Airline Management pilots

[@thejasonknightfiascoband5099]

"Nowww. This guy, Clay Lacy, I'm not going to mention his name" 😂😂 👏

[@maxcorder2211]

Our squadron in Vietnam had a Black pilot. When we launched for a mission, he would announce on the radio; “The jig is up”. He was a great guy, fun to be around in the O Club.

[@sammulhare302]

Thanks Ron. My first strike coming up. Amazing how we received similar letters, union busting hasn’t advanced much since the 80s.

[@ibiro868]

I was a UPS driver for some time and there was a strike in 97. The guys who crossed the line were shunned and never spoken to again. A few declined a retirement celebration because no one ever showed up. I left in 2022 but even then-25 years later- the brothers and sisters never forgot.

[@lbowsk]

As it should been. Many thanks.

[@PaulLoveless-Cincinnati]

Wow. Were you paid while on Strike?

[@ibiro868]

@@PaulLoveless-Cincinnati yes there’s strike pay. It isn’t much but the strike was only a few days before we were on the verge of crippling the company.

[@jimsmith1160]

❤thanks, Ron! I was hired at UAL in ‘89, retired in 2020. Enjoyed every minute of it. I also enjoy your channel. 👍

[@ronrogers]

Thanks!

[@carlvanderweyden9527]

Ron, I always love hearing your stories! I was a 1987 hire and retired 7 months ago. Brings back some fun memories of my 36 years with UAL. Keep up the good work and keep those stories coming!!!

[@ronrogers]

Thanks for sharing

[@davidisaacson9543]

Did you keep a diary. All these great hanger flying stories you tell are like they happened yesterday. Your recall is amazing.

[@ronrogers]

I did not keep a diary, but do have lost so pictures that spur the memory.

[@rezamostafid8810]

Thank You Captain for this eye-opener......very instructive and entertaining....

[@ronrogers]

Glad you enjoyed it

[@47colton]

Captain Rogers, everytime you post something like this it brings back forgotten memories. Sometimes I feel like the only guy still here that ( other than the remaining 570 pilots) remembers the first few years after the strike. My wife was in active labor with our first child and some scab flight manager told me i would be fired if I didnt show up for my trip later that evening.

[@planeflyer21]

Thanks, Ron! Suggestion: It would be good to get your opinion as to the "Why" all the aviation world stopped pursuing records of fastest, highest, shortest time to altitude, low altitude speed record, etc. You've touched a bit on Greenameyer's Red Baron. It just seems like it all stopped after the Streak Eagle program.

[@ronrogers]

Good point, but it seems things went from power and speed to stealth and systems. Also, records were getting harder and harder to break.

[@mattp1803]

As a history guy, and pilot, I absolutely love your channel. It’s great listening to your stories, even when you “digress” it’s so good. 👍🏻

[@ronrogers]

I appreciate that!

[@PaulLoveless-Cincinnati]

This was very interesting. Im 35 and have no experience with unions or strikes. I found it to be informative.

[@richardp2240]

Going to a strike with my colleagues right now Ron, great advice. Well done.

[@ronrogers]

Best of luck!

[@davewitter6565]

I remember a story of a respected UAL pilot who played off the Clay Lacy Bible story. When he retired at the mandatory age 60, he marched into the chief pilots office. He claimed while sitting in the outhouse, reading the family bible he was shocked to discover he was actually 99 years old at the time he retired.

[@parkburrets4054]

I’m glad you talked about Clay Lacy

[@Pbairsoftman]

He never mentioned his name! 😉

[@RichardCummins-ni4em]

Another great vid Ron, sounds like that Lacy bloke was right up there with the " Educating Penguins".

[@mamulcahy]

Did you ever read the book The Peter Principle? The basic premise is that in a hierarchical system, people are promoted to their level of incompetence. After 40 years in the corporate world, I can vouch for that!

[@ronrogers]

Sure did, long ago!

[@nickbanas3102]

Real interesting stories. The gate agent story really is incredible!

[@who2u333]

I believe that anyone in aviation in the late 80's were familiar with Clay. He did a bit of self promotion. I was unaware of his history with United however.

[@47colton]

His portrait was posted all over our training center for years. If I recall, UAL lent him a 747 to use to set a round the world flight record Also his charter company took.alot of adverisement air to air pictures I believe..

[@MarcDodsworth-kh3yz]

Bit later than your United pilots strike, we had a pilot strike in Australia which affected both the domestic airlines They don't think they had many if any that crossed the lines but the federal government changed the rules and allowed the international pilots to come in and keep the planes flying. It was surprising move as the country had a Labor (centre-left) government and the the prime minister of the day had come up through the union movement

[@Beensash]

Hawke was an imposter.

[@fjp3305]

"They're home every night with their wives". Well, some pilots wouldn't like that.

[@wiljam1968]

I was based at Clay Lacy Aviation for eight years as a pilot but I was a customer. I didn’t fly for him. Years later I went to work at Lacy’s but by that time Clay had sold the business. When Covid hit, I lost 50% of my pay. The new owners of Lacy’s got the 27mil in PPP money but I didn’t see a dime of it. However, all the non flying managers got their offices rebuilt and the new owners got new houses.

[@w4id676]

Is this the same Lacy whose Lear type rating school was shutdown for fraudulent billing of the government for veterans that used the GI Bill for flight training? Also, the photo of the fellow sitting on the Harley is a good friend of mine and did much to solidify support during the strike.

[@michaelbohlander6711]

Bo is a great guy as is Ed D Great Stories thanks for posting

[@ronrogers]

You bet

[@sharoncassell5273]

Thànks for showing the inside guts of airman structure.

[@jaytowne8016]

I love your sick leave story! Wish I knew the one earlier.

[@mrkc10]

Ha! So Ron let me get this straight. You won’t be inviting Clay over for dinner or to hang out at the lake anytime soon ? 😂 Remember set 570 in the ADF prior to leaving 👍🏻

[@ronrogers]

I met Clay at the SETP president's dinner. I introduced myself as the ALPA representative. Let's say the interaction was cool at best.

[@DaleShipsIt]

Ron, fascinating story. I think you’ve mentioned previously that your Dad was a strong union man as well.

[@ronrogers]

Yes, but not overtly so. More stressing the importance of supporting your fellow workers.

[@wrightmf]

I wonder if an airline company would have 5-stripe pilots instead of chief pilot they would be Pilot Of The Airline like General Of The Army (Eisenhower, Bradley, etc).

[@chuckcarmichael7835]

After 1692, Ron flew the orange, red and blue.

[@MrNoneofthisisreal]

L+oved the colonsoxopy story. I was a smart ass and tried to drive home after the procedure. Frove tight through a stop sign. Demerol is powerful stuff. Ooops.

[@MrNoneofthisisreal]

Loved, colonoscopy, drove. right. Thanks. I feel better now. R

[@michaelgill7248]

At my airline, if we got close to a strike the pilot's motto was "fly the contract". Amazing how much going strictly by the book slowed things down.

[@625shapiro]

We used to call it "Malicious Obedience".

[@47colton]

​@@625shapiro we called it contract 2000

[@Beensash]

Yeah, work to rule.

[@artheriford]

How did the gate agent think the flight was going to leave without the captain? Sadly, as ground handling has gone more and more contract instead of having the airline's employees, the collective brainpower has shrunk even more

[@pongokamerat8601]

Clay, the Lazy scab...

[@johnopalko5223]

Of _course_ you have a bad attitude, Ron! That's what we love about you. Most of the people I highly respect have reputations for having bad attitudes.

[@fleetwin1]

Am hoping to retire at the end of this year, but facing my first strike here at Heckle and Jeckel Airlines. Hoping they send out the strike booklet soon, sure don't want to inadvertently do something stupid if I am in mid sequence when the strike hits. Alot of new FAs these days. My only advice to them has been, don't ever cross the picket line. Being a scab is a career killer for sure. The company will promise you anything if you will come to work, then through you right under the bus afterwards. I remember my first year, I had been flying with a nice crewmember several times, didn't realize she was a scab in 93. Boy, was I "advised" quickly! YIPES!!

[@65gtotrips]

Ron, was it just the Captains who were on strike and not the copilots and flight engineers (if any) ? Or was it anyone in the cockpit ?

[@ronrogers]

No, everyone was on strike.

[@Raptytime]

So the 570 was going to cross the picket line, but the union stopped them?

[@ronrogers]

Not necessarily. But they were brought up to speed on the consequences of crossing a picket line and virtually all decided not to.

[@47colton]

Every 570 pilot I ever flew with were great people. They went through some turmoil in my opinion concerning the 50/75 and seniority..

[@jcheck6]

I was a 570, was well briefed by ALPA and knew the consequences of crossing. Tough decision by many of us that were also hired by our 2nd or 3rd choice airlines but wanted to go with United. It was the old "bird in the hand" thing. I and several others passed on UAL because we had a May 3rd hire date elsewhere and knowing the strike was going to be May 17th we went to the "other" airline. In my case it was the right choice as my airline preserved our pension and through future mergers we all became a NERD, Never Ever Really Delta.

[@2140BlackCreek]

Ron, no matter which airline, it is not very different. Those that cross the picket line are cut from the same cloth; and the management pilots? Well, same tailor. different airline. Except, the UA brown uniforms. Golly those were not "photogenic": LOL

[@jaytowne8016]

At Cobra our agents were always like that!

[@CAPEjkg]

Always thought the mentality of someone who screws up being steered towards management a hilarious notion. Sad that companies still think they can treat their employees like crap for the bottom line. Until they start doing whats right, unions will always have a place. You just want to fly and not be bothered with all the corporate junk. Great topic!

[@PG-ei3ky]

How much extra did Line Check Airman make?

[@ronrogers]

When I was doing it, I don't exactly remember, but it was very little. There were other ways I could make a lot more and at times, being an LCA was hurting my pay. Because of this, many quit of would not become LCAs. I hear now, for the LCPs (change the name to protect the innocent or guilty) the pay is much improved.

[@hobbyelectronics6630]

Your AI pilot has 5 stripes. Is that a management stripe ? What do you think of spin training for private pilot certification ?

[@ronrogers]

That is just the AI and I thought it was rather humorous to have 5 stripes! As far as spin training for PPL, absolutely. None of my students soloed without being able to enter and recover from a spin. Should absolutely be required.

[@jaytowne8016]

Management pilots were known as Seagulls..... You know the rest. Clay is a " special " case I have my own thoughts on him that our much like yours. His business in Lear Jets did some truly dishonest things to young pilots. And that's the best that can be said.

[@ronrogers]

Yes, I had heard that sort of comment.

[@cturdo]

A "normal pilot?" Haha Tell us how you really feel!

[@bobcfi1306]

Unions and scabs. That’s almost as bad as talking religion. But I enjoyed your insights

[@ronrogers]

Yes it is close and I have hesitated a bit on the subject.

[@Beensash]

It's an important part of the industry. I'm glad someone's talking about it.

[@Synergy7Studios]

When it came to treating scabs badly, did you give any consideration to their situation? As in, what if it was a young guy who had his second kid on the way, had just bought his first house, etc? Maybe he really didn't want to cross the picket line but couldn't bear to hurt his family? Was any clemency given to those guys?

[@ronrogers]

Let's see. I had a house and car payment, just came off of furlough with almost no savings. A wife and three small children that I was the sole support. Tell me again how bad the others had it?

[@Synergy7Studios]

@@ronrogers all good man, I was just curious. I've never worked in an industry with a union, and I don't know much about how strikes work and the like, much less how the social interactions around them work. I understand the importance of holding employer's feet to the fire. I recently had to bother HR for months before they finally put my raise through. I just wanted to understand exactly how far you guys take it when you do these strikes. The whole idea is completely new to me. What becomes of strikers that can't afford to continue the strike? Do they usually have to quit and find a different job?

[@airplanes42]

Title is inappropriate. This video is about union issues and ugly labor negotiations, not "management pilots." I've know many large airline management pilots who were wonderful people and loyal union members. They had the ALPA pin on their monkey suit when they had it on during office days. This video was almost painful to listen to, way too much whining. There are many anecdotes where line pilots manipulate the system to their personal benefit, all the anecdotes recounted here were about management pilots manipulating the system, video was way too one sided.

[@Ed-hz2um]

Wow, obsess much? Unbelievably bitter over a labor dispute that happened almost 40 years ago. This will eat you up until you put it behind you. Want to learn what a really hash strike was like? Ask any auto or steel worker. I'm betting that I'll get lots of pushback on this...

[@ronrogers]

Not bitter at all. I sleep very well.