Mid-Week Mini Mail Call #6 - A Mac special! Board recap and floppy repair

[@justinv433]

What makes your mail call videos light years above the rest is that even though you don’t open as much stuff in one video, you actually check out the stuff you open instead of just saying it will “be seen in a future video” and throwing it to the side.

[@countersurprise]

Justin V fully concur!

[@HoboVibingToMusic]

After a hideously bad day, bit of Adrian's videos cheer me up. Good work! :D

[@CrazyTechReviews]

Adrian's Analog Attic

[@gallgreg]

Love the MECC T-Shirt! That is truly AWESOME!!

[@timrb]

10:55 DeoxIT mentioned. 11:06 DeoxIT used. In all seriousness though, I do enjoy watching these videos.

[@frozendude707]

So true :D that stuff is lovely, but for my fellow Europeans who do not have access to the DeoxIT brand, look for "contact cleaner" as in electrical conduit, or "electronics cleaner" in your local language at general chemistry supplier (paint/construction/etc) or at an auto-parts store. They are usually not sold in places that sell electronics components, I think because electronics suppliers probably would not sell enough to satisfy the contracts of the large chemicals only distributors. There are variants that leave some protection against future corrosion, use this for connectors, and those without, that you can use if you plan on soldering something later. /rant/ Heck, since most types of flux is illegal to sell in most of Europe (if needed we buy individually from Hong Kong or Shenzhen, still illegal to use commercially, but meh, no one checks, they only check sales), we have to use ikky solder fat instead. Things are different in different places. *sigh* /rant/

[@cjripka6752]

Great video. I like how you open the package and immediately start working on it. I also love the MECC shirt. I'm from MN and used their mainframe in Jr. High and High School.

[@rwdplz1]

3:49 I have one of these, you just have to drill the hole, makes a nice 'upgrade'. You can also use the flyback off the Classic analog board to upgrade the Mac Plus'es

[@nbntelevision1]

Always brightens my day to see a mid-week video. I wish I’d been able to source your knowledge as I was fixing classic macs when I lived in Portland for 12 years. Took them with me to Canada, though. Keep up the good work!

[@fluffycritter]

On that floppy drive I'd try reflowing all the solder joints, and making sure that those transplanted transistors were put on in the correct orientation.

[@mrjsv4935]

Yess, mail call video :) That snapped disk drive ring reminded me when I replaced my Playstation CD spindle. Similar peace snapped surprisingly easy as well and sent the peaces flying all over the room. 20 years old plastic was already so fragile.

[@WY.C64-Guy]

@11:43 -- Years ago I had a PC 486/SX once with a failed hard drive, and also happened to have the parallel version Zip100 drive. Just as a "what if" experiment, I did manage to get it set up to boot first from a floppy drive enough to install the Zip100 driver, and then boot Windows 3.1 from the Zip100... INCREDIBLY SLOW... but it worked. In college, in my graphic design classes, Zip drives were the standard with our Mac labs. Students were required to buy a new disk every semester... really talented students obviously had multiple disks to contain all their freelance, non-assigned work. 100 MB was the norm, then 250 when that was available... anything more than that was burned to CD. And then these things called thumb drives came out....

[@shmehfleh3115]

On those old macs, I think you can hold the option key down on boot to display the boot menu.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I think the whole idea of a boot menu came much later.

[@MindFlareRetro]

Really liking these mid-week mail call videos. I was never really an early Mac guy but I am enjoying learning how you troubleshoot and refurb these. Great work!

[@awd42]

Hold Cmd+Opt+Shift+Number (0-7) to boot from that SCSI ID. This will also work for booting non-Apple CD-ROM drives -- holding C only works with Apple drives.

[@valentine_puppy]

Thanks Adrian, you know, When i was watching this when you were talking about the monitor motherboard as a parts board It brought me back to a film called Brave Little Toaster. The guy in the film repaired them with spare parts and you remind me of that guy. So cool. Oh and I hope you don't take offense to that because i really love that film and I was hoping you might take that as a compliment.

[@MrRadar]

The Brave Little Toaster is one of my all-time favorite films. Did you know that John Lasseter (who would later go on to direct Toy Story and Cars) originally wanted to produce it using a hybrid of 2D animation over 3D-rendered backgrounds (in 1986!)? Disney, who employed him at the time, rejected the idea because it wouldn't *save* money (even though it would not cost any *extra* money) and even fired him for suggesting it! You can definitely see some of the influence of The Brave Little Toaster in the original Toy Story.

[@justinv433]

wargent99 the air conditioner traumatized me. I’m still scared of window units.

[@andrewfinley459]

Woooooo , love these videos!!! Glad you’re doing well and doing what you love.

[@ion-shivs]

I love when a simple mail-call turns into a full-blown salvage/repair video. :)

[@ExStaticBass]

It sounds like an allignment issue. There may be a tool for realigning heads. There might even be a video of the process. What I've always done is to make a witness mark to show the original position and make micro adjustments from there. It's tedious but it works.

[@solar3mpire]

Thanks for the twisting technique, I repaired my Roland SC-88 digital board by recapping it.

[@sjn7220]

Cool shirt! I grew up in the '80's in Minnesota and remember MECC.

[@WY.C64-Guy]

I *wasn't* raised in Minnesota, but was raised *on* MECC software in our school computer lab. :-) Good memories.

[@hupshall]

I rebuilt a floppy from two parts drives once. What I found was that I had to swap both the stepper motor and the drive electronics as a combined unit (and then readjust the stepper so the heads could read the disk tracks). There where subtle differences in the steppers and the software on the drive appeared to be calibrated for that.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Interesting. Sucks the ribbon from the original heads was ripped or I would have swapped that too.

[@sammy61187]

Nothing better than a mail call love these episodes :)

[@BilisNegra]

Came for the Mail Call series, got an unexpected Mac Repairathon side episode. Not bad at all!

[@cablekiller]

Look into thermoplastic beads. Those will help in repairing those old pesky plastic pieces that like to break all the time. They are fantastic.

[@UpLateGeek]

Ooh, I hate it when a repair half works like that! So frustrating! If you still had the other part of the torn flex PCB cable, you might've been able to carefully peel or scrape back the plastic covering the traces and re-solder them together, but it's not easy. Hopefully the parts will come in handy in the future though.

[@andrewjenkins816]

Really appreciating the increase in videos recently!

[@xx3868]

Maybe a Ultrasonic cleaner? Great for electronics and car Carbs too!! Look forward to next instalments of repair.

[@cbmeeks]

If some of those caps don't come off with the "twist method", you could try a hammer and chisel. Or maybe rent a jackhammer.

[@pekkasaarinen2902]

@Marcel H Just being patient and using right tools is way better than making a quick job with brute force. But each to their own.

[@kh103]

Great unboxing. Nothing worse than opening something up and putting it aside, never to be seen again. Looking at you LGR and 8 Bit Guy....

[@vincentpinckard2243]

That desktop clutter at the beginning of the video!.....classic!

[@BollingHolt]

I guess I'm going to have to pickup some soldering skills here soon before my collection starts to get ruined LOL. I have probably ten or so vintage Macs in my collection, but I haven't touched a soldering iron since I was a kid LOL.

[@AndrewTubbiolo]

Breaking a PCB like that is not a drop. That's something like a lift fork on a forklift being driven into the unit during shipment.

[@DBinCardiff]

This video is wildly High Def. amazing.

[@lokz9632]

I had similar read issues with one Amiga 500 FDD, it started working correctly after recap

[@alisharifian535]

it is a long time that i have not heared floppy drive noises!

[@four20team]

That MECC shirt!!!! I love it! Where can I get one?

[@hfiguiere]

14:19 Crystal Quest. That's a flashback !

[@Eyetrauma]

Dang a midweek video, you’re too good to us.

[@Electronics-Rocks]

hi great show I have all the service manuals for machines sold in UK except Macs . Also to take the tarnish off the track use as a fibreglass pencil. just google they are cheap enough now a days

[@patprop74]

18:41 3d printed replacement perhaps? it would make for an interesting fix.

[@infinitecanadian]

Yes, please!

[@fred_derf]

When you boot a Mac, hold down the option key and you'll get a choice of what drive to boot.

[@infinitecanadian]

Those white gears are made of nylon, used because it is naturally slippery and therefore acts like it is greased.

[@sinseven7395]

Great stuff. I am glad to have found this channel and enjoy binge watching :)

[@twocvbloke]

That Sony FDD, under the barcode label should be a screw to remove the flywheel from the motor, I had a similar nasty noise from a now deceased Amiga-wired Sony drive in the same place, though in its' case it was plastic parts that broke up, though still worked for a time, but the whole thing just crapped out and no longer works at all now...

[@twocvbloke]

Of course had I watched another 30 seconds, I'd have seen that you already noticed how it comes apart, different to my drive.......... :S

[@frozendude707]

25:00 I have seen such failures happen before on (PC) drives where the magnetic core of the head has come partially unglued from the foam or flatflex ribon. Could also be perhaps that the core has a crack or chip in it? You probably need a microscope to tell tho.

[@crmccluskey]

Regarding the FDD repair -- Some folks suggested caps, but I was wondering if you inspected the Double Sided / High Density switches were stable?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I hadn't but it seems to work OK reading all the disks and only seems to have problems writing. Don't think it's that.

[@crmccluskey]

@@adriansdigitalbasement I didn't thank you ahead of time in my comment. So to start, thank you for the continued fun/educational videos. I do enjoy every video -- especially the serials. :) I'm not familiar with the floppy bus (I should since I owned an SE for years, just never had and external floppy), but how did you eliminate the motherboard being at fault as shown? Seems we know the external floppy port is good, but it still seems to be question if the internal floppy circuitry of Classic II motherboard is at fault or if the mailbag+spares floppy is at fault? I think a known good floppy+cable would need to be attached to the Classic II mo-bo to prove this out one way or another, correct? Either way, it's exciting to see things that would be destined for the circular filing cabinet given a change at another life.

[@gallgreg]

Love watching the troubleshooting!! You have some definite skills that put many to shame! Sorry you couldn't quite get the drive working - you came so close!! I wonder if there is some sort of PROM that can be swapped between drives to get the calibration for the other head? Also can't wait for Part 6 of your Mac Repairathon!!!

[@darkwind9000]

If you have any of those spare Mac classic boards without cases they would looks awesome in a custom atx pc case!

[@dkmmhdk]

The ferrite core of the broken transformer are kind of fragile, so if it has taken a hit it's enough to make it shatter.

[@andrewinnj]

How do you handle the stuff that folks send which is, either largely or wholly, unusable? More generally, how do you deal with ewaste?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

If it's ewaste, I take it to ewaste disposal. If it's useful but not something I need, I pass it on to someone in the local community.

[@greybush1079]

Binge Watching !! Thx For the Great Content

[@jscollett]

I'm going to start calling you the Mac Whisperer.

[@fromfin90]

so strange to consider washing a motherboard, piece of electronic in soap and water, now i know why its done, still a touch on the strange side when everything else is scared of water

[@yorkyswe]

DeoxIT saves the day again.

[@katho8472]

Well, it's a long shot (being an C64 amateur) and I don't if I am making sense at all, but if only formatting 800K is a problem... Can it be about the track 0/track 1 recognition? How are 800K and the other formats different from each other in terms of tracks and sectors? Might that lead somewhere?

[@gbowne1]

3D print one of the plastic rings in a better material.

[@questionablecommands9423]

I miss me some Crystal Quest

[@FynboenDK]

Maybe the black spindle can be 3D printet and whith a stronger material as the original, so it doesn't break as easy when trying to but it back on.

[@brianv2871]

It's not been my experience that 3d printing is stronger then fabricated plastics, it's usually the opposite. I've made 3d printed retro parts before, but I'm not sure the effort vs reward for a part like this and on a disk drive with a limited amount of years left (considering the remaining lifespan of existing media) would be worth it. Lots of more interesting and rewarding projects that can be done with the time and effort.

[@FynboenDK]

@@brianv2871 Strong enough? - maybe if he used Polycarbonate instead of Nylon. Worth it or not? - it is still a solution, which was my point, dont make a big deal out of it.

[@Foobar_The_Fat_Penguin]

If you had a template (whether you superglue the old one together, 3d print one, or temporarily take one from another drive), maybe you could use it to create a silicone mold and then fill it up with a two-part resin that actually has the necessary strength to it. Sort of like a poor-man's version of injection molding. Not sure if it's worth the effort though.

[@808v1]

if you don't use deoxit you're punished for it Adrian...always use deoxit on every repair, service or meal.

[@bitoxic]

13:10 Mac dance party!!!!! 😁👍

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Hehe. Lots of Eeeps!

[@Choppy_PHC]

you could try demagnetising the floppy drive heads, its a similar method as done on vcr and cassette tape heads.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Hmm I have a tape degausser. Maybe that might work. I don't know though the drive mostly works that's what's strange.

[@Choppy_PHC]

@@adriansdigitalbasement i haven't tried it myself but i've heard from a few different people that have tried it have had some success, if i remember correctly in your video you said it formats 400k floppy disks, being that they are single sided it suggests theres a issue with only one of the heads, though it is strange that it will work with 1.44mb disks. (assuming i remember correctly as i watch a lot of your videos). love your channel btw

[@basvanharen2904]

Thanks for the video!

[@rorykurek643]

Hey Adrian, great video as usual! I know you've mentioned before that the water is pretty soft where you live. Mine is pretty hard, so I hesitate to use it to clean electronics. Any ideas on a cost-effective solution?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I'm still wash with it and just use a blower to dry the board off. Like a shop vac but I'm reverse.

[@scramble45]

Hey Adrian have you tried using a cheap electric tooth brush to clean up corrosion? I do this with some IPA and it works really well.

[@MattKasdorf]

Amy Farrah Fowler: "Outstanding. And if we fail, we can always stop at CVS and pick you out a nice toothbrush. I call mine Gerard."

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Heh. I really like that idea. Plus their head is nice and small. I think I'll be picking one up. Any particular brand that works better than another?

[@scramble45]

@@adriansdigitalbasement I used a retired oral b electric toothbrush, works really well against that blue corrosion gets in between the legs really well of chips. I don't think you can make a bad choice if you spend 20 - 40 bucks on one. I just use rechargeable AA's in mine.

[@Natures_Intentions]

Enjoy your content thanks for making these videos.

[@HuntersMoon78]

The plastic ring on the disk drive looks like Bakelite.

[@jimjimx5418]

Cmd + opt+ shift + delete Is the startup command for “boot from other disk”. Also, I can use that floppy drive for parts!! Send it to me please.

[@r.d.machinery3749]

Dead disk drives go to Silicon Heaven when they die, so don't feel bad.

[@RambozoClown]

Compressed air might just clean out that floppy drive motor. Try 100 psi.

[@MrSatellitehead]

Thanks again Adrian!!

[@baitsnatcha]

Careful with that "twist method" - twisting leaky surface mount caps on corrosion damaged pads is the perfect way to lift the pad right off...

[@kreskogym]

I really don't understand why he is persistent with that crap method?!

[@SidneyCritic]

​@@kreskogym I used to think that, but just twist a SMD cap off and you will see very thin wire/pins, meaning they will break before lifting a pad. Twisting is a shear stress, and pads hold stronger in shear when cold than pulling upward on a hot not fully desoldered pad. Basically if a pad lifts it wasn't any good anyway.

[@GORF_EMPIRE]

It's a perfectly viable way to remove them because the caps are not very resilient and the chances of them lifting the pad are very low. The cap leads are like thick tin foil and not very strong.

[@PJBonoVox]

This discussion has been had on every single one of his videos. Give it up now.

[@brianv2871]

Yeah, sometimes theres not necessarily a best way, but a best way for you. There are some recommended repair and soldering techniques that are completely outside my skillset but others find optimal for them. It's not one size fits all, or even one size fits every occasion.

[@ZerodJailbreak]

Do you have the link to your Analog Board repair forum post?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Oh yeah forgot to post that! Here it is and I'll add it to th description. www.vcfed.org/forum/showthread.php?69242-Will-trade-two-complete-Macintosh-Analog-boards-630-0102-for-a-working-one&p=622498#post622498

[@nils-kopal]

How about 3d printing the part of the disc drive you broke, Adrian 🙂?

[@ayushkaushik8794]

Don't use that emoji 🤣😨

[@theannoyedmrfloyd3998]

Did you check the speed of the floppy drive?

[@johnfowler6600]

I see you seem to use ordinary tap water for cleaning boards so I assume your area does not suffer from hard water wouldn't distilled water be better for rinsing normally

[@gurrag79]

Your thumbs heal faster from all your thumbs up (-: from all your successful repairs :-)

[@ZylonFPV]

Wouldn’t it be better to use a hot air gun to remove the caps rather than using the twist technique?

[@Saavik256]

Surprised to see an AMD chip on the Mac board.

[@DanielMonteiroNit]

Gosh, I love your intro XD

[@infinitecanadian]

One thing I don't like is that because you got spare parts, some computer got junked for them. We wanted to see you repair that frame; I really wish that you hadn't thrown it out.

[@CurtisOvard]

Adrian did you get a new camera, this video is super clear

[@winstonsmith478]

"Aluminium"? Too close to the Canadian border? ;-)

[@Rollinggirl39]

He’s Canadian

[@wazhoola14]

Yes that is the correct pronunciation, that other word is just a nonsense.

[@infinitecanadian]

I'm Canadian; we call it 'aluminum' here.

[@winstonsmith478]

@@wazhoola14 See the wink in my comment? It's a joke... And by the way: The name aluminum is derived from the ancient name for alum (potassium aluminum sulphate), which was alumen (Latin, meaning bitter salt). Aluminum was the original name given to the element by Humphry Davy but others called it aluminium and that became the accepted name in Europe.

[@winstonsmith478]

@@infinitecanadian Since I believe I've seen Canadians spell "color" as "colour," I had assumed that they also prefer aluminium. In any case: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jn6Xm32ZbdxnfpI

[@ultrametric9317]

There is so much failure of these bog standard parts that one wonders if the real enemy isn't heat. Nothing is more destructive of electronics in normal operation than heat. Jobs obsession with having a quiet computer was shall we say, dumb.

[@knghtbrd]

Would be if not for the fact that by the time these machines were out (1991), so was Jobs (1985). Jobs' Macintosh was the XL, the 128k/512k, and maybe the Plus had been been designed with his brand of leadership. It's true the Classic and other compact Macs were designed with the same style, but they definitely ran hotter. Not saying Jobs wouldn't have done it this way, just that he didn't. The history of the Mac and expandability is interesting. It really seems like it was Jobs' influence that locked down the Mac to be non-serviceable and non-upgradeable. After he was canned, Macs began to be expandable and that trend only reversed after the gumdrop iMacs (which would've predated his return in terms of R&D.)

[@CrazyTechReviews]

if adrians basement is called adrians digital basement, then wouldn't it be adrians analog upstairs

[@hypercube33]

Minnesota represent. Also pretty clear you dont have a 3d printer :) You could print a replacement piece you snapped...or gears. Maybe PM me?

[@randygreenwood1096]

Surprising that you can wash a circuit board in water, seems like that would destroy it.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

It makes it shine!

[@razpones]

how do you dry the boards?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I just use an air blower. Get almost all the water off. Then let it air dry overnight typically.

[@razpones]

Thanks!, I will try it next time I find a mess in a board.

[@Samuel-ge7im]

Nice!

[@frazzleface753]

My kid ran water over the tv remote for two seconds to 'clean' it, and now it doesn't work after drying thoroughly against a fan all night. Adrian immerses a whole motherboard for several minutes in soapy water, and it improves its functionality. What Gives, Bro??! :/

[@duderobi]

The difference is the remote was powert.

[@frazzleface753]

@@duderobi Ah ok, so with the battery in, it shorted stuff out?

[@gallgreg]

Any time electronics get wet, you should immediately remove power (take out batteries, etc) take apart the item as best you can, then dry it out as quickly as possible (use IPA and/or fans). Moisture left on a powered device can quickly corrode everything! Water can be your friend or enemy, depending on how it is used!

[@clothinghanger6978]

Well if the remote had batteries and wasn't completely disassembled, it would damage it pretty badly. The remote's shell was probably holding water and letting it corrode the board badly and the batteries were powering it the entire time this was happening.

[@gbowne1]

There are several Sony MP-F75W drives. -01g, -011g, -012g, -21g I looked for schematics. I'm not sure what the differences are between them.

[@theretrospector4926]

does serious drama happen to the parts while shipping in past ? *lol* just kidding, love your videos!

[@Codeaholic1]

Is it my bad vision or is Adrian's camera's autofocus going nuts?

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

No it's crappy Panasonic Lumix camera has terrible autofocus. I need to replace it I guess but the thing was quite costly.

[@Codeaholic1]

@@adriansdigitalbasement for still shots you could set the focus manually and turn off autofocus.

[@carrollmontgomery]

I'm not sure if you have seen this, but I have to show you. Found it on Craigslist Best Of: www.craigslist.org/about/best/sfo/6725919483.html

[@kd5byb]

Honk if you love mail call! BEEP BEEP!!! :)

[@thedungeondelver]

Another great vid, Adrian! BTW, your autofocus was going *crazy* in this vid in the beginning. Unfortunately kinda distracting from the great content.

[@Naturalbeachbum63]

Yes ha

[@DForce26]

Put your motherboard in the water... Erm... :D

[@aminorityofone]

as long as you fully dry it, it will be fine

[@jeffreyphipps1507]

The power supply died of dysentery...

[@williamsquires3070]

If you need one Adrian, I’ve got a few of the clear, plastic “windows” for external Zip drives. Yours looks to be the 100 MB variety. We used to use the external parallel-port Zip drives at work all the time; we still have two stores that use them for monthly backups, the other two stores went to Windows XP and now use USB flash drives. I saved the top lids from “bad” Zip drives that came back whenever a store closed or merged, so just drop a note at wsquires at satx dot rr dot com (sorry, I have to spell out my email, or spambots will harvest it.) 😊

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

Heh yeah it's a 100mb drive. That would be cool I could just epoxy it back into place and get rid of that crappy bag I have taped to the top. Thanks!

[@waynefoux7245]

Any tips on how not to make a mess with DeoxIT? I'm always left with it everywhere, ruining labels, and covering everything. I'm curious if there is a better product or a better means to apply.

[@adriansdigitalbasement]

I put some on a little eye dropper bottle. So I can apply it strategically as needed.