[ENG] 2024 SSL AUTUMN | RO.8 M2 SoulKey vs Light (Tastosis)

[@Natenesss]

Tasteless saying “I looked down on you for over a decade.” is wild 😂😂

[@gasstationpeanuts1814]

I love their banter lol

[@100thMkey]

🤣🤣

[@cl8804]

could've sworn useless was trolling when he said that he thinks toast came up with "crazy-zerg" FailFish

[@TylerClibbon]

"your honor my client did nothing wrong, he macroed perfectly"

[@misterkefir]

@@cl8804 yeah, very bizarre It was a pretty popular strat all the way back in 2007-8 afaik

[@BroodWar4Ever]

I tell my wife this is my k-drama so she understands

[@OD-ee8cm]

너무 웃겨😂

[@dori356]

Artosis is so good at making the strats understandable and digestable, I've never played brood war but he made it very fun to watch.

[@tkay42]

The casting of this series is exactly for what I support the patreon and begging that enough people does the same, so we can enjoy this for ever. 😊 "Crazy Zerg" and ASCII-Korean reading ftw!! 🤣🤣

[@Zorak_1337]

The fact that Tasteless thought Arty named it Crazy Zerg has me dying

[@elidhx6635]

He hears Crazy Zerg and is just like "OK i gotta take down this nerd a little"

[@frogslat4579]

@@elidhx6635every time it’s brought up lol

[@kathorsees]

Arty literally screamed at his cat for trying to snuggle up to him during a match and called it a "fucking protoss cat". He's exactly the kind of sick, criminal mind that would come up with a name like "Crazy Zerg" (so lame) and try to force it on people. I'm with Tasteless on this one fam, ngl 😢

[@elidhx6635]

@@kathorsees Despicable.

[@THAC0MANIC]

@@kathorsees whats funny is years ago it was Tasteless who said Ogre / Crazy Zerg in a commentary / side broadcast once lolz

[@MrTheQuestioner]

Brood War > Sleep Edit: thanks for translating the player quiz games in between the maps!

[@gregajk]

Oh is it?? I automaticly skip that for years... 😇

[@godlyobject6509]

Dude, the translations are so kino.

[@MyWay-d5f]

​@@godlyobject6509kino?

[@ch420newsteam]

@@gregajk then you are missing out on the whole Human factor. Why listen with commentary then? Oh. because you want to know about the playstyle, but only from the mouths of caucasian men.

[@darkjedi4z]

thank you, THANK YOU so much for translating the interviews in between the games!! it is great to finally learn more about the players behind-the-scenes!!

[@iithunderii9800]

That game 2 was a masterclass from SoulKey

[@memph1ston]

The fucking GAME I have been waiting for. A finals-caliber matchup in the RO8. LETS GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

[@Azuciea]

Artosis is so bubbly this cast, Wifetosis must have laced his coffee

[@sirdiealot53]

They were very giggly today lol I miss the rAnDoM things they make up like get your boats ready (sc2)

[@aquilegia9734]

"This is going to keep Light in the Dark" ... "Pause the game, we got to talk about this!" ... "I looked down on you for over a decade!" ... Epic commentary gentlemen! :)

[@Mairve]

Speaking of watching SCV's mine, thats literally what got me in to starcraft. I watched my cousin play and the first thing i seen was a SCV mining minerals. The sound effects are awesome too. That's all i needed to determine this game is sick as hell lmao.

[@yyyy-uv3po]

The sound of drilling SCV is awesome indeed! It's kind of soothing, I could almost get it played in the background nonstop.

[@JGD_CZE]

From mid game interviews: Cheolbyeog or wanbyeog, which nickname suits you better? Cheolbyeog. Cheolbyeog - 철벽 - Iron Wall. Wanbyeog - 완벽 - Perfect

[@misterkefir]

Thank You very much for translation!

[@ethansaltmere]

cheolbyuk wanbyuk

[@DesignInDepth]

Tasteless clearly yet covertly talkin trash about Stormgate with the early game being basically removed from that game/everything automated (During game 2 of this cast) was very therapeutic. Definitely hit the nail on the head, early game pacing is omega important.

[@elisabettajdj335]

stormgate is just an even worse sc2 with all the braindead shit automated.... sc2 is already like a mobile game. Stormgate is even worse which is incredible

[@loveboat]

Here's an idea. Make worker automation a feature of Tier 2 or 3. Problem solved.

[@adept7497]

@@loveboat No one wants solutions. Fanboys want to drown in nostalgia. That being said, Stormgate is mostly crap, Sc2 clone.

[@misterkefir]

Completely agree. Brood War is fast enough to be entertaining already.

[@MythrilZenith]

Much as developers want to just shuttle players past "slow" parts of the game to get to "the real gameplay" faster, statistics show that actual players of these games vastly prefer slower starts most of the time. Age of Empires 2 had a mode called "Empire Wars" which they were pushing heavily a few years ago, which would start both players in Feudal age with a 20-ish worker economy, all ready to get into the "decision making" part of the game. But it was seen as a novelty, and most players continued to play the normal mode, Dark Age start, even though 99% of games the first few minutes are execution of a static build order. There's just something to that normalcy, the slow buildup, and the option to do a wild early opener that isn't the norm, that makes RTS games sing.

[@antilarge7860]

17:14 Man I remember when I discovered Korean Starcraft. I used to stay up and watch the pro matches as a kid loved it to death regardless of the fact I couldn’t read/speak Korean. Such warm memories

[@misterkefir]

Back in 2012 I woke up at 5:30am and skipped a whole day at university just to watch the Proleague final between SKT1 and KT Rolster. One of the best decisions I've ever made. Witnessed some legendary stuff as it happened ;)

[@alexharper4640]

So glad these are bo7 This match up would have been a good finals even.

[@overwatch3595]

43:38 It's fucking 44 vs 103. What a comeback by Soulkey.

[@Aphasiesc2]

Yes, that's fucking crazy. I've been watching starcraft for 20 years and I dont think I've seen a turn around like that more than once or twice (other than some obvious throws). Lights mistake (in my opinion) was that he spent those 6-8 vultures on harassing Soulkeys economy (3rd/4th) rather than laying deep layers of mines to secure his bases. A half supply zerg can't bleed units through mine fields and still come out on top. But that's subtle in such a crazy game. Really one for the history books. What killer instinct Soulkey has, it's just amazing

[@EB-bl6cc]

I think the big mistake was to stop making valkyries. If he just kept making them and kept control of the air (probably best play to keep them split into 2 or 3 groups) then soulkey would never get un-supply blocked and would just die once you clean up the ultras. He had him by the balls and instead did the mech switch which was the exact thing soulkey needed, breathing room to recover

[@sirdiealot53]

Light just kept floundering, soulkey was harassing like crazy

[@spicoledude]

Valks took up a lot of supply so soulkey stays calm and comes back yeah that was legendary

[@Bleak13]

I was impressed by Arty’s read, he straight up called that Soulkey was gonna win from there

[@Gemma_Rashida]

Something I love is how completely calm Soulkey is in between games. He remains completely still like a Buddha statue

[@jasons4645]

YOU GUYS ARE AWSOME!!!! TY FOR EVERYTHING!!

[@paulkruger7934]

Only just started watching but gotta say... the observer did an amazing job. Switching to only Light's vision for the scan imakes it so much better.

[@bubblegumtate3384]

Yeah, SSL observer is very good at his job.

[@memph1ston]

@@bubblegumtate3384 i hope they pay that guy well

[@chrisbrannigan6210]

If it's the same person from the last few years, they've mentioned that the Observer is a former pro Zerg player.

[@Naraku-no-Hana-WE]

Wait, you mean Artosis didn't have to be exiled to Canada? It was all just a misunderstanding over Crazy Zerg? We truly are living in the worst timeline.

[@MNSalty]

Tasteless has really upped his commentary quality, grinding the game has served him well

[@Yurinator2]

Not a spoiler I havent watched yet, but im SO excited for soulkey this season. This man is looking brutal

[@godlyobject6509]

I CANNOT believe that second game. How!? HOW!? Great series. Expected from two titans.

[@maxjk1143]

1:36:05 damn tasteless stilll has the analytical mind and passion to make commentary like that! almost forgot what it felt like. keep it on tasteless, love you!

[@vladimirgregor]

Commentators are awesome! Finally after 25 years I understand what "Crazy Zerg" is.

[@nines_tv]

I love that Tasteless always giggles when its mentioned lol, I was thinking it wouldn't happen this season XD

[@drudd75077]

Fast ultra may be a better name

[@dirkauditore8413]

What is gasless expansion, 9 pool, etc tho? I dont understand.

[@vladimirgregor]

​@@dirkauditore8413 - "gasless expansion" - Terrran opening, when Terran builds a Command Center (CC) before making a refinery. Sacrifices gas income in favour of having more minerals to afford a CC sooner. 9 pool: Zerg opening, when Zerg builds a spawning pool as soon as his drone count reaches 9.

[@dirkauditore8413]

@@vladimirgregor Ah i get it now ty bud. I just feel like they call things names assuming everyone knows.

[@PseudoPr0]

SoulKey soon to be the first post-SC2 bonjwa!

[@EB-bl6cc]

Agreed with his comment at the end of the series, it's gonna take flash coming back (fully) to stop this guy, and even then it's not a sure thing because zerg is so broken in the right hands

[@Ichareus]

I woke up to a chill thinking my radiator broke. Turns out it was a Tastosis SSL upload all along

[@rat_datboi2185]

Tastless feeling a high from sending out workers explains why he is so much more into this game than me 🤣

[@benloper5727]

I usually skip the Korean pregame interviews, but I just noticed this translator is a lot better than previous seasons!

[@InnerverseCreations]

he's been doing it for many seasons now

[@kathorsees]

I really appreciate the translated interviews. It adds a lot. I'm not familiar with Korean culture, and it's quite different from what I'm used to, so that's interesting. I also don't know these players yet (just started watching BW), and hearing their thoughts helps me build some rapport beyond "I play zerg, so I root for zerg".

[@ElectricFencer]

You should check out the banter of this season ro16 grp selections was hilarious

[@kevinhu7684]

@benloper5727 Isn't Ziggy the best though? I don't recall where I read this, so I could be making it up, but he not only plays Brood War, but has been living in Korea completing a PhD in Korean history and language or something like that. We are getting top-tier production from this team.

[@TheUbernuck]

Artosis "I'm in a great mood watching, playing this" I believe the first part not the second part

[@HenglishShogun]

“Looked down on you for well over a decade” 😂

[@spiderfiend]

@SOOPesports_EN Are the games always going to be uploaded at 30 fps? Previous SSLs (ASLs) were in 60 fps. It is much less blurry at 60, especially during big fights.

[@sanctuarygaming4984]

And in a moment all is changed... the chills have returned

[@ItBlobs]

"NoT aS CrAzY aS CrAzY zErg" LOL

[@De_Nome]

Very good and entertaining games. I am usually skipping some of the minutes from the games when nothing really happens but this was action packed.

[@neonmarblerust]

I tried ensnare on workers one time. Really not strong. The math works out that each ensnared worker goes from 3 trips to 2 over the 25 seconds.

[@whatthefart20000008]

Yeah, he was using the queen to scout because that unit has great vision, once light trapped it in there, there's nothing better to do than to dump the energy bank on the worker line

[@GreenClawForestry]

A 33% reduction in economy is okay. Its no psi storm tho.

[@neonmarblerust]

@whatthefart20000008 Yup. Better than 3 parasites

[@BioReptiles]

Yeah i think the most important part of it is the scouting. The ensnare roughly translates to about 130 minerals not mined, so its not cost efficient. But its better than nothing, specially when your main objective is scouting

[@BioReptiles]

Spoiler. The first two games light played pretty good imho, after that it seems that he got worse. Maybe his emotions getting to him

[@BreakTheIce222]

Game 2 was incredible! What a comeback

[@Nooctae]

Watching Ultra go around alone and be mountains to take down in early crazy zerg games is hilarious. They're so hard to take down despite being alone against 10 different units sometimes lol

[@MondSemmel]

30:10: Re: SC:BW early game and pacing: IIRC a recent Grubby video mentioned that you can essentially categorize multiplayer games by how quickly you clash with other players. And if there's some time until this happens (like in SC:BW and especially WC3), then new players who might get crushed once the multiplayer part happens can nonetheless enjoy themselves and get used to the gameplay until then. Which is great especially for when you're still familiarizing yourself with a new game.

[@kathorsees]

I watched this vid by Grubby, and it's a good observation. At the same time, I feel players often fail to see just how subjective tastes are, even fickle. I vividly remember players and casters clamoring about how painfully slow and "uninteractive" SC2's early game is. People were comparing it to MOBAs, saying "player vs player, skill vs skill" interactions start from minute 1 there (directly opposite to what Tasteless said in this video, lol). RTS early game is "single player" (notice how it was used derisively back then), essentially "sim city + solitaire". So everyone applauded the changes that LoTV introduced. Players are people, and they don't know why or what works in games very well. As a game designer, I constantly encounter this. E.g., if a player thinks a certain gun in an FPS is too weak, you can often fix that by just making the gun louder and adding more bass to its sound. People will perceive it as stronger, and feel the game is "balanced" again. Of course, I'm not saying players are dumb and their opinions don't matter. However, a restaurant customer may not be able to precisely explain why they like this steak, and it's impossible to recreate a great steak by just following the customers' feedback. Same applies to all art, really.

[@raydespoir]

That's a good point. Often times people generally don't know what they want, but they do know what they like, even if they can't explain why. I mean, if you ask people back in the day before cars existed, they would've told you they wanted a faster horse and carriage, they didn't know what they actually wanted until it was invented.

[@HasekuraIsuna]

Reminds me of that resturant that suddenly started getting complaints about their good being cold when served - something they had never had before. Turns out people took minutes to take pictures of the food to upload on social media, and thus the food went cold.

[@kane_lives]

@@kathorsees Old SC2 is not representative of all RTS tho. A 4 pool in SC1 hits at around 2:00-2:10 minute mark, which some may still consider slow-ish, but a triple bike rush in C&C 3 KW hits at about 1:25-1:30, and can do game ending damage. I've seen pro Quake FPS 1v1s where opponents didn't see each other for the 1st minute as well.

[@Mackinstyle]

I will never tire of how melodramatic and over the top the opening to these tournaments are.

[@kathorsees]

The songs they wrote for this have me in stitches tbh. "Gamers play, this never ends" - it sounds like a tired complaint, clashes so wildly with the jubilant music. "Oh god, when will they finally stop..."

[@Fewshin]

I feel like light getting owned by hidden bases is a theme for him in the ASL/SSL

[@SPyoutube42069]

still 30fps. :( please fix this it makes a huge difference the ro.24 was in 60fps and was much higher quality

[@Picaroon9]

Ensnare with Crazy Zerg makes so much sense conceptually I don't know why it wasn't the norm. The only way marines beat ultras if they are in a huge ball and ensnare wrecks that.

[@mikaeldurbin6447]

You guys need to make a Tastosis AI bot so the world never has to live without em!

[@ItsStillMudkip]

Watching from inside hurricane Milton. no power but we get cell service and thus brood war. Thanks for the entertainment!

[@alwaon3820]

20:52 "...this is gonna keep Light in the dark" )) fun play with words )

[@ShirpaTheShirpa]

Game 2 was insane. I have never seen those units look so scary

[@markmuller7962]

Soulkey has such a big brain it reminds me of Flash

[@vladimirgregor]

CRAZY ZERG explanation starts @21:30

[@electricgoose4691]

can't wait to see the other half of the bracket. All the sets have been so great so far :3

[@pyrothem]

Who needs sleep? Not me tonight!

[@billiondollardong]

so worth it

[@CultOfMonika]

Yeah finding pro games back in the day wasn't easy. I remember someone very dedicated reposting every game he can find on the Bulgarian version of KZbin

[@CorrectHorseBatteryStaple472]

22:55 Tasteless you silly goose, Bananazerg is a completely different build

[@dionowen6050]

I liked the Snow Vs Barracks unique games. Excited for this series go Soulkey!

[@dimayurchenko4859]

It was an insanely great one! Love to see those, as Zerg vs Terran match up is refreshed. Spoiler I love so much that Zerg didn't use defilers and still securely won. I love to see Terran not winning just by simple push to undefended base.

[@AresHeroSC]

Just after 0:17 the word Starcraft flashes on the screen briefly. You might need to use the , and . keyboard controls to pause it on the right frame. However, in the background it says ASL instead of SSL 😂

[@BioReptiles]

This was def the best series of this season, along with sharp vs hero

[@reishiki8682]

Right in time for lunch, thanks Tastosis!😊

[@samrands5967]

It's a good time of the year. SSL, NFL, Worlds. Life is good

[@flyingsteaks]

btw could you guys put the korean vod sound like -3dB when they and tastosis are talking at the same time? (maybe some sidechaining?) it gets a little bit hard to listen to (like at 56:30 you get the korean host talking, tastosis talking and background music all at the same time)

[@MondSemmel]

The comeback in game 2 was just insane.

[@onarass6321]

I'm predicting another SoulKey vs herO final.

[@GringoXaba]

32:05 there's a lot of satisfaction in getting your four workers to bring back their first load at the same time! And heres a quirk. 8 minerals for a worker in SC1 won't get enough for a next worker. In SC2, correct me if im wrong, it's ten workers bringing in 5mins each, you get your next worker on the first load.

[@08societysfinest]

The small moments are artful and satisfying. Like a well timed Zarya bubble going wub wub wub.

[@michaelbird9148]

Wild opening games! They were fantastic to watch. Was interesting to see Light pull a bigger range of play (including cheese) even if his control was off today.

[@JPR3D]

I think what Tasteless brought up about pacing is important and deceptively simple - Gaming at a high level, or even playing at all deepening on how intense the type of game is, is exhausting. Giving the player a break from the extremely high mental workload of the rest of the game not just lets you perform some internal processing, it's a break in between workouts that you need or else your brain is constantly over-saturated and your ability to think and problem solve burns out. As a player, it literally makes you feel better because you're still playing and doing good stuff like making workers and starting your build, but it's not straining you. Games like Half-Life recognized this early on by giving the player breaks from shooting to solve jumping puzzles and such.

[@isambo400]

Very creative styles in this match!

[@mf_________]

34:00 I believe the captivating nature of broodwar having only 4 workers is the concept of 'less is more', and having fewer workers actually increases your options to builds and strategies. For example, if the game started with 7 or 8+ workers, things like 4 pools, 6 or 8 racks, or proxies/cannon rushes wouldn't ever be as prominent a thing if the worker count started higher. Completely negating an entire option of play for each race just by something as simple as the starting worker count shows how bw got it right. It has a balance most games today don't bother trying to uncover.

[@kathorsees]

To be fair, cannon rushes and proxies are a lot more common in SC2, and games there start with 12 workers. Cannon rushes especially, I even recall Tastosis discussing how SC2 made them stronger and actually viable at a pro-level. There are even pro-players who made it deep into tournaments playing nothing but cannon rushes (Has) or assorted Zerg cheeses (Bly with his iconic proxy hatch). So I don't think having more workers closes off this option of play. It even enables more cheese - e.g., I've never seen a BW pro block his opponent's wall-off with a proxy hatch, which happens in SC2 a lot (Dark, Scarlett, Bly...). I'm not trying to yuck your yum though. I'm all for slow starts - it's what I love about Brood War's campaign vs SC2. Missions in SC2 are almost always time-critical, involve multiple moving objectives, etc. And that really gets in the way of the basic RTS fantasy to me - the fantasy of starting small and growing big, building a beautiful base, etc. I loved this part since I was a child. So much so that when I didn't have a computer around (e.g. on a beach trip) I'd build sand castles and pretend it's ork buildings from WarCraft 2 - so the building, resource gathering, teching up aspect was, perhaps, even more interesting to me than the military strategy part.

[@gfdgdfgdfgdfggfdgdfgdfgdfg9709]

Totally Awesome! Favorite Battle in Soop

[@gregajk]

Fun Fact: Arti created the name "Starcraft" 🙃

[@ESGR1]

Soulkey is literally the zerg version of flash.

[@RollinLeonard]

i just did some crude ENSNARE math. SCV's mine 65 minerals per minute or 1ish mineral a second.. Ensnare last 25 seconds and reduces unit speed by 50%. so if you ensnare 20 SCVs you just cost terran like 200 minerals. i don' think it effects the gather speed but if it did it would 270 minerals. i'd like somebody with more time on their hands to make some actual field tests of this.

[@billiondollardong]

I've thought for the past 10 years that Soulkey was top 5 and could easily become the best player. Always saw him as someone with more potential than all his competitors

[@Shoveltime198]

The goofy level was perfection.

[@B12adSC]

this argument about "crazy zerg" made my day and made me feel better about people calling it that, because it is a ridiculously bad name hahaha but so funny the banter regarding the name of the strategy is hilarious.

[@zergu-yf3gd]

thanks for lack of spoilers.. you know ppl autopilot to the comments without thinking!

[@dogbread7975]

This is my Football and I'm sick of saying it's not.

[@Icthi]

Lol live your truth dog breath. You don’t need to hide.

[@Kragith0]

Got a hurricane outside but there is a new Ro8. Power don't let me down so I can enjoy this

[@BLooDCoMPleX]

"I thought you came up with the name Crazy Zerg, I looked down on you for over a decade" LMFAO

[@joebazooks]

*why are the names of the players different in the chat window of the lobby???*

[@mormorgranat]

What a beast Soulkey is. I knew he was good, but I just woke up to his brilliance

[@corey8910]

I thought FOR YEARS that Artosis made up the "Crazy Zerg" name as well. I'm glad I wasn't alone on this thought.

[@markmuller7962]

Doing so many convoluted mind games while controlling the game at 400 APM... I have so much respect for the pros it's hard to express

[@darkstarpress9455]

Consider a big element of starting with four workers: It allows super low-econ early game builds like 4-pool. You want to extend the duration of "early game" so that meaningful things can (but don't always have to) happen during the early game. In a MOBA example, you CAN have a big teamfight at level 1 before the creeps spawn where you use up your summoner abilities to go hard for an early edge, but if you mess it up you hand that edge to the other team. When you fast-forward that part of the game away, you just dump straight into mid-game and it's much less interesting.

[@markmuller7962]

I love the amount of games and content!

[@Eliteownage]

much love all

[@carlchristofferlysdahl567]

I dont know if im goin crazy or getting chills from the banter!

[@elliotwalker4182]

I have to say, after years of watching ASL/SSL and hearing Artosis call that crazy zerg is coming out, this is literally the first time I have actually seen it happen.

[@diegobuenovillafane869]

Can't get better a SSL cast with our favorites Tastosis

[@ChRicke-rt9hy]

Woohoooo thanks for the amazing cast! Chills yo

[@supaflytoon7684]

Flash has to come back to fight SoulKey, otherwise Zerg God will just dominate Brood War. SoulKey is a grand master!

[@IntoTheSkyy]

Great series. It's insane to me that [spoiler] Artosis walk talking about how many top level Terrans are complaining the late game Defiler tech is too strong right now. Then, Soulkey comes in and beats Light without making a single defiler in the entire series.

[@mclemonn]

dude the crazy zerg story killed me LMAOO

[@kristoferjhess]

as a viewer i love that brood war starts with 4 workers and i get to see the builds grow from a seed into a tree. i watch sc2, but enjoy it less because it feels more like a short story rather than a novel.

[@tehvolka]

Soulkey's play is so sick. He's so smart.

[@bfors8498]

Out of focus tasteless, a professional streamer and caster for over a decade, will never get old

[@daven6569]

How can we download the replays from this?

[@Th3Sh1n1gam1]

I was going to sleep with the fan on tonight, but after this, chills.

[@neonmarblerust]

The chills speak for themselves