$529 Manual Espresso VS $450 & $3000 Espresso Machines - Flair 58, Gaggia Classic Pro & Lelit Bianca

[@KyleRowsell]

Are you interested in the non-electric flair 58? Which device would you choose?

[@Anthony0855]

@@KyleRowsell is there any specific scales that are good for making coffee or will any scales work

[@eihabmahmoud]

Where is the code for the giveaway? I watched the video twice to double check, and it is no where to be seen!

[@Nathan-kw2hs]

@@peterabel1057 want to know this as well, doesn’t seem to be specified anywhere

[@KyleRowsell]

@@eihabmahmoud it’s there! Watch the upper left corner of the video in the second half of the vid.

[@dhletro]

@@KyleRowsell yes it's there!

[@davidlyons6235]

Some people complain about the work going into getting a cup of espresso with a manual machine but they never consider how much easier they are to clean and maintain.

[@lor7780]

Yes but if you want milk steaming manual machines become unsuistainable for someone that has a routine

[@davidlyons6235]

@@lor7780 if routine is your only concern I disagree. The routine just changes.

[@lor7780]

@@davidlyons6235 not if you don't have much time. With a lever machine you need to heat the water manually, then heat the milk, then froth it with an inferior method compared to traditional steaming.

[@davidlyons6235]

@@lor7780 it's still a routine though. You didn't specify time.

[@davidlyons6235]

@@lor7780 as far as inferior frothing methods, be specific. Texture or art? I know flavor is not an issue. The Dualit should be sufficient and easy and quick to clean.

[@brusdaar]

One thing I haven't heard anyone mention is the fact that with an espresso machine needs to be maintained weekly with descaling and cleaning. It seems like with the flair, all you need to do is rinse everything out and you're done. For that reason i've been leaning more towards getting a flair over a normal espresso brewer.

[@truckerallikatuk]

Depends on your water really. With good water, you don't need to descale that often at all, just rinse out and clean.

[@brusdaar]

@@truckerallikatuk that's interesting. I'm not sure how good or bad the water is here. But, I didn't like the idea of having to descale with a chemical all the time. Some of the videos I saw while researching suggested that you should clean and descale weekly which seemed excessive.

[@LivingRad]

amen. Literally in the middle of cleaning my gaggia as I type this lol

[@김천재-c9j]

I got Bezzera Unica. The espresso tastes amazing. I use bottled water from super market. One time cleaning per week is not that bad as long as you can taste awesome cafe at home.

[@LivingRad]

@@김천재-c9j agreed

[@brianharder7714]

Good review. I just bought the Flair 58. Should be here this week. This will be my step up from the ROK. As for the steam issue, I think unless you are doing latte art, heating the milk via microwave or stove top and then using a whipper will do the deed just fine.

[@donh1572]

Love, love, love, my flair! Blows away my Rancilio Silvia and my flair isn’t even the 58mm model. Who would have thought espresso technology would improve by going manual. Looking forward to 58 vs Robot challenge

[@KyleRowsell]

Can’t wait to share more about it.

[@isaiahstruve2224]

Mannn I hear this. My Silvia is really frustrating.

[@abueloraton]

@@isaiahstruve2224 The Sylvia is not consistent, right? Is the problem its high pressure pump plus its high water temperature?

[@isaiahstruve2224]

@@abueloraton It can be consistent, but its tough. The pressure is a little too high sometimes. And the temp is REALLY high for espresso in my opinion.

[@abueloraton]

@@isaiahstruve2224 But the Flair is also a nightmare, isn't it? Its process and its liw temperature make it very limited, don't they? I doubt if it's truly worth it.

[@thedamnbored]

Your vibe in your videos is so much more relaxed and confident, and i feel like you are really coming into your own. I love the latest videos, and i appreciate your effort and professionalism.

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks friend. Glad you liked this video.

[@alexlazaridisf.7276]

Had the Gaggia for 6 months. Loved it. Had a PID installed and an OPV. Made great espresso. Upgraded to a machine with flow profile later, but remember the Gaggia fondly - my first machine, what an adventure in learning.

[@KyleRowsell]

I Love this!

[@Jallak-h9g]

@@KyleRowsellsa go

[@The_Loathsome]

Just got the Flair 58. I’m blown away at the easy it makes rather outstanding espresso.

[@yasirisfernandez1802]

Your enthusiasm perfectly mirrors all us coffee heads! Great content!

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks!

[@SWatchik]

Just sat down with a coffee and opened youtube... Perfect timing! ☕ For me the Flair would be my choice. I make one coffee a day, and manually grind my beans so I'm happy with a slower overall process and enjoy the interaction when making a brew. Also I never have milk drinks so easy choice!

[@KyleRowsell]

Wonderful! Thanks for sharing.

[@grrothman]

I was literally just debating with a buddy whether he should get the Gaggia or Flair for his first espresso machine. Thanks so much for this content!

[@Red.exe7]

What did he get?

[@gregwhyte7398]

I've literally been making this exact decision recently. What a timely video. Thanks

[@chrisflammger8320]

Dude, I bought the flair pro 2 as my first machine. I really like it but then like a week after I got the machine flair announced the 58 and I really want one :( chasing Temps on the flair pro 2 is my life and I t seems that would be so much easier on the 58 with it preheat settings.

[@gustavomaeda9448]

Me too

[@zekecoscolluela8985]

I'm more focus on manual brewing right now, winning the flair 58 would be a great addition and help on my coffee journey 😍😍

[@KyleRowsell]

Good luck!

[@zekecoscolluela8985]

🤞🤞🤞

[@Roman-ur4dt]

I have the Pro2 and I love it, even though it does have some flaws which the 58 seems to address. Regardless of the flaws, what I love most about the Flair is how quickly I can get an espresso shot out. I have a thermopot on standby so I can get hot water instantaneously. I heat the brew head on the stove while I grind and tamper the shot. Clean up is ridiculously quick - dump the waste, rinse out the basket and the shield and you're done. I can make a latte in 7 minutes including clean up. For the milk I use electric frother with manual temperature control which yields surprisingly good foam.

[@Hectorogents]

What kind of frother do you use?

[@Roman-ur4dt]

@@Hectorogents breville milk frother. I mention it in the video on my channel about making lattes.

[@cheesychester9647]

Big fan of your channel. I'm deep into pour over now, but no experience with espresso. Started this coffee journey 9 months ago w/ a Hario Skerton grinder, random cheap scale and kettle from Amazon, and just a V60. Now I have a Fellow Ode w/ SSP burrs, Clara French press, EKG kettle, Stagg XF, 2x V60's, Acaia Pearl scale, Aeropress, 2x Atmos containers, and some fancy drinking glasses. Spent too much money on coffee this year, but I'm happy to have a hobby during these tough times to keep myself busy. I think the Flair 58 would be a great start for espresso for me since I'm guilty of upgrading all my stuff within months of use. Thanks for the great content Kyle! Keeping an eye out for that code word too.

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks for the comment Jacob!

[@ShaunPanzer]

This wasn’t mentioned by anybody in the comments but I think the Flair 58 is more attractive than the other machine and I’d rather see that on my counter .

[@jisink]

Kyle, love these comparisons you're doing. In the Flair 58 vs Cafelat Robot video, you mentioned the strong clarity of the Flair 58 vs the complexity and gooeyness of the Robot. How would a Gaggia Classic Pro with PID and 9-bar spring compare tastewise?

[@stuffnuns]

Been making my espressos at home with the Flair Classic for several years, and I am able to get amazingly good pulls almost everyday, I’ve had a Breville and an Estro, and the Flair, with in a day or two, I was getting better pulls than either machine. The 58 is a work of beautiful industrial art.

[@bencops]

Can you buy espresso ground coffee to use in the flair classic or will you also need to buy a grinder ?

[@davidlyons6235]

@@bencops the same rules apply to the Flair as all espresso machines. Sure, you can use pre-ground coffee but freshly ground is superior. It's really up to you.

[@skyking9248]

@@bencopswhy? If money is the issue the newer economically friendly grinders on the market today are in abundance. Varia Lagom mini Ode Comandante etc etc. The thought of pre ground coffee makes me a little sad.

[@ChinmayH]

Ordered the flair after weeks of research. Yes seeing you and James Hoffman all day for weeks 😂. I am excited that this will give me control on temperature, pressure, 58mm portafilter and easy to clean and maintain. Yes it’s expensive but at this price range could not find anything that checked all my requirements. I saw how to mod gaggia for temp control and did not feel comfortable opening up a $450 machine. Getting a sette 270 based on your recommendation, I do have the C40 grinder but looking at a quicker way to grind.

[@nobodyspecialjusteric]

GCP is foot in the door machine. I paired with 1z jx-pro, perfect as a budget conscious first timer can get. Gonna save my gramma's Christmas dough toward an electric flat burr grinder before i consider outgrowing the classic.

[@mercury15316]

The non-electric version sounds really interesting. Thanks for this great video once again. I hope the distribution chains and retailers will have this available soon in Europe too.

[@baskloet8834]

I love my Silvia with PID and mods, and it works great for me. But when it comes down to pure beauty in both form and engineering, I'd pick the Flair 58 in an instant

[@JohnWick-wm4pd]

Thank for posting this video!! All the reviews, I’ve read Gaggia, I would not want to take a chance on getting a used or a lemon.. The 58 is a little pricey but a lot less of a chance of it failing.

[@zorqis]

So relevant picks. Commenting after the video came up a second time. I agree the first thing to know is if someone likes light/medium/dark roasts, and what flavors. Then choose a grinder: a good conical like the Niche w/ Mazzer/Gorilla burrs or the better manuals (Helor, Bplus, 1Zpresso, Comandante etc) - or a good flat burrs machine w/ SSP red or coated Ti burrs. Then, depending on your puck preparing skills and frothing needs, choose an espresso machine. For me, the ability to completely control the pressure profile, and not having to pay for rotary pumps makes direct manual lever machines a preferred choice. Temperature was an issue with the Flair Pro (but not an issue with dark roasts), but the Flair 58 addressed that, albeit in a rough manner (I'd prefer more temperature levels on the controller). As with the Flair Pro, maybe it's wise to wait for the 2nd version of the 58, but this already looks near-perfect to me. The Flair Nanofoamer takes care of the milk. The total cost of the Flair 58 + Nanofoamer + Lunar + Stagg is about the price of a decent midrange espresso machine and half of the Bianca (which looks way much better, I have to admit). As for back to back shots, I don't see why it would be slower than with the Bianca, it depends, but I take your stance on it, the setup and the workflow is simpler with the Bianca.

[@eduardomedrano520]

Thank you for the video! I was exactly deciding between these 2 machines and because of your explanations I decided to buy the GAGGIA Classic Pro and am very happy with it! Thank you once again, keep up the good work!

[@classicrockonly]

I'm set on the 58. However, my dad has been wanting an espresso maker in this price range and he is waffling between both these units. One thing he is most interested in is if the 58 will be less maintenance (no backflush, no descaling, no replacing shower screens), then the 58 might be his choice, even if the lever is more inconvenient than pressing a button

[@johnsmithington3167]

You're using the flair on a daily basis?

[@classicrockonly]

@@johnsmithington3167 Yup! Been using the 58 2x a day since I got it, and did the same when I was maining the Pro and the Classic...I think this is 4 years of Flair for me lol

[@chipkk7868]

Love your approach to coffee and honesty in reviews. I can make my decisions for equipment and procedures based upon your singular videos. I recently purchased a distribution tool to improve my puck compression. All that and your videos are just fin to watch.

[@KyleRowsell]

Ah this means the world. Just trying to make coffee a little bit more approachable. Glad you feel I’ve done this.

[@michaelfree3308]

I like both. I think I would pick the Gaggia. For around $300-$400 you can mod it to include a PID, flow control, and pressure gauge to get a similar control with the Flair. Plus, you would have the ability to steam. Those are things you can add whenever you feel like it and your budget allows. The Flair is definitely cool. I would love to have both, but if I could only pick one it’d be the Gaggia for ease of use.

[@chojuj4533]

If you buy the components yourself, not a kit, it would cost a lot less too

[@LastAphelion]

Your content helped me decide to buy a flair 58, thank you so much. I put off buying an espresso maker for yeeeears because I saw what the rabbit hole was like, didn't want to drain my bank account at the time, but didn't to waste 100s of dollars on a machine that was going to frustrate me and that I really wasn't in love with. Fast forward to now, I was thinking about the Mara X, but then I saw the Flair 58. I want to explore outside my coffee comfort zone and expand my palate and be able to perfect lighter roast shots hence my need for pre-infusion and pressure profiling. The Mara X would have been an additional 300 for the flow control. I was considering the ECM Classika which included flow control out of the box for 1600 but then the wait for steam not being a HX... D: I realized at those price points I wasn't fully in love with either nor did I really want to wait for pre-heating times and steaming down times back to back. For less than a third of those prices you get a machine in the Flair that gives full pre-infusion and pressure control, something that not even every machine worth 1000s can even do out of the box. I'm going to spend the coming year with my Flair to find out if I'll hate myself for not getting a semi-automatic, or if I'll want to go with a beautiful lever like the copper Elektra, or maybe I'll never want another machine after this? Can't wait to find out :)

[@azimiimran]

How’s it going so far with the flair?

[@christophert320]

I picked up a Gaggia Classic for $40 that was listed as non-working which only needed a gasket seal and some pretty intense descaling. I really want to mod it but I know that I'm going to want more features even when I'm done. Probably going to end up selling it as well as my Silvia and then I'll pick up a 58 and a Bellman preowned.

[@therealghost2178]

That puck distribution is on point for sure!

[@EricMacam]

Adding a bellman stovetop steamer for about $100 is a great option to add to the Flair 58 for those milk drinks.

[@eviesyd]

May I ask then why not a la pavoni ? I am a bit confused …

[@anderslinder9623]

During the last work-from-home-year I have been really trying to max my AeroPress-experience - now using the Joepresso and NanoFoamer every single morning (along with a C40-grinder). Wanting to upgrade but couldn’t choose between the flair pro2, robot and a la pavoni.. and then the 58 came and made the decision even harder, and now you add in a non electronic version in the mix 😄

[@michaelcousineau6734]

It's incredible how much better you have gotten delivering content since the last year. Inspiring stuff. Keep it up dude.

[@KyleRowsell]

I appreciate that!

[@skyking9248]

I know this video is old, but while I was waiting a few months for my espresso machine to be built / delivered, I gambled on Gaggia GCP for a temp machine. RETURNED it the very next day. All plastic internals. I left mine on for about 40 minutes as I was setting it up, pulled a few shots and something melted internally. Hot water everywhere. Average people love and defend what they buy generally, because it somehow becomes an extension of their ego. How many people have you heard raving about their GCP or their Niche grinders…..

[@TheEnubis]

Excellent video. One thing I'd like to add that I feel didn't get enough attention is the Flair's (a most good manual expresso machines) ability to save a shot by adjusting the pressure and time you are putting into the shot for the extraction. I feel like I have a lot more flexibility in what I am doing with my Flair. It's an amazing entry point for espresso in the sense that you get to really learn a lot more by being very involved in the creation of the shot.

[@destinhinton4687]

I just ordered the Flair58x for our first espresso machine. I paired it up with a Niche Zero. Conveniently both are scheduled to ship in January. Late Christmas present for the wife.

[@frangeech]

How are you liking the Flair 58X and what made you go for the cordless model?

[@LivingRad]

Nice video. I always love the quality of your content. Maybe the cost is similar but hugely different styles of machines with vastly different features. One thing I keep hearing from people is when entering into espresso it becomes a hobby not just a coffee. It takes work to make good cups of coffee and various tools like grinders, tampers, and accessories to help take it to the next level. For this comparison is really becomes a question if you want to make milk drinks. If Yes go with Gaggia..simple as that. If you are just getting into the coffee scene there is tons of room to grow and resale is pretty good to when you want to upgrade you can quickly and easily ORRR if you want you pick up other more specialty machines like the F58 to accessorize your coffee bar.

[@duffyrides]

I have an older Gaggia Classic but i am looking for other options, including the Flair. Thanks for this video!

[@joshuahankey]

Thanks for this video! maybe I missed it, but I don't think you ever said which one tasted better?

[@wojtekmalinski5181]

Great review. Did you consider comparing Flair 58 vs La Pavoni? Both are manual machines should make interesting comparison…

[@sebas9504]

Great video, Kyle! It’s awesome you could partner with Flair on this giveaway. On the note of milk drinks and the Flair, it’s worth mentioning that you could buy a cheap milk frother for a few extra bucks. Sure, you won’t get the microfoam needed to make latte art, but it’ll work. Or you could spend some more money on something like the nanofoamer. So lack of a steam wand isn’t necessarily a deal breaker, you’ll just need to spend a tiny bit more to replace it :) P.S. I am a Flair fanboy

[@FlairEspresso]

NanoFoamer makes a great companion as well!

[@pshing0304]

Thanks for your video. I have been considering between them as well. At the price point they are very similar. The main consideration is whether I want the ability to pull back to back, or the fun of manual profiling. For the classic it’s no doubt I will keep on modding it for fun, so it’s another couple of hundreds to go😆

[@rjejames28]

Flair is better I promise

[@OdPlomp89]

Bring back dancing Kyle! Plus great comparison 😍😍

[@KyleRowsell]

Now it‘a considered dancing? That escalated quickly!

[@evolv.e]

I buy choice coffee beans, hand grind, weigh, use WDT needle & OCD distribution, tamp firmly, top with a puck screen, and time my Third Wave Water extractions through a preheated portafilter. Overall, I enjoy my cups of espresso and feel that I can pull the same shot consistently. That said, I am interested in purchasing either a Gaggia or Delonghi super automatic so it’s easier for my wife to make a great cup of milk drinks with ease, but have had some reservations about how well a super automatic will compare with a puck I’ve prepared myself. I’d love to see a comparison video between either a Gaggia Cadorna Presige or a Delonghi Dinámica Plus (or a Magnifica Evo Latte Crema) vs. a similarly priced semi automatic vs. a full manual prepped set up. I have a feeling that the finished product will still be in favor of the manual prepared set up, but as there is something to be said for convenience, I’d like to be surprised and know if a coffee connoisseur felt that a super automatic was able to come close, though, I imagine the main advantage will still remain with milk drinks prepared with a steam wand. *If* one we’re looking for a balance between convenience, ease of use, and making great milk drinks, I’d love to know what super automatic machine is currently doing a good enough job to still satisfy someone who appreciates the outcome of careful puck preparation and extraction. Thanks!

[@GoTellJesusSaves]

I really wish that more manufacturers who are already producing espresso machines in their own factories would produce some manual brewers at very nice prices.

[@Solarez]

The flair looks so nice! I need a expresso machine 😫

[@KyleRowsell]

Good luck on the giveaway!

[@LloydJosephVentura]

Just saw your video. I like how you explain the full details on both espresso maker. This helps me a lot because I was confused if I am going to buy a manual Flair 58 or an espresso machine that has the same price as 58. Now it's all clear to me that I am going to choose Flair 58. Am I still valid for the giveaway? HAHAHAHAHAHA. That would really help me start my pop up coffee shop again. I just don't have enough money yet, but even a used Flair 58 would help me start my small business again. Thanks Kyle! Hope that you will see this comment soon. Thanks

[@xPho3niix]

Yesss. It's always a good day when that notification pops up.

[@CalebsCars]

I have a flair neo and a gaggia, absolutely love my setup

[@1967davidfitness]

Hi Kyle, l really enjoyed the video and would like to invest in a great grinder, but my budget is limited to about 200 USD. Is this enough? Have you got a tip? Many thanks

[@SasanSB12]

Can't wait for the comparison video to the cafelat robot!

[@KyleRowsell]

Can’t wait to share it!

[@rbmanb]

Having Flair 58 paired up with LP would be more interesting, since it's lever to lever.

[@rebeccahansell4917]

I am new to the espresso scene and am excited to explore the potential to create on the Flair. 😃

[@KyleRowsell]

I’m excited FOR YOU!

[@rebeccahansell4917]

@@KyleRowsell wait... what....

[@KyleRowsell]

@@rebeccahansell4917 I mean, if you were to win.

[@rebeccahansell4917]

@@KyleRowsell don't toy with my emotions... I've been saving my pennies and holding my breath for a Niche Zero to become available too

[@ezzy_cyclops1117]

I would choose the Bianca ... And I did. Mine arrives in 2 days. Nice video, thanks

[@richardrandolph9794]

Great video! I'm definitely for the Flair 58

[@benbauer7866]

I just feel like having the steam wand just makes the Gaggia more appealing.

[@mkcello33]

Can you maybe review a Classic Lever machine, like the La Pavoni Professional. They are quite affordable and in my opinion have huge potential, but you rarely see any well made content about them

[@RonDevito]

OK, I'm coming in here after two years, but it's till relevant.... For milk steaming with a Flair, you can use a Bellman SS50 stovetop steamer. On a 5,000 BTU flame, it's good to go in 17 - 18 minutes. I see no difference waiting for this stovetop steamer, than waiting the same time for the Gaggia to heat up. Using the Bellman now with a Bialetti Brikka Moka pot in which I brew 70/30 Robusta/Arabica blends. I use a WTD and fill the Brikka's boiler with boiling water from a standard kettle, so I'm already following a manual espresso-like workflow. I would agree with Mr. Rowsell that if you are pulling multiple shots back to back, the Flair is not optimal for that. You're probably in double boiler machine land for that application.

[@andreavon5929]

Great video Kyle, probably would choose the Bianca, but would like to play with the Flair 58 it looks really gorgeous and I don’t really drink milk base drinks, but the Bianca because of the flow profile and the Flair for the lever machine experience!✌️

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks for sharing friend!

[@peakproofuk]

Would you recommend a Flair 58 AND a Classic? I've had the famous Gaggia Classic / Iberital MC2 combo for over a decade and I love it but I fancy experimenting with Flair.

[@peterhunter3279]

I don't know if you realised but you used a different group handle for each machine, rather than the same one that you mentioned at the start of the video.

[@borzica]

I’ve been pondering this decision too! Thanks for the vid

[@KyleRowsell]

My pleasure!

[@od3n03]

I've been wondering about getting a Flair over a Chinese espresso machine. This video really helps!

[@KyleRowsell]

glad it helped!

[@rdalmasso7326]

Kyle would you do a video on the best ( and must have ) equipment to join it with the Flair 58 ? I am thinking about distribution tools, tempers and mat, filtrer basket maybe too, to kinda upgrade the flair 58. I should receive mine on July as many people and I never get into expresso at home so some suggestions about tools would make a great video I think !

[@leonard984]

I have a Flair 58 LE and a Kinu M47 Classic. I have all I need to make my shots!! I canceled my order for Profitec Pro 800. I don't drink any milk drinks. I have no maintenance, no water tank maintenance, etc... press it and forget it.

[@ozanaktar5743]

Hello I have the niche zero should I combo with bambino plus or gaggia classic pro evo? Tastewise for espresso shot Thankssss

[@jimjim930]

haha i ordered the pro2 right 1 day before the leaked product video came out.. tbh the pro2 is quite nice.

[@danielsoukup5734]

Flair 58 all the way. I can’t drink milk and don’t enjoy milk alternatives, so steaming is neither here nor there for me. I get good enough microfoam in my French press for those times the wife wants a latte. Manual brewers hit the sweet spot of cost and quality especially for someone on a tight budget (hello grad school!).

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks for sharing!!

[@floxshuilee1760]

After watching your last video about pro2 and 58, I bought a pro2 and love it.

[@KyleRowsell]

So glad to hear that.

[@jonathonaltmann4493]

Definitely still prefer the Gaggia. With the temp surfing and pre infusion hacks Lance Hendrick talks about there are many different hidden ways to brew coffee. Definitely looking forward to the PID mod eventually, my only real two gripes are 1 having to remove the drip tray to get a good spin on the milk (although you can get lower drip trays for them) and 2 having to dump the water in the boiler if you're steaming milk back to back. I've been playing a lot with altering brew pressure during the shot by way of the steam valve and temp surfing to get better brew temps. It's a sweet little machine.

[@atavax311]

One thing you didn't mention that I think is a big pro of the flair 58 is durability. It is not uncommon for people to spend big bucks on an espresso machine and kill it in less than a year with scaling. I'm a chef, the ability to tinker with the espresso to a greater degree than anything else remotely close to it's price is what compelled me to order one the day preorders became available. Not just pressure profiling either. You could infuse your water before heating it up, heat it up in a kettle and brew with it. Espresso brewed with rose water becomes a possibility.

[@clembert9370]

Nice video, can't wait for the next video !!!

[@KyleRowsell]

Can't wait to post it :)

[@jdupuis4829]

I have an espresso Forge which is similar to the Flair. I love being able to pressure profile, but the lack of temperature stability is a bit of downer.

[@KarstenLangPedersen]

An interesting "machine", that I wasn't aware of. Hopefully, they'll start producing it again, soon.

[@johnsmithington3167]

@@KarstenLangPedersen Not sure why you put quotes around machine. It is a manual machine, as are shovels, screwdrivers and pulleys. A device consisting of fixed and moving parts that modifies mechanical energy and transmits it in a more useful form.

[@KarstenLangPedersen]

​@@johnsmithington3167 I should maybe have written "contraption" because, though you are right, it's not what we normally associate with an Espresso Machine.

[@clintonherring]

I think the flair would work even for a milk based drink because you could have a separate frother which may save you on looking for a machine with a double boiler. My current home espresso machine really struggles to pull an espresso shot then heat up again to froth milk.

[@LivingRad]

Valid comment. The gaggia isn't perfect with that and is one down side for sure...plus steam power. There are a few hacks for that too tho :P Beauty of the Gaggia community ;)

[@thiagoorlandi2436]

Awesome video. I have jx pro but haven't really mustered up the courage to spend on an espresso machine. The distribution of funds aren't going in that direction yet 😜

[@KyleRowsell]

Fair enough!

[@RoloTomasie]

Great video. I'm hoping to get into espresso-making soon. I want a good grinder, but I can't justify the $1,200 the Niche Zero has been fetching lately. Do you (or any other viewers) have a recommended grinder in the $500 -or less- price range? Also, I somehow missed the codeword...

[@kyoshimadoshi]

Check out the Turin Df64

[@samcoffee5396]

df64 is 450 on amazon in us now

[@ende421]

Df64, Eureka Mignon SD, Lagom Mini or a hand grinder from 1zpresso.

[@jonathonaltmann4493]

I don't agree with the comment 'you can't adjust brew pressure while brewing' on the Gaggia. You can use the steam valve as a pressure relief valve (kind of) to adjust brewing pressure. It would be good to be able to put some kind of a Cameron gauge on the steam wand so you can get more of an idea about the pressure going through the group head.

[@ende421]

That way you're pumping even more cold water into the small boiler while extracting. That's poison for thermal stability. I just added a $11.54 dimmer to the pump of my Silvia. Works fine without the downsides.

[@jhomrich89]

I was thinking of a lapavoni as a lever machine to setup in my roasting space, but I think the flair will fit my needs and budget much better. I don't need a steam arm either because my main machine is a QM67 so if I want a latte I already have something

[@camaperture8116]

Solis Barista Perfetta kicks the Gaggia to the curb. 54mm pf, which I don’t think is such a big deal, but very nice accessories and works great out of the box. 40 sec heat time, ability to program in manual preferences, small footprint…awesome value price/performance.

[@ende421]

Technically the Gaggia and the Silvia are about on par. The Silvia feels much more solid, has an OPV, a bigger brass boiler (instead aluminum) and a separate hot water switch. It's 200 bucks more expensive though. Worth a thought. Both should be PID-modded IMHO. I have a PID modded Silvia for 15 years and a Niche. The Argos is ordered. Guess I'm ripe for a lever.

[@leumas75]

So, does there exist a mod community for upgrades to the Bezzera Hobby-01? I chose it over the Gaggia several months ago after a true hands-on, side-by-side comparison; it just seemed more capable, more durable, and more… me, whatever that means. But now I seem to be having more difficulty finding upgradables for it (a PID would be awesome, so would an OPV). Any help steering me in the right direction would be awesome. [Also, a little FYI - some of us espresso lovers / home baristas don’t have a choice but to stay clear of the manuals; I have sustained such heavy spine damage that I can neither lift my arm high enough to grab the handle (of a Flair, for instance) if it’s sitting at countertop height, nor do I have the strength the pull anywhere close to the right bar levels.]

[@MaggioRacinginc]

You warm it up for 15 minutes but you can still handle the porta filter. I’m confused sorry lol? Is it just to heat the machine up?

[@englishhuji]

Sorry, coming late to this conversation. Thank you for your wonderful service to the coffee community. I have a dilemma similar to the one presented here but with higher stakes machines. Something like the Elektra al vs the Bezzera Magica or even the La Marzocco LM. Taking everything into account, including costs and consistency, how do they compare?

[@galat1a]

i think for me the flair will be great: 1. I only drink espresso, no milk 2. Our water is hard and I want to avoid the cleaning process 3. I live in an area that the services for the electric machines is not accessible

[@jeromethemechanic6871]

Watching this while enjoying a smokey thick single origin 6 oz extraction via my trusty well worn imported Keurig.

[@yinyang592]

Thanks for sharing and giveaway.. what Gaggia bottomless portafilter i s the best to upgrade the machine espresso experience? Thanks.

[@CM-qg4zh]

If you prefer the flair 58 but want to make milk drinks, you could get the nanofoamer as an extra equipment to froth milk.

[@KyleRowsell]

Absolutely!

[@chef_and_coffee]

If I could afford a dual boiler machine I would get that but seeing as I already have a Signature Flair I'm not sure if I should upgrade to the 58. I really want to and I think it would pair great with my Kinu M47 Classic but I really like the shots I'm pulling now and feel I can still learn a lot about manual espresso. Maybe I'll just keep saving for something like a Linea Mini or something.

[@timmarshall4881]

Appreciate this very watchable video.

[@a-aron2276]

I don't fully agree with you on the gaggia, it's more like 3-5mins and my shots are proper consistent. Also was a barista myself with about 7-8years behind me. Just run the water through the portafilter for 30 seconds before you start extraction. If you're unsure if you're being consistent, stick an lcd temp sticker to your portafilter. Just work with the machine instead of bending it to your will. It's not commercial grade. I'd go gaggia any day of the week. Got my nice conical burr grinder so maybe that's most of the battle.

[@philipji]

Awesome video again Kyle!

[@axeldlt]

I am looking for a coffee maker that does not have plastic or aluminum in contact with the hot water, do you know if this machine meets that specification?

[@amanbeerkhanduja6490]

I've been considering the Gaggia Classic for a while now, and the Flair 58 is the only machine that's in competition to it for me right now. I hope I win the giveaway!

[@KyleRowsell]

Good luck!

[@halal959]

Great video! I am worried about about the very bendy table with such expensive equipment on though..

[@KyleRowsell]

You and me both!

[@CH-yp5by]

Your better off getting a pre 2014 GAGGIA classic and with the money you save you can mod it with a PID, Flow control dimmer mod and do the usual upgrades to the group plate and shower screen and in the end get substantially better results than a new machine for the same price.

[@ACDCphilipp]

Really nice comparison, i had always thought about getting myself a 9barista, just because i love the idea behind it... but a flair seems to let myself have more options and things to experiment with, when the espresso just isnt right to my taste... definetely joining the giveaway, ty for this kyle :D

[@angellingatjr1805]

Another great video, hoping to win that Flair 58, keep it up Kyle.

[@KyleRowsell]

Good luck!

[@danymeeuwissen5973]

I really get better espresso with my Flair's (Pro2 and 58) than on my semi-automatic ECM machines. throw in a nanofoamer for milky drinks and you have exceptional quality for a moderate budget. I agree a good grinder is needed to get the most out of it.

[@KyleRowsell]

Thanks for the comment Dany!

[@Assenayo]

Out of the 3 I would opt for a 58. I know someone that has a La Pavoni, I have a Flair Pro 2 and I'm totally converted on lever espresso. I'm keen to try some of the spring lever machines too like the Elektra Micro Casa or the Profitec Pro 800. I even have seen this Odyssey OE-1 on Hoon's channel that is in early development that will offer both spring and direct lever. But that looks like it's a while off. But for machines on the market, I think I would lean to the Flair 58.