8-Core Mac 🆚 AMD PC: Is the Windows Mini PC Era Ending?

[@theTechNotice]

Full video Why I'm doing the raffle 👉 kzbin.info/www/bejne/nGHFq6CEa8eii8k Enter the Competition here ✅geni.us/raffallM2 3 Lucky Winners: - Mac Mini M2 - Mac Mini M2 PRO - Intel 13600k *terms & Conditions apply

[@hasanmahmoodbabu7090]

Sir,,how are you... I think you are well anf good.... I want to be a freelancer.,. But i could not buy a pc.... If you give me one pc...i will start a fresh start...if you have possible to give me new mac mini or any kind of pc like powerful mini pc

[@nickdedidis7589]

The elephant in the room is the pricing . Here in europe you can get the um690 barebones , two 4tb ssd drives for a total of 8tb of storage thats btw way faster than the mac mini , 64gb 5600 ram , which is quite a bit faster than the stock one ( eta prime tested the um690 with ddr5 6000 and got round 5-10% higher cpu scores and even higher than that gpu scores) and still have enough left to buy the base mac mini and a cheap plane ticket from Athens to Rome ! all for the crazy cost of a mini with 24gb ram and 2tb drive . You could also use an Egpu with the um690 but not with the mini. For any production scenario thats memory bound , say music production with large sample libraries , the mini cannot compete at the same price range period. Apple asks 460 for 1tb that cannot be replaced if it fails , and 460 for 24gb ram that cannot be replaced if it fails . Thats not good for a production environment that experiences a tech failure of this sort . And im writting all these as an apple user . Im migrating to pc this year hopefully .

[@mbvglider]

If you're actually considering a mini PC for music production, I say you should think about a few more things. First of all, no Windows mini PCs (or laptops) are quiet enough to be in the same space as your microphone, IMO. It's not that loud, but it's not silent, either. Every single Apple Silicon Mac, from Mac mini to any of the laptops, is completely silent in regular use, allowing for easy on-location recording. Also, most interfaces have very good Apple drivers. For Windows, some do, and some don't. In addition, chipsets matter. I've had some weird issues with Ryzen PCs there. Intels seem more suitable for music production because the chipset drivers tend to be more reliable for me, but then Intels use more power and will require more (probably louder) cooling. Additionally, most mini PCs don't have enough connectivity. Just one USB4 is going to be limiting when trying to put together a studio machine. Also, service for Apple tends to be pretty painless, compared to trying to get service for a minisforum. People say "you can't replace the RAM or SSD if it fails" and while true, in practice, it's very unlikely for RAM or SSD to fail out of nowhere. When I've experienced severe failure in computers in the past 3-4 years, it's usually been something like the power module or main board and never the RAM or SSD, and Apple tends to be pretty good at servicing things like that; PC manufacturers are usually slower and more likely to blame you for the failure. Having said that, I personally wouldn't recommend the M2 Mac mini for music production; the M2 Pro Mac Mini exists and is a much better idea as it's much faster with greater connectivity; a used M1 Studio is also great, too. The long and short of it is that if you're actually looking to do music production on your computer and you want to use Windows, get a full-sized desktop PC where you chose everything that went into it. If you don't want to think too hard about everything that goes into your computer, I think a Mac saves you a lot of pain in the long run.

[@Alperic27]

M2 is just a crazy shitshow … maybe M3 will deliver enough added value to justify its premium price, but m2 simply does not … and this is just testing with the 6900… 7940hs will likely increase value-for-money gap when it comes out in a few months in the next umxxx series

[@Alperic27]

@@mbvglidersaves lots of pain’ … this is the coolaid apple wants us all to drink… but in the end, it is simply not true…. there has never been a product launch that worked fine on day one with the intended OS… never … i used to keep track of all the ridiculous things that failed. PS: I am an apple user for the past 15 years … .. I just dont swallow their BS… apple made the perfect utube-click-whore machine.. and their bet has paid off. But theiy botched the gpu on M1 and slightly improved things on M2.

[@error4159]

@@Alperic27 Dream on, lol. As the UMXXX is updated, so will the Mac Mini. And we all know app specific updates will keep the Apple hardware ahead. And theres no huge price difference here so the UM has basically no chance against the Mac Mini in the market place.

[@Alperic27]

@@error4159 i see with have a fanatical believer here … good for ya … 😀

[@a9udn9u-vanced]

The um690 actually fared well in this competition. Better than I expected. I'm waiting for their Ryzen 7945/7845 APU powered mini PCs, seems like those will be worth the wait!

[@lexavlogs7149]

Imagine with a i7 apu that would destroy everything

[@thewiirocks]

No kidding. I'm so used to Apple making Intel look bad that I was unprepared for AMD to be this competitive at this low of a price. Nice work AMD!

[@vinylcabasse]

@@lexavlogs7149 lol wut

[@KuntalGhosh]

@@lexavlogs7149 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂😂consume 200w and melt the case.

[@bdhale34]

It would have absolutely slaughtered the mac in gaming though on all levels. Also if the mac mini had the same amount of ram and storage it's $1200.

[@mbvglider]

I tried out a mini Windows PC for a bit (ASUS model, another Ryzen CPU) and there are a couple things to consider. First off, the external PSU is something you have to account for when you consider how big it is physically speaking, as it has to be placed somewhere. Also, while the noise is irrelevant in an office or living room environment, IMO, in a quiet bedroom or recording studio, it would be quite noticeable. Anyway, they're quite good for the right user.

[@daneo617]

I've been using my Uh9 mini PC for years and my 4 Tb hard drive makes more noise which is minimal 🤷🏼‍♂️

[@Ajay-pf6bv]

If you just want to do basic stuff like browsing, e-mailing, office work and maybe a little bit of photo editing, getting a Mini PC with Linux is by far the most cost efficient approach. On top comes data privacy. But I get that you couldn't do the whole benchmark comparison as not all those benchmarks are available for Linux.

[@declice]

Not much point comparing these imo. The mac is a very niche compared to the mini pc. If you only need video/photo/audio/code editing the mac is amazing, but falls flat on it's face when you need more.

[@clippedwings2121]

Great comparison video! Both are great systems in their own right. 2 months ago I was in a toss up between the M2 Mac Mini and the Beelink GTR6 (same AMD APU as the UM690). I ended up getting the AMD system because I wanted to game on it as well and I am glad I made that choice. It's simply mind blowing to me that I am able to run games like Cyberpunk 2077, Fallout 4, Overwatch smoothly. Another benefit of having the AMD GPU is it can take advantage of AMD's FSR upscaling tech to boost frame rates in games- something obviously missing in Apple's systems. If you'd like a productivity powerhouse and want to do some gaming on the side, i'd recommend going for the AMD system. It's not all perfect with the AMD system though- it runs hotter and louder so something to keep in mind

[@Leptospirosi]

The problem I'm building up with Apple is about Legacy software: when you spend thousands of dollars in softwares that are working perfectly fine, you don't want an hipster CEO coming out and telling you to have to upgrade everything because they swapped processors completely. I had to switch from a G4 to Intel and now to ARM in less then 12 years and is getting annoying while on a PC I could still use a 30YO software without much problems: not very good for professional uses. As an hybrid user, I don't care about brands and life stiles: for me a computer is just a piece of equipment to get the job done, and at the moment I feel Windows 11 is the better OS for compatibility by far.

[@Badjujubee]

I do work supporting an open source library that we have been having a bear of a time doing validation testing on the Mac OS side as time goes on. Between java dropping stuff off and Apples meandering of Xcode between OS versions it's getting hard for us unpaid computer monkeys out here XD

[@dealstobid]

So true. My MacBook need upgrade to newer macOS just to use some new basic software. It’s gets slower on every upgrade. While in windows it just works

[@craigdaurizio686]

I say this all of the time. Apple bricks their hardware, while PC doesn't ever fully do this. I bought music software in 2007, works perfect in win 10, 2010 MBP can't do anything on it involving software from that era

[@LunaticEdit]

@@craigdaurizio686 PC doesn't fully do this, sure, but Microsoft does (EUFI, TPM, etc).

[@craigdaurizio686]

@@LunaticEdit A big part of the discussion is hardware. In 2023, we're at the point where it's a debate involving some hardware that doesn't confer ownership. This is a big deal. The fact that I can reformat+rebuild my entire system without a network is really the defining difference. Ownership is power, without it, you're carrying around someone else's stuff, asking their permission to turn it on once and a while. No thanks, not anymore at least.

[@nomenessuno2463]

I’m a Mac fan but my problem with the Mac is that I cannot repurpose it as easily as the the x86 pc. I can upgrade the storage and ram and install any number of Linux distros to serve some purpose in my home network.

[@retrocomputing]

You should buy it for software, not hardware. There is no software that can take full advantage of Macs outside MacOS stuff

[@nomenessuno2463]

@@retrocomputing yup. I’ve bought many macs for its reliability, consistency, “free” OS updates, and their excellence with media files, including my current m1 MacBook Air which is probably the best laptop I ever used. Finally, need to replace my wife’s 2012 iMac 27 inch…at least I can repurpose that and extend its use. Move to m1 limits that a bit, but maybe I’m just a little too over zealous in squeezing out the most life span for the computers I buy.

[@retrocomputing]

@@nomenessuno2463 I'm still using 2012 Mac mini for web dev. If the Mac is too slow for your secondary machine just sell it. There are many new or used small office “net top” PCs that you can buy instead, Lenovo makes some good ones.

[@0netom]

a decade of lifetime is not horribly bad though, is it? regardless, it annoys me too, that the HDD in my 2013 i7 27" iMac with 32GB RAM started to fail and I can only change it, if I unscrew the LCD...

[@carisi2k11]

@@nomenessuno2463 How are you going to repurpose that 2012 imac?

[@desireewise3670]

I was looking for a video like this, so happy this came on my feed

[@tadejpeckaj1151]

Interesting.. entered the raffall as well 🤞🤞🤞

[@dadabooey]

Was waiting for this comparison ... thanks!

[@JohnnyStrides]

Does the Mac really have the edge in encoding? I don't think you used the AMD encoder on the Windows machine but were using the hardware encoding built into the Mac. Not exactly apples to apples...

[@c4g5]

Speedometer 2.0 results vary on different browsers on same hardware. Test should be done both on FF or both on Chrome.

[@mischamim744]

There is a small but very important .... A 64GB Mac will cost about 3,000 euros! If you add another terabyte or God forbid 2-3 terabytes of memory, then get ready to sell your ten-year-old car. Thanks for the review.I hope many will see that this is just marketing. And there is nothing better than a good PC for the creators, as of today. That's why it's funny to watch reviews, which tell you that the MAC is not worse than RTX 4070 or 4090! Maybe if someone is just taking pictures. Or just cutting video.Although on the other hand you can do everything on the phone, it just takes a lot more time.:))

[@Aladinzc]

People should also see that comparing noname PC with the most expensive brand is not a real comparison. You will ever build more powerful PC for the same price. Not talking performance per Watt that is not that important for desktop tho.

[@Teluric2]

You cant encode a 300GB file in a phone.

[@GlobalWave1]

Or using it for music production which a laptop is perfect for making music on the go or where ever you’d like to take it. The MacBook laptops are perfect for that aspect. A but pricey but works wonders.

[@eleventy-seven]

A 7950 with 64gb and a 3080ti will beat the pants off the Mac.

[@lindsaywebb1904]

Unless you make music. PC is comparatively trash for audio and midi. I tried to swap completely to PC about 7 years ago but have ended up running both systems for that reason

[@fajarn7052]

But, the fact that I don't use MacOS is already ending the era of Mac in my household before it was even started. If I was offered one UM690 or 2 Mac Mini...I would choose the Mac, sell one and buy UM690.

[@QuicknStraight]

This comparison pricing you use is totally deceptive. The Mac Mini M2 with 16GB RAM / 256GB SSD costs a whopping $999 (US Apple store), against $649 for the similarly spec'd UM690. For $949, you can get the Minisforum UM690 with 64GB RAM / 1TB SSD. Clearly, the Minisforum is much better value. Running the rendering tests with 64GB in the Minisforum would be interesting.

[@ag4eng]

Mini PC form factor is an interesting idea. I’m using one as my Linux machine, but I only paid less about $200 so very different price range and expectations. One note is that Dell & HP have the Micro PC form factor, but not competitors for the Mac.

[@akin242002]

The good ones also run Linux OS. Miniforum, Beelink, Intel NUC, or Geekdom to name the popular mini-PCs.

[@TheEmrickman]

Great comparison. Looking at the minis forum as it’s on a big sale right now on their website

[@nick-dogg]

I just like using windows better, I do appreciate the sense of security on the Macs though and the integration it has with my iPhone. I like the direction Intel and AMD are heading. Can’t wait for their future CPU’s and looking forward to the ARM version of windows 12

[@gregorybull3753]

The power efficiency of those m series chips is amazing

[@samuelschwager]

If you want more more ram or storage with the mac minis it gets pretty expensive pretty fast...

[@ratadeldesierto760]

really great video, Congrats! One doubt, 16gb would be enough for video editing (twelve minutes max per video) just premiere or resolve with chrome tab with spotify at the same time!? thank you very much!

[@microcolonel]

The Geekbench stuff is not very comparable though. Compiler choices are different, different ISAs, different tuning. GPU stuff also has issues in comparisons; with two different GPU APIs, performance is not really comparable since the software is substantially different. Similarly, when comparing Blender, the Cycles CPU rendering code is more optimized on AMD64 than on AArch64, and even if they started on both at the same time, they would still be different pieces of software. And again comparing Safari on the M2 to anything on the PC is similarly not meaningful as a comparison of the hardware, as you regularly see differences like this between versions of the same browser on the same hardware, and between browsers. The best comparison would be Chrome on both, since Chrome is well optimized for AArch64 and AMD64... Still not a very useful comparison but definitely more useful than Safari vs Chrome.

[@nyambe]

Besides benchmarks, have room full of old PCs and parts that are boxed. On the other hand I still use my 10 year old MBP for downloading content to external hard drives. I wish PCs would work always as they did the first day, but the truth is that they don’t. The last one just started rebooting randomly after less than 2 years. It was a decent laptop

[@akshaymathur136]

Weird. I have laptops from 2012 that are running fine. My main laptop is from 2016 and still going strong. No weirdness or wonkiness

[@stevec5465]

My 2014 gen 3 X1 carbon running windows 10 just fine. The only problem is the soldered ram on the motherboard. But it did come with an SSD. My Mac mini late 2014 came with a 5400 rpm hard drive!!!! The standard even back then was 7200 rpm. Not even a hint of an SSD unless I did it myself. But, I can say that it started off with Catalina and is running Monterrey fine.

[@dennisdevine9563]

Great Video!

[@marcelomoura6685]

Mini PC Windows is a good choice. Minis Fórum? A good option.

[@stevecreager8109]

I think that it depends on what operating system that a person likes. Apple has a very robust eco system that appeals to certain people. I like Apple in everything but a PC. I like doing my own builds for my video editing. Thanks for doing the comparison.

[@harrysantiago6166]

i want mac mini

[@scott4825]

It's kind of funny how long it took for the Windows crowd to accept mini-pcs. Apple cam out with the intel mac-mini like 20 years ago, and there wasn't much praise. If you aren't doing serious processing (needing a big graphics card), I feel they are a good desktop solution. It's an easy solution for a M1/M2 mac because they are low power consumption and lower heat, and their power supply is built in. Fan noise hasn't been an issue. My guess is that for typical home use, it rarely goes on.

[@jacksongunner7122]

What the heck are you talking about, there have been mini-PCs out for as long as there have been mini's.

[@olibertud]

I have a suggestion, is it possible to consider a comparison about Power Consumption / Benchmark To achieve X benchmark, it draw X power. Then bring it to 1:1 ratio or a 100% basis comparison to see the "Power Efficiency over work". I find that very very helpful for people looking for the price bracket and the benefit of everyday use.

[@vmafarah9473]

Why power efficiency need to consider if it's 30W, it won't affect power bill as using Intel machine consuming 240W.

[@karthikeyan53]

If you compare power efficiency then you need to understand that Ryzen 6900hx is 6nm and M2 is 3nm. If AMD made a processor with 3nm transistors then it can outperform M2 in many many areas with huge marks. But AMD won't do that because Apple market share for laptops and PCs are very very less. Most people prefer Windows machines because they want a device which can do anything they want.

[@vmafarah9473]

@@karthikeyan53 3nm TSMC is efficient, but cant hit higher clocks since it isnt matured enough, If amd used it against intel, they may loose in gaming by a big margin and also in apps that require higher single core clock. intel is still on 10+++ but wins due to overly matured node that can hit higher clocks but cant keep up with amd in efficiency.

[@vmafarah9473]

@@karthikeyan53 6nm is a sweet spot, cheaper, higher clocks, much more efficient than intel.

[@vmafarah9473]

@@karthikeyan53 APPLe booked whole 3nm . so no room for other players. iphone is the main user.

[@dougfunk01]

Hey your chapter for Premiere Pro should be at 15:50 just FYI. Thanks for the video!

[@WayneWatson1]

I'd like to see a comparison of the 2018 Mac mini i7 vs m2 Mac mini

[@floretsports5910]

I want too

[@frozeneye100]

I cannot even decide amd vs intel vs arm. I use things for different stuff. Great for testing etc. one thing I did not do is the power draw. I do find myself using Mac mini for stuff where there is no real intense stuff happening and it works well. For gpu intensive I do use my proper beefy laptop and for Linux I do use my good old trusty amd tower that has so many expansaions on mobo I can just whack a boat load of virtual machines and direct assign stuff. Good to see the actual power draw. But even web surfing Mac looks like it blocks sections using scroll. Windows and Linux in terms of gui is to be honest way better and smoother

[@bassyey]

AMD and ARM. Intel is just straight up trash with that power consumption.

[@Alex-wg1mb]

Would like to see some mini pc from Minisforum with nvidia gpu

[@theTechNotice]

Yes!

[@VJBEATS-bq2nb]

Great for music production ❤

[@vegtalk8920]

Does the price of mini PC includes the windows license? If yes it would be interesting to see how this machine performs on linux and what would be the price.

[@winknotes]

I'm glad to have found this video. I'm a music composer and was seriously considering a Mac mini, but for the price wondering if it would be more cost effective for me to get a UM690. Typically memory pressure is pretty great with VST plugins but CPU can be an issue with certain types of effects plugins (reverb, limiters, etc.). Any thoughts with that type of application if you're familiar with that use case?

[@kabloosh699]

I think if you want to do anything that isn't email, streaming, and other basic productivity work you may want to look at something twice the price with a dedicated GPU. The Mac may work though since Mac has software that is tailored to its hardware which can really give it an edge over the Windows PC which will require third party software that is best suited for more powerful PCs.

[@winknotes]

@@kabloosh699 Thanks for the reply and thoughts. I since found a model (same company) that's intel based and has more cores AND better single core performance. From a statistics standpoint it's more powerful than my Dell refurb so on paper should give me better multi-core performance when I need that and better latency when I'm recording a midi track live. I can still use my Dell as a networked VST slave server if I need the additional sample capacity. From what I understand GPU isn't very important for music production tasks but if that is a serious bottleneck in these machines I'd like to know things like that.

[@kabloosh699]

@@winknotes well it has no dedicated GPU. It would make sense that music doesn't really utilize the GPU since it isn't exactly producing an image so CPU is probably more important. CPU is generally less important these days than having a dedicated GPU and the amount of ram. I would argue the least important thing is disk space for one reason only. Cloud Storage. If you need space to store large amounts of data either get a cloud subscription or buy a network area storage (NAS) device and store everything on there. The only exception is gaming. If you're gaming you will want disk space on that machine. Otherwise 128gb SSDs are perfectly fine since all you will be storing locally is the OS, applications, and syncing with whatever cloud storage drive solution you went with.

[@bassyey]

As long as you get the latest Ryzen you'll be fine. I do bass and guitar recording all the time. That being said, I also have a Mac Mini, works well too. Actually, I use all 3 OS, lol. I remote into my Linux server for software development.

[@novalogue]

Did you get a Mini PC? Also looking for something music production related

[@KuntalGhosh]

one thing you didn't mention is the mac can be configured to have a 10gigabit nic for 100$ more , that is something you can not do with even lot more expensive windows prebuild computers and the dual or quad thunderbolt port gives nearly unlimited upgrade potential , you have 40gbps of bandwidth on hand and can easily expand storage with external nvme ssd and lot more ports with docs and adapters , the single usb 4 gives similar potential to the minipc aswell. ram is not a concern for mac , mac os has lot better ram management than windows so it can do quite a bit more with less ram.

[@terrymann9995]

Do you think by just upgrading the memory could increase the performance enough, do to it being shared through the neural engine?

[@williamburkholder769]

The sweet spot for these Macs is 16GB Unified Memory and 1TB SSD storage. Beyond those specs, unless you are doing very heavy lifting, you'll see marginal returns on expenditure. The M2 Macs are MUCH faster when given breathing room, especially SSD capacity. At 512GB on the M2, and 1TB on the M2 Pro, you have a RAID ARRAY, which nearly doubles the read/write speeds. My M1 MacBook Air with 16GB/1TB sees read speeds of 2900 and write speeds of 3050 megabytes per second. Higher end Macs can approach double those speeds. I would never buy an 8GB M-series Mac. I would never buy a 256 GB M2 Mac, or a 512GB M2 Pro Mac.But they are fine for many folks who don't push the envelope like I do. To get to the sweet spot, you can buy from Apple Refurbished and save 15%. Same merchandise, same warranty...

[@FlintG]

I mean as someone that owns a ps5 for the gaming console of choice I almost would just rather use a mac mini instead of using windows but for now my gaming pc is not bad either still at windows 10 pro. I honestly don't need a upgrade for a pc but if I was to get a new one it would probably be the m2 mac mini.

[@bassyey]

That makes sense. I use Linux, Windows 11, and MacOS. I don't get all these OS wars. I use 3 for my workflow lol.

[@carterjohnson25]

So what you're saying is when the 7000 series version of the AMD mini is released soon it's going to slaughter that M2 😳

[@karthikeyan53]

No until AMD uses the 3nm processor like M2. AMD use 6 or 5nm because Mac are not even competition for AMD. Mac has very less market share and people using Mac's are very very low because Mac's are only for specific tasks, it can't do all.

[@bassyey]

7000 series is so good. I'm going to upgrade my 2000 series once 2nd gen DDR5 stuff arrives. I plan to build an ITX build, no GPU (or maybe 2 fan GPU, anyway not a gamer).

[@geoffreyjohnstone5465]

The real conclusion is that if you want to use Mac software get a Mac. There is pretty much a zero upgrade path for the Mac Mini whereas you can upgrade storage, ram and even add an external GPU such as the GPD G1 to the UM690 which I find makes it a much better proposition for ME. YOU might see it very differently, and thats cool.

[@odinbagus]

But what about Mac Mini M1 16gb vs UM690?

[@karthikeyan53]

Bro it is 900$. Huge price difference from AMD PC.

[@xzm996]

14:29 the browser used must be same on both platforms. Use firefox.

[@marcelomoura6685]

I prefer Windows Mini PC.

[@mikeg1265]

I have an M2 Mac mini but I have 4 thunderbolt ports. Are you sure that’s not an M1?

[@LeicaM11]

You do have a Mac Mini M2 >PRO

[@marcopaolini3478]

Very interesting video, but I would like to make two clarifications: * The Mac should be compared to the MiniPC with the same RAM/SSD configuration, and therefore the prices change, and by a lot, but the Mac's SSD performance also improves a lot. * The MiniPC is much more compact *but* it has an external power supply, right? I think this should also be taken into account. * The MiniPC case is completely plastic, while the Mac is metal. * The browser speed test I think should have at least been combined with another round with the same browser on both computers. * A test on the performance of the USB4 port and on the TB would have been interesting to do. * In another channel it was highlighted how the MiniPC processor easily throttles under stress.

[@javiej]

About the prices, if you increase the Mac mini price (by a lot, in order to get double ram and doble SSD ) then you should also apply same budget to the mini pc. For that prices you can get a Windows mini pc with a small Nvidia GPU (for example in NUC style, minisforum, and others ), which will simply obliterate the Mac mini not only on CPU benchmarks but also in all GPU related benchmarks and video processing , as Nvidia has all the hardware video decoders and decoders that are missing in the AMD.

[@marcopaolini3478]

@@javiej My reference to the RAM/SSD doubling was not directly related to the budget but to the fact that the two systems were not comparable in terms of RAM/SSD: one (Mac) has 8GB of RAM and a 256GB SSD, while the other (MiniPC ) 16GB of RAM and a 512GB SSD. It is therefore obvious that by comparing the two systems with the same RAM / SSD equipment, the "extraordinary" convenience of the Mac is no longer there... ;-)

[@theTechNotice]

This one didn't throttle at all, it's got such great cooling, have a look at the dedicated review of this :)

[@ZhuJo99]

you can’t compare USB 4 to Thunderbolt. Not at all. USB 4 is barely on par with TB3 but without any such hard requirements as TB has. Ie while you MIGHT get monitor support and 100 W power delivery and 32 Gbit/s for data, on Thunderbolt it is REQUIRED

[@javiej]

@@ZhuJo99 Yeah on TB3 it is required,.but TB3 is obsolete in all the important aspects: - USB-C "permits" (but not "requires" to pay for ) charging up to 240Watt, way beyond TB3 obsolete capacity,. and some Android smartphone manufacturers are already offering. 240w (next year everybody.else) -.Next thunderbolt standard is going to be double faster with PCIe passtrough at 80Gb (even 120Gb in one direction), bit this time it is an Intel exclusive (not covered by previous agreements with Apple). Now that Apple is not using Intel CPUs (and also abandoning PCIe and eGPU support to avoid open market competition) please explain us how is Apple going to convince Intel to get access to the new Thunderbolt generation. It could be that Apple will then launch its own propietary link, but on any case it is obvious that they are just preparing the next round of their usual bs: 'Convert all you old gear and cables into eWaste for the.planet and buy the new model", as they have been doing over the last 20 years. Just one example: most thunderbolt eGPUs purchased by Apple users had to be rescued on eBay by Windows users for their laptops,.or become eWaste otherwise. Really, Apple users don't benefit from thunderbolt , they just use it because for most of them it is the only way that they are "permitted" to connect things. And compared with PC desktops they had to ppay double the cost than using a simple PCIe slot , and just for one generation!. Is it that for what you want thunderbolt? Because I don't.

[@stevec5465]

The best accessory for a Mac mini M1 is a hammer.

[@fabriciochamorro2985]

Can you compare both with the same operating system please?

[@HDRPC]

Happy Holi sir Soon no one will able to match Intel 20A node in Arrow lake in performance and efficiency coming is 1st half of 2024 for both desktops and laptop. They are going to use new transistors called RibbonFET and also power via backside power delivery. Intel meteorlake with Intel 4 node, laptop exclusive chips are also coming this year end and have 50% better per watt than 13 gen laptop chips and new igpu also knows as tiled GPU will be 2 times faster than current iris xe igpu in 13 gen laptops. RibbonFET transistors and power via will be game changing for Intel. Now everyone will see why x86 is best and will be best for anything you throw in performance and efficiency.

[@terrymann9995]

I’m sorry I am a windows builder, and Mac user. What you say could happen, yet I am tired of Intel empty promises. I guess that is tech in general anymore though.

[@HDRPC]

@@terrymann9995 brother this time there are mo delays until 2026 cpus. All 4 generation of CPU and their 2 generation of arc GPU are on time. Intel 20A and 18A node is ready. Meteorlake will launch this year only for laptops and then arrow lake for both laptops and desktops for which i am very very excited. They will 100% deliver 5 nodes in 4 years starting from meteorlake this year 2023.

[@-opus]

rumours are pointless, aside from advertising to the gullible.

[@Kozum1983]

Whats the name of the program for the temperatures on the mac?

[@HDRPC]

Sir vulcan vs vulcan, open cl vs open cl is better comparison😅😅 Then cuda vs metal if nvidia GPU is available as cuda and metal are in-house api of nvidia and apple silicon

[@nick-dogg]

I like my Mac mini, but i don’t really like mac os. The wifi has issues too. I see a lot of bugs and complaints with users facing the same issues, and it’s been going on since the m1 mac mini. It was very surprising to hear.

[@LunaticEdit]

I completely believe you, but I don't really know what kind of bugs everyone's talking about, maybe I'm just lucky. My oldest child, wife, and I have been using Apple products for almost 5 years now and not _once_ have I had to fix issues for any of them. Before then it was a constant nightmare with viruses or broken installs or updates. Use what works for you, of course!

[@hvasya]

​@@LunaticEdit as a user of Mac mini m1 and MacBook pro 14 can confirm that Bluetooth works better on my windows PC. it's not big, but annoying.

[@vdtb1758]

I think, Geekbench just only optimization for Apple A, M series. For me, Geekbench is trash

[@HDRPC]

Bro when i asked geekbench developer that why geekbench 6 don't have cuda api for GPU test so he says no one uses cuda api. I was like🤣🤣🤣🤣. Every 3d artists use cuda API and RTX cores and even in video editing cuda is must. I think they will never provide cuda API and i will never test Geekbench scores. They are just biased towards apple. I just ignored geekbench forever.

[@leejenshakya8524]

well geeknech is nota stress test and it doesnt count hyperthreading so amd and intel always score low as they have hyper threading but apple silicon has no hyper threading even in p cores ....geekbench is good to test snappiness of basic task while cinebench is more of raw horsepower

[@FBL9982]

Geekbench Is super fake , part of Apple , cinebench Is real

[@AbcdEf-lz6oe]

Yeah, there’s something really off with GeekBench. Even if you only considered x86 CPUs from AMD and Intel, they’re still way out of wack. Generally comparable CPUs in other benchmarks like Cinebench, encoding and Blender render times turn into crazy Intel win with Geekbench somehow by at least 10-15%. Like a 12650H vs a 5900HX. In most benchmarks, the two are completely matched for multi-core performance, then out of nowhere Geekbench throws you a 33% multi-core win for the 12650H.

[@malavpatel77]

@@AbcdEf-lz6oe memory speed might have something to do with it

[@JohnCorrUK]

If you uploading to KZbin, the rendering at KZbin after uploading your video is the most time consuming part of process (if you have a fast Internet connection) in my experience as Apple and PC owner

[@theTechNotice]

yeah, that's due to the Apple servers and how fast they're able to do it :)

[@kericsX]

Can i convert finished Videos with m2 mac mini without cutting software? For example with handbrake for macos. Only Convert from h264/h265 to av1. With ryzen 6000/7000 apu it‘s not Feasible because 6000 has vega and 7000 has only rdna 2. Both without Av1 Enconding Hardware.

[@LeicaM11]

You can, but no AV1 encoder/decoder in HW anywhere, so conversion is CPU based and slow.

[@akin242002]

As a PC guy, I'm naturally leaning towards AMD mini PC. However, the noise would get annoying if working at home or watching 4k movies.

[@emilmaylow3094]

8:56 apple silicon has 2 types of cores, singe core measured from p-core, but the remaining 4 cores slower than that of amd

[@zeroskills925]

Hi Tech notice, can you please review the intel A770 with the latest driver for creative applications.

[@adewouters]

Surprise surprise the Mac is better optimised and therefore faster in tasks typical of the Mac user (photo and video editing), whereas the PC is more interesting for general computing. So as usual it all depends on the needs of the user. Now, considering the price for equal hardware configuration, I would rather say the mini PC is a better deal, unless, once again, you are that Mac user needing a small machine for video editing.

[@HDRPC]

Sir when i asked geekbench developer that why geekbench 6 don't have cuda api for GPU test so he says no one uses cuda api. I was like🤣🤣🤣🤣. Every 3d artists use cuda API and RTX cores and even in video editing cuda is must. I think they will never provide cuda API and i will never test Geekbench scores. They are just biased towards apple. I just ignored geekbench forever.

[@Teluric2]

Indeed many engineering aps use cuda to use the GPU cores to increase performance .

[@HDRPC]

@@Teluric2 yes almost all 3d apps supports cuda acceleration.

[@coldcoffeehk]

Please do not use the mac mini base model for performance comparison. Please use the mac mini with 512M to do it again.

[@karthikeyan53]

What that 512 SSD going to do?

[@40wallflower46]

I am not a bench geek. Other reviewers state for each test, something like, "higher is better..." You don't bother. So I I gave up after remaining in the dark. Sorry. I did want to know which one was better.

[@karthikeyan53]

The Ryzen 9 6900HX is a 6nm processor but the M2 is 3nm so the power efficiency is great. M2 is a lot better on video & photo editing software because of the encoders and media engine. Ryzen doesn't have any media engine but AMD can beat apple if they use a 3nm transistor on Ryzen processors. But AMD won't do that because Apple market share on laptops and PCs are very less. So literally Apple is not even a competitor for AMD & Intel. Most people won't buys a PC which can't be upgraded or do only specific things.

[@zodiacfml]

thanks Ive always wondered how the M2 fares vs Mini PC reviews I watch. Apple definitely needs an upgrade, x86 caught up. The M2 is just a slight improvement of the M1. Apple is riding on the success of the old M1 up to now.

[@bdhale34]

Also take into account that the mac mini with the same amount of RAM and storage space costs $1200.

[@KunkhmerboxingTV168-r4x]

The upgradeable on PC is unbeatable

[@LeicaM11]

You never may get an M2 for 599 here😂 My Minisforum with i7-13700h (great performance) failed after three weeks of working and needed a replacement.

[@DeepteshLovesTECH]

AMD GPU is a failure in video editing. So that explains the low puget bench premiere pro scores.

[@boogiedownbronx73]

I just got the m2 with 16gb ram for 750 usd new through apple.

[@retrovox]

Please review Gigabyte Brix Extreme mini pc!

[@denvera1g1]

A very small amount of power draw on the windows side is due to the SODIMM RAM and NVMe SSD, on the MAC PC these tightly integrated parts generally draw less than 5 and often less than 1W, where as the replicable parts on the windows computer often draw over 10w, it is a small price to pay for upgradability in my opinion. What i'd love to do is take my Mac Mini, and buy one of these Minisform machines to see which machine is more efficient. I did this in 2020 comparing my M1 Mac Mini with my work's 4750U laptop, and the laptop was often more efficient when normalized for the same performance. What i dont like about Intel and AMD is that they push the silicon to its limits and this is its default behavior, so it does it all the time, basically keeping the processor well outside its efficiency curve, where as Apple keeps it locked in the best spot for efficiency. This is a double edged sword though, while you can, with some effort, keep those Intel and AMD chips from getting into that low efficiency state, I cannot push my M1/M2 outside of that efficient frequency if i need something dont faster, at the sacrifice of power consumption and fan noise.

[@fablewalls]

When you're that person whose job uses Blender and Da Vinci Resolve...

[@jacksongunner7122]

This really is not a fair comparison, if you want a mini with 16GB of RAM and a 512GB SSD you are paying $999 versus the same configuration for the Ryzen PC which is $649 so s $350 difference. Also if you want to play games then the Ryzen is way better than the mac. But the ARM processors are and always will be much more efficient than the x86 processors so if you are concerned about energy cost it might be better long term depending on usage and cost for electricity.

[@netron66]

Well, still hate iOS itself so PC will not die

[@hermanthotan]

Can you make the new video m2 vs amd 7940hs cpu

[@-opus]

"Is the Windows Mini PC Era Ending?" Obviously not since apple is a rip off.

[@crearg8259]

Oh, that’s the brand with Liquid Metal leakage!

[@mikapeltokorpi7671]

Junkshop: did not fit in memory and cached to disk?

[@daneo617]

Where's a good place to get an older version of the Mac mini 🤷🏼‍♂️ anyone Thx in advance ✌🏻

[@theTechNotice]

Best Buy?

[@computerenthusiast402]

Can you make a video about the best bang for buck 1 monitor and PC/Mac KVM switch desktop setup ?

[@technicallyme]

The Apple memory is way closer to the cpu and 100 gig memory bandwidth How loud is the amd? The Mac minis are usually silent. I'd prefer quiet over a small loud fan

[@karthikeyan53]

But AMD using 6nm processor. They can use same 3nm processor as M2 to reduce high temps and improve performance and power efficiency but they won't because people who use Macs are very low in population. Most people just want their system to do anything they want. But Macs are not like that.

[@technicallyme]

@@karthikeyan53 most people wouldn't upgrade the hardware regardless. I'd say the amount of people that would are pretty close to the mac owners around 10% of the market. there's nothing you can do on windows you cant do on UNIX.

[@karthikeyan53]

@@technicallyme Macs are not for all. You can't play lots of games on Mac, for 3D modelling gaming PC with nvidia graphics cards are best. Windows/Linux has lots of apps for lots of things compared to Mac. Mac is literally expensive. You can get Windows and Linux PCs for cheap now and you can upgrade it later.

[@technicallyme]

@@karthikeyan53 that's kind of the point they are highly specialized but these two cost the same amount and mac really isn't that expensive if you compare it to a surface or dell xps, a Mac is roughly on par. As far as 3d modeling it depends on what you are using. Right tool for the right job, while mac may struggle with blender, Maya works well, and macs are very good at encoding as this video showed. And if you're are buying a computer for games then you’re probaly not using a nvidia rtx a4000 either

[@catchnkill]

That is a user case choice. If you need more than Apple can put it the chip, you are doomed. No matter how fast the memory interface is it cannot make it right by not having enough. When a user case calls for a lot of memory, you need a PC that can have memory expansion capability. Different product for different use and really they cannot be properly compared.

[@WyzrdCat]

It was an era? I don't know a single person who ever bought one of these, but lots of Mac Minis.

[@harryvlogs7833]

Dude what you talking about the m2 mini is 649

[@seigoulenmate7366]

I would love to see the pc compare to imac pro 2019

[@el_dallasyt]

I would choose mac for productivity. But mini pc because of windows

[@HDRPC]

I will choose Intel arrow lake laptops for productivity and gaming also than any mini PC coming in 2024. Laptops are way better than mini PC. Otherwise build a PC is best of the best decision.

[@el_dallasyt]

@@HDRPC yeah building a pc is better but i don't have that much space

[@HDRPC]

@@el_dallasyt oh no. How bro you don't have space? Those who can afford any tech products, they must have enough space. I don't know what are you trying to say but yes you can do or buy whatever you want. Ok No one can force anyone for anything.

[@eleventy-seven]

Unless your programming for a the Mac environment why spend the money? A Chromebook for school and a good 16 core chip at home like the 7850-5950 for compiling programs or editing videos is faster more expandable and can use more software without a VM. Macs are a rip. The company is looking for new suckers however.

[@bassyey]

​@@eleventy-seven Apple copying Nvidia. Nvidia is always looking for new suckers with their pricing

[@bigdeagle1331]

Need an update on the Amd 8700g igpu!

[@lwpweb]

whin one is noisier?

[@KyleRuggles]

Not bad! I'd say get the mac if power is an issue, I watch a lot of vanlife video's and this would be an easy sell for them!

[@denvera1g1]

2:30 The RAM is unified on both units, not just the Mac Mini

[@b.f.rchannel1997]

Where is gaming test...?

[@mohamedisaac924]

itś fun seeing apple tubers saying crap just to justify how good apple product are

[@Teluric2]

From the start mac are losing the race RTX 4090 runs with drr6 that is faster than ddr5 inside macs.

[@nielsdebakker3283]

It is a no brainer, apple does not get a cent of my money. And for older pc's, I still have one or two 10ish years old pc's which officially can't run w11 but do. (And if not, linux is one download away.)

[@panathaninf]

Cmon you didn't seriously fall for the "cheap" Mac mini trap... you know what planned redundancy is? The base mac mini is redundant right away... 8 gb and 256 gb disk space non upgradable in 2023 is a no show

[@Cakebattered]

These are general purpose machines, not dedicated work devices, so why conduct video editing tests, but no gaming tests? Lets not pretend that video editing is a more common use case than light gaming. Time to stop shielding Apple products.

[@becontentandsilencethemind1562]

After 1 week trying out the mac mini I had to return it…..because… Uncontrollable hair loss lol

[@theTechNotice]

Lol

[@DerekDavis213]

Mac Mini is the probably best for most people out there? What about one HUGE problem with the Mac? It uses ARM processor, and it doesn't run Windows properly. Also Mac is terrible for gaming.

[@mkunikow]

Wait for AMD Zen 4 mini PCs ...

[@user.fedorman]

I had an iPad, Macbook and iPhone, the same thing happened to me with all the devices, I feel that they belong to Apple and they lease them to me, they decide which programs I should use and what hardware I should have, Macbook you cannot update hardware or install another program that is not to the taste of Apple. With PCs you can update hardware, use Linux, Windows, I feel more free and owner of my devices. Apple? no thanks