Alignment Dowels (132)

[@VanceCarolin]

I my experience, I have found that during module initial design / construction, assembly goes well when everything is carefully measured and all screw holes are precisely pilot drilled. When everything is dialed in, I disassemble the modules, then I add some Titebond 2 glue. Finally, I reassemble them with the original screws and clamp them well. No creep, no breakage after over 8 years+ with all my modules. Also... grave errors tend to occur when drilling alignment holes without some sort of Porta-align or jig to keep you at a perfect 90 deg from the surface. Your freehand method in the ham-handed hands of many people, can reap very predictably unpleasant results. Using your method, only if you are a seasoned musical instrument repairmen or a retired cabinetmaker, can you expect to carry it off. (In any case, the photos tend to evidence that you have exceptional carpentry skills that many in most module clubs don't seen to possess.)

[@paulskehan6274]

Hi Larry I am in a NMRA group here in Australia. About 2008 we built a number of modules for display purposes. We used those dowels. A jig was made to ensure that all ends lined up accurately. It consisted of a piece of wood (lumber) with another piece attached at right angles across it. Two small holes were then drilled where the dowels were to go. The end boards were then lined up and clamped to it and a small nail placed in the holes to mark the end. After taking the end out of the jig the holes could then be drilled. The modules are held together with a single G-clamp. They have been to about 30 train shows so far. Some over 150 kilometres away. Very quick and accurate to set up. I love your videos and have learnt a lot. I subscribe to a number of other channels but have found yours to be the best. Stay safe Paul from Zillmere

[@TheDCCGuy]

Very good point. Hopefully if someone is already a member of a modular crew they will be aware of the groups standard. I participated i the Northern Virginia N-Scale modular group about a decade ago and know first hand of the problems that arise when folks do not strictly adhere to those standards.

[@ChrisFWhite]

In the club I belong to we took a similar approach of making up a template. This was particularly useful when retro fitting dowels to old layouts where scenery meant it was difficult to judge alignment of the baseboard surfaces. When building new baseboards we clamp the end pieces together and employ a bench drill for greater accuracy, doing all the drilling before assembling the baseboards.

[@jeffpeterson9627]

Your series on constructing a small modular layout is exactly what I've needed. I wish I had found it before I started my layout. Thank you!

[@keeganconor4631]

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[@genesisgrant2620]

@Keegan Conor instablaster =)

[@keeganconor4631]

@Genesis Grant i really appreciate your reply. I got to the site through google and im trying it out atm. Takes a while so I will get back to you later when my account password hopefully is recovered.

[@keeganconor4631]

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[@genesisgrant2620]

@Keegan Conor No problem =)

[@jhoodfysh]

Good information Larry, thanks

[@redietdelelegne734]

Larry, this video prompted me to use what I consider a sufficient and stronger alignment system. I used 3/8" diameter wood table leaf dowel pins to align (and partially support) adjacent modules. (My module size is 2-1/2' x 5' and I join two "horizontally" & two "vertically" to create a 5' x 10' layout. I am doing this so I can take apart and put back together to free a room &/or move to another location some day.) I use 4 to 5 wood table leaf pins along 5 foot expanses. (Using 2 to 3 wood pins along the 2' ends of your modules is analogous.) Installation: Once two modules are clamped in place, I drill a 3/8" hole all the way thru both of the adjacent 3/4" thick boards. (This drilling is a single through drill operation for each pin - quick and easy!) Then (while still clamped) I put glue on the back end of the dowel and insert the dowel front end first as far as I think necessary into the drilled holes. (one drill operation but two wood thickness of 3/4" each adjacent and aligned to each other.) (exact precision in insertion depth is not really necessary.) The modules separated without any problem - glue did not come out thru the front of the pin. The pin pentrates as much as 80% of the female hole when module edges are flush. I had anticipated putting a 3/8" dowel disk to plug the rear of the hole after the glued table leaf pin had been inserted. However, the glue held without this unnecessary plug dowel addition. The system works wonderfully and not much expense. (3/8" diameter table leaf pins are available on Amazon for very little cost.) Also, I had anticipated that I would need to open the female hole that receives the table leaf pin by using a 3/8"+1/64" diameter drill. Since I am using standard quality pine, the fit is working well without this secondary drill operation.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Great idea!

[@andrewdking]

I very much doubt a wooden dowel alignment method would be suitable for an exhibition layout where the board modules are being assembled and disassembled hundreds of times in the layouts lifetime. The female hole in particular being just soft pine most probably, just won't be able to endure the constant battering.

[@uptownphotography]

Great idea with the mustard dispenser for the glue. I always have problems with restarting Elmer's Glue once it sits for a while, so I can't wait to use my mustard up! Thanks. Philip

[@TheDCCGuy]

I was encouraged to switch when the original lid gummed up and then I broke it trying to free it. Now I grab empty mustard bottles and keep the handy for similar jobs.

[@uptownphotography]

@@TheDCCGuy Yes...great idea.

[@jerrybengtson9779]

I just use the mustard caps on my Titebond glue bottles. They fit perfectly.

[@flyboy2610]

I like that idea about keeping your wood glue in a mustard bottle!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Adds a nice smell to a scene! Actually the original glue bottle spout got terribly gummed up and when I tried ot get it open again it fell apart so I had to find another one and the mustard bottle was handy.

[@andrewdking]

I am from the UK and am about to update my Club's 20 years old or more 00-gauge layout corner end board modules with these same blue Australian/UK DCC Concepts dowels. Our existing brass dowels are standard cabinet makers 1/4" dia items which have worked loose. Basically, they are to small for purpose. These corner boards attract members to lean on them, exerting a high down force. So noticing these new items on a DCC Concepts stand at one of the many UK shows (this company is always worthy of a butchers for new products, they don't make rubbish), I purchased a pack of four pairs. I assumed my Club's tool box would include the 13 & 19mm flat bits needed to make the holes. Not so, so today I went to two different local towns and five different tool stores, trying to track these two sizes down. 13 & 19 are basically metrified 1/2" & 3/4" (easy for you in the USA) but here in the UK its now more 12 & 20mm, so nightmare. I did eventually track the correct sizes down. I therefore recommend you initially buy the installation pack which includes said drill bits. On your video showing their installation, you missed mentioning some important points : The dowels should be as far apart from one another as access with the drill will allow. This ensures greatest corner to corner accuracy. You didn't mention the pilot hole should be as square to the surface as possible in both planes. I saw a KZbin video of some guy using an old CD as a mirror with two lines on it draw at 90° to each other through its centre. The hole in the centre of the CD is centred about the hole you want to drill, and the silver surface acts like a mirror. Just align the reflection of the drill bit shank to both the lines and the drill should be square to the surface. I haven't tried the idea yet, but sounds plausible. The other problem, was you deciding to drill the 13mm hole from the inner side of the board i.e opposite end of the hole. That's an absolute no no. As you found out, those flat bits burst through, nearly destroying the neat seating surface for the dowel's flange. You then tried to clean out the 13mm hole from the opposite flange counterbore end, which probably made the dowel's body a loose fit, therefore losing the very accuracy we need. Flat bits are useless for cleaning out holes, they rely on their point being able to follow a pilot or bite into virgin wood. I suspect the dowel body should be a light tap fit into its mounting hole, so being 13 and not 13+ a bit, is very important. Its also very important the 19mm seating counterbore is drilled first following the initial pilot hole, so to leave the pilot hole intact for the point of the 13mm drill bit to follow, to produce the mounting bore hole as concentric as possible hand held. A good idea to test this on a scrap piece of wood first.

[@TheDCCGuy]

Excellent comments and suggestions for the installation. I definitely will point anyone asking for more info to read your post. Thanks for taking the time to do it-Larry

[@andrewdking]

@@TheDCCGuy thanks for taking it as intended, constructive criticism. I may get in touch with DCC Concepts and query their choice of drill sizes. I assume inch size drill bits are still freely available in the US, as they just may have been looking at your side of the pond as their main market ?

[@TheDCCGuy]

One point of explanation, I was following the enclosed instructions that tell you to drill the holes on the face first then drill through the end piece from the inside face. I generally assume that they have tried it both ways and find the way they recommend to be best so I usually do as I am told. At any rate it still provided a tight fit even though there were a few rough edges as a result of drilling fro the inside out.

[@andrewdking]

@@TheDCCGuy ok, so definitely worth a trial run on a similar but scrap piece of wood to judge best results.

[@RicktheRecorder]

Although more expensive, I always use Forstner or saw-tooth bits, which don't necessarily need a centre. Flat-bits are a rough and ready tool which I avoid in any kind of precision work.

[@Mercatoyd]

nice clean simple system.. Thank you for sharing

[@danshobbies13]

I built a nice HO layout. I used Woodland Scenic products. I spent a year building it. When I moved from that house it got destroyed during the move. I said I’m never doing that again. However building it in pieces like this might be a huge help when moving.

[@DavidBurnett1]

Interesting video - thank you. I was not aware of that version of alignment dowels, so will investigate. Just a suggestion on that - I would prime the holes with PVA also, to be sure the timber is wetted out with PVA before you insert the dowels, just to ensure a really good fixing. Either that or quick-setting Araldite. Not sure if you guys have MDF (Medium Density Fibreboard) over there? That is something I am considering using for the baseboard. As to your comments on use of PVA, I had never come across the creeping issue, but it makes sense. Hmm. I will keep an eye on that, as at the moment I am experimenting with modules (no where near the track-laying yet) made of MDF, and entirely held together with PVA (just glued and clamped), and using Titebond III (thankfully we can get it over here in Australia). Another option would be a UF glue such as Aerolite 306, but with the requirement for mixing, it is not so convenient. So thanks again for your interesting and thought-provoking video - appreciated.

[@TheDCCGuy]

My main concern with MDF would be potential sagging over time. However if supported with cross braces it is not likely to be an issue on modules. I also wonder about the weight if MDF is heavier than plywood. The PVA creep issue is most likely to manifest with heat so if a module is left in a hot car or loft look out.

[@DavidBurnett1]

@@TheDCCGuy Hot car - very good point! Yes, MDF is a little more dense, so a bit more weight, but I am looking at 6-8mm for the top, and 4mm for the sides - very light weight. Robust - well, as earlier, I am experimenting for now. Thanks for your quick reply - appreciated :).

[@Blue68Camaro]

Thank you for the video...... Depending on what I am building I use both Glue and Screw or Glue and Framing nailer, gives you the best of both worlds. Since these are movable I would do both but then again I always over build, just ask my wife. I don't like French's mustered, will it be still legal to keep it in a Goldens mustard container instead? :~)

[@ChrisFWhite]

Usual technique for avoiding blowout would be to drill the smaller, 13mm, through holes roughly halfway from each side or at the very least make a shallow cut on one side before drilling through from the other.

[@TheDCCGuy]

I agree that is my usual method but I assume DCC Concepts says to do it the way I did it is because once the 19mm hole is drilled into the face the pilot hole might be distorted whereas coming in from the back it is still “fresh”. At any rate the dowels went in to just the right depth and once the glue set up they are in good and tight. They suggest using the wood glue since it would be easy to remove them and use them again whereas with something like Gorilla Glue or epoxy they would be a one time use.

[@AmauryJacquot]

in fact, proper plywood offers better dimensional stability and strength than dimensional lumber. just like things like LVLs are much stronger than dimentional lumber in house building

[@maryginger4877]

In my experience, most people choose a material because its currently popular, then buy the cheapest grade from the cheap store ... Guess what happens next....

[@mikeh2412]

A regular 13mm bit would be a lot better from the back side.

[@williampark8480]

I feel glue and screw is a good strong structure.

[@joelmurphy479]

Love your series of building a model railroad, just what I needed. I was thinking about using several modules going off at a 45-degree angle off both ends, is that something you would recommend? Thank you

[@TheDCCGuy]

You could do that or just make rectangles and but them against one another at the corners. Makes for easier construction than the angles. For a really neat design see the Beer Line series in Model Railroader. It was set up so the various modules could be arranged in different configurations-one of my favorites.

[@robertpetit57]

I just ordered a couple sets of dowels for my future modules. Is there a distributor here in the US? I am.planning on making a drilling template to standardize the locations of my holes, both horizontally and vertically. Nice series, I have watched to 146 so far. Keep up the good work Sir!

[@TheDCCGuy]

Iron Planet Hobbies carries some DCC Concepts products but not the alignment dowels. Your best bet is to order them direct or off Hatton’s website in England. I get stuff from them all the time and shipping is cheaper than from my local supplier just 60 miles away.

[@robertpetit57]

@@TheDCCGuy I ordered a set off of their website. I ordered the kit and two extra sets of pins. About 50 pounds shipped to me. ($66 USD I think)

[@tashrigley]

@@robertpetit57 i have searched but cant find them on Hatton's website can you help me out thanks

[@robertpetit57]

@@tashrigley I ordered mine directly from DCC Concepts. Good service from them. They are very well made, I was very happy with the quality of what I recieved.

[@martinpattison4018]

I like the dowels that you used from DCC Concepts and I hope to use them too. One question, would it not be better to have one set the other way around as for now they have no Track on them. Ok, you only have two boards, but if there were more say three then the next time you put them together they would all line up.or of course, you could just write a number on them. Martin. (Thailand)

[@TheDCCGuy]

I considered that but it increases the chance someone might put them in backwards. Also, unless you do very precise measurements when installing them it is highly unlikely they will line up at all if the correct ends are not joined. As you say numbering the ends like table makers do with table leafs will take care of the problem until they have track on them. Modular clubs that use a dowel system do have to set standards and should use a drilling template to make sure all modules fit together.

[@earlfreeman93]

Larry will theses alinement dowels be able to handle the stress of over hanging module when they are sat up on a heavy-duty coffee table or a bed; when one truly lack the space to set them up any where else. Or should a stronger method be used like carriage bolts?

[@TheDCCGuy]

These are just for alignment not for support. I will be installing carriage bolts to join the modules together and legs for vertical support. This is exactly how I build the main Piedmont Southern benchwork. If set up on a flat surface such as a table the carriage bolts should work to hold them together as the table will provide the vertical support.

[@sugarcubeaudio152]

Phone sections that you use alone will shrink overtime there was a Peace in a magazine I can't remember the article by a gentleman built a layout using 2" and 1" foam and in 110 year span he lost about 1⁄4 of an " and gaps formed however it is light weight and it does make for great modules

[@exadorthecat3346]

Who will notice in 110 years!

[@Vman7757]

Can I get these Alignment dowels in the united states?

[@TheDCCGuy]

Not hwt I know of but you can order them from DCC Cocepts or Hatton’s websites. I just got an order today from Hatton’s. Only took two weeks but shipping cost less than from my local dealer just 60 miles away.

[@robertnelson432]

Try as I might I can't understand what these pine do. There is no obvious connection between them. You mention male and female but how do they work ?

[@TheDCCGuy]

The two male pins insert into the females and since they were installed in a set position any time you mate the two modules up the pins will always interlock in that exact same position guaranteeing everything will fit together perfectly assuming you got them installed that way. These alignment dowels or registration pins are also used to guarantee that the two halves of a mold go together perfectly when an injection mold is put together, and other similar processes.

[@martinworrall5888]

If you drill the 15 mm hole from both sides you should not have to clean out the recess hole.

[@RicktheRecorder]

13mm

[@RicktheRecorder]

This is a great channel, usually full of sound guidance, but I must take exception to the advice on glue which, if not exactly nonsense, is at least very questionable. First, the esoteric, if possibly eccentric, requirements for the construction of split-cane fishing rods (nearly all modern rods are built from carbon fibre) are of almost no relevance to building baseboards, unless they are to double as trebuchets or catapults. Second, Gorilla glue is not a type but a brand. Gorilla make glues based on various adhesives. What he is talking about is polyurethane glue which is available from many manufacturers. It is well tried and tested over several decades for use in boatbuilding, among many applications. The only proviso of which I am aware is its slight susceptibility to UV degradation by sunlight if the glueline is not covered, seldom a problem for model railways. Most would consider such an adhesive overkill for modelling purposes. The waterproof versions of Titebond or EvoStik PVA are more than adequate for baseboard construction. After all they are used in high-grade furniture assembly which generally takes more of a beating than model railways. If one is neurotic about gluing then there are always systems such as urea formaldehyde (Aerolite), or resin-based (West or SP) which has almost limitless strength and life expectancy in boat, ship and aircraft construction. Third, the contrast between gluing and screwing is really a false dichotomy. Unless one truly wants to be able to dismantle fully, the standard method is both screwing and gluing, each method of fastening having complementary advantages. Fourth I saw no discussion of weight. Solid timber can be heavy and cumbersome. If one is indeed moving stuff around then box and girder designed plywood construction has much to commend it. I would add a couple of other observations. The alignment dowels become more accurate the greater the space between them. In the video they are closer together than I would suggest. Try to get them as near the outside of the boards as you can manage. If at all possible, I would counsel against drilling them into the end-boards in situ. The scope for angular inaccuracy is high. Prepare the end boards for the fixing bolts and the dowels before constructing the baseboard, ideally in a drill press to get complete vertical accuracy, and preferably with a Forstner bit, rather than the coarser flat-bits. My own design of hardened steel alignment dowels incorporates the fixing bolts concentrically so there is only one set of drilling to be done and they take up less space. They are a fiddle to make however and the ones shewn will be fine for most purposes. DCC also make them with a 5A through-power connection which sounds neat.

[@TheDCCGuy]

When using a new product I tend to follow the manufacturer’s suggestions. In this case they recommend using PVA glue to lock them in place.

[@RicktheRecorder]

@@TheDCCGuy The discussion on glue related to construction of the baseboard, not the fixing of the dowels. I have no opinion on DCC's choice of adhesive. As you say, one would tend to go with their recommendation.

[@openeyes-411]

Thank you Rick, saved me the trouble of leaving a comment - you articulated my thoughts and then some!👍👍

[@openeyes-411]

@@TheDCCGuy Hi Larry, the one mfgr suggestion you shouldn't have followed was drilling the smaller dia from behind - which a spade bit will always create blowout chipping, somewhat butchering the shoulder for the pin... You should drill 3/4 or so of the way thru from the interface side, then finish from behind to get nice clean holes every time. Otherwise, great video & alignment pin technique! Charlie