as the engine raved up!

[@FFred-us9tw]

Great job showing how a traction control system works. Lot's of comments from people who simply have no concept that this is normal for a heavy train when starting. The system works fine. Nothing unusual in this video. It was not stalling. Traction control will cut power to each axle that is slipping (or is about to slip) momentarily and then re-apply power. When this happens the train will often lurch backwards or simply stop moving. But the computer is doing exactly what it's supposed to do.

[@iceclimberGD]

Yep, still awesome to see from a railfan's perspective though.

[@pianoboylaker6560]

Can't you just feel the sheer power of these beautiful machines?

[@blitzkringe]

That horn warning is SO thoughtful, thanks!

[@arthurerdman37]

The Accounting Department must be assigning locomotives again.

[@IGuessIDoThings]

It’s kinda funny seeing the engine move slowly back and forth. Modern locos are so powerful you wouldn’t typically expect it to struggle like this.

[@NoBody-ht1oh]

200kpa or so of independent can reduce the tendency for the wheels to slip during a hard start like that, this keeps the tractive effort there for longer and allows you to build a higher amperage/KN, especially with older DC GE's as they tend to just fully drop the load with the slightest wheel slip. Also helps if the train brakes are fully pumped off too, as i suspect was the problem here.

[@jimmyg5408]

Think you’re right about the brakes it seemed to lift fairly well in the end. Bit dicey stalling up DC traction like that was a long walk back for us if a mid-train loco derated on you happy days 🚂🚂

[@Cinemaaereo]

"Horn incoming" Very gentle! Thanks.

[@ivanjulian2532]

Great video. A question if I may? Are all three locomotives synchronised regarding their throttle settings?

[@Johnny64ism]

Yes they are controlled from the engineer in the lead engine

[@TDURybka]

Love how the Engineer shuts the window cause it about to get noisy!

[@the_autism_express]

1:43 "Don't forget Stepney's tip about sand. Lay it on the rails as you back down, and roll it firm with your wheels. You get a splendid grip that way."

[@kleetus92]

I was just going to say this, as I was looking for this comment... roll back one engine length sanding, or better still, sand as you come to a stop, as you won't have to drift backwards.

[@hazardeur]

as a noob, why would sand improve grip? wouldn't it be best to have no material between rail and wheel at all? why does sand not make it more slippery

[@kleetus92]

@@hazardeur I'm guessing you live in a dry hot climate? In winter we put sand or fine gravel on ice and snow covered roads to increase traction. Same is true here. The actual contact patch of the wheel and the rail head is very small, by putting sand on it, you're spreading that area out, and also roughing up that nearly polished surface between the wheel tread and the rail head. If you put down too much sand it can be an impediment, but in small doses it really helps out a lot.

[@hazardeur]

@@kleetus92 i'm actually living in the heart of europe so it's not too hot and also not very dry, mostly the opposite actually. I just have no idea or experience with this topic haha. But with your explanation makes a lot of sense to me now, thanks! It's all about that dosage, just has to be the right amount.

[@Redbikemaster]

The rocking while attempting to get traction reminds me a lot of my semi truck. When it's got traction, the lower gears can really lean the cab to the side from engine torque. But in low traction situations when you're trying to get rolling, you'll often have a similar movement as shown here, just side to side instead. It can be really jarring if you suddenly break traction under load. I once was climbing a hill on a backroad in Pennsylvania and was fully loaded. It was snowing heavily and near the crest of the hill the truck started bucking like a bronco because it was starting to slip on the hill. It was a stressful moment.

[@Southwest_923WR]

Very interesting indeed, I was stepping on gas gas pedal of my house slippers trying to help!

[@chayannecastellano7221]

Ive watched this vid like 25 times already and i cant stop watching it

[@SirChristian100]

You may be just a sandcorn in the universe - but you are ESSENTIAL for HUGE things to work - you are important!

[@askforever2022]

0:25 sounds so nice

[@cat_with_sunglass]

EMD 16-710G3 Diesel engine

[@askforever2022]

@@cat_with_sunglass thanks mate :))

[@again5162]

We run the worlds longest trains in Australia, our longhaul coal trains are designed so at takeoff only the weight of 1 carriage is moved, in between each carriage is a clutch that engages gradually meaning only the weight of 1 carriage is being shunted, for a long enough train the front engine will be doing 10kmh before the clucth engages on the last carriage which still won't be moving. Somebody mentioned also it works like a spring when braking hard so makes for a smoother safer journey

[@rashmisharma7387]

KZbin: Wanna see how a heavy train struggles to move? Audiance: Interesting.

[@abhinavaravind6844]

Very cool video, I saw something similar here in India when a very long and heavy freight train had to be started uphill but wasnt able to find the momentum to get going. Had to use 3 banker locomotives just to get rolling. Just one point to note at 2:15, its all about how much torque is available from the traction motors. Not the horespower. More torque = more load pulling capability. Since another user pointed out that the other locomotive units weren't under power, and only the lead unit was, it isnt surprising to see some wheelspin since all the load is take by 6 traction motors instead of 18.

[@channelsixtysix066]

I remember reading about early diesel-electric locomotives in Britain, none had didn't any wheel slip warning system. So when slipping started, engine drivers had no idea, this caused terrible wheel-burn damage to the track. There were several derailments caused by burnt rails breaking, it took a while before track maintenance crews realised what was going on.

[@iceclimberGD]

Holy cow, that must have been terrible to have to fix lol

[@batman51]

Have a look at kzbin.info/www/bejne/qGjKm4yOhraBlc0 !

[@leonblittle226]

@@iceclimberGD As luck would have it in those days all trains used screw link or instanter couplings which had a fair amount of slack each so you could grab a couple of mph before the entire consist was moving on a big train - the downside was you may well put the guard in the van at the back flat on his backside if you got too rough with it which didn't make you very popular!

[@SIMONP1965]

I had no idea a locomotive could spray sand on the track for traction.. ya learn something new every day...

[@McHeisenburger]

Today I learned that trains can blow sand on the tracks to increase traction.

[@MarioGomez-zg7hb]

En el minuto 2:46 o 2:47 aproximadamente, se escucha algo parecido a un golpe en el metal y se ve algo que sale volando por encima del segundo eje. ¿Se safo alguna tuerca? ¿Que fue eso? ¿Hizo mucha fuerza el tren?

[@randallellison6421]

As impressive as it is to watch these things start a heavy train and climb a hill at 5mph, what's scary is that how fast these locomotives actually are! They don't look it, but they can fly down the track! We have a stretch along the south part of BNSF's Thayer Subdivision that runs from about Portia to West Memphis, Arkansas that is not only level, but virtually straight and it's not uncommon for trains to hit 60mph or higher on this stretch. I was at Bay, Arkansas dropping a crew off and as I was turning around to leave, a Z train appeared at track speed and roared by just a couple of feet in front of me, I literally never heard it coming, talk about a wake up call!

[@iceclimberGD]

I took a trip to the Thayer sub last year, they sure do go fast up there! Thanks for watching!

[@randallellison6421]

@@iceclimberGD wow, super cool! If you're back in the area again, look out for a Railcrew Express van, you never know, I might just be in it!

[@iceclimberGD]

@@randallellison6421 Will do! I loved that area, will definitely be back at some point.

[@ausieking]

As soon as the second set of wheels catch the sand it starts moving very nice

[@shreyaszagade1881]

Indian Railways pull double stacking by using 2 electric engines and 1 electric engine in between and they are quick and fast.

[@freevideos051]

The sound of the engines makes me smile.

[@menguardingtheirownwallets6791]

having sand nozzles at the front of EACH wheel would help.

[@reginald2004]

But the front is sometimes the rear.

[@NanoMine]

I think not all wheels are powered, Nozel is only there on powered wheels.

[@reginald2004]

@@NanoMine Each wheel has it's own traction motor.

[@RFRyan]

I never knew there was a hill in Dalton. That ACC handled like a champ though.

[@spacecalander]

None of these units have the starting tractive effort of a AC4400, or a ACGEVO. A dash 9 is barely better than a dash 8 at getting a train moving. Nice close ups.

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks!

[@rrmike19]

The head one does...

[@brian5606]

Wrong

[@randallellison6421]

The SD70MAC and the SD70ACe can top the AC4400CW and ES44AC, at least that what many of the BNSF crews tell me. They'll say both the MAC and ACe will keep pulling long after the GEs quit!

[@louisguerin8513]

Nothing to see and you still make a video, I'm impressed!!

[@bobbycoffey7761]

They almost need a sand nozzle in front of each wheel instead of just the front of the trucks

[@sth475]

When stopping on a grade with a heavy load we are taught to lay sand for the last loco length as the train comes to a stand. Makes starting off easier.

[@jamesbond-cb4dt]

Bring in two big boys 🤠, they would pull the train like a charm

[@candreel]

The cameraman, instead of helping to push the locomotive, is just filming...

[@rockstarauthority7354]

This is a joke right?!

[@l3p3]

ikr smh

[@l3p3]

@@rockstarauthority7354 he could have tried at least!

[@cat_with_sunglass]

This is joke?

[@АлександрМелихов-к8м]

Nice. My respect to the driver is whether the Loco doesn't have an anti-slipping system. Smooth and precise control. The only thing I don't understand is why they only pull. It seems that the train is heavy and long. It also has auto couplers, so they can push the train back to squeeze it and then pull. These couplers always have free space to move, so if a train is long enough, they can start moving forward without full load. This is hard to do safely but a skilled driver can possibly do this. At least, in our country they do this quite often.

[@FrogandFlangeVideo]

Great video !! Here's a question for you engineers out there: when applying sand in a MU setup does application of sand in the lead unit cause sand in the trailing units also ? James.

[@dannyholt105]

Hmmm, good question!

[@hotshothogger]

No.

[@chrisparker1267]

38 years and I never knew this was an issue that existed with trains.

[@SD40Fan_Jason]

Another Hot-dogger hogger who goes from idle to run 8 and lets the electronics handle the rest. Whenever the wheel slip indicator comes on even on the oldest engines, they automatically activate the sanders briefly. When the wheels are slipping constantly, the newer systems will force the governor to cut back to half power and then re-engage once all the wheels are synchronous, which at a start like this is a complete stop. It's really hard on the equipment to have to switch from 100% power to 0% and then back to 100%. A seasoned engineer that doesn't intentionally break stuff knows this and would not have used the wheel slip indicator to activate sand, nor would they have stayed in Run 8 while trying to get started. This sort of behavior is the new wave of railroading though. Crews are no longer expected to think outside the box and use the tools that are right there in their hands. Instead they are given the threat of losing their job and forced to put on a good show for the cameras and event recorders only. When I came to work for the railroad, when I hired out there was still pride in the job. Engineers dressed like well mannered gentlemen and their focus was to do a good job, by handling the train in a safe and efficient manner so that they got done as quickly as possible without anyone getting hurt or anything breaking. Today, it's a different aspect of railroading where engineers come to work, constantly looking over their shoulder, knowing fully well they wear a target on their back.

[@nyotamwuaji6484]

Okay that was cool. I've never seen a close up of a auto-sander in action like that.

[@Adam1nToronto]

The wheels with the sand blowing in from in front and actually making it between the wheel and the rail are not slipping - the traction aid appears to be working. The wheels where the sand is blowing in from behind, and thus uselessly ending up on the rail behind the wheel, are the ones that are slipping. My guess is the slipping wheel is what tells the traction control to back off acceleration. The loco rocks back and forth for a while, slowly making some headway until the slipping wheels reach the sand blown in from the leading nozzle, at which point they gain traction, stop slipping and allow the whole thing to get moving. I wonder if placing twice as many sand nozzles, so that each wheel always has it's own leading nozzle (regardless of its orientation), and blowing sand in only from the leading nozzle (the trailing nozzle appears to be useless, until the loco is turned around) gets it going any sooner. I also wonder if applying power to only those wheels with leading nozzles, while disabling those without, would prevent a "slipping" signal from being sent to the computer, thus preventing the premature disconnection of power. The traction control computer should do that automatically.

[@scottnewton2966]

Train was not "stalled". It was simply stopped and trying to get the whole train moving. A train stalls when it is under power and speed is reduced to a stall, by way of track elevation or losing an engine.

[@dorianm.3612]

Can we build a gear starter? Sliping wheels is the worst think. Can we connect gear for few meters to make first move? Somethink like gear between wheels and flat gear between rails pulled up by pistons.

[@unclejohnieplays5651]

I feel his pain and pure joy As a truck driver I’m stuck and need a tow is never a call you want to have to make

[@sunnysiderails397]

WOW really cool video, love the up close shots of the wheel and sander working!!!

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks!!

[@SoCal_Railfan]

If your wondering why the train is wheel slipping, they throw the throttle to fast and then the wheels create wheel slip.

[@TheDrAkira]

Niceeeee!!! Trains are so hypnoticals to watch, I don't know why.

[@ebolawarrior451]

Video is great but watching that suspension load and unload is nuts.

[@user-mn3sp4ni4v]

What is the flying object at 1:11? The shadow is casts on the fence makes it seem small but it moves so smoothly through the air.

[@iannickCZ]

Gliding pigeion I guess

[@kurze3215]

FUN FACT: This train number is 1804, which is the year the first steam train was invented

[@maciejgawot3352]

Impressive! I was stunned when I saw it pulling on the suspension like if it was just a civic on handbrake :o

[@lambfactory2537]

I remember when we started getting ac4400's. We would stop behind a crossing until the dispatcher told us to come to town. From a dead stop with 105 loaded coal cars. 2 engines on the head end. come out to throttle 4 and release the independent brakes, move to throttle 6 and release the automatic(train) brakes. It would slowly begin to move. Then to full throttle. Going over the same crossing without stopping notch 8 we would be down to 12-14 mph.

[@SKYKOP1972]

Well. I thought I was quite the locomotive brain. Back to amature status. I'd never seen an engineer rock a train to get it moving. Very cool video. Thanks!

[@kleetus92]

that wasn't operator input, that was the control system doing the work.

[@SKYKOP1972]

@@kleetus92 no kidding? Huh.

[@kleetus92]

@@SKYKOP1972 Honestly it's pretty impressive. If you're bored, look up AC sensorless vector control ... en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vector_control_(motor)

[@mikegenset5228]

Wow that was absolutely fabulous to see

[@lovecntrains2732]

Whoa he's working hard and I love that engine sd70 never gets old

[@justinburns3262]

Great video! Really appreciated the warning prior to the horn

[@iceclimberGD]

Thanks!!

[@timosha21]

I'm a tram and I approve this video! :)

[@filanfyretracker]

I saw the DC to AC and was expecting MNRR New Haven line for some reason, New Have Line shares trackage with Amtrack in CT and so I had this image that a loco existed that was Diesel, DC Third Rail and Overhead catenary.

[@Edyth_Hedd]

Very cool to see the engineer "rocking" the locomotive like I would a car I was trying to get out of a snowbank. And does the engineer have the capability of activating the nearby crossing gate from inside the cab? It's something I've always wondered.

[@iceclimberGD]

Some yes, but they have to be set up for that. This crossing and most others use either motion sensors or a circuit that the metal axles of the train complete as they get close.