A cappella arranging: How to create rich and resonant choral chords | Choir With Knut

[@DJLA]

3:15 That feeling when the harmony hits just right and you cant help but Knut.

[@a2zpiano]

As a pianist/ keyboardist , I have always had a big interest in vocal arrangement.. This lesson has helped.. Thank you!

[@KnutsMusic]

You're very welcome! :-D

[@melodysimms4835]

0:32 I CANT with the smile from the one member who you can tell composed it for the group lmao. So proud!!! 😂

[@BillHilton]

As several other people have said, this deserves about 190 million views. Brilliant!

[@jayjin7487]

A lot of music theory and science. Wasn’t expecting it but everything made sense.

[@KnutsMusic]

Thanks for your comment! I realise that this can be a tricky topic, but I'm happy to hear that it wasn't confusing 🙂

[@scottmorwitz2753]

Thank you! I’ve begun composing 4 part choral pieces after being a professional singer and chorister for over 30 yeas and it’s nice tie the harmonic series in with the Bachian choral standards. Makes you wonder how much he knew about acoustics at that time.

[@arthurbomamigo3448]

Really nice choir ending!! I really do appreciate this harmonization

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you very much! 😀

[@lisiak1166]

Best explanation of doubling 3rds and parallel 5ths I've ever heard wow. Feels good to finally understand the thinking behind it!

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you! Yes, I remember that when I was first told about parallel moving fifths and doubled thirds I didn't get a particularly good explanation of exactly why they were discouraged; it seemed like an arbitrary "rule" without any real justification! It wasn't until my last year of university, when I learned about the harmonic series and how it affects how frequencies sound together, that I made the connection. So it's not obvious, but it's understandable once we look at the physical properties of sound! However, I often use parallel moving fifths to achieve a "medieval" or "glassy" quality, so there are definitely times when they can be very effective! 😉

[@choralvoice]

@@KnutsMusic Great video! And yes, avoiding parallel fifths is so important, especially between the outer voices (oops: see your parallel fifths at 10:58). 🤭

[@KnutsMusic]

​@@choralvoice Hahah yes, I do have parallel (compound) fifths between the outer parts in this example. With parallel fifths I do find, personally, that I don't mind them if there are inner parts between them like in this case, as this will kind of "cover over" the parallel motion, especially in the case of pop music. Of course, this will come down to personal taste; some may find that the parallel fifths effect is still too strong even with inner parts between them, and another factor adding to this might be how tension notes are resolved (something like resolving the dominant seventh upwards might sound awkward). That being said, if you're writing common practise counterpoint then you should probably avoid parallel moving fifths between the outer parts if possible!

[@jimmywang5441]

Awesome, thanks for taking the time to create this series! Not just explaining the 'what' but also the 'why' - this is invaluable knowledge. You are helping to foster a capella music all over the world! Cheers from Australia

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you very much for your kind words; I'm glad to hear that it was useful to you! :-D

[@gemmamerinserra4988]

Very good video. It explains what many harmony treatises fail to explain.

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you very much; you're too kind! 😊

[@randyalexander4042]

Don't cross voices? Did you learn that in a basic music theory class? So did I, but after reading thousands of choral scores I find that all the great composers have done it, and it's GORGEOUS! If you limit your writing by never crossing voices you're missing out on a huge palate of tone color. Same goes with "big intervals on the bottom", harmonic resonance is going to come out of having notes that match up with the harmonic series, not just simply having intervals getting smaller in the chord going from the bottom up.

[@kristoff_silva]

Bom, eu não li "thousands! os choral scores"... mas eu acredito que as coisas mudem, a depender do domínio estético em que o arranjo esteja situado. Ouvindo grupos vocais ( como o trabalho "Vocabularies", do grupo vocal de Bobby McFerrin), há, de fato, vários cruzamentos que soam "gorgeous". Mas não creio que o mesmo arranjo funcionaria para choral. Tudo que foi dito a respeito de ressonância pode ser relativizado quando se pensa que o grupo cantará em condições 100% acústicas, ou trabalhará usando microfones ( quem sabe até compressores). Então, prefiro considerar os aspectos positivos da aula desse professor do vídeo, mas respeito e acolho também as observações que você fez, apesar do tom ( já tão comum) de interpelação não amigável, típico da internet. .

[@bacondoesthings123]

these are just guidelines, and shouldn’t be followed as set-in-stone rules

[@JackieLanceTenor]

Yes that is one of the basic things we learn in music school when it comes to arranging in a standard four voice chorale style. The tips that he's giving in this video are like a basic crash course in arranging for voice just like one would learn in music school. Music is just like many other things, you need to learn the "rules" first before you can effectively break them 😊

[@dandeeand]

What a thorough and entertaining presentation!

[@santhoshjayakaran]

Clear cut explanation for many 'generally' followed rules. Amazing!.

[@prinzyth7395]

This is amazing! I learned about overtones from my saxophone teacher, but I never understood what they were; I thought they were just random notes that low pitches on the instrument could break off into, not realizing their greater influence in harmonies. I’m starting to arrange music, and I know this video will come in handy. Thank you!

[@KnutsMusic]

Thanks for your kind comments; happy to hear that you enjoyed the video! 🙂

[@rhyswheeler19]

Deserves far more views and likes. Nice outrow!

[@K8theKind]

Brilliant video. Omgosh I’m your thousandth subscriber! Gorgeous overtone singing!

[@KnutsMusic]

Wow, thank you! Yes, you are indeed! :-D

[@seth6string]

I appreciate this. I dabble in orchestral composing just for fun and have no theory education. This sort of thing is extremely helpful for me as I often write something on a MIDI app and think it sounds good but always wonder if what I've written makes sense according to music theory or is even playable by a competent musician on a given instrument. Thanks again.

[@KnutsMusic]

Do you think about the harmonic series when structuring the chords while arranging? If not, how do you approach them? :-)

[@SamKeilyMusic]

I never realized that all those part writing rules in music theory had scientific significance! My mind is blown! It all makes sense now.

[@MrOwl1985]

Thank you! That was so clear, concise and informative. You are great teacher.

[@KnutsMusic]

Glad it was helpful! ☺️

[@andywilliams6194]

This was excellent guidance. I will watch it several times. Thank you!

[@BRexxors]

Very well explained! I was brushing off my studies to help a friend with some composition and theory basics...this is a perfect reference!

[@KnutsMusic]

Brandon Rexrode Thank you; I’m happy to hear that it was useful for you!

[@italovidigal1990]

The best chanel's are definitely the best ones.

[@Utkarsh2811]

That was great. I think I'll just bookmark this!

[@nicholaspaul924]

As a professional musician/film composer who is very much driven by the fluid flow of chords this video has helped me so much

[@KnutsMusic]

Thanks; I'm happy to hear that you found it useful! 🙂

[@russcarlson7551]

Sorry to be late to the party. Awesome video. Super helpful. (As many have said.) But, I was blown out of the water by the opening four-part "Lorem ipsum dolor sit amet...etc." So much fun. Never have I ever heard 'placeholder text' sang. Bravo, sir. Keep up the great work!

[@LuanBermudez]

G O L D content ! ! ! thanks... I would never have the possibility to learn faster these topics working alone, first because I have one voice (and all this stuff aboit voicing a choir depends on having different sub-harmonic resonances in different types of voice, so, even If I make any stuff alone I couldn't see these changing in effects properly!)

[@StenOlleMoldau]

Wow. Thank you! So very very informative (and easy to digest!)

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you; I'm happy to hear that it was useful to you! 😊

[@douglascutler1037]

Well done. Very helpful having the audio examples of comparative techniques. Give us more.

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you! Yes, it's great to have good singers available, and that they're willing to help out with quick recordings between sets at corporate gigs! 😅

[@kiliankraus]

love the questioning looks the singer give at the start... we've all been there ;)

[@twominutemusictheory]

Thanks for the shout out! Great video!

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you! Your videos are extremely useful and the one on the harmonic series was quite relevant; thanks for explaining it all so clearly! 😄

[@sevenkilamare4348]

I'm glad that I found your channel.

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you; I hope you'll find my videos useful! 😀

[@sevenkilamare4348]

@@KnutsMusic Yes..very much 🙏

[@hotlemongingerhoney7759]

Thank you. This was very inspiring. and very informative. Although I don't have any clue about music theory. I don't even know what chords I am using in my music. I would like to have some strong choir vocals in my next track and it certainly feels like a challenge. Music theory for me is like hieroglyphics. So I follow the sound and see where it takes me.

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you for your comment! Don't worry, you don't NEED to learn music theory to do music (a good musical ear is the most important), but it can be helpful for speeding up your work, and these days there's loads of useful material online, including here on KZbin! 🙂

[@kasrakkkk]

the last cadence lol.i am a beginner in harmony and looking forward for new videos.thanks

[@garciagrcia]

This video is super well made. Congrats man!

[@silv-eee]

I kinda love parallel moving fifths. They sound so medieval and dramatic.

[@jameswheeler9171]

Great information! Thank you for taking the time to create the content and share!

[@KnutsMusic]

Thanks for your comment; happy to hear that you found it useful! 🙂

[@tiffanylovelovelove]

very informative video! your content deserves more attention

[@johnalan4860]

You are perhaps the most serious musician I have ever watched on KZbin, but in an awesome way! Your dedication to music is inspiring, sir. Where, might I ask, did you study?

[@KnutsMusic]

Hahah, thank you! I went to London College of Creative Media, formerly known as London Centre of Contemporary Music 😉

[@khrienvich4084]

Very nice and informative... thank you

[@arbenramadani2024]

your demonstration is great man! thnx

[@KnutsMusic]

Glad you enjoyed it! 😁

[@alexandergomez617]

Muy aportante, gracias! Saludos desde Medellin Colombia.

[@MariaMartinez-researcher]

As a choir singer, I have seen these norms broken frequently, to the most interesting effect. However, I agree with one: too high and too quiet is really hard to sing. Of course, Beethoven did exactly that in the Ninth. "In the Heavens must live a loving Father" we sang, while cursing Beethoven's memory. On an even funnier note, there are videos around about microtonality and different tuning systems in the varied cultures of the world. Western harmony is not the only way to arrange sounds, or voices. ✌

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi! Yes, it's certainly fine to deviate from the suggestions I outlined if you're trying to achieve specific effects! My suggestions are definitely very "safe", but of course music isn't only about using the safe and predictable solution all the time. I can confirm that Beethoven 9 is a roast to sing for the tenors as well; after waiting to sing for 40 minutes it's 20 minutes of very high notes until the end! 😅

[@uttum87]

An excellent explanation. thank you.

[@riverdreams9510]

Parallel moving 5ths are useful when your trying to built up the arrangement.

[@momuntaiah]

Thanks for the tips

[@salonidesai3035]

Really helpful!! You deserve more subscribers!

[@rikbardyn5914]

Thx a lot for this pist ! I learned a lot from it !

[@KnutsMusic]

That's great; I'm happy to hear that it was useful to you! :-)

[@ayykussh]

thank you for this it is so helpful. I was doing my project for choral arranging. i hope you can also makes videos about how to use ostinato, descant and canon for choral arranging. godblessyou

[@KnutsMusic]

Thanks for your comment; I'll try to cover those topics in future videos! 🙂 If you're wondering about writing descants, I did do a video on countermelodies a while back which may be useful; a lot of the same guidelines will apply to descants 😉

[@MajWinters100]

Interesting. I've dabbled into 3 voice but never into 4 voice arrangements. I'll keep an eye on these tips for my next arrangement. (I've written a 3 voice arrangements for saint seiya's opening "Pegasus Fantasy", using mostly my instincts, and I feel like I pretty much obeyed these rules :P. My next for fun arrangement will be a 4 voice gospel song)

[@Daniels_Rose-3.7]

very useful thanks

[@jackaguirre8576]

0:52 whats that song, is that "Baby's First Chorale?" I cant find it anywhere on KZbin?

[@KnutsMusic]

Hey! Hahah, yes, that's a joke chorale I wrote where I deliberately made every "mistake" one could make in a classical chorale, with parallel moving fifths and awkward voice leading all around. And the text is Lorem Ipsum 😆

[@jairosacramento5537]

This video is great 👌

[@LFCEPrograme777]

Thank you

[@Gregggggggggg]

wait, but what about the parallel fifths between the soprano and the bass? 10:57

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi Greg! The intervals between the soprano and the bass are "compound fifths", i.e. an octave and a fifth rather than just a fifth. In isolation they do sound like parallel moving fifths, though here there are other notes in between the soprano and bass which make this effect less pronounced. People will have differing opinions when it comes to parallel fifths with other notes in between them; I personally don't mind so much, since I don't think the fifths "stick out" as much as they do when there are no other notes between them, but some people may. So, much like when parallel fifths are used in isolation, it's a matter of taste and style. Though, to be honest, I probably could've written a better example here, so there wouldn't be moving fifths of any kind, just for the sake of illustrating the difference. If I ever revisit this topic I'll do this!

[@amilafernando1856]

Thank you really helpful

[@KnutsMusic]

You're welcome; happy to hear that you found it helpful! :-)

[@Jesusllerena21]

What a great video!! You've got a new subscriber!

[@LapiniYui]

Thank you for sharing

[@ActorFlautista]

What software do you use to have the choirs in the background of this video sing so perfectly? I love the sounds!

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi! All of the vocal and choir recordings in the video are performed by live singers 🙂

[@avialbersbenchamo4797]

Thank you 🙏

[@ydva1317]

In the example in 5:10 the one that "Doesn't sound ""wrong" "" you have a tenor singing a C# or that is the loudest overtone I've ever head. Perhaps we could hear the chord as written without the Major 7th if your example is to be honest and truly informative?

[@crocodileman7790]

Is this can be apply to strings too?

[@pwoseidon]

Thank you so much!

[@KnutsMusic]

You're welcome! :-)

[@ГошаЛитвиненко-н1н]

Can we use just a counterpoint rules, without looking on the harmony theory? Which technicas of composition of choral music could be used by beeginers like me? Thank you, I am really happy that alghorythm of youtube suggested your chanel

[@KnutsMusic]

Hey! Thanks for your kind words! I did make a video about countermelodies a while back, which you can find here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/gJmoopWPid-Lf7c It's very basic and doesn't go into detail about musical genres that use counterpoint extensively, but will give you some general pointers :-) Regarding the techniques used, is there something specific you're wondering about? I think the "simplest" way to do choral composition is to do chorale style composition in three or four parts, as it mostly takes out the rhythmic interplay and just focuses on voice leading and effective use of harmony. There's also a lot of resources out there on how to do it, and it can be used for pretty much any type of music (albeit more effectively for some than others). I'd also say that less is generally more with voices; you can simplify a fair bit and still get an effective performance. Don't shy away from unison/octaves and "basic" harmony! And as with so many things, just doing it loads and hearing how different arrangements sound will get you a long way; suffice to say I've learned the most from doing arrangements that turned out to have strong flaws in the end!

[@mindless9342]

Great stuff. Subscribed!

[@Sedamusic]

very helpful thank you!

[@LauraTheMusician]

I noticed that in the voice-crossing examples, they both featured the D# leading tone resolving down to the B. Was this out of a preference for ending with a complete chord (including the 5th)? I personally enjoy it more when the leading tone resolves upward (in this case to E), and am willing to sacrifice the 5th from the destination chord.

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi Laura! Yes, in this case I opted for a complete chord, though I do prefer resolving the leading tone upwards when possible! When I do a whole arrangement I'll consider how long the chord is held for; if it's a shorter chord I may not worry too much about making it "full", but if it's a longer chord, particularly if it's the last chord of the arrangement, I'll usually choose a full chord. In this case I would've ended up with a chord with three roots unless I'd made it an inversion, so I figured I'd sacrifice the voice leading slightly 🙂

[@yamchathewolf7714]

Useful stuff man!

[@GermonoToussaint]

Yes. Yes.

[@_leivo]

Pro info!

[@argile5]

So just to be clear, what exactly is the cardinal sin of arranging?

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi! I joke in the video that it's parallel moving fifths, since this tends to be frowned upon in certain genres of music and perhaps a little too vehemently so. But of course there are no "cardinal sins" of arranging, except perhaps to arrange in a way that's impossible to perform on an instrument (like asking a soprano singer to sing the C at the bottom of the bass clef, for example)! ;-)

[@AswantKumar]

thank you!

[@reuelmensah7380]

Hi, what do u do with extended chords that have more than necessary notes for a four part harmony. What notes in the chord can I go with in the arrangement?

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi Reuel! It'll of course vary from situation to situation, but generally speaking the melody note definitely needs to be in it, and the root note since extended harmony is usually in root position. You can safely get rid of the 5th (if it isn't the melody note and hasn't been altered), as it doesn't tend to affect the quality of the chord much. Key is to make sure you have the third and seventh present, as these have the strongest effect on the chord's quality. This does mean that, if the melody is on the root or fifth, you'll probably need more than four parts to make it an extended chord, though if the melody is the third, seventh or an extension it does mean you've got space for one extension in four parts. Exactly which is a little harder to determine, as it will depend on where the melody is and where the chord is heading. The most general tip would be to avoid any extension that creates a minor 2nd or minor 9th interval with the top part, though again there will be plenty of situations where you can do this! Maybe I'll look into this in a future video, though I did do an (admittedly quite long!) live arranging session of Greensleeves with extended harmony a while back if you're interested!

[@Vasioth]

In your example at 10:56 you still have parallel fifths between the bass and soprano so not a very good showcase of an example without them 😅 I mean they are most emphasised in the outer voice pair (SB) compared with inner voice pairs, even if you're talking here about the SA. The outer voice pair should be all kosher with its counterpoint, at least in my eyes. They're the voices we are most drawn to and the most contrapuntally relevant until you start introducing imitative counterpoint in every voice like, say, a fugue.

[@jervisleron33]

new subscriber here🙋

[@pzdipuing]

Sir is bass person must be the shortest and tenor must be the tallest or

[@KnutsMusic]

Well, in the opening skit I’m singing the tenor part and I’m a fair bit taller than Jeremy, but I’ve met a lot of short tenors and tall, lanky basses! 😜

[@pzdipuing]

Thank you dude great video great song

[@amir.nouroozi.composer]

Nice

[@landersiqueiros6538]

What were you singing at the beginning?

[@KnutsMusic]

Hi! It's a joke chorale I wrote called "Lorem ipsum", where I "break all the rules": lots of parallel moving fifths and octaves, strange voicings and overall just having a lot of fun with them 🙃

[@landersiqueiros6538]

@@KnutsMusic Hahaha I did notice some of those things, nevertheless, it still sounded very nice! I guess that's the human voice for ya 🤷.

[@KnutsMusic]

@@landersiqueiros6538 Hahah, thank you! Some of these old compositional rules are perhaps a bit antiquated and don't mean as much today, since we're exposed to a lot more styles of music now than people were likely to be back in the day. But I also included a version "following the rules" as backing music at the end of the video (at least I think I did; it's been a while since I made it!), where you can hopefully hear a difference when compared to the opening version 🙂

[@paulmdevenney]

It's pretty hard to hear your voice above the background choir.

[@judeantoinelugsanay8382]

Just a question. Do you agree that the best chords in which you can double thirds are the 2nd, 3rd, and 5th of the scale? That's what I read in Hawley Ades's book.

[@KnutsMusic]

I would personally only avoid doubling the third in a major chord, and that's not considering any other factors, like section size and placement in the singers' ranges. So, in your example I'd agree with doubling the third being okay for the 2nd and 3rd steps of the scale (which, assuming it's a major chord, would both be minor chords), and for the fifth I would probably not do it personally (since it would be major or dominant). But it's also going to matter how many people are singing each note, of course, and where in their range it is (low notes in the range may not project much, so more people on that note might be better). I think it's best to treat the "no doubling of the third in a major chord" rule as a general tip which you can break at your leisure if you think it'll be better for the chord in question, though in most situations it'll probably sound better to double the root or fifth instead. ;-) That's assuming that you're using triadic harmony; it's not nearly as important if you're using lots of extensions (though then you may not have any parts left over to double the third)! I hope that's helpful; sorry if it's a little scatterbrained! X-D

[@judeantoinelugsanay8382]

@@KnutsMusic hehe I'm very sorry. 6th I mean.

[@KnutsMusic]

@@judeantoinelugsanay8382 Ah, I see! Yes, the sixth step of a major scale would also be a minor chord, so that sounds like what I think! Though I would always put voice leading first; if doubling the third in a major chord creates the least awkward and most singable line, that's probably the best solution ;-)

[@emilyrln]

The last chord of that intro was… spicy.

[@KnutsMusic]

Hahah, I basically wrote a chorale where I "broke all the rules" and made my friends sing it with me; they took it in good humour but I should hope most singers don't have to endure singing an arrangement that bad too often 😆

[@emilyrln]

@@KnutsMusic The look on her face XDD "Doth mine ears deceive me?"

[@NahuelPavano]

Thanks a lot for this! Im putting together a vocal quintet. Can anyone give me a hand on repertoire suggestions? Looking for stuff in the same vein of take six or jacob collier! Every suggestion is welcome. Greetings from argentina! subbed!

[@garygimmestad4272]

While there’s good information about the harmonic series and resonance in this video, Knut’s conclusions are radically conservative. Unless you’re interested in imitating the canon from which these rules were derived (your question implies you’re not), don’t let Knut’s rules guide you, but do let the lessons about resonance guide you. One of our mutual heroes, Jacob Collier, argues very convincingly that there are no wrong notes. But he understands far better than most of us how frequencies and timbres resonate with each other. Studying jazz harmony would be a good start for you. You can get scores for some Take Six tunes, and the amazing June Lee has transcribed a number of Jacob Collier’s tunes (wow!). You can watch them scroll by with the music on KZbin. You can also get scores arranged by their great predecessor, Gene Peurling, who was a singer and arranger for the Hi-Los - the masters of the mid-20th century tight harmony style which Take Six took to another level, and Jacob Collier to yet another. Transcription is by far the best teacher. Start easy and let your ear and brain develop. It’s the old 10,000 hours thing. It just takes time. If you combine it with studying scores you’ll start recognizing tropes and idioms and develop a shorthand. Good luck!

[@MaharlikaChorale]

this video is very informative i learned a lot i think this is the 16 times i watch this video... i really like the last part of the Like Comment Share Subscribe! if you can share the music sheet and allow me to use that... looking forward for more videos...

[@perryfrimpongmensah3710]

The vinheteiro reference XD

[@mrridikilis]

great info! but the music playing is deeply distracting!!!

[@rudikacktgerne111]

Hey great Content! I like your Videos a lot, just make sure u get your links right :P you talked about some other Videos from other creators, would be great to find them in your description. Keep it up & have a nice day (:

[@KnutsMusic]

Thank you for your kind words! Ah, yes; I did link to them using cards in the video but have added links in the description as well ;-)

[@yamchathewolf7714]

5:46 am I the only one who thinks the one with not crossed paths sounds worse?

[@ClassicalFreak74]

Smart and handsome 😍

[@damdominici]

I need to be your friend

[@Mario-yx1pq]

the choir in the beginning was so flat lol

[@Nienpet]

The swingle singers background music is annoying. Great content though. Thanks 😊👍

[@lukemullan636]

3:15 i SHIDDED FARDED AND CUMBED

[@aishikchakraborty6816]

Thank you so much!!

[@Mr_A_Mia]

Thank you!