Airbnb hosts vs. renters: a tough conversation about the housing crisis

[@lmao6]

It’s not just small mom and pop investors making airbnbs, there’s also large corporations buying up properties to make them.

[@playapnoyx05]

That's not happening in our area. What area are you in?

[@moldenm5239]

There are also individuals renting long term condos and apartments and then turning them into airbnb via arbitrage without buying real estate. Some hold 30-40+ long term rental leases and add more to expand their airbnb business.

[@REAL_TALK.]

I agree, BAN BIG CORPORATE Airbnb ownership. Everyone can agree with that, why isn't that being said on air?

[@chrislaverick6413]

There is a subdivision that was built out here in thorold niagara, and more than half the homes are air bnbs

[@MrUntapishtim]

It must be stopped.

[@erinwiebe7026]

Shubi - "I think that part of the solution has to be that if we have housing that's planned, zoned, designed, built for housing - that shouldn't be turned into hotel stock." Well said. This needs to be better regulated.

[@wowJhil]

This is so true! The difference between a hotel stock, which Airbnb basically is, and regular housing is huge. The vacancy also in these buildings would overall naturally be higher then in regular housing.

[@zdrux]

"We should regulate who private citizens let into their homes" is basically what you just said.

[@jonatand2045]

​@@zdrux The things they do to continue to not allow demand to be supplied through new or denser developments.

[@wowJhil]

@@zdrux Yeah, obviously the Airbnb stock is just their own homes.

[@ClaudetteFurrer]

Yet, why are hotels allowed to offer long term rentals?

[@tammime]

At the heart of this issue is the approach of treating housing as an investment, real estate, rather than a place that people need to live in and should afford.

[@zachnar0125]

Lol, people today are animals. They take and take and take, because modern society is literally structured that way. Have you ever been a landlord? Two sides to this problem. Ive seen both sides and it isn't as simple as you state it is.

[@Mallory-Malkovich]

​@zachnar0125 if people are animals then landlords are parasites.

[@milhouse7145]

Then there would be no rental properties at all.

[@Mallory-Malkovich]

@@milhouse7145 You're so close to getting it.

[@atesah]

@@milhouse7145 why? Yes there would lol

[@brenfu4982]

How can renters afford to buy a house if we have a hard time affording rent. The lady who said she was willing to put down 24000$ upfront for rent... I remember when that was enough for a down payment. These professional landlords don't seem to understand that they are inflating housing costs by turning these into short term rentals.

[@2S7PION]

But how will I afford my own 2 million dollar mortgage myself if I'm not leveraging everything for my BNB's /s No self awareness, we will hit a ceiling and a housing correction. A majority of entire generations are already behind economically let alone being able to carry the ballooning costs of housing that's occurring. Either that or some kind of other societal change as when a majority are left behind it typically adjusts somehow.

[@KateLicker]

I agree whole picture is scary..and they sure picked an endearing poster-example of it with couple on left, didn't they..

[@atesah]

@@2S7PION yep we really can’t go on like this

[@dynasty5053]

@Bren Fu 💯 Exactly

[@dynasty5053]

Maybe the landlords need to go get themselves a second job or stop buying property to seek higher profits

[@thrillhouse7867]

I wouldn't have an issue with short term rentals if we had an abundance of affordable homes. There definitely needs to be a limit/balance

[@jonatand2045]

Instead of taking away more liberties, just allow affordable homes to be built. Often that is ilegal.

[@jonatand2045]

@@sandrafer7393 Build more.

[@KateLicker]

@@sandrafer7393 cull investors..

[@Tommyaka]

The answer is simple... Implement a Government tax that targets short term rentals. This will encourage short term rentals to be converted to long term rentals, and the additional tax revenue can be used to build more Government/social/affordable housing.

[@jonatand2045]

@@Tommyaka Do you think nimbys are going to allow that housing to be built? That's why there os a shortage in the first place.

[@alexsteven.m6414]

In my opinion, a housing market crash is imminent due to the high number of individuals who purchased homes above the asking price despite the low interest rates. These buyers find themselves in precarious situations as housing prices decline, leaving them without any equity. If they become unable to afford their homes, foreclosure becomes a likely outcome. Even attempting to sell would not yield any profits. This scenario is expected to impact a significant number of people, particularly in light of the anticipated surge in layoffs and the rapid increase in the cost of living.

[@bernisejedeon5888]

@@JeanpaulCeme You are right! I’ve diversified my 450K portfolio across various market with the aid of an investment coach, I have been able to generate a little bit above $830k in net profit across high dividend yield stocks, ETF and bonds.

[@yolanderiche7476]

Do you mind sharing info on the adviser who assisted you?

[@edelineguillet2121]

After locating her, I composed an email and arranged a phone conversation. I'm optimistic that she will reply, and my goal is to conclude 2023 on a financially successful note.

[@michael2810]

I don't see a crash coming because you can always rent to pay your mortgage. So equity does not play a factor in the purchase.If people payed over the asking , the rent price is higher than the mortgage and no one's selling. People would have been buyers are renters now its really sad . They would have to build and increase inventory to cause price to go down. There no option for people with little cash and high student debt to buy.

[@spatty2589]

You are hoping there is a market crash. In reality those that bought second homes in order to rent out to make money as ABNB hosts are the ones that have destroyed the housing market. That is a different set of circumstances for the markets we have.

[@MimaLopez-jt4vq]

The current housing crisis in Canada is unfolding as a multifaceted challenge that requires our collective attention and strategic solutions. As real estate prices continue their upward trajectory, the dream of homeownership is slipping away for many hardworking individuals and families, leaving them in the throes of an unsettling rental market.

[@johnsoncoleman1293]

Absolutely, . The crisis isn't just affecting potential homebuyers; even those fortunate enough to own homes are experiencing the ripple effects. The accompanying surge in property taxes and maintenance costs has propelled the overall cost of homeownership to unprecedented levels.

[@FabianCruz-yj7pi]

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[@cloud_ix_]

¤□Kayla Tabitha Rodrigues's name has frequently been associated with proficiency in real estate and financial matters. Her reputation precedes her, and she has a knack for providing tailored solutions, be it for aspiring homeowners trying to find a foothold in the property market or existing homeowners striving to maintain their financial equilibrium amidst these challenging market dynamics.

[@MimaLopez-jt4vq]

You're absolutely right, I've been keeping a close eye on the housing crisis, and the financial strains it's causing are undeniable. It's heartening to know that there are experts like Kayla who can offer practical solutions.

[@johnsoncoleman1293]

I'm intrigued to know more about the kind of advice kayla provides. Can she really help people in such dire housing situations?

[@bytesizedscreencasts]

As a owner of a house who is also renting to people in Canada, it is not the renters responsibility that you took variable rate interest because you wanted to be greedy. Renting is to offset some part of the income/mortgage not the whole mortgage. I charge a fix amount and increase according to the laws. If my mortgage increases that it is my own personal responsibility to pay it somehow and not take it from the renters pocket

[@nishali3343]

The variable rate is just an example. in 2018, 5-year fix mortgage was around 2%, which means you have to renew in 2023 @ 6% or more. do you think the landlord will continue to rent at a lost!

[@kelsmoshigh]

​@@nishali3343Good point this person is full of it

[@RH-pn9qg]

Exactly, a lot of people took advantage of the low variable mortgage rate and bought up multiple properties thinking they would be on easy street and never have to work for a paycheck again. Now they all went up and are acting like they’re the victims in all this; I will never have sympathy for the greedy opportunists who prey on their own community.

[@RH-pn9qg]

@@nishali3343don’t buy up multiple properties at once for a profit then scumbag

[@bytesizedscreencasts]

@@nishali3343 You rent by your choice. If you cannot afford the mortgage without renting a part of the house may be then do not buy the house

[@Meyers1793]

If you need income from AIRBNB to pay off your mortgage then you CANNOT AFFORD THAT MORTGAGE.

[@Youarenot_Special]

This basically, he's saying one mortgage could put him into bankruptcy then he is over extended af

[@ashleyc506]

And Airbnb is a method some use to get into the housing market.

[@Youarenot_Special]

@Ashley Churchill you need to like why wouldn't you potentially triple your income with air bnb

[@nottheone582]

@@Youarenot_Special because there's not enough housing stock for everyone to do this, so you're essentially enriching yourself at the cost of society. it's parasitic

[@maranorth]

You clearly do not own a house in a major Canadian city. No one can afford a mortgage. It is a risk you have to take. Just like any investment. And clearly you have not been paying attention to the news. Mortgages went up 40%-50% in the last 2 years. That was not the fault of the owner. Bank of Canada is totally screwing over the middle class. When they should have raised interest rates in 2020 when they saw inflation skyrocketing back then, they did nothing. Plus, people cannot even afford groceries right now. So, in case you have not noticed: things are a mess.

[@frankstared]

It is not just younger Canadians who are suffering, but older Canadians and even even middle-aged X-Gens who were squeezed out by boomers and then their kids. Staggering that these landlords only seem to think about me, me, and me. I wonder if the people who are drawn to being a landlord are coming from experiences where they view life as a competition with others. This is why they are locked into a very toxic life pattern but what is worse is that we have structures and systems which cater to such greed-sickness.

[@TheRealBatCave]

So u think this Christian guy is a soulless greedy individual cuz he rents out a property?

[@jvssocialmedia2459]

Most legit rentals I see from private landlords are from newcomers (or claim to be, maybe as an excuse not following laws) who buy properties and turn them into expensive rooming homes or Airbnbs.

[@carolr7823]

Being a landlord is not a charity. It is a business where you have to deal with renters who don't pay their rent and may trash your property.

[@jamesshore3191]

It will be significantly worse when young Canadians fully enter the housing market

[@runningfromabear8354]

We couldn't find a rental property while building our house so we bought a cheap house in Northern Ontario to live in for the time being. Finished our build early but now have a house and looked into renting it out. Then we saw the rules for landlords VS tenants and decided absolutely not. Airbnb for $200/night vs taking on a tenant who could refuse to leave the property when we finish our 4 year of 5 year mortgage commitment. We don't get to decide how long people live on the property. There's no rules about airbnb around here. It's working really well for us. It's not a party area. We can carry the mortgage on our own if it dries up anyway, it was cheap. Better rules for landlords and we would have been willing to add to rental stock for a few years. The big problem is we need social housing in Canada. I don't mind paying taxes into it with everyone else but as second property owners, we be sacrificing ourselves for renters to potentially destroy our house and sit in it indefinitely while waiting for the LTB to pull their fingers out of their butts and take action.

[@iamdmc]

As a landlord with properties in downtown Toronto I take a moral stance against airbnb, because I believe that the society which allows me to own multiple properties does so with the implied responsibility to provide safe housing in exchange for a fair rent. I encourage all of my tenants to save and buy their own properties as soon as they can so that they can also benefit from owning their homes. The majority of my tenants are young professionals on their own path to home ownership.

[@TorontoMillenial]

According to City of Toronto of those 16k units on airbnb approximately 4k units are STR (Under 28 days) and have approved licenses. The other 12k units are LTR (longer then 28 day stays) on the Airbnb platfom.... Many landloards are using Airbnb for LTR to help filter bad tenants from good tenants and protecting themselves and their financial future instead of waiting on the LTB to change...

[@danielfaria1548]

moral or not, this is a direct consequence of the policies and lack of regulation from our government. Unfortunately, even if they were to change it accordingly this would all be short lived until our monetary policy were to change too. it all starts at the head of the beast and trinkles down.

[@staycee639]

Working professionals are not making a wage that can provided them to even get a mortgage to cover what is considered market value in most cities across Canada. So that ideal is one of the past. As a working professional, I can just manage the crazy expensive rents that are paying my landlords mortgage and the increases in costs for everything. There is never enough for savings.

[@TorontoMillenial]

@@staycee639 STR/Airbnb uses less then 3% of all toronto housing and has limitations like max 120-180 nights a year. Do you know what mass immigration is doing do the housing market everywehre? LAst year alone 1.2 million new people immigrated. They all needing housing, food, doctors, health care clinics, jobs. The basic infrastructure to live and accomodate and housing is already severely scarce. The Feds didn't create any programs to go hand in hand with the mass immigration that's been going on for nearly a decade now. Mass immigration is adding massive strain everything. That's why most Toronto/sounther ontario suburbs that are actually affordable are daycare desserts with no doctors anywhere. You think $3000/mth for a downtown 1 bed + den apartment in downtown toronto is bad now? Wait another 2 years. that same appartment will be $5500/ month thanks to the mass immigration that is destroying the quality of life in Canada.

[@ThaliaLemon]

Not all landlords charge a fair rent that enables their working renters to save up for home ownership. My household pays more than 40,000$ for rent and utilities, and yet we've been told we're paying "under market" and that our rent SHOUDL increase. While we are all working and saving money, we've annually not made up enough savings to pay the DIFFERENCE in rising house prices, and that's with all three of us pooling our resources. We can't afford to buy a home unless the market drops. And when the market drops, you can bet corporate investors will be there to scoop up all the foreclosures before any resident has a chance.

[@JOIHIINI]

I think that it would be worth mentioning that the reason a lot of landlords favour short term rentals is not necessarily just the returns. The Ontario ltb court system is broken, if someone decides to stop paying rent on a monthly rental it will take anywhere from 8-12 months to legally evict that person. Whereas with a short term rental less than 14 days the residential tenancy act doesnt apply the same rules. The province allowing the court system to get worse and worse results in people turning to alternative options with regard to renting their property to avoid exposing themselves to the liability of losing almost a year of unpaid rent they will never recoup. If the court system caught up after covid maybe it would create incentive not to use this method of renting. Just saying, its worth having a discussion about some of the real reasons people turn to this method, rather than blaming the individual.

[@blurtam188]

FACTS!! The LTB in Ontario is a professional tenant's dream!!

[@JOIHIINI]

@Blur Tam I once had a tenants "guest" who in reality moved into the unit without my permission stab another tenant that lived in another unit in the same building, and they were actually released from jail and back living with their roommates in my unit before I got eviction papers related to the incident. 8 months for a violent crime eviction, meanwhile knifing somebody in the FACE. Yes that's right, THE FACE. put them in jail for less than a year. It really says something about the judicial systems in this country. Not to mention the people that actually were on the lease of the unit went without paying for those 8 months. 8 grand down the tube and a violent offender back on the streets. Short term rentals have been outlawed in hamilton where this took place. If they hadn't done that I probably would have opted to do it. But this narrative will never be pushed. It's always the landlords fault no matter what according to the media.

[@misssunshine8469]

This is a huge factor for many landlords favouring short-term rentals. The government wants the people to rent their homes and assume the financial responsibility if you renter screws around and doesn't pay you. This is 100% a government issue and I don't care how many investors are buying - there simply are not enough houses. Wages are too low. People cannot even qualify for a mortgage. Its horrible across the board.

[@yevkenny]

If it’s such a risk to rent to long-term tenants, then why “invest” in the house to begin with?

[@alanj9978]

@@yevkenny Well, let's see. Investors easily can borrow 80% of the cost of a house and then get all the capital gains to themselves. Tax-advantaged, no less. Due to central bank meddling, interest rates mostly went down for over 20 years straight. That in turn maximized said capital gains. And over the same period stock markets puked 3 times, while housing did not, making housing a much more attractive investment again.

[@jamiehume4927]

I dont think landlords should get into this as a means of 'getting ahead'. Being able to maintain your investment property..yes. But housing is not an 'industry'. People need home stability and housing safety.

[@grildcheez1504]

Ultimately there is only so much demand for short term housing.

[@vital17]

Landlords are the biggest producers of new housing supply. Invisible hand at work. I make money producing value that others are willing to pay for. What is the alternative? Government construction? We have public housing in the states and its full of horror stories.

[@Tudysucks]

lol u won’t be saying that if u didn’t invest in property. At the end of the day the government failed to manage the country. We have a housing shortage and they keep letting people in. What next do u house owners to do? Have them share their houses to people? If have 3 bedrooms and only using 2 share the other one? Come on tell the government stop sending in more people into our country.

[@MrGluepower]

Food is also not an industry, and yet it is

[@Mechanical-Animal]

Just charge hefty federal taxes and provincial fees for AirBnB and short term rent properties outside of the owner's primary residence.

[@jonatand2045]

Or allow them to increase the number of units in their residence, which is often illegal.

[@dhosquet]

Taxation is not a solution to everything / anything. We need to move back to people helping people. The government could play a role in that be leading by example. instead, the majority of people are in survival mode.

[@MariamMariam-ue7vz]

The Fed gov imposed HST on ABB as of last summer. Hosts can’t charge extra to compensate so it was a direct 13% reduction in earnings for the hosts. It’s not a viable business model now and I have no clue why ppl think it’s a good idea… not in Canada at least.

[@mickpeterson3722]

​@@dhosquet Canadians are re.tar.d ed so this is what they parrot

[@icyx9268]

@@dhosquet YEAH where do ytou think that came from govornment was meant to act as a communal aspect in democracyt / exactlky what your refferancing and when they under a series of ploys to behind closed doors increase corruption enablance and giving hand out corruption / authoritarianistic all control to exploitative abusers to put in more abusive exploits till whole worls is unsustainable exploits unrecognizably disfunctionate where all founding principles are left behind this is what this sub 0human be so psychopathic sensless to hold up artificial power through a means basic nessecity psychopathically exploiting blatantly so when you say " ppl need to be nice to eachother " without any recognition or account for communal guard rails keeping corrupt exploiters of which will always exist and manipulate there ways into control anyways basically your advocating inadvertanty immutably despite whatever consciously you suconsciously dont recognize about tone deaf naivety of your statement of igorance and unequipped unpreapred lack of understanding to comprehend and consciously grasp to greast extent of depth possible that what your advodcating for is self destructive corruption to enable them to schemily infiltratively manipulatively further deteriorate our structures and all functional intents and tare them apart to sustain and than set up hierarchies of orienting and prioratizing above all sustainment of this freagile corrupt means of control tyhat is all they know and than pretend it is somehow aligned with logically justifications and good for a country its blind belief big daddy hero worship out of lazyness technical iunknowledgability opf which your espousing promoting illusions surrounding perceptionarily as justification's for these lazy fragile leeches psychopathic toddler brute narcissists in there illegitmate sensless short sightedness wont give up artificial unsustainably self desturctive psychologically deteriorating amongst socially humans power through means that have no correlation to that use and excess abundance of gettiung power of which in there fragility and by default short sighted thoughtlessness due to lack of skills with any kind of envolvment in this and just by your insinuated tone you mistake tax for theft well its not theft its retreiving illegitmately abusive stolen money giving a small minority of it back to ppl who were robbed through corruption they are subject to sanctioned in last 40 years since reagan gave corrupt ppl all power under a series of uncontextualised illusion's

[@mahalia_kendrick]

Buying a house that use to cost 150k at 3% interest just before march 2020 in Texas to now costing 250k at 7% interest is not the best financial decision LOTS of people are taking. This will bust horribly...

[@Jessrobbie]

Back in 2000 I got a job offer and we moved from Canada to the US, so, we've seen both sides of the mortgage equation. Based on our experience, we definitely prefer the US. I recall the dreadful negotiation phase every so often in Canada. Here, I was able to lock in a 15-year mortgage term and didn't worry about rates during that timeframe. If the rates go down, then you can re-negotiate at a lower rate, pay off the debt and move on with a new mortgage.

[@Ariellasegal.]

Forex/stock is the best investment anyone could get into. As it could make you rich in a blink of an eye. it's not recommendable to go into trading or investment when you don't know how it's done, Investing with a good guide is the best way to get started in the trade market. would free you from modern financial slavery...

[@Kellymccormack534]

​@@Ariellasegal.😮really?? I've always wanted to invest in stocks but was always discouraged. I wanna start now, Would it be okay if I asked you to recommend a specific advisor or company that you used their services? Seems you've figured it all out.

[@Ariellasegal.]

​@Kellymccormack534: I usually go with registered representatives. ''BRITTNEY ROSE COHEN" for example has the best performance history (in my opinion) and does offers 1v1 consultation to her copiers which I think is amazing. I don’t know how many traders like that are there.>

[@Ariellasegal.]

Student study review ➪†1850..

[@MeganRuth]

"I can't take my family on vacation." My god. How horrible! This man is truly suffering.

[@dudeorduuude5211]

Says the kid who has never owned anything.

[@sew_gal7340]

Imagine if youre working 60 hours a week and someone says you dont deserve a vacation

[@MeganRuth]

@@sew_gal7340 Imagine working a 60 hour week and someone says you can't have a roof over your head.

[@NadaLimunada]

The airbnb guy in this panel is also a mortgage agent and drives around in $100,000 cars and owns numerous properties….

[@gabe9671]

He has people living in his home for free for the last 8 months, as opposed to making fun of what he said why don't YOU step up and cover the rent of those people since they have a right to housing and he has been covering their right to housing for 8 months, maybe its time you did your part and paid their rent.

[@Unrealisednostalgia]

The landlords argument in a nutshell: 'Why should your right to housing get in the way of my right to exploit our housing crisis for profit".

[@lacnoslen5644]

exploiting for profit..scumbags,all of them.

[@j.w.2391]

I found Krystan to be rather Contemptible...Blind in Perception and lacking in Ethics / Moral conscience as he plays his board Game of Monopoly !

[@jerrylee3887]

😂 With that attitude.... You will stay a renter. I don't feel bad for you with a mindset of a victim.

[@atesah]

@@jerrylee3887 oh my gosh guys we’re in the presence of a sigma…. Mindset is all we need to overcome corrupt greedy capitalism. It was our beta mindset that made the housing crisis!!

[@zomgoose]

​@@jerrylee3887 you wouldn't make it in today's world if you were starting out as a young one.

[@marilynnemeth3625]

Wage stagnation is also a problem factor here… when properties make more money than workers. People who have the means to become property owners, who then choose short term over long term rental on their property, rather than work for wages. I kind of feel bad for Krystian in a way, being a landlord is probably more profitable and secure for him than having a productive and beneficial to society day job. He is making his way through life, but it is obvious that he knows his choices are negatively affecting the world around him.

[@shauncameron8390]

And currency devaluation.

[@marilynnemeth3625]

And a whole handful of factors… Obviously airBnB isn’t the only thing causing a housing crisis.

[@ashton.m]

Wage stagnation. So lets have a million new people enter the country who will be looking for work (mostly entry level work) and let's expect that wages should go up? Lol ok. Currency deval. You mean inflation. Say it, cuz that also points the finger at the Trudeau government... which most voters in Toronto VOTED FOR. You get what you vote for.

[@kendralillie4686]

Why take a chance renting to leaches?

[@shauncameron8390]

@@marilynnemeth3625 AirBnB is just a consequence of government policy making long-term rentals costly for landlords not just financially but legally.

[@92mahl]

The guy on the far left epitomizes the "got mine" mentality. It's a big problem to put the entire cost of home ownership on the tenants, then you are getting a house for free because you were already so rich as to put up the capital on the front end. This creates a class divide where poor people fund the lifestyle of the wealthier class

[@jonatand2045]

If it is so profitable then property owners should be allowed to increase density so demand is supplied.

[@nottheone582]

@@jonatand2045 circular logic. you sound daft tbh

[@Lifeisapartydresslikeit]

If the government stops raising rates and have our mortgages double and finds a way to have a better eviction process then rent would come back down to earth. My mortgage went up $700. I don’t make $700 more per month - so I increased the rent on my tenants. Tell me what else I should do? Sell my house then? Still wouldn’t solve the rental crisis!! Think about that!!!

[@Eric-lx8hp]

How else is he gonna pay for his bling

[@wombat4583]

@@Lifeisapartydresslikeit This is why you should choose fixed rates mortgages. Too many people want to further gamble with variable loans.

[@karlsaleh4157]

I'm a landlord and I think Airbnb has created way more problems than it solves.

[@rebeccahillsares8253]

Thank you

[@nottheone582]

first reasonable landlord in these comments!

[@ibrochillin]

Back up with data?

[@keithck3720]

Same and absolutely agree.

[@grildcheez1504]

The fact is Airbnb has also created Homestays, renting a room in one's home and looking for room mates, providing affordable agile interim flexible accomodation to transit workers, new immigrants, students, people with changing home circumstances etc has long existed prior to Airbnb. Airbnb just did it the best and created additional supply that would'nt see the market because of how complicated it was for the space to be made available. If someone had a spare couch or bedroom they could now add new supply to the market which would'nt exist in the first place. There are tens of thousands of room made available in people's homes as a result where community is felt and relationships and networks are built. Can people justify more rent as a result of their abillity to colocate with someone else and endure the inconveniece for market determined extra bucks. Sure. More supply, more connections, more networks, more community, more funds going into local communities and the businesses close to them, more effeicient and agile use of existing space. Are people at the edges trying to abuse the core value of Airbnb. Yes. But the facts and value it brings needs to be maintained to maintain a vibrant economy that incentivizes people to make space available to those that need it.

[@inercia2002]

The story the female renter had about the units in the building she was trying to rent all turning into airbnbs is similar to one I heard in metrotown. A low-rise building where as soon as an old renter vacates, instead of becoming rented long term again, there's an arrangement with "a friend/partner" where it becomes another airbnb. Why there isn't a sliding scale of new airbnbs registrations allowed compared against the tenancy vacancy rate is beyond me. Cities would make so much money!!!

[@aria751]

I agree, this is an ethical issue. I understand a landlords perspective, especially in the “survival of the fittest” economy we live in, but at the end of the day we are moving away from our humanity and what’s needed to build healthy communities. It’s sad, because things could truly be different if people weren’t competing to live and survive.

[@cloutm_anager8262]

Your comment is how communism starts. I know you don’t think that, but read history then you will understand. And we all know how communism ends…

[@grildcheez1504]

Actually the opposite. At it's core Airbnb isn't meant to be or compete with hotels. Homestays, renting a room in one's home and looking for room mates has long existed prior to Airbnb. Airbnb just did it the best and created additional supply that would'nt see the market because of how complicated it was. If someone had a spare couch or bedroom they could now add new supply to the market which would'nt exist in the first place. There are tens of thousands of room made available in people's homes as a result where community is felt and relationships and networks are built. Can people justify more rent as a result of their abillity to colocate with someone else. Sure.

[@TorontoMillenial]

If you can't afford to live in toronto perhaps its time to move to a town in which you can afford... According to City of Toronto of those 16k units on airbnb approximately 4k units are STR (Under 28 days) and have approved licenses. The other 12k units are LTR (longer then 28 day stays) on the Airbnb platfom.... You must give the numbers proper context. Many landloards are using Airbnb for LTR to help filter bad tenants from good tenants and protecting themselves and their financial future instead of waiting on the LTB to change...

[@cloutm_anager8262]

@@TorontoMillenial 💯

[@grildcheez1504]

@@TorontoMillenial The 4k units are also valuable. A friend told me a lot of this is misplaced narrative and he just rented STR for two week to a separated father who wanted to be close to his young kids on his time off and a student who needed a temp place while finding a long term rental. Short term was a missing gap in the local communities and homestays and temp accommodation are much needed to help and support local communities for their interim needs

[@spencehutchinson1904]

Airbnb had the same effect for housing as Uber for cabs. It streamlined monetization of property, leading to more people acquiring and hoarding property for profit. Housing stock simply cannot keep up with demand. I don’t blame anyone at the table, they are trying to make a living. Unfortunately opportunity in Canada is concentrated in limited areas, we need to figure out how to create opportunities outside the gta. Shout out to Armine for keeping it real.

[@grildcheez1504]

Airbnb also provide agile flexible dynamic space to those in need in all communites and clearly this was an unaddressed demand in the market and lots of space that wouldn't normally be rented also became housing. BC already has a speculation tax, a empty homes tax, a short term rental tax, short term rental strata bylaw fines of $500+ a day etc. Solution is more housing, better paying jobs, affordable interest rates, people willing to work hard, upgrade their skills, buddy up with a partner and budget judiciously with disciplne.

[@TorontoMillenial]

It's not possible to actually list or 'publish' a toronto property so that it's live on airbnb without a license. You can only do a single residence with a limit of 120 nights a year. It can only be your primary residence. It's not possible for corporations to have a primary residence. Again people need to do their research before complaining and knowing what the rules and regulations already are. You guys are about 3 years late. These regulations were implemented and enforced in 2020

[@spencehutchinson1904]

@@TorontoMillenial the landlords here were only Airbnb’ing their primary residence?

[@TorontoMillenial]

@@spencehutchinson1904 That's the current regulations in Toronto. I don't know anyone that can or how they would bypass the rules. Airbnb won't publish a listing to be live without a license anymore. The by law officers really cracked down on city of toronto properties. Other towns and municipalities and subburbs like mississauga/brampton is different story. I don't know about those

[@networth00]

Why doesn't the government offer benefits to builders to build more houses? Then people would stop blaming fellow citizens.

[@OrGrunebaum]

Most of the buildings in liberty village are empty. When I did canvassing during the last election in Toronto, most of the units were empty and unused. How do I know? We put papers in the door handles with our candidates information. When we came back 2/3 weeks later, they were still there which means no one entered the units. I question this statement that we need to build more and not work on fixing the current empty unit issues.

[@ninemoonplanet]

Like here on the West Coast, most of those empty units are owned by REIT Real Estate Investment Trusts. Corporations. The units are deliberately kept empty to avoid any repairs, minor like paint, major like appliances (if there are any). Those investment corporations bundle those properties, sell them on stock markets. Each sale means the buyer is going to raise rents or keep them empty.

[@DimaRakesah]

Them being empty doesn't mean housing needs are being met. There is an issue with property owners purposely not renting out units in order to try to sell them off to investors, letting them sit empty.

[@jacqueline5625]

I'm proud of the young people for being so articulate and keeping their cool despite their basic needs being threatened. The guy on the far left (Airbnb host) is being incredibly dishonest at various points in this interview. If anyone is at risk of personal bankruptcy because of having income properties, they should NOT be taking on such risk. All the people who bought property during record low interest rates and are crying 'unfair' when the rates go up, they are simply financially illiterate. When their mortgages go up in cost because of interest rates, they should look at themselves and their own folly and sell, not raise rates for their tenants. If the tenant could not qualify for their own mortgage, why should they be responsible for someone else's poor financial sense by paying off their mortgage, which is now inflated because they overbought. This is a systemic issue and our government is complicit in the problem. When a significant number of MPs own investment properties, we have a MAJOR accountability issue. They obviously have a conflict of interest and the spotlight has to be put on this issue. Thank god for this economist, Armine, who is telling the truth amongst all the bullshit rhetoric.

[@philisdaman99]

Simply put: AirBNB and other short-term rentals should be illegal if they are not a part of the owner's principal residence as was the original intent of the platform. The impact their existence has on the housing stock, especially in tourist towns, makes it impossible for entry-level workers to house themselves.

[@thebuccaneersden]

1 family = 1 home. Simple as that. The moment you start treating homes as sources of income, thats where the inequality begins. And there is no benefit. Income isn't rising that fast. The moment you list a property on AirBnb or sell to a foreign buyer, you are depriving a Canadian. It's a race to the bottom just so a lucky portion of the population has a decent retirement. In which case, many many future generations are screwed. It's all playing out in the open. Defending it is indefensible.

[@kaankanca4634]

Should have 2 as a limit, since a lot of people enjoy having a summer and a winter home. But I agree that they shouldn’t be treated as a low risk investment

[@SofaKingShit]

I honestly don't think that Inheritance should even be a thing. In the current economic environment it's almost impossible to own a house unless the person has parents who are willing and able to contribute significantly to getting some property while those who don't inherit any land are almost certainly destined to be life long rental slaves to exactly those fortunate people who did actually get lucky enough to win the property lottery from birth. Almost like a minor aristocraticracy.

[@ginalolli3477]

I live in Amsterdam, NL. An owner has to register before they can put their apartment on Airbnb and its capped at 30 nights per year.

[@chrisg5853]

The biggest issue with this conversation is the entity with the most power to enact change is civic government. Pitting landlords and renters against each is a fruitless exercise and takes away from the real people who should be held accountable. How about CBC bring on the people who are actually accountable and putting them on the hot seat instead of villifying everyday people just trying to pay their bills.

[@Mallory-Malkovich]

Which people specifically do you think are responsible for this? Who is it you are asking them to talk to?

[@chrisg5853]

@@Mallory-Malkovich well specifically for this conversation since it was Toronto based then it would be Toronto City Council but obviously they are without a Mayor currently. In addition the Housing Minister and Premier. Ask them the hard questions. Why are housing projects not getting built? Why does it take so long for permits to be granted? actually, ask them the hard questions. The only way out of this mess is to start building more affordable housing stock and at the same time stop the removal of affordable housing stock from the market that is then replaced with luxury housing. on a side note the high levels of immigration is not helping either as we cant build housing fast enough and our social services are collapsing under the pressure.

[@Mallory-Malkovich]

@@chrisg5853 That's a good answer, and one I largely agree with. Thank you for your thoughtful response.

[@ashleyc506]

@@chrisg5853 To your list of questions I’d ask the housing minister; I’d add “Why shift %100 of the risk to small landlords when you claim you want their units? If you really want their units on the long term market, you’d come to the table with something rather than nothing. The province needs to insure tenancies against damage/non payment and expedite evictions to under 30 days. Otherwise people will just hold on to their units out of self preservation.

[@v.j.3029]

Those who are responsible are everyone who voted for Trudeau. Wait until there's 100 million of us in the country and everyone's gonna live on top of each other, in a tent or in their cars. You all voted for this so say goodbye to the middle-class. Import the third-world, become the third-world.

[@ironhammer4095]

Its astonishing that as the housing crisis worsens and worsens how these "investors" cling to their beliefs that they have every right to treat housing as a money making venture for themselves. Market Ideology taken to an extreme.

[@shauncameron8390]

They do especially as they were the ones who took on the legal and financial risks of ownership.

[@MentionBiscuit]

So glad you mentioned financial risk…. That would also include risk of a non paying tenant. Or one that drip feeds you have of the extortion rent for a few months a year. That’s risk. If you want to treat housing like the stock market let it behave as such.

[@mwehpakonne]

@@MentionBiscuit Exactly right!

[@blobtv7444]

when you spend hundreds of thousands on property to rent out it better be a money making venture, what world are you living in?

[@MentionBiscuit]

@@blobtv7444 it’s not going to be money making anymore. Grift is over find employment.

[@karinal75]

How can we expect the housing crisis to get resolved when our housing minister Ahmed Hussen presently owns two rental properties in Ottawa? Take a look into how many politicians are directly benefiting from this shortage.

[@bigdaddyyc]

Owning rental property does not outright contribute to a housing shortage. I don't know much about his rental properties, but they could be purpose-built triplexes that were always meant for the rental market. I would argue that a housing minister with landlord (and rental) experience is great to have. If he was flipping pre-construction single family homes however, then yes that is speculative buying that contributes to a housing shortage.

[@KyleAthollHunter1]

@@bigdaddyyc owning a rental property is the key driver to the over inflated market

[@bigdaddyyc]

@Kyle Hunter I understand how it can seem that way but not all rental properties should be seen as a bad thing. Some are beneficial. For example, what helps the housing situation more, building a fourplex rental property or building a large single family home on the same lot?

[@KyleAthollHunter1]

@@bigdaddyyc there is nothing beneficial about hoarding and scalping homes

[@spicoli4217]

The only reason he bought it is to make money off people. Nobody buys a second property and rents it out from the goodness of their own heart. Its purely a money making scheme. Him being a federal cabinet minister, of housing no less, its just even worse.

[@acrylitearon687]

Canada really needs more rent regulation and housing, it's putting renters in increasingly precarious situations.

[@phil649]

I’m a property manager and can sympathize when the one landlord claims it’s less risky for him to rent short term vs long term. As long as the government is going to cause long delays with evictions for current landlords and red tape for potential landlords, there is no incentive for long term rentals from any investor.

[@xeslana1426]

Sooo much this. Plenty of article examples of homeowners facing foreclosure because of problem tenants and the chokehold for legal evictions (or any service really) at the LTB. Homeowners don't want to gamble on strangers anymore when things as basic as refusal of rent payments without cause can take 8 months to a year to be dealt with. And that number is climbing. As renters keep calling it, "the cost/risk of doing business." Well, many don't want to take that risk anymore. Or can't.

[@ashleyc506]

The LTB is a huge part of the problem. The province issues the rules but shares none of the risk. If you’re a small landlord with limited ability to withstand the risk, why on earth would you take it? Small landlords are just ordinary people with a spare unit but the LTB doesn’t see the distinction between an individual with a duplex and a REIT or property management firm. And they wonder why no one wants to invest in long term.

[@atesah]

can you sympathise with renters too? Landlords are in the investment game, if they don’t like the risks involved than they can get a real job. Renters are in the “I need a place to live and not end up on the streets” game. I know where my sympathy lies

[@gemalhorne9089]

@@atesah Any smart business operator in any type of business would very smart to limit the risk of their business going bankrupt. Why does renting units have to be such a risky game?

[@ashleyc506]

@@atesah I do sympathize for renters, but as a landlord I’m not willing to gamble my own personal and financial wellbeing for them. I’ve seen first hand what bad tenants are capable of and what few rights landlords actually have in evicting them. If the province wants any unit of mine on the long term market, they need to shoulder more of the risk. Otherwise I’ll keep it to myself.

[@gemalhorne9089]

Government overly regulates long term rentals and makes the risk significantly higher for property owners. Property owners choose to not participate in the game because the government makes it suck. Now everybody is confused and mad at landlords..?

[@AuntyKsTarot]

The regulations are needed because landlords are the worst settler colonizers of them all - just vultures

[@yevkenny]

No. Property owners don’t appropriately assess the risk of being a landlord. If tenants are expected to have a savings to cover 3 months rent, then landlords should have enough savings to cover 12 months of a mortgage. Or more. The landlords bad financial position shouldn’t be the responsibility of the tenant. But because we can’t trust the market to create that equilibrium, the government has to create that to protect the foundation of people’s life: their home.

[@networth00]

All while welcoming in loads of illegals to take up more housing.

[@PlayMyMusicPlaylist]

Airbnb only at primary residence and must be hosted by owner. If they want to do vacation rental then go through the same process as motel. National rent cap is needed regardless the age of the building. Need to make sure it is easier and faster for landlord to kickout bad tenants.

[@ninemoonplanet]

Then explain why corporations are getting into the B&B markets in a big way. Daily I see condos owned by corporate investors empty until those are listed as B&B rentals. Some are rented as "single rooms".

[@ninemoonplanet]

The one panelist just said he's renting MULTIPLE units as B&B units, obviously doesn't live in any of them.

[@TorontoMillenial]

Toronto has the strictest rules and enforcement for Airbnb now. tens of thousands of condos that used to be on Airbnb all came back onto the LTR market and now they’re underwater because they’re not making enough in rent with these high interest rates. Now they need to be licensed approved by the city and it has to be their primary residence and they can only host 180 nights annually. It's very strict and enforcement is serious. The majority of toronto condos on airbnb now are for LTR (28 days +) because it's safer for landlords to find qualified tenants on there then off the street.

[@Numenorean921]

Just ban Airbnb completely, it provides no benefit to society and only helps landleeches get richer at the expense of low-moderate income people and families.

[@ZanoniAgnew]

Many Air BNB hosts would return back to long term rentals if there were proper and real protections for landlords in the RTA. It's easy to villanize homeowners and victimize tenants with these conversations, but the real story is that squatters take months to remove, costs of removing bad tenants often go into the $10's of thousands, the stress and anxiety these situations create is absolutely massive, and there's little to no protections, and little to no ability for landlords to recoup financial losses, and no consequences for the tenants who have stolen months of rent while often doing thousands in physical damage as well. This reality is almost consistently overlooked. The damage of the insufficient RTA to protect landlords and create incentive and opportunity for tenants to take extreme advantage of landlords is a major major aspect of the decrease in rentals. This villanization of landlords and victimization of tenants must stop, and the REAL issues be addressed if there is to be a shift. The media needs to quit being ridiculous and one sided.

[@grildcheez1504]

That's too broad of a spectrum and airbnb at it's core isn't meant to be or compete with hotels. Homestays, renting a room in one's home and looking for room mates has long existed prior to Airbnb. Airbnb just did it the best and created additional supply that would'nt see the market because of how complicated it was. If someone had a spare couch or bedroom they could now add new supply to the market which would'nt exist in the first place. There are tens of thousands of room made available in people's homes as a result where community is felt and relationships and networks are built. Can people justify more rent as a result of their abillity to colocate with someone else. Sure.

[@misssunshine8469]

I 100% agree with you. Your points are all very valid and strong reasons why landlords opt for Long term over short term. Got to give the landlords incentive to rent long term, start with protecting them from tenants who know the huge loopholes exist for taking advantage of landlords. This is a government issue, not an investor or landlord issue.

[@rachelk8368]

Housing needs to be for people. Not a stock or money making machine. We need to ban airbNB and short term rentals, we need to ban foreign buyers and not allow HELOCS. There needs to be a stop to easy cash for people who already have multiple properties. There needs to be way more tax for people who are landlords.

[@jonatand2045]

More and more state interventions when the state caused the housing crisis by not permitting enough construction to supply demand.

[@gemalhorne9089]

Making it more expensive to hold and rent rental properties - brilliant idea!

[@Lifeisapartydresslikeit]

I completely disagree. Why should you tell people what to do with the asset they work very hard for? Leave people alone with their properties. You cannot tell me what to do with my life or lifestyle just like I cannot tell you how to live your life!! Like come on!!! Be realistic. Blame the government for your woes!! Why can’t you tell the government to create low income housing or affordable housing?? We as landlords are already creating rentals and most renters play games and pay rent for a few months and never pay again! If the LTB would throw out scum tenants we would be able to rent our properties out without fear.

[@rachelk8368]

@@Lifeisapartydresslikeit The government already has lots of rules and tells people what they can and cannot do. ie you can't build certain structures or rezone without permission. If people don't have business licences as hotel operators should they be allowed to destroy communities to make hotels in other people's backyards?

[@wombat4583]

@@Lifeisapartydresslikeit Lol people protest every time local governments add even a few more affordable housing programs in their neighbourhoods.

[@linlena901]

I like this face-to-face debate.

[@rebeccahillsares8253]

But I wish they both felt the pain of the tenants

[@kirkin2006]

Unbalanced debate,

[@mateofernando5066]

Every sentence coming out of the property owner's mouth always starts with "I" want to pay off my mortgage. This whole problem has started becaue the person want to treat housing as a tradeable commodity that they can profit from. The first solution to this problem is to just heavily tax anyone who has a 2nd, 3rd, 4th property which would discourage property speculation, leaving property ownership strictly for housing and not as a vehicle to make money from. This will at least increase the supply by restricting airBNB. If you want to make money by speculating please do that with stocks. They were designed to be risky and have high potential of return. And, the best part is people don't need them to live in them. 🤔🤔🤔

[@warren6090]

They are actually better investments too because you don't have to deal with all the problems of maintenance and increase interest rates on your loans. You don't need leverage to purchase stocks and there is a greater potential to make millions more if you start young.

[@rometimed1382]

The problem becomes that then there are no units being built because as the cost to build increases (largely due to government taxes) there are less and less regular people who can afford them. In Vancouver just the taxes account for 1/3rd the price of these types of condos.

[@grildcheez1504]

The fact is Airbnb has also created Homestays, renting a room in one's home and looking for room mates, providing affordable agile interim flexible accomodation to transit workers, new immigrants, students, people with changing home circumstances etc has long existed prior to Airbnb. Airbnb just did it the best and created additional supply that would'nt see the market because of how complicated it was for the space to be made available. If someone had a spare couch or bedroom they could now add new supply to the market which would'nt exist in the first place. There are tens of thousands of room made available in people's homes as a result where community is felt and relationships and networks are built. Can people justify more rent as a result of their abillity to colocate with someone else and endure the inconveniece for market determined extra bucks. Sure. More supply, more connections, more networks, more community, more funds going into local communities and the businesses close to them, more effeicient and agile use of existing space. Are people at the edges trying to abuse the core value of Airbnb. Yes. But the facts and value it brings needs to be maintained to maintain a vibrant economy that incentivizes people to make space available to those that need it.

[@karanveerkahlon3987]

Lol that landlord is a scumbag and you can tell he doesn’t have any of his tenants best wishes in mind, he does it all for personal gain

[@grildcheez1504]

@@karanveerkahlon3987 wait till the government is your landlord. The beauracrats who manages your low income housing can't/won be able to do anything as they collect their government pay with a broken feedback loop to the pricing mechanics of the market as they navigate through all the bearacaxy and externalize the costs until they can't anymore.

[@11trickyrick]

The real question should be “Why are investors not interested in building new rental housing?” The answer is that Canadian tax policy since 1972 has made new rental construction a very poor investment. It’s that simple. Market rental housing - as compared with most “subsidized” and “affordable” rental housing - is built by private investment. From 1946 to 1972, when the tax treatment for building new rentals was favourable, there was lots of rental housing built. In 1972, almost 50 per cent of new housing unit starts were rentals.

[@travismaclean5804]

How was it more favourable between 1946 to 1972? What exactly was the tax advantage?

[@11trickyrick]

@@travismaclean5804 There were five tax measures to encourage rental housing investment between 1945 and 1972. Here is a simplified summary of some fairly complex provisions. Investors in rental housing could claim very high depreciation - 10 per cent per year on wood frame buildings - against the taxable income from the properties. This provided a “paper loss” tax shelter and encouraged investors to fund rental construction. In 1972 the allowable depreciation was cut in half to five per cent, then later to four per cent. The rental investor could claim any losses, including those “paper losses” based on the accelerated depreciation, to reduce taxable income from other sources. Such subsidies are often needed in the first years of a project facing high startup costs and lower tenant revenues. Coupled with the accelerated depreciation rate, this provided a very attractive tax shelter. In 1972 the tax shelter attraction was eliminated. “Rollover” provisions said an owner or investor who sold a rental building paid no taxes on the profits if they were re-invested in rental housing within the calendar year. This encouraged re-investment and attracted people with limited capital who, by buying and selling, were able to build up equity in a business that did not have particularly attractive returns but was conservative and stable. In addition, because people wanting to sell a building would do repairs and maintenance to maximize price, buildings were kept in a good state of repair. In 1972, “rollover” was no longer allowed and a capital gains tax was imposed - first at 50 per cent, then at 75 per cent. (It is now back to 50 per cent.) Given that most long-term capital appreciation in rental real estate is around the inflation rate and the taxes paid are substantial, the sales of rental buildings and re-investment all but ceased. Liquidity disappeared from the market. Before 1972, a small rental business was treated as any other “small business” and paid lower taxes. If the investor was actually managing it, it was considered an “active business,” allowing additional preferential tax treatment. Since 1972, rental businesses have not been treated as small businesses and are not considered “active” businesses unless they have more than five employees. Given that contractors do most of the work in a rental, few rental owners qualify. Once an owner has five employees, his is no longer a “small business.”

[@travismaclean5804]

@@11trickyrick I agree that those would have been significant tax advantages. Thanks for taking the time to explain.

[@morvk2008]

Long term isn't profitable. It is also high risk You are on a hook for big capital, massively big and then, you have little control over the product you offer. Eviction/cost setting... Capital follows the path of least resistance. Toronto isn't one.

[@morvk2008]

@Richard the tax incentives you described would have made a huge difference. Will you run for office please?

[@sarscov9854]

If 1 tenant makes you go bankrupt, it means you're overleveraged and it is indeed your own fault, not that tenant's fault. You didn't calculate risk.

[@networth00]

That's none of your business.

[@sarscov9854]

@@networth00 the landlord going bankrupt over 1 tenant is a dmbfk.

[@networth00]

@@sarscov9854 One bad tenant can cost tens of thousands.

[@jvssocialmedia2459]

Make a law that you can only use a property as an Airbnb 4 months a year, or one year in three. Make AirBnBs pay a steep fee to fund a sub-tribunal to prevent clogging the housing tribunals/courts available to all landlords and tenants.

[@julianlawrence1648]

No one should own two houses until everyone owns one.

[@networth00]

That will never happen. Life is not fair. You have to work for what you want. Go get yours.

[@julianlawrence1648]

@@networth00 It isn't a level playing field. As such, those with more (capital, abilities, health) should share with those who have less.

[@networth00]

@@julianlawrence1648 Go live in Cuba, China, N Korea if you want a "level playing field". You have much more than someone in Africa, so why don't you share what you have with them? Your parents failed you.

[@predragii]

This should have been an hour long discussion.. great format

[@Rich-wx3tx]

The only way short term rentals will stop is when home owners have more control over who lives in their home. If a renter can stay in the home without paying rent for 8 months or more before they can finally be evicted, these short term rental companies will continue to grow in popularity. I personally would not risk renting out my home knowing that a single bad renter, no matter how tiny that percentage of renters are, could bankrupt my entire life and I have almost no recourse. ( yes I could sue, and win, and likely never get a penny paid back to me). If they changed the laws that said if a tenant does not pay their rent, they’re out within a week, there becomes no reason to pay air bnb all the fees associated with doing business through them. Bad tenants know that it’ll take at least a half year for their case to go to the tenancy board, during which time they can live for free and nothing, not even the sale of the house, can get them out. That one risk alone is way too much for most owners who are not involved in the rental business as their profession, which I believe is the vast majority of home owners that are just looking to supplement their income so they can afford to stay in their home.

[@DimaRakesah]

Renters: I need an affordable place to live Airbnb Owner: But I want to make even more money so I can pay off MY home The problem is one group of people is getting an easier way to own property and shutting out the other.

[@noneofourfinbusiness]

Or looker at the other way, without airbnb those owners would be renters competeing for less homes. You seem to forget that the short-term rental market increased the number of units as people invested in renovating basement suites and garages.

[@TorontoMillenial]

Toronto has the strictest rules and enforcement for Airbnb now. tens of thousands of condos that used to be on Airbnb all came back onto the LTR market and now they’re underwater because they’re not making enough in rent with these high interest rates. Now they need to be licensed approved by the city and it has to be their primary residence and they can only host 180 nights annually. It's very strict and enforcement is serious. The majority of toronto condos on airbnb now are for LTR (28 days +) because it's safer for landlords to find qualified tenants on there then off the street.

[@noneofourfinbusiness]

@Peter James well I have been waiting for AirBnB to get into the LTR market in a bigger way. Unfurnished LTR with full tenency agreements but also with a proper reputation system. It would be hard for any actor off the street to set up an online market like that, but for airbnb its just a feature extension and they have the brand awareness to capture it all at once. They could charge a drastically lower fee for unfurnished LTR and own the whole market. ....especially if they provided insurance as well!!!

[@DimaRakesah]

@@noneofourfinbusiness Them having a home or renting equals out the same because it doesn't change the amount of available housing. Someone else will buy that property, it's going to be owned either way. Taking units OFF the long term rental market to do short term rental DOES impact the amount of available units and decreases them. Only one of these is actually decreasing the amount of available long term rentals, and the amount of people doing it is staggering.

[@noneofourfinbusiness]

​@@DimaRakesah Ya what we need is something like airBNB for the LTR market. With their reputation system and even with their insurnce products, it could be a real benefit to the market. Overall I am in favour of services like airBNB they have brought immense efficiencies to the market and I think they have enabled many more people to be able to buy homes knowing that they can run helpers suites like this. The solution I think is more supply. To bring more supply on faster I think that zoning should be loosened up immensly. I am big fan of what they have done in Tokyo. Tokyo has grown a lot over the last thirty years, and unlike everywhere else, the ratio of home prices to wages has stayed steady. In North America, Europe and Austrailia home prices have outpaced wage growth by a giant margin. The things they do in Tokyo that are different is they have a unique zoning environment that leads to really cool mixed use neighbourhoods that are enjoyable to live in and provide more developers the ability to add more housing. Also, I think the zoning laws do not restrict the types and shapes and sizes of homes you can build. They are built very safe to strict building codes, but not design codes so to speak. So developers are able to build housing that people want and can afford. I think all the talk about reducing demand from airbnb and foreign buyers is a distraction to the real problem which is artifically constrained supply systems. Of course the other thing is....people don't need to live in Ontario of BC, you can buy homes for a quarter of the price in Calgary, and even less in Edmonton. And if anyone says "well people don't want to live there" you can answer "well they don't want to pay high prices so they have to choose"

[@shanerob681]

I still think that overall it is the government’s fault for allowing investors to gobble up housing. There should be legal measures in place that prevent people from owning more than one property for the purpose of renting. That’s the only way anything will change. Otherwise, these landlords are doing nothing wrong in trying to grow and protect their investments. Why take the risk of doing a traditional rental where as a landlord, you have no protection from a bad tenant?

[@That90sShow]

Bringing I'm 1 million immigrants a year might not help

[@networth00]

It's called FREEDOM.

[@spicoli4217]

Yes, pay down your mortgage by extracting it from your tenants, not with money from your actual job. Thats whats wrong here. These landlords here are clearly using it to fund their lifestyle and "get ahead" but by doing so, they are leeching money off people who will never get ahead. Its predatory and its gross. Isnt their fault entirely. Its how the Country was set up. Its just so irritating

[@That90sShow]

And the banks making money from "selling" mortgages by printing money is normal? 😂😂😂

[@mwehpakonne]

Agree!!! We are supposed to feel bad for the landlord meanwhile to them this is borderline passive income (not saying it's no work, but clearly not that much work seeing how easily they scale from 1 property to 10)

[@Polycodone]

I was gonna say this lol. Why don't they get a real job and use that to help offset costs etc? If they're such amazing and good people why do they not carry any burden, but push it off to the tenants?

[@spicoli4217]

@@Polycodone They are so used to their lifestyle, that they feel threatened that they could be in a position where they won be able to anymore. Again, its not like what they are doing is illegal or anything, but its just so morally twisted. I know so many people in this position too. They act all high and mighty like they earned it, but they literally made all of their equity through luck and timing. A coworker of mine bought a home 8 years ago for about 1/3 of the price that its worth now. Its not even a nice house by any standards, but it shot up. Then he sold it, bought another much nicer house, and his lifestyle has changed completely. They go on trips all the time, and his life is great. Although, we make the same amount of money.

[@scientifically_sarah]

I thought this was a very insightful and respectful conversation about a topic that's so personal across Canada. Here in Kingston ON we have issues with an overabundance of short-term luxury apartments and very few rent-to-own, condos and truly affordable housing in the downtown core. I think adopting the policies suggested from Qubec and NY seems like the best way to go!

[@TorontoMillenial]

Toronto has the strictest rules and enforcement for Airbnb now. tens of thousands of condos that used to be on Airbnb all came back onto the LTR market and now they’re underwater because they’re not making enough in rent with these high interest rates. Now they need to be licensed approved by the city and it has to be their primary residence and they can only host 180 nights annually. It's very strict and enforcement is serious. The majority of toronto condos on airbnb now are for LTR (28 days +) because it's safer for landlords to find qualified tenants on there then off the street.

[@AuntyKsTarot]

And kingston has an even greater shortage of low income rentals since you all gentrified the north end / skeleton park.

[@TorontoMillenial]

Kingston should apply the strict regulations that Toronto has. Toronto is the leading example of Airbnb rules and regulations. It has the strictest in the country and it's enforced. Ever since the Toronto rules came into play tens of thousands of condos and homes came back onto the LTR market.

[@TorontoMillenial]

If someone goes away on vacation for 1-3 months. Or if retirees want to go to floriday for half the year they should be allowed to rent out their home. The problem isn't airbnb if it's regulated and strict like Toronto. The problem is extremely aggressive immigration goals beyond what our builders can possibly build in a rapid amount of time.

[@ThaliaLemon]

​@@TorontoMillenial We were building housing at double the rate of population growth in Vancouver and our rents still SKYROCKETED. It's not an immigration issue, it's a "rich people own too much of our housing stock and control our rents too much" issue.

[@truegrit7697]

Air BNB destroys neighborhoods. It is a smaller version of corporate investment in the housing market. Air BNB rentals should be in designated zones, and not be able to pop up everywhere.

[@ianp383]

CBC knows they are on the right side of public opinion on this one so they keep the comments open...

[@sadiek8785]

I mean, even Kristiyan seems to think he’s on the wrong side of it if you look how intense his twirling of his ring was particularly once the economist came out and called him out on his arguments. He is stressed.

[@jamilajohnson7460]

​@@sadiek8785 he should be,his I don't care about anyone but me is not a good look on national tv.

[@reginalsamedy5632]

I like how they expect landlords to just solve all their problems but fail to realize WHY they did it. Like she said, she wanted to get ahead financially. in this economy, either you get ahead or you declare bankruptcy. Prices of EVERYTHING continues the rise but somehow it's the landlord's responsability to cheapen your rent ? we need to slow down the rate of immigration, raise wages and lower these ridiculous interest rates and thats just the start

[@electricpurple4112]

They are part of the problem, as someone who noticed a flood of available housing available when no one was using airbnb. Plenty of people admitted their place WAS an airbnb.

[@Incognito-fe8cw]

It"s not the landlord's fault ! When everything keeps costing more and more every single year, you can't blame investors for trying to make the most when they can ! Bad tenanys can stay for 14 - 24 months without paying, and the landlords can't do a thing about it ! Being a landlord has become very high risk ! The governments want to control everything and now they can't even bring back a 2 bedroom appartment in a nice neighborhood for $700 a month !

[@alitiner9967]

They should also be asking why it is so much more profitable to convert to short term rentals. Is the long term rental market overburdened by regulation or legal dysfunction. Is the system overprotective of bad tenants? And why are we vilifying landlords when there is a shortage of them. The real fix is to build more units in the long run but in the short term regulations can be adjusted in a way to encourage property owners to rent their properties long term. If you take the approach of penalizing short term rentals, this will only disincentivise investors from property and lead to further shortage.

[@moxiee216]

Housing is a societal problem that requires societal solutions. We do not expect individual doctors to fix the health care crisis, why are we expecting individual landlords to solve the housing crisis. STR has definitely exacerbated the shortage, but the government needs to step in & see what they can do to provide affordable housing for tenants. Until innovative ideas are developed; developers will continue building new high rises condos & apartments & charging astronomical rents for them. This leaves marginalized & lower income Canadians on the side lines again.

[@networth00]

GOVERNMENT NEVER SOLVES ANYTHING. Let the market decide. STOP counting on your corrupt government to fix anything.

[@FJB-qs8gl]

Solution is limit Airbnb ability to suck away long term rentals in our city/society/Canada; therefore limiting an owner's ability to rent their property as an Airbnb rental rather than a long term rental, such as was done in NYC & other cities.

[@david-Davidson]

You need to think of a solution where the government implanting some new policy solves everything. Our government is garbage, they're never going to implement anything that affects housing negatively.

[@jonatand2045]

​@@david-Davidson Allow the construction of more units. Nimbys don't want it because they are ignorant and leftist don't want it because someone might profit (also ignorance). Hence many comments suggesting that property owners get less of a say over their property.

[@nottheone582]

@@david-Davidson this is implemented at the regional level, not federal boomer

[@TorontoMillenial]

Toronto has the strictest rules and enforcement for Airbnb now. tens of thousands of condos that used to be on Airbnb all came back onto the LTR market and now they’re underwater because they’re not making enough in rent with these high interest rates. Now they need to be licensed approved by the city and it has to be their primary residence and they can only host 180 nights annually. It's very strict and enforcement is serious. The majority of toronto condos on airbnb now are for LTR (28 days +) because it's safer for landlords to find qualified tenants on there then off the street.

[@cloutm_anager8262]

Solution is to have more housing supply but government being too slow and it costs too much in taxes to build doesn’t allow developers to build the required amount of buildings for the population.

[@starcatcher3691]

I am a landlord and I definitely think it makes things worse for renters

[@grahameve3564]

Landlords/hosts: I shouldn't have to take any risks. I've invested and shouldn't lose money because of it. Renters: so I'm supposed to just not live my life? Because you've invested?

[@calvinchan3028]

I don’t get why the landlord said he had to go bankrupt if he can’t pay the mortgage… can’t he just sell?

[@chan0110]

@@calvinchan3028 He obviously wouldn't go bankrupt. If push came to shove, he would sell to make up any losses due. But because he has the ability to make `choices`, he's choosing other options which would prevent a worse case scenario. On the reverse side, I have to ask the equally fair question: If a renter can't afford to pay rent, why not get job that pays more? Of all the things a person can control in life, surely your job is one of them. I certainly don't think it's other peoples responsibility to `take a hit` for the team just for other peoples social justice beliefs. Especially when those people are not the ones 'taking the hit' and expecting others to do so for them.

[@rainorshine7816]

If that were the case there would be no services, such as grocery workers, gas station workers, food service workers So someone got to do these jobs right??? Think of those “essential” workers who have a right to affordable safe housing!!

[@vlee123]

I think this will be a circular argument with no end as essentially, you're asking for one side to take a loss so the other will benefit. Unfortunately, the end will always be along the lines of: Landlord: "Why should I provide a subsidy to you so you can live your life?" Renter: "Why can't you make less/potentially take a loss so you can better my life?" And this effectively takes the government, who ultimately should be responsible to society as a whole, out of the picture.

[@chan0110]

@@vlee123 I couldn't have described it better, and I agree with you. It's very easy to get behind a cause when your the one who's benefiting while someone else pays. But if the roles were reversed, I'm sure a large portion of people would suddenly feel otherwise. I don't blame anyone, this is just human nature.

[@burnt1ce85]

The real debate should be the government vs. home builders

[@cloutm_anager8262]

Exactly. Air BnB is just a scape goat by the government.

[@shauncameron8390]

@@clo AirBnB is a product of pro-renter/anti-landlord government policy.

[@networth00]

THANK YOU.

[@aria751]

This was well done and I appreciate how cool the conversation was. We need more of this!

[@blurtam188]

The old lady at the end yelling at the two people trying to get ahead was the opposite of cool. I'd love to debate her - she wouldn't stand a chance.

[@LizaB486]

@blurtam188 you couldn't win a debate against a wet, brown paper bag, bud. Lol She's trying to tell you what the problem is, and you're just not listening. Try listening. There are literally thousands upon thousands of long term rentals off the market. What's that tell you Mr. Debater? I'll debate you. Go...

[@iqtestingforteachers]

@@LizaB486 No there aren't thousands and thousands of that.... your very term "long term rentals" does not exist as a zoning or legal category of a dwelling. If there was such a category, short term rental landlords would be in violation of law and be held accountable, and the problem would be solved. Try talking sense. Go.

[@LizaB486]

@iqtestingforteachers there are 100,500 airbnbs in Canada. That literally means that those long term rentals are off the market, turned into short term rental- airbnbs. That's the difference between long and short term rentals. Short term= 1 week or 1 month. Long term= 1 yr or 2yrs or 5 yrs or 10 yrs. So the airbnbs have sucked up all of the housing possibilities for tenants, and even for buyers, causing a huge supply and demand problem and driving up prices for everyone. Try talking sense. Maybe take a few courses. Lol Go...

[@ThaliaLemon]

@@blurtam188 The fact that they're facing homelessness and upset about it doesn't invalidate their arguments. You're a fool if you think being angry means you've lost a debate - the loser in this debate are Canadian residents. You're gambling on our survival if you invest in housing.

[@jambi1527]

The landlord could lose their 2nd, 3rd, 4th, etc. investment property, but the renters are increasingly more likely to become homeless at this pace. Both suck, but the consequences arent equal. Its a risk to own a second property. It shouldn't be a risk to just live and need housing. I dont blame the landlord, but the governements for letting people play the landlord game like this.

[@shauncameron8390]

The landlord's consequences are both legal and financial.

[@jambi1527]

One person still has a place to live

[@zaydqasas6156]

@@shauncameron8390 investing is a risk in every other investment except real estate? Why would we protect one investment class over all others? I'd really prefer not having tent encampments in my city and providing these people with a decent home vs what some dude made on his ROI's on his 2nd, 3rd properties. If a landlord is that over leveraged that they risk financial collapse by being a landlord, then they aren't making wise investments. That's the equivalent of me using every penny I can to short a stock that doesn't end up declining in price. It's just gambling.

[@theylied1776]

Here in the United States, there are very few luxury apartments that will allow Airbnb. And there are very few homeowners associations that will allow homes, townhomes, or condos to sublease for Airbnb.

[@jonatand2045]

The bureaucracy also doesn't allow homeowner to increase the number of units in their property.

[@TorontoMillenial]

Toronto has the strictest rules and enforcement for Airbnb now. tens of thousands of condos that used to be on Airbnb all came back onto the LTR market and now they’re underwater because they’re not making enough in rent with these high interest rates. Now they need to be licensed approved by the city and it has to be their primary residence and they can only host 180 nights annually. It's very strict and enforcement is serious. The majority of toronto condos on airbnb now are for LTR (28 days +) because it's safer for landlords to find qualified tenants on there then off the street.

[@itsjustramblings]

Interest rates have been rising only from Sept'22 and for almost 2.5 yrs of pandemic they were near zero. Whereas the rental prices have been increasing quite a lot even before pandemic. One of my friend's apartment rent went up by 25% during early pandemic months, it was insanely difficult to find a new place since not a lot of people were moving and with restrictions. Btw, AirBNB was launched to help people to make extra income by renting their rooms and basements. Fine, if someone chooses to make it a business by buying multiple properties then in that case, they should be treated as a hotel business and subject to those rules and regulations. Look, I take all the risk so I will look to maximize profit and improve my lifestyle and get ahead and why should i care about others? Is the same reason every big multinational corporation or large business owner says when they cut costs and lays off people. I didn't expect to hear the same thing from a mom n pop real estate speculator. kudos for playing in the big league. And since they are against regulations, may be they won't object to a big real estate company building tons of cheap rental apartments even if it is box/studio size and there is tons of demand. Outside of Quebec, there aren't too many studio rentals in Canada, to my knowledge.

[@TimScott-x2d]

how can you have a society where people can't afford a place to live? how can someone work if they can't afford a home? I used to be able to rent a place in Vancouver for 500$ a month within the last ten years.

[@Doraemonhandle]

Unfortunately living in a major city is no longer meant to be affordable for everyone.

[@shauncameron8390]

@@Doraemonhandle It never really was. That's why in most cities in the world, the poor live on the outskirts.

[@Youarenot_Special]

​@@shauncameron8390 the outskirts of my city sells brand new duplexes for 650 grand. They have garages so I mean yippee 😢 condos for 550 and wait for it a full house for 750 and guess what you have to pay condo fees too because they built a cute garden in the middle of the square of houses. Isn't that just cute.

[@sew_gal7340]

people CAN afford to live in society, just not nyc or sf...the world is so much bigger than these 2 places.

[@taj1111]

I like how the tenants (male far right) are not seeing that the landlord has financial obligations to fulfill too. The greyed haired woman is also deaf, it’s not a profit issue: landlords literally can’t even break even a lot of times. Taxes, interest rates, insurance and condo fees are going up. And then there’s entitled tenants who default sometime. What should a landlord do?

[@warren6090]

15:50 "why dont they increase interest rates a quarter of a % at a time" because macro economic policy does not care about your airbnb business. They are trying to control inflation. The economist should have mentioned that. Those are the risks you take when you take a variable rate.

[@ruthtepper8431]

The LTB made the landlord a hostage with the enormous costs he/she/they have to absorb - run away from being a landlord in Canada. If you still wish to be a landlord move your equity to red state in the U.S.

[@ad03dh]

The same people who complain about air b and b are the same ones who use them. I never use them. Hotels only. I don’t see a purpose for them: that is what hotels are for

[@MariamMariam-ue7vz]

They offer a kitchen - that’s the primary advantage.

[@johnlittle3430]

@@MariamMariam-ue7vz People with money love to feel like they're in a proper home, even when they're away from their proper home! Won't SOMEONE think of these people and their basic needs?!

[@MariamMariam-ue7vz]

@@johnlittle3430 I don’t understand.

[@networth00]

@@johnlittle3430 Stop letting illegals come in and take housing away from citizens.

[@toniodacres5557]

Air BNB is probably the best way to go. Tenants Long Term don't even pay their rent and now we have Professional Tenants trying to skirt housing costs. The cost of doing business is a reality sorry folks. Raise the rent!

[@sam3r_11]

i just wanna know what happens when airbnb dries up... this is the government problem, airbnb hosts are not the bad guys, but the government failed Canadians when young professionals not only can't own, they can't even find rentals

[@networth00]

They can find rentals, but they want top-notch places for cheap.

[@User9865-b8u]

The airbnb guy's arguments are shallow at best. The problem is not the individual airbnb investor, and rather the corporatization of Airbnb.

[@GoodKarma1020]

The male landlord was twirling his wedding ring the whole time, and I kept yelling “sit up straight and stop playing with your damn ring” 😂😂 We are to far gone!! It’s all ready the Wild, Wild, West, the changes to curb this insanity should have been a preventative model years ago. Now we’re in crisis mode about to explode. And yes the market will explode and it won’t be pretty!!

[@pyranomics7229]

I noticed that too. Seemed like a nervous tick tbh. I had a relative who had tonnes of mental/personality issues (she was very controlling and had a lot of pent up resentment) and she had ticks like these.

[@vespaman101]

Mom and Pop AIRBNB owners should be able to do it. Large corporations should be severely limited. I think the process of buying a home, saving money, buying a new home, and renting our the old home long term or AIRBNB is totaly legitimate. Thats your retirement. Maybe even early retirement. The issue is when someone gets 15, 20, 30, or even 1000+ units. Or better yet when a company does this. I truly think the solution is a severe hike on short term rental taxes when going over a certain number of rentals. I also think there has to be a pretty significant limit on how many AIRBNB units a company can own out of a cities total housing. I would also like a limit on how much a company can overbid on a home. Maybe only 5% more than the next highest offer and only able to adjust thier offer twice. Just an idea. We should also reduce build to rent. There should be a huge percentage requirement for build to sell and a requirement to lower price by builders if the house doesnt sell in a certain amount of time. Thats just a lot of thoughts and suggestions. I think that lets people like me, the aspiring early retiree, and the aspiring home owner get a fairer playing field.

[@rachelk8368]

Currently Calgary has 5300 Airbnb units and 3200 units of housing a viable for purchase. This is a huge mismatch.

[@That90sShow]

Maybe point fingers at the banks Karen.

[@cloutm_anager8262]

How is this a mismatch? According to who? Calgary is experiencing an influx of Torontonians. Very different. Every other year it’s fine. Has nothing to do with Air BnB

[@MariamMariam-ue7vz]

Just because a unit is listed, doesn’t mean it’s not someone’s actual home. Many hosts rent out their home on ABB when they go on vacation, or they rent out a room in their home. Or like me, they rent out part of their basement, as a suite but it’s not a full apt so it’s not taking from the LTR stock.

[@rachelk8368]

@@MariamMariam-ue7vz Everyone's situation is different. But there are a lot of people who are treating housing as a commodity and it is tearing our communities and country apart. Things have only been made worse with STR.

[@charonstormborn8998]

Anybody else notice how uncomfortable the landlord guy got when they started talking about air bnb being accountable for their business practices.. yikes 😬

[@grildcheez1504]

There is only so much demand for short term housing. 99% of people need ong term housing 99% of the time. BC already has a speculation tax, a empty homes tax, a short term rental tax, short term rental strata bylaw fines of $500+ a day etc. and are making $100+ million from these taxes. Airbnb alone remitted over $50 Million in taxes. What are they doing with it:? The truth is More housing units, better paying jobs, affordable interest rates, people willing to work hard, upgrade their skills, buddy up with a partner and budget judiciously with disciplne.

[@vital17]

@@grildcheez1504 Yes! Oversaturated STR markets in a lot of US cities are cratering and a crash is being predicted. The homes that arent making money will either be sold or rented long term. Just stand back and let the free market do its job. Also simplifying the building process would go a long way towards fixing housing shortages.

[@ohcanadaeh]

The government has the power to make a drastic change to airbnb, real estate speculation thru taxation. The government uses legislation and taxation on Canada's oil and gas industries on climate change. Why don't they do the same in housing which is a basic need for Canadians.

[@msyamashita01]

Without knowing anyone’s financial situation here I think you’re looking at 4 people all struggling to better themselves and their way of life. As STR’s become more and more saturated and less profitable the owners will swing them back to long term rentals. It’s just a new variable the market will need time to balance out.

[@vital17]

Yes! Oversaturated STR markets in a lot of US cities are cratering and a crash is being predicted. The homes that arent making money will either be sold or rented long term. Just stand back and let the free market do its job. Also simplifying the building process would go a long way towards fixing housing shortages.

[@sew_gal7340]

The root of all our problems is that the rich are way too rich and the poor are way too poor. it doesnt matter how you deal with the problem nothing will be solved until everyone is brought down to the same level.

[@shauncameron8390]

@@sew_gal7340 For what? It's not the rich's fault a lot of the poor can't manage what they have to save their lives.

[@bena.282]

Generally speaking, I find arguments for AirBnb quite shallow. - “It's a free economy". Well, why don't you open a manufacturing factory in your backyard? Context matters. - “I need AirBnb to pay my mortgage”. If you rely on AirBnb to pay your mortgage, then you should not have qualified for the mortgage. I’m sure you didn’t specify AirBnb on your mortgage application. You likely got a residential mortgage and then decided to treat it as a business. And let's face it, most AirBnb owners treat it as a scalable cash-cow business rather than a mortgage helper. - “Long-term rental laws are unfavourable to landlords”. I agree with this, but how is AirBnb the long-term solution? AirBnb should be regulated like any other business requiring a commercial license, zoning, safety regulations, commercial mortgages and special tax considerations as deemed fit. It baffles me how and why councils still focus on stricter long-term rental rules when AirBnb is running like the wild west in the background.

[@lala-ct9ir]

There should also be regulations on what an Airbnb host can expect of people staying in their place. If you run a hotel, then act like one and don't expect the people staying in your place to adjust to your special needs.

[@TorontoMillenial]

@bena.282 You obviously have not researched this topic. Toronto has the strictest regulations for STR in the entire country. It's literally not even possible to list your toronto property on airbnb without a license. It has to be your primary residence and can only do it 120 nights a year and you have to pay crazy high MAT tax that's 8% now on top of the licensing fees and regulation fees and insurances. You also need approval by building management. Good luck finding a condo board in toronto that will allow STR! Seriously go research before you comment

[@bena.282]

@@TorontoMillenial I didn't mention anything about Toronto specifically but the rules you mentioned are ineffective. 1/ It has to be "primary residence" on paper but practically, how many airbnbs are actual primary residences? Declaring a place as "primary residence" is the oldest trick in the book. 2/ Getting an airbnb license is peanuts compared to getting a license to run a hotel. If it's a commercial business, then let's treat it as such. 3/ Who's counting, reporting, and enforcing the 120 night limit? Even if enforced, 120 nights at airbnb rate >= long term rental for most units.

[@TorontoMillenial]

@@bena.282 It's obvious that you haven't done much research on this. 1/ you can't publish a Toronto listing on airbnb without a license. In order to get a license you need to submit and prove your primary residence on government id. You can only have 1 primary residence because you can only have 1 address on your drivers license/government id. If you change your primary residence on your government id after you get your license form city of toronto the governement id office will notify the city of toronto that you've changed your primary residence and the city of toronto will cancel your license and unlist your listing off airbnb immediately and you will not be able to get another str license. It's strict and severe for breaking the rules...2/ I don't think you've ever attempted to get a str license because it's not 'peanuts' as you say. There is lots of paperwork. It takes months to get approved. There are inspections. There are quarterly update requirements. There are fees. There are high MAT taxes (8-10%) plus HST.. And there is renewal. Hotels don't have anything like that. 3/ Airbnb shares ALL the data for each listing with the city of toronto. Finances. nights occupied, even guests names. It's litereally counted on the backend of the airbnb profile. Once you reach the max nights allowed for a calendar year the only other option is to offer 28 nights + rentals which is LTR. Stop arguing and do your reseach before complaining. Seriously it's ridiculous that your screaming and complaining about this and it's already been regulated and enforced 2.5 years ago.... The problem isn't airbnb (in toronto). The problem is mass rapid immigration. Boomers that didn't have enough kids. And the notion that if you can't afford to live in Manhattan or Toronto then move to an burb or exoburb that is actually more affordable.

[@bena.282]

​@@TorontoMillenial ​ Again, I emphasize that I'm not specifically referring to Toronto. I agree with you that immigration and lack of supply remain the largest fundamental problems. But let's not downplay AirBnb's role either. In my opinion, AirBnb has morphed into community altering business model from its humble roots. Heck, Hostaway that just raised $175M to "automate, streamline, and grow your AirBnb business". I'm certain the average Joe renting his basement wouldn't need a management software. And I maintain that the policies you mentioned have large loop holes in them.

[@Olive_O_Sudden]

Regardless of how many years a renter has lived in their unit in Ontario, their landlord is permitted to raise the rent by at least the annual guideline set by the province. If you're a landlord, and that annual increase isn't going to cover your continued investment costs, then go invest in something else. It's not--or shouldn't be--renters' responsibility to pay for your investments.

[@everydaytwiceonsundays4498]

We're talking about a situation where the bare-minimum incompressible expenses - rent, electricity, phone and internet - will put someone in the red. Better hope you never get hungry because you can't afford food, better hope you don't have to pay gas, car repairs, clothes, shoes, or a winter coat, because it all goes on the credit card, and you can't afford to repay it. We should ban AirBNB outright. We should tax housing investors, and tax extra for properties sitting empty. We should build social housing as fast as we can. We should forbid or tax into oblivion people and companies who speculate on housing. We need roofs over our heads way more than the rich need to get yet richer.

[@jacqueline5625]

I totally agree. What we need are government leaders who have the backbone to do these things. It's actually not difficult to solve this issue, it's a lack of political will.

[@beautanner8409]

Thank god they brought someone in who could concisely articulate the situation to all involved... it was interesting to see how it changed the body language of the two on the left.

[@nanniebb]

It's all about self preservatìon and the almighty dollar. They go into real estate to MAKE MONEY. They don't care about renters.

[@j.w.2391]

You're being very Democratic...Not "self preservation"----but SELFISHNESS AND GREED.

[@CountNadir]

Why should they? Do they have some legal constitutional obligation? It's the governments job.

[@shauncameron8390]

[@ashleyc506]

Landlords aren’t charity workers. Not sure why that’s so hard for people to understand.

[@djohnston6214]

@@CountNadir they have a moral responsibility as a citizen not to exploit/contribute to the housing crisis facing our nation. If you must persist on being a leech and tearing at the social fabric of nation by all means continue. Prepare yourself for the ire and disrepute that is due to you, and that is well deserved. Social responsibility isn’t just for mega corporations.

[@alexandermcisaac]

Well put it this way i worked for 10 years in the city i live in now, me and my wife payed rent for 7 years, with my landlord increasing rent to 600 more in a span of 4 years until the landlords wanted to make the town homes were we were staying into condos and sell them so we purchased a home with in the city because i did not want to pay for a condo. Fast forward 3 years and now the mortgage we have now is cheaper then rent in the area we live buy almost 1k Something is wrong in canada

[@grildcheez1504]

Ofcourse owning costs less than renting because there is one less intermediary. The landlord adds another intermediary and if you think prices of tomatos, mcdonlads and gas are going up 70% but rental rates won't go up then you need to re think you're perspective.

[@nishali3343]

@@grildcheez1504 That's a false statement. 1 bedroom condo - 550 sqft - cost $600K in 2023 (if you are lucky). With 25% down with a 6% interest rate, the monthly mortgage is $2800, add $500 for monthly condo fee and $200/month for property tax, that's $3,500. As of June 2023, 1 bedroom in downtown TO is $2,200 - $3,000, renting is cheaper. This is one reason rent is sky rocketing this year as buyers can't afford to buy as it's cheaper to rent.

[@grildcheez1504]

@@nishali3343 Ofcourse if the cost of borrowing changes 19x in 1 year its bound to cause a readjustment in the market in the midium term and renters are able to arbitrige the difference in the short term. At a fundamental level. Rent cost is a function of - Downpayment+ borrowing cost+expenses+landlord return. Unless you are telling me that landlords are in it to lose money renting over a long enough timeframe can't be cheaper than owning in any more than a speculative arbitrage play.

[@acadian76]

The one renter summed it up perfectly. Is a building or area is zoned for residential housing it should not be allowed to be operated as a hotel.

[@DavidAlsh]

"I would be bankrupt if I didn't have the means to cover the mortgage " - then buy a restaurant or stocks. No one running a business is guaranteed a profit, why do you feel you're entitled to a profit?

[@sharonzwahlen6724]

Maybe hotels and motels need to be part of the conversations. Why are people choosing to rent an airbnb over a hotel? Or why not convert part of their building into apartments.

[@jonatand2045]

Converting into an apartment is blocked by nimby bureaucracy when not illegal.

[@nottheone582]

hotels aren't set up or built to be easily converted into complete living spaces. They often lack sufficient electrical systems, plumbing, and what they have aren't built to the same code as residential is. this would essentially mean stripping them back to the studs and completely rebuilding. no hotel owner is willingly doing that when they can leave as-is and make 5x what a monthly rental would net

[@That90sShow]

Hotels are renting to refugees and migrants and paid by tax payers

[@misskyekye]

I wouldn't choose an Airbnb over a hotel . I hate Airbnb it's a total ripoff most of the time.

[@sjandrews]

Who is the woman who came in for the second half? I want to see more of her work. That was spicy but spot on.

[@linlena901]

The main issue is the inefficiency of the landlord and tenant board. We only turn to Airbnb because of bad tenants. We lost a 6-month rental income, and we have to pay all expenses in the meantime. It is too risky to take long-term tenants VS Airbnb. We have been burned by bad tenants. If the landlord and tenant board could evict the unpaid tenant in 1-2 month, the landlord would love to rent in the long term.

[@zachnar0125]

Amen

[@atesah]

isn’t that just the risk of investing ?? Capitalists always talk a big game about how risky it is investing. Bad tenants are in the minority anyway but when you do encounter them, then sorry dear landlord - those are the risks you take when your investment is a human need. Get a real job like the rest of us, don’t do it if it’s too risky lol

[@zaydqasas6156]

Sounds like you sort of suck at picking tenants. A proper background and employment check usually weeds out the bad tenants. Your investment backfired because you mishandled it and now it's on a short term rental platform. Just sell the property, you shouldn't be a landlord if you can't properly vet people.

[@djohnston6214]

The real estate business isn’t a printing press. There are risks involved that you as an investor must contend with if you seek a reward. Sorry to say but must businesses fail, that should be the case in real estate too. Along with that, the business model of short term rentals must be much more regulated and taxed higher to discourage the practice.

[@ashleyc506]

⁠@@atesah You answer your own question. A landlord has the option of which market to invest in. Short term is less risky, so that’s where they put their money. More investment in the long term market requires the province to mitigate the risk for the landlords, otherwise they just won’t invest in it. Being mad at capitalist for not being a charity isn’t an argument, it’s just victim mentality.

[@magdalena2115]

airbnb is meant to benefit travelers, generally speaking. these airbnb overall are not doing anything to benefit community. in fact it's hurting your people. it really is encouraging landlords to take people's housing away to make as much money as possible. It's tempting, i know. but it's wrong. Please have a heart.

[@tanteu03]

It’s amazing how the governments, cities and states try to push off this issue like this. The problem is actually how they run the area. People view this topic as if it’s the real issue when it’s actually not. Amazing how they can do that

[@zesteecheeze]

Part of the problem is that air bnb washes a lot of money...

[@thomasfung3205]

I wonder if the table would turn if the housing price and rent drop. Would tenant pay more to help them?

[@smarie3874]

Interesting. I wish they’d discussed the middle ground of incentivizing long term rentals. Maybe taxes should be higher on income generated from Airbnb rent instead of long term rent. Maybe property taxes should be higher on properties that are Airbnb. To the point about housing becoming hotels, hotels pay all sorts of taxes that individual landlords don’t.

[@lala-ct9ir]

You are correct, this should be the way to go. Also more regulation on what Airbnb owners can require of their guests and what at a minimum they need to provide.

[@codierussell6587]

To this point, more like taking away the issues of long term rentals. Landlords have been vocal for awhile about issues that push them towards airbnb. One of those problems is the evictions that got brought up. In a lot of provinces if a tenant stops paying, the police still won't remove the tenant. If the tenants trash the place it is the landlords that have to pay to have it fixed. I don't blame landlords for making the change. The laws on the book deincentivise long term rentals. If some of these problems were fixed legislatively, then the incentives of having longer more stable tenants would outweight the potential bad tenants.

[@svitlana212]

Short term rental operators do pay more taxes to the cities and also pay to obtain short term licence. And to protect property from potential tenant abuse and rent nonpayment even paying the vacant tax is often a better option. The rental laws in Ontario are horrible that is why rental stock drastically decreases. Ask for more controll 🤣

[@TorontoMillenial]

You should really do your research before you comment. It's called the MAT tax. It already exists. It just increased this year to 8%. There is also the fees for the licenses and renewals and insurances. Property tax should be based on size of units / homes. A large home commands way more dollars in LTR and STR. Right now a 500 sq ft shoebox condo pays more in property tax then a 8 million dollar mansion in toronto. It's messed up.

[@svitlana212]

@@lala-ct9ir 🤣🤦

[@rebeccahillsares8253]

As tenants, all we need is a place to lay our heads, and a place to call home. Our lives are complicated, and the Government should build more affordable housing for low-income earners. All we need is help, house prices are rising every day, and we're suffering😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭😭

[@ironhammer4095]

The Internet changed everything about Housing. Now "investors" can buy into Toronto and Vancouver housing market buying up all the properties that are developed for sale. Since 40% of Federal MPs are rental property owners you know why Canada's immigration numbers are off the charts (1.1+ Million per year - Im including the 600k work visa people). Feed that demand for housing and keep wages down.

[@KS0102]

It should be illegal to make money off of residential real estate. This is the reason why we have so much poverty and homelessness. Make your money doing something else.

[@imrozrupani6730]

How do you feel about making money on food/groceries?

[@KS0102]

@@imrozrupani6730 There should be stringent limits on profit margins for that, too.

[@imrozrupani6730]

@K S who decides what an appropriate profit margin is for a company? If you are relying on the government, there is a reason why socialism didn't work. Think about the bread lines in the old USSR

[@jonatand2045]

​@@KS0102 Venezuela tried that, guess what happened.

[@That90sShow]

But legal to make profit from commercial real estate?? Lmao... And banks are OK making hundreds of thousands from residential mortgages?? Lmao. Are you really this dumb?

[@nickdavey]

Talk to the developers and corporate entities who actually are manipulating everything, instead of everyday people. Lets see how well that goes. Short term rental programs are a problem but not the overall problem.

[@casual35]

You're wrong. Those same everyday people who bought homes in the 1980s are renting their homes, basements and rooms way higher than it's worth even though they don't have these so called costs, interest rates etc. They will sell their house they bought for $140k for $1.8m

[@themajesticend491]

Most entitled landlords do not want to think from a tenants perspective. They want their tenant to starve and stay cold, but pay their conplete rentals on time.

[@jamesmarks8099]

If they did, it wouldnt be worth being a landlord.

[@shauncameron8390]

Maybe because the tenant's perspective is that of someone who needs to get his financial stuff in order? Landlords have every reason to be entitled as they own the property and are well within their rights to grant or deny/take back an apartment to whoever he/she wants for almost any reason.

[@YesItsMeGuys68]

What did the woman's closing comment mean? When she indicated that the renters were the future and not the business owners ???? She came across being incredibly biased.