5 MISLEADING Claims About USCCA Membership That Are WRONG

[@BasedAFPatriot]

Thank you for the clarification. I am now 100% convinced that "insurance liable coverage" like USCCA is *NOT* what I want if charged with a crime. You gave me 5 reasons to cancel my USCCA membership and join (spend my $) with a "pre-paid legal" program that WILL defend me, regardless of the _alleged_ crime. Thanks again! 😂

[@benw2569]

Exactly.

[@crispinmacfarlane1478]

Good choice. I lost confidence in USCCA

[@wendellhatcher7011]

Get ccwsafe they literally cover you.

[@AKA_MixMaster]

ACLDN!

[@bradlayton8570]

I’ve been a USCCA member for many years. Unfortunately, this disappointing video has clarified and confirmed all my concerns about USCCA and has convinced me I need to go another route.

[@solidrockofjesuschristmini2423]

Wise decision

[@n5uge12]

Me too. I have cancelled my membership.

[@SurvivenTerry]

USCCA SUCKS!

[@GHOST41293]

Yeah, I'm canceling my elite membership .

[@drengillespie]

They got called out on a couple videos and thought this would be helpful(?)

[@christopherh2370]

Sounds like to me USCCA is putting themselves in a position of a win-win. Either you win the case or you drop it and the insured has to pay back all the expenses.

[@rickwrack7776]

An insurance company will ALWAYS find a reason NOT to provide coverage. Just remember that 👌

[@XX-166]

There’s a difference between fixing my roof or repairing my sideswiped vehicle as opposed to possibly going to prison. I want to always know the exclusions on that one.

[@allthisforsomevideo]

So don’t give them one.

[@XX-166]

@@allthisforsomevideo easier said then Done when something happens

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@allthisforsomevideo The reasons are built into the policy.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@williamhsmithjr2991 " if they choose not to train and take any safety classes, their chances to live in or through a gun battle becomes very small." Only about one CCW holder in every 200 will ever even draw their weapons in their entire lives. Less than that will be involved in a gunfight. That is a very rare event. " If you or I are in a illegal gun fight and your charge with a crime, you will not be covered, you will not be covered." Stop worrying. Both the statistical odds and the insurance policy say that the odds of that happening to you are about the same as being struck by lightning multiple times. Do you have insurance against being struck by lightning? Same thing.

[@pappamike6231]

I have heard the "no coverage if convicted" story and that scares me with our corrupt judiciary.

[@Jordan-ql6tm]

After being a member for years and switched to CCW Safe, plenty of videos comparing the two policies. Uscca isn't a bad service at all but they just lack in some area's CCW Safe was better in, and the track record in more than a few types of incidences pushed me away from Uscca. A lack of proper up front red flag protection was a big thing as well.

[@threestans9096]

good thing convicted doesn’t mean the same as charged.

[@AlmightyEvil1]

Ummmm it can damn sure walk a thin line in this country. Let’s not pretend to be naive

[@shawnb4938]

Read the contract. Much of what he says is not true is in the printed contract

[@buck3336]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/nZOok4KAgsl-aZI This man explains the insurance part much better.

[@michaelbaumann42]

This absolutely helped me. Thank you so much. I canceled my policy and will be looking for other coverage.

[@JaneDoe-xn3ct]

Texas Lawshield is what I have

[@AlmightyEvil1]

Lol

[@DDDYLN]

I'm about to do the same thing.

[@travfromthelou]

I left and joined CCWsafe

[@michaelbaumann42]

@@JaneDoe-xn3ct do they accept credit holders in calfornia. Will check into them.

[@henryrodgers1752]

“…insurance coverage IS SOMETIMES PROVIDED until a final decision is made that a crime was committed.” Yep. Just what I needed to know.

[@Magnarmis]

All I heard in the beginning was "We aren't a sketchy insurance company, we are a front man for a sketchy insurance company"

[@andrewhollick6387]

The most frequent reason for not joining USCCA I hear is that if a member has been accused as murder but claimed was self defense AND the verdict goes against the defendant then USCCA can and will go after the defendant for legal fees.

[@AG-no1dq]

they clearly have the right to do so

[@920WASHBURN]

Yeah, they will. Which doesn't make sense. They could just do a bad job in court and get all that money back.

[@GodsservantJohn330]

That's exactly what concerns me about uscca and I am a current member but considering switching my entire family to a different group if this is not addressed in the video, I am watching it right now

[@andrewhollick6387]

@@GodsservantJohn330 I asked the question to local USCCA rep while at a Gun Show. I asked for a copy of the policy. He initially agreed, then declined after I told him I’m an insurance adjuster who handled litigated claims

[@ghostblack9209]

Very reason why I didn’t go with them.

[@scoth2455]

Unfortunately with even a legitimate case of self defense being politicized an innocent person can be found guilty. If this happens to me I would be in jail unable to provide for my family. My family would be left owing USCCA money.

[@garryrice1954]

That’s better than being in jail with your family trying to pay for your defense. If they can’t afford to pay it back, they can pay for you to be defended in the first place.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@garryrice1954 Show me any evidence that USCCA ever pays claims. They say they do. If they do, then there ought to appropriate legal documents filed with the insurance commissioners.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

I can't find any evidence that any of these companies have ever paid any claims.

[@stevedodge1570]

No the USCCA won't, but the insurance company can.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@stevedodge1570 They never have. If you know the odds and how to read an insurance policy you know they never will. In the first place, the odds are about 1,000 to 1 that you will never have a covered incident in your entire life. If you did, you would discover the sad truth about what their policy really says. You will never collect a dime, no matter what. You will never know anyone who collected. It's a scam. That's why it is illegal in some states.

[@prongATO]

Someone please correct me if I'm wrong but it feels like the part about you having to pay all legal fees back if you're convicted is a bit of an issue. Why wouldn't they want ever single person "insured" to be convicted? That way they make off with the monthly fees and really don't have to provide much of a service at all.

[@Soloong_Gaybowzer]

It's worse than that. They have a clause in the contract that says they won't even defend you if you've been accused of committing a crime. Essentially they claim to provide coverage, but offer themselves a way out of providing coverage in the fine print.

[@solidrockofjesuschristmini2423]

I believe it was Kayla Giles she was platinum member and they dropped her in middle of her defense and threw her to the wolves, uscca has not said one reason why, if they had a good reason I feel like they would say it but they remain silent

[@prongATO]

@@thystaff742 after the shooting? They sound absolutely useless in all the situations where you get them, in the cases you would need them.

[@-ved89]

@@solidrockofjesuschristmini2423their exact words were “ it was clearly premeditated murder” . So they made the decision themselves and dropped her. 🧐

[@Shikaari1]

I attended “Should I Shoot” class given by USCCA at Top Gun in Memphis today. I have been on the fence about joining USCCA and now less inclined to join.

[@brianj123458]

Coverage ends with conviction scares me. I've been a USCCA member for 10 years now myself this comment you made is making me wonder should I look around for another Coverage. The reason I say this is because a conviction of someone that did nothing wrong should have there appeal covered to try to overturn the wrong verdict. People that did nothing wrong get convicted a lot depending on what state, city they live in to my opinion. I live in California and if I had to defend mine or my family's life's say on a trip to Las Angeles I may need an appeal to keep me out of prison to be in my family's life for doing nothing wrong

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

Other people have mentioned that they Cover appeals and they only consider someone 'convicted of a crime', when you are no-longer able to appeal (you can only do so many appeals per case)

[@Falconryder]

Your appeal may also not work, even if you're innocent. Shouldn't be grounds for reclaiming money spent on legal defense. Regardless of what the lawyer/salesman says here, there's nothing illegal about providing attorney coverage; it's a constitutional right even if you are guilty.

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

@@Falconryder This isn't about 'providing attorney representation' the legality tangle is when it comes to how that representation is 'payed for'.

[@Falconryder]

@@Gwydion_Wolf No, it doesn't. If I had wanted to pay for Al Capone's lawyer, there would be no legal repercussions possible for me, because until the trial is over, everyone is presumed innocent, and legal representation is a codified right everyone has. If they were providing actual insurance, where they agreed to cover damages payouts to victims after their client injures them during a bank robbery, that is the thing that is illegal. Not paying for a lawyer.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

None of these coverages would be worth the money. It is the statistical equivalent of playing a slot machine that pays off about once every 15,000 years.

[@captaink2665]

Coverage ends on a Conviction. That means you do not cover Appeals! Yes I am a Member, thanks for the information, I might look at other companies that don't leave me hanging on a wrongful conviction.

[@keres993]

Exactly. He really didn’t ease my anxiety about this point at all. If anything, he confirmed that we should be suspicious

[@Brendan-hi9vn]

The definition of conviction in their policy is the last non-appealable verdict. Try doing some research for yourself.

[@kaa_man]

That's the reason (no appeals) I decided to go with another company

[@raftika1]

@@kaa_man what company did you go with?

[@zacharylowe8083]

It’s written in the contract that it doesn’t count as a conviction until it’s no longer appealable.

[@jamespmullin21753]

From what you say a lot of people will cancel USCCA

[@springfever2002]

Basically USCCA cleared up everything that I already researched. USCCA does not cover appeals. Once a person is found guilty they are automatically considered a criminal and you will attempt to recoup your losses from them or their family. However, there are other companies that will cover the appeals process and won't come after the CCW holder and their family to recoup their losses if convicted. The justice system is a mess. There is always that chance that a person is found guilty due to a technicality and not because they are guilty. This is why many times an appeal is necessary. If USCCA does not cover the appeals process and only handles the first trial. That is a problem as every case is unique and different. So an appeal may be necessary in some instances but not in others.

[@ChickenPermissionOG]

Uscca has no loses they are not an insurance company.

[@Cowboy_up429]

​@@kawikadee9670 they only work in 2 states. I was at there web site about an hour ago. They also will not pay out bail money. You or your family has to pay out that first. They also will not represent you in civil lawsuits.

[@scotttruong]

What’s the other company name?

[@jackomalley3687]

Usscca will cover you until you exhausted all appeals

[@Carv97]

I’ve been on the fence about this for years and I’m happy they dropped this video because it made my decision to not go with them and cleared up the decision for a lot of other people as well, I think this video might’ve done more harm than good but I’m very happy I got to see it maybe I will get insurance down the road just not sure if it’ll be through USCCA

[@ElainesDomain]

Yep. This video sells bad.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

See kzbin.info/www/bejne/nZOok4KAgsl-aZI for comparison.

[@walterniklowicz9141]

Take a look at us law shield. It's cheaper and won't ask for money back if their lawyer pleads you out.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@walterniklowicz9141 I wouldn't worry about it, if I were you. Statistically speaking, your chances of having a qualifying event are the same as playing a slot machine that pays off once every 15,000 years.

[@gregdarmenio6902]

I think you'll find the same things in every insurance company

[@dcpanam]

This video is wild. “Let me tell you how USCCA is TOTALLY different than what we advertise and confirm that in this day and age, you most likely won’t be covered.” Can’t believe they would put this out. So glad I cancelled.

[@dravenocklost4253]

Don't worry. We investigated ourselves and found no wrong doing. This video lol

[@knight907]

Wow! Thank you for making this video. I wanted to give you the benefit of the doubt that “coverage for a crime” is not the same as “coverage for defense against being convicted of a crime”, but you’ve made it very clear that you consider them to be one and the same. I thought that clause was just to ensure people didn’t think you’d pay any fines or fees that were part of the sentence if they were convicted. This video has very specifically explained that my understanding was wrong, and that what you provide is at best **only** effective in civil suits (despite your claims to the contrary), and at worst could end up costing members huge amounts of money in fees you attempt to recoup if your attorneys can’t win their case.

[@WelshRabbit]

How about costs of appeal to reverse an error made at the trial court level where the defendant was initially convicted but the conviction was reversed on appeal?

[@CBODev]

This is my specific concern too. More than ever, as we see everyday in the media, you can travel out of your "red" county and into the "blue" city and political environment will automatically be a conviction for most anything involving a firearm. USCAA, IMO, most likely will not go beyon the first round to defend you.

[@DG-sn6eh]

C. “Conviction” means the final non-appealable entry by a court of an adjudication, judgment, order or ruling finding a party guilty of a crime. However, this does not include the “insured’s” “conviction” for a violation of a concealed carry or similar law.

[@venz8201]

@@1watersthree see the comment above. A conviction must be unappealable to qualify.

[@Iranian_Cowboy]

“Unless an exclusion applies or some other term of the policy isn’t satisfied.” Lemme put that in laymen’s terms for y’all: “we try to find any sorta loophole to terminate your coverage so we don’t have to pay out.” Bravo 👏 🤗

[@GodGunsGills]

Amen

[@stevedodge1570]

That's kind of what it meant to me also.

[@deejayimm]

So hypothetically, if the uscca were covering the McCloskeys when they stood in their front yard and pointed guns at a trespassing angry mob, but then later pled guilty to a lesser charge, would you pay for their legal fees? Or would they be required to pay you back?

[@AG-no1dq]

the way I understand this, they could recoup and go after them

[@rolandblaise1149]

That would be how I interpreted point #4 as well.

[@mortykatz2236]

@@AG-no1dq I’m an insurance agent- most carrier’s have similar clauses. Especially health carrier’s that write disability policies during the first 2 years they can go after whatever they paid you based upon misrepresentation. If the attorney that the USCCA assigned you recommend a plea- how long would the carrier and the USCCA be in business - if they pulled crap like that.

[@javoratree3861]

Yeah they would and that’s why I won’t join…

[@AG-no1dq]

@@mortykatz2236 I would respectfully say that you should read the policy. I did and switched. Also spoke to an experienced criminal/ self defense attorney.

[@joshottinger6380]

HE SAYS: It is illegal for anyone to insure an illegal act. Insurance coverage is sometimes provided until it's a final decision that a crime was committed. Coverage stops in the event of a conviction. BUT THEN HE SAYS If the member is charged with a crime, but claims they acted in self-defense, there will VERY likely be Insurance coverage. How will there VERY likely be coverage for someone who's charged with a CRIME and claims it was self-defense if it's ILLEGAL FOR ANYONE TO INSURE AN ILLEGAL ACT? These two statements are contradictory to each other. So which statement is true?

[@BakerchopzZ]

I recently found out about that little clause that they have the power to deny you just because you are convicted or it "might be illegal". If you end up in court, its because someone is questioning you of ill intent. That will be a good percentage of all cases. I'm actually leaning more toward getting a lawyer on retainer. At least that way they will back me even if I'm accused or convicted of a crime. I've actually been hearing a lot of issues with USCCA lately which has prompted my search for a safer alternative.

[@jimmymac1958]

I just purchased USCCA. This video has me questioning my decision.

[@mastersergeant8672]

Me too.

[@ken60659]

#4, so if you agree to a plea deal, the insurance company must recoup its expenses. By entering into the plea deal, you stipulate you committed an illegal act, and an insurance company cannot insure an illegal act. Therefore, the insurance company must recoup its expenses. Roughly 90 % - 95% of criminal cases end with the defendant accepting a plea deal. So at least 90% of the cases that USCCA members bring forward are not covered? How much does a USCCA member pay every year to have a 5%-10% chance that his/her case will be covered?

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

How many of those 90-95% cases are 'self defense' and how many are Armed robbery, kidnapping, manslaughter..... ect? Negligent Homicide while driving drunk would fall into that 'criminals cases' statistic as well.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@Gwydion_Wolf The statistic that is important to them is that only one person in 200 will ever have a qualifying event in their entire lives.

[@theodorehunter4765]

Here's the rub: Having legal counsel is NOT an illegal act, even if you are guilty. They are using a bait and switch tactic to cover the fact that they aren't going to cover your legal fees if they lose your case.

[@jackomalley3687]

Ken if a person is truly innocent they will never agree to any plea deal period. Someone like what happiness Derrick Chauvin case he probably felt he was kind of guilty so he did or would most likely accept plea deal

[@benwah3593]

After listening to this video, I am feeling like I might have wasted my money for getting USCCA coverage. I am going to read back over the policy and see If I can decipher it a bit better. We all know sometimes a justified use of deadly force can still end up in a conviction especially in the US today, so they cover your criminal legal expenses, or as he said " most likely will cover criminal Defense 🤞 , UNLESS SOME FINE PRINT IS NOT BREACHED BY THE DEFENDANT". So if you are found guilty , you are bankrupt and go to jail. Wow I really don't feel secure now on what might happen, if God forbid I ever have to defend myself with deadly force and the jury doesn't rule in my favor. One thing he did not cover , if you are found guilty but the conviction is overturned on appeal does the USCCA give you back the money they bankrupt you by recovering all their expenses???

[@leskobrandon4666]

"There will likely be coverage"? Ok, I'm canceling my membership!!

[@leudwigvonshwartsenhelm3624]

The only reason I joined this organization was because I was led to believe that they will defend me if I get into a self defense situation....... Is that not the case?

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

They will. And as others have stated, they WILL cover appeals, but that coverage stops if you lose the 'final appeal' (you can only appeal a decision so many times per case). What they can not LEGALLY cover (as in, it is illegal for them do do it), is if for instance, you break into someone's home and get involved in a shooting (as you were 'committing a criminal act'). Or if you for some reason agree to a 'plea-deal' which results in your essentially stating "yes, i admit i performed a criminal act" (even though its a lesser charge, its still an admission of guilt of a crime.) If there is no case of "self Defense" there, that is when they cannot cover you. Someone on this thread keeps bringing up a woman who shot her ex-husband while he was dropping off their child for shared custody as a 'see! this is what they do!" moment, but they fail to mention that she shot him from her car, while he was giving their 2 year old a hug, or that she stated it "felt good" to kill him, or that she had a history of abuse charges filed against her. What she did was in no way 'self-defense', so USCCA could not 'legally' defend her as there literally was no case for self-defense to be made.

[@DA-zh9gi]

PSA - After 8 years as a USCCA Platinum member (since 2015).... I just cancelled my membership and switched to another program (I now have a law firm backing me up). People like myself expect real attorneys backing us up and not insurance companies involved or pulling any strings. Your model has been exposed regardless of how you try to justify it or talk around it. I am sure you became quite wealthy over the years since you were a pioneer, but time to revamp the business model or become extinct like the dinosaurs... I'll be watching and would love to see you beat the other program I just joined. I'll come back if you fix the problems and offer more, but not until the protection is guaranteed regardless of the situation... You need to rid yourself of the insurance company involvement, period.

[@moneymakersism]

What program did you join if you don’t mind me asking? Been looking for me to join

[@davidhodge144]

I’ve been hearing that if you agree to a plea deal, which is what happens in most cases to save time, coverage is void. So if the prosecutor agrees I’m innocent of murder but wants me to agree to negligence in some other minor area, would a plea deal void coverage?

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

He mentions that in this video. The thing to remember is, as he said.. in a "Self Defense Shooting" situation, no amount of 'plea deal' will not result in a "criminal charge", and insurance company's cannot 'insure' criminal acts. Negligent Homicide means you did something wrong. Ie: Shot someone who was NOT a threat to you, missed the person who was a threat and hit some innocent person, ect. Even in a self-defense situation, you STILL have to be aware of what else is around you. So if your involved in a self-defense instance, and the ONLY person injured is the person that was attacking you, dont accept any type of 'plea deal' as that simply is you stating "i know i did something wrong".

[@davidhodge144]

@@Gwydion_Wolf Firearms Legal Protection rep (at the link below) says that MOST cases result in a plea deal for political reasons. The DA will say “Just admit fault in this minor area so it’ll all go away and we can avoid a 6 month legal battle.” They need some sort of “win” for their careers. So with the USCCA that wouldn’t be an option since you need to fight for 100% innocence and can’t give over something minor to make it go away. Do you agree? Any idea if plea deals are as common as they make it seem in the video below? By the way, I’m a USCCA member. Love what they’re doing. This video just got me worried. kzbin.info/www/bejne/b5jVqml4f9B_eqM

[@Agachak2]

Let alone the civil trial later on...

[@TheDunestrider]

Moral of the story: avoid insurance (as is provided by membership with the USCCA) and go with a company that provides attorney services.

[@USCCAOfficial]

What makes you feel that you would not have access to attorney services, Jim? As a benefit to a USCCA membership, you have access to our complete Attorney Network, which consists of a list of vetted attorneys around the United States that are familiar with the current self-defense laws. The policy issued to and held by the USCCA that provides the association and its members with self-defense liability insurance has no limit for defense expenses and a per insured $2,000,000 annual aggregate liability limit for compensatory damages.

[@OverTheVoids]

​@@USCCAOfficialAre you honestly so daft and deceptive as to put a spin on the implicit point that OP was making?! It's pretty obvious that his concern isn't ability not having access to attorneys. It's about who has the most incentive and best business model for defending the members and not abandoning them when it is convenient for the provider to do so. Insurance companies have business models that are categorically centered around the notion of taking the most money while providing the least payouts to the insured. THAT is the crux the problem with your business model.

[@marksmith4892]

@@OverTheVoids I'm here investigating the supposed new "improvements" USCCA just made to their policy and by way of my investigation I learned some things pertaining to this line of comments. USCCA says you have access to an attorney network but they DON'T specify HOW MUCH THEY PAY to an attorney per hour, so for example if they pay $200/hour then they will get a fresh graduate of law school who is inexperienced, but if they pay $600/hour, they will get a seasoned, experienced expert. So yea you get to pick which attorney you want from potentially a pool of the shittiest, most incompetent lawyers on Earth, so limitless coverage for defense expenses doesn't mean anything except that you will receive legal services from a 2-bit incompetent willing to work for crumbs.

[@DadBradTo5]

There are a LOT of "exceptions" & "exclusions' in a number of these policies from the various CCW companies, that raise several "Red Flags" in my mind. (Btw, I recently DROPPED my USCCA coverage for my wife and myself, bc of all of these exceptions, as well as all of the legalese which (imo) seemed to be one "Weasel Clause" after another) . One (of the MANY) things that caused me concern was an exclusion to cover one if they were accused of "Brandishing" a weapon. Of course the company (USCCA, CCW Safe, etc) will use the legal definition of "Brandishing" of the respective state one lives in! The reason I mention that, is bc one of my sons is in the military, but in a "Free" state, albeit stationed in a high-crime area. He is able to carry both open and concealed. One night upon exiting a Walmart, he had a nefarious-looking character start making a "beeline" towards him. My son merely brushed back his jacket which then revealed his holstered handgun. He never even had to touch his handgun, and the character did an immediate "180". Had I done the EXACT SAME THING here in the "Socialist Paradise" of Commie-fornia, I could be immediately charged (under our laws) of 'Brandishing", and then be automatically EXCLUDED from coverage for legal defense fees, according to the "agreements" of some of these CCW policies. Its "Weasel Clauses" (imo) like this (again, among others) that was a major catalyst in me dropping my USCCA coverage. The "Final Straw" was also the REFUSAL (to the best of my knowledge) of ANY of these companies to provide their "Loss Ratio's", meaning how much they take in ("Premium Dollars") vs how much they "Pay Out" (Losses) in Legal and other related fees. This TOTAL LACK OF TRANSPARENCY (again, to the best of my knowledge) should make anyone considering ANY of these companies, to "Think Twice" re what exactly they're getting for the monthly premiums they're expending. Just my thoughts and personal opinions fwiw...

[@reverse_shell]

Thank you for this reply! Cohesive and straight to the point. The lack of transparency is a huge concern and I'm not really sure if I need one of these companies if they won't be there when I need them if something should happen!

[@dtimboggs]

So the USCCA DOES require one to replay for their defense, if a guilty plea is taken. You actually said it.

[@throatpunch4789]

Every lawyer I've asked said to stay away from uscca

[@marksmith4892]

which association did they recommend instead then?

[@bwalker4194]

More worrisome to me, is that one does not to be convicted of the stated charge to be denied, I believe that any lesser charge resulting in or plea-bargained down to a conviction will mean denial of coverage. Not for me, thank you.

[@Lethalmuffin87]

Well guys, I really do appreciate this video. It took months of hearing rumors to finally see this video and hear clear and concise answers to some of the allegations against y’all. I know y’all try to provide a protection to us, however there are a number of weak points in the structure as you have noted. What we are looking for is peace of mind. Unfortunately, knowing that we cannot be insured against our worst fears by you or anyone else is a problem that leads us to find a solution that does. If we are going to spend the money for peace of mind, there has to be a serious appraisal of what that peace of mind will look like. For me, it means an attorney on retainer. Others may have different needs, but either way I appreciate USCCA for being honest and transparent. This is the responsibility of anyone offering protection. Thanks again for all this information guys, stay safe out there.

[@lalvare]

I've been a member few years . Today 1-1-24 I cancelled my policy due to New laws in Cali SB2 Basically I am criminal where ever I go "Sensitive areas" One more reason to live this insurance membership that do not bak u up when u need it the most.

[@rriv]

What about the case of Alan Colie that you guys did not defend and who was found not guilty on defending himself? So, you are not an insurance company, but you cannot insure an illegal act, so you can insure a legal act but you are still not an insurance company?

[@MelkorHimself]

Tom, surely you can see the problem by doing this video. You've appeared on a ton of USCCA videos, and it's abundantly clear you're on very friendly terms (if not also on their payroll). There is a glaring conflict of interest. You should have let unaffiliated third-party attorneys post on this channel with their assessments of USCCA's coverage.

[@josephryan9230]

Great point!!!

[@kennylavay8492]

What should be said is, there should be people who actually used the insurance for their benefit and real cases of people who had the insurance needed to use it and the out come from the people who got convicted and those that did not get convicted. real folks that can be verification of their cases. no blue smoke and mirrors only of what it will cover. How about some information of what it actually will not cover. No BS just the truth.

[@kennylavay8492]

I have heard a few different people on the internet that USCCA is not all what it is cracked up to be, and if you need them it is too late at that point. read between the lines of what is (NOT COVERED and what you could be charged if the case goes against you)

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@kennylavay8492 They should be able to give two simple numbers: 1) How much did they collect in premiums? 2) How much did they pay in claims? The first number is somewhere over $250 million. The second one is probably close to zero.

[@WoodsDog]

@@kennylavay8492 this*

[@Bonham-ik1pe]

So glad I moved on from USCCA and went elsewhere for my coverage.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

The entire industry is a scam. There is no chance you will ever get paid, no matter what.

[@jackhanifan5206]

Where did you go for good coverage.

[@Bonham-ik1pe]

@@jackhanifan5206 I moved over to CCW Safe. I went with their best plan.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@jackhanifan5206 Don't go to any of them. The odds are about 1,000 to 1 that you would never have a covered event in your life. These companies are banned in some states because of consumer fraud laws. Save your money.

[@37gdog]

You can't insure crime, that's all you really need to know. I have been shopping around and I am leaning towards Attorneys for Freedom now that they went national. Not insurance, just lawyers. Each to their own.

[@DonTruman]

That's the issue, not USCCA's insurance company. How does the cost compare?

[@davidcantwell2489]

Ok, this video proves they're feeling the sting of cancelations.

[@GeminiiMiind]

I dropped USCCA and went with CCW safe.

[@AshGreen359]

He basically confirmed all the so called "Misinformation" I combined ACLDN with Attorneys for Freedom retainer program

[@Ranalla651]

Was thinking the same thing !

[@AshGreen359]

@@Ranalla651 The things not covered with that combo are red flags

[@bleutooth1000]

Why isn’t anyone talking about his non-answer in #4? Do you charge people back for costs incurred if a person is found guilty or plead guilty? It seems like the answer is YES they do charge you back if you plead guilty!

[@MrTacticalReviews]

Thanks for clearing this up, so basically, if you want to be represented by a lawyer - hire a lawyer NOT insurance.

[@inyourdefense0]

I've been a USCCA member for years, and this was a very necessary clarification.

[@USCCAOfficial]

We are honored to have you as a part of the USCCA family. We are glad that you got value from this content.

[@RamathRS]

@@USCCAOfficial Now how about you address the numerous legitimate concerns listed elsewhere in the comment section which were *not* covered in this video?

[@nosteponsnakey]

@@USCCAOfficial can you please answer the question about the coverage in a civil suit? What happens if you are convicted but then exonerated upon appeal?

[@danvote2441]

You should read the Delta defense policy. I am still a member, but there are a few other reasons I struggle with whether to stay with them or not.

[@danvote2441]

@@nosteponsnakey It talks about it in the delta defense policy definitions under section V, "“Conviction” means the final non-appealable entry by a court of an adjudication, judgment, order or ruling finding a party guilty of a crime. However, this does not include the “insured’s” “conviction” for a violation of a concealed carry or similar law."

[@edzaslow]

"Members"? I think the correct appellation is "customers." A member of the USCCA has no vote or say in how USCCA is operated.

[@jamesreasor7155]

I left USCCA several years ago, because at that time it appeared that we have to come up with the defense money first, then they reimbursed you later.

[@USCCAOfficial]

I think you may have the USCCA mixed up with another company, James. I would take a look at the video linked below as it goes over the common misleading claims about the USCCA membership. I would suggest you check out this video as it goes over the most common misleading claims about the USCCA membership, James. kzbin.info/www/bejne/kJ-YmX6giNGgrbc

[@kevinbartoszek4186]

So if you are falsely convicted USCCA will come after you for costs and not appeal your case?

[@cdle007]

You are correct.

[@timothychartier]

No?

[@kennylavay8492]

If you want to really find out how good the USCCA insurance policy under another company name is, you have to talk or have them speak about what happened to them after a self defense shooting and if they got off and or what was covered and what was not covered. and will the policy cover civil law suits against you for the same rate or is there another rate added on for that case.

[@920WASHBURN]

What do you mean "rate"? It's just a monthly fee and civil is included.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

Look at the LOSS RATIO. How much money did they collect for this stuff? I count AT LEAST $250 million per year. How much money did they pay out in claims? Let them publish that number.

[@gregdarmenio6902]

@@cliffordschaffer5289 usually a liability company has to hold so much money in reserve in order to cover claims that could arise and the reserve amount is based on the real experience in pain claims so you could find that out

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@gregdarmenio6902 Yeah, I know. I spent years in insurance. The term you are looking for is LOSS RATIO. That is Total Claims Paid divided by Total Premiums Collected. For any real insurance company that comes out to about 67 cents in claims paid for every dollar of premium collected. That's the standard rule. Anything less than that means a bad deal for the customer. For USCCA, as one example, they should be paying out at least $200 million in claims every year. I don't think there are enough self-defense cases that this would even be possible. I can't find any evidence that any of them have ever paid ANY claim. The odds say that claims would be extremely rare, and the policies would exclude practically all chance of them making a payment.

[@ROCKHNTR]

Ended my membership after reading more into it. It’s just a insurance company that will find a way to not pay. Seems like they are more interested in $ than helping

[@FestusHaggen]

How about if a USCCA member is wrongly convicted in trial? Does the USCCA initiate an appeal and represent the plaintiff during the appeal? Or does USCCA just write the plaintiff (a USCCA member) off due to being convicted and send the member a bill to recoup expenses for the original trial that resulted in an incorrect verdict?

[@reroan2670]

I called and canceled recently. Their "retenstion specialist" was a clueless, soft-spoken girl who was trying to talk over me the whole call. I'm 30 F, I have patience, but a simple 3-4 minute call turned into 20 minutes of her basically calling me dumb for not seeing the recent email "personally written by the ceo," about changes to their policies. Sure, he wrote it, but pushing out a mass email chain isn't personal. They're floundering. It was just a joke, glad I canceled.

[@stephanie_beth]

That, my friends, is why I joined a defense fund, not an insurance company.

[@khatdubell]

One intelligent person here, at least.

[@920WASHBURN]

Tell me more

[@LanternOfLiberty]

Please expound?

[@bmp112]

I’d love to hear more about this, not a member of USCCA myself because when I first heard of them their terms left a bad taste in my mouth, I’m currently a US lawshield member, but if they have similar problems and you have a good alternate I’d be interested in looking it over.

[@LanternOfLiberty]

@@stephanie_beth Thank you. I respect Mr. Ayoob and I will definitely look into it. 🙂👍

[@danieldefense3825]

I’ve canceled my USCCA subscription just now

[@Mojo32]

Honestly these explanations made me even more apprehensive about joining. Unfortunately.

[@richsrides8204]

OMG! Glad I didn't pull the trigger on this coverage!

[@jimflowers6455]

The 3rd and 5th points (can't cover "illegal" acts and recoupment if you plead, or are found, guilty), are in my educated OPINION (as a licensed attorney for over 30 years), not correct. It is true that you cannot insure an illegal "act." BUT, posting bail, and mounting a defense against a criminal charge, ARE NOT "illegal acts." The 6th and 8th Amendments of our Constitution provide for bail and a legal defense. The most guilty defendant ever is entitled to bail and a vigorous defense, and providing them is not an "illegal act." I am doubtful of this spokesman's credibility.

[@devonsimmons1631]

I don't know what the membership costs are but to me it sounds more beneficial to just keep an attorney on retainer.

[@seanezell4159]

If you know the laws in the state that you reside in, you don’t have to worry about having any kind of insurance to protect you in the event you have to take a human life in self-defense. These people are in it just for the money. The big thing to remember is that most people unintentionally “incriminate” themselves while talking to investigators right after a self-defense shooting, and don’t even realize it. One thing to remember, when you call 911 to report the incident, tell the operator the location, and that you just shot an armed intruder, then hang up. Do not answer your phone when they try to call you back, because every thing you say is being recorded. Place your handgun on the kitchen table and leave it there. When the police arrive, they will ask you what happened. DO NOT discuss ANYTHING with them. Tell them your name, d.o.b., etc. for their initial paperwork, then tell them that you are going to cooperate 100% with the investigation, but only with an attorney present. Like your Miranda Rights says, “if you cannot afford an attorney, one will be appointed to represent you at no charge.”

[@bernardcohen3245]

This guy has convinced me that this company not to go with

[@bobstorey554]

I have been a member for many years. I enjoy you and Kevin discussing hypothetical scenarios and usually find them crystal clear. You muddied the water for me on this one on the being found guilty and what happens then. Do you drop me and go after my family for expenses or are you there for me on appeal?

[@farlesbarkley1022]

Check the definition of conviction in the policy, it's final non appealable conviction

[@kennylavay8492]

What you actually need is an attorney to read between the lines of what is and what is not covered.

[@AG-no1dq]

@@farlesbarkley1022 And then they can go for recoupment and you are screwed on top of being in jail.

[@farlesbarkley1022]

@@AG-no1dq yes if you commit a crime and plead guilty to that crime it may not be the best position for you at that time

[@farlesbarkley1022]

@@tonyl3762 You will have to be more specific. Is this in reference to the obstruction of justice, arson, fraud, identify theft, murder, one of the others...? IDK, I don't particularly care what happened with Giles. Should I? Fill me in on the deets

[@richardharris5819]

It's really hard to believe all this when ya have a California Business License.

[@tomoconnell2858]

I considered USCCA membership but decided to go with CCW Safe.

[@davidyoung9202]

This guy did not make me feel any better. I'm looking for another solution now.

[@joedoe7839]

We all know that you can be convicted and found guilty even if you are innocent. CCW Safe won't stop coverage because you were found guilty. They also won't seek to recoup funds spent on your defense. They cover you for appeals and for mistrials and retrials. I assume they are able to do this because they are a legal service membership plan, not an insurance plan.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@1watersthree Show me any evidence that any of them have ever paid a claim or defended anyone. If they were legit companies they should be spending hundreds of millions per year on self-defense cases. That isn't even possible. The whole industry is a scam.

[@johngori9477]

So, for clarity: (1) USCCA would not cover an appeal if their attorney fails to successfully defend the client even if there are obvious flaws in the court proceedings justifying an appeal? (2) If the best the USCCA provided attorney can do to defend you is ask you to accept a plea to a lesser offense and do shorter prison time you'll also get socked with a bill for his "services"? As a USCCA insured I ask these questions as someone who doesn't get involved in criminal activity, nor do I interject myself in other peoples' matters when out and about. So my most likely use of the insurance is after defending myself in my own home. It sounds like in the two cases above I would basically be either effectively uninsured or only partially covered. Correct?

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

For clarity, none of them have ever paid a claim and none ever will.

[@ELCLAVE300]

So would the USCCA explain what would have been the benefit if Kyle Rittenhouse had been a member?

[@AKA_MixMaster]

Should have been fully covered!

[@APHill-ip8qt]

Go with CCW Safe. You get what you pay for.

[@anthonydeveno9028]

Interesting video. I have a question about what can constitute probable cause when dealing with law enforcement. Here is the situation I was pulled over for failure to yield to a pedestrian. The officer who stopped me conceded that his vehicle obstructed my view. So I was not given a ticket he then asked me if have a gun in my truck which I said no. He then asked me why didn't I tell him I have my license to carry and I don't have a gun with me. I told him that I am not required to tell you I have a gun buy the states law. He then asked if he could search my vehicle and I told him no he doesn't have probable cause. He insisted that I should let him search if I'm telling him the truth about not having a gun in my truck I then asked him if can explain to me why he thinks he has reason to search my truck he said because I didn't mention I am concealed carry permit holder and didn't tell him I don't have a gun with me at the beginning I said no you may not search my vehicle you don't have probable cause and asked him if I could go which he let me

[@917Stefano]

@@TStheDeplorable This is an excellent explanation! Like you, I have been on both sides of these conversations, but I have never read such a clear description of things.

[@monzudihungadowski2161]

I had USCCA for two+ years. I dumped them for CCW Safe. Seems like I made the right choice.

[@USCCAOfficial]

Why do you say that, Monzudi?

[@GRIIIMMEDIA]

So if I lose my case I owe you money?... Yeah that doesn't sound sketchy at all.

[@RamathRS]

Of course they are going to say that anything opposed to their reputation is "not true". They are, first and foremost, interested in making money; not losing it. How about we get a third party to go over the detail, fine print, and actual case studies as an example?

[@Falconryder]

Third parties already did that posted their videos. That's why USCCA made this one as rebuttal.

[@farlesbarkley1022]

Tom Grieve is a third party. And you know what? You are too! Pull up the policies and compare them yourself. Pay particular attention to definitions, exclusions, coverage territory, and what covered expenses entail (example, defense expenses is far broader than simply lawyer fees) Let us know what you find

[@dieterludwig3006]

Yeah I got away from uscca as fast as i could. Fine details are just to fishy for me.

[@farlesbarkley1022]

@@dieterludwig3006 any detail in particular?

[@venz8201]

Be careful because the critique videos are often by law firms who are competing with the USCCA for business

[@veteranredbeard6222]

So nothing about recoupment? If you lose your case, will they have to pay the money back? Because CCW safe has no such clause. If anything, USCCA has an incentive to help you lose.

[@haywoodyoudome]

Of course they're not going to say anything about a client losing and being handed a bill on top of a jail sentence. That would have a negative impact on sales.....

[@timbango2090]

Except you guys did deny to cover someone before they was proven guilty. You people said they was guilty before taking it to court. And the judge and lawyer even said it was a good chance for self defence.

[@895austin]

This has confirmed all of the other videos I've watched. If the USCCA isn't the insurer, why buy a policy with them. So many loopholes they can use to wash their hands of your case and then come back at you for money that they paid in your defense. After you have paid them your membership fees.

[@USCCAOfficial]

UFCIC is contractually obligated to uphold its promise and provide coverage to members who have been involved in a lawful act of self-defense, which is defined by the policy as the act of defending oneself or others against an unlawful, unprovoked, and imminent threat of death or serious bodily harm. If a member, as a responsibly armed American, acts in this manner, coverage will be extended to them. The notion that the USCCA would drop someone simply because they were charged with a crime is 100% untrue.

[@johannk.2138]

Thanks for the info. I think I will look elsewhere. I don't want to be left hanging.

[@cyphonrider]

Recoupment clause: USSCA is the only carrier of 7 that I am considering that has a recoupment clause. That is the reason why they are out of the running for me personally.

[@TexasTuareg]

Should have been titled "Everything You Heard about USCCA is True." This video is absolutely bizarre. Seems to encourage looking for alternatives to USCCA.

[@NendoCrescendo]

We investigated ourselves and found we are 100% good

[@thereefaholic]

So your confirming that if a member is found guilty when he or she claimed self defense that the member must pay back the insurance company. Good to know.

[@daxschoenheide3387]

Only if you convicted of the crime.

[@thereefaholic]

Yes so if Rittenhouse was found guilty he would need to pay hundreds or thousands back to the insurance company.

[@deebee4575]

@@daxschoenheide3387 If you take a plea deal, you will be convicted of a crime.

[@Gwydion_Wolf]

Yes. which is the law no-mater 'what' Insurance company you chose has to do. It's either that, or they write off the expenses as 'charity', but that would put them in the crosshairs of Legal teams claiming they are 'bypassing' the law preventing anyone from having 'insurance' of a criminal act.

[@thereefaholic]

So it seems like there is an incentive for the insurance company to lose the case so THEY (not the attorneys) get all the legal fees back. The lawyers have an incentive to win because their record allows them to adjust their rates up. so it’s not a misleading claim it is 100% true. Regardless if it is law or not the statement is true. USCCA does NOT do memberships in NY because It violates NYS insurance law, seems like it also violates other states laws as well (if you lose). I think the self defense insurance is a great idea. But if the law allows requires you to pay back the money if found guilty that is too high of a rinks in todays political climate. You should NOT lose you ability to appeal because you happen to defend your self in a blue state with a blue jury.

[@barrybradley5995]

Yes, I have been a USCCA member for going on 3 years now, and I will most likely be switching to AOR very soon. Upon joining I never heard of these non coverage scenarios. I actually live in Arizona where AOR is located. What good would paying for coverage that when I need them the most I’m left assed-out?

[@donnellschweitzer8258]

I have had the elite level with uscca for almost 2 years. A friend told me about this crazy "loophole" that uscca will use to get out of paying for my defense if I am found guilty by a biased jury and an over influential jurer even though it was a self defense situation and an armed assailant. What about the coverage which uscca should provide me in my appeals process?????? Uscca, what ever happened to being innocent until proven guilty?????? The appeals process is included in this. Monday morning I will be cancelling my uscca membership immediately!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[@slsumf]

Me and my wife took a conceal and carry class about a month ago and signed up after the class, now that I've been doing my homework on these guys I told my wife I don't trust these people anymore, finding a new company.

[@coziii.1829]

I call bull on protecting people A woman shot through a door that her ex was trying to break through. She had platinum You all dropped her and lost case

[@TH-eb5ro]

I recently got a USCCA ad online. I then went to their FB page. Right away I became suspect as they have information that shows a conflict in what they do. We all need to call our insurance companies. My home insurance covers to a certain point. If you have an HOA or other business situation we need to discuss that issue with our insurance also. If we have a weapon we need to be researching attorneys also. There is one layer which is the legal issue after the event and then another should there be a civil action, and there often is one. USCCA posts things that are more like the NRA than something like Gun Owners for Responsible Gun Ownership. Psychologically it is fear based marketing. I think more people being properly trained and recurrent trained is a good thing and USCCA certainly helps with that area. One of the best classes I attended was free at my local Sheriff's Department, start there before you purchase a weapon. Some allow youth, teens to attend. The classes are neutral an do not endorse any one position or insurance thus allowing you decide yourself unlike these groups who motivate right toward their products. We owe it to ourselves to look for reviews and pros/cons and read the fine print, otherwise it is just marketing.

[@jameseb89]

I had this cleared up over the phone a while ago. I had to call because some clown on KZbin was saying that USCCA does not cover you if you are charged with a crime and only covers Civil suits. I read the contract and then called USCCA to be sure and they said that is incorrect. I’m glad you made this video because not everyone is going to investigate deeply into things like I did.

[@Badbri2A]

I also seen this video you talking about. And almost didn't renew.i wrote something about it in the community page,which I'm not good at and cont really figure that out..but never got any answers.so I'm glad I seen this video, and it some what cleared it up..

[@tommylee4135]

If USCCA wont cover their customer if found guilty, doesn't that give USCCA incentive for the customer to be found guilty?

[@Colt45.]

You answered my questions and I can tell you I'll be looking for some real coverage.

[@john091077]

I have read USCCA has a recoupment clause whereas other companies do not. Please explain.

[@danieles6684]

Do you publish your stats on the number of criminal cases you have handled versus rejected?

[@jimfields9217]

Everyone now is going for Attorneys On Retainer Program and I can understand why. City’s,County’s, States have become so anti GUN, it’s getting difficult to know all the laws. Hopefully USCCA will see that this is better and change to this format. Regardless of What happens WE need someone in our corner.

[@1oldbluesheepdog]

At 2"20....Regarding self defense; can you clarify " if the terms and conditions are met"?

[@exgenica]

Beginning with the segment at (01:20) "USCCA plan coverage stops with conviction." Okay...so what happens with all the fees and costs that occurred BEFORE conviction, but were either not billed to the defendant or not paid by the insurance company BEFORE the conviction. Are those pre-existing fees and costs therefore automatically excluded because there was a conviction? Does the insurance company try to recoup any costs etc it covered (bail, trial costs, etc) after a CONVICTION? What about coverage for any APPEAL? What happens during APPEAL? Is anything covered during and for an APPEAL process or does all that get STOPPED because of the CONVICTION? What about civil liability coverage after CONVICTION? Is any coverage listed for civil lawsuits also STOPPED after a CONVICTION due to the law?

[@MasonCatalone]

Should've put in a clarification regarding appeals. Some people think that USCCA will deny claims upon conviction if there is still a chance at an appeal.

[@danvote2441]

I agree, it is defined in the policy as a non-appealable judgment. I think he should have quoted the policy more so that people can reference it.

[@worldguy4528]

USCCA does deny claims if the case goes from civil to criminal. Don’t fall for this scam

[@willj487]

Im a licensed insurance agent of over 20 years. I appreciate the education, the insurance coverage is all but worthless. This video makes this abundantly obvious,, in their own words.

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

I was one, too. This stuff is the worst insurance I have ever seen that is still legal anywhere. The odds are about 1,000 to 1 that you will never have a covered event in your entire life. If you did, you would find out what the Primary Insurance clause says, first.

[@donh4750]

When I purchased my handgun I looked closely at USCCA and planned on purchasing a plan until I read the fine print.... They do not cover Washington State.... I live in Washington State. So I had to look for another company and found U.S. Law Shield that does have coverage in Washington State. I do watch and learn from the USCCA instructional videos on youtube

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

The odds are about 1,000 to 1 that you will never have a covered incident under any of them in your entire life. Ask any of them how much money they spent last year for self-defense cases. The answer is zero.

[@donh4750]

@@cliffordschaffer5289 I am covered under U.S. Law Shield

[@cliffordschaffer5289]

@@donh4750 The chances that you will ever get anything from any of them is zero.