I worked at GM Holden's plant when we were making the GTO coupe,G8 and GXP for Pontiac..we also made pre production pilot G8 versions of the Commodore Ute ( to be badged G8ST)...this was an awesome time to be working at Holden,and a very proud moment for everyone at Holden to be making V8 performance cars for Pontiac.
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Very cool! Thanks for commenting!
@cavalierliberty68385 ай бұрын
I blame saving Buick as the thing that singlehandedly killed both Pontiac and Australian made Holdens.
@billyjoejimbob56 Жыл бұрын
Jon: I have been enjoying your video series, and Pontiac was and still is my favorite former GM brand. My dad's first car was a 10 year old 1941 Torpedo Coupe six. That was followed by a less used 4-door sedan six. After a '56 Chevrolet, he returned to Pontiac for a 1963 Catalina 4-door sedan. With three on the tree and no power steering or brakes, it had to be the most stripped down Pontiac off the assembly line that year. Then there was the '66 Caalina Safari that dad loved but mom was afraid to drive. In 1995, I purchased a new Bonneville SLE... Leather interior and upgraded exterior trim with the then new Series II 3800. It was a distinctive look for its time, and a good car for many years, but a money pit once it reached 100K miles. I agree that for most of Pontiac's history, it was an unremarkable brand based on shared platforms and varying levels of badge engineering. Its best years began in 1955, stretched into the 60s, then faded into a generic commodity by the mid 70s. Developing a meaningfully different personalities for each GM brand was an achieivable goal in the 50s when each brand was essentially a single core product line offering multiple body styles and trim levels, but that didn't last. As the market evolved into multiple size segments, resources had to be sub-divided into multiple platforms and vehicle architectures. Light trucks grew in share and importance to the bottom line. New segments such as mini-vans, and SUVs drew customers away from traditional body styles. Competition became global both at home and in markets abroad. The resources that once enabled distinct brand identities for Pontiac and other brands were spread too thin to capture the attention of customers in a changing market place. Today's GM has retreated from most global markets, and in its home market comprises just three brands/channels... Chevrolet, Buick/GMC, and Cadillac. Each makes most of its profit on badge engineered versions of shared light truck and crossover sport utility platforms. It is no longer the GM that Alfred Sloan once envisioned.
@THEDonnyB9 ай бұрын
The split grill Pontiac look is iconic. It makes Pontiac arguably the most identifiable car.
@jeffery2864 Жыл бұрын
The Pontiac brand brings back many fond memories in my family. My uncle Jim was employed by the division as a technical illustrator for his 30yr career at GM. My first remembrance was of his red body / white roof 1959 Pontiac Bonneville that he claimed could hold 5 golf bags (which it easily did). My dad brought home a Tempest in 1961 that was an economical car for moms use in a deep maroon with matching color-keyed interior. My career as a tech illustrator saw me work on the ‘84 Fiero program. We were able to take early prototypes out onto I-75 in Troy, Michigan to experience a real sports car feeling. There was much new production technology introduc-ed - space frames that were placed into a jig that simultaneously drilled all the holes needed to fasten the plastic body panels (an industry first). I also recall working on the J-car program in Pontiacs attempt (along with Chevys Cavalier & Cadillac Cimmaron) to downsize into the compact segment. In 1986 Pontiac had a very stylish new Bonneville that I felt was GMs best looking full-size 4 door. But then who can forget the Aztec, a forward thinking sport utility that was nothing short of ugly! (At least Breaking Bad brought it back to noterity!) I recall go -ing the last North American (Detroit) International Auto Show to see the last ever Pontiac display. Sad to see what was once the “wide track” division fall into the annals of auto-motive history!
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
I've got a video about the Fiero and one of the coolest things I discovered when researching it was that jig you mentioned that drilled all the holes for the panels at once. That was just cool. :)
@dicksanders82069 ай бұрын
Nice reference -- the Aztec in Breaking Bad.
@wonkychikn5 ай бұрын
Fun fact..the Fiero plastic body panels were developed in conjunction with Nylex plastics of Australia!
@empireoflizards Жыл бұрын
'Platform Sharing' must be a nice way of saying 'Corporate Meddling With Company's innovators' lol. Aside from that, perhaps one can still see Pontiac's subtle roles in car history that had some stand-out moments and then declined but otherwise still filled a valid role in car history.
@dicksanders8206 Жыл бұрын
What a great story, Jon. This video is highly enjoyable. I will watch it again! Thanks.
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Awesome, thank you!
@bobcarlino72809 ай бұрын
Agreed!
@Trapper42652 жыл бұрын
Jon, kudos for another extremely poignant and intelligent history of once America's most popular car brand, Pontiac. I currently own a 2008 Grand Prix, base model, I purchased new, which rolled 200k miles this summer, primarily due to GM's reliable 3800 engine, but to restate your point, it could have very well been an Olds Intrigue, a Buick LeSabre, a Chevy Malibu or Impala. By 2008, the Grand Prix's only claim to fame is that it looked sportier, that's it! Thanks again for a Grand Prix run down the fast lane of Pontiac's highway to extinction. Hahaha! You would make a great "TED Talk" speaker on automotive history. 😊
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Haha! Thanks for the comment and compliment. I don't know all this off the top of my head, it takes a lot of research. :)
@andrewdonohue1853 Жыл бұрын
supercharged 3800 or NA? the GTP (later GT supercharged) was a blast with some mods. the 3800 is one hell of an engine. i have owned many, and currently own 2. you can pry them from my dead cold fingers. GM's current engines largely suck
@ginaboos9563 Жыл бұрын
Pontiacs handle much better than the others with the great buick 3800. Been running pontiac for 32 years. Just wish they paired a better trans maybe even a 5 speed.
@andrewdonohue1853 Жыл бұрын
@@ginaboos9563 an L67 5 speed grand prix or bonneville SSEi would have been a blast
@ericbritton9346 Жыл бұрын
That was a great history of the Pontiac brand. I had owned three in my time. 1987 Grand Am LE sedan white 1998 Grand Am GT sedan green 1997 Bonneville SSEi silver I miss them so. Now Chevy Malibu are the sole survivor of the GM brand, we don't have anything to choose from anymore. Now we have is SUVs and crossovers, there are considerable boring cars, and people don't want to have fun anymore driving. They treat them like household appliances now, and more Imports and European markets are fun cars now. Sad to say.
@slantfish65sd Жыл бұрын
Okay okay you win. Your videos are pretty freaking awesome. I really appreciate you bringing a lot of this Pontiac Street a lot. You're really touching on a lot of the early history and stuff that a lot of other people just skim over and they don't include. Awesome work sir
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
I appreciate that! I always get interested in the little threads that connect things - like my Studebaker video where the family founder almost wasn't allowed to leave Germany because he had secret knowledge about working with metal and wood they didn't want to leave the country! I'm always afraid people will find the cool little facts boring, whereas I find too in-depth discussions of minor changes in head bolt patterns yawn-inducing. Just trying to be "me" and hope others find it interesting! (oh, and I do like to win. LOL!!)
@davinp2 жыл бұрын
It's been said the odd looking Pontiac Aztec helped kill off Pontiac. GM used cheap plastics in Pontiac. The Pontiac Vibe is a better vehicle because it was made by Toyota. It's the Pontiac version of the Corolla Matrix. This was Toyota's last partnership with GM
@bradsmith950 Жыл бұрын
Pare eez e Ann
@dougybrownie481 Жыл бұрын
I have a vibe GT and it has to a Toyota engine and it’s a great little get about car.My dream was GTO or a Trans Am , that’s when Pontiac was great
@TheREALOC1972 Жыл бұрын
Nah, getting rid of the Firebird is what killed Pontiac. They could have done nothing but the Firebird and it would have survived.
@Thatdavemarsh Жыл бұрын
I love these far too brief histories. Your stories are told extremely well and are thoroughly enjoyable!
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Glad you like them!
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
Also don't forget Pontiac's Canadian Sub-brands like Acadian and Beaumont.
@garrettbenson7743 Жыл бұрын
I’ve got 2x1965 Ponchos and a 66. GPs and a Lemans. 36k, 42k and 44k original miles with original paint. Love those cars. Putting new white walls on the 8 lugs today!
@8176morgan Жыл бұрын
A great many years ago our family car was a white 1961 Pontiac Tempest station wagon. My father had bought it used in 1964 and It had previously belonged to a postal carrier who during that time span had already put around 60,000 miles on it. That particular car was the worst by far that my family ever owned, with the primary reason being that despite being a mid-size station wagon it had only four cylinders producing an output of just110 hp, which is far too little for a car of that size, so as a consequence it was constantly causing us problems. At 88,000 miles it went through the costly process of having the engine rebuilt and a couple of years later we limped it down to a car dealer that my father knew well and bought a brand new 1969 Rambler Ambassador station wagon - and what a difference that car made in the way of reliability! As a result of that first-hand experience I have never had a very high opinion of anything that General Motors has had to offer, even though I'm sure they have produced vehicles of significantly better durability. BTW. There were over 300,000 first-generation Pontiac Tempests built between the years 1961-63, and yet according to the Pontiac Little Indian car club there are less than 600 which are known to have survived; making it I guess a fairly rare automobile today, but also one that bears testimony to the very poor quality of its overall workmanship. 🙁
@fob1xxl Жыл бұрын
In 1959 my Dad bought a Pontiac Bonneville 4 door Vistadome hardtop, or 4dr flat top. It was gorgeous. White body with Coral roof. Interior was white and coral. A real knockout ! Car was so big, but handled like a compact. Fond memories. I was a teenager !
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing!
@bobcarlino72809 ай бұрын
My parents had a couple of Pontiacs: a '59 Catalina wagon with a 389-4V with dual exhausts; a ho-hum '67 Executive wagon; and a '73 Grand Prix SJ with a 455-4V (that beast could smoke the right rear tire like there was no tomorrow!). I've only owned one Pontiac: a '78 Phoenix with a 305 under the hood...a good, reliable car. In my opinion, Pontiac easily had the best-looking cars of the 60's...such as the '63 & '69 Grand Prix; the '65 Bonneville; the '67 GTO hardtop; etc.
@williamflack57674 ай бұрын
I had 1976 Pontiac Grand Le Man's. Beautiful car. Dad helped me get it. I was 16. Paid the note 100.00 bucks a month. Factory 8 Track player. Bucket seats. Full console. I hope to find a 76 or 77 Grand Prix. Had the 350. Pontiac, my favorite car.
@leonardgordon17482 жыл бұрын
Great video with lots of information that I never heard before. My Dad after he retired bought a yellow mid 80s fourth generation Gran Prix. He loved that car although the doors were so long you could barely get out of the car in the garage. It’s funny how that is the only Pontiac that I remember him having even though his cousin owned one of the biggest Pontiac dealerships in the area. Thanks again
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the kind words! Funny you mentioned the size of the doors! My grandfather's Pontiac was a 70-ish something (i was young and don't really remember) but you could barely open the doors in his garage!
@eddiego8197 Жыл бұрын
I had a 2005 Pontiac Vibe, it was identical to the Toyota Matrix only 6" longer. It was super reliable, roomy, very economical, and just a joy to drive, best car I ever had it could do 80mph and get 32mpg, what a great car!
@bobcarlino72809 ай бұрын
I was always amazed at how poorly the Pontiac Vibe did in the marketplace. IMO, it was genius...the reliability, economy and value of a Toyota, but with a Detroit nameplate for those who insisted on "buying American".
@courtneypuzzo2502 Жыл бұрын
some of my favorite muscle cars including GTO Trans Am Firebird Gran Prix etc. my aunt Betty had a used 1970 Trans Am in the late 70s to mid 1980s
@nofaith5994 Жыл бұрын
I had a 1950 Pontiac Silver Streak with a massive straight 8 and a 1973 Pontiac Catalina that was the most luxurious beast imaginable. Loved them both.
@mbd501 Жыл бұрын
I grew up in the heyday of the Firebird and Trans Am of the 70s and 80s, so I still think of Pontiac as the performance division of GM. I always liked Trans Ams better than Camaros or Mustangs.
@fob1xxl7 ай бұрын
It was the HOTTEST MUSCLE CAR around in the 60s . From FIREBIRD, GTO, and THE JUDGE, they covered it all !
@RoadRunnergarage85702 жыл бұрын
Thanks for doing a Pontiac history video!!... I'd like to see one on Plymouth, Mercury,AMC, Studebaker etc...
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Your wish is my suggestion! LOL!
@jonathang20172 жыл бұрын
Bunkie Knudsen's (pronounced nude-sen) granddaughter is a very good friend of mine. Missy has some very interesting stories about Lee Iacocca, Larry Shinoda, and "Uncle" Harley Earl. One of my all-time favorite cars is the Continental Mark IV, and I continually thank Missy for the fact that Bunkie approved and green-lighted the design before he was fired as President of Ford.
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
That's awesome, be cool to hear some of those stories. :)
@RagShop1 Жыл бұрын
Reportedly, Bunkie also ordered the crash restyling of the T-Bird which resulted in the 1970 model with it's sharp, bird-beak like prow and a new fastback roofline. It wasn't a new design but a restyle of the 1967-1969 model meant to shore up sales until the all-new 1972 Thunderbird came out.
@jonathang2017 Жыл бұрын
@@RagShop1 The Bunkie Beak...
@wmalden Жыл бұрын
I always pronounced Knudsen “Kah-NOOD-sen”.
@TheREALOC1972 Жыл бұрын
That's cool, Susie, his son Peter's granddaughter was my High School Sweetheart in the late 80's, and I corrected him too.... I met Bunkie and Francy, that's what he called her, a couple times. he was an absolutely incredible man and he had this auroa about him that just told you "Don't screw with thIs man", I had a 76 Camaro and he insisted on going for a ride in it, about halfway through he made me pull over so he could drive even though he wasn;t supposed to drive, then we pulled back over a couple blocks from the house and switched again so noone would know. He knew you know.... contrary to popular belief and GM folklore he knew what Pete Estes and John Delorian was up to when they were "breaking the rules" coming up with the GTO and stuffing that big 400 in the Firebird, he hired them while he was head of Pontiac simply because they were Rebels and would do stuff they weren't supposed to do, he knew just never said anything in order to let it happen.
@texasbassranger9 ай бұрын
I learned to drive as a kid in a 1953 Pontiac Chieftain with a straight eight engine. It was a bit slow off the line but it was like driving my living room down the road. It had a back seat the size of a tennis court and was....uh, perfect for a teenaged boy. I loved that car and do to this day.
@keithgray692010 ай бұрын
I've always liked Pontiacs, owning a 75 Formula 350 and a 05 G6 GT with a panoramic roof. Loved both cars!
@carrsllccarrillo6507 Жыл бұрын
Pontiac was indeed the performance division. It captivated the youth and prowlness of a brand that wanted to stand out from the rest being under the GM corporate umbrella. Since I was kid watching Knightrider I always wanted to own my own firebird and that opportunity came when I turned 17 and owned a used '87 Trans Am. From there I became a Pontiac fan for life. By the time I turned '23 I end up selling the car and bought something better, a '89 Flame Red Metallic GTA with ttops. Although I may be a bit bias and this it my opinion, to me it was one of best looking, best handling sports cars with a solid axle system that I have ever driven and as a auto tech I can sure do that kind of comparison. I also had many ties among family and freinds who also owned Pontiacs of their own. An aunt who owned a '77 grand prix. A great uncle who owned a '78 Trans Am. A freind who owned a '67 GTO and 2 grand prixs of the late 90s. A second cousin who owned a '82 Trans Am. An uncle who owned several: a '67 firebird convertible, a '79 Trans Am, a '89 GTA convertible with the 350, a 25th anniversary Trans Am, the 30th anniversary Trans Am. My mom owned a '07 G6 and my younger brother owned '02 GTP Grand Prix which I rebuilt the engine. (Love those 3800s) Even at the first shop I worked for my boss had a Pontiac. First a '93 Bonneville SE and then '01 Bonneville SSEI. For whatever reason I have always felt comfortable driving a Pontiac and that hasn't changed my mind one bit. That car company to me was screwed over by GM as a whole with playing politics when the bailout rolled around. The axing of the brand left a bitter taste in my mouth that hasn't left. I felt it was totally unfair for allowing the other brand: Buick to continue. Especially when GM end up selling out to China and selling more Buicks there then here. As much as I want the brand to be revived (and wish it was bought out from another party), I rather not see it occur as it would be tarnished by a greedy corporation that has no idea what it had. To me division #2 is #1 in my eyes.
@andrewdonohue1853 Жыл бұрын
the 3800 is a fantastic engine, it's a real shame GM doesnt build that kind of quality anymore. i still own 2 3800 pontiacs. im surprised you had to rebuild one, they typically run forever unless you flog them HARD
@carrsllccarrillo6507 Жыл бұрын
@@andrewdonohue1853 unfortunately the engine was neglected from the original owner. From my observation the car sat for long periods as the odometer just shows under 80k on the clock when I bought it. When I did the tear down the oil was pretty sludged up in the valley. I believe lack of maintenance was the issue and upon further tear down it look like the #2 rod was loose causing it to knock during travel. I plan on doing a complete tear down and rebuild down the road. But for now the replacement used engine is doing quite well and enjoying the miles of smiles its putting on my face.
@WhittyPics Жыл бұрын
I have owned a few Pontiacs in my lifetime. I bought a 78 Firebird when I was 18
@j.kevvideoproductions.6463 Жыл бұрын
Very concise breakdown of all the GM divisions and companion makes! Apparently my Maternal grandparent's owned an Oakland during the Mid Twenties. My Mother didn't remember it very well though as she was just early grade school age at the time. The first car I ever bought with my own $ was a '71 LeMan's 4 dr Sedan. It was a good solid car that was very reliable, but not sporty enough for a guy in late teens, or early 20's. Ended up buying a '73 Mercury Capri.
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Thanks, appreciate the kind words! getting into the companion makes was necessary for the video... but hard to do to keep it concise and not drone on about it. (at least I hope I didn't!)
@spod299810 ай бұрын
I think it's worth noting two things about the 1980s Pontiac: for one, the 6000 actually held up against Mercedes and BMW. It received several awards from '84 - '87, and got ABS and AWD options for 1987 buyers, but was plagued with quality control issues like most other GMs of the era. Second is that the J2000, or 2000 Sunbird, or just Sunbird (they changed the name three times in three years, lol) had an awful start, which is why the car didn't sell too well, but had a turbocharged I4 option starting in 1984 which did bring some buyers back. It was actually a pretty powerful engine at the time, but ran hot and again, faced quality control problems, namely rusting issues.
@davinp2 жыл бұрын
Pontiac had just rebadged Chevy, Buick or Oldsmobile but the Pontiac was the sportier version
@robertzip49 Жыл бұрын
I graduated high school n 79. I had a 65 grand prix. 4 barrel. Loved that thing
@holykingfish Жыл бұрын
Great video. Canadian Pontiac Parisienne is pronounced Parry-she-anne. Which is what you would call something from Paris, France.
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
I know. I've had many comments that I got it wrong. :)
@mbd501 Жыл бұрын
Par-ee-zee-enne. Its French for Parisian.
@alext8828 Жыл бұрын
Make it -zhe- and you got it.
@alext8828 Жыл бұрын
Point of interest. A friend of mine got hold of a '54 Pontiac convertible with a 4-speed Hydramatic transmission. The neck-snapping 1-2 shift would occur in the middle of an intersection. And second gear was no slouch either. It was the straight-eight version. Those transmissions became legendary. Nothing was faster. I don't know if any other GM car utilized them.
@bucklinoutdoorpowerequipme3846 Жыл бұрын
You mentioned the Chevy Citation. I had an 80 Citation with the 2.5 4 cylinder with a 2 barrel carburetor with a 4 speed manual transmission. Run like a striped ass ape. Was never beaten by another 4 cylinder in a race flat out. Not even a 2002 Honda CRX could keep up with it. That car had spirt. Plus if I said out of it it got 40mpg all day long. Damn I miss that car. I parked it because reverse was almost out of it. And my sister's boyfriend at the time stole it and sold it for scrap while I was driving an 18wheeler. Along with 15 other cars I had.
@bobcarlino72809 ай бұрын
"Striped ass ape"? Love it!!!!
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
Hey Jon, we had a 2001 Pontiac Grand Prix GT and it was a really nice sporty FWD sedan that can take corners pretty well and lasted about 5 years then after that it started to fall apart.
@andrewdonohue1853 Жыл бұрын
we still have a 97 and it hasnt fallen apart. it's 27 years old but we did buy it with 36K on it, old lady's car. currently it has 54K on it. it's needed some minor repairs, nothing driveline related. i coat it heavily with fluid film to keep the rust monster away.
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
@@andrewdonohue1853 Awesome brother
@johnnymason2460 Жыл бұрын
I'm glad Knight Rider got a mention here. That show helped the Firebird sell so much better. It made me interested in having a Trans Am. I actually still want one.
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
I think they're still great looking cars, but that could be my childhood speaking! :)
@SeaTravelr1239 ай бұрын
Hi Jon. Great presentation, looking to hear more. Pontiac did lose its way, But I still think they had some of the sharpest cars Even through the malaise years. I own 7 classics. 63-75. Big guns. Bonnevilles and Grand Villes. Also had a Vibe 365K before I decide to trade it, and I still miss it. Aztek was ugly, but well thought out. I always liked them. But the cheap materials at the time did them in. Would have been interesting to see them sell the name plate and see where fresh ideas would have taken it.
@andrewdonohue1853 Жыл бұрын
i love my 2 pontiac cars. i just wont get rid of them. i have a 2003 bonneville SSEi (love this car) i wont drive in the winter. it has SOME rust underneath but i bought it before the previous owner finished destroying it. it has been parked for the last 3 winters and the rust really hasnt gotten any worse. i also treat the car with fluid film. i hope i can keep it for a long time, the body is gorgous..... no gas filler area rot (where the 10th generation bonneville rusted out badly). we also have a nice 97 grand prix L36 3800 which is my wife's car. we dont have a choice but to drive it in the winter, but it gets coated heavily with fluid film. i cant park them both in the winter, but the 97 is solid and still has complete rocker panels. most people treat these cars like garbage, just drive them and do nothing to prevent or stop rust. i try everything in my power to keep them nice. i do NOT like GM offerings anymore, and for the 1st time in my life i bought a new car so i can keep the bonneville OUT of the salt. i bought a subaru crosstrek 6 speed manual.
@manher4335 Жыл бұрын
What saddens me is that 3rd gen Firebirds were nothing more than reskined Camaros by that point until the end.
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
Not to mention that the 3rd and 4th gen Firebirds look extremely hideous and ugly compared to the beautiful 1st and 2nd gen Firebirds and Trans-AMs.
@Romiman1 Жыл бұрын
Not only the 3rd gen.
@bobfeller6049 ай бұрын
My parents had a '66 Bonneville and my dad said it was a terrific car.
@lonnyjaw Жыл бұрын
We bought a brand new 2004 Pontiac Grand Am GT 2 door coupe with the 'Ram Air' and we still have it. For the most part it's pretty reliable and it 'rocks' as far as performance. We've already had a couple of people asking if we would sell it.
@richarderickson8840 Жыл бұрын
Learned to drive in parents 1965 Catalina station wagon, White with green interior. then I crushed back passenger side door leaving the carwash. Dad never let me drive his stuff again. Thanks for your content.
@draymanil Жыл бұрын
Awesome video. I’ve owned a couple antique pontiacs and loved them
@FoxKing3884 ай бұрын
I’m subscribed to your channel dude and I gotta say I’m interested in all the old car history stuff you talk about I always had a interest in cars 🚗
@AllCarswithJon4 ай бұрын
Hope you enjoy it! Glad you're here!
@FoxKing3884 ай бұрын
@@AllCarswithJon oh I’m staying because I wanna hear everything about every car brand history because it’s interesting 🤔
@johnh25142 жыл бұрын
Thanks for another good video. At the time of the GM bankruptcy, I rooted for Pontiac’s survival, but in hindsight it just made sense to go. Sadly, it’s renaissance came at least 5 years too late.
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the comment - and what I found is that I had agreed with you, their renaissance was cut short I thought, but in hindsight it was scattershot products that looked good on paper, but the rest of the line up was same-old, same-old. I now think it was less "renaissance" and more likely "death throws".
@harrytran18742 жыл бұрын
GM killed off brands like Pontiac, Saturn, Hummer, Oldsmobile, Holden, etc. Then GM brought Hummer from the dead.
@davidtucker3729 Жыл бұрын
Pontiac fan forever. Thanks Jon
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
my pleasure.
@allanbeller529 Жыл бұрын
You did a great job, but overlooked the stillborn Pontiac Banshee that was the inspiration for the 1968 Corvette Stingray. Its been said that GM gave the Firebird to Pontiac as a consolation prize for sacrificing the Banshee to Chevy. Another overlooked Pontiac was the 1987 front drive Bonneville that received rave reviews and was a sales success, which replaced the `1984-87 midsized rear drive model. Subsequent Bonnevilles didn't get the same press nor were as successful. The downfall of Pontiac was that after about 1988 Pontiac lost its stylistic edge, and by the late 1990s/2000s their cars were as bland on the outsides as Oldsmobiles, while their misguided attempts at sporty-swoopy dashboards as described by Bob Lutz, looked like someone poured a blob of molten plastic into the car through the open sunroof..
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
I'd never heard that Lutz quote before, but I love it. :)
@rogersmith5292 Жыл бұрын
My favorite Pontiac is the 68 tempest overhead cam 6 cylinder with the 3 speed munsey.
@devonmask5192 Жыл бұрын
The Parisienne (Par-eez-ee-en) was an emergency rush job, after Pontiac made the same mistake Chrysler did in '62 by going too far into downsizing. The mid sized LeMans was made a Bonneville and bombed as full size cars started to sell better again, hence the Canadian Pontiacized Chevy. Could have also included: The 4 cylinder Tempests rope driveshaft (the slant 4 had MAJOR balance/vibration issues, which the flex shaft kinda helped mask). Endura front end for the '68 GTO was also a big deal (and I believe captured a fourth MT Car of the Year spot). The Super Duty 455 was a clever (if somewhat illegal) last gasp of a musclecar engine, creating Trans Ams and Formulas that could stand square with most 60's muscle cars.
@gregcrabb3497 Жыл бұрын
Glad you put the proper pronunciation. That always irks me...the same way people mispronounce Porsche (por-shuh)...the "e" is not silent.
@charlie_nolan Жыл бұрын
I think actually in the 90s and 2000s, Pontiac made some very cool cars, even if most were somewhat badge-engineered or imports. Such as GXP trim cars, the imported GTO, etc
@MisterMikeTexas2 жыл бұрын
It was sad to see Pontiac go. If the brand were to be revived, it unfortunately would likely be all-EV like the new Hummer.
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
We've all got to face up to it.... they all will be soon.
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
The 04-06 GTOs are not even real Pontiacs, they're nothing but rebadged Holden Monaros from Australia mate just like the 08-09 G8s are nothing but rebadged Holden Commodores as well.
@vladtheimpala5532 Жыл бұрын
The malaise era made it hard to build excitement. Pontiac gave it a shot though. I like the 60 Bonneville and the 64-70 GTO. The Tempest with the transmission in the rear was innovative. When Pontiac got the Corvair platform, DeLorean didn’t want to do just another knock off of a Chevy so he went to the drawing board and came up with a winner that didn’t get the attention it deserved. Other than that, I agree with you. Pontiac didn’t have enough of its own unique identity. With a few notable exceptions Pontiac built boredom.
@RoadRunnergarage85702 жыл бұрын
My Grandfather was a Pontiac man .. In fact my folks still own the 75 Grand Prix LJ that was my Grandfather's last car... We take it to a few shows a year....
@michaelgagne28712 жыл бұрын
Gratuit video! I never knew G5 were only sold as coups in US. In Canada, we had a 4 door variant.
@blumobean Жыл бұрын
Pontiac, some of the most beautiful cars ever made, and some of the crappiest ever produced. I owned a 1977 Grand Prix, absolutely beautiful light metallic green. Came from the factory with a broken spark plug, and went through the dealership shop (supposedly). Wife drove it home, then I drove it. Took it to the dealership the next day. Asked the shop manager about that huge red Sun test machine, said it must have cost a young fortune. He said yes it was expensive, and I told him they should sell it. He was shocked when I said that my car had a broken spark plug, and they must not know how to use it. Later oil started pouring out of the rear seal. Worse car I have ever owned.
@gordonwallin2368 Жыл бұрын
Cheers from the Pacific West Coast of Canada.
@warrenny7 ай бұрын
Agree with you that at the time Pontiac was cancelled, it could not do anything that could not be done by another brand: extra power, extra luxury, etc. That could all be added to any GM brand. I haven't fully delved into all of your videos but I still think the biggest question is why was GMC allowed remain? When I was growing up GMC was barely a recognized brand name. It's the same product. She is a hack. She is being paid to sell brand new
@AllCarswithJon7 ай бұрын
I think GMC was allowed for 2 very basic reasons. 1. Many (most?) dealerships were Pontiac, Buick, GMC. With Pontiac being cancelled GMC served as the "Truck" option for people going to Buick dealerships. :) 2. Money. GM designs a new truck for Chevy, then sells a similar version at GMC, typically for more $$$. GMC trucks are a cash cow for GM, adding sales that may not automatically go to Chevy.
@warrenny7 ай бұрын
@@AllCarswithJon I did find your video on GMC. I had no idea that GMC was that old. I suppose it was/is a popular brand and I just never knew it.
@TheREALOC1972 Жыл бұрын
I knew Bunkie Knudson, which is pronounced "Nude-son" btw, I his Great granddaughter Susan was my High School Sweetheart, and He knew..... contrary to the popular belief and folklore from GM publicly, he knew what the guys at Pontiac was doing, people forget that he was the President of Pontiac before he became the President of GM, While at Pontiac he hired Pete Estes from Oldsmobile and John Delorian from Packard to do EXACTLY what they did while Pontiac in the mid and late 60's. When he took over at GM he moved the Pontiac Division out of the buildings they were in to the back of engineering compound on purpose, out of sight out of mind, on purpose.
@alext8828 Жыл бұрын
Skunkworks II.
@rt_goblin_hours Жыл бұрын
I grew up in a Pontiac grand am we did a roadtrip across the country in. Only issues was it overheating lol
@captainofiron3 ай бұрын
So many times Pontiac could have revolutionized GM but it's awesome ideas were always killed, Banshee, the original Trans Am 302, the original idea of the Turbo V8.
@pto200 Жыл бұрын
Enjoy your videos. Very complete and fair information. Do you have a video on what happened to Dodge trucks?
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
No. I've often thought about doing one, especially when they made the jump to 'mini-kenworth" bodystyle, but I've never taken that task on.
@pto200 Жыл бұрын
@@AllCarswithJon Well then, i would appreciate your consideration. Thank you
@michaellong63362 жыл бұрын
Great job. Perfect length. Great assessment
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Much appreciated!
@WayneMemphisMojo2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for doing this video on Pontiac. I've only owned 1 Pontiac (T-1000 Chevette clone). My ONLY complaint about Pontiacs which may only apply to their late model cars ... those red dashboard lights & gages, I never liked that.
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for sharing
@carrsllccarrillo6507 Жыл бұрын
Every GM manufacture had different color instrumentation. Red was distinct to Pontiac for many years.
@georgewilson1184 Жыл бұрын
I do miss Pontiac & Olds
@ryanhildebrand8658 Жыл бұрын
My first car was a red 90 Sunbird SE with pop-up headlights. It was a looker. It never gave me one problem. My second car was a burgandy 92 Grand Am. It looked nice but it was in the shop every month for something big. I came to a stop once and it crapped out. Come to find out, 3 of the motor mounts had fallen off, so the entire engine thrusted forward into the radiator. It busted the fan blades that shot fragments everywhere damaging more of the engine. My dad paid to fix it once again. Finally the head gasket blew. I begged him to not fix it and let it go to the junkyard finally. He let it finally die. It was the worst car I owned with a 95 Accord a close 2nd place.
@RoadRunnergarage85702 жыл бұрын
You could say the same for Plymouth and Mercury near their ends too.
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Don't tell anyone I'm doing a Plymouth one right now, and yeah... I can say the same thing. :)
@johnlavender242 Жыл бұрын
My favorite memory of Pontiac is learning to drive a stick on a 1949 Pontiac Straight Eight in 1964.
@darinrodriguez855110 ай бұрын
I had 77 Firebird Formula it was my second car at age 17 n I loved it big block 400
@drakbar5957 Жыл бұрын
Brand engineering begets boring automobiles that eventually disappear. Pontiac had its 15 minutes in the spotlight, but there are few today who remember that time.
@tonystidham4564 Жыл бұрын
It's interesting that despite some cool cars, Pontiac never had a one million vehicle sales year in its history, but got real close a few times
@timothyhays1817 Жыл бұрын
It seems like GM like moving the Pontiac General Managers over to Chevrolet. Knudson, DeLorean and John Middlebrook. The last was at Pontiac when was I at the Pontiac Roadside Assistance center in the early 90's.
@Project_Low_Expectations Жыл бұрын
I got my drivers license in 1990… so the cars that were new at that point were mostly front wheel drive, and since I was more of a GM guy, there were only a few platforms with different flavors on top. Chevy was the normal flavor, the common… the standard. Olds and Buick were mostly old people stuff… bland flavor. Caddy was an unobtainable, fancy flavor. Pontiac… Pontiac was SPICY… Even though we all knew that for the best part it was all the same crap underneath, the Pontiac always felt, and looked… better. A Z28 is cool, but a Trans-Am, that was bad ass. Didn’t matter, they usually had a 305 and the owner would swear up and down it was a 350. The Grand Am was WAY cooler than ANY of its lesser styled N car siblings. Even the front wheel drive cutlas was cooler than the other A body models. Who else dared to lie to the HMFIC and call the fiero an economy car… no one else had the nads to even try building a mid engine sporty car. Even though we knew it was the same woman with a different color wig… she looked better as a spicy redhead. But GM had to dilute the models down even more. They got rid of the wigs, no more spicy red, no more blondes, just blah brunettes with some gray coming out… for the best part, unless you were paying attention you couldn’t tell what model you were looking at. For a while there, in 06 to about 2010, I thought GM was going to get rid of ALL brands, (except caddy of course) and turn it into, the GM models. All under one name, under one roof. I miss Pontiac. Not what it was when GM shot it in the back of the head… I miss the Pontiac from the late 50’s till the late 90’s. When Pontiac was like Chevy, only better.
@Matthew.R.Gaglio11 ай бұрын
My first car was an Oldsmobile Achieva and my second was a convertible Pontiac G6. The convertible version of the G6 was nicer and more fun than the standard four door version. But the corporate mindset at GM has really destroyed any of the uniqueness and personality the cars had. After the bailout I just became completely disgusted with the company and I refuse to ever buy another GM.
@dancurtis6115 ай бұрын
Anyone else wonder what might have been if you could have ordered a Trans Am with the Buick Regal Grand National turbocharged V6 under the hood? Yeah, me too.
@tommywatterson5276 Жыл бұрын
Do a series on Olds history too unless you already have.
@johnnymason2460 Жыл бұрын
Basically, Dodge became what people wanted Pontiac to become. It's a shame, really. Pontiac could have been great again. A direct competitor to Dodge. Imagine a Pontiac G8 competing against a Hemi-powered Charger.
@daveridgeway2639 Жыл бұрын
In 1966, the Pontiac GTO hit it's all time sales peak. I would say, just about the most popular High Performance Automobile (Muscle Car) sold for 1966. Please reply. Dave...
@harrytran18742 жыл бұрын
The Bonneville name started on the 1954 Pontiac Bonneville Special. Pontiac added Pontiac G3 in the US but, Pontiac G3 Wave Hatchback, Pontiac Wave Sedan in Canada but, it's a rebadged the Chevy Aveo. The Pontiac models exclusive for Canada are Pontiac Pathfinder, Pontiac Strato Chief convertible, Pontiac Sunburst, Pontiac Tempest, Pontiac Sunrunner, Pontiac Firefly, etc. Also, Pontiac in South Africa, Australia, New Zealand, Middle East, Mexico, etc. Pontiac tried bringing the Sportwagon, Ute in the US as a Pontiac G8 Sportwagon, Pontiac G8 ST ( Sport Truck ). Pontiac made the cool concept car based on the Chevy C3 Corvette as the Pontiac Banshee Concept but, axed by GM. You don't think Pontiac coming back but, no one thought GM bringing back the Hummer from the dead under the GMC as a GMC Hummer. I think GM bringing back the Pontiac from the dead under the Chevy as a Chevy Pontiac.
@CJColvin Жыл бұрын
Also Pontiac in 60s made some Canadian sub-brand as well like Acadian and Beaumont.
@timblaes70286 ай бұрын
60's Ponchos were great, lost it after 72
@georgewilson1184 Жыл бұрын
WHY did all automakers abandon the COUPE segment of the car market
@vox1966 Жыл бұрын
I own 4 Fieros and a 1997 trans am convertible love pontiac
@Alexs23743Ай бұрын
Make some noise! Pontiac is back!!! ...in Minecraft, if I ever decide to play the game. D:
@georgekostician32292 жыл бұрын
I like the fact you did this video but once you got to the 80’s you said the 6000 STE came for 84 I think you got the celebrity eurosport mixed up with the STE because STE came for 83 and the celebrity eurosport came in 84 but other than that it’s a good video
@AllCarswithJon2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for the comment. I'd have to re-listen to be sure but I probably just mis-spoke (or noted it wrong to begin with!). Honestly, if that's the only mistake I'm thrilled! :)
@georgekostician32292 жыл бұрын
@@AllCarswithJon that’s the only one I caught and normally I wouldn’t say anything but I do have a 1983 Pontiac 6000 STE in my driveway and a lot of people actually think the STE came for 84 but the only thing that came for 84 on STE was the black paint and the Digital gauge cluster but other than that not much is changed for 85 the 2.8 V6 went multiport fuel injected and 86 it got a new front end and 88 they added a AWD option to the STE making it the first and only car on the A-body car line to have AWD as a option as you can see I’m a big fan of the 6000 and a lot of FWD GM cars from the 80’s
@aguerra1381 Жыл бұрын
'84 STE had an awesome dashboard.
@jeffanderson3962 Жыл бұрын
Bought a '88 Lemans hatchback for $550 in 2000 as my first car (well the first after I had my license anyway). Drove it for 3 years so I'd say I got a good deal.
@jonathanhaines5342 Жыл бұрын
Owned all well kept older pontiacs, now I’ve moved on to some dodges. I personally feel I don’t owe any loyalty to gm for the sure death they put upon pontiac in the early 80’s.
@dmfraser1444 Жыл бұрын
Wow. The presenter really mangled the name of the Pontiac Parisienne at 16:05. It is supposed to be "pr i zee en". As well, it was not an import. In 1965 the Canadian and US car industries were amalgamated and cars from either country have been considered domestics in both countries ever since. But otherwise, good job.
@jim7700 Жыл бұрын
i always liked Pontiacs
@jeffanderson3962 Жыл бұрын
Its almost as if the people who came up with the Aztek were on a little bit of the blue stuff....
@alext8828 Жыл бұрын
Ha! I was looking for a Walter White comment. They must have thought everyone and his brother wanted to go camping. Management managed them right out of business. Probably drove home in Mercs.
@Chris-mi5ff Жыл бұрын
Nice. I really liked the Sunfire in red, very cool for a compact, was ready to buy one just after they were foolishly discontinued, it was like a smaller, less expensive Firebird, which I also always wanted after changing from the Smokey-Bandit style to the Knight Rider styles. For your info you butchered the pronunciation of Parisienne (my dad had two in the 60's, covertibles), failed to mention the Beaumont. The Fiero looked very similar to one of the experimental designs you showed with the mid-frame engine and pointy nose with blunt tail. They were a good brand, sad to be discontinued...
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Thanks for the comment. The Sunfire my first wife and I looked at was something like "purple". and also a very base level. Not appealing. :) Yes, yes... I know. I swear to you the pronounciation I used for Parisienne was what I heard growing up in my specific area of the South. I've heard about it.... trust me! :)
@Chris-mi5ff Жыл бұрын
@@AllCarswithJon Thanks for your reply! Can you do a video about the Durant Co., who had a factory in the small town I was raised in? Or the MacLachlan, which I believe was the last all-Canadian car made before the Canada-US Auto Pact?
@bucklinoutdoorpowerequipme3846 Жыл бұрын
I had a 65 Grand Prix. But I never got to drive it. As grandpa put a new water pump in it. He put the gasket in wrong. It suverly overheated and it lost power. I was in the process of rebuilding the engine when life got in the way.
@HowardJrFord10 ай бұрын
I hate it when young people describe the displacement of old car engines in liters .
@AllCarswithJon10 ай бұрын
Young? Thank you!
@lawrencesmith. Жыл бұрын
As an aside, I 'passed' on buying a new Pontiac Solstice in favor of the Saturn Sky. Sadly, they were both doomed.😞
@martyduncan2636 Жыл бұрын
I do have a bone to pick with you on one of your assertions. “Never to take to boring GM and make them a ‘performance’ platform”. In 1973 and 1974 arguably the ONLY GM sports car with any performance wherewithal WAS the Pontiac Trans AM! Pontiac cleverly and deftly made the 455 SD Trans Am the ONLY sports car that General Motors had left. It was faster than the Corvette and dodged the federal government’s demands that cars use catalytic converters and burn unleaded fuel, etc, etc. IMO, and many other long suffering sports cars enthusiasts of the dreadful mid ‘70s, contend that the SD 455 Trans Am laid the groundwork for the late ‘70s resurgence of the Trans Am and what was left of the, admittedly neutered, muscle car era.
@kaydenholden84923 ай бұрын
Sorry to bug but you said Parisienne wrong the pronunciation would be paris(French pronunciation) ji anne
@nickphillips2125 Жыл бұрын
Jon, You do present great reviews... however, your constant use of " finger quote marks " is, not only hackneyed, it is annoying. Wishing you great success with your KZbin channel
@AllCarswithJon Жыл бұрын
Thanks for the feedback. It's amazing the little things you do that you aren't even really aware of until you film yourself. :) Oh, I find I still do it, I'm just better at covering it up with an image. LOL.
@vassa1972 Жыл бұрын
Loved the brand
@wiiambarnarx848511 ай бұрын
Your crazy! Pontiacs were very good looking cars and not boring. Theirs cars performed and styling was one of a kind awesome! Has anyone ever told you that you look boring??
@AllCarswithJon11 ай бұрын
Frequently.
@wiiambarnarx848510 ай бұрын
I've had a Pontiac Lemans, Sunbird, Firebird, Grand Prix's, 2 of them. I enjoyed everyone of them and I wish Pontiac was still around, I'd probably have one. They should have killed Oldsmobile first. Except for the Cutlass 442 Olds was boring.