[ENG] ASL S15 RO.8 Match2 Mind vs Queen (Tastosis)

[ENG] AfreecaTV StarLeague(ASL) Season 15 (Tastosis)
Ro.8 Match2: Mind vs Queen

[@anonamos701]

"Ive been known to complain time to time about things that feel unfair, but Vermeer is well-made" -Artosis, 2023

[@Galacsia]

I feel obligated to mention that in sponsored matches on Vermeer Terran has 57.1% winrate vs Zerg and 56.7% win rate vs Protoss. Having said that, as a Protoss I love Vermeer, we need more maps like it.

[@MrNacktnasenwombi]

That means its imbalanced but favors Terran, right?

[@Galacsia]

@@MrNacktnasenwombi I'd say so. It's slightly Terran favored, enough to be called imbalanced but nothing major.

[@SplashJohn]

Yeah, I loved that. " . . . from time to time."

[@TheChupacabras69]

It seems that TvZ consists on a timing push just before defilers.

[@Scrambles2112]

WHATS UP NERDS!!!! ASL FOREVER!!! TASTOSIS FOREVER!!!!

[@beridledodopidop4822]

Me me I'm your nerdboy!

[@eurapeon]

​@stop censorship No.

[@heptagram2108]

​@stop censorship he is in not in Korea anymore so they produce by distance from recorded unwatched material.

[@Scrambles2112]

​@stop censorship u must not watch RT's stream often, RT will cast broodwar till the day he dies🙌🙏🫶

[@kabuteshiitake7071]

Wazzuo nerds!!!!!

[@SplashJohn]

Okay, I'm finally pulling the trigger on Patreon support. I feel a little bad for waiting so long, but hey, better now than never. And I encourage other procrastinators like me to go for it. The quality of these casts is top-notch, and well worth a few bucks to ensure they continue. Many thanks to Tasteless & Artosis!

[@danieln6700]

Its the only time I actually supported something on a patreon because I want to keep seeing BW games and been into starcraft forever.

[@FrankiePacino]

absolutely .this is better than avatar 2

[@sethhinson9937]

Why is there hardly any fans in the studio though? Anyone know?

[@FrankiePacino]

@@sethhinson9937 most broodwar fans are older and have busy lives I would guess. I don't know any 20 year old who plays BW

[@elchinolatino15]

I'm supporting all 3. Can't get enough SCBW

[@bpaulauskas]

Never played SC, yet here I am eternally watching tastosis. That’s how good these two are!

[@WinterCody]

That's because no one else broadcasts

[@shaggyfeng9110]

@@WinterCody They are the best. I saw the SC2 final, which Time was beating everyone and won. Tastosis was way better than the other commentator duos. You are right, tho, not that many people broadcast SC1.

[@WinterCody]

@@shaggyfeng9110 I've followed artosis since I was a kid and he's hands down the number one caster for the sc sport. My opinion was just no one else makes a serious sc channel like he does

[@bencheevers6693]

Something incredible just happened I almost missed it and it was too quick to pick it up live, at 28:44 the tank that's in the middle lefthand side of the screen was targetted onto the other tank under dark swarm, Mind was quick and smart enough to attack his own tank to splatter the defiler food couple zerglings that would have destroyed that tank and he ended up saving it. I seriously cannot believe it, in the middle of that engagement with everything going on Mind targetted his own tank onto his own tank knowing that the shot would miss and splatter the zerglings attacking it. (To clarify, if he had targetted any of the zerglings then it would have missed, that zergling would have lived, the others died and the tank splattered by friendly fire splash, the only way to get every zergling and not the tank was to target your tank under dark swarm knowing you'd miss and hit everything around the same way a single lurker is invulnerable under dark swarm but splash around it still does damage) I've never seen that before, I'm sure that if that is what he did then it's probably a known interaction between units but in the chaos of this game I can't believe he picked out that one tank, told it to fire then told it to stop before the dark swarm vanished. Not sure if all the hydras were retreating and that tank was saved in the end because of camera pan and hectic minimap but when you see a player do that, that's like 10x worse than a player killing a drone, it's like next level and puts fear and doubt into you and your play. Oh wait, upon further review the hydras left early and it was just the defiler food under dark swarm swiping away at that tank, not enough time to unsiege and run I bet Queen never thought in a million years he wouldn't secure that kill and the tank gets away to fight another day. Edit: Despite Queen's pedigree, (not that mind doesn't have impressive runs as well, what comes to *mind* is that season that they nerfed the maps so flash got out early and it was just Mind carrying the torch, not 100% on that, the storylines and names blend together a bit but I think something like that happened) I won't be surprised if Mind takes this match after seeing that, due to his cerebral and unique play and the racial balance of the Ro8 I'm definitely rooting for him. In the third game on Vermeer, Mind played out of his mind, Arty was right it was perfectly tight, perfect control, perfect decision making and patience, he if the terran doesn't win early on vermeer it's a real uphill climb that often ends in a slow painful death as zerg slowly expands and chokes out the terran. It looked like maybe Queen was over confident trying to get more damage than was possible, I'm worried he's internalized his success and thinks he can walk over other players because that's a recipe for disaster. I can say that if Queen didn't push so hard against perfect defense it wouldn't have been so onesided but like Arty said from the beginning, Mind had an edge and was playing perfect so even without those mistakes I think he would have been able to convert that advantage before Zerg got 4 bases or if he did get to 4 while terran secured more expansions then it would have been late enough to bleed out the main and natural. My point is give that success to Mind for playing out of his mind, don't hold it against Queen for making those dumb mistakes. And don't get me wrong, top 20 terrans in the world like Scan and the people who win Narok die to that pressure 95% of the time, at the very top level though I don't think it's wise because the very best players seem to be on another plateau.

[@lordofleaves]

Underrated comment and fantastic observation

[@Poohdork]

It's a 3 month old comment, but that's not what I saw. The other tank is shooting as the zergling and while the splash killed it, he wasn't microing anything.

[@bencheevers6693]

@@Poohdork If a tank shoots at a zergling under darkswarm the zergling will live, you can't kill all units under darkswarm, will always leave one in a clump that are touching, also the terran tank would have taken splash damage and died as well, that's why I think what happened happened

[@eikbfsrum]

I haven't even started game 1 yet but I love the trash talk before the game - "I think Queen might be easier than SoulKey" and "I was matched against an easy Terran today"

[@baptiste2863]

yes ahah it was good

[@Necroneer]

Yeah fun banter

[@electricgoose4691]

1:07:37 queen blowing off his fingers as he gets ready to micro mutas. What a boss

[@IYPITWL]

good catch that is so funny

[@steveyya]

*Spoiler alert* @46:45 Arty meant to say Mind @47:37 Overload drop research time = 101 seconds Overload speed research time = 84 seconds @1:14:09 Almost perfect boxer marine lurker micro HYPE

[@49Chevy]

I saw the 2hr runtime and I was thinking "ok so its a 3-0, but hopefully the games are good". This was a pleasant surprise.

[@usmh]

Anticipation (the add-on) is your friend!

[@eurapeon]

Spoiler: It wasn't the outcome I wanted, but at least now there's no chance of a ZvZ final with a sub 2 hr runtime, which no one would want

[@erwinjohannarndt4166]

@@usmh Thanks!

[@ssf4evo]

that marine-Boxer micro was crazy. GGs

[@DarkLeviathan8]

I've only watched 3 games yet (and the series isnt over) but Mind has been playing so fucking good in ro16 and ro8, it's insane

[@eriknewman7889]

Mind is going NUTS this season and I am HERE FOR IT

[@dampiere]

That marine killing lurker micro took me back to my happy place. SlayerS_BoxeR will always be my Emperor of Terran.

[@dirkauditore8413]

Same, where is he now? Also why isnt that micro used more

[@dampiere]

@@dirkauditore8413 Well, last I heard, he was playing pro poker online. That's a long way of saying idk. Re the micro, apparently, it's easier to just macro more and a better use of apm.

[@DeepeyeLV]

Thank you guys for the amazing work! Such a pleasure to come back to such videos. Besides the fact that games are even better now than ever!

[@haoxus9413]

Great games Haven't seen them yet, but you know I'm right

[@misterkefir]

You're right ;)

[@natoh1s]

Insert Tasteless' inevitable comment about sparkle about 10 times per season xD

[@zolniu]

76 is such a fun map. Every game on it is crazy and interesting. I hope we have more this island maps in the future.

[@bladesofseven]

Oh I've been looking forward to this one.

[@aimwell7089]

Oh yeas we like the new upload speed. Actually refreshed afreeca channel and it wasnt there, clicked youtube and it was first saying 4 min ago hahaha. Yes I wanna see this badly

[@amaialaurentia]

This season is so insane

[@marcins4473]

please, do not ever cut "problems that you have " This is so funny to listen to you guys !

[@duchwkrzaku94]

1:02:02 Loved that part

[@zihaoguo6649]

Mind was savage in the trash talking 😂

[@michaelbird9148]

Awesome series! It was nice seeing both players have moments of playing so well.

[@AAkCN1]

Awesome cast. Loved the mic glitch and resulting chaos. Always fun to hear you both clowning. Loved Mind's smile after game 2 with him shaking his head. Good series and thanks for the cast.

[@dmr87]

Been watching Brood War since the Averatec Intel Classic and GOMTV days with Tasteless, let’s goooo

[@elchinolatino15]

Love you guys. One of the best matches yet.

[@exist0142]

Love plot twists, and this season has been full of them!

[@SplashJohn]

SPOILER ALERT That was really interesting to hear Mind in the post-match interview, saying how some of his critical decisions were made on the spot, or due to chance (like deciding to go CC-first because his depot was delayed). So really, this whole thing could have gone either way. At this level, when both players' micro and macro are on point, one little decision can make or break.

[@shaggyfeng9110]

They are truly great!

[@sangvinhun]

nice shittalk/BM in the pre-match interviews :D

[@TheFelineEffect]

And those akward smiles also! haha

[@CoqPwner]

Another awesome series. So glad ASL is still going strong. Cheers guys

[@josefharvey5614]

I just finished eating and I get this as a reward. Thank you so much

[@ShadowBanned0]

same here, terrible timing imho. It's a long video and would like to eat while watching. Now I have to wait 23 hours to watch. -_-'

[@DerKontrabass]

OMAD diet? :)

[@Lopyswine]

I've been a patreon supporter since day 1.

[@AshleyWilliamsN7]

Defiler is so nuts against Terran. Consume seems like it gives twice as much mana as it should.

[@bradyhicks5994]

Great games. Amazing to see the continued evolution of the meta and how fresh the game can feel 25 years in

[@Conquistador1519]

Great games, great cast. Thanks guys.

[@sigma4693]

You guys deserve every penny,what a stunning match ups . Long live scbw

[@lordofleaves]

Amazing series and cast ❤

[@2bitgypsy]

I think Tasteless was only pretending to not hear Artosis to hide the fact he had just time traveled to the wrong timeline.

[@thetreehuggersband]

When I feel I can't count on anything in this world anymore, I listen to Tastosis and remember there is some hope !!!!

[@MrDdz]

My case of the Tuesday just got cured. Thanks TasTosisuh!

[@nanthilrodriguez]

The Mind games were out of this world. So were the Queen games.

[@andreaskallstrom9031]

Great games, thank you!

[@udun84]

Cant stop the MIND game.❤

[@Mer-Turner]

Was that bomber holding a sign in the crowd before game 3? Right around the time they had technical difficulties.

[@Stranzua]

Man, it takes 12 hits from a hydra to kill an scv? Sounds crazy.

[@Redtornado6]

It takes like over 30 shots to kill a zealot by a marine, but it only takes 3 shots for a zealot to kill a marine 💀

[@gbs5009]

Hydra's do explosive damage, so they're only getting 50% their base firepower against SCVs. Combine that with their higher than usual health for a worker, and they can actually soak a lot of hydra shots.

[@iljimae5126]

ChatGPT says 6 hits... But it takes 18 hits for an SCV to kill a hydra. I think Queen should have ignored the SCVs and kill everything else.

[@beef5able]

@@iljimae5126 chatgpt is wrong

[@Cody27]

@@iljimae5126 It takes a lot of micro because if the scvs are attacking they will gain attack priority. Chatgpt doesnt know anything it just predicts what comes next. It could tell you the info about each unit then do the math so its more clear about its logic.

[@paulhamtorlia3039]

Now that was Mind blowing.

[@TheMagicStik]

I'm glad we're going to get a varied semis at the very least

[@ripmeemaw2119]

great games

[@divra1994]

fantastic matches, really fresh Terran mid games.

[@MichaelSotoCE]

I can't wait ❤❤

[@detrockcity3]

A lot of Terrans would’ve just pumped straight reinforcements down to the natural attack. Mind bringing these simultaneous drop ships to the distant expansions is brilliant. He always has just enough.

[@TonchoTonev]

These two are 80% of the reason for me to watch ASL!

[@volter84]

I Wonder how many of u guys realized, that in 2nd game after hydra drop Mind didnt put those marines into bunker on purpose..

[@beef5able]

Why

[@volter84]

@@beef5able he needed those marines together with scvs to kill/surround those hydra from drop. If he had put them in bunker, they would be almost useless - 3/4 hydra attacking wallin were not crucial threat at that point.

[@beef5able]

@@volter84 it did seem like a misplay when queen didn’t try to move the hydras attacking the wall up to help attack the main force

[@diegomaradona3561]

Last season our Terran hope was Light. But we slept on Royal. This season our Terran hope was also Lightt i guess. But we slept on Mind

[@754759119]

Why is it updating so slowly this season? Ro8 was already finished, and Match 3 & 4 are not yet posted?

[@MMarcuzzo]

OMG SO FAST. LETS GOOOOO

[@MeteCanKarahasan]

Omg two of the best players duking it out!

[@plasmaastronaut]

nice gamble opener by the winner in that last game.

[@MeteCanKarahasan]

@@plasmaastronaut omg already a spoiler while I'm at 4th game. So hyped wink wink *v*!

[@plasmaastronaut]

@@MeteCanKarahasan i hide my spoliers in others' comments. 99% of plp only read comments after watching cos they know there are spoilers there. Guess u are the 1%

[@MeteCanKarahasan]

@@plasmaastronaut noo! 》:(

[@AndrewTheTransformer]

1st game was solid but 2nd game was a strat I tried in vanilla Starcraft few years after its release aha

[@yyyy-uv3po]

You can see him shaking his wrist during the ending interview. I hope he manages to keep it under control, I want to see more of him!

[@Xcenttric]

Top notch games! Can you even ask for more?!

[@zanartofwar7892]

Lol i just realised listening their commentary at 0.5 or 0.25 speed is hilarious 🤣

[@sandromaggi4568]

A lot of nice mind games in this series.

[@nifarious]

Best Boxer micro 2023.

[@junior-vw8fi]

Why haven't they don't match 3 and 4 yet? They usually behind?

[@zTiiFo117]

❤❤❤

[@jameson5508]

Timestamps (5 games listed and stamped regardless of match outcome to avoid spoilers): Game 1 - 14:28 Game 2 - 42:33 Game 3 - 1:01:47 Game 4 - 1:20:29 Game 5 - 1:35:17

[@sergeyk9060]

What a gentleman

[@seancurtin8479]

King

[@glassberg5018]

You have secured your place in StarCraft Valhalla

[@beridledodopidop4822]

somebody buy this legend a beer

[@Omgtired]

Hey, guys, what's the most firendly race to start playing in your opinion? not talking about performance at the highest level eventually, but more so about laddering from time to time

[@grouchomcgrouch4150]

honestly, it's whatever you feel the most comfortable with. you can win and do well with any of the three at any level of play, it's a question of which one suits your play style the most more than anything else

[@abstractdaddy1384]

Without question it's protoss. Honestly, you could play for a couple hours with each race and it will become very apparent. Zerg is fine if you're more into it. Stay away from Terran.

[@Galacsia]

I agree with mr. Groucho. I've been playing Protoss since 2003 because it's what I like the most but funnily enough I'm better at playing Zerg, even though most people think Protoss is easier than Zerg. I would try out the 3 races and then see what you enjoy the most or the one you're better at.

[@grouchomcgrouch4150]

@@abstractdaddy1384 I disagree. I played competitively for 15 years, they all have their strengths and weaknesses and it really does depend on who is playing what. In my opinion zerg are the strongest but not everyone is capable of controlling so many units especially when most of them are fragile. Their strengths can be a weakness in the hands of the wrong player. It's not as simpler as saying "just play zerg" if the player is not cut out to play that way. As far as "stay away from Terran" goes, I think you have watched Arty ham it up for donos on his stream a little bit too much. Terran is very strong in the hands of the right player. You need a stubborn mindset and you have to enjoy grinding out wins in a long series. If you don't have that kind of mindset and stamina Terran is not for you. As far as Protoss goes, again, I think you've been watching Arty ham it up for the camera too much. They have strong units but they all cost an arm and a leg in resources and supply and they can die embarrassingly fast if you make a mistake or get caught off guard. Not everyone is cut out for that style either. TL;DR - It really depends on your play style and skill set. Every player should gravitate towards the race that they feel the most comfortable with, because Starcraft is a game of who makes the fewest mistakes.

[@11_Hashtagged_11]

POGGGGERS

[@Daren_PNW]

The failed Slayers_Boxer marine lurker micro, LOL. fun series!

[@Baldodeathmetal]

YEAH BOIIIIIIIIIIIII

[@NateBrotzman]

Why does this match not show up on Liquipedia ASL s15? The bracket there does not match the match up here, very confusing

[@NateBrotzman]

Queen does not appear on the season 15 bracket at all

[@TheDasErdinger]

@@NateBrotzman ? It does show up. Zer0 = Queen.

[@appleman515]

Finally!!!

[@zenartvonduke380]

Can i still play SC BW when im retired? NO... but will still definitely watch ASL when that time comes.

[@danieln6700]

He said on stream match 3 up. Must of thought the editing was finished.

[@seacresthill]

I'm surprised Tasteless didn't say "Battle of the glasses" even once.

[@Yamulo]

Doesn’t rain also have wrist problems

[@acardioxc]

Can someone who knows more about Brood War and also Korean culture answer this for me: When the players talk trash before the match like this, do they mean it, or are they all buddies just giving each other a hard time?

[@Galacsia]

I'm pretty sure it's the latter. The players have overall great communication with each other. They do have a bit of banter as you can see in Jinjin's channel but at the end of the day there's very rarely any animosity.

[@beef5able]

Banter

[@eriks2962]

I get the sense that the productin pushes them a little to trash talk each other too!

[@abstractdaddy1384]

Mind even said at the end that the trash talk in the beginning was just a joke and that Queen is very strong player.

[@aml7758]

Mind control!!!

[@hallo-mt5tx]

this was really good, but i wish queen was less greedy with rushing defiler

[@violetrecluse]

lets goooo

[@sirdiealot53]

Sparkle was ASL 5 Tasteless. 5 Years ago lol

[@kayDawgTV]

Seventy Six is a great map. Mind shaking his head in the end was fantastic. I really want to know what he said to himself after the game. Just shittalking Queen would be hilarious.

[@taylorjensen2787]

On Vermeer Mind should put firebats in the scv mining, he is going for no bunker, but i think it would be better in that area to have 1 firebat

[@andrewdelacalzada6802]

wow

[@michaeljackson765]

game one of mind vs queen, if zerg goes three hatch, seems like the only counter is to get a fast factory to get a siegetank out and kill the sunkens from a distance and punish the greed before mutas/defilers come out

[@stephenchyau3009]

I haven't finished the match yet, but I just want to say how good it feels when Queen loses. I think it has to do with his arrogance. okay back to the game, go Mind fighting.

[@VolkannGul]

Mind games.

[@AmirHa]

"do you really not hear me" lol

[@sleeper1855]

Gigaballs play

[@dirkauditore8413]

1:33:12 What song is this pls :(

[@yellow6100]

11:00 LOL "some of his recent bo5s"-artosis ----no ,its his freaking never been defeated in ro8 bo5s

[@Robin-zs8tf]

I think tasteless is keeping mind in his mind

[@MissKorea-oy9ip]

Tasteless doing okay? He seemed a bit tight and couldn't get a smile on his face.

[@ant0ine2]

Congratulations to Mind for beating the scumbag defiler build.

[@user-wk4np7fh2v]

11:05 track ID?!

[@LeonRedfields]

14:20 first match start

[@HeatIIEXTEND]

3rd game fuck yes

[@yellow6100]

I get it how queen makes his nest but why do other zergs make queens nest?

[@HasekuraIsuna]

I'll answer this hoping it is not just a joke. Queen's Nest is the pre-requisite for Hive.

[@yellow6100]

@@HasekuraIsuna Queens name is queen so he makes queens nest. -Others should make their own like jaedongs nest.

[@420Galleon]

Funny how 26 years out from actually playing the game, here I am, yelling at Mind, one of the greatest terrens in the world, IRRADIATE THE CLUMPS OF HYDRA INSIDE THE DARK SWARM, THATS THE COUNTER

[@sirdiealot53]

unless you have like 6 SVs its not efficient enough. defilers, mutas, ultras, lurkers way more likely targets

[@bencheevers6693]

Yeah you gotta get defilers when you see them or the dark swarms keep coming and leapfrog across the map and get on top of your natural or expansions and you lose

[@Appletank8]

Unless Hydras are perfectly clumped, you might only get 2 of them, which isn’t going to help you when 25 Hydras are running at you. Arguably D Matrix firebats would be more useful.

[@justadudeN72]

I think the solution for the hydra/lurker/defiler play for Terran is in vulture mines since it would slow the dark swarm push (they dark swarm your mines, hydras cant shoot them) And you can try to use the vultures themselves to pick off defilers. Obviously they'll try to bring ovies to pick off the mines, but there is hope as overlords cannot be protected by dark swarm.

[@sir0herrbatka]

I am having fever right now, and just the weirdest thoughts are coming to my head… Nukes. Nuke the dark swarm.

[@BLooDCoMPleX]

It's probably too slow to tech switch into Vults and Mines at that point of the game since Hydra/Lurker/Defiler hits pretty quickly. Terran might need to directly go into full mech if they want to use Vultures and pros seem to be avoiding that lately. I'm not a Terran player so I can't say why.

[@ivarkreuger3098]

Defense matrix on firebat, hydras cant hit it under dark swarm

[@justadudeN72]

@@ivarkreuger3098 Tru, that's way simpler I overlooked Dmatrix

[@justadudeN72]

@@BLooDCoMPleX True, good points. I'm a pretty casual BW viewer, I just watch ASL that's just what came to mind, but Ivar's suggestion of DMatrix on Fbats seems way more feasible lol