Alien Biosphere Evolution #1: Are Humanoids Plausible?

[@DigGil3]

I don't like humanoid aliens, but a plausible explanation for them existing is the "Wait Equation". Imagine that humans develop a colony space craft towards a another star. This journey takes millennia, if not millions of years. Meanwhile, that's enough time that Earth's civilization develops a better spacecraft that travels much faster. So when the original colony ship arrives at the alien star system they find it already colonized by other human descendants.

[@DushanChaciej]

Huh, I'm actually writing a fantasy (which is actually moreso sci-fi) book with a similar idea behind it.

[@collinfulling3223]

That is one way, it could also be possible through convergent evolution, in a similar fashion to how arthropods frequently take on a crab-like body plan. The human body plan could be a sort of ideal for primate analogous life to reach sapience.

[@tompatterson1548]

@@collinfulling3223 I doubt it. What you need is a way to manipulate objects and a big brain, so a trunk would work too. It doesn't have to come from centaurism.

[@presidenttogekiss635]

I mean, the Xenomorph is a parasite that takes on the characteristics of the host. So I'd pick it.

[@athanasios3019]

That's why it has a human skeleton underneath his exo skeleton

[@johnwicked1132]

Nah i'll chose the lifeform from Darwin4.

[@CarFreeSegnitz]

So how does a xenomorph evolve? An advanced life form evolves to live entirely independently, eating plants & animals in its environment. Then in an encounter with a completely unrelated life form, adapts seamlessly. A different biochemistry which is very likely undigestible, possibly even toxic. Then to not instantly kill the new host to facilitate transmission. Parasites need millions of years of co-evolving with their host. Much longer co-evolution may lead to a symbiotic relationship wherein the host actually benefits, may indeed seek out "infection".

[@presidenttogekiss635]

@@CarFreeSegnitz The Xenomorphs aren't natural animals though. They are genetically engeneered bioweapons (the only good idea in the new movies in my opinion).

[@earthterra8546]

@@johnwicked1132 same

[@2Potates]

I've been having this idea for a scifi novel in wich "aliens" are humanoid because they are decended from human colonists.

[@Phrenotopia]

Go for it! :)

[@OmegaWolf747]

And if they met each other, they wouldn't recognize that they had a common ancestry and might even go to war. Then someone uncovers their distant past, but nobody believes it.

[@armchairrocketscientist4934]

I am writing a sci fi where we discover humans on an exoplanet, and explore the scientific ramifications for how civilization reacts and how our understanding of the universe changes.

[@genghiskhan6809]

@OmegaWolf747 Bruh. I can imagine a general history looking like at one point humanity was so advanced that we spread across the galaxy and due to some unifying force all of these “alien” races end up with a mythology about an ancient race (us) who basically end up serving as their gods with themselves as their only descendants.

[@armchairrocketscientist4934]

@@genghiskhan6809 In my story, an astrobiologist hypothesises that a higher civilization anciently planted its species across many star systems, including us. However, I never affirmitively give an answer.

[@cyanimation1605]

“Or even an exoskeleton, as unappealing as that would be to humans.” Anyone who’s ever played Mass Effect: Can this wait for a bit? I’m in the middle of some procreation.

[@SpaceRaptor510]

I mean turians are fucking hot

[@robertcorbell1006]

Also, he mentioned fur and feathers. A quick trip online can tell you that there's plenty of people who don't find that unappealing in the slightest. ;)

[@The_True_Mx_Pink]

@@robertcorbell1006 As a furry, I can attest.

[@robertcorbell1006]

@@The_True_Mx_Pink Lt. M'Ress is a good example of a pretty kitty. Plus all of /b/ knows by now my thoughts on dear sweet deer.

[@alltoohuman01]

They would have certain similarities but would probably not resemble us. They would presumably have sensory organs to perceive the world around them, manipulator appendages, a form of locomotion, a way of ingesting nutrients and a way of propogating their species. Other than that they would probably be very different, depending on the planet they evolved on.

[@Phrenotopia]

I got you covered there for the video series I'm planning here. Stay tuned! I will try to cover all these aspects.

[@aliensphereoid748]

Agreed! Weather an intelligent being would look like us depends on the planet they hail from. For example, a planet like our own would create aliens that look like us. However, an ocean planet with only small islands for land might have intelligent aliens more adapted for an aquatic life style as i think the human body plan is more for a land based creature and is not the best for swimming through vast global oceans effectively wich a creature living on that kind world would probobly need to do in order to survive. Stopping by small islands to rest or maybe set up shelter at.

[@theapexsurvivor9538]

We can also assume that they either have lots of densely packed manipulation limbs, or something analogues to a hand (likely with a fairly similar shape, e.g. two wide "fingers" and a "thumb", a pair of pincers, etc), or both. This is because it facilitates a wider range of tool use. Basically, it should be able to have a firm grip on a hammer, axe, and knapping stone.

[@t.b.cont.]

It really depends on what’s most efficient for the environment as well as ability to manipulate objects. On earth, it just so happens that being bipedal is a more energy efficient form of locomotion than quadrupedal, which most modern vertebrates are. We needed to be energy efficient in order to put in extra energy into brain development in evolution, aka for a species to become as sentient as we are it has to already be very successful in its environment. We also have symbiotic relationships with various bacteria that many animals also lack, which help us to further break down nutrients in our guts using less energy, humanity isn’t just successful because of our brains. Maybe species on other planets adapted to land by becoming decapods or hexapods, unlike us going the tetrapod route. For those species becoming bipedal would be much more of an endeavour. I can easily see the creature from Darwin IV becoming as sentient as it is because it seems to save a lot of energy by floating in its rather vertically inclined environment, it seems like a pretty successful species The idea of a humanoid shape, however, I feel gets more flack than it deserves. I feel like modern day complete rejection of human shaped aliens feels more like a want to think different than the past rather than something based in fact. I’m not saying that they’d look like us but you cant deny that the body plan worked for us quite tremendously. However we evolved in the wide, flat plains of Africa which required the ability to walk vast distances using little energy. Something that evolved in a completely different environment would most likely have a different body plan. Animals on earth are a great example, in the ocean the smartest animals are orcas, dolphins, and cephalopods. Even animals like pigs and dogs are quite intelligent, and I would consider them as a runner up for most intelligent terrestrial animals on earth excluding primates.

[@TlalocTemporal]

Don't forget corvids. They also have a complex social structure and a contextual language, in addition to tool making.

[@Whatever94-i4u]

Quadrupedal locomotion is MUCH more efficient for basic locomotion, that's why it's so common among many vertebrates (except for theropods, but they had huge and very muscular tails to balance them out), humans just shifted towards bipedalism, because we needed to free our forelimbs (later arms and hands) for tool manipulation. But we had to go through a TON of chances to make it happen efficiently (longer and stronger femurs, wider, stronger hips to support the internal organs while standing upright), so it was not as energy efficient.

[@Rhaenarys]

Theres actually another reason for bipedalism that helped us with becoming more intelligent as a result, and that's the change in how we have sex. Bipedalism allows for the missionary style of sex, which us actually very energy efficient compared to the typical dog style. This method of procreating allowed us to retain energy, which allowed us to do more than other quadrapedic species. I dont think the question is if there would be other intelligent species on the alien planet though. We know dolphins and orcas, and even crows are extremely smart. But they lack the capabilities to manipulate their environments to the same extreme as we do. I may be wrong, but I think that's really the question, if another alien species would be able to be as intelligent or as capable as us without having the basic body structure of upright bipedalism, extremities that allow them to manipulated objects, like fingers, and a thumb, flat foot, and same style of reproduction, which would mean the reproductive cycle would be generally the same, too. Whether or not they look like us is a different story, and more than likely not. But...say the whales never went back in the water and ended up being the top dog of evolution. They'd be similar in the sense of the body structure, while still looking like a possible dog or bear head. Like an anamorphic type of alien I could see being very plausible. But it would still have the basic human shape.

[@Rhaenarys]

@Ethan Kellerman No, Actually....I never said anything otherwise, so not really sure your point? My point wasn't about whether or not whales have land ancestors, but the importance of bipedalism to become like us.

[@plantsanimateddavidinventa871]

Yeah

[@captainstroon1555]

Building a civilization doesn't require a specific bodyplan such as living in the ocean does, which means convergent evolution doesn't apply to intelligent life. Human-like Intelligence requires just a few things: Sensory organs of some kind (best if linked to a brain or an equivalent there of), being capable of communication (physically and mentally), being mobile (which favors bilateral symmetry, especially on land), some kind of extremities to craft and use tools (Hands are not the only option, neither do they have to be two) and some form of social structure (hunting in packs is optimal, but herding or swarmlike behavior might also work). How those reqirements are met, is irrelevant and concidering all the different possibilities and combinations, I can immagine quite a lot of alternatives to our bipedal upright stance.

[@eduardopupucon]

well, most of the academia has a consensus that at least bilateral symmetry is favoured by natural selection for locomotion in land, one evidence for that are sea cucumbers, which are part of the echinoderm phylum which demonstrates pentaradial symmetry.

[@eduardopupucon]

sorry for my bad english by the way, english isn't my first language.

[@martijnvanweele6204]

True, but there are other benefits to the human posture. For instance, we have almost unrivaled stamina thanks in part to our upright method of locomotion, placing us among the most effective predators in the animal kingdom. It makes some sense for a creature like a Yautja to have a similar body plan.

[@captainstroon1555]

@@martijnvanweele6204 We have almost infinite stamina because of our sweat glands. But yes, running on two legs requires less energy than on four or more. On the other hand, standing on two legs does require more energy. But intelligence doesn't require its owner to be bipedal. Second place on earth are dolphins, and they don't have any legs. Granted their aquatic body plan prevents them from developing an advanced civilisation, but my point is, a creature doesn't need to be humanoid to be intelligent.

[@wastelesslearning1245]

I mean you can but would it be the most efficient and their for more likely outcome idk? Like I guess you could have a hiper intelligent sea cucumber that used it’s anus guts to slowly gather materials and armor and grind super hard to acquire wieldable weaponry (no spear, bow, sling): even daggers would have increase drag and with low strength noodles ass arms I guess it’s better then nothing. Their saving grace would be gathering poisons to tip There pointy weapons or it would probably be poison spiked armor cause sight due to coming form a line where moving and reaction isn’t a thing their eyes would likely got vestigial . Also increase drag forces from under water decrease efficiency of mechines and good luck refining materials under water without fire or bodies adapted to high pressure and heat where poison spewing thermal vents are located . I guess they could attempt a ten foot poll strategy where they collectively push; doubtful but may promote hive mind that forms a collective body where the “cells” or more cucumbers. Like an underwater version of the hunters from the halo video game. An above ocean sea cucumber would not fare much better. But I like this idea a lot actually; a race of Pickle Rick aliens XD

[@wires-sl7gs]

Actually the humans in Star wars are actually from earth, from what you can find in the lore a super intelligent AI takes over earth, the humans escape using a ship that somehow ends up sending them far into the past(Idk the details, been a while sense I watched the videos) and restarting civilization, though not before being enslaved by a alien race. basically a bunch of space-time hi-jinix (Reposted Comment from first reupload)

[@Phrenotopia]

Yes, I heard of this lore (was it in a comic?), but didn't want to dig to deep into it. That may be a subject of another video, although I saw that Trey the Explainer may already have covered this.

[@Phrenotopia]

Hmmm, no, he made an attempt to explain all humanoid aliens in SW that I have some issues with.

[@tambal40]

@@Phrenotopia it's not really canon

[@presidenttogekiss635]

I'd always tought the reason the aliens in SW looked like humans was a mixture of being descendent from humans (like Darth Maul and the Zebraks) and the FORCE doing its thing.

[@jackrutledgegoembel5896]

@@presidenttogekiss635 Yeah

[@hammerofpraxis9646]

This was really interesting! Personally, I feel like Mass Effect does a reallt good job of showcasing intelligent alien species and how they differ from us, from the almost humanoid Asari, the birdlike Turians, the elephantine Elcor and the cephalopod-like Hanar

[@Rokkoasas]

TheBestKindOfRaptor 77 I was just thinking the same thing! Mass Effect does good job, most races keep the hand/feet/upright category but none seem like a "copy" (maybe the asari or quarians, a bit). I'll take a krogan, turian, batarian, salarian, rachni and prothean any day as a realistic alien.

[@Phrenotopia]

I don't know much about Mass Effect, but now you make me wanna check it out and perhaps do a video on it.

[@Rokkoasas]

If you're into scifi, you should totally give it a go, it's an experience!

[@KlavierMenn]

@@Rokkoasas I think reptilian/amphibian/arthropod sentients should be more common than 'mammalian' or even 'synapsid' sentients. If life aways rise from the sea, the first animals to able out to the land will aways be some kind of 'fishapod' i. e a four limbed fish OR an arthropod with a shell to protect it from the blazing sun, and so, have more time to evolve into sentience. Using Mass Effect lore as an example: Tuchanka, homeworld of the Krogan was an 'evolutionary crucible' which life fed upon life, powered by Aralahk a F-Class star (To put in perspective, Sol, a G-Class star is PUNY compared to Aralahk ) until a PREY ( The side facing eyes, hump and slight hunched stance, as if they are ready to sprint off are a dead giveaway ) gained enough sentience to start fighting back and shaping the world where they were born. That lush world, however died when the Krogan discovered that fissing as atom was possible and started to fling nukes at eachother.

[@ferencgazdag1406]

There is a problem percieving the Asari, because all species in the Mass Effect universe see them quite similar to themselves. It could be because their interesting reproduction.

[@petersmythe6462]

I think "soft humanoid" might be very common indeed especially on worlds similar to Earth. Especially if we are artificially restricting our search to societies capable of at least reaching orbit of their own world.

[@petersmythe6462]

But hard humanoids like Vulcans are probably vanishingly rare. And the specific details are likely not similar.

[@Patchuchan]

Maybe as it would likely have to live on land to eventually build a rocket and get into the space though an intelligent alien just needs to have a body plan to puts high resolution eyes near it's brain and dexterous appendages that allow it to be able to carry tools while it walks or flies. I read a book called Foot Fall where creatures that look like small elephants try to invade the Earth and saw some very creative crab like aliens in a Dust video called Good Business.

[@ekszentrik]

4:00 in an infinite universe, the likelihood of a perfect analogue of humans existing in a far away galaxy is approaching 1.

[@sienielain9222]

But not 100%

[@alexsgamingshow2474]

If we ever encountered a "humanoid" extraterrestrial species it would probably something close to the Xenomorph, being a hostile animalistic species.

[@eduardwiebe3737]

Maybe the humanoid aliens are descendants of Humans which have been Isekai-ed

[@mattmorehouse9685]

I've heard that a four legged body plan is at least somewhat plausible, simply because bilateral symmetry helps with efficient locomotion and more legs mean more resources that are used, so you might as well go with the smaller number to save on energy. With four legs, I could see it being plausible that other species would evolve to grasp branches or objects and this could set them on a path towards larger brains, more complex social groups etc. That and, in active animals the sense organs would generally be clustered around the part going forward, so that the animal doesn't have to back into everything, and they can process information quickly. So I'd say the idea of a two legged, two armed body plan, with a head at the front end is not implausible. The idea that these creatures would mimic Earth physiology with the exception of pointy ears is... less likely.

[@jamesd5366]

I've always just assumed that humans in Star Wars are humans from our time in the Milky Way that went through a wormhole or something.

[@jefferyandbob3137]

I think a big thing people need to consider is that the only example of land animals like us are from fish that then later added on limbs. And on this planet most animals have 6 legs, not 4. Hell, the octopus is pretty good proof you don’t need a vertebrate body plan to be intelligent, let alone specifically a human body plan.

[@Phrenotopia]

Good points! It's clear there are many highly sentient species on Earth already, like octopuses and also corvids. However, these have been around and in that state many millions of years longer than humans. What would it take for a high-end sentient creature to become sapient is the big question.

[@nerdywolverine8640]

About Star Wars: theres a theory that that framing of long ago and far away could be a retelling from a droid such as R2D2, meaning it might not necessarily be that in relation to us now, and could theoretically be set in our future.

[@hanvitlee6346]

The probability calculation of DNA base pairs at the start is incorrect, but the point of the video still stands.

[@Phrenotopia]

I was waiting for someone to spot it for quite some time after I discovered that little slip-up myself. Good find! :)

[@silvertheelf]

The 2 most plausible are the xenomorph and the last alien because they are the least human of all of them. Oh! I consider humanoid forms to human to be alien because they look similar.

[@MisterSketch4]

the last alien is an eosapien from the amazing book, 'Expedition' by Wayne Barlowe

[@vogonp4287]

I think that they would be more insect like.

[@willoliver9036]

Realistically it depends on the environmental pressures

[@Patchuchan]

Perfect humans are unlikely but something vaguely similar might be possible due to convergent evolution like how bats and birds are similar though they have a common ancestor. I do expect intelligent aliens to have a head containing a mouth and sense organs such as insect still have this plan and some cephalopods have eyes remarkably similar to vertebrate eyes.

[@danielbickford3458]

I've actually thought about what it would take to have a sentient alien life form. So far what I've got is you need some way to be mobile. Feet tentacles Wings it doesn't matter. You just have to be able to move, you don't have to move fast, you don't have to move far but you do have to be able to move. You need some sort of manipulators. A trunk, hams, tentacles, psychokinesis, you just need to be able to manipulate Tools in some manner. You need some way how to perceive your environment. Sight hearing echolocation electrosense all our options and all would work quite well. Generally speaking any advanced alien societies would be based off something that starts off in groups. Packs, schools, herds all would be viable options. In order to progress in technology faster you need to be able to cooperate. And well sure you could have a sufficiently advanced society that are based solely on immediate family groups each one passing their knowledge on to their direct descendants and direct family members you would need several times the timescales to reach the same Tech levels as someone who is willing to teach someone not related to them. Other than that anything's fair game. Are they made out of carbon or silicon? Do they breathe oxygen or methane? There are nearly infinite ways to design an alien

[@Pragmatarian]

Human bodies aren't optimized for flying, running or swimming... they are optimized for carrying. We are physically the best at simultaneously allocating a wide variety of resources over greater distances. Our ancestors were frequently confronted with difficult allocative problems, which they weren't equally good at solving. Better allocators were more reproductively successful and voila! We are so smart. Our bodies are exceptionally allocative, our brains our exceptionally powerful, and this really isn't a coincidence. When other animals migrate it's not like they first have to decide what they'll take with them. They don't have to make a packing list. It was a very different story with our ancestors. Their ability to simultaneously carry many resources... food, water, weapons, tools... was incredibly advantageous, but it also meant having to make difficult decisions. Imagine that you're going to be among the first people to move to Mars. What do you take with you? If you forget something important it's not like you can just visit Home Depot. But you sure can't take everything that you want... so you have to ruthlessly prioritize. Correctly discerning what's truly important depends on accessing and processing lots of information. If there are any smart aliens, then chances are really good that they'll be, or used to be, humanoid. In their past they must have had to frequently make difficult allocation decisions, which would entirely depend on their bodies being exceptionally allocative, like ours. Before you can correctly figure out the chances that sentient aliens are humanoid, you first need to correctly figure out why we are sentient. As far as I can tell, we are sentient because we are humanoid. There are certainly other theories for our sentience, such as cooking food and living in large groups, but none of them have even recognized the fact that our species is both exceptionally allocative and intelligent.

[@flightlesslord2688]

Dolphins have bigger brains relative to body size and cephalopods are much more dexterous than we are

[@mykalkelley8315]

LordOfThe Flightless dolphins arent exactly smarter than us, so brain size isn't exactly what makes something intelligent, rather its how densely packed the neurons are..... And octopods get exausted easily despite their dextrous nature

[@flightlesslord2688]

@@mykalkelley8315 so crows are ridiculously smart? Their brains are denser than ours and are about the same relative to body size. And my dolphin friend says fuck you

[@stevebisset1522]

Star wars is set in the future IMO. The "long time ago in a galaxy far, far away" thing is just a fantasy staple. So yea, they are human.

[@PeterAuto1]

I think an "advanced" Alien species would only need 3 things. A way to interact with things, a way to observe things and a way to communicate. For Observable skills is only a basic level enough but the other two things are really important.

[@DogFoxHybrid]

I don't think it's likely for aliens to look almost exactly humans, but not that unlikely to have a generally human-like shape:

[@FromNothing]

Great video, as usual a very well thought out, analytical, and intelligent break down.

[@Phrenotopia]

Thanks, buddy!

[@lelduck6388]

Human’s view of aliens says more about them then the actual aliens most of the time.

[@Rhaenarys]

That's because we only have ourselves and our own evolution compared to everything else on our planet to compare by. When you look at how we evolved this way, it seems reasonable that an alien species of equal comparison would have at least the same body shape, as that is what made us the way we are, as far as we can see in our own evolution tree.

[@adamsmith13real]

In Star Trek lore, a humanoid alien race was what seeded most of the galaxy in the first place (billions of years earlier). This was specifically done to make intelligent beings who look like them.

[@XSilver_WaterX]

But it was shuch a poor execution of the concept, "Hey kids! I'm your all-humanoid mom and I want all of you to be happy and co-operative." Just wth was with that episode? It would be more believable if humanity created those races and abandoned the responsibility and memories to being parents of countless created races.

[@parallaxnick637]

Great video! Can't wait for the rest of the series! Not sure I agree with your final assessment though. Besides our fellow anthropoids, we have many sentient species on our planet (defined as passing the mirror test); elephants, cetaceans, corvids, parrots, even pigs. Clearly being sentient is not enough to rise above and control nature. And it's also clear that we developed our body plan a long time before our brains got big. So clearly our level of sentience is being constrained by our body plan. The question is, by how much?

[@Phrenotopia]

Thanks! You make some very good foodnotes that I had to leave out. Indeed, "sentient" is a tricky term. I use it the way they do in science fiction, so not merely consciously intelligent, like the creatures you mention, but able to communicate and develop culture+technology at the level of human beings and their scale of control of nature.

[@cormacb2326]

You forgot octopuses.

[@TiagoH1710]

@@Phrenotopia a better way to call human-level intelligence may be “sapient” or “sophont”

[@Zhranzagul]

Another amazing upload! Love this subject.

[@Phrenotopia]

Great to hear you're still around! Still waiting for those 1 million subscribers you promised. ;-) :-P

[@Zhranzagul]

Yeah my dude, you gotta work for those. :P Take it at your pace however, Il'd much rather have occassional uploads than a burned out youtuber

[@Phrenotopia]

Well, did experience a burnout over a month ago, but that was in relation to my day-job, making me even more determined to become a fulltime KZbinr. I've planned to put out more regular content the coming time. Cheers!

[@OmegaWolf747]

I think the diversity of life "out there" is beyond our comprehension.

[@pauljs75]

Thing is that most mammals have pretty much the same architecture as rodents which are still among those closest to the proto-mammal species. So even though we consider the evolutionary tree, and ourselves closest to and within the branch of primates, some alien species (perhaps insectoid) would likely regard us as some form of "giant rats" without as much consideration of all the other distinctive features. Also one would have to keep in mind convergent evolution, since some traits still come up in non-related species because of the utility they present. Things like horns or antlers aren't just on hoofed mammals, but also on insects, etc. So bi-pedal, forward facing stereo-vision, and at least one free pair of dexterous manipulating limbs are things that would be likely traits on any other possible technological species if we chance to come across them.

[@FreebirthBoccara]

Evolution is all about efficiency. If a species evolved on land you would expect four limbs since that is the least number of limbs that enables movement while remaining stable (one limb moving while three others keep it stable). Light sensing organs are very early evolutionary traits and are seen in extremely simple organisms that eventually develop into eyes. Two eyes is the most efficient use of resources since it gives you depth perception and more isn't particular advantage . (hence why we don't often see more than two eyes other than very rare cases of vestigial light sensing organs on some invertebrates from previous stages of growth) one head with those eyes near its brain makes sense as the brain and light sensing organs are almost always seen developing physically close to each other. So now you have something with 4 limbs, a head and two eyes. .. If its walking upright its humanoid. Though theoretically the location if those limbs and head could be basically anywhere on a torso as long as it makes sense from a developmental standpoint of how the body grows from whatever gestation it had.

[@MrVTom07]

I have to say I'm always amazed of how interesting your videos are.

[@dplocksmith91]

I personally don't take the "A Long Time Ago in a Galaxy Far, Far Away" bit from Star Wars literal. Star Wars obviously takes place in a different universe with slightly different laws of physics that allow for faster than light travel, antigravity, and psychic powers, so for all we know, the "Humans" in Star Wars are Homo sapiens genetically identical to the ones in our universe, and the planet they evolved on, Coruscant, is their equivalent of Earth (or was, before it became a city planet).

[@IgorTryp]

Convergent evolution often results in similar solutions for the same problem. Unless someone can imagine alternative designs that work as well as the humanoid design, all intelligent life may look like us.

[@Phrenotopia]

Well, I am that someone, as you will see on this channel. :-)

[@aliensphereoid748]

As for imagining alternate designs, i am verry much capable of that And actually have a reason for why they are not humanoid. I explained that in another reply somewhere here. But in a nutshell, the planet they inhabit is 90% covered by oceans or just one ocean since theres no large continents to break the oceans up. And therefor the creature has a more seal like design. But even saying "seal like" is not exactly on the spot as its part of a much larger family of creatures whom i called "sea coronas". Basicly, imagine a sphere or a cigar shaped body with 20 different limbs on it. Depending on the species of sea corona each limb could do different things. For example one sea corona species might have all its limbs as just fins and just swims aimlessly through the ocean feeding on organic debries while another species might use some of its limbs for crawling around on the sea floor picking up things it finds with other limbs and consumes them with a limb modified to be an extendable mouth piece. And the intelligent being i designed is basicly the most complex of these. It has 2 different heads, one for consuming prey and one for seeing and sensing. 6 other limbs were modified to be seal like fins/legs for crawling on the shores of small islands and 2 other limbs were modified to have different fingers at the end of them wich can be used like a human hand to grab stuffs and make tools. The rest are just fins designed to propell and steer the creature through water at high speeds. To be more effective at that it can also flush itself out making it more streamlined while swimming. I would be verry happy if i can get some feedback on this.

[@Phrenotopia]

Account D You are right that the environment influences what a creature ends up looking like. I would add to that, also to counter what IgorTryp wrote, that even similar environments will not inevitably lead to a humanoid body. Or at least: There is no reason to think that. The human body shape is the result of a long and flakey evolutionary history. I really like your proposed sea creatures. You're on the right track by thinking of a basic body plan to make variations upon. Would these creatures be living on the Ocean Planet of Proxima B that I proposed in another of my videos? In that case, you could imagine what would happen if they adapted to living on the terra firma provided by floating reefs. Perhaps 1, 2 or 3 pairs of limbs would be freed up to carry and manipulate stuff, while the rest remain for walking. You have to remember that any technological being would have to be land-living in order to master the use of fire and onwards. Thanks for sharing your ideas!

[@aliensphereoid748]

Thanks for the reply! As for you'r questions, No, i am not really thinking about making them live on Proxima b. But rather another Red dwarf System known as, Gliese 445. We did not discover any planets around there wich will allow me to create my own solar System around it. Wich will consist of the ocean planet complete with both floater AND volcanic islands being in a binary pair with another terestrial planet and becouse they'll orbit each other relatively close, That'll mean that not only will they be tidally locked to each other instead of the star, thereby creating a day/night cycle but will also allow for a powerfull magnetosphere. Wich is definetly a pluss for life! And i chose this star becouse This star (if my soursces are correct) will be the star the Voyager 1 probe will pass by after a long, LONG trip through interstellar space. But it will not get too close. it'll only pass by within a distance of around 1 light year. wich is still pretty far. And if it wasn't obvious from where they'll be located at, i'll tell you why i'm putting them there. Becouse i'll actually want to write a story about these guys. I haven't really completed the story and its direction but so far what i've gotten down is that when Voyager 1 reaches the System it'll encounter a near by rogue planet wich will re direct it dead towards the inner solar System of Gliese 445 (i know its a little too conveniant and probobly barely has any chance of happening but otherwise i don't think i could make our aliens capture it) So anyways, after discovering the probe the sentient sea coronas will abduct the probe and do all kinds of reshearch on it and will discover the location of our solar system through trial and error and a lot of misconceptions. They decide that they will send a 1 way small team of theirs to our solar system using a make shift alcubierre drive (their first one infact). And the rest is either spoilers or incompleted story ideas. But Speaking of sentient sea coronas, i've already got a land dwelling, tool using race of them. I've allready described them in detail in my previous reply and have made a few sketches of them. Their designs might be a little too complex but hey, gotta stick to my body plan! Wich brings me to my own question. Do you happen to know a storry writing site where i'll be able to post my story? Thanks in advance!

[@Phrenotopia]

I think you have a great imagination and some good material for a story, so I urge you to keep on working on it. I myself am not so much into story writing and wouldn't know any good sites. However, there is deviantart that, even though it's mainly about illustrations and art, would also lend itself fine to illustrated novels. Good luck with your story!

[@armchairrocketscientist4934]

Answer to question at the start. #6 - All intelligent species in the universe are humans with the exact same biochemistry, structure, and appearance as us.

[@eliasE989]

Nice video! Bipedalism with a head on top of the body (like humans) is convenient for a big-brained species. Big brains and a protective skull are heavy, so it would be a waste of energy to hang it like for example a dog does. Still, for me it doesn't sound beliavable that humanoid body plan would be the only way for intelligent species in the whole universe. Jonathan Losos' book Improbable destinies: How predictable is evolution has some thoughts on this subject and about convergent evolution.

[@creditsunknown7974]

*laughs in octopus*

[@notoriousgoblin83]

I think that, just due to their frequency, these 3 things should be present in most advanced terrestrial life, in conditions similar to our own. 1) some form of head, or other sensory organ cluster. This is found in all but the most primitive creatures, due to the benefits of clustering sensory organs together, especially near the mouth. Also to the front of the body 2) some form of legs, or leg. Legs are highly useful for moving, and it takes a lot of specialisation to move effectively without them. Also, unless you're on a low gravity planet, some kind of limb to hold the bodies' weight will be useful for large creatures that want to move at any rate, since using the entire body is very slow at large sizes. Third, some kind of grasping appendage, or other way of manipulating objects, but since arms evolve readily from legs they are ideal. You could use elaborate mouthparts too perhaps, or something else. Tldr: Intellegent life needs 3 things: some kind of head so they can see, hear and whatever other senses they have well. 2) legs or some way of moving fast, if they are human sized this will likely be some kind of leg 3) something that does what hands do, allowing for tool use and creation of more things

[@T.R.A.I.N.I.N.G.]

make a video on alternative biochemistry and also one on plausible and interesting non-humnaoid forms that sapient aliens can have. great and interesting video.

[@Phrenotopia]

Thanks! I will eventually end up at those topics if all goes well.

[@BensLab]

Great video Fedor! Well worth the wait!

[@idle_speculation]

I quite like Doctor Who’s explanation for human aliens. The Time Lords came first, then were so enamored of their own form that they released a genetic virus into the universe that caused humanoid body shapes to keep evolving on distant planets.

[@rikuurufu5534]

"Plausible" and "Probable" are entirely different matters. If humanoid life were implausible, we would not exist. Whether our body plan is common among sentient life forms is another matter.

[@collinfulling3223]

I think the human body plan might be somewhat common among alien sapient life. It’s probably the ideal body type for either plains dwelling or primate analogous species to develop sapience, and converge into a humanoid shape similar to how multiple clades have convergently evolved into a crab-like body plan

[@penroc3]

glade to see some wayne barlow, i like his hellscapes better for viewing personally

[@flightlesslord2688]

In Star Wars theres 2 possible non-cannon origins, 1 convergent evolution, 2 a colony ship in the future goes through a wormhole and boom, your in a long time ago in a galaxy far far away. And considering some of the actual aliens in Star Wars were Halloween masks, normal humans makes alot of sense. And Avatar used motion capture, the other creatures are alot more speculative despite evolving very convergently with humans. And xenomorphs look humanoid because they take in human DNA, and also budget, and... their design isn't far fetched for a vertabrate like alien.

[@-ElysianEcho-]

Haven’t watched the video yet, but i wanted to drop my two cents on something I think, while it’s like not the most common body plan for potential intelligent life, i do think we would see it be a common one for intelligent quadrapeds as high intelligence as ours only is useful if you can manipulate the environment efficiently, which you need grasping limbs for like hands/tentacles/advanced prehensile tail Since you need to see what you are doing while manipulating items too, i feel it makes most sense for the front limbs in a quadraped to be modified to be the main if not sole manipulation limbs, this would probably make them sensitive and precise compared to their original use, meaning you’d likely want to keep them away from the work that would just be a waste of these biological tools, meaning you’d likely see the creature gradually convert to a bipedal gait, so, while they’d likely be very different too, i do think the idea that our body plan has some clear advantages for an intelligent animal has some merit

[@Phrenotopia]

Why yes, departing from a tetrapod bodyplan, a humanoid form is not an unlikely option, if not a likely one for a technological species. So the real question is: How likely is a tetrapod bodyplan? :-) I hope to answer this in upcoming videos.

[@ferencgazdag1406]

Humans didn't adopt bipedality only for tool use. It was a much more basic need: to see over tall grass. Obviously, it can't be said exatly, but i probably expect aliens to be shorter (like dwarwes), if bipedal at all, because the only pressure was for grasping limbs, and not for height, while for humans it was both.

[@ferencgazdag1406]

@@Phrenotopia Well, i think it depends on the likelyhood of limb loss. If you fix one distance from the ground (unipedal), then you can move along a sphere, so you will fall over. If you fix the distance from another point on the ground (bipedal), you can move along a circle, so you will still fall. If, however you add the third leg (tripedal), you can exist in two points on opposite sides of your triangle of legs, so you are stable, but once you lift one of your legs, you will be bipedal, and fall, so you need another leg (quadropedal). Of course, humans don't fall because we have complex balancing organs, and a sophisticated central nervous system, what i don't really expect in times when limbs are just forming, and the organism is still simple. The addition, and usefullness of any further legs can be justified with frequent limb loss, or segmentation, but it will not be seen in intelligent life, they don't lose limbs because their tool use, and they probably overcame side-effects of segmentation, because they had a lot of evolutionary pressure to force them into tool use.

[@-ElysianEcho-]

@@ferencgazdag1406 good point, it will depend entirely on their environment of course, other factors that could lead to height would be things like low gravity, evolving from a niche that focuses on getting fruit from tall trees, or even something we have trouble imagining, as well as aesthetic mate selection, since it's literally alien to us, it's pretty hard to say much for certain

[@TiagoH1710]

@@-ElysianEcho- we got our chin from sexual selection, so…

[@michaelhofmann6443]

You're great! Keep going!

[@abnormallylargefrog565]

The one with the club you showed o the quiz part was from a documentary envolving 2 probes that land on a planet called Darwib IV and their mission is to study planets surface and its enviorment.

[@sergeantsonso3490]

not common, or plausible, but still POSSIBLE. which is an encouraging thought.

[@chasingcheetahs5017]

Late response but humanoids are the perfect red herring for episodic spec evo series (Dylan Bajda's website Serina: A Natural History of the World of Birds has a similar thing where the bludgebird is hyped up to be the sapient species, having a method of manipulation (their tentacled beak), a posture somewhat similar to a hunched over human and it is even shown wielding a club, but in actuality it isn't the sapient species. Another example being Biblaridion's Alien Biosphers with the Tanybrachids, which while not humanoids were very ape-like, and were the 5th creature shown in the episode to go completely extinct due to being so over reliant on brachiation for movement that they could not survive at ground level.) Random trivia: the grey archetype of aliens may have originated in the 1890s novel The War of the Worlds, as livestock that the octopus-like sapient Martians farmed.

[@mr.cat_cz5184]

I imagine aliens as beings that have organs that allow them to develop their insights. So: hands, tentacles, claws, special fins or even branched tail and tongue. I also got a blob that can change the shape of the body to create technology.

[@kern-on-dee-cob1562]

In Star Wars the “long long time ago” is simply a misconception it actually takes place in the future

[@trekpac2]

I’d like to see you develop this further! For instance, creatures on other planets likely carbon-based; focused on harnessing oxygen; moving to land where efficiency of using oxygen goes up 10 times; mobility favourable to use of how many limbs; structure evolving such as visual systems, brain, nervous system, muscles. A great topic to look at further, and you have such good skills to collate ideas on the subject.

[@Phrenotopia]

Thank you! :)) I am working on a revisal video on this one. Stay tuned and watch the rest of the Alien Biosphere Series in the meantime!

[@trekpac2]

@@Phrenotopiayes, I will.

[@TheCockeyez]

I think both are possible. Humanoid aliens could simply be genetically altered humans in the future.

[@martijnvanweele6204]

I find relatability perhaps the weakest argument for humanoid aliens in fiction. Remember the time we related to a little cuboid robot with a four-word vocabulary? As Pixar demonstrated in the making of Wall-E, really all you need in order to get your audience to relate to a creature (or robot, as the case may be) is eyes that can mimic human expressions. Inversely, no matter how human you make a creature, simply a lack of eyes can be enough to remove any relatability, crossing over into the uncanny valley or straight-up horror. Think, for instance, of the Xenomorph. Contrary to its name, it is actually relatively humanoid, but it lacks eyes, making it significantly more scary. Or think of the Pale Man from Pan's Labyrinth...

[@artembaguinski9946]

The probability that we're a very rare kind of intelligent life is very low, most probably we're among the most common kinds of intelligent life. Hence most intelligent life forms are probably similar to us.

[@Williamfuchs420]

In old cannon star wars the humans in the star wars Galaxy are actually the descendants of Humans from Earth a future colony ship that left Earth fell through a rip in time and found themselves back in time where they are found by a native race of enslavers and proceeded to become a major race of this ancient galaxy

[@joshou3759]

None of them since it would be more accurate if they had fur or feathers, and they can’t exist as an underwater or partially underwater creature as you need fire to advance technologically. Flying creatures, maybe but they’d have to have thumbs and at least 4 limbs to actually grab stuff and need to stay on the ground for long enough to gather resources to make fire and keep it going and build stuff but that would mean you’d not be flying a whole lot. So it would have to be standing upright all the time or has the ability to stand upright for long, have thumbs, be on the ground, and not go in the water for it to survive. So it has to either be mammalian, humanoid, or have feathers but stay on the ground like the dinosaurs.

[@Phrenotopia]

Well, we'll see in my upcoming videos. :-) You guessed right that none them were more plausible than the others, but for different reasons.

[@thejurassicwarewolf3300]

i am sensing a STRONG humanoid bias coming from this one

[@wasserruebenvergilbungsvirus]

@@thejurassicwarewolf3300 Maybe because humanoid is the only form we can be certain of being compatible with intelligence. From our current knowledge, concluding that intelligent life is likely *less* humanoid would be illogical.

[@QuarkGamingLLC]

It never makes sense to me why some people outright hate humanoid aliens. Yeah, it gets a bit boring when it’s just humans in hats and/or face paint, but it’s highly possible aliens do look like us. Likewise, science has shown us many life forms(for example, squids)have a body plan that is as good as our own for the development of civilization. The chance for aliens to look NOTHING like us is as high as the chance for aliens to look EXACTLY like us. I.E: Non-humanoids=humanoids

[@chrisbrownie1511]

Thank you said somebody finally said it 💯👏👏

[@EnderGrimm]

There is also a high chance of some form of head like structure since it makes logical sense to have to sensing organs by the mouth.

[@davidmurphy563]

What a fascinating series, please keep it up. You forgot to mention panspermia. You also constrained yourself to unicellular animal life. There may also chemical processes found on planets which may qualify for some, but not all, the definitions of life. Also, it might be worth covering the principle of mediocrity and discussing what is the 'mean life' on Earth. Finally, you can talk about what conditions life may be found in - eg Europa analogues - and seeing how that might constrain options / drive evolution. Thanks for your hard work, I thoroughly enjoyed it.

[@Phrenotopia]

You're absolutely right, of course! There are so many aspects to this to fill a several hours long video. I will try to do it in separate videos along the way. Thanks for the compliments! They really do mean a lot!

[@clickpause8732]

Well a simple distinct difference you could have for humans is gravity. Lower gravity equals tall, higher gravity equals small. Higher gravity also would increase relative strength, and the larger size of the planet would mean larger population. So you'd have a planet of weak, tall giants with small population on low gravity and literal dwarves on the high gravity.

[@DapperDinosaur]

3 is the one I picked as most plausible, just because the lighter than air idea from Darwin IV is physically suspect to me.

[@jgr7487]

Convergent Evolution?

[@NeoMetalSoniclordglitch]

the independent evolution of similar features in species of different periods or ephos in time line animalwise.files.wordpress.com/2011/09/convergent-evolution-marine-all-about-reptiles-com.gif

[@franciscoalejandro7567]

It's when two different species develop a similar adaptation independently.

[@jgr7487]

it's not a question, it's an answer to the question proposed by the video

[@franciscoalejandro7567]

@@jgr7487 Oh, I see. Since the video already mentions convergent evolution, we assumed you were asking what it was.

[@Dell-ol6hb]

The xenomorphs and the Darwin IV intelligent aliens are the most realistic to me out of the options shown. This is because the xenomorphs are just a parasitic life form that steals the dna of its host to create its adult form which is why most of the xenomorphs shown in the movies are a bit human looking it’s because they were hijacking humans. Some microscopic organisms already do this DNA stealing thing to reproduce so it isn’t that implausible for the same thing to happen on a macroscopic scale as with the xenomorphs. The Darwin IV intelligent aliens are also realistic to me in that they are so divergent from humans yet they have all the things that as far as we know are necessary for intelligent life and they have a clear evolutionary history on the planet sharing the same jet locomotion that many of the animals on the planet have.

[@Phrenotopia]

I agree with something as non-humanoid as Eosapiens seeming the most plausible. With regards to the Xenomorph hijacking its host's DNA, that is actually highly unlikely as I explain more generally in the video. Genetic material can be vastly different between worlds, unless - of course - Panspermia is the thing.

[@wasserruebenvergilbungsvirus]

How are they realistic? How do they even fly without any sort of (visible) propulsion through wings or similar structures? Less human does not mean more plausible.

[@Dell-ol6hb]

Phrenotopia oh true I hadn’t thought about that, I guess it’s able to happen with certain micro organisms on Earth because they are closely related enough and they aren’t very “complex”

[@Dell-ol6hb]

Wasserrübenvergilbungsvirus well I haven’t seen the Darwin IV doc in years but if I remember correctly they do have a visible system of propulsion I’m not sure of the exact mechanics of it, but perhaps the Darwin IV atmosphere is dense enough to allow for jet propulsion similar to the kind we see on Earth with Squids and various other cephalopods. Again I’m not a physicists so I’m unsure but it doesn’t that out of the range of possibly unless we are to assume that life can only exist with Earth like conditions which Darwin IV most certainly lacks.

[@pheephanatic]

Probably most common would be single celled creatures, or ceolenterates, or echinoderms, annelids..etc.

[@pheephanatic]

They would still be really cool though.

[@lexibyday9504]

The humanoid form came from a quadrupedal ancestor that adapted to a life of climbing and then was forced to adapt to a life on flat ground. If humans had evolved in litterally any other environment or from any other ancestor they'd be different. A humanoid will only result from a climbing quadruped forced onto flat ground. if the ancestor was hexapedal in the same situation they'd just use the front limbs as ams and be done with it. if the ancestor was a tripod the rolling through the trees motion I imagine it would have used would be kept on the ground and all three limbs would be hands. if we don't take the animal out of the trees than it's just a quadruped in a tree. if we never put it in the tree then it's just a quadruped on the ground. the process for creating a biped is statistically unlikely to repeat even if statistics dont matter to the genetics.

[@Phrenotopia]

Hush! You're getting way ahead of me!!! ;-)

[@lexibyday9504]

@@Phrenotopia sorry it's just that's probably THE most important argument against humanoid aliens. The fact that there's only one sequence of events likely to result in a humanoid. Unless the moncalamari evolved for climbing coral before being forced to adapt to swimming I see no reason they'd be humanoids.

[@JellyAntz]

i think that the humanoid will evolve from a quadruped without a tail. with a long tail it would be like a theropod dinosaur

[@complex314i]

The only humanoid aliens that don't bother me are those related to us like Nietzscheans (Andromeda) and Jaffa (Stargate) as both are genetically modified humans. My personal favorite are the Kromaggs (Sliders) as they are a hominid species, just not human. Nietzscheans & J from Andromeda as they are genetically engineared humans. Jaffa from Stargate as they are also modified humans. A favorite hu

[@Checkmate07351]

Funny enough halo actually gives an in universe explanation to why all aliens have a humanoid form.

[@jackalnerf6230]

Time and interdimentional travel is possible in Star Wars, probably how humans got there.

[@T4N7]

Tho I agree with ur point, about the Star Wars question, "wut r the odds of a race looking exactly like humans somewhere out there in the universe?" Well technically they r 100% simply cuz the universe is infinite n everything that can happen will happen n statistically it's impossible for there to not be an identical Earth with identical people. But th weird part is that everyone of different races look human shaped within the same galaxies. Cuz the proximity of intelligence that looks just like us is the statistical impossibility. So ya, Luke n the floating thing with hands r the 2 aliens who r most likely to exist within the context of their own franchises

[@facundobinelli6077]

Awesome content

[@stefanatliorvaldsson3563]

great video

[@Phrenotopia]

Thank you, my phrend!

[@StrangeGamer859]

In an infinite universe, the probability of humans evolving in multiple planets eventually approaches 100%

[@enderking1525]

I actually took this into account with one of my worldbuilding projects. While I did have a few humanoid aliens, I was able to have somewhat of an explanation that most of them share a common ancestor with Hominids. Now you may be wondering how this is possible, but the simple answer is there were aliens before the evolution of humans that were moving species around.

[@ceryler.4096]

"Looks at self in mirror." Well I exist, so at the very least its theoretically possible.

[@Lumberjack_king]

Alien life would most likely have a "head" with sensory parts and a way to process food but wouldn't have what we would recognize as a "face". They might not even have jaws.

[@jonathanthomas8736]

Certain aspects of the humanoid form do seem to be highly likely. For instance, bilateral symmetry seems to want to evolve whenever there's a through gut, yes? Any organism that would find intelligence adaptive would need a reason for it, and a more or less complex social structure seems to be part of that. The signaling involved in maintaining such a structure would tend toward language. Cooperative action requires an awareness of self, and gradations of otherness so that the roles of cooperants are not duplicated inadaptively. Tool use, which would extend the capabilities of a species beyond the body inherent, requires manipulation with some degree of dexterity. Not necessarily hands as crows use tools, but the more dexterous and resilient or redundant or replaceable the manipulators, the more complex the tools in early stages. I could go on, but while that doesn't get us to humanoid, it starts heading in that direction.

[@NyoomMonster]

Tbh it depends on the evolutionary pressures the organism is face with, combined with the resources available, and the topology of the planet, and the body plans of other organisms (both plant and animal) on the planet they evolved on, as well as the time given to evolve and similarness of their environment to earth.

[@llanorick]

I think that humanoid is one of a handful of common body plans for a tool using, intelligent creature.

[@catfwish]

What about the Eridians from Project Hail Mary? They are intelligent organic life (it is even implied that they had a common ancestor through panspermia), yet have bodies that are not even cell-based, for the most part, being effectively steam-powered robots made and maintained by a central brain/cell making organ.

[@PhilosoShysGameChannel]

This was a good vid! Thanks, dawg!

[@blaircolquhoun7780]

Mother Nature wouldn't make the same mistake twice. Maybe they'd be sentient wolves who walk upright or maybe sentient lizards. Back in the 1980s, there was a thought experiment called Dinosaur Earth which speculated what might have happened had the dinosaurs not gone extinct and what so-called "dinosauroid" would have looked like.

[@andyhunjan]

Octopodes seem incredibly intelligent

[@MatthewCampbell765]

I'm not sure if I'd call the xenomorph or the floating alien (I remember what it's from, but can't recall what it's called) "humanoid" per se.

[@Phrenotopia]

Hi there! I'm not sure what to say, because I actually don't call these humanoid, or fully humanoid, in the video. That was the whole point of the exercise.

[@thejurassicwarewolf3300]

the floating ones are called eusapiens

[@drsharkboy6568]

The floating one was Eosapiens, from Alien Planet.

[@Lumberjack_king]

Another reason that most almost all aliens are humanoid is probably because it's easier to empathize with a Character if it's a human or human like or if they act like humans. The less humanoid the alien is the more we precive it as a animal or monster and unintelligent we treat it less than us

[@Nanamowa]

I think intelligent aliens would also have eyes, as sight is a great resource that has evolved a miriad of time independently of one another. Given this, if they are upright, the eyes are most likely at the top of their body, as this would give them the greatest range of view. I think they would breathe oxygen, as most multicellular life evolved as a result of the increase in oxygen in the atmosphere, and combustion is a great way of storing energy. I believe they would also have an advanced way to communicate, like us. It makes sense that communication would be important, as any intelligent species is likely a social species, seeing as the most intelligent animals on our planets are very social and have varying levels of communications, creatures like Crows, Elephants, Wolves, Dolphins, and Apes are all highly social creatures and have advanced forms of communications.

[@dawoof5119]

Maybe if the humanoid aliens would be possible in the way of convergent evolution. Like ants and termites are similar but not related. Ants evolved from wasps termites from cockroaches. They change to adapt to there habitat.

[@lotusnaturals1897]

0:20 this one cause i like Expedition

[@Chrischi3TutorialLPs]

Fun thing is: Assuming an infinitely large universe, theres bound to be an identical copy of planet earth out there, as an infinite universe would have infinite matter, but theres finite ways to arrange that. Infact, in an infinite universe with infinite matter, youd expect to find an infinite number of identical copies of earth, or, for that matter, the entire milky way galaxy.

[@jameslape8656]

I think hands/aposable thumbs or highly advanced tentacles would be neccessary for a technically advanced species as well as a complex nerveasystem and complex eyes. I also think exoskeletons would be less likely but still possible. Some form of advanced digestion is aslo likely to form like how humans can eat meat and plants as well as made advancements in how to get more calories from what we ate. Some form of being very adaptable would also probly be quit likely.

[@jameslape8656]

Complex respiration is also needed so like would likely exclude animals from the sea.

[@SchiwiM]

I do believe, a technological alien has to be humanoid. Because you need a big brain and fingery hands to build the technology, it's also useful to walk upright to have the hands free to carry stuff around. An alien who walks on 4 legs without hands and fingers will hardly use tools, like pens and paper to preserve knowledge for future generations. Dolphins for example are intelligent too, but they will never build a car or a space rocket. A humanoid form is the most likely for a technological society.

[@raidermaxx2324]

the humans in star wars fit easily inside the newly emerging "multi-worlds theory" based on quantum observation and the schroedingers cat experiment, which has been recently pushed into the public consciousness by cal professor Sean Carrol.

[@danielharshman796]

its a strong body plan, good view of your surroundings, looks bigger, bipedalism saves a lot of energy, can grab and even throw things, I bet humanoids are common

[@JO-iv7tl]

I believe with many people the cutting edge idea of convergent evolution was taken too literally and that's why humanoid became the status quo. On one hand this presumes the human form is a niche in and of itself. On the other hand it's literary license of a new idea. To which convergent evolution of humanoid worked enough to get the story across . That is now a fabric of our understanding. I forgive my literary ancestors.

[@peterbard]

The basic humanoid form has come about several times in our current epoch but the our current system could be termed low oxygen very different from the ones before it which had a much higher level of oxygen I think that might be more of a norm universally so I think that an insect form might be more common among other worlds

[@Rhaenarys]

I would argue they wouldnt be exactly like us, but the aspects that make them humanoid, walking upright, having hands to use as tools themselves, and a brain capable of making decisions and comprehensive language, would be a must. As far as an exoskeleton, I'd think that would be very unlikely as the laws of size in nature (cant remember the proper term, forgive me) wouldnt allow it. As far as fur...well...we already have "fur", we just pretend its somehow different from other mammals...even though we are literally mammals. We also arent the only hominid species. I mean...we are sort of today, but we already know that we werent alone, with up to 8 different hominid species living and thriving, and at least 3 interbreeding with us. And that's not including the many that came before us, and the evidence we are seeing from chimps now. In other words, from the evidence we have, they would be considered humanoid to be like us in regards to intelligence. Not necessarily for the average creature, but to be like us, yes.

[@nikolimoon6165]

I kept saying Depends on it’s home planet