HSS Flash vs ND Filter | Take and Make Great Photography with Gavin Hoey

[@michaelfranzyshen8241]

This video inspired me to take up wood-chopping. Seriously, great video on HSS!

[@marksilvester4508]

Using a strobe in HSS mode will significantly reduce flash output, about half, if you need the flash’s full power ND filters are best.

[@Abakaschi]

Light from the flash going through a ND filter will loose power, too (stops as per the filter’s rating)

[@jasonbodden8816]

@@Abakaschi But you still have the FULL range of power of your flash at your disposal. That's the difference.

[@hazybrain7]

Probably noted here already, but High speed sync really eats your battery power, so you'll get a lot more shooting with the ND filter - worth bearing in mind. Great tutorial - as always !

[@huyongquan6554]

Hi speed eat 1/8, ND eat 1/4, which is much power consumption. It is the game between high speed sync technology with solid unchanged ND. High speed win.

[@jasonbodden8816]

@@huyongquan6554 High Speed Sync generally robs you of a good bit more flash power than ND filters. That's just fact. ND's don't rob you of power. You just need more power the greater the strength of the ND filter but it doesn't rob you of any flash power out the gate.

[@voederbietels]

@@jasonbodden8816 and no HSS flash banding problems with electronic shutter

[@richardmendoza4389]

I never even knew about using an ND filter with flash until recently, so this was quite an informatiive video. I've been practicing more with HSS, & find it quite versatile. With that said, there's always other uses for the ND, so I think I'll pick one up in the near future & play around with it, too. Thanks!

[@HM-jm4om]

There is no difference when the flash is strong. I expected to see the advantage of the ND filter when using a weak flash. It is known that in HSS mode a lot of power is lost because it has to discharge several times when opening the curtain.

[@GavinHoey]

In my (unscientific) experience I find the Flashpoint Xplor 400 and 600 max power to be roughly 3 stops of light down on the non-HSS flash. So if I'm a adding a 3 stop ND to get to the same exposure, I'm more or less using the same power in HSS and non-HSS. At least that's my feeling. That said, HSS power settings are a moving target with shutter speed making a sizable difference to output, whereas an ND filter is more predictable... if only there were just one correct answer, photography would be so much easier 😉

[@michaelballance1893]

@@oneeyedphotographer Electronic shutter is disabled with flash (HSS or normal) on my A7Riii.

[@PosranaRegistrace]

@@oneeyedphotographer The way electronic shutter works on Olympus does not allow to shoot with flash properly. The picture is fully exposed by flash at some of the lowest shutter speed (it was 1/8s for E-M1, newer are slightly faster, around 1/20 or 1/50 I think). Not really practical.

[@premiumparis]

OneEyedPhotographer flash won’t work in electronic shutter... also you’ll have rolling shutter issue and flickering with some lighting. That’s because the mechanical shutter allow uniform lighting. Google how electronic shutter works :) As for HSS vs ND, you’re doing the math wrong. First of all, the power will depend on how fast you’re going. If you’re going to 1/8000 it will be a lot more than 3 stops lost. Bottom line is that it is definitely easier to use HSS but ND is the better way ans will give you better results, especially in extreme conditions (very strong light, or need to have the flash further because it’s a wide shot, or using a huge diffuser, etc)

[@bestpractices2654]

@@michaelballance1893 Yep. The untold story of mirrorless in most cases. Anybody else on this thread experience that restriction with your mirrorless DSLR?

[@erroljs1]

4:55 That's not luck, it's experience 😊

[@GavinHoey]

Probably a bit of both Errol 😉

[@iainblacklockphotography]

I really must remember the TCM option on the trigger. Quite handy for initial tests. Great video as always Gavin

[@GavinHoey]

It really is a handy feature Iain, especially when social distancing makes using a flash meter tricky.

[@cerec69]

I guess the issue with ND filters you could spend a load of cash if you use a selection of lenses with different thread sizes. HSS is something I’m dying to try out as I already own a transmitter for my Canon 5Div. Can you use multiple flashes for HSS?

[@mannydelossantosproduction1306]

Perfect timing. Just used a variable ND filter for the first time to take sunset portraits at a sunflower field using off camera flash. Was pleasantly surprised 🙏

[@jimpack9622]

You have any trouble with the VND? I have one and have to be careful as it can create x type shadows at certain angles

[@jasonbodden8816]

@@jimpack9622 Well, the X pattern only forms at the very extreme end of the filter's range so it's best to avoid that portion of its range.

[@darrindelaporte9030]

Thanks Gavin! Excellent break down of the processes. May be a good idea to cover the disadvantages of HSS such as limited distance due to power consumption as well as flash overheating issues with multiple shots. The ND filter would not make the flash overheat as much and you will have a longer distance if necessary for the flash to reach. Thanks again.

[@thehumanityoflife6460]

But you need to have a mirrorless camera so your viewfinder would not be dark when viewing thru it.

[@jackyyao8231]

@@thehumanityoflife6460 are you sure mirrorless viewfinder not dark?

[@mverick160]

The one big difference. If you use a ND filter you flash can put up all 400watts. If you use HSS your flash can only put up around 133watts. Because it has to fire multiple times and has to be able to recycle. So if you need the extra power, use ND filters. If you don't need the power use HSS. For HS, Hypersynchs, benefits. You can ramp up the shutter speed and not lose power. And not use a ND filter.

[@GavinHoey]

I've no idea about the numbers I'm more about "if it works, it works". But if you're right (and I'm sure you are) then would a 3 stop ND filter suck up more flash power then HSS? I might be wrong but a 400ws light = 200ws (1 stop) = 100ws (2 stop) = 50ws (three stop).

[@HellbellyUK]

@@GavinHoey The way I explain it is that the ND filter lets you "trade" aperture for shutter speed. So say the exposure follows the "Sunny 16 rule" , so thats f16, 1/100 shutter at 100 ISO. This equates to f11, 1/200 shutter at 100ISO (this assumes a flash sync speed of 1/200 sec). So you'd set the flash to give you an exposure of f11 and away you go. But what if you want use those lovely expensive fast lenses wide open (or as close as possible). So you want to shoot at f2, that's 5 stops away from f11, so with a 5 stop ND filter that's the equivalent to f11 (with regards to light, but not to DOF), so the ambient exposure and the flash exposure both stay correct. The advantage of using an ND is that it's more power efficient than using HSS (as soon as you go into HSS you lose 1.6-2 stops instantly, and generally around another stop for every stop of shutter speed increase, although this second loss is usually cancelled out by opening the aperture). Hope that makes some kind of sense :)

[@basharhijjawy7871]

Gavin, thank you so much for yet another great video and toturial. From your closing line, you said that using a mirrorless camera made it easy to use the ND filter because of the intelligent EVF. This means that using the filter with a DSLR will not be so easy as it will be hard to focus and even compose. So as a DSLR user I think HSS Flash is the answer for me.

[@bernidre]

I use a nikon d610 dslr and it works perfectly. I use a variable nd filter. Twist to let in light and focus, then twist to darken and take my shot. No issues what so ever, especially if you don't have an HSS setup available.

[@mmz0810]

@@bernidre that’s also how I do it on my dslr

[@johnlegg1446]

I really enjoy your videos. They are easy to follow and understand. I tend to want to watch your's much more than other Adorama videos. (no offense to the others but it's true) Thanks for what you do.

[@RobertMossack]

If you do use an ND filter, buy a good one. The cheaper ones can leave a color cast that needs to be removed on post.

[@michaelballance1893]

Does auto white balance remove the color cast in camera? If no why not?

[@PosranaRegistrace]

I have a few Vari-ND filters from China, each was around 10-ish USD and they have almost no color cast at all, so the quality is not always about price... However the reason can be that they are stacked polarizers instead of just glass with color coating on them and it is true that some stronger NDs even from well known brands has strong color cast. Then again, non-variable ND filter is not that much of a fun for shooting with flash.

[@brucesmith9144]

@@PosranaRegistrace Variable ND filters are finicky. If you adjust them incorrectly, the dreaded _X_ pattern creeps into your picture.

[@jasonbodden8816]

@@brucesmith9144 They're not that finicky. I have 2 cheap ones and they work just fine. Never had the X pattern issue.

[@jasonbodden8816]

@@PosranaRegistrace Yip. I much rather a Vari-ND filter than individual ones of different strengths. Wastes much less time and I get no visible color casts or flaring so I'm good. I prefer it to HSS, honestly.

[@ternielstvalle]

This was a master class. Exactly the info i needed.

[@Alexander84001]

Good video. ThaNk you. But not all cameras has 1/8000sec exposure. My Nikon D610 has only 1/4000 and minimum ISO 50

[@monsterwerksvideo]

Thank you! Now I have a much better understanding of HSS and I look forward to practicing it. Love your videos - fun and educational! Most importantly, to the point.

[@valokuvaamoloppi285]

Never tried actually ND filters in location when taking portraits :) - need to try just to compare myself. Thanks for great videos, helps with my work :)

[@anzaeria]

Great results from both the ND filters and HSS. If a small reduction in contrast is the only difference you can see, then that would suggest that you are using insanely expensive ND filters. For many years, Ive been using Hoya ND filters which are considered quite good in terms of quality but obviously not top of the range or super expensive. Generally, Ive been very happy with them for slow shutter speeds of rushing water and for video work. Though recently, I tried something Ive never done before. I photographed the same scene with and without a Hoya 3 stop ND filter. And I was quite alarmed by the differences. The photos taken without the filter came out so much nicer and the ones with the filter had a weird, unpleasant look about them. Previously, I was strongly considering using ND filters for outdoor portraits with flash (being on a small budget) but now I'm not so sure after seeing my own comparison photos.

[@meljenkins1016]

Wow, so that's how you get high speed sink at 1/1000 when your camera is limited to 1/250. I was in a high school football game which was played at night in stadium lights and I took a photo of the team after the game and my shutter was 1/1000, ISO was 16000, F 6.3 and had a flash that was turn full power using a 14mm ultra wide lens with high speed sync. To my surprise the picture came out perfect, by accident. Now that you mentioned about high speed sync used even though the camera will only give 1/250 knowing that it has a flash mounted on it.

[@patconnors6188]

Great video explaining on how to use ND filters & HSS. Other than saving on the life of your batteries. Are there any other advantages on one over the other? Explaining the use of the TCM button a plus as well.

[@manoharmgr8235]

SUPER ,CONGRATULATIONS,*** நன்றாக இருக்கிறது வாழ்த்துக்கள் R.MANOHAR-CHENNAI

[@TienChoihk]

In case you have an AD600, HSS is the easy way to go. However, if someone only has an AD200, HSS is very lightly to be too weak to counter a bright background.

[@LadyFairChildVideo]

to anyone reading this. invest in a really good ND filter. the ND filter has to be really good quality. otherwise you'll get a softer image. a good ND filter will allow you to stay within the cameras HSS sync limit, while still cutting the ambient (to avoid the high shutter speed that cuts the power of the flash). so, to me the best solution is flash/strobe with a good ND filter to cut the ambient and keep the flash power 1/250s/1/200s depending on your camera specially when fighting against the sun.

[@codyconrad7333]

The exposure's looking nice but I think the light needs to be warmed up the backgrounds very warm in the subject looks cold.

[@tobiascrow2792]

For workflow a good ND seems better, truth is difference between ND and HSS is sooooo little, barely can tell the difference, nobody would know if you used an ND or HSS

[@kottize]

mhmmm ok, but remember that the high-speed sync makes you lose a lot of power !!, a speedlite with NG 60 easily has a NG 21 !! if you use a powerful strobe instead of a "cobra" speedlite it works fine otherwise you have to be careful to use high speed

[@hungvu1676]

How do you meter the flash when using the ND filter on? My trigger is kind of old version and can't use TTL to measure light and switch to Manual mode. Thanks

[@ludivogel8856]

How is it that your flash power were less when in HSS. They always say that you loose power of flash when in HSS especially at the 1/8000. So my expectation is that when in HSS the your power should be slightly more that with ND even if you use a powerful flash.

[@jameswburke]

Good comparision - Also a consideration is that HSS eats the batteries up very quickly compared to normal flash and ND filters.

[@TroupeGoal]

Hang on, he's not using the flash on his camera to illuminate his subject in the HSS photos? He said he'd just turned on HSS on his camera but what's what umbrella there for?

[@wailabdelgaphar609]

Is canon st-e3 trigger can do that feature of ttl reading light meter or that is it just Godox (tcm)?? If so how i can do it 👏❤️thank you

[@focus1ist]

Thanks! Learned a bit more...

[@adventurelife969]

Hey From Pensacola Florida love watching all ur videos ur extremely informative and I’ve learned a ton from you

[@gentlegnt]

Love your work and teachings, as always, Gavin. Thank you so much!!

[@retirementhobbyfarmdiyadve1511]

This was an excellent and informative video. I also liked the setting for the photo shoot and the model's costume. Seeing those was also educational. Gavin's enthusiasm is always fun and inspirational. I really appreciate Adorama sponsoring such great videos.

[@markbrown8251]

Your video was so go. I never had the thought of using ND filters with flash. Thanks I have more knowledge now. Keep it up.

[@LeneMulan-jt2dc]

I really love your videos, is there a way can do a video call to set my lumix g 90 for highspeed shotting

[@flashback9966]

If you are still there? Great video, but on the very last shoot you didn't use TTL and then transfer readings with TCM function. Any reason why not?

[@cifuentesphotos]

Great video Gavin. I will like you to do one with basic equipment for the ones like me, that do not use TTl and have limited filters. Remember, we are not all gear chaser. Thank you.

[@fabriziogiuffra]

If you used a flash on camera a transmitter and filling light you could set the dark side of the model more or less dark.

[@LeneMulan-jt2dc]

I am willing to pay you for video call to help me set lumix G 90 to flash system like the one you are using in this video please let me know if this is posible

[@Tht1Guy]

I’m glad to see more people talking about ND filters. One of my favorite ways to shoot is full sun using my ND 16 (4 stop) filter and 38 or 45 degree hard light reflectors.

[@kaydawgy1999]

Do you use any flash?

[@cmps91]

I only have one question, its difficult focus the subject with 5 ND filter?

[@shawnvine4918]

Thanks for the comparison between the two methods. Haven't done much work with filters, so this was nice.

[@dunnymonster]

Always a joy to watch Gavin at work. 😊👍

[@robjeeves]

Awesome work mate. Enthusiastic concise delivery. Gavin for the win 🥰

[@uldisstrods1509]

Is your flash more powerful than v860iii?

[@toddstrong1353]

I wish you would have tested the ND filters that fit over the sensor. I'm curious as to how the camera focuses with one of those vs. the on lens filter.

[@PatrickSmeaton]

Careful with that axe. Excellent tutorial!

[@Lucamitm]

If you go with hss, do you lose power only or also gain recycle time? Thanks

[@recfotoevideo3109]

Gavin. Whats happened when we use a speedlight in hss? Your power down for 1/4?

[@CoachAnthonyMiller]

Nice video. Thank you for your explanation of HSS.

[@brianharvey2468]

Thanks a great example of a good video I could follow easily.

[@irish60plus]

In a wedding situation and using ND, I can see setting up the second camera for this.

[@jasonchuc]

Mr. Gavin Hoey, you did it again! Another great tutorial video.

[@nancymerrill4351]

What is the best modifier that you use for outside portraits?? Size and brand please

[@bluerainbug]

Would it be possible to use the live ND mode built into that em1iii and achieve the same results?

[@Rohambili]

Variable ND filter win! HSS is for only who have all the money in the world...

[@darrinyo-mamakimble7002]

That was very informative never would’ve thought of dealing with light like that. Awesome thank you so much.

[@xonx209]

ND filter makes it harder to see the subject or focus properly.

[@mywildlifestories3793]

Lovely Gavin. Always admire your work.

[@notmyname8527]

Nd filters for portraits. The photos are not so sharp . Misses critical focus.

[@devinh7821]

You can set the flash to ttl and when you switch it to manuel it will have the power output you used in ttl?

[@srig4963]

Great video, what metering were you using?

[@matthewcheung5136]

TCM - "TTL Flash Converted to Manual Flash"

[@enjoiskaterguy]

Great, simple, and easy to understand explanation

[@EDDIEGARAGE]

so I can not copy what you have done because I own a 6D with mirror sad!

[@VitorAlvesEng]

I am from Brazil and i was looking for a video to take this doubt to me, it came at the right time this video, thank you so much ...

[@arekusu89]

Mesma coisa comigo.

[@MrCustomiz79]

It’s nice to see you using a flash that most photographers can afford.

[@SEPK09]

Good job Gav, good to be out and about i bet.:)

[@josephgarcia3767]

Enjoyed this. Liked the section where you took photo using ttl setting and then pressed tcm button, which put in a manual setting for strobe strength. Do you have any other tutorials about the use of ttl and manual on the remote?

[@GavinHoey]

Here you go Joseph kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6LXl4msfq6Vo8U

[@AchishkaNawagamuwa]

This solved my questions ❤️

[@kingsamvisuals]

That bokeh is stunning. Such lovely rendering

[@keithks]

Thank you thank you thank you! Very precise!

[@Kitt5150]

Just worth noting that HSS drains your battery faster as the flash has to stay on for longer and HSS also reduces your flash power for that same reason. So if using HSS, use a really powerful flash as Gavin is doing here as smaller flashes may not be powerful enough, especially outdoors.

[@GavinHoey]

You're right about HSS but it's not quite that simple. Using an ND filter requires the flash to increase power by 3 or 5 stops (in this case) and that ALSO drains power. As for big vs small flash I tried that here kzbin.info/www/bejne/jJqqkomciMd-pMU Spoiler alert... the little speedlight did WAY better then I expected!

[@dmt99vn]

@@GavinHoey plus filter also decrease image quality no matter how good they are

[@PosranaRegistrace]

@@dmt99vn It is not always as dramatic (or even visible). However it lets you use flashes that does not have HSS, which is a huge plus.

[@perpetualflame]

But why use a filter if you can just adjust your shutter speed

[@MarcusPocus]

at 1/4 of power that look AD200 at full power is usable in this situation.. anybody can to confirm this? ..thanks for your energy/enthousiasme that look very easy when you explain it!!

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Marc. In theory the EVOLV200 (AD200) has one stop less light then the XPLOR400 (AD400) I used here. So in theory if I needed 1/8 power with the XPLOR400 I could get the same results with the EVOLV200 at 1/4 power... in theory.

[@jackyyao8231]

does AD200 can make this job?

[@samirnorry6770]

You are Always Amazing 👍👍👍

[@pictureeyecandy]

Just wondering, because the flash is pulsating in HSS, This is more taxing (wear and tear)on the flash VS using an ND filter?

[@GavinHoey]

Hi Alvin. I guess it might although in my experience if a flash is going to fail it's always been due to my mishandling rather then age 😲

[@pjhaebe]

When im trying the TTL method..no ND, I get a 1/1 flash power regardless of other settings...using a speedlight

[@melodyphillips2388]

Speedlites and PLENTY of batteries!

[@EdwardOlive]

hi yes super video but why not shoot at minimum iso 100 or 50 to help too?

[@ralphdesignphotography]

What flash did you use please for those shots please?

[@bebitonenita65]

Gavin, great to see you outdoors...

[@Lisdiyanto]

Thanks for the tutorial

[@asfilmproduction1433]

Sir great information thanks.

[@dawidsiedlec7331]

great video :)))

[@cooldudesjce]

What is the metering used ? Is it evaluative ?

[@seanivrymusic]

this is excellent info and examples

[@KatieF307]

While there is some issue with needing increased power with HSS, given the capabilities of the XPlor 400, there is ample power to accomplish the task. One of the things I really admire about Gavin's work is that he provides a humble low cost solution without showing Profoto flash units, 75 different Profoto branded modifiers, and the latest and greatest Sekonic light meter. I have been watching Gavin's videos for the past 8 years and I keep learning more and more with every time I go back and watch something again. I think the take home message with the TCM feature is that once you dial in the necessary power level, you can lock in the settings rather than relying on any variations as a result of HSS. In an auto mode, HSS can vary between shots and the end-result can be uneven. The ND filters are fascinating to me as it basically becomes a scrim on the lens. There is a need for increased flash power there too to a degree. One thing that really helps the situation with ND filters is that both the Sekonic 478 and 858 have a built in compensation for ND filters. On the other hand, I liked Gavin's explanation of using the meter and adjusting for 5 stops to compensate for the ND filter.

[@cerec69]

Were you not worrying about the shall DOF shooting at f1.2? Getting all of your subject in focus must be a worry. Or is it because you’re using a shortish lens rather than an 85mm or 100mm? Great videos as ever.

[@kennethfabreag7889]

Very detailed! Thank you!

[@konsamprincesingh7763]

Thanks Gavin. You solved my biggest problem. I can't afford a light metre. I use a godox xpro and your ittl to manual technique saved my day. Thanks again.

[@Strongbear2013]

Thanks for the helpful video @Gavin Hoey. If I had more than one speedlight with one functioning as the key light and one as a rim light, would they both need to be high speed sync to work with the camera and flash trigger? Or does only one of them need to be (eg the key light) to allow faster shutter speeds? Does a second speedlight affect the shutter speed or shallow depth of field at all (eg if it's just lighting a model's hair)? And with that in mind, do both flashes need to be of equal capability and quality or could one be much cheaper and with far fewer features (eg one being a Godox over £150 and the other being a Neewer of only £29)? Thanks

[@udaypamphilos]

Hello Sir, thanks for the detailed explanation and sample shots. I have a question - I am a beginner photographer from India and I was asked by a fashion startup company to shoot their apparel with models/mannequins in the studio. Our budget is very limited and I am looking at Godox AD300 Pro with a 120 CM Octabox as my key light. I already have a Godox TT685 and a small softbox which I can use as a rim/hair light or as a secondary source to light up the background. Could you please suggest if the AD300Pro and 120 CM Octobox would be enough to light up head to toe shots? Please suggest.

[@okyaratilla5194]

Thanks for sharing your useful and nice experience with us. And my experience is a tail of yours. When using ND filter with camera values S=1/8000 and F=1/1.2 you can get same color and light result without ND filter and just closing aperature ND filter value. Only difference will be depht of field. So if we need small depth of field that means good bokeh we should use ND filter. Another point of using any HSS speedlight we have to know (most of them shows on screen) “flash duration”. My speedlight flash duration is 1/220 sec for 1/1 power and 1/15380 sec (with bare bulb) for 1/256 power. If I choose 1/16 poweer flash duration is about 1/4760 sec. That means camera shutter speed is not so important if ambient light is not dominant. Regards

[@KMaybach1]

Dear Mr. Hoey, I have a question regarding the modifiers that you are using for outdoor portraits. In this video, you are using a softbox but in your video: Better Than Ambient Light ..., you are using a different modifier. May I ask you, how you decide what modifier you will use for an outdoor portrait? Many thanks

[@tonypmedia]

4:05 ... Not really a bad shot as is, drop them highlights, lower contrast a bit, a tiny tiny bit of saturation and it would make a nice light and airy natural lit photo. Awesome shots man! I'm not a filter type guy but you workin them suckers man. Love the videos ALL of them! FYI, that wasn't no luck, that's experience, sometimes we simply question ourselves but typically nail the shot lol. Love it that way. You simply know how to look with your eyes and can pretty much pinpoint where your settings go without no durn light meter.

[@StudioGalvan]

I fully expected that you would need to set the flash for HSS to at least 1 to 2 steps more vs the ND method. I was wrong. In this test, the required manual flash settings were almost exactly the same! 🤔 Hmm, I'll need to do my own test to see how my Nikon+Godox setup will react.