Why It's Time to Be A Techno-Optimist

“Technology is the glory of human ambition and achievement, the spearhead of progress, and the realization of our potential.” -Marc Andreessen
Welcome to “The Ben & Marc Show”, featuring a16z co-founders Ben Horowitz and Marc Andreessen.
This past week, Marc released his new vision for the future - “The Techno-Optimist Manifesto” (a16z.com/the-t.... In an article that has sparked widespread conversation across traditional and social media, Marc challenges the pessimistic narrative surrounding technology today, and instead celebrates it as a liberating force that can lead to growth, progress and abundance for all.
In this one-on-one conversation based on YOUR questions from X (formerly Twitter), Ben and Marc discuss how technological advancements can improve the quality of human life, uplift marginalized communities, and even encourage us to answer the bigger questions of the universe.
We hope you’ll be inspired to join us in this Techno-Optimist movement. Enjoy!
Topics Covered:
00:00:01 Teaser
00:00:34 Ben's favorite reaction to the Manifesto
00:02:11 Rob Henderson and "luxury beliefs"
00:04:35 "Techno optimism" vs. "effective pessimism"
00:10:32 Bringing Techno Optimism to marginalized communities
00:17:09 The Digital Divide and what we should really be worried about
00:19:32 How technology allows us to answer the big questions of life
00:22:59 Technology increases resilience to natural disaster
00:25:31 Economic systems to prevent human corruption
00:28:34 Pro Business vs. Pro Market
00:33:33 Love, Money and Force
00:39:09 Private capital vs. public research
00:43:51 Being anti-statist while supporting American dynamism
00:46:43 "Ideas reproduce" / Law of Accelerating Returns
00:48:28 Economist Julian Simon
00:52:57 What keeps us from the "insane gains" of nuclear fission
00:57:15 Consequences of not having to work
01:03:08 Chinese vs. American education / "Education is not market-based."
01:10:25 Can we predict the consequences of technology?
01:15:35 Super high IQ people and radicalization
01:17:02 Predicting the most controversial part of the Manifesto
01:21:03 Sign off
#technology #tech #ai #economics #business
Listen to Us!
- Apple Podcast: bit.ly/3SdsfNt
- Spotify: spoti.fi/3SclPOr
Resources:
Marc on X: / pmarca
Marc’s Substack: pmarca.substac...
Ben on X: / bhorowitz
Books mentioned on this podcast:
- “When Reason Goes on Holiday: Philosophers in Politics” by Neven Sesardic amzn.to/455zYRv
- “The Ultimate Resource” by Julian Lincoln Simon amzn.to/3Ft2MIi
Stay Updated:
Find us on X: / a16z
Find us on LinkedIn: / a16z
The views expressed here are those of the individual personnel quoted and are not the views of a16z or its affiliates. This content is provided for informational purposes only, and should not be relied upon as legal, business, investment, or tax advice. Furthermore, this content is not directed at nor intended for use by any investors or prospective investors and may not under any circumstances be relied upon when making a decision to invest in any a16z funds. PLEASE SEE MORE HERE: a16z.com/discl...

[@guizaoacc]

I think you two should do this every week! These talks are great.

[@hobbydutch5206]

Wow didn't realize Marc grew up in a poor family. Compared to how much impact he has made while still alive. You both are living legends for real

[@defaultmysq]

Marc and Ben show the only show worth watching on the internet and it is free! Better than Netflix 🥰

[@JessicaQChen-lv5uk]

Much much better

[@simtu251]

Netflix definitely sucks but you can always add to your own imaginative and strategic thinking while watching good shows like Breaking Bad, The Wire, etc. Good shows are more or less like a good book. Just stay away from soap operas or inclusion stuff and your brain will be all well.

[@joeingram1]

Excited to watch this one

[@sebby007]

Thanks for sharing your thoughts. It helps me get a more accurate view of the world.

[@pauljastrzebski5164]

Great post, great video, and great way to look at the world

[@___Shawn___]

Great episode. Very insightful! Looking forward to the next episode!

[@nounsnews]

Beautiful! We at Nouns News aim to be The Techno-Optimist network! You go guys! 💪❤

[@Iridescence93]

I appreciated this talk. I tend to be a depressive person and there is so much doom and gloom lately that confirms my biases. It is very refreshing to hear a counterpoint to the everything sucks crowd

[@Hastingsnow]

Thank you!

[@frankdasilva]

Excellent conversation! #technoptimism ❤️👏 Thanks for sharing your thoughts.

[@secondhandentity]

marcs grasp of history economics and sociology is immense

[@simplulo]

I like how he often cites stuff from my childhood, like "We don’t care, because we don’t have to" (in his Manifesto).

[@tuckerbugeater]

Yet, he's so wrong when it comes unlimited growth and social relations. @@simplulo

[@fire17102]

Hey guys, I think a lot of people could easily get into being techno optimist if you guys could do an episode on post labor economics. An era of abundance, transportation, opportunity and freedom, without selling your time or soul, without modern slavery, without orginized oppression. Where accessibility to prosperity is so big that people will choose to contribute, not out of survival, but because being a freeloader is just a boring existence. Hope you see this :) Jah bless & all the best !

[@overman2306]

Most people will choose the boring existence.

[@ama4617]

I just love the way you two talk. Thank you for making these videos a brilliant idea🎉

[@John-Brown]

2:07 luxury beliefs 4:25 what does effective pessimism look like? 10:16 how can we distribute transformative philosophies like yours to marginalized communities where a culture of despair and victimization predominates?

[@paulstekala7243]

Great podcast. Thank you for sharing.

[@vmachacek]

i did enjoyed it immensely, this is best content on youtube

[@chenlim2165]

Wow, the observation about super smart people going unhinged around 1:15:20 is pretty prescient.

[@STATE.38]

Ive been following both yall for over 20 years. Yall resonated with me when i was trappin. Now im a consultant for tech and real estate brokerages . So much for Mark being disconnected😂.

[@DigitalNomadOnFIRE]

This channel is so good...

[@elliptictree]

Great content.

[@black_eagle]

Has the nuclear waste problem for fission reactors been solved?

[@theAIdilemma]

There was great insight from the second last question by Sam Arnold 1:10:10 "To what extent do you believe we really control what technology does after its release? Can we exert any meaningful control after invention?"

[@zooq-ai]

Ben and Marc, you should build a movement around Techno-optimist to find talent who are passionate about this, and to organize against government regulation and fight-off the increasingly anti-capitalist sentiment spread in colleges. Every Tech CEO must be asked where do they stand on this and shareholders/investors must effectively vote out who are anti techno-optimist manifesto. They should publicly say this so that rent-seeking employees know where their organizations stand so people can self select

[@JessicaQChen-lv5uk]

Marc is one of the few speakers I can’t speed the view. He talks too fast and the contents are condense and insightful, worth listening with the noral speed.

[@MauriceMauser]

Fission is the clear choice over coal. What’s nice about fusion is that it doesn’t have the same waste and runaway risk of fission. It’s actually very hard to sustain the plasma conditions for more than a few seconds. The required energy input is what made it uneconomical so far. What has changed is Moore’s Law in Superconducting Magnets that now work at a bit higher than previously absolute zero temperature (for superconductivity to set in). Impressive is also Norway’s water energy storage. The sun would actually deliver enough solar energy for our needs. Which doesn’t equally apply to planting a tree on each available square metre of land to remove CO2. Algae play a more promising role here next to geoengineering the atmosphere. Moving to other planets is extremely optimistic given our snail speed of travel and planets missing conditions like the magnetosphere. Without even the moon impact, days here would last just about an hour or so.

[@MauriceMauser]

Man Passes Reverse Turing Test

[@Iturner72]

Common Marc and Ben W

[@ChristaLaser]

Great point that technology can drive prices down. A lot of the constituents of politicians are pushing them to take anti-technology actions to lower prices, but something they might want to do instead is invest in government grants for R&D in technologies that lower the cost of production and distribution of goods.

[@aescubed]

I think we have a model for a work-optional society, however we need to ensure it’s that it’s REALLY work-optional. As in, human wants are infinite, so let’s assume that 10 trips a year including trips to Mars, plus a decent 1 apartment per person, enough food to last 10 lifetimes etc can be created for, say, the purchasing power of $100. Ok, now there is a person who wants to go to Pluto, that’s not part of the basic “free” plan in the current civilization. Perhaps later, like PDF became free, trips to Pluto will also be part of the basic package, for now though, you need to produce value and exchange that value to be able to afford to go to Pluto. This is the most likely scenario than WallE or, well, Star Trek.

[@Digitalhistorie-xz5jl]

Great manifesto!

[@yampipampi]

"My friend Kanye..." - Ben Horowitz .... IDK why, but I really wasn't expecting that.

[@joelalain]

Hi Marc, I love your "Techno-Optimist Manifesto" because it made me see the positive i wasn't seeing. But there is one thing that don't seem to fit in that manifesto. Right now people are creating AI videos that take a "science subject" and then ask ChatGPT to build a text of x words about it. They ask it to "invent stuff", add controversy, etc. Then they use another AI to make the video and voice. These videos are then ultra-optimised to tease people, and appear near real science video. So tons of kids and less educated people listen to those and then think that "the pyramids are giant electric generator" or other things like this. My point is that every time there is a new technology, it seems it's the unscrupulous, the crooks, the snake oil salesmen and cronnies that come FIRST to use it. Now when in 6-12 months AI improves just slightly, here's my fear: according to your manifesto, any body will be able to make anything, like products. Well let's say i'm a crook with millions of dollars. What i'll do is create an AI template for a super optimized business and then have it look at all the ads on youtube, facebook, X, adwords, etc and look at every products and with a well crafted "AI employee group", i'll ask them to understand the products, then design and build a better one and make a website and compete directly with that product, but with better ads. Imagine that ONE person being able to spin 1 million (or 1 billion) such compagnies and flood the market with competing products that are better (assume there is the ability to manufacture those products). ALL those people and their great ideas are suddenly pretty much pointless and unseen since the better marketing and product of that ONE person just destroys them. Now imagine having 1000 such people with 1 billion AI companies each. Suddenly the economy collapse since the normal people can't compete and don't have as much knowledge on how to build that super optimized AI business template. You might say "well the economy will crash therefore they'll have to stop". But the thing is they can make TONS of money way before that happen, buy 10 000 robots, 1 million acre land and live there in total abundance for the rest of their life even if the world around them is burning and collapsing. What will stop such a thing from happening? As we see with those fake science AI videos, it's already happening for that AS SOON as it was possible, BEFORE the "good people" like Veritatisum or "Smarter Every Day" etc started using AI themselves. How would you answer this? Also, I'd love to work for you, what unique skills are you looking for?

[@simplulo]

Military organization of basic research and large projects is a fourth model, though I would put it under government organization. The first two models are commercial and social. We have plenty of traditional nonprofits, not to mention modern crowdfunding platforms, that can support non-profit efforts and maybe even organize large projects.

[@manasyadav3033]

Whenever Ben smiles I feels that a devil is coming to get me 😅😂

[@brettwood8091]

This seems like a great podcast. Is there a way to hear it in Spotify or another Podcast app? I can't seem to find it. The A16z podcast does not show this Ben & Marc content. Maybe it's for KZbin only -- anyone know?

[@a16z]

Spotify: spoti.fi/3SclPOr

[@amassa96]

Who is that lovely lady in the top right of your screen Mark?!

[@EthanDeanplus]

Marc, even if you're right, what does it matter if your message can't permeate a skeptics bubble? If you truly believe your message, spread it by giving interviews with journalist's that are critical of your point of view.

[@conformist]

disagree on talking with journalists. the tide has turned, tech should not play the journalists game

[@tuckerbugeater]

yes, they are the current aristocracy @@conformist

[@MatMytka]

Talking about luxury beliefs at the beginning is gobsmackingly ironic.

[@cirecrux]

Behind the mask, we are all human

[@Ztube111]

Brilliant question! 😂

[@jld2823]

14:53 Great point that technology drives prices down in the free market context. I hope companies in their portfolio can help lower down prices/costs for housing and health care to make them more affordable, even though those markets are not ideal free markets as some might argue. But isn't the entrepreneur’s job to come up with real, sustainable (not temporal) solutions for whatever market reality is and hence deserves investment?

[@peterdguru]

2:20 I prefer the term "Champagne Socialists"

[@yamorak]

A few minutes into this I'm struck by how much this sounds, in spirit, like the Monty Python routine where entrepreneurs compete with each other for the distinction of having the worst childhood. There's a lot of truth here but the sanctimonious pronouncements ignore so much.

[@simtu251]

So, off topic. What's with the pictures behind Ben? They look like he bought frames and didn't replace the stock photos.

[@graysonkinsella236]

For whatever it's worth, I think it's Matt Ridley who coined the term "ideas have sex", not Paul Romer.

[@web3wg]

This is such a great & needed essay! 🥰 It’s a long read so we recorded an audio version for those who would rather listen: kzbin.info/www/bejne/np2kpoFte89llbM

[@fire17102]

❤

[@nomadv7860]

Haha you guys are right that the instant ad hominem attacks kinda show that the points were not easily refuted

[@mixtape-yd2sn]

Are you optimistic about Databricks still? Two founders and one board member each sold $32M shares in December last year according to the January Tender Offer’s disclosure documents.

[@albionicamerican8806]

Marc's manifesto is self-contadictory because it cites Hayek's armchair theorizing about an alleged "knowledge problem" as a permanent limit on man's abilities. Marc is just carving out a probably contingent exception to his wish list of science-fictional ambitions, when that just shows he has read a lot of libertarian propaganda without thinking about it critically.

[@user-xk2vs4lr2v]

einstein is stalinist? Oh, man, ChatGPT and google covered this up.

[@Mills-London]

🦾💢

[@dannysullivan3951]

Another tech bro thinks tech is the answer to everything never mind democracy. Tax these idiots.

[@benweagraff]

Regarding China's economy and the recent slow down in growth, this is more due to the same demographic trends that slowed the Japanese economy in the 1990s. Some would say that the Communist Party has been more involved lately as a result of their slowing growth. This is a spurious analogy.

[@TCD企医生]

我们是一家中国的初创企业。我们正在搭建AI和互联网系统。为全球的企业发现并解决问题。希望得到您这边投资。

[@mooktakim]

OpenAI+Google is not the best example of a free market working correctly. OpenAI was started by billionaires. Big companies like Google can buy early startups very easily and kill the disruption. We need regulation to make sure there's a free market and no monopolies.

[@leonfa259]

Nearly every country by now has mostly free markets, the issue is that one still needs to price in externalities (positive and negative) also while markets are great for distribution and allocation we still want to feed even unproductive people and allow them to get back up again.

[@alldaywhodie]

Silicon Valley should buy and develope Bir Tawil

[@DigitalNomadOnFIRE]

wall-e isn't FULL dystopian

[@Snaveltjeskrant]

1:11:24 So Thomas Edison believed that the usecase for the phonograph would be religious sermons. If we relax the terminology here a little bit: that is more or less what happened with talk radio and podcasts. If a show runs long enough, over time it devolves into preaching to its own echo chamber.

[@denirgar]

I've been mining truth from being a poor kid with victim minset to trusting institutions and then to being a suspicious hippie about institutions cuz everything seemed wrong... But everything seemed wrong because I could imagine something better. It seems to me like you're part of the bedrock... I really wonder what is exactly this magic technology mentioned at 27:21... and why, if it is magic, it is not public as a product people can touch yet... . -.

[@MitchellPorter2025]

It's probably blockchain, and the idea of using digital encryption blah blah as a substitute for trust in institutions

[@davidh.65]

Can you please have the intern create timestamps for the different sections? Thx!

[@JeremAl]

I agree theoretically with a lot of what you guys say but you seem to have never heard of communist (East) Germany. There was NO unemployment and they discovered it with the fall of the wall. They all had a descent life, healthcare etc… That is why there has been a lot of nostalgia of the communist time when 20% were unemployed in the 90s 2000s. There’s even a name for it “Ostalgia”. (Ost = East in German)

[@dzidmail]

The life in modern prisons can be decent too.

[@JeremAl]

@@dzidmail unemployement is the worst way to criticize East Germany communism since there was none lol. There are plenty of valid ways to criticize East Germany communism (autocratic, dictatorial, represive system...) but unemployement is by far the worst point to make!

[@francinehardaway7888]

People hate change. Nuclear power was the last big scary technology before AI. Most of the tech development between nuclear power and AI have been safer and easier to adopt. AI has been presented as causing the fall of the entire economy. Personally I don't think so, but most other people do. How do we fix that?

[@Mills-London]

😂

[@runookiomah169]

Farm animals - that is not an advance.

[@VinceBelpiede]

Zero risk on nuclear? Maybe give it a 1% given Chernobyl?

[@eanerickson8915]

You love markets? great. How come government has been growing in the last 100 years and getting dumber?

[@pse2020]

U guy miss one important fact... Why do we have poorer peoople?

[@sanesanyo]

Sorry its hard for me to take them seriously when they themselves were using their position of power by having a private allocation of Solana (supposedly decentralized solution) and then dumping the coins at an absolute crazy mark up to uninformed retail investors. How can they talk about corruption & big banks when they are living an example of that corruption 😂😂?

[@evarlast]

"I don't think it is easy to forecast these things"... meanwhile the whole conversation and recommendations in this entire hour+ is based on false assumptions made because these billionaires who are entirely out of touch with the real world. Terrible. Best thing these guys could do for the world today would be to give away all of their money at STFU and never speak again. The world would be a better place.

[@anyvoicespeaks]

marc andreeson literally invested in coin scams during covid and has been sued for rampant fraud and discrimination, yet there is always an endless line of clueless tech bros thinking that if they are nice to him he'll invest in them, its so funny and sad to watch! :)

[@tuckerbugeater]

who's in charge? you can't stop the avalanche. keep coping!

[@rosscopaddison9588]

WokeCrunch wrote a scathing article, not surprising really.

[@oleingemannk]

Does not matter if he's self made, he is a scam pushing all this web3 stuff. Admit that you're wrong, and move on.

[@tuckerbugeater]

And you can't stop it.

[@oleingemannk]

No need, it will slowly die@@tuckerbugeater

[@KumeikoApple]

Hahahhaha, the article is a joke.

[@1fattyfatman]

Guess you can't buy looks. Yikes!