A Disastrous Beekeeping Decision | Synergistic Reaction

[@viahoneybees]

Thanks for the video, Mike! We all make some mistakes along the way. That is where the beauty is at. We always learn best from those.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Tom. This was a hard hitting lesson. Just needed to gove the crystals more time to dissipate I suppose.

[@rodkirt9273]

My hives are in 35 miles due south of Atlanta , Georgia . I live 1 mile west of the Flint River which has thousands of fertile honeybee hives in the trees of the river’s swamps . My robbing is extremely intense ; so I reduced my entrances to 1/4 inch by 3/8 inch and my hives are able to “ come and go “ easily enough but the feral bees can not rob my hives .

[@MikeBarryBees]

I have mine all reduced, but if they get weak, it's over pretty quickly. I don't see it too bad, but once they are all but gone, it happens so quickly. Glad you have it under control. I know that large swamps, rivers, and lakes house a ton of feral bees, and I know it has to be a lot to deal with. Thanks for watching!!

[@rtxhoneybees]

I just followed up an OAV treatment with Apitablet, 24 hrs later. I did it with 9 colonies that had significant mite drop after the OAV. This is the second time I have done this. No problems the first time. The smell of Thymol in the Apitablet is a good bit weaker than the Apiguard. The fact you had another colony with differing results leads me to beieve there is another reason. That voice over was a great addition to this video.

[@MinnesotaBeekeeper]

Same here, same thoughts. Something else is going on.

[@dcsblessedbees]

It doesn't sound like he was using the over time items, sounds like he was using actual treatments. An OA and Thymol treatment would cause a chemical interaction. I'd bet they got into something and it weakened them to the point the others saw them as a target.

[@dcsblessedbees]

Ya he put Apiguard on them it hits harder then the pucks.

[@MikeBarryBees]

I thought about that for sure Phillip. There were some dead bees on the other one, but not like this one. Could've been something that had them already sick too. Just not sure. I'll just wait a week between them if I do it again, but only if I first do the OAV. Thymol first would require more time since the thymol absorbs in the wax. It does dissipate out of the wax well, but it takes at least 2 to 3 weeks for that.

[@judykeller599]

You didn't bore me at all I'm a second-year beekeeper and I'm still trying to learn all of this thank you so much for showing this I know it was bad and when I lost quite a few fees not long ago from Robbing at I cried my son really had to do some talking me down to keep me from quitting

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Judy for the support and for sharing that.. Yes, we can have a bad experience that can really discourage us, but that's why we need to be in touch with other beekeepers, to get encouragement. Just like your comment hear and others that encourage me. I lost 17 out of 22 years back due to an unknown poisoning, and likely was malicious. It was hard to start back up again, but I am glad I did.

[@donbearden1953]

Mike, I love your honesty and thank you for posting it! I have Apivar on a couple of horizontal hives right now and I almost hit them with OA this past week with the Apivar still on. Maybe the Lord has used your video to show me and possibly many others not to mix two treatments! By you weakening one of your hives, you may have saved many hives for other folks by teaching them not to do what you did. God bless you my brother! The last 13 months of my life has been very hard and I’ve learned to look at things differently and look for the good and not just complain about the bad. I don’t feel like I’m better than any one else and I know I make mistakes every day. Thinking about the things that you said in your video it brought 2 scriptures to me that I feel led to share and here they are. “Trust in the LORD with all thine heart; And lean not unto thine own understanding.” ‭‭Proverbs‬ ‭3‬:‭5‬ ‭KJV‬‬ “Offer the sacrifices of righteousness, And put your trust in the LORD.” ‭‭Psalm‬ ‭4‬:‭5‬ ‭KJV‬‬

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks so much for the encouragement Don and I sure hope it helps everyone. I think about you often my friend and I know it's been a difficult time for you. Many prayers offered for you and always here if you need anything.

[@SylantBill]

Thank you for this video. I was just getting ready to do the same thing.

[@MikeBarryBees]

My pleasure and glad you were able to see it before a possible mistake. It may or may not have been, but better safe than sorry.

[@brianbennett4374]

Thanks for sharing with us. Hope they make it threw. Keep us posted. Good luck with them 😊

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Brian and I will have the follow-up posted soon. Next video actually.

[@michaelshelnutt3534]

You got photo bombed again @ 14:50 LOL

[@MikeBarryBees]

I saw that!! LOL!!

[@louiseibbotson588]

Sorry to say Mike these are the most informative videos for beekeeper . I think because they were so big they created a lot of heat and that kicked off the mix of treatments and started to kill them . Reduce feed and 🤞. Thanks for showing this .

[@MikeBarryBees]

Well, I sure hope everyone can learn from this. I will post the follow-up next. Thanks for the encouragement.

[@ThatBeeMan]

Thanks for the good advice, Mike! I wonder if this synergy is a problem with any thymol treatment with OAV.

[@MikeBarryBees]

My pleasure Brad. I'm not sure, and really not 100% sure about this actual situation, although everything points to these two compounds mixing. Phillip said his low dose thymol sugar tablets aren't having adverse affects, but they are quite a bit weaker. And I would have to wonder about the OAE. It doesn't coat everything, but it is concentrated on the pads. I'm just not going to take any chances and honestly, they are normally done a couple months apart in my yards.

[@gregdunn8208]

Good information Mike. I'll be more careful mixing treatments from now on.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Greg and we have to be mindful whether they are organic compounds or not...That is definitely my take away from it.

[@shanephillips113]

It's been so.warm up here in East Tennessee that the bees have been super active. I had them beefed up before the October frost but we're in the 80s for at least another week. I think I'm gonna have to feed again.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Yep the warm weather when it's supposed to be cool sure can throw a wrench in our plans. Keep them heavy and hope you have a great fall season Shane!!

[@dcsblessedbees]

Oh no fun Mike they made a mess there, beekeeping is hard some times. When they pick one they are going to rob-out it's difficult to get them to stop, they hammer a hive HARD! Thanks Mike. Over a short period of time the the residual OA crystals break down and doesn't leave a contaminant. I believe I saw on a video, OA stays in the hive for 30 minutes when we vapor then after that the residue will stay on the wax for 24 hours or so, depending on local climate.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Yes, same thing I have been taught about the vapor and the crystals. Definitely need a week between treatments to be sure in my opinion.

[@brucesbees]

I treated recently with Apiguard. Waited a week and hit them hard with OAV. Then waited another week and used Apiguard. Seemed to work ok but they did have that delay of a week between treatments. Didn’t stack the two treatments the same day. As you said it could have been something else but certainly could have been synergistic effect. Silver lining…I bet the mite count is low. Maybe they will make it and grow to a nice strong colony!

[@brucesbees]

I really wonder if they did get into some kind of poison though because if it was synergism from the treatments it seems like it would have hammered the other one as well.

[@MikeBarryBees]

That is the only thing that does make me think it might not have been the two together is that the other didn't succumb. Not even close. Thanks for commenting Bruce!

[@kathyhathaway8823]

Hello Mr Mike It is always better to show all sides of all the things we have to deal with good or bad an that is what I like about YOU an your VIDEOS you are a straight shooter to everyone. This one to me is kind hard to tell what caused it an it may be all the above. When my yard got into that poison I had dead bees bunches of inches deep . I just wanted to go an bang my head on a tree but I thought well it would probably kill the tree also . I think what you did was the perfect fix to what needed to be done. Thanks an have a good week . Thanks

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement. It was a hard video to make, but I like to show it all as best I can and try to keep the camera around a lot of times. That's why I started the channel, to show what an average hobby beekeeper goes thru now and again. Thanks again!!

[@laruestephens3743]

Great story with a lot of good teaching points, Mike.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks and thanks for the encouragement. Enjoyed seeing you again and hope to get back over there to the coast again soon!

[@brucesouthernsassapiaries8316]

SCPO Mike, I feel your pain. I have experienced this same thing in years past when using Thymol late in the season on individual high mite count colonies. I believe that the Thymol masks the "normal" pheromone profile of a queen right hive and marks the hive for robbing during a dearth. I didn't have that issue when I had thymol on all of my colonies only when done with individual colony treatment. Happy Veteran's Day!!!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the comment and that makes good sense. Very well could've been the issue here. It really caught me off guard.

[@brettellis1837]

I think a some one needs a big hug.😂

[@MikeBarryBees]

I sure was upset and irritated at myself all at the same time Brett.

[@johnkasprak5707]

We’ve all been there and will again. If it was easy … you know the rest! Thanks for sharing this. It’s a valuable lesson and will surely save others some heartache. Take care!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouraging comment John!! Hope you are well.

[@bligon11]

I’m sorry you lost some of your bees!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the concern and for watching!!

[@keithspillman]

Don't beat yourself up. We've all zigged when we should have zagged!!! No doubt it's aggravating.....but you have a few million other bees doing just fine thanks to you!!!! Take care and see you soon at NAHBE!!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Keith!!

[@alphaxanon]

Hey Mike, long time viewer, fist time poster. I was looking back a couple of videos and I think I heard you say this very hive had a mite count of 20-30. So maybe by the time you got around to treating it, it was too far gone with whatever viruses. Just a thought.

[@MikeBarryBees]

I thought about that and another viewer brought up something similar. But I don’t think it was a virus since basically about a deep and a half of bees died within 18 hours. Now what the other viewer brought up was that they could’ve had a high virus load and that they were unable to take the treatments due to being sick. Still not sure that is really viable, but it could be. I still lean toward the mix of OA and Thymol, but really, who knows at this point. It just resembled a poisoning, similar to when someone poisoned my entire bee yard back around 2016. I’m glad you came on and posted and I sure appreciate your long time support!! Thanks so much!

[@jamescarter7752]

The combination of the two chemicals probably made them sick and the robbers sensed their weakness and started robbing. I've been keeping bees for over 40 years, and still make mistakes from time to time. With a little attention they will probably be just fine. God bless.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement James!!

[@LittleRiverBees-or6qp]

I bet a good chunk of those dead bees were the robbers.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Good point, maybe so. It has been reduced by at least one deep though. I have the follow-up coming in the next video.

[@royprough1877]

I was just thinking tonight about running formic then hitting with vapor to kill phorectic mites after the treatment this makes me rethink it my summer treatment...

[@MikeBarryBees]

I'd definitely be careful running two different treatments too close to each other Roy. Not unless it's already been done.

[@redfish440]

Thanks Mike, you’ve never made a boring video in my opinion, hopefully this colony will take off again and they’ll be fine. God bless !

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks so much for the encouragement!

[@nancynolton6079]

A beekeeper keeps taking the bits and pieces of info and mulling them over until a reason/solution arises! Good work Mike! And yes always praise the Lord!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the post Nancy and I agree, we just keep analyzing the info and we can build off of it.

[@daleford5531]

So find the queen .take a frame of brood and add it..move the hive somewhere else! Easy fix.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Or reduce them, add honey, and then feed them. Just as easy. I don’t go and take brood from other colonies this late. That’s not a good move in November. Makes more sense to combine them if there were no queen.

[@Burntbranchcreekbees]

I have done things on a couple of occasions that resulted in the loss of colonies as well, and you are right because it does make you sick when you really care about their welfare. God bless you brother and your bees.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement!!

[@royandrews7423]

I don't use ANY chemicals on ANY of my hives .

[@MikeBarryBees]

Well, that’s good Roy. Everyone has their research threads and reason for doing what they do. By the way, I don’t use chemicals either. These were two organic compounds. Same as using essential oils. There is synergy with oils and it has been proven that oils and combinations of them can damage the good bacteria and spores and natural elements the bees have built up in the environment. It’s all a research game and many people do it many different ways. I made a mistake, but I’ll continue to use compounds in combatting mites, just more carefully. I like to hear what everyone does, even if it’s nothing at all so that I can be well up to speed.

[@1bojaq]

Wasn’t boring was a good learning video. Might prevent someone else from making a bad decision.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the comment. I hope others take note for sure.

[@rodneymiddleton9624]

It's all possible with the cause. Thanks Mike!

[@MikeBarryBees]

I agree Rodney. Thanks my friend!!

[@CentralKyBees]

We all make mistakes. I accidentally let a colony starve to death last year, I was making a KZbin vid and ran across it. I knew what had happened and you could tell by my voice in the video that I was upset and mad at myself. I had just overlooked that particular colony and didn't feed it. Things happen but we bounce back.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement! Just aggravated at myself more than anything.

[@JamesCrouchX]

You made a discovery!

[@MikeBarryBees]

Indeed I did....A hard one, but a discovery nonetheless.

[@taylorboysoutdoors]

Great info Buddy. Hope yall are well. ❤

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Jody, all good down here. Hope y'all are well too.

[@danielweston9188]

They were sick before treatment.....

[@MikeBarryBees]

I don’t think that was the case. A virus would not kill that quickly and that many in 18 hours or less. Viruses kill off quite a bit slower. More of a dwindle. Nothing’s impossible, but I just think it resembles a poisoning for it to be that fast, whether external or by the two treatments.

[@danielweston9188]

@@MikeBarryBees HVL reducing their abilities to handle the treatments.

[@brettellis1837]

And a op rum to calm the farm lol 😂.

[@gallowaylights]

00:10:14 Aha... pheromones got masked and they had a civil war!🤔

[@MikeBarryBees]

Well, whatever the case, it was a massacre!!

[@wpankey57]

I’m sorry to hear how stressed out you are. I know you care for your bees and want the best for them. I hope they make it. Keep us posted.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement. I have the follow-up being posted soon.

[@tarheelbeekeeper3971]

Life lessons are never easy but hopefully we learn from them. Keep on keeping on. At least it wasn’t a total loss. Thanks for sharing

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Randy for the encouragement.

[@DonaldFarmHoney]

Thanks for the video Mike. You probably just saved a lot of colonies. You can hear it in your voice that you were torn up about your bees.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for commenting Billy. I was even more irritated at myself. That whole shoulda, coulda, woulda deal....

[@russellaymond312]

Mike just learn from it. It can happen to anyone of us thanks for sharing.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the encouragement Russell!!

[@T.S.Beez01]

watching Bob Binnie earlier today, he did mention that adding AO & APIVAR, is toxic, IF you don't let the APIVAR clear for at least 2wks, but adding APIVAR to AO. the AO only needs 3 or 4 days to clear. so quit knockin yourself sideways, sounds to me like there's another reason, even if you're correct, accidents happen, BUT, going off what you're saying "I don't think it was your fault" GOOD LUCK with this & other hives... UK beekeeper

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks for the thoughtful comment!! I have yet to catch p on watching and should be seeing Bob's video this weekend. I usually stay a week behind on his videos with work and all. I just need to think things thru to eliminate beekeeper error to the best of my ability. Easier to narrow down when we do that. Thanks for watching from abroad!!

[@T.S.Beez01]

not a problem sir, i watch you regularly​@MikeBarryBees

[@KajunHomestead]

Great video Mike, Stuff happens but least you giving them a chance to make it through the winter.

[@MikeBarryBees]

Thanks Brad!