Alien: Covenant Retrospective

We get as sloppy as the script.
Billy's Book: / the-nicest-parts-of-hell
Twitter: / blabbercast1

[@MarioLanzas.]

the neomorph bursting from anywhere makes sense. it's supposed to be a more primitive and chaotic version of what later would be the more sophisticated and optimized xenomorph

[@rydz656]

I always thought because Shaw was sterile, the eggs David made wouldn't produce any queens.

[@cameronl.4702]

Interesting point! Never thought of that.

[@jimbowlan5804]

@rydz656 he mixed her eggs with the black goo

[@WillisWheeler]

I saw this opening weekend, when the girl slipped on the blood , everybody was in the movies was laughing their butts off at that part . And thank you for clowning this movie .

[@blabbercast]

Thanks Willis! Enjoyed your Royal Rumble review! And no problem, we went at this film!

[@WillisWheeler]

@@blabbercast omg u watched my review , thank u so much . I had to laugh when u said next is alien vs predator lol

[@blabbercast]

@@WillisWheeler Yeah I checked it out. Kind of got out of wrestling but I still like to watch reviews here and there. And LOL, next week is 28 Days Later.

[@sgregg5257]

Covenant was the worst since it had so much potential and just went off the rails in the wrong direction at each turn. My advice is 1:Do not pander to an audience base. All good films had no such audience base to satisfy. Star Wars had NO base. Jaws had NO base. Alien had NO base. Raiders of the Lost Ark had no fan base. So just ignore the fans and write a good screenplay , if it is good, then the audience will be there. 2: Let the suits manage the money with a rod of iron. Too much freedom for a film maker does not always make for a better film. 3: This is the hardest part, do not write a screenplay for easy adaptation for a world wide market. This is hard since the money is in world wide sales. However it means that any story has to be primarily action, linear, stereotypical, lacking nuance, in order for it to translate. This also makes for bad films. 4: KISS, keep it simple stupid. Plot complexity is not always the sign of a good story either. Keep the plot simple and expand from there. But keep it simple at the core. 5: For Alien specifically, do not make humans and their creations the center of the universe. That destroys the whole original concept. The original concept was that we are nothing special, maybe just food. The "Company" is just a product of that food. So it too is nothing special or powerful or anything much at all. There are forces in the cosmos whose actions are in no way effected by humanity. The original concept made the crew of the Nostromo discover this in a rather brutal way.

[@blabbercast]

Well said!

[@cameronl.4702]

Wow, well said!!!

[@nikitaaverin]

This is a pattern that I have noticed ever since Tony Scott committed suicide. Each and every film from Ridley Scott has more or less become biblical in its tone. Creation, life, death. Since he is churning out movie after movie at least once a year, makes me think that he is panicking, since he knows his age and that he's not immortal.

[@MultiPolarWorldCo-op]

There's only 2 Alien movies in existence lol Alien Isolation novelization would make a great movie imo.

[@AndJusticeForMe]

This movie was comical. Also, I’ve been thinking about this one…the captain had no authority to do a course change. He didn’t even bother to communicate with his superiors. He deserved a good chest-bursting.

[@TheSAFEone09]

First movies also really struck a cord in me and made me care for this franchise , Alien is probably my favourite film , Scott seems to think it was all just him now and can't understand he was just one part of that lighting in a bottle .

[@blabbercast]

Exactly!

[@DamoBloggs]

Each time I witness this franchise spiralling into absurdity, I can't help wondering what Neill Blomkamp might have achieved. I hope one day we will finally get to find out. You guys are great. Easily as good as a certain red correspondence 😉

[@blabbercast]

Fingers crossed for that one! And I don't know about being that good 😉 Appreciate you, Sojourn!

[@nightlovel]

Love this franchise! I've been enjoying listening to you guys! 👍

[@blabbercast]

Awesome! Thank you!

[@silverfuryranger]

Yeah, for me, the only alien movies in existence are the first two 😂

[@reloadpsi]

In 1979, there were movie critics who called Alien a dirt-average slasher movie hidden under pretentious production values. I've never considered that to be a fair assessment, but boy did _this_ movie ever make me remember those remarks. This was all of the above while also being a pointless filler arc.

[@skidmc]

It s so funny cuz 40 y from now, that opinion too will appear as clear bs

[@JayFog2010]

Another solid BlabberCast! Awesome watching the channel grow as it deserves it 🍻

[@blabbercast]

Cheers! Appreciate that!

[@CarouselExperiment]

That scene where the Alien is smashing it's head against the glass is brutal. Imagine being the pilot and seeing that haha

[@blabbercast]

I did like that scene. I would piss myself.

[@sumstuff6956]

I think the alien vs human action what we did get was great like the high grass section ripped off from original alien 3 script I thought it was great one minute crap the next minute covenant was schizophrenic experience as along time alien fan who loves the first two and isolation the most

[@dmzedd77]

I agree that it makes more sense that the Ovamorph (egg) should be laid by a queen. However, it is possible to have an Ovamorph without a Queen. In the first Alien, there is the deleted scene which shows Ripley coming across the Xenomorphs "lair." That is where she encounters a cocooned Dallas. Here it shows the Alien cocoons the victim and their biomass is used to transform the victim into an Ovamorph. The scene shows Brett already turned into an Ovamorph. It also shows Dallas about half way transformed, which prompts Ripley to mercy kill him with the flame thrower. Just thought I would share this as you both definitely made a point regarding where did the Ovamorphs come from that David had in his villainous lair. Without a Queen, using Ridley Scotts canon from the first Alien, that is how. David used the biomass of some other victims to create the Ovamorphs. Where these victims came from I know not, but it is technically possible in the film canon to produce an Ovamorph in the absence of a Queen. By the way, absolutely LOVE your podcast guys! I am thoroughly enjoying your retrospectives!

[@blabbercast]

Appreciate that! Really enjoying your in depth comments! You should do a channel if you haven't already. You are great at analysis! Good stuff!

[@dmzedd77]

@@blabbercast Thank you for the kind sentiment! However, I am just merely offering some comments and information since such feedback was invited on your show. Not so sure about my own channel, though I always enjoy joining as a guest (or as the Dungeon Master when we do our charity live stream D&D games)!

[@petervlcko4858]

Remember the time when foreign planets looked like different worlds? And no like Northern Europe? Well…

[@gardeningandlife137]

Holy crap I didn't expect this so soon

[@user-so6yj9vk1g]

“A movie must contain all the questions and answers within it” that is a terrible take. Many great films leave things unanswered. It’s okay to let the audience draw their own conclusions

[@blabbercast]

That is true, as we had stated in other reviews about other films, we didn't mind some ambiguity. We certainly botched that statement. Thanks for watching.

[@nerinine]

I watched in theater and i was so disapointed, because Doctor Elizabeth Shaw was dead. A few months later, when i watched it on DVD and read the Prometheus 2 draft, i understood that there was no place for her in Alien Covenant. Ten years had passed and she was contaminated with the black goo. Only if David had transformed her in a Xenomorph queen, it would had been possible to see her alive on the planet 4.

[@woody8060]

Be very curious to see your guys’ Terminator retrospectives. Particularly 3 and Salvation

[@blabbercast]

Doing T1 and T2 in March. 3 and the others will be a bit later in the year.

[@jordancrossgrove8827]

The guy you were talking about who “survived” the face hugger is where the second protomorph came from. How he was impregnated from having one on his face for literally 3 seconds idk, but that’s how it was born on the ship.

[@cameronl.4702]

Interesting, never thought of that. A good explanation!

[@blabbercast]

Facehugger shot his load quick. Thanks for the info!

[@petervlcko4858]

@@blabbercast 🎉

[@davidmckayii752]

This movie was funny.

[@jamessuess418]

I wanna know how the eggs got there in that crypt place and if David is gonna make Shaw into the alien queen he’s working on her body to transform it into something I guess that’s for the next movie 🍿

[@blabbercast]

That part is really blurry. Curious to see where that goes.

[@wendelladams8060]

I’d never seen this film (Yeah, I despised Prometheus that much.), but after watching your Alien review series I broke down and watched it. I totally agree the lore in Covenant is inconsistent and David is a walking deus ex machina, but the film was entertaining. I really think watching you guys explain the film’s flaws kept my expectations low and let me just view it as a mindless popcorn flick. Keep up the great work!

[@blabbercast]

Glad we made it work better for you! Alien Resurrection is my popcorn flick. Sometimes it is better to turn the mind off and just enjoy. We usually don't try to get analytical but we had so much back and forth for hours about the prequels the frustration boiled over a bit. It happens.

[@doubleplusdanny]

The eggs came from Shaw.

[@reloadpsi]

This movie doesn't lead into Alien. David didn't make the eggs on LV-426; the crashed ship has clearly been there for way longer than a single century when you look at the state the corpse in the Engineer ship is in. There's absolutely no way David had anything to do with that happening. All David explains is how the Alien keeps showing up in so many _other_ parts of the galaxy for all that spinoff material to exist, an explanation that was never needed in the first place. The assumption that he sets up the events of Alien is completely groundless. Covenant is a filler arc. That is all :P

[@cameronl.4702]

Well said!

[@joachimvandenheuvel507]

I consider everything filmed past Alien 3 as fan fiction. Why the hell would anyone kill the mystery of the derelict ship and the origin of it's cargo.

[@rwrae72]

I have a question about Prometheus: after the Engineer was awakened and he killed Weyland, he got in the pilot's seat and took off for Earth. His ship was rammed and he crash landed. He then went after Shaw. Prometheus was a prequel to Alien, right? In Alien, when they found the derelict ship there was a pilot in the seat. How can that be? Who was it? What am I missing?

[@blabbercast]

That's a good question. ... they f'ed up!

[@WickedScott]

There was the seed of a great scifi film in this one. It just wasn't a good Alien film. I always imagined the Engineer home world would be a bubbling cauldron of bio-mechanical madness and horror. Not albino Romans.

[@blabbercast]

That would have been a cool direction. The return to mystery. Damn bodybuilders. JAH!

[@cameronl.4702]

Albino Romans ! Lmao, that was awesome!!!

[@nerinine]

Albino Romans fighting albino aliens.

[@smoothbrain4384]

You guys have great takes on these movies. Fair and even praise/criticism not hyperbolic! The backlash for the unloved sequels was a bit too harsh. They have some great aspects that are worth appreciating but flawed at the core. The modern movies are beautiful but the scripts are an unfocused mess. If I may elaborate on some major issues. . Neither Prometheus nor Covenant allow the audience to form an intimate connection with a character ergo they don't allow the audience a surrogate into any of the horrifying situations characters in the Alien universe would find themselves in. The dread of the unknown hiding in the dark, the claustrophobic struggle for life, the risk of being horribly defiled and consequently enduring a painfully gruesome demise. The audience cannot fear these things the characters are supposed to fear unless they empathize with them. And the audience cannot empathize with a character that takes unbelievable actions or has motivations that don't make reasonable sense. Having something bad happen to a character by itself isn't character building. Just because Daniels watches James Franco burn to death doesn't mean we empathize with her because she's sad now. Watching a character make choices, the wrong choices, the right choices, struggle adapt and change for better or worse in reaction to adversity is what builds empathy with the audience. It's also time to drop the "Last Girl" trope, it's too obvious when they try to replicate Ripley into these movies with the superficial qualities and overlook what made her interesting in the first place. Her character is well defined, she is headstrong, sticks to her principles, stands up for herself in the face of conflict and that's admirable. It's not that she's an attractive short haired woman in space. They keep serving this character up in front of the spotlight and it deflates any and all tension when they are in danger because we know they are going to survive. Watching Alien '79 for the first time, you wouldn't know Ripley is the main character until the second half of the film. While there are terrifying premises in both Prometheus (the journey to find your maker who hates you) and Covenant (android goes haywire carries out gruesome experiments on hibernating colonists), they just aren't explored in ways that pay off for the audience. -- We still end up with the same uninteresting question in both films; What is the black goo besides a terribly inconsistent unintriguing MacGuffin?

[@blabbercast]

Great post, especially the one about Ripley not being the main character until the second half of the film! Lots of stuff is too hyperbolic these days and we like to joke around. I enjoyed Prometheus, and really did not get into Covenant, but there are still cool scenes, but the characters are very flat which falls to writing. Appreciate the post!

[@smoothbrain4384]

Shaw actually was a good character, so my point holds less water there. Her story really deserved more attention. Killing her off screen was very Alien 3 of them. It still boggles my mind how they throw tens even hundreds of millions at these productions and pour thousands of man hours from the most creative professionals in the world yet they don't spend the time making the script air tight.

[@benquinneyiii7941]

Essex Nimitz

[@techguyone11]

Great work guys, whats the next series ? RoboCop might be fun

[@blabbercast]

28 Days/Weeks later

[@leemc5646]

Why does the pilot press the button inside the room when she's trying to get out of it. Wouldn't it lock from the outside Also when she had the gun she should of stayed outside the door and shot into the room, being in the corridor would be safer as she could close the door again and run if necessary.

[@blabbercast]

Good point!

[@Corporal_Hicks]

I just got Alien Isolation Book 😃👍

[@blabbercast]

Awesome! Looks awesome! Enjoy! Love ya Hicks, come back!!

[@cameronl.4702]

Me too! How do you like it so far?

[@jamesyandsonsoutdooradvent9394]

They could have made David come to Earth and then do the Earth war storyline from the comics

[@blabbercast]

That would have been cool! Would have preferred it.

[@OatmealmanSix]

You guys should do a retrospective of 1982s The Thing. Definitely getting a sub from me.

[@blabbercast]

Great suggestion! Adding to the list. Love that movie!

[@OatmealmanSix]

@@blabbercast I’m a huge fan of the film as-well! It be great to see you guys dissect it.

[@jaydub7386]

I wouldn't say I liked Covenant. I was not too fond of Prometheus either-two garbage modern movies making a cash grab from a great franchise from the past. David is an awful character, and Scott has no more creativity, so he just made the same character with Walter. And why not? He keeps making the same movie over and over again.

[@tigtrager6923]

I don't believe that there will be any follow up to Covenant. I don't think anything is even in the works. I feel like it's fortunate if the prequel to Alien ends with Covenant just because Prometheus really wasn't scripted any better either and this led to the downhill spiral we now see. Covenant doesn't really leave anything left to build on. A third prequel installment would do nothing to further the story along unless it was solely about David to complete his story. Something to explain what happened to him and all of those colonists he will experiment on, or something that ties in with how the derelict ship ends up on LV-426. A plot that involved even the engineers putting a stop to David might, I stress might, be worthwhile if done correctly. Otherwise, maybe the Alien franchise needs to move in a direction that is distantly post-Ripley. There is a tv series that may be coming, but if not done correctly it could undo everything, much like the AVP movies attempted.

[@bobjordan69]

Hows this for a retrospective: It was SHITE

[@blabbercast]

Would have saved us some time. LOL!

[@bobjordan69]

@@blabbercast Happy to find a review that articulates what bugs me so much about that movie!

[@leemc5646]

😄

[@cameronl.4702]

Lmao!

[@yurgalmightygmail]

Yesterday i watched it again and its starting to kick in. We just need to take them like a Star Wars episdoe 1,2 and 3. It's not so bad if you will watch it few times and will give it a time.

[@blabbercast]

That's awesome it started to work for you more after another viewing. We need a long break from these prequels as you could tell from the video. Appreciate you, Almighty!

[@Dead_Again1313]

You jinxed the franchise. Look what happened to Star Wars lol

[@mysteryminx2619]

Whatever Ridley gets up to -- and he runs hot and cold for me -- I may love it or hate the story and the cast, Ridley, being a fine artist in his own right, he will always give you something beautiful to look at, cinematography, sets, landscapes, character designs. And yes, the unbelievable Carlo Bugatti Throne Chair. It is very real, Bugatti was an all over the place designer, The Throne Chair is made from Ebonized wood, vellum, and copper -- and one most recently sold for 30 grand. Weyland is a demanding and demeaning father, and I'm with David, "That being said, doesn't everyone want their parents dead" Shaw: "I didn't". She had a caring and loving father who stopped his own work to explain things to her in gentle terms and taught her to rely on her faith. David is a construct, and construct who believes he understands emotions, but has a skewed development of morality. Beings are mortal. He is not. Let's see how mortal they are. And who is the true Supreme Being. I love a great Big Bad Xenomorph shoot 'em up, but I found myself watching both these films for Fassbinder's interpretations of Walter and David, how he can manipulate an Engineer into destroying Peter Weyland, he wants his parent dead. David, gets everything he desires or manipulates into existence. I found another way to watch these two films, they are about faith, and creation, intelligent design, and starting over. Nearly every civilization who believes in a superior being who created the Earth and all living things, has a corresponding story where those same creators have destroyed their creation and began again. David is a god. David is a thinking synthetic creation created by a race he find abhorrent. David is an abomination. He simply isn't sure which he is.

[@FlyingOverTr0ut]

Your guys' channel is wonderful. I absolutely love your commentaries. They're unlike anything I've ever seen. I love how you guys genuinely love the movies and have such empathy and respect for the filmmakers and actors, even when you don't like the films. KZbin's filled with a lot of caustic and snarky movie commenters, and I appreciate so much how down to earth, genuine, and appreciative you guys are of these films. I can't say enough good about what you're doing. I found your randomly while looking for Prometheus and Alien: Covenant analysis since I love hearing people's thoughts on scifi. Please keep going. You guys are pros.

[@alanadrex9527]

i highly enjoy their retrospectives too!

[@blabbercast]

That really means a lot! Truly it does, thanks so much for watching and enjoying. Seriously, comments like this make us feel we are doing good when we always question whether or not we are. We got a little too vitriolic in this one, but this burned us out a bit having to look up so much stuff. Appreciate the kind words, means a lot!

[@Sticklike]

Well Scott answered one of the great questions of humanity "What was first the chicken or the egg?" now we know its the egg.

[@blabbercast]

That's true. We finally know.

[@Dead_Again1313]

It doesnt attack David because they got their hands in the air like they just dont care.

[@blabbercast]

😂

[@benjimlem1284]

Man, you wasted opportunity for "EL SCORIPIO IS REEAAAAAAAADYYYY!" at around 4:08. Shame on you : ^)

[@blabbercast]

😂

[@leonefurlan137]

You are interested in the chair frim the beginning of the film? David mentions the name in that scene,describing what he see's , Rombaldi or something the brand is called...

[@blabbercast]

Missed that. Thanks!!