Active speaker system ICEpower 1200AS2 + 2x 200AS2 ASS1800 Part 3 Setting up the crossover

[@richardtechboy3302]

Thank you, this is just what I needed for my system.

[@partyk138]

Very good video! I have suggestion for next production. Would be nice to listen you explaining how to make measurement. I made similar setup but I adjusted it using ears only 😅 I want to compare it with measurements and discover full potential of my speakers :)

[@guntarssmits2104]

There are four grades of measurement. But you should start with optimum speaker placement anyway to get a good sound stage. The first is my described method with headphones where you insulate yourself from the room and then compare both in-room and headphones to try to get as close as possible. It is a simple and precise method that includes room influence. The second is to apply the noise with one of the measurement software and try to get a flat response. It also includes room impact. May be good to properly place speakers. The third - get linear anachronic chamber response using digital DSP and step response where I do not see any value unless you are not in the treated room. The room will spoil everything And the fourth - have a treated room and by using DSP crossover fix everything that you can. It is a complex task and you need knowledge close to the studio mastering person. Modern DSP crossovers with parametric filters in the hands of beginners in most cases land with failure. Your music listening experience will not improve but you will have a perfectly neutral sonic balance to be able to mix recordings. The funny thing is that with the first method you are at 95% of the audio quality.

[@partyk138]

​@@guntarssmits2104thanks for answer. Unfortunately I have limited options with speakers placement (limited to one place 😢). I noticed better soundstage when I moved speakers closer, but they can't stay in this place. I made a lot of tests with active crossover but probably I reach limit. I will try your tips in next free momment, do you think dsp can solve placement issue or it's just waste of money (in scale 1-10)?

[@guntarssmits2104]

On a scale from 1-10, it will be “0”.DSP can change some coloration issues, extend bass performance, correct baffle compensation, correct some loudspeaker components design amplitude frequency limitations, and do speaker time alignment but cannot change room reflection soundstage smash. Your active system's largest benefit is loudspeaker driving tolerance and control which you can describe as detalization. To further improve your sound stage you should use speakers with waveguides forming more focused direct radiation and narrow vertical plane radiation. At some point, you are at your current system limits and the next step is room treatment or rearranging your listening sofa configuration to be closer to speakers. In my video, there are THX placement recommendations drawings and those are industry standards for the best result. No shortcuts, sorry😊

[@partyk138]

You confirmed my suspicions 😅 I have to discuss with my wife about it. One more question, did you compare dsp with Behringer crossover from previous videos?

[@guntarssmits2104]

@@partyk138 In most cases for home usage you do not need DSP. DSP is great for pro musicians when you change performance places, have many speaker boxes, and get nasty reflections from architectural constructions. With more than 40 DSP adjustment parameters you can get more or less acceptable sound for live performance and suppress some positive microphone feedback. To simplify this process test signals are built into the crossover DSP, and typically good DSP crossover has measurement microphone input. For home usage, you do not get much from DSP You can improve some tiny bit of coloration, but your overall impression is minor or not improved. There are only a few potential steps with a big impact - amplifier power, amplifier bridging, and direct loudspeaker connection to multichannel amplifiers with crossover prior amplifiers. The rest of the processing has a minor impact on your listening experience. In the case of home recording, you should start with room treatment and then use DSP and acoustic measurements to get a neutral sonic balance for proper mixing.

[@QAT4969]

this is an absolutely gold vlog teaching for audiophile. i plan to use trinnov altitude for my surround processing. if i didn't mistakenly heard, it has active crossover for each channels, correct me if i'm wrong. so hypothetically, if i were to build a symmetrical 25 surround channels, (floor, bed & height channels including main LCRs and top center voice-of-god height speaker) that would sum up to 50 discrete channels yes? 25 high frequency and 25 low-mid frequency channels. correct me if i'm wrong here. 2. also in regards to trinnov, their bass management and wave forming, does the 1.25 of A listening position still applies? i highly appreciate your vlog Mr. Guntars, top-notch educational stuffs.

[@guntarssmits2104]

Hi, thank you for the inspiring comment. With the Trinnov altitude processor, you are stepping into the next-generation home cinema. And what is most important is that the processor is separated from the amplifier. It is important because THD processing and amplifiers are developing at different speeds, similar to photography where a good lens is living 10 times the camera body life’s. Modern amplifier boards in home cinema exceed human hearing limits, but THD processing is still in development. In-home cinema speaker placement is less critical because you have a number of them filling the room and reducing room impact. Subwoofer placement issues are compensated by the digital processor changing phase and volume of low-level signal in the digital processor. The measurement microphone takes the role of a precise listener. Wit stereo everything is so critical due to non-optimal standards. It would be far simpler in the case of 3 speaker systems- left, right, and center. Historically stereo is developed as 2 2-channel system where a 3-dimensional effect is generated by our brain capability which is adding critical placement limits.