Is the U.S. Public School System Collapsing? New ProPublica Report | Amanpour and Company

[@atlanticgirl76]

I've been a teacher for 20 years. We have very little influence in our own field. Public education has been systemically destroyed in the past decades by school committees, superintendents, politicians, corporations and parents. These groups made terrible decisions like the ditching phonics based reading, implementing social promotion, allowing phones in schools and more, all while teachers begged them not to. Fewer and fewer students will choose to study education in the future. I have a family member who works in medicine who said they have the same problem: corporations and administration making the decisions and destroying the field.

[@eeship]

Unfortunately, also by the teachers unions.

[@gardengal87]

​@@eeshipIn a huge city Luke Chicago, yes. Not the many suburbs

[@greggpon7466]

Good observations. These large school systems are run by lawyers and gulp MBAs who have totally different agendas than student welfare and academics.

[@intuitionz1198]

@@eeship no, that's not what's happening. you will do absolutely anything, say anything, to destroy people's perception of unions. not that there hasn't been any corruption, but that's not what you care about. I mean seriously, how many other things in life do you decide that you're just going to dismantle instead of trying to fix the corruption? most of the corruption of unions has been weeded out. now it's just a matter of getting people to stop believing that unions are a problem. y'all don't seem to mind that police union though. 🙄

[@kagreen2k]

@@eeshipNot true. Administrators are largely to blame but the teachers always get the blame.

[@katiee3842]

As a public school teacher for 12 years I can vouch that academic rigor has COMPLETELY degraded since I was a child. The whole day is devoted to parenting the unparented children of today.

[@olgab.3961]

The curriculum is disturbingly weak. My daughter just started 5th grade at a public school in a wealthy district. The kids in her class are provided for and there are no bad behavioral issues, I've asked. And they're still barely learning. The study materials do not teach reading or writing, except enough to pass digital tests.

[@katiee3842]

@@olgab.3961oh I’ve seen it. I have worked in one of the wealthiest districts in my area, and same, they were still lowering standards more and more each year.

[@joifire]

💯 facts

[@olgab.3961]

@@katiee3842 I often hear teachers blame the students for misbehaving. But what if the students understand the garbage waste of time they're being forced to sit through. And their impulse is to be rude to show the teachers "You don't have my respect because I know that you're selling me out, dumbing me down instead of teaching me."

[@personnesenki4521]

That's unfortunate. Sadly for you the parents who cared took their kids out of that system long ago.

[@Smw006]

Public Education in the US has been collapsing for the past 40 years - it has simply become undeniable now.

[@Jay-jb2vr]

No shit

[@AdamCarbone1]

You wonder why it’s a constant fight for funding, unfunded mandates. Politicians making decisions, not educators. And parents fighting and not supporting their local school because little Joni/johny is the problem

[@katenoke1571]

@@AdamCarbone1 the parents rights crew are out of their minds

[@katenoke1571]

@@Smw006 it's doing fine. We educate all students, not just some. Kids nowadays are smarter than their parents. They have much better critical thinking skills

[@Smw006]

@@katenoke1571 I have taught special education these past 17 year in 3 states (Illinois, Texas, & Massachusetts) and it's NOT doing fine. There are huge systemic issues and while some kids have critical thinking skills it's not across the board. Maybe some kids are smarter than their parents, but that's that's pretty meaningless if they can't do anything with it.

[@kb8990]

I REFUSE to teach in public schools again. It is an actual safety hazard for me to be there and I feel sorry for the kids who are stuck. As adults we at least can opt out. Kids are stuck.

[@katenoke1571]

@@kb8990 DRAMA ALERT!!!!!

[@katenoke1571]

@@TheNesbittExperience You discredit yourself as soon as you use the word "groomed." Sure sign of a cultist.

[@TheNesbittExperience]

@@katenoke1571it absolutely was grooming. I was employed as a child because my sending district wouldn’t pay. They made me the janitor. Do you think students should be employees? Do you also think teachers should not be paid a living wage? I appreciate your empathy. 😂

[@TheNesbittExperience]

@@katenoke1571I should also note the deplorable and unsafe conditions I taught in. Including the year they put me in a dirty old video store with no equipment. Including the year I fell down the theater stairs because I was forced to find a new location to teach mid teaching. You have no idea what my students had to endure.

[@lukeyznaga7627]

very accurate statement. its a warzone. and drugzone.

[@kb8990]

Left teaching and have never looked back. Homeschool my kids because I know too much about what a mess it is!

[@katenoke1571]

@@kb8990 nice to see a Duggar on here!!!!

[@kb8990]

LOL

[@Wayfarer889]

Homeschool was the best decision I made for my daughter in 5th grade! She has been able to learn deeply, efficiently, and at her own pace. She's 16 now, and is eager to get a part-time job as she completes her high school education and pursues dual enrollment at the local community college. I am so glad we didn't waste her time in a classroom setting!

[@BlessedGJ]

@@Wayfarer889same here. Homeschooled 2 neurodivergent boys. School wanted one in a self contained classroom for autism. I had him repeat first grade in homeschool and now he is ahead academically. The other was medicated for school and after school homework time until we were brave enough to homeschool. He graduated with a 3.5 GPA medicine free. Public school did not have the resources to help my boys. They work wonders for some families but I think more families are tasting the peace and freedom of homeschooling and realizing the huge waste of time public school is. How do I know? I was a public school teacher. Hopefully, the closing down of schools will help to wake up public education to a more functional level because change is way overdue.

[@mybestlifefortherestofmyli7137]

No one wants to address the agenda of lgbtq, children reading inappropriate sex novels, teaching Critical race theory, teaching children to hate their own country. And that their parents don't know what they are talking about, or how about High schoolers being told they can change their clothes and be who they want to be when they come to school whether it be boy or girl.

[@Christinekueblerartist]

At this point in time the pandemic is no longer an excuse for behavior issues. It’s a cultural problem.

[@Kra-ri6fd]

Very true. Public schools are not the place to learn to socialize. I learned this while witnessing distance learning. I then pulled my son out of public schools and saw a drastic improvement in his behavior from then on.

[@saganandroid4175]

Read between the lines and you are right.

[@gumbypokey]

when families are passe and not considered necessary or even seen as adversarial....

[@Victor-tl4dk]

It's, I think more than one thing. Schools are like Norwegian prisons for students, students are watched 24/7, but on the other hand nothing can be done about so-called 'disruptive students' in many areas. Parents 'influence' teachers way too much. Teachers do not get paid enough for the kind of work they do. Culture in the US, in the past has been anti-learning- like a lot! People are getting distracted by 'stupid stuff' for politics and not enough seem to choose to care, for whatever reason, about 'substance.' it's a good number of things I think. The most important part about learning ... are the learners themselves.

[@Christinekueblerartist]

@@Victor-tl4dk yep! I would agree with all of that! Norwegian prisons… that I’m not familiar with. I’ll have to look that up!

[@denisceballos9745]

I agree with Mr. MacGillis. I taught public high school SpEd in CA for 23 years - the lockdowns sealed the fate of our public schools. Students weren’t participating with the zoom classes, many dropped out and just never returned. A lot of high schoolers got jobs or helped their moms raise younger siblings. A lot of our kids don’t view education as a way to get ahead in life.

[@Yourmom-tc4rn]

Government school education isn't a way to get ahead and has not been one for decades, if ever.

[@18_rabbit]

and that's how any society descends further into profound types of ignorance, and then poverty

[@kni9ght]

Nelson Mandela said “Education is the most powerful tool to change the world.”

[@MaggieJean]

Children suffered greatly during the pandemic. We needed change long before the pandemic. There has to be a serious makeover in our educational system.

[@dre5229]

I feel like unless these parents fix their attitudes, stop blaming teachers, hold their kids accountable, and help their children when they are failing nothing is going to get better 🤦🏾‍♂️

[@katiee3842]

Teachers need BOUNDARIES. Stop tolerating abusive children. Parents need to be HELD ACCOUNTABLE for their children.

[@katenoke1571]

@@katiee3842 everyone should take a chill pill and start supporting others instead of tearing them down. What happened to you to make you this way, that's what I would like to know...

[@startuphub4097]

If you believe that, then you'll have to support an entirely new prison system for parents cuz we're going to be locking up a nation of negligent parents.

[@MF-qf7bs]

Schools caving in to parental pressure has been the major cause of deterioration of education. It began with lowering the scholastic test requirements needed to pass a student onto the next grade, and continues with insisting their special needs child be placed in the general populace classes with teachers untrained and unqualified without the sufficient help to handle the number of students competently and then blamed when things go wrong. With pay that often makes it impossible to live in the same community.

[@katenoke1571]

@@MF-qf7bs please cite your sources

[@rapunzelz5520]

It's the district administration that refuses to expel troublemakers.

[@spanishtutor2552]

The school system today is horrible, we teachers have been quitting for years

[@andrewfisher8749]

Appreciate your honesty. My Teacher friends echo your sentiment.

[@TraderRobin]

Well, maybe YOU should STOP quitting!!

[@Bambi7ish]

​@@TraderRobin And risk getting killed?

[@independent-ts6ys]

Republicans worked at destroying our public school system for years. They're still doing it so they can eventually privatize the school system so we would have to pay for them to go to school. Elementary, junior and senior high.

[@ronswansonsdog2833]

@@TraderRobin Why don’t you get your teaching credential and fill the job you don’t want some miserably abused teacher to quit? I bet you’re a parent of an a hole kid. You sure sound like it.

[@erikw2460]

We need to start funding our schools nationally.. not just based on real estate. This is horrific for our ability to have an informed public.

[@Merriwether-w8k]

It's by design - rich kids get better education - poor kids stay poor

[@marwar819]

He gives all kinds of 'REASONS' for the fleeing of public schools except the true one. Parents don't want their kids in schools that force the indoctrination of transgenderism and wokeism on their innocent children. We hear a lot about depression in children. It's caused by parents and teachers.

[@oedhelsetren]

All peer reviewed studies have shown funding actually accounts for very little academic success and it's almost entirely dependent of whether teachers care or not. Public schools are failing compared to private schools because private school teachers aren't unionized. Get rid of bad teachers in public schools and it wont be an issue.

[@imperialmotoring3789]

You want to raise property taxes on poor people to pay for rich people's kids? Wow. You must be a democrat.

[@imperialmotoring3789]

@@Merriwether-w8k Actually poor kids that go to Catholic school get a better education than kids that go to government schools. School vouchers must be offered to all.

[@vicmarc4984]

Parents are TIRED of having to constantly fight for a decent education, too many kids have crap parents and THEY are destroying the public school system.

[@amanda-10]

The problem is that parents are fighting the wrong people. Teachers are on your side. Stop electing people to school boards that are dismantling the very systems you are entrusting them with.

[@jvcyt298]

@@amanda-10 ; Well said.

[@Daniinthecity_]

@@amanda-10we have had an absent dschool trustee here in Vegas for over a year. Apparently this person lives in another state across country, she would join the meetings via Zoom. Well due to her lack of presence, her district lost a small school that’s affecting our mountain community here in Las Vegas… well, she’s finally getting the boot and also the people that allowed this person to continue serve her district in spite of not living in the state anymore.

[@Bambi7ish]

​@@Daniinthecity_ Absolutely ludacris to not live there.

[@NicholsonNeisler-fz3gi]

School choice

[@billbernhard3582]

THIS is the time to get tough on students of public schools ! Uniforms, no more cell phones, absolute manners and respect for staff and teachers - all this newly mandated on a take it or leave it basis ! If kids are not ready to learn for any reason, they need to take a year off, then decide with their families about what they want for their future. Without a good education, crime and jail await ! Black & Brown kids are no different than any other kind of student. "Free" education is not free at all ! It's expensive - it's a gift - it can be quickly withheld if students refuse the new terms and conditions ! Humoring children is ridiculous ! Get tough - demand compliance with the rules - extend the school year, if conditions indicate that !

[@18_rabbit]

yeah some of those idea are perfect! But in addition we'd have to couple that with optional training-work options and a track to eventually do public service for federal gvt or military. THis is basic stuff, we need to cooking or we r going to have major issues in society, as we liberals can well see over the past eight years into right now!

[@christianchellis9057]

No that won’t help them. School choice and more freedom for students would.

[@camovets5719]

Unfortunately in a “democracy “ the average voter will never vote for higher standards, the masses are asses and want freebies and low , easy to pass , standards.

[@JarheadMcLovin]

The country has to start looking at children as assets not commodities for corporations to exploit. This is especially true when you consider birth rates are dropping off a cliff and AI is coming down the road, you need to prepare the population now. If the Scandinavian countries could turn thier educational systems around from some of the worst in Europe to now having some of the best, I can't see why it can't be done here. we're spending $1.5 trillion to upgrade thousands of nuclear weapons plus spending another $200 billion for new ones ( like 3,700 nukes isn't enough). Wouldn't that money be better spent creating generations of engineers and scientists, craftsmen and thinkers?

[@lukeyznaga7627]

maybe I should move to Scandinavia

[@zoponex3224]

Plus funding genocide in Israel. But Vance thinks grandmas should take the place of daycare.,At least for working people.

[@WWZenaDo]

You've pinpointed one of the problems. In America weapons are considered more important than children.

[@action2news256]

No child held accountable

[@normalizedaudio2481]

The War Against Public Schools......

[@theobserver9131]

War against the people.

[@victorygarden556]

Prussian schooling is re-education oriented around making yes men. People who put their kids in government schools are criminals.

[@imperialmotoring3789]

The war against school choice vs. forced government education.

[@TheTaoofEternalWar]

Public Schools don't discipline punks anymore. Schools aren't safe, but we should be forced to send our children to them?

[@bthink3610]

War by who? This happening in states dominated by Democrats their beloved teacher unions

[@sandrasheldon5407]

I am 75, I have no problem with my tax money going to public schools so that all our population gets educated, and our children learn how to treat each other well.

[@personnesenki4521]

I would love to see my tax money go to private school scholarships for poor children. I'm going to need services rendered by educated professionals in the future, and I want them to have the best possible education.

[@bangheadhearagain]

​@@personnesenki4521 another scammer idea. We have history on this and it doesn't work.

[@personnesenki4521]

@@bangheadhearagain Except that public schools aren't working now. Every private school is better than any public school.

[@orion6372]

This is a really good point, thanks for sharing. It’s a great reminder that we all need to be more united and share common goals instead of being selfish and putting ourselves in our little boxes.

[@bookgirlny8511]

Me too

[@inthehouse1960]

Hopefully, this will lead to less administration and more teacher input. The only way for a teacher to make a decent salary is to become an administrator - that's why we have TOO MANY OF THEM. Teachers should be able to make the same salary as administrators by being responsible for and credited for their work in the classroom.

[@charlotteschnook1351]

All of America is collapsing, most Americans are desperate, over worked, broke, fatigue, stressed and couldn't give a crap less about life anymore.

[@Authentic-Israelite]

It’s the end of the empire.

[@SusiesRepeat]

Never was a truer word said.

[@nassimsabba8922]

We are not the only country in the world. It would be nice to do a comparative reporting on the spectrum, from China to France, Germany, and many developing countries. Are they doing better? Why? and How? Anything that could educated us about education?

[@Tamar-sz8ox]

Layers to this : People have options and also people are not having kids anymore

[@Frank-sm9yl]

The Democrats globalist great reset in action.

[@arontotheleft]

The options aren't better. Charter and private schools are better than public schools. All they do is reduce funding from public schools.

[@andrewfisher8749]

@@arontotheleft Deliberately misleading or lying.

[@TraderRobin]

@@arontotheleft Private schools teach our children to become obedient little Adolf's!!

[@thatright4985]

Another layer is that minority family's like mine that have more than five children, far prefer homeschool over public school. There's a reason too. Couples with many kids are very committed to that project and have less tolerance for a system that has their kids for so much of their kid life but doesn't grant parents very much agency over their education.

[@janicepalesch9221]

I went to the public schools in a large metropolitan city through high school graduation, in 1964. Discipline and orderly conduct were the rule. If a student did not comply with expected behavior, that student was suspended; if the behavior did not improve markedly, that student was expelled. That was the correct route to take, because the rest of the students deserved an environment in which they could learn. When I was in law school, I did a practicum in one of that City high schools, teaching basic law. It was in 1982, only 18 years after I had graduated from that very school district, but it might as well have been 100 years later and worlds apart. Completely unlike my years of education, the school was disordered because the students were horribly unruly, loud, and disrespectful. The students in the class I taught were Juniors and Seniors, yet many of them were unable to take the tests I wrote because they were unable to read or write. So, the disintegration of the public schools is not a new phenomenon, and it is not a product of the pandemic. When I talked with teachers in that school about the problems I saw and about the fact that the school system had failed them, the teachers told me that they were "little more than babysitters". I was horrified. Clearly, something should have been done about the disorder and refusal to learn or behave DECADES ago. THAT is a huge part of the reason our public schools are failing and closing. Yes, there are other factors, but the failure to maintain an environment for learning and requiring kids to apply themselves to their studies is one of the largest factors. Parents seeing the poor learning environment and the results of that on their child naturally have moved their kids to other school districts. And, they have taken their tax money with them. This has been a tragedy for everyone. Republicans have hated without any genuine reason the public schools system for a long time. They accomplished their goal of dismantling that system with a LOT of inadvertent help from teachers and school administrators, who failed to provide an environment for learning. The pandemic only exacerbated a situation which had already largely come apart at the seams. I believe this can be turned around, but it will take a LOT of work. These days, school personnel are far more concerned with doing social work than educating. That needs to change. Privatization is NOT the answer; it merely hastens the demise of the public schools.

[@joeyappley202]

@janicepalesch9221 I completely agree with this assessment. Privatization of education has done far more damage than good.

[@Frank-sm9yl]

Wrong. Since Democrat Jimmy Carter started the departm 18:05 ent of education Democrats have destroyed traditional education, culture, customs, ideas and values for their globalist great reset. It's reflected in Democrat run schools abysmal aptitude scores. Those schools are unruly and our of control. Conservatives want their kids to learn traditional subjects not proper pronouns, transexuals, supposed systematic racism and secular sjw virtue signaling identity politics. In our conservative town the minority students during this terrorist organization BLM riots said they have never felt racism.

[@nancychace8619]

I don't know about how damaging the privatization of public schools might be, but you can't blame parents for seeking better alternatives for their kids if the public schools are failing.

[@arontotheleft]

@@nancychace8619 Except, study after study suggest private and charter schools aren't better. If anything, they perform the same, however that money goes to prop up churches and private citizens.

[@joeyappley202]

@nancychace8619 I totally agree that parents can't be blamed for wanting a good education for their children. However, I think it's important to look closely at the facts, history, and the nuances there. Ultimately, there have been policy decisions that have reinforced an environment that has caused public education to fail some children in some places. I'm not against all private education, but funding private education with public funds is not good. It's another form of socialism for the rich (corporations), and strips resources from public schools. And as the interview shows, it has caused public schools to close and puts families in very hard places when trying to get good education for their kids.

[@aidenalamo6262]

When I was a kid, if you messed up on any assigned work, your parent was called. Teachers only taught when I was a kid, they refused to be therapists, surrogate parents etc like they are expected to be today. My generation needs a wake up call about how to be an effective parent while managing their own stressors. This is why schools are closing besides bad practices by staff members at the highest of levels.

[@lukeyznaga7627]

excellent comment

[@rickeymcclaryjr.2350]

Couldn’t have agreed more.

[@sawas2421]

Agree, except for the part about parents **expecting** the teachers to be therapists and surrogate parents. Teachers should be there to **teach their subjects**, nothing else, in my opinion. I want teachers to stay OUT of the students' personal lives. The students and their families deserve their boundaries to be respected by the teachers and coaches, as well. Not all teachers respect those boundaries, especially coaches, and this can be horribly destructive. And our high schools are more focused on extracurricular activities, especially athletics, than educating the kids. Extracurricular stuff should be done on the kids' own time and not connected to the school. School should be for getting an academic education. Period.

[@katenoke1571]

@@aidenalamo6262 when you were a kid, children didn't have rights and any adult could beat them. Thank goodness times have changed.

[@katenoke1571]

@@sawas2421 that's never been what teachers do. Every teacher makes a connection with their students. They're not robots.

[@Himmiefan]

Common Core hasn't helped.

[@rb-pk8ds]

I respectfully disagree .. but I am old. In the 1960's my family moved from Denver CO to Kitsap county WA ... my entry to year 6 was not seamless but it was not tragic because then "common core" meant both CO and WA were expected to be teaching basically the same subjects at basically the same level. Our community was linked pretty hard to the US Navy as many of our families were transitting thru courtesy of being attached to aircraft carriers being stationed at the Puget Sound Naval Base for "long term" repairs ... these families came from everywhere and were also able to integrate ok because of common core / expected class teaching levels. Maybe common core needs to be cleaned up but there was a purpose to it.

[@hypnokitten6450]

This country has a terrible habit of being presented a proposal, funding a quarter of it, blocking half, and then pointing to what's left-over as having failed. Common Core was a good idea. A lot of its funding and teacher salaries and so on got blocked. A lot of states fought it and whittled it down until it was a shadow of its self. And the remainder... yea, failed. We have done this with a LOT of good ideas.

[@victorygarden556]

@@rb-pk8dsI actually went through common core and it translates to institutionalizing kids, making yes men, and slowing down the advanced kids for the dumb kids.

[@virginiamoss7045]

@@hypnokitten6450 Same with the Affordable Care Act; Republicans only voted for it after they destroyed it to where it wouldn't work well. In spite of that, it's working better than I expected, but the original would have been almost perfect. We can still repair it if we care enough.

[@porkchoppeaches]

@@rb-pk8dsThat’s not the same common core that was implemented during the W. Bush era. That common core curriculum has cause brain damage in a generation .

[@tryrightbrain]

We had a FABULOUS public school education in Sacramento area during the 70's and early 80's. We could deal with UC work upon finishing high school. But we also had LOTS of sports, and music, scouting, skateboarding, shop, ceramics etc. Lots of parents and family came to meets, games, muscial performances. And if your parents heard you caused a problem for the school, your a** was grass. Kids had more positive social outlets, and parents made sure you stayed in line. All those agreements went down in flames - that is why people flee to home school. We had so much fun in school I would NEVER have wanted to be at home - with my parents????? WHAT??? I cannot even imagine not seeing my pals and favorite teachers every day.

[@marygee3981]

🎉nice, those were the days. No devices to keep kids glued and indoors. A new world now.

[@madfoxcityemnau6414]

I would have had to learn Latin Greek and Plato at home, which probably wouldn't have been so bad in the long run but I agree, staying home would have sucked! Homeschooling is very cool imho. The wages of single or even dual income households is so disabling and undermining of actual parents. As a parent, if our household had the financial capacity I'd have taken great joy in keeping my child at home, much to my child's dismay😂

[@WillN2Go1]

All discussion of education funding is meaningless if basic reading and math standards aren't being achieved. Does it matter if a school is closed if students weren't learning there? If the vast majority of students at a school don't read anywhere near grade level and can't do basic math; whether it stays open or closed only matters for some basic level of socialization. It is not a learning institution. (The Bush "No Child Left Behind," had ridiculous standards. '100% of the students will be achieving at grade level by....' But what if levels never change? That's what's been happening.) I thought that the pandemic would result in at least a portion of the students self learning away from schools attaining high levels of knowledge, or skills. That seems not to have happened. I taught for ten years. I just boggled my mind how 'educators,' were so busy talking about this and that, but when it came to reading: zero progress but endless boring teacher meetings on 'the importance of reading skills.' (I always asked, "Instead of sitting through this meeting can I instead monitor the kids who have detention, allowing them to reduce their time by reading?" Always the answer was, "No." ) These meetings were part of multi million dollar reading 'programs,' all of which fail, all of which are almost exactly the same: Endless teacher meetings. The books that came with these expensive programs were junk. They would abridge an out of copyright book like Treasure Island into twenty pages of 14 point text reducing it to boring meaningless junk. End result after five years or so? No result except for the adoption and purchase of an even more expensive reading program that will fail. The school district I taught in set a goal of five years to raise reading levels. The obvious question is, How long does it take a child to learn how to read and improve that skill? You can teach almost any child to read in a couple of hours, after that the critical factor is that the child read. (My sister taught me how to read one evening on the way to our grandmother's house. Neon bar signs. Did the schools I attended have 'good reading programs and methodologies'? I have no clue. I just remember all the reading I was doing, some for school, most from my own interest.)

[@donniemoder1466]

Public schooling sucked when I went in the 70s. It is a community of mediocrity at best. Wasted so much time in public school.

[@kitkat22322]

Seriously even in the 90's I just sat there while the teachers disciplined other students..waste of time, when I could've got so much done home-schooled

[@sjmom5119]

Oh but what about "socialization"? Isn't that the continuous excuse from school employees and husbands that won't allow their wives to homeschool

[@startuphub4097]

Public schools are like prisons. Kids undergo a punishing visionless, soulless education cramming knowledge without understanding or wisdom.

[@christiethomas6905]

I agree the same for the 90’s I loved learning and reading had nice teachers but wasted so much time and could have done so much more. Very sad that was 12 yrs of life.

[@marblox9300]

I am 65. Hindsight has proven that grades 1-8 and then HS 9-12 are a Complete Waste of Time. Students know this. Schools are basically a jobs program to keep the huge money flowing to themselves. The ONLY thing that I have ever used from HS is Drivers Ed.

[@erinhanna6323]

Hard to ask people to pay up when wages have been stagnant for decades. The people bleeding education dry forever need to pay up, but they own and control most of the levers of power.

[@brooklynnchick]

While I agree with you emotionally, as a teacher, I have a hard time buying that excuse when the parents can still afford lotto tickets, cigarettes, beer, gambling, cable, nights out, junk food, and other luxuries. Somehow they can’t afford decent educators.

[@erinhanna6323]

All those things they buy are the cheap stuff to find some comfort when they can't afford real quality products or services...including education for their kids.

[@Frank-sm9yl]

​@@brooklynnchickparents are tired of Democrats using schools to indoctrinate students with secular sjw virtue signaling identity politics. Students know about preferred pronouns but can't spell, read or do math. In Democrat Baltimore no students test higher than a 4th grade level in any subject but they Know about transsexualism and supposed systematic racism. Parents are sick of how poorly students are taught. Democrats fill schools with illegal immigrants who need expensive translators. Democrats put tampon machines in the 4th graders bathroom and put boys in the girls locker room, bathroom and sports. Many parents and taxpayers don't want to fund such indoctrination.

[@katieandnick4113]

To be fair, they are the ones who were responsible for the institution of formal, public, compulsory education to begin with. They wanted a populace smart enough to operate their industrial machinery, and now that automation and AI can handle much or most of that, this type of education is no longer necessary. You seem to have made the same mistake most people do, which is to believe that this type of education has ever been about improving material conditions for the average person. If that happened, it was an unintended consequence. They don’t need us anymore. Not to work their machines and not even to buy their goods and services. We are being culled, but it’s a relatively slow process, and most of us are too scared to be able to acknowledge and accept it. The human ego has a remarkable way of filtering out threatening information if it perceives no way to escape the threat. If you’re under attack, and there’s nowhere to run, you will literally not perceive the threat that is right in front of your face. I don’t know how long it will take, but it’s well under way. They don’t want us here. They have never wanted us here. They have only tolerated us because they needed us to work for them. They don’t even need us to buy their stuff because they own all of the resources, and money is simply a tool they use to control us. Consumerism creates weakness and dependence upon them by us, and as long as we are here, they prefer that we depend on them so we cannot see what they’re actually doing. The more you depend on someone, the less capable you are of viewing it objectively. How much of our time and energy is used thinking and worrying about money? Why do we need money? To buy things we need in order to survive. If we had everything we needed or believed we needed, as they do, we wouldn’t care about money. Money and power only matter to these people as long as we are here. Their ultimate goal, for as long as wealth inequality has existed, has been to get rid of us, and they’re very close to reaching that goal. Cherish every day. Spend as much time as you possibly can with your loved ones. We don’t have much time left.

[@litedawg]

@@erinhanna6323quit making excuses for bad behavior

[@greendragon0009]

The primary problem in public schools is the violence our children are confronted with everyday. It is impossible to learn anything if you're constantly in a state of stress.

[@katenoke1571]

@@greendragon0009 true

[@ScaleScarborough-jq8zx]

Read the classics, my friends; they pay high dividends, and no one can stop you.

[@marthareis5873]

It's not just the impact of school closures -- it's odd to repeat that over and over without also noting broader demographic changes. Public schools were in trouble well before the pandemic.

[@Gwion-x8w]

I voted yes on 80 to give parents a choice between public and private schools. Opponents are whinging that this takes govt funds away from public schools. They're right. Public school have failed by tolerating violent, disrespectful students and socially promoting students with no academic requirements, resulting in graduates who can't read or do basic math, making High School diplomas a joke. The solution is ZERO tolerance for students who are disrespectful and violent. If a student assaults a teacher or another student, EVEN OFF CAMPUS, they should be expelled. If that disproportionately affects certain demographics, TOO BAD. Those parents should have raised their children to be decent human beings instead of animals.

[@joeyappley202]

Privatization of public schools is an awful trend. Subsidizing private schools through school-vouchers is even worse. This is just another tool to shift tax dollars into private companies. I would much rather have my taxes go to a public entity devoted to a public good and have it be regulated by public institutions. Not all privatization is good, especially if it looks like new-segreation.

[@stephenoshaughnessy2279]

"like new segregation ", that's not what ProPublica said. If you play back the opening intro, he said that the heaviest public school loses are coming in black and Hispanic neighborhoods.

[@elinope4745]

It's more like capital flight and less like gentrification. I would like an option for my tax money to go to different places than yours go. We should all have a choice in how our time and effort goes into benefitting society.

[@victorygarden556]

Choices in the private or one choice in the public domain. I like choices. You’re nuts.

[@imperialmotoring3789]

Chicago Union run Government Schools spend 44k per student per year and have a 14% literacy rate at graduation. Catholic High Schools are about 16k to 18k a year per student and have a near 100% literacy rate at graduation. Vouchers will save taxpayers.

[@TheTaoofEternalWar]

Former Oklahoma school teacher here. Our public school system has one standard, EVERYBODY GRADUATES. Show up when you feel like it, do no work, harass students and teachers at will, nothing will be done about it and you will still graduate. They aren't doing it for the kids, they are doing it for the money. Our public schools are a joke.

[@spicywater123]

This is what happens when you throw a chromebook at a kid and tell them to learn from it rather than having a fully staffed teacher workforce.

[@ninabishop8634]

Faith in public education was deliberately destroyed. The Moral Majority and other conservative groups want religion in our public schools. It's been a carefully calculated endeavor, and it started with Reagan. Reagan created a hysteria about our schools failing which was unfounded and conservatives have been pushing that agenda ever since. The US used to have a public school system that was the envy of the world. Eisenhower POURED money into US public schools in order to beat the Russians in the space race and US presidents all did that up until Reagan. There's money in public education because of the data and the testing and curriculum and research companies want it. We need to fully fund our traditional public schools again and charter and voucher proponents need to find another way to fund their privateering agenda. THAT'S what's wrong with our schools. Get the gov't and corporate suits out of our schools and let teachers do what they do best.

[@victorygarden556]

The government hires public school teachers. You will never get them out unless you go private. This is hilariously obvious.

[@TheTaoofEternalWar]

I'm a former public school teacher, the problem is discipline, it doesn't exist. Liberals will never register that fact in there delusional little heads. Go teach at an inner city school in OKC. Then tell me what is wrong with our school system. All the money in the world won't buy discipline.

[@dswan1418]

Yep

[@b.a.johnson5820]

The moral majority (I used lower case because they were/are low themselves) with emphasis on Jerry Falwell Sr. wanted to blend schools with their versions of religion. This started with Reagan and its been going ever since. It's so sad it's taken decades for people to start to realize this.

[@tiggs5591]

Get the ulta liberal communist ideology out of schools

[@michaelobrien8661]

In one word from a former public school teacher: yes.

[@Foslopac]

You reap what you sow. Parents are opting to educate their kids in better environments, and good for them.

[@johnphamlore8073]

Once people start listening to the podcast, "Sold a Story: How Teaching Kids to Read Went So Wrong," every parent who has the means will pull their kids out of public schools.

[@olgab.3961]

Thank you for the reference.

[@KimHeb.]

Exactly, I was extremely upset after listening to it.

[@MF-qf7bs]

The reading a book to your child before bedtime should be considered a top parental duty. It will instill in them a desire to read a book on their own when you tell them you don't have the time right now. Motivation is. a powerful thing. Like the child who drove to Target for a drink she liked.

[@tatianapolanco2115]

Great podcast! I’ve told several people to listen to it since I heard it myself

[@hazelstef]

That's not the reason why we are withdrawing our children. They are simply not learning because common core is a horrible way to teach children and we are sick and tired of the WOKE agenda.

[@larisamikhaylova6782]

Free public education is one of the most important human RIGHTS , it should be viewed as such, and not only as some pesky nuisance

[@dancer23918]

The problem is 'education' means different things to people throughout such a diverse country. If the governments definition of education doesn't match what you want your child to learn or how your child learns options are important.

[@midnite22767]

What is crazy is that other countries around the world have figured out what works. It wouldn't take much for the US to adopt these strategies used in places like Finland and Singapore whose students regularly outperform those in the US. But like so many industries in the US, the public school system is broken for a reason, there are powerful groups that benefit financially from the disfunction. Thank god I can afford to send my children to private school.

[@corbinsmith6953]

If they have figured it out why are other countries companies so unsuccessful compared to us ones. Turning kids into test robots might not be the best thing for actual success.

[@hypnokitten6450]

@@corbinsmith6953 So that's largely unrelated. Educationally most other competitive nation are superior at K-12 levels. Our colleges tend to be better (they're waaaaay better funded and they use educational models that are more similar to other countries). As for American company success? * rich natural resources (we don't have a lot of inter-dependence) * slavery / low-wage workers - we got an economic jump-start on the back of unpaid slaves, and we're still riding it with immigrant workers paid under-the-table and offshoring our big corp work (either directly, hiring other countries for pennies on the dollar, or indirectly by purchasing parts that were made with sweat-shop style labor) * huge oceans - while other countries spent their history fighting each other we've had few natural predators here * soft-power - instead of colonies (high military cost, high resistance) we made other nations depend on us for military security, 'foreign aid', etc - and then demanded really one-sided deals for our corporations * survival of the fittest - while our big tech companies Are more successful, that's actually not a Lot of our companies. But we reward the ones that made it big / give huge breaks to those that become billionaires, so once they start taking off they get a golden carpet ride. But the rest of our companies / workers? Eh. We just kinda look away when they struggle and die by the wayside, keeping our spotlight on the success stories.

[@jusletursoulglobaby]

it's a little more complex than just adopting their models. The culture in those places are different as are their values. Models that work there are in conflict with American individualism. A lot of the things that would work mean parents need to be accessible and involved for them to work, but that is in direct conflict with our labor market and the demands/expectations on average workers.

[@midnite22767]

While its true that the US is producing titans of industry and innovation like Elon Musks, Steve Jobs, Jeff Bezos, they are the exception, not the rule. The VAST majority of US children will never even approach this level of success. I read a quote once that I feel gets to the heart of this situation which is that "Not everyone can be President, some of us need to sweep the floors." Not saying there is a conspiracy but a weak public school system also help to produce those in society that we need to pick up the trash.

[@corbinsmith6953]

@@hypnokitten6450 take mark zuckerberg for example. A genius who was interested in computers who on his own pursued his interests at a young age that lead to a massive success story economically. If he had grown up in Singapore he would probably gone to school for 10 hours a day all year or whatever they do and never developed his own passions. There are reasons American companies exist and Europe and Asia lack the dynamics of a free country.

[@kathrynwilliams6661]

When Rahm Emanuel was mayor of Chicago, he closed 50 Chicago Public Schools in 2013 in Black and Brown communities. The stated reason was for under-enrollment and under-performance. The suspected reason was to boost charter school enrollment. Charter schools notoriously have selective enrollment, corporate funding, yet want monies designated for public schools. These closings had a profound negative impact on the affected communities.

[@freddyrodriguez4732]

why cant people just read and study. why is it so hard

[@gerardkiff2026]

Schools are for education not community. That’s what church picnics are for. Our kids are falling way behind other countries.

[@rb-pk8ds]

As i understood it one of the problems with public school buildings during the pandemic was crappy ventilation / air processing (air cooling?) ... that could be a nationwide federal infrastructure program to "future proof" these buildings. Then federal funding to ensure building integrity, class size limits, teacher pay, curicullum protection AND fully stocked libraries. Use state & local money for extra curricular things such as the arts, sports, and before & after school care. Abandoning our public schools is pretty much abandoning our future. Maybe we should not do that!!

[@personnesenki4521]

Our school taxes keep going up every single year and every year the same school districts keep promising to fix or replace these buildings. Nothing is being done with the money being collected via tax now. More money won't fix anything.

[@wesleyneilsen7671]

Seems like everything in the US is collapsing

[@JosephHuether]

Not trying to be critical but I must ask: How does lower enrollment add cost? So many suburban towns resist “adding housing”, saying they don’t want to add to the school population and tax rolls. Interestingly, parochial schools have been closing for decades. There was a lot of school building when I was growing up amidst the baby-boom school enrollment. during the 1960s. Both my suburban New Jersey Catholic elementary school and all-boys Catholic high school have closed over the past 30 years.

[@jusletursoulglobaby]

ehhh... schools are funding on a per pupil basis. lower enrollment means less revenue and the same admin expenses thus additional costs? idk that's my guess. NCLB introduced the concept of closing failing schools. that was enacted what... 2001..2002? so yea the closures have been happening atleast 2 decades

[@ISpitHotFiyaa]

Lower enrollment doesn't automatically add cost. Whether it does or not depends on how well a district can manage its fixed costs. For instance, a building has capital costs (i.e. bond interest) as well as maintenance. If enrollment drops and the district now has a bunch of underutilized buildings then their building costs haven't changed but they're spreading them over fewer students. That's a problem. But it's a problem that's solved by consolidating schools and selling off buildings. Higher enrollment could also bring higher costs if it means the school has to build a new building. You could do an analysis for any individual district but there's no universal rule about lower or higher enrollment bringing higher costs. In theory a district with consistent enrollment is easier to manage and probably has the lowest per-student costs but that assumes you're dealing with competent managers who've correctly sized their buildings for that enrollment.

[@mlw5665]

This all started with corporate influence on public schools and meddling in the curriculum

[@ea42455]

As a retired public school teacher, I have to say that's BS. Not corporate influence, but growing mandates and restrictions imposed by the federal and state authorities... many of which include no additional funding. "We know you can do it" or "Do the best ya' can" is the constant refrain.

[@arontotheleft]

@@ea42455 Except, you're wrong. The Gate Foundation pumped billions into divesting from public school systems and failed.

[@mlw5665]

@@ea42455 Sorry,but corporate pushed curricula are behind mandates in the same way that protecting big pharma's profits was behind vaccine mandates. Corporate America and the government are one and the same now, no matter which party.

[@18_rabbit]

@@mlw5665 no way! i'm a liberal and i even entertain all suggestions of too much corp influence in everything, but that has nothing to do with this! This is cultural and gvt spending at local levels, since Reagan!

[@richardbetts816]

Corporations lobbying politicians

[@tfustudios]

Many folks in our area (Southern California) have taken their kids out of the public schools, or, moved out of state. CA housing costs as well insane behavior by many students.

[@cdheidt]

10% isn’t really that great of a decrease. Prior to this reported stat, we talked about overcrowded classrooms. The problem is we aren’t committed to funding schools no matter what problems arise. The School system is poorly managed- an enrollment decline can be due to a lot of factors, but to simply close schools is a short sighted decision.

[@18_rabbit]

sorry but it's simple math budgetary issue, like here in Western Washington state. Them's the numbers!

[@weirdshibainu]

If your boss told you that he's cutting your wages by 10%, I doubt you would be cool with it. 10% is a big number.

[@Wayfarer889]

Part of it is actually due to fewer kids being born, actually. Universities have been talking about a coming enrollment cliff for a while now, and it's largely due to population decline. That said, I think a lot of parents were appalled during the pandemic at how much time was wasted and how little learning was really happening at school and the opted to make a change. Honestly, the only way to really build a system that works for modern day society is to start from scratch.

[@quantgeekery6358]

Whenever I hear "disproportionate impact on Black and Brown/Latino children," my "white guilt" grift radar goes off.

[@RonaldPetrin]

It’s about time someone comes forward.

[@workingtoseethelight8244]

We can barely get the Republicans to even let kids have lunch. Universal Free Lunch! Fund the schools!

[@Makmurf]

The question is how? Easy to say, need details.

[@shannon-fu8dj]

There is literally no such thing as a free lunch.

[@raristy1]

@@MakmurfBy finally fixing the tax code that taxes you and I 30% while the 1% often get a tax REFUND!!! BTW, you and I pay for that “refund”!!

[@victorygarden556]

Stop streaking money and calling what you buy with it “free”. You’re just a thief.

[@raristy1]

@@victorygarden556 Says the MAGA troll who dreams of being a 1%er some day. You’re the REAL thief!

[@jakelong6860]

This makes no sense because at one point we were talking about class sizings getting too big. Now we're not. Now we're talking about not enough kids makes no sense

[@rmcnally3645]

Exactly this! Why on Earth a school would close when it can have smaller class sizes, makes absolutely no sense. Especially the example of school 10, where the building will remain open but it's going to serve as a Montessori School instead, for a higher wealth demographic. I think you see what's actually going on. This has nothing to do with covid, it has everything to do with administrators and politicians wanting to make money and screwing poor and working families out of a decent education. This is not a covid issue. This is a corruption issue.

[@gracevalentine1666]

The reforms of the 90s killed public schools, guys like Alan D Bersin - a prosecuting attorney who became superintendent of San Diego unified- his minions are Cindy Marten and Staci Monreal, now deputy sec of Ed and special appointee. In the 90s I remember students saying the reforms would close their schools and only rich kids would get education. The attacks on teachers were public, intense and personal.

[@kitkat22322]

Agree, I was a kid in the 90's (80's babies) my generation was the guinea pigs of testing it started in the 4th grade they started testing our knowledge, we had to take the SAT's for college but it all proved BS. Passing these exams did not prove any outcome on how you would end up as an adult!

[@gracevalentine1666]

@@kitkat22322 right, the reliability veracity of test results was tied to zip codes and the wealthy just bought their scores. We didn’t find another way to cull the masses so we get incompetent snobs who don’t know shit about anything.

[@eeship]

I’m intimately familiar with Rochester schools. There are plenty blames ALL around for this failed public school system. With many surrounding suburb schools among the best in the states, with far lower per pupil spending, money is not the only issue.

[@lupemerrit]

I don’t even call it education anymore… our kids are getting dumber by the minute.

[@9doggie12]

Yeah because of public schools

[@kaleena3846]

@@9doggie12No, because of lousy parenting.

[@9doggie12]

@@kaleena3846 lousy parents have always existed but people still learned

[@bubblebobble9654]

Our kids came home from grade 4 with a 1st grade worksheet. From experience with the older we know the school won't accommodate kids at or above grade level if they feel the class average is somewhere else. So we pulled them out. Other kids also got pulled out and are doing home school, at least 5 kids total. What's left are the most difficult low level kids. I feel bad for the kids who could excel but their parents just can't do online school.

[@SanityTastesGood]

Yes. Families are homeschooling because the public school system is failing children. Between woke ideology and the fact that 6th grade students are reading at 3rd grade levels (in CA) , and the school system doesn’t hold failing students back a grade anymore, there is no incentive to learn. My teacher friends are quitting left and right. They say that the behavior of the students is out of hand, disrespectful and abusive, and the parents don’t give a damn because they are too tired to discipline or sit down and do homework with their children. It is what it is. This isn’t a race issue. It’s happening in ALL communities. Rich, Middle Class, and Poor. It’s not proportionally higher in low income areas… it’s EVERYWHERE.

[@catherinec2967]

We have a great public school system in my neighborhood-pre-k to 12th grade. It’s an economically, racially, and culturally diverse community but it works. High school graduates were admitted to Harvard, UCLA, Duke, Cal Tech, University of Chicago, you name it. Protect our communities and protect our school.

[@Interglacial_optimist]

Well we decided to build our cities for cars that can go a hundred and fifty miles an hour instead of people walking to the community shool.

[@shirleygriffin7672]

Remember to read WEAPONS of Mass Instruction by the late John Gatto, and this book is amazing. Like him or not he is spot on

[@workingtoseethelight8244]

Many of the people who claim to be advocating for home schooling, in the comments here, have not even learned to use grammar or spelling check. No one is perfect, but there does seem to be a trend. Remember that language is your friend and be nice to it. Infinite Blessings.

[@jercasgav]

The people that do not use proper grammar WENT to public schools for the most part; they were not homeschooled. Many of these folks with writing issues graduated from college; ergo, it is NOT homeschooling a child that causes this problem lol. With modern tech like the internet , a myriad of internet based learning platforms, and many books for purchase online it is quite possible for a parent to give the child resources that are superior for learning in areas they might lack in themselves (like writing skills). Anyone that graduated from high school should be capable of teaching another person to be proficient at the same level of education they passed previously. In theory, what could be more unnatural than turning your children over to complete strangers that you do not know or get to hand pick to form the mind of your children? Just because we have had several generations of this since around the turn of the 20th century does not mean it is normal, necessary, or how humans have learned well for most of human history.

[@madfoxcityemnau6414]

​Agreed. Homeschooling, if you have the capacity really is quite ideal if you go outside and socialize as needed. Every day I thank God my child is in the midst of teachers who gaf. I was extremely disappointed in my child's parochial elementary education. The pressure to drug/medically abuse kids en masses is quite frightening. The truth is mass education always sucked and we all had to make the best of it. Kids in large groups for hours at a time is NOT conducive to growing up and preparing for an adult life. (My own child: Mom a lot of the kids at school are a-holes. Me: You're right but you dont have to be one of them.) I know my parochial education was of much better quality and today. If I had known how crushing wage stagnation would be, I would never have gone past community College to get a 4 yr degree only to be spending all my free time teaching my child high school class content 😅

[@cimabuehw]

@@jercasgav You started your comment with generalizations that aren't really justified. Not all parents are capable teachers, some are. The same is true for public grade school teachers. What is definitely true is that all children do not learn at the same rate nor at the same time. Most teachers are NOT equipped to deal with that number of needs in the standard issue classrooms. There are ways to deal with it, but most teachers are not trained in those variety of classroom styles, I did not see any of that addressed by the author of the article nor have I really seen it addressed by anyone who responded to the article.

[@CH-gn7rf]

Homeschooling all the way. We have been enormously blessed, and the children are at or above grade level and flourishing 🎉❤

[@Tamara-qd5dc]

A public school in Oakland California, awarded Thomas Edison award to the student last school year. Anyone wants to know what was the award for? A science project? A Math Olympiad participation? Nope, the award named after an esteemed engineer and inventor was given for the student's participation in the Gaza protests. Fun facts: in 2022, 67% of Oakland public school students did not meet state requirements for reading and 74% did not meet state requirements for math. The Oakland Unified School District (OUSD) spends $17,426 per student annually. The majority of school funding in California comes from the state, not local or federal resources. Districts receive these funds based on the number and needs of students attending schools. If I were a parent in Oakland, I would have sold my last shirt and sent my child to a private school.

[@VoteForBukele]

The United States needs a public daycare for non achieving children. School should be reserved for the few who actually value education.

[@TheRealLarissa]

I taught and volunteered in such schools... communities did this to themselves. Truly.

[@laj382]

Extremely large classes with a few bad apples and no consequences for disruptive behaviors.

[@TheRealLarissa]

@@laj382 that is just the tip of the iceberg. And it's way more than a few bad apples. The saturation of gang culture is insane and it's way beyond the students. It's parents grandparents aunts uncles cousins. The lifestyle of violence and lack of respect for education and literacy is horrendous and the amount of money wasted on administration leaves those who are in the classroom sitting targets not just in the classroom but in private life too. I'm speaking from personal experience. And then so many of them go to church on Sunday and drop cash in the basket and pump up the anti choice jerks. It's all gross You know, one of the only States with worse schools than California is Texas.

[@TheRealLarissa]

AND in Texas if you are a Cherokee person with an evangelist preacher for a daddy you, as a teacher can get away with sleep with students. No joke. I know a family....

[@kris.listen748]

“Communities did this to themselves…” You're too old to really think this way. Did you listen to the video at all? Do some research, Larissa. Reading is fundamental.

[@MommaBao]

If you're from the Rochester area, then you'd know it comes from top down. Yes the community is a problem but the bigger problem is administration not caring and milking the school system.

[@glennwatson3313]

I've been a teacher in Alabama for thirty years in public school. My kids are good, my parents are fine and the admin is helpful.

[@urbanlumberjack]

The public schools behaved in a completely irrational and anti scientific a throughout the pandemic. Giving these administrators more power and money is insane.

[@Tad-For-Global-Peace]

As a person growing up through the public school and university getting rid of public education would ruin every single family who can't afford going to private schools and also private schools aren't always available in rural areas. Trump and his project 2025 lack judgement and logic on this. I mean he tried to remove public schools funding during his first term with his incompetent secretary of education, imagine if he's elected in 2020 or 2024 he could try and really do it.“ 💯

[@happyappy19931]

🙄

[@StumblingThroughItAll]

Randy Weingarten did more to drive this trend and a MASSIVE loss in trust in the public school system than almost any other single person. It was her and a number of other officials that completely lost my trust and had me move my children into private school. Keeping schools closed was a devastating error both for children and trust in the institution of public schooling. Randy was on the front lines fighting for extended school closures and beating up on private schools who were opening their doors to kids who were being abandoned.

[@tfustudios]

This 👆!

[@makestank4800]

You mean during COVID or after COVID?🤔

[@hypnokitten6450]

The school closures were needed, as kids are the main vector of transmission for most things in a community. And (aside from life-long physical harm a lot of kids avoided) instead of covid killing over 1 million Americans in 3 years that number would've been Drastically higher. (For context, Russia has had some of its worst losses in history in the past 3 years, and its only lost about 500K). We can make up education, but dead is dead. But yea, we should've responded much faster with funding alternate teaching methods for kids to not fall behind (instead of piece-meal every school on its own and trying to stretch its budget to figure out the tech and tactics). And funding how to re-open safely (masks, distancing, etc) instead of attacking (sometimes physically) teachers and even little kids for trying to stay safe during the re-opening (a lot of teachers have quit because they aren't paid enough to both risk their lives and have to deal with parents demanding that they die just so little johnny doesn't have to wear a small thin mask)

[@StumblingThroughItAll]

@@hypnokitten6450 I am afraid you are quite uninformed on this issue. The further we get from the pandemic, the clearer it becomes that shuttering schools was a profoundly detrimental action to take and there is little to no proof that it actually provided any protection to the general public what so ever. As a crystal clear example, Sweden kept schools open the entire time, and has the lowest all cause excess mortality of any western nation. There is no clear correlation at all between school closures and better community health outcomes. There is no objective proof that closing schools "saved" countless lives, and an ever-growing mountain of evidence that school closures had disastrous effects, most acutely felt by children already on the margins of society. If we want to talk about the issue of structural racism, we have NO better example in modern policy than school shutdowns and how it rapidly expanded the gap in educational performance between racial groups. You won't hear Weingarten bringing that one up for some strange reason. And I am not just talking about this as some thought project. I watched it with my own two eyes. A child my family cares for who lives in the throes of poverty with her working single mom was absolutely crushed by school shutdowns. She was removed from her support systems and isolated from embodied interpersonal interaction for 18 months, all the while being told it was for her health... I plead with you to open your mind even just a little bit to see the destruction the policy decisions made by the likes of Weingarten wrought.

[@hypnokitten6450]

@@StumblingThroughItAll I hear what you are saying but I am not un-informed on the subject. And a personal experience is not a statistic or generizable objective truth. And I read the Sweden research during and after, and there are more details there then the memes of 'Sweden's lack of lockdowns worked'. Which makes complete sense since ware talking about a real disease, with a real death rate, and an easily understood transmission vector (air/breath) that can't be protected from with 'good vibes and prayers'. Sweden is a low-density country with a lot of single-person households compared to other nations, especially the US where even our small towns tend to be high-density (in comparison) with multi-generational households. Also Sweden's approach was basically 'sacrifice old people' - 90% of their deaths were people 70 and older. Our approach was 'let's not kill grandma for the sake of the economy' which I think is a lot more humane. It never developed the holy grail of 'heard immunity' and had a significantly higher death rate (per capita) then all of its neighboring countries that had similar densities. Straight up numbers? Yea, Sweden's economy did well, by murdering its citizens on the altar of 'money', and it was largely protected by its country's composition - not its lack of response. This is held up by both the actual numbers (eg. Johns Hopkins numbers, Pub Med numbers) and common sense (deadly diseases transmit as per their vector and kill as per their mortality rates). As for objective proof that school closings saving lives? There is actually a LOT of data out for that, where states / countries have been measured by how quickly they closed schools vs death rate during that pre-closure and after. As well as death rate increases from states / countries when they re-opened schools. The later is a bit harder to parse in the US because the states that rushes to re-open tended to be red states that were also fighting vaccination and masks, so it is hard to say which of those things caused them to have such significantly higher death rates (in spite of usually having lower densities). But you can look up the numbers on the national library of medicine and a number of other sites. Or if you prefer distilled data check out ground news so you can parse out info sources with heavy bias. But yea, looking at 'how quickly schools were closed' shows a direct tie between school closures and reduced death rates. As for the racism part and school closures, absolutely. There was absolutely a tie. Just like there was a direct tie between racism and death rates. Underserved communities suffered the most from covid deaths, school closure impacts, economic impacts, etc. No question. But 'why' is important. 'Covid' is not racist, it just kills people. Covid deaths is because those areas got the vaccine later then other areas and they had a lower trust in vaccines due to history. School wise they got tech roll-outs for effective at-home lessons later, many of the families didn't have the tech (fast connections, strong computers) at home to use them, parents couldn't afford to stay home with kids and didn't have jobs that could be work-from-home, etc. Economic impact is obvious. So yea, there was an impact. But that's not to say 'schools should not have been closed' - especially since those communities tend to (for cultural and economic reasons) have more multi-generational homes. Yea, there was a trade off. Death vs education. And ideally there should not have been, and we'd be spending our money evenly across all areas of education, especially during a national emergency. And having the pandemic ravage the community even more, while also killing off more of the already-few-teachers in those communities? I suggest that would've Also had a negative impact on education, besides just being cruel. And yes, there was a trade off between physical and emotional health, between the trauma to a child from isolation vs the very-painful death of adults and elders in our society. Sweden said its ok for the elderly to die brutal deaths in return for the kids not being isolated. China tried a zero-death policy that was the other end of the spectrum. The US maintained isolation until it could get a rapid vaccine roll-out, then started opening. We could've done WAY better and re-opened faster and more safely if we hadn't also gotten hit with a miss-information attack from the right that led to mask resistance, vaccine resistance, massive super-spreader events, etc. Still, we hit somewhere in the middle of the two, balancing between protecting our adults and seniors vs re-opening for our kids. Not perfect, but there are no perfect solutions in a once-a-generation global disaster.

[@ryanvannice7878]

The writer admits that the "blue" states and cities suffered more post pandemic, but the conservatives are cutting the legs from under government schools. I'm confused. If the Demoncrats are such advocates of public school, why are those not recovering as well post pandemic? I will give the writer credit; he did say more than once that blue places were impacted more even when the interviewer tried steering him away.

[@jensonee]

is it a goal of conservative leaders to end public schooling?

[@ds7675]

Absolutely!! In AZ when public school employees were fighting for a pay raise and striking, many of the Republican state legislators were in Michigan listening to the Koch brothers about the evils of public education in this country.

[@timjohnson2186]

I am blessed by parents who sent me to private school

[@gobot4455]

When you have people like Betsy Devoss who actively work to undermine the public education system and a political system that incentivizes stupidity of the masses, you this what we have. I am in a technical field and have noticed that the younger people are some of the most confidently wrong people I have ever met in my professional life.

[@rc6184]

No child left behind put the final nail in the coffin for public education.

[@Uncommonsenses]

I know several families who have pulled their kids out of public school and many who send their kids, but with much trepidation and their concerns are entirely about how political schools have gotten. Public schools have decided to represent ultra liberal values and disenfranchise families who do not share a liberal world view. Why would anyone send their child to school when the educators have decided they don’t have to notify parent of important health issues like a child changing their pronouns, or a school that has decided to privilege one interpretation of history and civics over all others? When public schools decided they were more qualified than parents to raise children and substituted an education in liberal values over a skills based curriculum that invited children from all backgrounds, they violated the trust of families, teachers and students. The fact that there is no mention of this in a nearly twenty minute interview on dropping student enrollment, tells you everything you need to know about the bias of this news source. Public schools are failing because they are trying to indoctrinate, not educate. When you do that, don’t be surprised when families find other ways to give opportunities to their students.

[@MichaelSmith4501-jd8pu]

If you want your child to have MASSIVE issues just send them to public school.

[@carolannnoble3981]

Schools need to go back to educating our children. Not just passing thru for numbers. US education is inferior. Concentrate on the basics maybe parents would support.

[@Coloradocorean]

What are the basics then? Schools have extra money for basket weaving?? Schools are being forced to be psychologists, healthcare advocates and feed kids bc parents can’t/WON’t do their part.

[@flamechick6]

YES, and i would appreciate it if there was support for doing homeschool, i have 4 left that need to go to school and its a bit overwhelming 😭🙏 we're in Texas so its easy to unenroll, but finding a system for us is so daunting 😢

[@TheThiaminBlog]

This isn’t about money. Here the amount spent per student in our public schools is more than is spent in our most expensive private school.

[@sjmom5119]

Do you know why it costs more? It's the federal requirements tied to the funding that is causing the higher cost

[@SanityTastesGood]

And there is really no excuse, because more money is allocated per day for Hispanic students than any other race. It’s true. When you register your children for school the paperwork is separated by race.

[@18_rabbit]

@@sjmom5119 what federal req's?!

[@katenoke1571]

@@SanityTastesGood omg, stop with the whining. We're all part of a community. Scapegoating isn't appropriate. Honestly, what a bunch of nasty people.

[@katenoke1571]

@@18_rabbit special education mandates. We agree to offer a free appropriate education that meets the needs of all students. That's why public education is more expensive. Speech therapy, occupational therapy, small group instruction, assistive technology, special reading programs. All children deserve to be able to learn in the best way for them.

[@tejaswiniravindra4307]

Pay teachers better , increase allocation to education , the next generation needs a solid education

[@JonasNJ-b4j]

In blue states like NY and NJ, we spend more than $30,000 per pupil yet the standards continue to fall. The issue isn't more money: that money is stolen by corruption. Charter schools are very popular because they remained open during the pandemic and because they deliver results. Parents vote with their feet.

[@zoponex3224]

❤ Pro Publica.

[@noname-pz9kb]

They forgot to mention that most people are not interested on having their children around “teachers” who have difficulty deciding on one hair color and everything that entails.

[@roygbiv5164]

It is only collapsing because we have a weak federal government when it comes to education. There should be no religion involved in schooling, there should be one set of standards for everyone and all schools should get equal funding and have qualified staff. There are certain aspects of our society that would benefit from "socialism", and education is one of them.

[@cimabuehw]

Their are a lot of comments in your entry with which I agree, however I part company on all kids getting exactly the same thing. All children do not excel at the same levels, nor do they all bloom at the same time. They need to be met where they are and public schools no longer even talk about those needs.

[@spanishtutor2552]

Ir is always about the budget, never about the teachers

[@loislane4421]

Lack of parents, respect, discipline, and value of education.

[@Rnankn]

If enrolment is down, then use the same quantity of resources for fewer students. By doing nothing, schools could have greater teacher-student ratios, and therefore improved quality.

[@virginiamoss7045]

That was my initial response. Great! Fewer students, lower ratio to teacher, more time to teach, more individual instruction, no disruption. The only problem is that the city probably has rules about ratios and finances and time that prohibit better schooling. Shutting down a building or leasing it to Montesori saves some money, even earning some from renting.

[@cimabuehw]

Amen

[@nanday100]

Public schools have embraced screen time and got rid of physical teaching strategies, abandoned discipline and failed to stand their ground against cell phones, stopped field trips and added more and more on teachers' plates. The system is worse and burnt out. Can't blame the parents for just wanting to educate better at home.

[@hypnokitten6450]

Fascinating.. and the pandemic obviously played a huge role.. but I wonder if it is getting too much credit. It got people looking into alternative ed, but if they stuck with it after then they must've liked what they found. Or more like they realized they didn't like what they'd had. I went to public school, no shade, but it wasn't good then and by all accounts its gotten Much worse now. And the attack isn't from just one side of the isle. From the right we have * defunding at every opportunity (less money = less quality in a capitalist society) * preventing any reasonable forms of gun reform (constant school shootings = parents don't want to send their kids to schools to get shot, teachers being asked to act as human shields or Hollywood wild west sheriffs) * war on information (teachers afraid to teach reality / real history = propaganda and poor quality teaching) * war on teachers (teachers attacked for everything from rainbow stickers to masks to books they teach from = teachers aren't empowered to teach. so any parent not wanting glorified babysitters finds other options) * bullies are glorified (not all athletes are bullies, but we built a system - in public education, in our media, in everything - where physical strength is at a higher social tier then academic strength, and we 'overlook' when the strong beat up on those around them, we even joke about it. And then we stick hundreds and thousands of kids together in that system with almost no adult supervision outside of classroom time, little consequences for the bullies, and every incentive to hide your intelligence and not stand out if you are not one of the 'cool kids'. This is normalized but it is NOT normal - not in academia history, not in most other competitive countries) * teachers quitting (low pay, overloaded classrooms, attacks by parents / states fighting right-wing morality-wars, literal threats from parents in right-wing echo chambers) From the left we have * lowering the bar (everyone gets a gold star, some states now require students just get passed without testing, students moving to harder and harder classes without the solid foundations to take on those classes - making classes / public-schools almost meaningless and students un-prepared for college and the real world) * preventing any form of discipline (teachers that are quitting are speaking about how they are at best ignored and at worst physically assaulted by their students with little to no consequence, no tools for maintaining order and the safety of students from other students, no support from admin / parents, and students are weaponizing safety tools - crying 'assault' or worse when teachers give them bad grades or ask for respect in classrooms) * war on information (teachers afraid to teach anything even slightly controversial, fired at the first sign of offending anyone - even though it is impossible to do any form of study of human history / civics / anything without offending someone) * 'otherness' is glorified (I'm bi, poly, etc - so not saying being 'other' is 'bad', I love being 'other'. But part of growing up is finding yourself, which means you try to stand out. Media / events / schools highlight either athletic performance or being part of some protected group. Not to say those are bad, but there is no other available path for standing out. With no other paths being provided, nothing else really being celebrated, and since most people won't be athletes, a lot of kids Are finding their way into protected groups. Not because they're finding themselves but performatively, conforming to something to get a bit of that spotlight on them. And yea, they may even fully believe they are what they say they are... but statistical history suggests a lot are performing) * war on teachers (standardized lessons / tests / expectations tie-up teacher's ability to personalize classes or teach to the level of the students coming in from lower grades, teachers expected to act as social workers and therapists even though that's not what they trained for, teacher qualifications are way more expensive then the salary that should pay off those qualifications) * teachers quitting (high stress, high risk, little support, blamed for everything, can't have private lives without being scrutinized as if they were saints, always one student or parent complaint away from being fired, canceled, and utterly destroyed socially with no right to a trial, evidence, anything) In short? Yea, the pandemic highlighted a problem. But it wasn't 'THE' problem. The problem's been building up, for a LONG time. I came to this country when I was 8 and I literally skipped 1 grade instantly, and would've skipped 1-2 more but my english skill wasn't there yet. And I came from an average european country, nothing special about me or that country's school. That was a couple of decades ago. US public education has been crap and only got worst - the US only leads in education because colleges and trade schools make up the gap. But yea... this is bad.

[@jennywhisconier7777]

wanted to hear this segment, but the guest's audio was to distorted to handle.

[@willzsportscards]

Covid may have accelerated this, but the school systems in general in America have been failing for a while now. No resources etc etc. My friend's kids coming home without homework. Classes are teaching to the lowest denominator (weakest student). I could go on and on. All these kids I know went private. Take that and the school shooting stuff, and my kids will be going private too when they're in middle school. If you can pay for quality, you pay for quality.

[@chuckstrawn3076]

And stop subsidizing families for taking their kids out of public schools to enroll them in Charter schools, home schooling, and private schools. Taking tax payer funds away from public schools by allowing these funds to go to private schools, results in the erosion of quality educations in public schools and the dumbing down of America. This might serve the interests of the crazy right wing elements of our society but not for people who care about quality public education which supports a strong democratic republic.

[@cottonfieldlover1]

No public education, no shared national identity, no nation-state. Simple. Say goodbye to all the returns from scale that stem from a shared identity thanks to public education. All other legitimate grievances pale in comparison.

[@scottrobinson9752]

I cannot imagine handing my child over to government schooling.... That is cruel and unusual punishment. Homeschooling is so much more productive...exponentially so. So glad my kid had never even stepped foot in a government school. Best decision my wife and I ever made.

[@hannathehappynomad]

The birth rate is dropping, so of course, more schools will be closing. In our district we have an opposite problem. They are building new building to accommodate more kids. My guess is the schools that are closing didnt do much good for kids education anyway.

[@brooklynnchick]

America gets what it pays for in public education. My husband and I are both secondary education teachers, he in math and I in science. We could make better hourly wages by working at a fast food restaurant but we LOVE teaching our students that math and science are tools that prove these students are intelligent, capable, innovative minds. We never went into teaching to make money, we did it to make students better. The more conservative politics and conservative parents have taken over our school boards and parent-support groups the more difficult and hostile our jobs as teachers have gotten. THAT’s why families are leaving for private education or home schooling.

[@MommaBao]

Actually the conservative parents are leaving in droves due to woke politics, focusing on diversity and not on learning just plain old math, reading, writing, history, etc. My friend in public education said public school is political in nature, that is turning away conservative parents. With the handling of pandemic and what my friend said, that is why I left public schools.

[@ClarityDetermination]

This is a straight forward result of government, financial policies.

[@TheTaoofEternalWar]

Former teacher from Oklahoma here. It's about discipline. The Jokers can get away with anything short of murder these days. The only standard is EVERYBODY GRADUATES. That's all that matters to the administration. Liberals will never acknowledge this fact. Good education requires LOVE and DISCIPLINE. One without the other creates monsters.

[@gracevalentine1666]

Retired blue teacher. Inner city coastal and rural experience. Do not be so stupid, we need good behavior to do teaching, it was parents like you that were “rule disrespecters” haters that resented teachers, reading and history.

[@feruspriest]

​@@gracevalentine1666 >.> where are you seeing evidence in OPs language that they resent teachers?

[@gracevalentine1666]

@@feruspriest I have the legal records - so does this blog: District deeds. Anyone talented defied the directive to run the district down so the real estate could be sold and education privitized. Read it for yourself.

[@feruspriest]

Again: the dude you responded to, what evidence do you have that he resents teachers?​@@gracevalentine1666

[@gracevalentine1666]

With respect to a fellow teacher, I was disciplined for dropping a student with 43 absences. I am a Democratic socialist, former hippy biker, and lefter than you might be able to imagine. Your argument is vapid, your students suffered for being exposed to you.

[@theradiantmomclub3173]

I resigned my teaching position to homeschool my son. I’ve been in the public school system and have never witnessed what I’ve seen the last two years. Sometimes my school site which was considered one of the better schools in the district sounded like a psych ward with kids screaming in the hallways, running up and down the hallways and disrupting learning. I know a kindergarten teacher who has 5 kids in diapers. She is not a Special Ed teacher. This is not normal. Why are parents pulling kids? Because those environments are unhealthy and full of stress and anxiety.

[@personnesenki4521]

If you're a conservative, why are you still sending your kids to public schools? The time to abandon them was decades ago.

[@ISpitHotFiyaa]

In most states you don't get a voucher or even a tax deduction. So you have to pay for the private school tuition on top of your school taxes. That's more than most people can afford.

[@personnesenki4521]

@@ISpitHotFiyaa For some people yes it is expensive. For others it is a matter of cutting back on worldly expenses. Downsize to a smaller/cheaper house. Give up the new cars. Give up the vacations. Give up on eating out every week. If you love your kids, you will find a way.

[@meganharris583]

@@personnesenki4521but that’s not the majority….

[@personnesenki4521]

@@meganharris583 Oh I agree... only a tiny minority of conservatives are willing to make the sacrifice needed to do that. Sadly, those parents will need to be content with their children being raised by leftists.

[@Runrunshaw100]

Public education is doing great. Keep it up. No reform needed.