A reshuffling of motor sizes, new 7" motor

[@Kabab]

There is so so soooo much I just chopped out of this video because I don't think I did a good job of conveying the information. I'll re-up all of this later along with the CineSplore videos in the near future when we actually get products into the store. Manufacturers are still severely impacted by the pandemic. The FPVCycle 30mm 7"-8" motor: bit.ly/35zN4ty Frame and new props coming soon The props I'm using on the quad are the DAL Fold 7 which I DO NOT RECOMMEND! because they randomly explode during flight. They are genuinely the best performing 7" prop for control feel but are unusable because of the exploding risk. There are currently no decent 7" props as far as our testing has gone. A few new ones are in the works. For now, the Gemfan 7040 and HQ 7x4x3 are the most reasonable options with the HQ 7x3.5x3 being better for lower weight 7" quads below 900g. Good ESC options for 7": Tekko32: bit.ly/2Ut7HRW Tekko32 metal FET: bit.ly/3kuuasr We have the lowest price on these boards. The quad in the video was running completely stock EmuFlight on the Zeez F7 board. You can use any FC you want. Any F4, F7, H7 or better FC on BetaFlight currently performs the same. The EmuFlight devs say that in the somewhat near future they will take some advantage of the H7 but unknown when. For now, there is zero benefit to an H7. About the DJI system: I don't recommend the bundle DJI setup with the air unit. The Vista's are an alternative air unit and much easier to use. Don't get anything but the default DJI FPV camera. No other camera is any good yet. The controller is not required. You can use any other controller to control the quad still. DJI Goggles: bit.ly/2tCGUJn, bit.ly/2Hvsp0t, amzn.to/3kBDag4 DJI Controller: bit.ly/3dDcGra, bit.ly/31CjUHV, amzn.to/3kp7zhN (you can't use a phantom controller) DJI Vista Unit: bit.ly/3avZCTk, bit.ly/3kpRpEU Longer Vista antenna's and cables: bit.ly/2ViXhFg Stay tuned to www.FPVCycle.com. We've been working extremely hard on a bunch of new things. ▼Join the FB group for more discussion: FPVCycle - Kabab FPV facebook.com/groups/37915... ▼ Tips? Patreon: bit.ly/2oGLP9b $1/mo from 1/4 of my subscribers will make me almost quit my job. Thank you -PayPal: www.paypal.me/kababfpv -Bitcoin: 1E4XZXoD4rS6MYWVWuenY7Kw2M1YgyNpoQ -Nano: xrb_1188ek5bd7tb9kw67asnp9o65byuoaxbtpxuznx1ribf75x78awywmakj55f -ETH: 0xD067F93811f2eC31CB1928901002dfdf9A492EF5 -LTC: La2KWYAjp4VT2Lq2M76pbjzXWvRyjpfCtG

[@EdturdEnfart]

You gonna do a savage bee video or what do you think of the savage bee by Newbeedrone?

[@Kabab]

@@EdturdEnfart it's a bit too similar to my work for basically anyone to say it wasn't very very heavily inspired by the babytooth. I'm not going to bother with it but I can already tell you the spec they've setup for it won't perform nearly as well and the build is gonna be frustrating because of the extremely challenging aio board they expect you to solder to.

[@EdturdEnfart]

@@Kabab thank you for the quick response you are awesome I will definitely building the baby tooth and tp3 this winter !!!

[@sleepyheadfpv1507]

@@Kabab hey man! Would you still recommended these motors for a Thicc build?

[@Kabab]

@@sleepyheadfpv1507 yeah they're definitely more powerful than any 2806.5 but I'm actually beginning to test light X8 builds and you may want to consider a 2806.5 on top and the 3106.5 on the bottom with a more aggressive props on the bottom....

[@lrfpv5292]

Bob, you are a genius. Not telling what size motor you're using prevents the chinese companies from taking monopoly over sections of the market. I applaud your courage to do this and when I have more cash, will try out more of your frames and setups.

[@marc_frank]

he once complained about T-Motor giving their motors names

[@lrfpv5292]

@@marc_frank Haha true lol

[@likandrosmar]

Thank you for this video.. Very nice flying... I am about to build my first 7inch quad...very excited

[@askee2572]

Okay!!! Got these motors in the mail last night got them soldered up and in the air today....gotta say so far I really like them. I had the 2806.5 motors on my 7" before and definitely feel the precision at low throttle and just more power. Way more playful for me. Really excited to get some more time on these!!! Thx bob for doing the homework for us. Money well spent

[@MCsCreations]

Really, really interesting, Bob!!! 😃 The motors look fantastic!!! Well done! Stay safe there! 🖖😊

[@MrJasonodonnell]

1:08 Thats one hell of a lean you got going on there son.

[@1slowgsxr1k]

Damn Bob. I want the whole vid! Speak your knowledge and experience. Next trip to LA we need to fly!

[@tehllama42]

I usually insist on providing some lengthy technical rebuttal to something minor... but instead: I can tell Bob was having fun flying this day... like comical amounts of fun. I'm enjoying watching the full flights, because I can tell that whatever other details he wanted to focus on, instead, just went ripping... and we get to ride along. (As always, LMK if I can help guinea pig this frame and test it out)

[@hateeternalmaver]

"I am not just a supportive comment for the algorithm. I am deeply concerned and involved with the topic at hand, as well as the author, and I encapsulate the entire video in a funny oneliner in-joke that everyone will like" =P much love, Bob.

[@_Brando_69]

The speed is insane. When you come back down under the trees you can see just how fast it's going

[@pippifpv]

Has the 7" props gotten better balanced over time? Can remember "some" time ago, 7" video wasn't as smooth as 5" quads.

[@Kabab]

yeah better balanced but still awful by comparison to how good 5" props have gotten

[@keithcarpenter5254]

@@Kabab use bi blades,and balance them yourself, more efficient.

[@Kabab]

@@keithcarpenter5254 definitely don't have time for that 😅

[@tehllama42]

It's not just prop balance (although they're plenty good), it's that lower authority motors are a nuisance to PID tune, and they pick up strange P/I gain ratios that can lead to wobbles.

[@DrMacca]

Awesome video Bob! Love motor talk! 😁 Stay safe and keep up the great work! 👍❤️

[@FalconRadFPV]

OMG I made a quad lighter than you!? Lol. Your tech talk videos have been really interesting, and the way I've seen you constantly redesigning quads and talking about it has been inspiring to my own creative process. Thank you! After I lost my FlosStyle earlier this year on a long range flight I designed my own quad based off a similar layout. The 7" long range quad is 150 g lighter than the one in this video with a 2200 6s (only 45c). Comparatively I'm not as badly off as I thought at 1335g with a hero 6 and 5200mah 6s li-ion setup that can handle a constant full throttle (w/ 1300kv motors though) I just got the 2806.5 motors after you got me set on them 😉 I'm starting a new build soon though so just might have to try these new motors on it! (if they aren't sold out yet! 😂)

[@Kabab]

yeah there were limitations here I wasn't willing to compromise on. I hate that the frame is so heavy and I still need to add some weight here and there too. It's very common to put the battery like that with the camera far out in front with a dead cat stance in order to get the props out of shot. If you don't need props out of shot than it's a non-issue. You can design a normal quad. Typically I don't go for the absolute lightest thing, I just don't like to waste material anywhere or carry dead weight for the sake of nothing related to performance.

[@badfourlife]

I still have a hard time believing you can full throttle with 1300kv 2806.5 ....the math just doesn't add up and I def pull over 70amps at 75% throttle scaled

[@Kabab]

@@badfourlife my motor is 1450kv. I go full throttle plenty on it.

[@badfourlife]

@@Kabab I mean full throttle on mine will overamp my 6s2p pack which has a max rating of 70amps.... I usually scale my throttle to 75% so I don't go over that so my Lion packs actually last and I don't have to worry about banging full throttle when I want... I even got a switch on my tango 2 that switches throttle scaling from 75-80% for last half of pack as I max out at 60-65 amps once I'm under 3.6v

[@Kabab]

@@badfourlife ah. Yeah that's a bit of a struggle

[@kydawg1684]

Your initial flight video was killer..... seems to be flying at 100mph and buttery smooth. Love that.

[@winder6]

Great to see some more innovation thanks for all your work and flight videos are stellar. See ya

[@stickboyfpv4742]

Hahaha damn it.... 10:37... WE ALLL KNOW that was a perfect shot...! I enjoy your channel man! Been busy but cant wait to catch up on your vids! See what I gotta vet next 🤣!!

[@David__]

Thanks for making this video Bob... totally agree with your philosophy around why 7" Would be more than happy to provide lots of useful feedback if you needed to test out any of these frame / motor setups :)

[@marc_frank]

7" just cruises so fast pigeons travel at about 100 km/h and they can take off backwards

[@volvo850enjoyer8]

I don’t get ir

[@strawhatsam]

Le Pigeon?

[@windwalkerproductions]

Have been waiting/looking for the right 7"+ platform.. holiday shopping first but gonna start getting parts/building something soon.

[@ruftime]

Thanks Bob! The ability for manufacturers to now continually innovate/update is awesome....you’ve seen the benefits.....Kwads and Tesla’s❤️........Life is good here in SoCal😌

[@kley53]

Question about the frame! I want to be able to record onboard so, It fits the air unit in the back? Thanks!

[@Kabab]

This will but this frame is becoming discontinued pending my latest research in my two latest videos

[@markbrittanypalys7406]

Any updates on the frame, not much available other then the fr7 right now. Secondly which kv from your motors do you recommend for 6s?

[@Kabab]

Hopefully it's in the boxes on the way. The issue is raw materials. Massive shortage

[@michaeljohnson6473]

So is the deadcat frame you showed available now?? A New Glide frame??

[@elxero2189]

Thanks, you're the one who sold me on 7" quads and I got the bigger racer star / T motor's on my quad.. I really wanted the brother hobbies 2806 or whatever it was but that's like nearly $30 each soooo. Those fpv cycle motor looks sweet almost looks like a 30mm

[@pirateradioFPV]

Does it still bob around like a wing without the hypersmooth stabilization? (:

[@Kabab]

almost zero bobbling. The bobbling now comes from tuning rather than the quad itself doing something weird. This is on default EmuFlight and I flew it way high up to see if I could catch some breezes and get it to bobblle about. It was locked....but the tuning wobbles are still there. Primarily on throttle pump because Emu doesn't use RPMFilters yet.

[@dividingbyzerofpv6748]

@@Kabab i know you dont like cruisers but I bet you would have no bobbles with a 4000-6000mah 6s pack on there. At 1350g my 6s2p 18650 7in build has no bobbles and that is after I sped the footage up 200-250% to go looking for them. Think that anything "light 7in" is gonna have some bobbles but having bigger motors helps dampen out any of the effects that a smaller motor may not be able to handle. 2306/2207 1600kv 4s was definitely a bad experience. 2806.5 1300kv results were awesome. Your motors are likely equally nice.

[@Kabab]

@@dividingbyzerofpv6748 I'm sure that would work out fine. Just not to my taste

[@pirateradioFPV]

​@@Kabab Sounds great, to me the 7" felt zero wind kind of quad when I had mine. Without the wind it flew fine (albeit sluggish due to the 22xx motors) but anything over 5m/s made it very unhappy, up to a point where you didn't even want to fly it. I've been trying to get my 6" to fly for a while, I have less than 10 packs on the K2 props but so far there's promise in that direction too. Of course 7" is a lot easier to sell to the people who already have 5" and at least in that size some prop development is happening, even if that development might not explode in speed but in the air 😅

[@pirateradioFPV]

Yeah, weight probably helps with the stability. To me it never seemed like a control issue, in most of the footage it really looks like the same kind of shudder the wings have, suggesting it's an aerodynamic issue. Such a thing is really difficult to fix with just the motors and there's only so far you can go with the props and the weight, given that you also have a performance window to hit.

[@archer4922]

Bob, I’ve been working on a project399 practice rig for a while and just need motors but have a quick question and wanted your opinion about motor size. While I want to get the BH 2510’s that they use in drl I’m wondering if the emax eco 2807 would be a good alternative or even your 30mm motor when it comes out? Kinda wanna stick with the 2510 but I’ve got a set of the emax 2807’s on the way that a buddy is sending me. I have flown the bh2510’s, specifically the 1280kv ones you sent rob(loft) a while back(I think I remember him saying he got them from you) and I love them. Never flown the 28xx series before and think it would be interesting.

[@Kabab]

The 2510 is fine but the 30mm motor is going to perform a lot better immediately. 1280kv is also a bit low

[@archer4922]

@@Kabab yeah the 1280 felt slow when I flew Robs but extremely controllable even on 5s. I was thinking about the 1380 kv, just a little bit, very little bit faster. Lol. But ima start with the eco 2807 only bc I have a set being sent to me but I know their heavy.

[@ByteMeFPV]

Wonderful, I'm drinking the Kool-Aid Kabab... Can't wait. Didn't look any further as soon as I saw you had a 7" motor, I ordered... Cheers.

[@igordenisr]

If you know how back engeenering works: they bought already this motor, take it apart, measure stator, measure coper wire lenght, width, turns, resistance etc. Not telling that on webpage is only downside for customer who is going to calculate specs of his biuld.

[@Kabab]

It delayed iflight by 4 months. Now they have a copy. More importantly, it took the focus off the motor spec and put it on what the motor is intended to be used for. There's no way to survive in this industry when all these companies copy everything overnight. We might as well just give up and all you'll get is the same crap over and over from all the rip off companies. If you have a better idea, I'm all ears. Also, the spec is on the product page. It's just not explicitly listed. It's in the product description

[@jarret8711]

hell yeah, i use 2 3s packs in series on my 4 and 3.5 in set ups. for the same reason. longevity, also i marry the packs

[@StreamStationAlpha]

Sold me on the DAL, picking up a set of these too! Keep up the Amazing work.

[@Kabab]

Wait. They explode. They made a new hub. Coming soon

[@Kabab]

The new hub is real good. fpvcycle.com/products/dalprop-fold-7-diy-folding-props-with-updated-hub?_pos=4&_sid=58dab937d&_ss=r

[@waldemarkraus2855]

@@Kabab How can I see it's the new hub or not?

[@Kabab]

@@waldemarkraus2855 you can't tell unless the listing specifically says 'new hub' like the one on fpvcycle does. They even look the same but one explodes and one does not

[@waldemarkraus2855]

@@Kabab I found some information and pictures here: www.foxeer.com/dalprop-fold-2-f7-folding-responsive-freestyle-props-less-propwash-g-318 Looks like the new hub is completely black and they use some kind of fiber composit material. They also call it "Fold 2" now. I found no source to get them here in germany. Even banggood seems to still have the old batch :(

[@RCDevotee]

Thank you for the video and insights! I am considering making a 7" chaser quad. I do a lot of remote control plane (prop and jet) chasing with my 5" 6S quads. I can keep up in short bursts but would like something with more sustained top speed. I will be thinking about these motors and that frame for my next chaser.

[@pedroespejo8374]

I was waiting for this video since i saw the photos on instagram jajaj

[@3eggerfpv397]

Looking forward to hearing more about this frame. I'm sure it will follow suit with all your frames, that being as light as possible. The problem with a 7" quad is vibration with the size of the motors needed for a quad of this size. I know I'm not telling you anything you don't already know, but I've never had any luck in a 7" quad with arm thickness less than 6mm. Lastly, i appreciate all your efforts in developing a quad size that just doesn't get any attention, for the most part!

[@Kabab]

Really zero attention for 7". The whole class just gets leftovers. I also hear you on the 6mm arms but it's just too heavy. 5mm and wider has been working out so far. Too much more than 160g frame weight really starts significantly impacting performance. The gopro is extremely annoying to throw on there too.

[@3eggerfpv397]

@@Kabab - Pretty much! Other than you, Rotor riot seems to be the only other company exploring the 7" frame! What no one is doing is targeting the 7" for freestyle specific. And, i get it, the market for this size quad is for Cine-Crusing. Would 7" freestyle be something you would consider exploring, or perhaps are exploring? I'm going to try your new motors on this TBS Source 7 and see what sticks! If these were in a 1700-1800kv I'm thinking that could be the magic mix, even with the GoPro! Again, i realize the market is for the lower kv for that size motor. Maybe for Christmas!! Thanks for listening!

[@Kabab]

@@3eggerfpv397 yeah I'm planning on two more 7" frames. Something general acro and the light 7"

[@3eggerfpv397]

@@Kabab I'm in!

[@UdonPenguin]

Its killing me i need my 7inch your first recomendations were the best 7inch experiance ive had. all the new goodies got me well excited. Really miss my stolen glide.

[@WEEBER13]

God, this is awesome work, Bob!

[@matthew04101]

i'm curious what is the max size allowed of the shafts of your 30mm motors ? 8mm ? 10mm ?

[@Kabab]

Like the shaft width? It's a 5mm shaft interna I believe.

[@bigbillneace]

Just curious, what updates or changes were made to the 5" glide frame? I've been running the hyperlite Flosstyle 5" for years but have broken a few arms. I got the 6" glide and it seems great so I'm considering the 5" glide

[@Kabab]

Various parts were beefed up and the lower deck was adjusted to make it easier to build. It's now 103g

[@paulbraunstein7430]

Hey Bob! Just started putting together the parts for a cinesplore build and I see you mentioned it in the description here... should I be waiting a few more weeks before I buy anything else?? It sounds like you may have something new in the works or am I just reading into your comment too far?? Thank you for everything that you do, you have helped me get up to speed a ton through your videos as I am new to this hobby, but already beyond addicted!

[@Kabab]

The updated motors are on the way now. Likely next week in stock.

[@paulbraunstein7430]

@@Kabab haha one of the only things I already bought (off your Amazon store)! Pumped to see the updated ones as well! Thanks for the response

[@Reecefpv]

Pretty bad when I come back and watch this again. I'm so interested in building something like this. Its been a dream for a while and ya never really hear about these motors. They are epic. And of course I want this beside my cinerat with your 2204 motors. And I love em of course.

[@Kabab]

We're still waiting on carbon manufacturing. It's taken forever due to CNY.

[@David_Nielsen]

Wow 7" can really haul! May I ask the name of the artist for that song in the intro? (I could only manage to find it on a channel that plagiarizes everyone's songs...)

[@Kabab]

I actually don't have the song anymore....lost among the other songs but it's a royalty free song. Nothing being plagiarized here

[@David_Nielsen]

@@Kabab thanks for trying. And I didnt mean to imply you were plagiarising or anything, but looking for it led me to discover this other channel asking for donations and taking credit for thousands of other peoples songs. Apparently he even got all the music finding apps like Shazam to direct to him instead of actual artists.

[@Kabab]

@@David_Nielsen there's tons of that happening on KZbin and on other sites it's worse. They sell ads on the page and generate revinue regardless

[@brianevans4]

This video was 80 minutes long😂😂😂 Do you ship to Europe? I am in UK and would love one of these frames and some motors! Great flights! 7 inch is amazing

[@Kabab]

yeah we ship to EU. Working on shipping to make it more economical but I'm not sure when we will be able to pull that off.

[@TERBANGFPV]

Hi bob, im building light 7 inch quad.. and i hate li-ion because of the wide voltage range makes the quad undertuned after going low volt. So ill use lipo. For 6s, its better run 2x 2200mah gnb 3s to get 6s 2200mah right? Because yes i hate when i found 1 dead cell in 6s lipo. It will works as good as single 6s right? Or is there any downside from using 2 lipo?

[@Kabab]

I'm doing exactly that. I hate it when a giant pack drops a cell and it's then useless. I'm using 2x gnb 2600mah 3s packs with a XT90 Y-harnrss I made that puts them in 6s series

[@TERBANGFPV]

@@Kabab but we need high c rating for the 3s lipo right? Yeah im asking this because on your other 7inch video you said using 2 lipo in serries is not as good as using single lipo. About the xt90, is it makes more flight time too? 2 xt60 with xt90 output right?

[@Kabab]

@@TERBANGFPV right that's because I was using xt60's. Definitely need xt90s. And yes definitely still need the c rating. I've gone for larger cells and 120c instead of lower capacity 130c.

[@TERBANGFPV]

@@Kabab alt my local teh highest c for 3s 2200 is gnb 100c.. maybe ill try to get that, and compare with my curent ovonic 1000mah 6s in paralel. Anyway have you done the test? 2p of 1000mah 6s vs 2x 3s 2000mah in series?

[@Kabab]

@@TERBANGFPV you shouldn't see much difference between a 2P and 1P pack. In the real world the 2P will be slightly better but not huge.

[@flyingmonkey8245]

Love your videos and editing

[@MarineSniper26]

So would these motors be better for Freestyle or more for cruising? I am working on a 7" cruiser/Mid to long range build now and these motors really peaked my interest. I want to see if the are as efficient as the 2806.5 of similar kv and just want to know if it could be abetter option for cruising.

[@Kabab]

A smaller motor will always be more efficient if kept within the efficiency range of around 40 to 60%. A bigger motor will just create more power in that efficiency range but it will also draw more power to do so. The smaller motor will need to spin up higher in the throttle range and we'll leave its efficiency zone which will make the bigger motor more efficient. The improved control is a side effect of the bigger motor if efficiency is your primary goal. These motors are designed for performance rather than very high efficiency however that depends what you're going to be doing with the quad. If you're planning on just doing a slow Cruise with a 1 kg quad, you could use an even smaller motor without any issues. But you sacrifice performance for that efficiency. If you're lifting a payload, you want your motors to be within that efficiency range so you need to spec the motor accordingly to to produce enough power in that 40 to 60% range to deal with your payload

[@MarineSniper26]

@@Kabab thanks for the reply that helps! With what you shared, it definitely seems like a nice middle ground for me then. With my current 5" with 2700kv 2306 4s, I can get around 4-5 mins or so just cruising. Definitely want as much performance as i can get without sacrificifing the efficiency. I also want them purely based on the colors as no other motors of this relative size have any color.

[@Kabab]

@@MarineSniper26 I've spent lots of time trying to figure out why sometimes I'll build a bigger quad and it'll be the same overall flight time as a smaller quad. It's because I'm always aiming for overall the same performance specs which results in 3-5min flights no matter what. If I want more flight time, the performance goes down hill. But if I just cruise I can get maybe 8-12min on the 7"

[@volvo850enjoyer8]

why is nobody reviewing the tmotor ft5 6s bnf? I fly fpv since 3 years now and i have never ever flown such a good quad, even better than the "special" "best" RTF Nazgul. I really love it and I would also love to see a review!!

[@Kabab]

Because it's an RTF and rtf is never really that good or worth much consideration. It's always a compromised build

[@JC-zg2id]

I’m less of a freestyle pilot myself and more of a cruiser and looking for something that can be both long range and semi acrobatic. What do you think about a 6” setup? Kv? 4s for long range and 6s for acro? Or maybe even just step down to 5” props and have it be a heavier 5” equivalent? What are your thoughts? Happy thanksgiving!

[@Kabab]

The 5" stuff I have coming will likely meet your needs

[@AlvaSpeed]

A good frame is a very important part to have a good flying 7 inch quad.

[@thewhitedillard]

picked up some 2810 brother hobby motors for my custom 7" stretched X frame, gotta cut some 19x19 motor mount arms to test them. was looking at these 3106 motors but volume minus bearing volume (3732cm3) was less then the 2810's at about (4830cm3 minus bearing volume) so went with them. hoping I love them, just wish brother hobby would do unibell designs. my 7" build is 889 grams with 1300mah lipo and hero 7 with a heavy adjustable BMC3D mount and TPU motor and arm mounts/protectors with TPU antenna mound. pretty damn light. with 2200 its just over 1000grams. will be more once the 2810's are added but I think you'd like this frame bob. only issue you would have is your get some props in few on the lower part of the gopro frame. have you thought about doing/making a 3108 motor with 13mm bearings and unibell bob? would be a nice option

[@Kabab]

I'm actually working on a 2808 right now. I don't think 7" really needs more than that. the taller magnets with my new magnet design will make up for the reduced width from the previous 31mm wide and give it more efficiency and power over the 3106.5

[@yannickg6904]

Curious about the Dal foldables exploding, what is the point of failure? I imagine it would be the mounting hubs and not the blades themselves...correct?

[@Kabab]

The hubs flex out and let go of the blade. They've updated the hub and are sending me some new hubs for testing

[@3eggerfpv397]

Finally some 7" quad development!! The motor looks sweet! I personally freestyle my 7" quad, not really interested in cruising per se, so I'm wondering if there's a plan for a 1700kv motor? Looking forward to the props hopefully with some varying pitch choices for those that like to fly these beasts radically!

[@Kabab]

1700kv for 7" 6S?

[@erick4188]

@@Kabab 🚀🚀🚀

[@josephrsalexander4589]

@@Kabab one of the guys at my field had a BH 2808 1500KV on a 7" quad. It was the fastest quad I've ever seen - I think a 1700 KV version would be all sag. IdK.

[@3eggerfpv397]

@@Kabab Yes! I'm running the BH 2806.5's 1700KV, 6s on a deadcat source one 7" quad for freestyle! The lower kv just doesn't spool up fast enough. Perhaps a lighter prop with a slightly heavier pitch with your motor could be the magic combo? Mindyou, i dont know a whole lot about the science behind getting the right combo of motor to prop for a given quad. What i do know is freestyling a bigger quad in a relatively tight proximity cement jungle is a complete rush!!

[@3eggerfpv397]

@@josephrsalexander4589 - The 1700kv in an open field is a rocket, but for freestyle, meaning flying this where i fly all my 5" quads, 1700kv isn't quite quick enough. 1800kv if thats possible on a motor that size would be perfect!

[@novet001]

Concerning props... ...coming from the point of endurance... What do you think about changing to regular 2-bladed prop? While we're at it, even wooden props would be interesting, as they're said to be more efficient over the tupperware. Thinking back, when testing a 3-bladed prop that matched closest to the 2-bladed, I had about 20 percent more flighttime with the 2-bladed...

[@Kabab]

The issue with twins is that they're just not as well balanced as a triblade. Triblades have that third blade that kinda half balances the other two so if any one blade is slightly off, it's less noticed. Additionally folding blades are further self balancing

[@novet001]

@@Kabab , with the plastic ones - I totally agree! Though in the times when I learned the rc-flying craftsmanship, it was frowned upon to not have checked every prop nevertheless... ;) But the wooden ones were quite nicely balance right out from the bag, and efficiency was quite better than with tupperware bi-blades. ...that's where my thinking is coming from... So for regular chaps, the triblades are quite okay - why bother if they're that cheap. But I have more the long-endurance in mind, less extremes like aerobatics or racing, where one tends not to plan to crash in the first place, so components can be a bit higher priced as life-expectancy is higher. I was thinging of a light frame - again, durability is not first directive as crashing is to be avoided - with one of those split-cams to have HD-recording on-board without the need for a hefty gopro, with properly matched motors and props... Maybe going towards 6s as the higher the voltage the higher the efficiency...? I guess the word long-range cinematic comes to mind...?

[@Kabab]

@@novet001 more rigid blades are absolutely going to be more efficient and better performance all around. Twins are also a solid 25% more efficient in my testing too. As for the light frame, once this one gets here, it'll be around 140-150g. I wouldn't call it light but it's about as light as it could get with the dead cat stance to get props out of the shot. The other option are the X configuration frames which can be found as ligbtas 90g or even less however the gopro needs to be maybe 6" or higher up from the center of the frame with still good tilt to get the props out of the shot. Regardless, this frame batch should be here in a couple weeks. Whenever china gets around to it 🤦‍♂️

[@AlbeyFPV]

Hey @kabab have you tested this 7inch motor on the fettec 45amp esc ?

[@Kabab]

I don't have that esc but 45A is more than enough for these motors.

[@AlbeyFPV]

@@Kabab definitely 45amps is heeps but I know the fettec esc does not play well with all motor combos. They had to update the esc to support more motors. Dont know what they are doing

[@Kabab]

@@AlbeyFPV this is a pretty typical function motor. It should work

[@AlbeyFPV]

The only reason I'm asking is due to my brother hobby 2806.5 1300kv motors work perfectly but my xing 2806.5 1300kv fly like potato. Both are duplicate builds but I still swapped the motors to "working" one and it did the same thing

[@Kabab]

@@AlbeyFPV that could be something failing or it could be some setting issue. Same esc?

[@ag137]

Sounds like an angry zipper! Interesting build. I'm curious if this will influence your 5" designs...

[@Kabab]

Kinda maybe

[@sgtsawhill1]

Curious if you did a performance test on your 7 inch frame with 5 inch props? I'm running 5 inch props on a 6 inch build. Not as noble, but very stable.

[@Kabab]

The 5" cineglide is extremely stable because of its large size already

[@danielscheuch]

What did you update on the 5 inch glide?

[@Kabab]

A bunch of things to increase durability and rigidity. It's 103g now. Haven't updated the product pictures yet and won't be updating them for a while either....for a good reason but doesn't matter to anyone but me

[@zaplocked]

Have you tried CNHL's 2200 6s yet? all C variations (70, 55, 40) are quite cheap at the moment. I just got a 8" yeti shipped out and their preferred battery has been out of stock for a while.

[@Kabab]

They're cheap because they're cheap. They just can't provide the amps.

[@zaplocked]

@@Kabab I see. I had heard good things about their smaller lipos. Would swapping to xt90 make a meaningful difference in this case?

[@Kabab]

@@zaplocked yes definitely. The xt60 is limiting for sure.

[@AfterFPV]

Any comment on the new BrotherHobby 2806.5 LPD in green? I'm not finding any detailed info on their specs, or even what's changed since the older avengers. Not even sure what LPD stands for?

[@Kabab]

they made another 2806.5? It's not going to perform much different whatever it is. Overall the motor size dictates it's performance more than most of the other factors.

[@AfterFPV]

@@Kabab Apparently: www.rcgroups.com/forums/showthread.php?3739039-BrotherHobby-New-Motor-LPD-2806-5#post45707671 RDQ and GetFPV are carrying them already. I'm tempted to get the old Avenger on sale, but if LPD stands for Low Power...D, then could be nice to pair with Li-Ion.

[@Kabab]

@@AfterFPV 🤷🏻‍♂️. Both 6" motors imo

[@echofpv1386]

What ESCs would you recommand for 8s on a 7in??? Thanks!!!!

[@Kabab]

Hard to say really. I'd go for a 4in1 still.

[@rafaelcamacho4580]

When are you releasing this frame 😬!!! Great video🤙🏼

[@PineyJustice]

Kabab, can you please get a 7" glide hammer kit up on the website for us to throw money at?

[@jlarson42]

Some sweet flying. On fpvcycle page you said the BrotherHobby 2806.5 1300Kv motors would be better on 6 inch. Do you have a 6 inch build you can fly them on? I'd be interested in seeing that. Been looking at building a 6 inch kwad. I'm curious about the flight performance that would give us. Remember to floss. 🤓

[@Kabab]

I generally don't really recommend 6". It's like a middle size that doesn't totally make sense. 5" can do just about everything 6" can do. That being said, yeah the 2806.5 will be an awesome 6" motor

[@jlarson42]

@@Kabab I understand, makes sense but I happen to have the Konasty Cougar 6" frame and everything but 2 more 2806.5 motors for a complete build. And your thoughts gave me an idea. Happy flying, 👍💖🤓

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

@@jlarson42 those are fine dude, i fly 2 6in badgers on 2207 2450 4s on bi blades they fly amazing...BUT i dont carry gopro my auw is 650g w 1500 695 w 2200, i just superview my dvr ;)...dji

[@jlarson42]

@@flo-ridafpv5713thanks for the info, I'm saving for dji. My 7" Source one build with 2200mah lipo and the BrotherHobby Avengers is 970auw. Super smooth flyer even in some wind. But not so acrobatic. I've got iNav on it. 🤓

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

@@jlarson42 yea buddy, theres pretty solid rumors of v2 goggle now fyi, nice yea heavy is better in wind, & my 2207 motors dont handle heavy 6in tri blades well, dont matter cuz they too floaty for me at 650-700g anyway & luv that bi blade sound hehe

[@jrock7859]

I'm trying the bh 3115's on 7 inch props, have I missed the plot or could this be good for aggressive flying?

[@Kabab]

Those motors are enormous. The only issue with them is the immense weight of them. It won't be quite as nimble but it should be more powerful. That size is better suited to 8" but will also run warm to hot.

[@jrock7859]

@@Kabab thanks for your reply. Using the dal 7056's , goal is to fly race-y. I'll report back if this works at all

[@tehllama42]

@@jrock7859 You don't need that much motor to feel racy - a full 3115 is a 8-9" prop in my book, because that can absolutely haul

[@SANDY-FPV]

that's one amazing flying quad!

[@ktranization]

Thanks for the reminder... I flossed today after it ;)

[@benedekvajas6545]

Can you show us the video without reelsteady? I know you want it to look as nice as possible but believe me, you don't need reelsteady to convince me to build a 7". Even though I never considered it before the video :D

[@Kabab]

It's on the FB page but yeah next time I go out to fly this I'll be sure to post that. This footage was run through RSGo at the lowest setting because RSGo does a good job of converting 4:3 to 16:9 without making it look weird

[@lukasmohr97]

hey kabab. first of all thank you so much for all the effort you put into innovation in our great hobby. you rock! 💪 i also have a question, im trying to build a super lightweight (350-450g dry weight) 7" for endurance mountain surfing. do you think i would need such huge motors? i'm not planning to do freestyle with it, but want enough power to get out of trouble while flying in the mountains. my current plan is to use the h7 beast 55a AIO and the xing cyber 1777kv on the TBS Pizzabox? (not released yet) 7" 46g frame

[@Kabab]

depends how much control performance you're willing to give up. You can run 7" on a 2207 motor with a 2200mah battery and get probably 25min flight time. It'll feel awful to fly but it'll do it. 2806.5 is really the absolute minimum I'd go to have decent control on 7".

[@dauntlessfpv]

Is this the cine glide? With 7” arms?

[@Kabab]

Not quite. The frame has just arrived at the store actually. Just need to open the box and list it

[@sufysprojects2689]

How is the zeez stack?? What are your thoughts on it?

[@Kabab]

It's actually quite solid. The lights on it are blindingly bright. I can't look at the damn quad when it's on 😅

[@sufysprojects2689]

@@Kabab 😂😂you mean, the led strips?

[@TomHerriman]

So this motor is for short fast smooth flying? Nothing long range and not a lot of freestyle flip-flops. Right?

[@Kabab]

It's made for improved control overall. It can be for anything however I would caution long range as it's not particularly efficient. Long range 7" crafts usually opt for smaller motors because of their increased efficiency. They sacrifice performance for the range.

[@sufysprojects2689]

I'd have loved to listen you talking for 80mins about quad stuff ;(

[@phaley51]

Thank you for all the great work and pushing the hobby in the right directions! Do you think there is a place for 8-10 in or are quality props and costs the limiting factor? Either way looking forward to the 7 in props you have coming up!

[@Kabab]

We don't even have good 6 or 7" props let alone 8". In time there will probably be a place. For now, we need to get something reasonable for 7"

[@fyshlearnstoskate]

I find the graupner e-prop 8x5 to be the best bi blade by a wide margin then master airscrew tri's and bi's are ok but very heavy

[@VolcomStoneXB]

Could this motor be a 3106.5? looking at you old motor chart this size is right in line with your sweet spot. Love seeing all the new stuff your doing keep it comming.

[@joleneolivares3733]

What settings are you using on the gopro?? Did you use realsteady go?

[@Kabab]

It's RSgo on tht lowest setting. Almost off. Just because it does a good job of fixing the distortion. It's not really doing much otherwise

[@kflaps1]

i tried using brother hobby 2810 1150kv motors on my 7 inch build. seemingly no matter what filtering or tuning sertup i did the motors would get burning hot. i never had it desync or anything but never really pushed it either. is that a common problem tuning 7 inch?

[@badfourlife]

Something has to be wrong, those motors are overpowered for 7" but I have same ones as I'm running a pig of a 7" with 6s2p pack.... I haven't got around to PID tune on these motors yet but I would prob start around 60p and 60d if you got a decent sized battery on it.... I was running 2806.5 before with pids around 100 and still had cool motors

[@kflaps1]

@@badfourlife yeah i just dont understand whats causing the issue. ive put the same tune as someone running basically the exact setup. down to the fc and esc. may just have gotten a bad motor or messed one up somehow.

[@badfourlife]

If youve used blackbox before it's super easy to find a bad motor with the motor outputs as one will always be asking for more throttle, other than that just make sure ya got the quad balanced....Def weird prob though, I think blackbox might be needed if you copied someone else and still are having issues

[@Kabab]

Nothing is wrong with the motors. The surface area to volume ratio is just awful. You can't get them to run cool. They're self limiting and inefficient as a result of this issue. It's not a big deal. Just know that they'll run hot and don't worry about it. The reliability will be basically 100% because of all the magnet surface area. The stator will have a good grasp of the bell. The trick is to balance the surface area to volume ratio and keep the whole thing reliable for the overall power you plan to ask of the motor.

[@llickmogan]

My 2810 1180kv are great on my source 1 7inch motors barely warm

[@marianh69]

Hey Kabab, first off I really liked that 7" flight footage. But also I want to ask some dental question and would be happy if u have some time to answer :) I usually like to use some tiny brush instead of floss to clean the space inbetween my teeth. The reason for this is that I find it easier and less time consuming than to floss. What do u think about those brushes? are they as effective as floss? Also I noticed that some of the stuff I clean from the space between the teeth (dont know the name) gets stuck on the inside of my teeth. The brush grabs this "dirt" but on its way out it gets stuck again in the teeth. Would u advise to brush the teeth before or after cleaning the spaces inbetween? Also I probably would have forgotten to floss (use brush) a lot more if u wouldn't remind us at the end of every vid xD

[@Kabab]

anything is better than nothing but nothing really replaces floss or otherwise something physically going between the teeth to clean. If you're not gonna floss, anything you will do is better than nothing but floss rubbing the tooth surfaces at least once a day is best.

[@peterdolenc4319]

Great video! How many amps does a setup like that draw? Do you really need such a huge (and heavy) battery? Going only by the youtube footage, 2810 motor seems a lot more lively on 7 inch still, but really happy that we are getting more good options for the sevens now. Keep up the good work! :)

[@fyshlearnstoskate]

Likely peaks close to 200amps

[@Kabab]

Amps are probably around 200 at peak. Doesn't really matter and we can't get a solid read on it anyway. Unfortunately you do need a substantial pack. It needs to be able to provide those amps. 1800mah on an xt90 is the absolute minimum I'd go with for this.

[@peterdolenc4319]

​@@Kabab thanks for this info, so using 2 1050mah 6s packs from the 5 " in parallel should be a great match.

[@shotbyarian]

what 7 inch props do you recommend atm?

[@Kabab]

Gemfan 7035 carbon mix material props. Not the polycarbonate only version. Specifically the carbon mix which is much more rigid

[@shotbyarian]

@@Kabab thanks a lot for this information! 🙌🏻

[@scorpion741711]

When is that beautiful frame be available?

[@Kabab]

just waiting on raw materials. super short supply due to covid unfortunately. ongoing battle

[@archer4922]

Your 7” has me really wanting to finish my practice rig now. Lol. 🤣 Phrasing. Lol.

[@tehllama42]

You and me both. I just need the carbon now, it's kinda sad to have a full stack and 2510's, plus prints just chilling

[@gmivisualsjason3729]

Wow another video...... your on fire

[@bkfpv]

This is so spot on for what I’m looking for. If it has decent flight time that is. What can we expect in flight times? Frame available in time for a winter build? (Season starts late april). Btw this won me over. New patreon here 👍🏻

[@Kabab]

Thank you so much for the support. It's HUGELLY appreciated. HUUUUGGEEELY. The flight time is entirely dependent on how you fly and what you're hauling around. No gopro and a big 2800mah 6S will fly for maybe 15+min cruising. Gopro and a smaller 2200mah with a single XT60 instead of XT90 will result in ~5min cruising about. Fly it hard and you'll get just 3-4min on that 2200mah xt60. Overall, the motors have the ability to draw more power since they are higher kv and bigger but if you fly them the same as you'd fly a smaller motor, they will be more efficient.

[@Kabab]

@@bkfpv oh wow. Quite the view. I'd say something like 2600-2700mah 6s with a gentle touch on the throttle should get close.

[@tehllama42]

@@Kabab is correct, 2200-3300mAh is where these will be happy. On the 2200's, flight time should be anywhere from 110s to 15:00 if you're being nice to the battery. 3300's add a bit more, but it's not massive. Throttle liming is the other way to ensure you're not just trying to pull 200+ amps out of the battery.

[@sully4875]

Man you make me want to spend all my money flying building 💸💸💸cool stuff

[@overfly_pt]

Great video thanks for chare 👌👍

[@makesomemore_]

Crispy and golden brown 🤩

[@peterzingler6221]

Any thrust figures avaible on these bad boys?

[@Kabab]

No idea what the thrust might be but it's not low. Bench test thrust numbers aren't really that useful. It's definitely more powerful than a 2806.5 (About 22% more power) but not as powerful as a 3115. It weighs as much as a 2807 however.

[@peterzingler6221]

@@Kabab thing is im looking for a light quad motor to use with a 10inch prop on a plane :D more powerful then 28xx sounds good to begin with

[@tehllama42]

It's a lot... like >2kg/corner a lot. The limits on these are the batteries and props, straight up - Bob is totally correct about it not being about peak thrust (but these things will party, don't worry about that). On a plane, for this stator volume, I'd trend toward taller (2808), but I can see why this 3XXX.X size is probably preferable if you want solid locked in performance.

[@Kabab]

@@peterzingler6221 typically plane motors tend to have taller stators and are operated at a much lower overall power output than quad motors. It doesn't really make sense to me why the motors are so tall for planes. This motor would be a good plane motor but no more than 5S on a 7" prop. That might even be a bit high. Quad motors are not designed for constant high load operation. While the motor will be able to pull maybe 80A, we average more like 10A per motor or less in actual use. So 7" ad 4S or 5S should be fine on this motor but I would absolutely monitor temperatures and wouldn't push it until verified not overheating. You have a nice coushin with the super high temp windings however.

[@Reecefpv]

I want 😜😁 seriously love that high speed run it looks so good and so smooth. Wish I could afford a 7". If ya ever need a tester lol 😜😉 I'll def push it. I wanna do some lo g range tests with it. Seriously been wanting to do long range. Just got my crsf updated. 🤘

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

Just put 6in arms on ur 5in n run gemfan 6042, stupid fast

[@Reecefpv]

@@flo-ridafpv5713 yeah I can already go 80 but that's not that much really and I can't sustain that for very long

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

@@Reecefpv ah yeah bigger props do give more speed for less amps, or just fly lower n closer to stuff for the speed feels, thats how i roll, 30mph looow lol

[@MojoPapiFPV]

Did you mention flight times?

[@Kabab]

3-8min depending on how you fly with this crappy battery I have at the moment. I broke my other packs. Waiting on new ones

[@mouseFPV]

Not crazy interested in 7", I just dont have the space to fly one... that said, holy fast batman. Crazy. Also I love the FPVCycle Color-scheme. Mint Green and matte white. Drool. Its weird you are the 3" guy and now the 7" guy, its nice to see the hobby expand outside of 5".

[@Kabab]

The platforms I'm building out will be the 3" 1S, 3" 3S, 5" and 7". The 4" stuff is fun too but just a bit of a side quest. The sizes listed above are the ones that will be completed and maintained over a longer period of time. Larger sizes are typically more specialized and I don't do enough of those specialized things to do those sizes.

[@mouseFPV]

@@Kabab I think 4" will be a much more time worthy endevour if there is a 250g exception to remoteID. The sacrifices needed to keep a 5" that light are somewhat extreme, 4" might be king in 2-3 years, something to consider 🤔

[@tehllama42]

@@mouseFPV You're absolutely right about needing the place to fly it. I'm super-duper spoiled, and have great places to run a 7" quad within a 5 minute walk from my house... but if you don't have a venue for one, then just build a Vista-capable 4" rig and ro a low with that, or run a toothpick and giggle all the way.

[@Fpvpilot928]

It's a 3106.5, lol. You blanked it out on the chart which was on another video.

[@aneudidone7851]

Un vuelo excelente👍👏😆. Yo también kiero bolar con tanta precisión. Eres grande 💪💪

[@nathanp3366]

How does this do for long range? Sounded like you briefly touched on it but I would love to hear a more in depth discussion. I couldn't tell if you were trying to say this is a freestyle motor on 7 inch or if this was a long range motor or it does both well but neither perfectly?

[@Kabab]

7" quads fly so poorly that I'd honestly sooner recommend a 5" quad. The flight time isn't that different of both are performance crafts. You just don't have the same cruising speed on the 5"

[@Fpvpilot928]

Just wondering if anyone's ever thought of putting the flight controller in the back of a deadcat quad instead of the central stack so that it is located more centrally between the props? I've always heard of how strange the deadcat configuration feels and am wondering if having the more central flight controller would help in any way?

[@flo-ridafpv5713]

Dont matter where it at since the frame is flat, bob discused this in past

[@Fpvpilot928]

@@flo-ridafpv5713 But if you were to, say, rotate the quad on the pitch axis around its center of mass, the flight controller would not just rotate on axis but be accelerated around in a loop. The g's created by the acceleration in a loop cause readings in the flight controllers accelerometer would not be there if it were only rotating such as the case with a flight controller located at the center of mass? I might try building one and switching it back and forth to see if there is anything to it, probably not anything, just curious. Thanks though. I'm gonna have to go back through the repository of Bob's vids. lol.

[@Kabab]

It doesn't matter where the FC is mounted. Dead cat feels weird because the CG is in the wrong place but we don't have a choice because we need props out of view.

[@Fpvpilot928]

@@Kabab Thanks Bob. For some reason it just bothered me that it was so far from the center of mass. Love the motors. I'll have to try and snag a set for myself.

[@metaldirtnskin]

I kinda wish I hadn't just fitted out a 7" with the BrotherHobby motors now... I mean, they are fine motors but the FOMO is strong in this hobby 😬

[@Kabab]

They're not bad. These are just better 😃

[@medrone7097]

2 Kabab videos in one weekend! 😁

[@kirbincap8307]

Sick!

[@heggy_fpv]

please tell me more how to build a 7in to fly for an hour, will be my next season project

[@heggy_fpv]

oh yes, I also design my mounts to put the fpv cam below the hd cam

[@Kabab]

This would take a bit of work to figure out. It probably wouldn't be too hard but all you'd be doing is hovering for an hour. It's currently not possible to have any kind of real performance in a 7" quad if you want an hour of flight time. Our battery tech is just not good enough

[@heggy_fpv]

@@Kabab I know, but you said it :)) my plan is to try tilted motors for reduced drag, lower weight and find most efficient motor, also experiment with prop combination, probably 2 blade and bullnose?

[@heggy_fpv]

my current is 25mins, at 24km round trip

[@jhughes2286]

Wow this motor didn't get copied at all, literally no other 30xx motors for sale, and nobody is talking about this stator size or making (me too) motors, the 2806.5 got soo popular soo quick probably because of you. Less motors available hurts the consumer I think you should start talking about the stator size.

[@Kabab]

Sorry, no chance I'll talk about stator sizes anymore. My strategy is working. I just want manufacturers to leave me alone. They can go do whatever they want. Stop copying me. I cannot continue to do what I do if everything I do just gets ripped off overnight. Literally everything I do that has any degree of popularity gets ripped off by these manufacturers. Look at Tmotor's entire new quad and motor lineup. It's 100% ripped off of products that were made by people in the community. They even ripped off Andy Shen's THICC.

[@jhughes2286]

@@Kabab Ok I understand, just hate the limited availability of your motors.

[@Kabab]

@@jhughes2286 me too. I've tried so hard to get world wide distribution. I can't even find a banggood sales rep

[@yannickg6904]

Damn, that thing hauls ass. Love the frame and motors. 7in quads need to be heavy to fly well. Lighter builds like the BH Hyperbola 7in don't seem to make much sense and you can see it in the footage.

[@Kabab]

7" doesn't need to be heavy. It just needs to have the right size motor and a power system to feed the motors.

[@yannickg6904]

@@Kabab Lol, don't pay any attention to me Bob, I don't know what I'm talking about half of the time...hahaha.

[@WEEBER13]

Agree! It's almost like Warpspeed on Star Trek!

[@WEEBER13]

Dude, seriously...don't feel like you EVER have to chop anything out! Bob Roogi = FPV ASMR, bro!

[@sufysprojects2689]

the end though!!!! ;)