5 Signs a Piece Is Just Too Hard for You...

[@karllegrand]

Or there is a signature "Franz Liszt" on the music score...

[@Sunkem1Not6Hacks]

Or a mysterious signature like Alkan. If you encounter that, take two steps back, turn around and run!

[@PianoTechSupport]

Or worse yet, if the title has [IMPOSSIBLE] in it and features Synthesia. Jokes aside, I do think Liszt should be saved for a later stage. Unless we are talking about Consolation or something, which are more approachable. Another composer that I think does just not have beginner friendly music is Ravel :D

[@katttttt]

@@PianoTechSupport Rush eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee😵😮😉

[@LisztenToMe]

Ravels prelude is a great piece that’s a bit easier and lovely

[@cadriver2570]

One golden rule I've come to is if I can sight read it at slow tempo, I'm ready to work on it in earnest. This is after years and years of joyfully reading through hundreds of scores. That hasn't failed me yet.

[@PianoTechSupport]

Good point:) I'm sure being able to sight read something means the patterns etc are all familiar to you, also that you can work with the rhythms, key signatures, structures etc. easily. Of course sight reading is superficial though. With slow tempo, even inexperienced pianists can sight read and make it through Chopins 10/2, but we all know that playing it is another story. I do still agree with your point overall though.

[@cadriver2570]

​@@PianoTechSupport Definitely agree. The caveat I left out is that knowing the repertoire well is also necessary to make that appraisal. 10-2 at speed is ridiculously difficult! To your point 10-1, 25-6, etc. are also readable... but actually performing them is something else entirely.

[@josecubela9642]

Yes, that is how i determine if I am ready for a piece or not

[@Piano_improvisations]

yeah but it depends because pieces with HUGE cords are way harder to sight read even though they are often a lot easier than pieces which are just single notes.

[@yeahrimxd1224]

I'm a cellist, but knowing your limits and where you are (level) is very important. I've been studying without a teacher for almost 5 years... this kind of things remind me how important it is to have a mentor, I hope I can get in a music school soon. Great video and advice, thank you so much!

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks! Absolutely agree about the limits. Know your limits before choosing repertoire, but don't be afraid to exceed them sometimes. But definitely, Never show your true limits in a performance is what I say 😂 all the best for getting into music school. I'm not a cellist but one advice generally I can give you for that too is, get lessons with people there privately beforehand.

[@dalcassian8351]

Very good points. Also I'd like to add if you approach it differently like you said winter wind you can change your thought processes so instead of thinking each individual note there are patterns. Clusters of notes you can learn and get into muscle memory. I'm self taught so can't play well but I know with training I'd be better but unfortunately years have gone by and I haven't got the drive anymore 😢

[@klippklapp3004]

I really enjoyed your thoughts and words about this topic. Thank you!

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks so much for always tuning in:)

[@clickz0r994]

started learning ballade 1 and my teacher didnt tell me to not learn it he just said he was impressed that i was learning it

[@bluemoon6625]

Thank you so much for this video, you speak a lot of sense. I think many beginners have this dilemma, especially people like me, who are learning piano by themselves, with no teacher to guide them. I love your statement that if someone attempts to play a higher level piece it could take 8 months to learn to play the piece "maybe poorly", but if they wait until their skills have grown they might be able to play the piece after 1 month. This really struck home with me. I have been using Alfred's All In One books, and am currently about 2/3 through book 2. I feel that the books give a decent grounding - what do you think of these books?

[@pedrocosta3311]

Great video! I really like your channel! Congratulations for your work 😊

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thank you so much!:)

[@Skullemojiiii]

Speaking of henle, I had to drop Schumann davidsbundlertanze(7) because after a month and half literally none of the dances (I had done 1-6) except maybe 2 sounded how I wanted them to and I was so frustrated. I then learned Chopin ballade 2(8) to good standard in a month, and then recently started Liszt Dante sonata(9) which is going pretty well.

[@fnsurg3395]

I am a cellist and I did exactly this when I was a teenager, learning pieces way too difficult compared to what I had already played, and it left huge gaps in my technique that I have had to slowly fill in over the past few years, it's kinda annoying when some techniques are super easy to other people around my level but I struggle because I never learned it correctly. I think having a teacher who can tell you no when you try to do something too hard (and suggest something easier) is super important.

[@pianoplaynight]

Tbf every single musician I know apart from people who had strict guidance from childhood fell into this trap one way or another. Myself included. It's really frustrating to look back on years wasted on trying to learn something obviously out of reach and learning all sorts of BS technique and tension in the process. I'd even dare say it's the n 1 adult beginner mistake.

[@adrianlui2779]

I think if you really want to learn a tough piece. You can learn it. I conquer one bar by one bar. Each bar play thousands of time until I can play it smoothly, then I go to the next bar. And practice every day (at least 1 to 2 hours). I self learn amd memorize Liszt's Love dream after 4 months of practice and I am only at grade 6. I never like memorizing a piece but this one is too tough not to look at the paino during the climax. I think a big jump actually save more time than playing many easiler piece before finally go for the one I like. My opinion is not that poplular though. I also think practicing scale everyday is wasting time. Just go to the piece you want to play it play it like playing sekiro. Yes I know my foundation is weaker. But playing the piece I like is the most important right? And I don't think it is not fun.

[@PianoTechSupport]

Yes absolutely it's possible to do this way, for example a beginner *could* learn Liszt b minor sonata, by looking at each bar every day and slowly figuring it out... but again just because they could, doesn't mean they should 😂 it makes for a nice long germ goal but not for a practical or recommended approach

[@Piano_improvisations]

@@PianoTechSupport yeah thats a bit hyperbolic but f.e. I jumped from river flows in you to rondo alla turca by mozart and it was okay and I had SO MUCH fun. I jumped from op 23 no 5 to hr no 6 and I had a lot of fun and now I am currently practicing paganini etude no 6 by liszt and I am doing pretty good. All these jumps are pretty huge in my opinion but I dont have a time limit so I dont care how long it will take me

[@Piano_improvisations]

@@PianoTechSupport I think you should also consider why people play the piano. If you just wanna have fun then you should play every piece you want if you have fun with it and dont hate it.

[@Sunkem1Not6Hacks]

Are there any signs that you have mostly developed all the finger strength you need for piano playing? That is to say, when do we know our technique is what is limiting us?

[@PianoTechSupport]

Great question. Finger stability or strength may be one aspect, so there are many more like appropriately positioning your wrists, how you use your forearms and your arms, shoulders, even back. Once you have figured the placements out of all of those, and you still cannot advance in a piece, maybe that is eventually the technical limitation that keeps you. But technique keeps growing for such a long time into the piano journey, even after 20 years of playing you can make small improvements. Key word is small, but there are always more efficient ways to do things. Efficiency means smaller or smarter movements that allow you to do things in speed, but still properly.

[@Sunkem1Not6Hacks]

@PianoTechSupport alright. Thank you for taking the time to answer my question.

[@pasadenaphil8804]

Very helpful video.

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks so much!!

[@nilskroehl]

Hi Do you have advices for Chopin 3rd Ballade? Especially the section near the coda in C-sharp Minor with the repeated chords in the right hand. I’m having a little trouble getting this up to speed. The section before with the repeating G-sharp is actually pretty forward and comfortable. And also with the pedaling in the main theme. What makes sense? The Henle Edition has weird marks I suppose 🤷‍♂️

[@EthanMillerPiano]

He has a video on the coda of ballade no 3 i’m pretty sure; he has them for all the ballades i think

[@EthanMillerPiano]

an another video i recommend for that is the tonebase piano masterclass with Michelle Cann. She gives insights on the whole piece and a lot of tips abt the coda.

[@PianoTechSupport]

Hi Nils! Thanks for commenting as always. Was just looking at the score, do you perhaps mean around 172... until 184 that part? I totally get it that it's "coda" feel but I think the coda is either later or doesnt exist in this Ballade so clearly (shhh :D) BUT yes that is indeed a difficult passage. The chords section from 173 onwards especially. Have you tried the following drill: playing only one note of the chord - then the rest notes that follow, but whenever you have a chord, just playing the top note alone of it. Then, after some time, playing 2 notes (so that would be a third), with the in between notes too. Then, playing the whole chord plus the inbetween notes. That is a possible drill for this section, layer by layer. About main theme pedal: I use Ekier which does not have many pedal markings. Indeed the whole thing is to be played mostly finger legato and pedalling as a glue wherever the legato sounds too thin. I just tried it and I half pedal + change almost on every note or two notes. Once it goes to bar 9, its more simple and basically bar per bar, or twice per bar. 14 the octaves of course not.

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks Ethan, and good shout about the tonebase video:)

[@wiktord9264]

This whole ballade is about using your wrist correctly to play those quick octaves. Once you learn the technique, the piece shouldn't be much of a problem. Think about jumping onto the first octave with your wrist down and then snapping it up while pushing the fingers down for the repeated octave. This saved me so much pain.

[@Jman008ful]

Useful advice! But I would suggest get a better mic, sound a bit muddy this time

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks for the feedback:)

[@thisismoyukhsworld2022]

Sir, have you ever tried to memorise and sightread Godowsky's Studies on Chopin Etudes????

[@PianoTechSupport]

Hello, yes since I have performed a few Chopin Godowsky etudes, I learned and memorised those pieces:)

[@santiagolara992]

Hello... I would be very thankful if you give me an advice, I'm learning french suite no.4, it's one of the easier ones, and Chopin prelude no.1, and my next goal it's to play Partita no.3, I thought about English suite no.2, but the eye test tells me that the suite it's more difficult, idk, and a recommendation, you could make a video about exercises and approach to vertical harmony, how to balance all the notes of a chord, like Rach op23 no10, or Chopin Prelude 4, that looks easy, but the action of the notes all at the same time, it's very hard

[@PianoTechSupport]

Hi there! Certainly ill try to help out. So about your repertoire choice first of all that sounds nice. Have you thought about playing for example the first 8 Chopin preludes as a bundle? I find playing just one or two makes for a less logical experience. There are sort of natural sets that people perform or learn when they don't want to play all. For example 13-18, 19-24. Or 1-8 is good too. English Suites are hard(er), but not so much than Partitas. It's up to your preference. The video suggestion about Voicing of chords is a great one and one I wanted to make for some time, I'll write that down. Thanks :)

[@faqenz3902]

mah boy keeping the good boy posture

[@PianoTechSupport]

😂😂😂

[@Random.pianist]

Great video! I have questions, is it okay to rely only on muscle memory ? If a piece is too difficult for me, what to do to make it slightly easier ?

[@PianoTechSupport]

Hi there! So.. muscle memory is kind of like the sugar in your diet, it works fast, gets digested fast.. but you don't want to rely on it alone right. You need a mental map of the piece, which can be done through a structural and harmonic analysis (this can be done very simply, or in a full extent, depending on your preference. ) but never rely on just that. To your other point : depends what makes that difficult, because there's no such thing as making it really easier..right? You can make the piece easier on yourself, for example by: slowing down the tempo (not playing a tempo speed) , or, by for example splitting notes and chords, runs etc into both hands. Just keep in mind that this is a compromise of some sorts. About practice though: you can make it easier on yourself by changing the bite size that you take when you practice. Have realistic goals and expectations is my recommendations. Start very slowly and try to grasp 100% of dynamics, articulation, and everything else, before you try to increase tempo.

[@Random.pianist]

@PianoTechSupport I really have doubts about the responsiveness across different pianos (especially between acoustic and digital pianos), I have a digital piano, and when I played on an acoustic piano, the playability felt somehow easier.

[@calebolanpianist]

I was actually thinking about this the other day. I started learning Scriabin Fantasy op. 28 and was wondering if it is too much of a jump. I’ve played about half of Liszt’s Transcendental Etudes, a couple of the medium Chopin Etudes (Ocean, Revolutionary, etc.), and some easier ravel pieces. The only thing is that I’ve never played Scriabin before. Personally I don’t think it is too much of a jump but I want to hear your expert opinion lol.

[@santiago621]

@@calebolanpianist not him but i've worked on his 4th sonata, please work on at least a couple of etudes and preludes. he writes in a very unique way and the technical challenges are often very similar across different pieces. op 8 no 12 might be good to gauge scriabin left hand jumps/arpeggios

[@karolpiql]

@@calebolanpianist If you never played Scriabin it is not very good piece to start with IMO learn at least one etude op. 8 and at least two preludes op. 11

[@PianoTechSupport]

Thanks for the comment. Sorry it took a while. So I think your technique sounds good, quite decent. Scriabin.. op 28 as your first piece, that's tough. I would've thought some preludes, Op. 8 etudes then some 42, perhaps sonata 3 or 4, and then you have a good grasp of it. I think even for Scriabin, that opus isn't easy to get. Do you have to perform it for a certain occasion or is this a free choice? If you don't have to play it, I say do something else first.

[@calebolanpianist]

@@PianoTechSupport So I do have to play it in April. It is a requirement for my school that I play. I could have picked a different piece but the reason I decided to pick this piece was bc it’s my senior year of high school and I wanted to try a piece that's beyond my comfort zone. I can play almost the whole piece pretty accurately in terms of notes and I plan to spend the next 4 months refining the small details and getting it performance-ready. I brought this piece to my teacher thinking she’d shoot it down for it being too hard but surprisingly she said it's not and I’m currently working on it with her so I guess it’s not totally out of my reach. Idk that’s just my thoughts on it.

[@polymath6475]

​@@calebolanpianistthe first 12 etudes of op8 are great, but I recommend one or two Scriabin sonatas before going on, as his other works are extremely demanding. I have a book of sonatas, but still can't manage them even after all these years (I'm 50 and play a majority of Ch etudes, plus many from S op8)

[@Piano_improvisations]

tbh I think if you don´t have a time limit, you should play whatever you want tbh (except like starting with la campanella or from river flows in you to mephisto waltz. F.e. when I op 23 no 5 was my hardest piece, I wanted to play hr no 6 and I did it and that is a HUGE jump. I also did a jump from river flows in you (after 1 year of playing the piano) to rondo alla turca. Playing the piano is about fun and so what ever is fun for you, you should play it. I played hr no 6 and it was pretty hard and it took me a while and now I am currently playing minute walzer (way easier than hr 6) but also at the same time grandes etude de paganini no 6 which is a pretty big jump but I actually do pretty okay.

[@polymath6475]

define: "River flows" and "hr 6" I cannot understand you even if I ask AI for help

[@javiercmh]

If you're really stubborn, playing a piece that's too hard for you can be very rewarding. I learned Chopin's first étude op 10 during a whole year, following Paul Barton's videos and improved a lot! Because instead of just learning the piece, which was maybe too difficult, I learned variations in increasing levels of difficulty until I could play the full thing. For example, one of the variations sounded like Bach's prelude in C, but following the chord progression of the étude. Have fun practicing!

[@PianoTechSupport]

Yessss.. so, I half heartedly agree with your comment, because I think every pianist in his life has or will have to climb that one / those mountain of a piece that's way harder than the ability. But if we look at it neutrally... this doesn't make for a truly long term efficient way to improve. Still, I get it!