All Buttons In Is Not A Ratio Control

Note: the issue I address in this video is fixed in the current version of Reaper. Update video here: • Its Not xxxxxxx Rocket...
In which I finally give in and take a look at the JS 1175 plugin (native to Reaper), and end up hacking away at its code in gleeful ignorance of how it actually works.
If you like this type of content and you want to see it more often, consider signing up for Channel Membership: / @danworrall
Video edited with VEGAS Pro 17:
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Reaper v6.26 changelog: "JSFX: update 1175 compressor and various others to fix overcompression, add deprecated blown capacitor mode to preserve old behavior ".

[@NovianLeVanMusic]

Interesting, so the behavior present in this video/before the 6.26 update is considered blown out capacitors.

[@finnnnnnnn1258]

"if this is a 4:1 ratio, then I'm a cheese toastie" 🤣🤣

[@GingerDrums]

I lol'ed at a Trainstation in Bielefeld, Germany.

[@fitzeflinger]

@@GingerDrums bielefeld, my hometown! what a great coincidence finding it in the comments!

[@nuphory]

@@fitzeflinger ...if it exists at all

[@fitzeflinger]

@@nuphory never heard that one before... :|

[@nuphory]

@@fitzeflinger really? thats so strange. its a very common joke

[@alexbrown1510]

This dude turns audio nerdery into something that should be a feature at an iMax theater

[@fjkldhakljf]

Dan worall is making movies at this point tutorial is an understatement

[@MrJC1]

I am going to read something... because i wrote it, and its the truth! "I f*kin love dan worral. He is the best music related youtuber ever... PERIOD!" Thank you. Goodnight!

[@raphaelkuttruf]

Dan Worral Productions are EPIC Hollywood is probably part of his backyard

[@one-eye1721]

The good thing about Reaper is that they are likely to see this and implement changes in an update.

[@jasonzdora]

@@petersamps HAHAHAHA thats so awesome!!

[@m13253]

The most recent update allows you to make a copy of a JS plugin inside Reaper now.

[@eliteextremophile8895]

@@petersamps did they just change what Dan changed or were there some much more profound problem in the code?

[@tinman1528]

Update: The bugs in this plugin have been addressed in the new pre-release version of the plugin. I suspect that your video helped to make that happen. Thank you for these great videos and information. Your effort, information, and hard work creating these excellent videos is very much appreciated. Keep up the great work.

[@Clarity-808]

Coincidence that TinMan is another plugin of theirs, IIRC 😏

[@thorstenoerts]

This is a great argument for learning to code at least a little bit.

[@andreyaek2266]

Et voila! From the 6.27 changelog, released a couple days ago. " JSFX: update 1175 compressor and various others to fix overcompression, add deprecated blown capacitor mode to preserve old behavior". There you have it. Gotta appreciate the interaction here. It's hard to know for sure, but my hunch is that this wouldn't have gotten changed were it not for this video. Good contribution! ;)

[@TheNoiseFloorav]

If you ever delete this video, we can't be friends.

[@thirdhemisphere]

JSFX effects are mostly user contributed and were included into Reaper distribution many years ago. They are not only meant to be used but also serve as the basis for user hacking, which is what Dan demonstrates (I wish you underlined this point even more - JS are meant to be tweaked!). Even if some of them have some bugs (and all code has), it's hard for Reaper devs to fix them due to obligations to backward compatibility - some Project out there relies on them working in the same way they always did. I believe I was the one who mentioned JS in my comment under the previous video. I'm honoured. Thanks, Dan.

[@ReNoMellow]

if you want a gain knob that can only go up : here's the modified line for the slider 3 : slider3:0Gain (dB)

[@dagamusik]

Would also be right (I mean if I can get same results) if I change slider 1 to: slider1:0Input (dB)

[@StevieInsane]

Will look at this in a few days, but I'm so glad that you are back, sooo much :)

[@SazLowify]

Thanks for showing how you dug into the code, it makes all of that seem far more accessible! I had no idea it was that easy to edit things. Fantastic work as always.

[@liegon]

I have absolutely no idea about compressor design, but I did some testing, and from what I discovered, the code that calculates the gain reduction `gr = -overdb*(cratio-1)/(cratio);` is actually correct. An equivalent formula, that's maybe easier to read would be `gr = -(overdb - overdb*(1/cratio));`, which basically calculates the difference of the uncompressed over-threshold level and the compressed level. The problem is that the value of overdb is roughly twice as big as it should be. Perhaps it has to do with the following line: overdb = 2.08136898 * log(det/cthreshv) * log2db; Edit: Turns out this has been discussed on the reaper forums quite some years ago: forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?t=125584

[@StevieBoyesmusic]

Removing that * 2.08...... bit I can make it null with inserting the same value inserted in the GR line, as shown in this video.

[@seenbelow]

Dan: we have to go deeper Great video, as always. I love when someone with more know-how gets into plugin details.

[@DoveSimon]

You're the smoothest talking cheese toastie that's ever been. It's always a great day when there's a new Dan Worrall video. Thank you sir!

[@sleepCircle]

*I thought this video made it abundantly clear that he is not a cheese toastie.*

[@ClintMoody]

Yes! More Dan Worrall tutorials! I can't get enough.

[@AmagrasMUSIC]

I can't express how many ways I find this video fabulous

[@deceiver444]

This channel is one the best thing I stumbled across on youtube

[@tshrdrums]

That was really fascinating... thank you!

[@autotel]

Really good! That's why every time I try use the 1175 I end up going like: nope. With your fix, it sounds well!

[@TjMoon91]

I just watched a video of someone changing the code in software I don’t even use… and enjoyed every second of it.

[@jesperborgstrm3385]

been thinking for a while to get started looking at vst code and you just inspired me to install reaper paralel to cubase to get started fiddling. thank you so much Dan. br

[@MrNicknayme]

I loved the hearing the melody in the rhythm

[@MrFeinberg]

This is not only my favorite Dan Worrall video so far, but one of my favorite videos so far.

[@archologyzero]

There hasnt been a video from Dan that isn't just 100% pure gold.

[@maybe867]

Wow. You made the 1175 usable. Thank you very much

[@XRaym]

Fixed in next reaper release: 6.26rc3 - March 26 2021 + JSFX: update 1175 compressor to fix overcompression, add deprecated blown capacitor modes for old behavior (havent check the code, not sure how it has been fixed, a diff check is needed) Keep reporting ! 😉

[@XRaym]

Funny, this bug was alreayd reported at least in 2013, and affects other JS plugins: forum.cockos.com/showthread.php?p=2008836#post2008836 Though, it should all be fixed in nest version. Glad you made a video about this :P

[@memeswillneverdie]

I love that outro of Dan pointing out the melody humming it and then going "we'll roll with that" and the full song comes in, it's a small thing but my god that's a good transition.

[@Millweed]

Yesssss! You did after all! Thanks!

[@Mediaright]

"If this is a 4:1 ratio, then I'm a cheese toasty."

[@MontyCraig]

Very toasty indeed!

[@raycochrane3971]

Thanks - sounds like it's worth having a go.

[@BLMeredith87]

Brilliant! I'll be doing this tomorrow, always wondered what the devil was wrong with the 1175 plugin

[@christianmartinez1]

The king returns!

[@JimijaymesProductions]

Yes the video we didnt know we needed!

[@Stormsurf001]

Epic Dan - Thanks so much!

[@JoeyFTL]

That bass at the end is mean... Another magnificent video by the almighty Dan Worrall

[@elowine]

Great to see I'm not the only one who mods scripts by guessing how stuff works and changing stuff until it does.

[@GrandNebSmada]

Congratulations you can be a professional programmer now

[@0e0]

hey Dan i loved this video. I do a lot of stuff with JS (Especially modifications with stock plugins) I have a specific use case I wanted to share for the weird dynamics of the stock 1175...which is if you are doing some phrase sampling hiphop..you get this awesome ducking sort of sound on your soul samples which makes them pump.

[@sstillwell]

@Dan Worrall , I expect the problem isn't with the calculation of ratio (which really, truly should be correct), but with the value of "overdb" which is being multiplied by 2.08136898 (suspiciously close to your 2.1, eh?) on line 84 of the stock version of the plugin (line 10 of the @sample section). Your change accomplishes roughly the same thing as removing that multiplier, I'd think. Being that I wrote that around 15 years ago and haven't touched it since...it's hard to know what I was including that constant multiplier for, but I think that's more than likely the problem. Some of the math in there is condensed down to constants where possible to avoid using expensive functions like LOG() or EXP() if I didn't absolutely have to in the middle of a per-sample loop. A lot of those JS plugins were written as proof-of-concept of things I was working on...and JS is absolutely BRILLIANT for that. Also, like anyone, I learn over time and things I did then may not be the same things I would do now. You live, you learn. Really, REALLY odd that nobody's brought it up before now...or at least nobody brought it directly to MY attention where I could do something about it. I only found this video because someone else pointed it out to me. Always feel free to reach out to me if you have concerns about something I've written - if you don't have my contact information you can file a support ticket or fill out a contact form on the website and I'll be happy to provide it for you. Thank you for bringing it (indirectly) to my attention. :)

[@sstillwell]

Reviewing the source code of Rocket compared to 1175, I'm almost completely certain that's the issue. I've reported the same to Cockos if they want to fix it in their distribution, although that would cause a major backwards compatibility issue for existing projects.

[@DanWorrall]

Now I feel bad. In my defence, I had no right to expect support for an old JS plugin that's bundled with Reaper... But thanks for chipping in and clarifying, and I promise not to do that again!

[@sstillwell]

@@DanWorrall absolutely not a problem...you shouldn't feel bad at all! I wouldn't have known the issue was there unless someone reported it...if you find a problem in something else of mine, please...DO let me know. I just find it somewhat humorous that it's taken THIS long for someone to say something!

[@petersamps]

No problem for backward compatibility, as it turns out. The plugin has been updated, and the old settings are listed as "blown capacitor (ratio n) - deprecated" under the ratio dropdown. So the old settings remain, as well as the new ones.

[@sstillwell]

@@petersamps yep, talked with Justin at Cockos last night and this morning about it and reviewed his fix before he released it. 👍. Existing projects will use the “broken capacitor” presets and new instances will use the new settings by default.

[@AlessandroRorato]

I'm bored... what could I do? Well.... I could open a broken JS software and turn it in a good compressor even without any coding skills! Ok... no problemo, let's do it! :D Only Dan can do this. GENIUS!

[@graywyot]

It's an amazing video!

[@HazardousTube]

New Dan Worrall video, dis' gonna b gud! Already liked, now back to watching.

[@groovepusher]

Dan's like the man.!

[@marceloribeirosimoes8959]

Beautiful!

[@jurv7626]

Bro... I was just thinking about the JS 1175 and this video pops up, are you in my head 😳

[@Not-Only-Reaper-Tutorials]

ypur phone is spying your brain, your thoughts, your will 🤣🤣🤣

[@crookman42]

I'm 1k! Wooooh! Never experienced that before! IT'S THE BEST MY MANS! For real tho, this song is awesome! Likin' those side-wobs!

[@ononearts]

Brilliant.

[@angeloboltinimusic]

How dare you upload a video when I'm just about to go to bed! ;)

[@Ali_Seraj]

and he wants us to stand up and dance ,, let's roll with that

[@lh7666]

How dare you even thinking about going to bed when Dan just uploaded a video?!

[@synthnomore696]

The tune hacker. Amazing track 🔥🔥

[@sound-ur1bq]

this guy also sing ;-), thank you so much Dan, it gets me motivated to learn coding JS now

[@666tonsofsquirrels]

Excellent video; small suggestion: change the pointer design so that it's visible in all background. It's hard to follow a black pointer on a black background 6:00 😁

[@APaclin]

Best comedy in mix engineering 😂

[@januardmosia3949]

Bad boy Dan 🔥🔥🙌

[@PASHKULI]

Dirty hacker suspense music... Nice hack, Dan! Will try it right now! Thanks!

[@MIHAO]

Interesting stuff

[@rogercabo5545]

Dan you have a unbeatable Mr. Spock analyzing logic. This is amazing how you identify coherence and and bring them to the point! Great!

[@znopeusz]

let's roll with that

[@MCAlvesPortugal]

I felt the same with that plugin. Great hack code.😎

[@ryanedwardmusic]

Well I hope you make a part 2 to actually explain all buttons in!

[@dirkchurlish4074]

sweet hack. thanks, dan! love your vibe and your content. A++++ would do business again

[@bedtimeread]

😂😂😂 Dan Worrall you are a genius!

[@hanneswesterberg]

Dan the Mad Man!

[@tomtechno827]

Bumm bumm bumbumbumm - let’s roll with that

[@jacklane3679]

Craving a cheese toastie now

[@ollieark]

National Treasure!

[@unclemick-synths]

The plus side for me is I'd completely forgotten about this compressor!

[@assasin06soul]

and just after a fiew days I find out that they fixed the JS 1175 and added a "Blown capacitor deprecated" mode.... My god Dan your powerful

[@fragster42]

Quite epic

[@hpoz222]

Analog Obsession’s free FETish compressor implements all-buttons-in as a “smash” switch separate from the ratio!

[@aerahtv0000]

not surprised at all

[@peterorany]

What a mind!

[@blazavsenik752]

haha song at the end,you are insane Dan! You wipe out ‘real’ hiphop/trap/electronic producers in your every video, not to mention many times with rea plugins. This channel is a real reality check for young hothed producers who think they know something (unfortunatelly myself included)

[@Casur1N]

Maybe a lil late, but Analog Obsession's FETISH compressor plugin is an emulation that separates the Ratio from the All Buttons control with a SLAM button.

[@CHEpachilo]

FETISH is kinda best 1176 style plugin. It doesn't have all the possible bells and whistles, but it is 1176 with separate slam button and really great SC Eq. Never used other 1176 since I have FETISH

[@chrisbroxson3124]

That last part of this video where you hum out the melody you hear in the drums and then add a strings version of that melody over the rhythm is mind-bogglingly helpful. Thank you.

[@KarasamaBeats]

1:28 “He does get browny points for correctly implementing the Dry/Wet mix slider” I paused the video, died of laughter and continued watching 😂

[@sleepCircle]

You're like the Post 10 of audio processing

[@ValentinPane]

Guess what is in the Reaper update 6.26 notes like 1 week later: update 1175 compressor and various others to fix overcompression, add deprecated blown capacitor mode to preserve old behavior

[@nolyspe]

everyone commenting about the technical content and no one is commenting about the sick beat that Dan uses in that video.

[@autobotsNdecepticons]

8:29 I half expected to hear a random "Harry Potter!" now and then.

[@Gortmend]

Thanks for this video, and enduring the drama. I don't know much about coding, but earlier today, I started copying/pasting parts of various JS plugins and soon I had made my own little Haas Delay plugin, with left/right volume controls, etc. Not rocket science, and I'm sure someone has done it before and done it better, but it does the job and making it was more entertaining than surfing the web for free plugins. So thanks again.

[@Marius_Tarceatu]

Pam pam pam-pam-pam. Oh look, i want more of that song ...

[@Zet237yt]

Aaaand there's the Reaper update :)

[@Mansardian]

Dan: Releases another epic video. Thousands of people: can't wait to copy the code.

[@SteveStockmalMusic]

You sir are certainly NOT a cheese toastie !!!

[@zimouspero]

Wow wow wow... 1000 thanks. how and where i can get the vídeo music?

[@threatnique]

That outro is such a mic drop … #boss

[@MrAlFuture]

Nice one, Dan :) You know, I'd wear a t-shirt with "all buttons in is not a ratio" emblazoned on it.

[@scacchomattho]

I'd buy it

[@sleepCircle]

me too

[@nj1255]

Great tip! Now I just have to figure out how to do the same thing in Macfizz's GUI modded version if 1175. Btw, how did you manage to load a jsfx in plugin doctor?

[@DanWorrall]

There's a standalone ReaPlugs JS plugin

[@ARE_YOU_SICK_OF_YT_CENSORSHIP]

i just modified Macfizz's mod, but didn't test it, so if you need pointers let me know

[@nj1255]

@@ARE_YOU_SICK_OF_YT_CENSORSHIP It is the dkaps.jsfx-inc file that contains the compression algorithm, right? Is it line 63 that needs to be changed or some other line? Edit: Figured it out. It is line 63 in dkaps.jsfx-inc that needs to be changed from "/this.cratio;" to "/(this.cratio*2.1);" Thanks for the answer anyways! :)

[@ARE_YOU_SICK_OF_YT_CENSORSHIP]

@@nj1255 yep

[@Mr.Bucket-san]

Does pressing all ratio buttons in work on actual analogue compressors, or does it also just effect the attack and release behaviour? We have a urei 1178 at uni and we've just started using it. Is it a case by case basis? Very curious to try it out.

[@DanWorrall]

The plugins all work like that because that's what the hardware did!

[@Mr.Bucket-san]

@@DanWorrall sick!

[@Beatsbasteln]

dan worrall, an audio engineer and musician who just casually improves the work of a dsp developer xD that's so cool

[@heavymetalmixer91]

What I get from seein this compressor work is that it actually is a Negative Ratio compressor, the most extreme way to compress. It works something like this: Let's say you have the threshold at -12 and the signal is peaking at -6. If you set a 2:1 ration the compressor would reduce 3 dB in theory. With a ratio of -2:1 (notice the minus which indicates it's negative), the compressor will reduce 2x times what goes over the threshold, which would be 12 dB. If the ratio was -3:1, the the compressor would reduce 18 dB. And so on.

[@Fetterbruhmoment]

Wow 2 Videos in one week?! Is this Christmas?

[@DanWorrall]

This one was a lot quicker and easier to make than most. Funny how the number of views I get doesn't correlate at all with the effort I put into it...

[@Marius_Tarceatu]

@@DanWorrall next tutorial by dan: what is wrong with stock youtube 😅

[@MartinvonBargen]

I suspect that if Dan is old enough, then he was that kid in 1980s BBC micro computer lessons at school who'd wait for the teacher to make a statement, then he'd chip in with, "well, actually..." I also suspect that he could correctly interpret the loading sounds of most, if not all ZX Spectrum games.

[@DanWorrall]

I'd be a developer now if that was me! Yes I'm old enough, but my dad bought an Acorn Electron rather than anything fun like a Spectrum. I didn't take much of an interest in computers till I bought a second hand Atari ST in the nineties (price: one pint of Guinness).

[@MartinvonBargen]

@@DanWorrall Similar story for me with school as I viewed the BBC micros as a source of agony, not fun. I got into programming a bit of BASIC with the Speccy, and did a year at uni too. My mate did a bit of sequencing with his Atari ST an I should have given it a go back then too. Speaking of Guinness, where did you have your first proper pint? Mine was in Flanagan's Apple in Liverpool, but the evening ended in disaster for me. But that's a story for another plugin dissection altogether. 🤪

[@DanWorrall]

A pub in Cheadle. Can't remember the name, its long gone. I was about 14 I think...

[@nj1255]

To everyone who wants to do the same edit to the Macfizz GUI modded version of the Stillwell 1175, It is line 63 in the dkaps.jsfx-inc file that needs to be changed from "/this.cratio;" to "/(this.cratio*2.1);"

[@StevieBoyesmusic]

just delete any parts that say, * 2.08............ does the same thing!

[@kurglekreutzer6344]

I want this new version! It would be useful!

[@DanWorrall]

I've shown you how to get it, no? Editing the code requires less typing than your comment ;)

[@kurglekreutzer6344]

@@DanWorrall Yep, I made it before I even typed the comment, but the Internet makes us all fools! Hahaha! Cheers!

[@johnnydove]

damn i could really use a cheese toastie right about now

[@Jaburu]

he actualy used PluginDoctor to heal a plugin

[@observer_music]

The youtube channel DIY Recording Equipment did a teardown of the hardware 1176, the ratio isnt actually a ratio control at all it controls the sidechain threshold

[@DanWorrall]

I found the video. I'm afraid I only half watched it, while playing Minecraft with my little boy, but if I understood it correctly: yes the ratio buttons move the threshold, but due to the non linearities in the sidechain circuit this results in a different effective ratio. But I might have got that wrong, I was busy killing blazes at the time... ;)

[@alexthi]

Funny! I've had a look at the code, and line 84 is: overdb = 2.08136898 * log(det/cthreshv) * log2db; No idea what that magic 2.0813... is for, but with what you're telling it sure looks very suspicious.

[@DanWorrall]

I have a sneaking suspicion, which I wasn't confident enough to mention in the video. However, 1176 compressors are feedback designs. In order to achieve a 2:1 ratio with a feedback topology you actually need a hard limiter transfer curve internally. Higher ratios, like 4:1 require ducking style transfer curves, just like the unmodified 1175. My guess is that this is actually running as a feed forward design, when that wasn't intended, and the transfer curves are designed for feedback operation. But I'm too lazy to try to untangle the code and see if I'm right.

[@alexthi]

@@DanWorrall That's an interesting suspicion. The code really looks like unfinished work to me: there is actually an RMS feature in it, which just lacks a slider on the UI. It takes very few modifications to turn this implementation into a feedback compressor (multiplying maxspl by grv, removing that 2.0813... and setting gr = -overdb*(cratio-1) without the division by cratio). It is a bit glitchy for very short attack times though (

[@juneaftn]

2.08136898 = 1/(ln 2)^2

[@sstillwell]

After 15 years, I don't know what the 2.08... was for, either. :). But you're correct that that is where the problem is. The ratio calculation is correct. Increasing the denominator of the ratio calculation by 2.1 roughly compensates for overstated calculation of the amount over threshold.

[@sstillwell]

@@DanWorrall 1175 is not a direct emulation of an 1176...rather just a compressor with similar VERY fast attack (and less so on release) times. That yields a surprising amount of the "flavor" of an 1176. Writing truly complex code in JS is difficult since all variables are essentially global whether you use functions/subroutines or not. @alexthi is correct about where the main problem you described with the ratio is actually located. I made a comment at the top of the page before I saw these comments. After 15 years it's all a blur anyway. :)