A FAKE GOLD BUFFALO HOW TO SPOT IT and How We Know for Sure!

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A FAKE GOLD BUFFALO HOW TO SPOT IT and How We Know for Sure!
Commercial Rare Coins
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[@bigrobnz]

man you need a camera man to film while you do the commentary,,,,,,,,

[@rgcwow]

Hold your frickin camera steady! Damn!

[@WingmanStudios]

It wasn't that bad. Calm down. It was a watchable video

[@user-tz5uq2bt1s]

I like the new Britannia design. It has a lot of security features. Probably more expensive to counterfeit.

[@markd.songsandstuff7728]

There's now a thing called Pocket Pinger that holds the coin while you tap it, pretty neat tool.

[@goldenrod8861]

There's a ring test app for devices. Should be using a piece of soft wood to strike, especially on the Buffaloes.

[@tubularfrog]

At about 11:30 you stated that the American gold eagle is 90% gold and 10% copper. The actual composition is 91.67% gold, 3.00% silver, and 5.33% copper. The Krugerrand is 91.67% gold and 8.33% copper, that's why they have a more reddish coloration. It would be interesting to see the analysis that your XRF tester produces on these two types of coins. Maybe for another video.

[@tmo4330]

Yes, the krugerrand does not even look like gold.

[@artboston4787]

The original St Gaudens $20 coin was 90% gold and 10% copper. Perhaps he thought this modern version is the same?

[@tubularfrog]

@@artboston4787 Maybe so.

[@adamellington4562]

Radar speed guns are calibrated using tuning forks, that should register a specific speed if the gun is properly calibrated. In theory, each specific ringing coin should register a specific speed on a radar speed gun every time. A speed gun is alot cheaper than an XRF and should serve as a quick check. Have not tried this, but shoud work if the coin rings at a frequency that is within the radar speed gun's detection range.

[@freedomfight1933]

Thanks for those tips! I'll be in the area and stop in sometime

[@BobBob-yf3zo]

Thanks for the upload btw

[@geraldfordman7474]

Thank you for these valuable testing techniques.

[@fredregler5055]

Very informative but you need a tripod stand for the camera.

[@CommercialRareCoins]

Working on it, New videos with a tripod from now on for you!!! ;)

[@merrymaurader2521]

@@CommercialRareCoins overhead tripod. I got one and they are awesome for yt videos

[@namehidden8854]

When you test specific gravity, you should not contact the water with your glove . . . you are removing water and throwing off the calc.

[@leonstarrksantiago3507]

The way you made that bell 🔔 like sound. Would it work on 1 oz gold bar?

[@CommercialRareCoins]

Yes, but it will have its own sound!

[@VerifyVeracity]

American Gold Eagle Coin is .9167 fine gold

[@upnorthcollector3267]

Cool. Thank you.

[@patrickt873]

Question. So if the XRF only measures the surface, what cost effective equipment will actually identify the metals?. I checked and those Sigma Analytics metal tester are pretty expensive. Any equipment you can recommend?.

[@ptaeiy]

I use a scale, digital calipers and specific density test and dimensional measurements to test my PMs. I also bought a relatively cheap Ultrasonic Thickness meter to verify my thickness measurements. Here's how it works .So if you measured your metal thickness, say gold, with a caliper and got a reading of say 3 mm. Then you set up your Ultrasonic meter to read Gold, and if it measured way more than/less than 3 mm. then your metal is not/not wholly made of gold. You can do same with any metal. As an aside, you could set the meter to read Tungsten and see if the measurement matches. This is a very good test for bars to check for non-precious metal inserts. Just probe at many different points on the bar to find any inserts.

[@alexpearson8481]

Weight is the main component. If it measures 1 Troy exactly or a touch over should be fine. then do a ring test and visual inspection. Should be good if it passes those. Any fakes I have heard of are very obvious. Gold coins are hard to fake. The only thing that scares me are gold bars that could have a tungsten center. Fire assay is the only sure way to know in that case.

[@MelloGee33]

@@ptaeiy Calipers don't do anything for un-graded, un-slabbed coins. If you get a Buffalo that was struck too hard or has some finning, then so much for the caliper test.

[@michaelargenta3856]

Where did you get those machines

[@SilasMarnerAuAg]

thanks for the video. imo government backed counterfieting. couldn’t get a real good look but the morgan’s looked pretty good at first glance too. china‘s just cranking them out. getting better and better every year. thanks again

[@BigMoney23223]

As soon as the racketeer nickel hit the table, the sound instantly gave it away it was a fake. Sounded identical to a regular nickel being set down

[@BobBob-yf3zo]

I've a buffalo that looks incredible in terms of fine detail, correct weight, passes ping test on mobile apps but the specific gravity value of 16.5?? My scales are not high end and using a plastic beaker in my kitchen. Should I be worried?

[@goldaddict6427]

11:26 Elsewhere on the internet, it says that the American Gold Eagle is 22k, i.e. 91.17% gold. Also, it said that the impurities added to the gold consist of silver and copper rather than just copper. I'm not sure whether you are correct or my other sources are.

[@samlevites9824]

You are correct and he is not. Krug is only copper added to it, but eagles are silver ave copper.

[@bx3556]

Everyone should at least train themselves on the ping tester and sound of gold 24k vs 22k vs not-gold. Makes things easier. But love these kinds of machines too.

[@larrywheels762]

My Buffalo reads 1.1 oz on scale. Excellent video.

[@appleztooranges]

My LCS dealer wanted to break out my pf70 buffalo to test it. I said hell no lol.

[@geraldfordman7474]

I challenge the term for your "specific gravity" machine which ought to be termed "Specific DENSITY" machine. If an object or thing is heavier than "air" then it will fall to the ground, not due to gravity. I do have GRAVE concerns about the term Gravity.

[@pabloescobar1106]

So what causes items to fall? Also specific gravity is a real measurement density and specific gravity are two different things

[@robertbrandywine]

Google says there is density or specific gravity. Nothing about specific density. Things fall to the ground because time slows down near masses.

[@ryanorrock6501]

We get it...don't we Peter? ;)

[@WingmanStudios]

Specific gravity is the scientifically correct terminology.

[@silversurfer6821]

density and boyoncy explains the world no magic gavity needed fellow FE

[@TimothyWhittingtonYeOldeRufus]

Thanks

[@madmike_9343]

So if mine says copy, is it real?

[@mrsig7381]

Great information! Thank you.

[@CommercialRareCoins]

Glad it was helpful!

[@victorfrankenstein50202]

Like the fake test comparisons, but the American Gold Eagle is 91.67% Gold, and about 3% Silver, and about 5% Copper. Just a tad misleading, but I’m sure you’re just round abouting for the general viewers.

[@gerardososa7016]

What's your opinion on Gold backs are there real and what companies do you recommend for buying some

[@robertbrandywine]

If the American Eagle was just gold and copper, it would have a reddish tinge like a Krugerrand.

[@jadenephrite]

Regarding 9:56, gold plated tungsten core coins can deceive gullible buyers, because the density of tungsten is virtually the same as gold which is 19.3 grams per cubic centimeter. If a specific gravity tester is used on a gold plated tungsten core coin, then specific gravity determination alone may not be able to distinguish gold plated tungsten from genuine pure gold with absolute certainty. Furthermore regarding 11:02, modern American Gold Eagle coins since 1986 are not 21.6 karats; instead they are 22 karats which has a purity of 91.7 % gold plus their alloy combination of 5.3% copper ad 3% silver. On the other hand, old United States gold coins minted prior to 1933 had a purity of 90% gold plus 10% copper which is 21.6 karats.

[@israelt.3739]

How to tell when gold and tungsten alloy is introduced with 25% or so integrated in the coin?

[@jadenephrite]

​@@israelt.3739 Thank you for your question. Fake gold coins are not typically made from gold combined with only 25% tungsten, because they would fail the specific gravity test. Instead fake gold coins are typically made from a mostly tungsten core with a layer of gold on the surface. The first step of detection is to weigh a dubious gold coin to measure its grams. The next step is to use calipers to measure the coin's diameter and thickness. Then compare its measured diameter and thickness to known specifications for that coin. If only 25% tungsten were used in the coin, then the coin's diameter or thickness will be wider or thicker than the required specifications. Furthermore, by measuring the diameter and thickness of a coin, then its volume can be calculated for cubic centimeters. Then divide the coin's weight in grams by its volume in cubic centimeters. Weight divided by volume equals the density of the metal. If the dubious gold coin does not have a density of 19.3 grams per cubic centimeter, then it is not mostly gold or tungsten. The next test is to perform the pinging sound acoustic test. A gold coin will produce a resonating pinging sound whereas a tungsten coin will produce a dull sound or a thud.

[@israelt.3739]

@@jadenephrite Dear Jade. Specific gravity of Tungsten is all most identical to gold..Therefore will not show on the volume /weight test..

[@jadenephrite]

@@israelt.3739 It is true that tungsten has almost the same density as gold which is 19.3 grams per cubic centimeter. Therefore two other quick tests can distinguish tungsten from gold. With the pinging sound acoustic test, a gold coin will produce a resonating pinging sound whereas a tungsten coin will produce a dull sound or a thud. The next test is with a neodymium magnet. Since Gold is diamagnetic, the neodymium magnet will be slightly repelled whereas Tungsten is paramagnetic and the neodymium magnet will be slightly attracted towards.

[@MelloGee33]

@@jadenephrite Thickness tests can be off if a Gold Buffalo planchet was struck too hard (or slightly off) on one side and made one side of the coin a hair or two thinner than the other side. Pure gold is soft, it happens. I've seen genuine Buffalos with the thicknesses off on opposite sides of the coin due to a slightly off strike.

[@marshalkrieg2664]

My Buffalo coin does sound leaden when I toss it onto the coffee table , but it then has the bell like tone as well, maybe that sound comes second or after. I bought mine from an established dealer in person so I am not too concerned.

[@williambones3487]

You should mention that electroplating was a new technology and people were not aware that it was possible

[@kostadinkostadinov2510]

The xray machind scans the inside, not the surfase

[@LANDSHARKK]

Gracias amigo

[@CommercialRareCoins]

De nada, me hermano!

[@operationsword9457]

He's correct; Maples have a worse ring. Some even thud. Speculating the super soft metal; Four 9's. Best to weigh and measure.

[@jimrawls5509]

Good information, but I got seasick watching it.

[@CommercialRareCoins]

Sorry very windy that day ;)

[@garybiggs9010]

I can't hear the coin ring test. If you would kindly send me a Gold Eagle and Buffalo I will happily try the test at home. Thanks! PS: I will reimburse you for the shipping cost too.

[@Danny_ll]

I want every major gold coin, but I just want to look at .999 gold, not 90% gold which is a different color. The color difference gets me. Ill still probably buy them lol.

[@migueliniguez9145]

You banged up those coins like crazy lol dropped them , hit them with other coins then rubbed them together.

[@nathanielcooke1902]

and the last test I like to do, if you're still not sure. You can go to your local Home Depot and get a table saw.

[@JonO387]

The buffalo sounded like a nice ring to me.

[@randalljones2823]

If it says copy on it, does that mean it's fake?

[@princeboateng694]

I love those $50 buffalo coins. I’m too poor to buy the real one though :’(

[@mth469]

use digital calipers to measure diameter, and thickness.

[@goldaddict6427]

My thought exactly. However, I think that that specific gravity machine is especially useful in case you're dealing with golf object with a more random shape. An example of such an object would be a gold bar.

[@mth469]

@@goldaddict6427 hence the reason to avoid gold bars and stick to 24k govt issued non-numismatic coins of standard dimensions?

[@goldaddict6427]

@@mth469 Yes, unless you regularly buy gold of different shapes and sizes. In that case, you're probably running a business in which you regularly deal with gold objects.

[@ptaeiy]

I use a scale, digital calipers and specific density test and dimensional measurements to test my PMs. I also bought a relatively cheap Ultrasonic Thickness meter to verify my thickness measurements. Here's how it works .So if you measured your metal thickness, say gold, with a caliper and got a reading of say 3 mm. Then you set up your Ultrasonic meter to read Gold, and if it measured way more than/less than 3 mm. then your metal is not/not wholly made of gold. You can do same with any metal. As an aside, you could set the meter to read Tungsten and see if the measurement matches. This is a very good test for bars to check for non-precious metal inserts. Just probe at many different points on the bar to find any inserts.

[@mth469]

@@ptaeiy I would have thought the wavelength of Ultrasonics was too long to accurately measure down to sub-millimeter accuracy. Have you found any fakes with your testing methods ?

[@makingwaves1239]

It is only one way to be absolutely sure, and that is to put your coins in the machine.

[@chiil034]

Seems like a lot of work considering it fails the weight test immediately, 21 grams... much less than an ounce.

[@carlosevalarezo8759]

Bad camera work and describe more detail side-by-side of what to look for.

[@josephkerns1183]

The fake ones always look like a the Proof versions. That is why I don't like the Proof versions of any coins. Rather have the BU coins instead. Much tougher to fake.

[@arnenl1575]

I'm not getting it.... When you throw a supposedly 1 oz coin on a balance and it says 21.82 g, then you can stop right there. Why all the expensive equipment? Even a cheap kitchen balance would tell you that it's fake.

[@Luckyboyee777]

Some fakes can be the same weight as a real if they use a mix of metals that works. Thats why there are so many test. Including diameter and thickness to measurements to compare to real.

[@turtle1211]

Buffalo has a nice ring , cmon dude - Clean your ears

[@ksiebert631]

Would've been nice to hear what the fake coin sounded like.

[@ronejr766]

I’d be scared I’d leave hairlines on that Buffalo by hitting it with that coin.

[@nate.leal.]

Did I miss the how?

[@MelloGee33]

Give it the *ping* sound test. Tungsten is dead. No sound.

[@gateke1]

Fools gold, they should put on it 'In fools we trust'

[@pavski]

Invest in a tripod please.

[@wizengy]

Bullion Test is an app for an Android device that analyzes the ring of popular bullion coins and gives a verdict of good or bad. This combined with a balance beam tester that checks weight and size will give good confidence for the common bullion coins. The 0.999+ gold coin like the buffalo and maple leaf do give more of a thud than a ring but can still be acoustically tested. The best is to place them on a little dome of soft foam rubber that is commonly used as a packing foam as this will give the full acoustic spectrum. Balancing on your finger will damp out the fundamental frequency and leave only the harmonics. These three tests can be done in about 15 seconds.

[@user-ol5rj8qn9o]

Like watching the Blair Witch Project.

[@Ab82903]

The weight alone is enough to tell....

[@daryljackson3704]

why not have A Sigma tester, alot cheaper

[@gilsgriddleandgrill]

I got soooo dizzy watching this video I had to stop watching it. Dang, easy with the zoom in and zoom out bro.

[@Rob-cm9jr]

I have a racketeer nickle

[@badgerbrry]

camera work is awful

[@stevelarkin3137]

Fake gold always has the proof look to them. That is why I never buy proof coins.

[@spincolor]

dizzying

[@jimjones8268]

its was only 21 grams

[@alanmustarde]

Please fix camera, it is painful to watch.

[@JesusChrist5000]

you can tell the way they ring that these are fake

[@mosiantiques8413]

To much camera moving wasting time

[@julianraiders1112]

there are shit tonnes of these on ebay coming from malaysia and china

[@Z123aba]

Those gloves are too big for your hands

[@InSpadez]

shame he is banging the real one around. worse for the coin if you get it graded.

[@shaggyduder]

Shit, this video was terrible, I stopped watching at the 3m mark, I was getting an F'in head ache.

[@kavya1638]

simply put, don't buy gold or any other kinds of metals. they don't hold up well with the market and almost no one trusts anyone anymore.

[@davidphilips1205]

Good, more for the smart people

[@Drew-Dastardly]

Specific Gravity test is easy to do with a scale and some cotton. The one thing you do not do is lump your stupid thick hands into the water and scoop out a pile of it. Instant fail. No wonder your pure gold was magically more gold that 9999.9

[@unitedstates1ish]

Worst video. Could not watch. Makes me dizzy. Hint. Turn off your phone while making videos.

[@Stevonoles1]

unwatchable

[@phil_k777]

Horrid camera technique! You should be ashamed.

[@lazyboylarry4345]

I can help you with balancing it, get a pocket pinger.