Amazon.com "Grade A" 310Ah -Ninthcit- LiFePO4 Cells Manually Balanced and Tested

[@WillProwse]

And get this, amazon is not paying for the return shipping. I've never had this issue before, and I stated that the product is defective. But Amazon did give me the address of this cell supplier's warehouse in los angeles so I will drive there myself and show them specifically how they screwed up and what they need to do to fix it. What a huge waste of time. I'll try to film the experience if I can. The warehouse is next to some other solar suppliers I know. Seems they all sit around and pump these cells out from the ports all day. Update: Hello, Dear buyer, we saw that you said there was a quality problem with the battery. Our colleagues will contact you for confirmation. We will refund you first. We will provide you with a prepaid return label after work. At present, we sell the new grade a battery of 280ah plus. Each battery has complete data and test report, Your return does not need to pay any return transportation expenses. Thank you! Best regards! Ninthcit customer service team Tommy Wang I just got an email from amazon stating that they are refunding the order. That is good. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Does off-grid solar confuse you? Check out my DIY friendly website for solar system packages and product recommendations, and so much more! www.mobile-solarpower.com Join our DIY solar community! #1 largest solar forum on the internet for beginners and professionals alike: www.diysolarforum.com Check out my best-selling, beginner-friendly 12V off-grid solar book (affiliate link): amzn.to/2Aj4dX4 If DIY is not for you, but you love solar and need an offgrid system, check out Tesla Solar. Low prices and great warranty, and they can take your entire house offgrid with their new Powerwalls: ts.la/william57509 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My solar equipment recommendations (Constantly updated! Check here first): 12V/48V Lithium Batteries: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-batteries.html Solar System Component Directory: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solarcomponents.html Plug-N-Play Systems: www.mobile-solarpower.com/full-size-systems.html Complete 48V System Kits: www.mobile-solarpower.com/complete-48v-solar-kits.html DIY Friendly Air Conditioner/ Heat Pumps: www.mobile-solarpower.com/solar-friendly-air-conditioners.html Complete 48V System Blueprint: www.mobile-solarpower.com/48v-complete-system-blueprint.html ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ My Favorite Online Stores for DIY Solar and Coupon Codes: -Current Connected: SOK, Victron and High Quality Components. Best prices and warranty around: currentconnected.com/?ref=wp -Signature Solar: Cheap Server Rack Batteries and Large Solar Panels: www.signaturesolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Ecoflow Delta Official Site: My favorite plug-n-play solar generator: us.ecoflow.com/?aff=7 -AmpereTime: Cheapest 12V batteries around: amperetime.com/products/ampere-time-12v-100ah-lithium-lifepo4-battery?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Rich Solar: Mega site and cheaper prices than renogy! Check them out: richsolar.com/?ref=h-cvbzfahsek -Shop Solar Kits: Huge site with every solar kit you can imagine! Check it out: shopsolarkits.com/?ref=will-p -Battery Hookup: Cheap cell deals bit.ly/2mIxSqt 10% off code: diysolar -Watts 24/7: Best deals on all-in-one solar power systems, with customer support and distribution here in the USA: watts247.com/?wpam_id=3 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Contact Information: I am NOT available for personal solar system consult! If you wish to contact me, this is my direct email: [e-mail] Join the forum at diysolarforum.com/ if you wish to hang out with myself and others and talk about solar FTC Disclosure Statement and Disclaimers: Every video includes some form of paid promotion or sponsorship. Some links on this youtube channel may be affiliate links. We may get paid if you buy something or take an action after clicking one of these. My videos are for educational purposes only. Information is subject to change/update at any time. Electricity is DANGEROUS and can kill. Be smart and use common sense :) DIY Solar Power with Will Prowse is a participant in the Amazon Services LLC Associates Program, An affiliate advertising program designed to provide a means for sites to earn advertising fees by advertising and linking to Amazon.com

[@WG7D]

That video of your return will be quite interesting if you can do it. I appreciate your research on these cells. Carry on ! WG7D

[@dylan-nguyen]

I’ve noticed Amazon is getting stingy on returns. I marked a $10 package as not received and they said to defer to USPS and USPS said if we say it’s delivered we can’t do anything I said that to Amazon and they said to file a police report….

[@LithiumBatteryGuy]

Will I can help you get real new cells. The sellers are pulling more and more scams these days. I sell them in Australia. I can get EVE and CATL and Gamfeng new cells. I haven't bothered with Lishen at this stage. I promise they are all new.

[@LithiumBatteryGuy]

They do cost closer to $130-140USD for new. Not like these $80-100 cells. They aren't new

[@xzibit8614]

Escalate and ask for US support. I’ve done this. You’re talking to a chat support center overseas

[@paradislarry]

I can not thank you enough ... I've started to buy everything electric, mowers etc, bought an EGO set up with a solar charged battery pack system, which can also be used for 120 back up in my Mobile Home. Started watching your videos 3 months ago, you've taught me almost everything I now know about electricity, and I am a 64 year old Luddite. Even tho you really pushed the information on this video, I actually understood every word thanks to your concise tutorials.

[@maikmeier5032]

Agreed, even though I cannot use the EGO on the other side of the Atlantic, it helped me find the correct 3 phase 380V with any 48V battery to connect. Awesome channel! Also, it helps to see that top balancing will only net 1% more on most cheaply purchased cells.

[@zodszoo]

Thank you for always being so forthright and honest with us, it is truly appreciated sir.

[@stans5270]

Will: "Don't do this at home, this is dangerous." No worries, Will. I have no idea what you are doing.

[@PeteZam]

lol exactly. but oddly enough i cant get enough of these battery and solar videos

[@JamesLewis]

LOL!... The battery was so close to being fully charged that the charge curve was already well into the CV "Constant Voltage" section, where the current drops off... so in order to top the batteries off quicker he set the power supply to a higher voltage so that it would move back to a CC (Constant Current) part of the curve. This is dangerous because it means that now YOU, not the charger are responsible for monitoring the battery voltage and ensuring that it doesn't get over-charged... if you forget and leave it, it could be destroyed (or with some chemistries it could cause a fire etc)...

[@justinjja2]

Simple explanation: His wires were too thin and were dropping voltage across them. He just turned up the voltage to compensate for that drop. But if he wasn't paying attention, his batteries would eventually get overcharged and would severely damage them.

[@spittingfacts4662]

Chinese companies ALWAYS LIES AND OPERATE UNETHICALLY. They are the absolute worstttt

[@JamesLewis]

@@spittingfacts4662 Ironically, just like we refer to "Elon time" when talking about SpaceX... Most of my circle tend to refer to "Chinese watts", when it comes to anything purchased from those suppliers... different products/brands tend to have different ratios of course... for example there are plenty of brands of 18650 cells where the actual capacity is as low as 5-10% of the claimed capacity... while other vendors do deliver 90% or greater of the claimed capacity... you just have to learn how to spot the signs!... Another example is LED products... there are reputable brands of flashlight that list lumens and they are usually within 95% of their claimed output... while many generic brands might be in the 25% range.... I think this has a lot to do with how well regulated they are by people like Will who test the products and hold their feet to the fire when their products don't meet the claims.... Another example is any kind of unbranded LED spot/floodlight for a car is usually around 50% for example...

[@zzcfrank]

I've bought some grade A EVE 280's from Shenzhen Qishou Technology... and while they were $106US each.. they were not bloated and pulled full capacity! :-)

[@ioanekoroivuki543]

Someone else mentioned that Eve brand and said that it worked as advertised. Nice.

[@davidmontgomery6170]

I bought 8 280 A grade cell and have been using them in outback australia in my Caravan. No issues thanks Will I will not be buying from Amazon

[@shanegaul]

Thank you for your input, it is appreciated. I've just ordered 2 battleborn 100 AH, I have only 1000 watt array, just ordered a watt 247 combiner box today and have a midnight solar classic. Your appreciation for these products encouraged me to purchase them. So once again thank you.

[@joanf]

OMG the feeling he got when he found out it was 304Ah, the happines in his face it's just crazy to believe that sometimes we dream things that actually become real.

[@AdamB9574]

Thanks for sharing Will. I bought 16 grade A 280Ah cells from Shenzhen Basen and they were not bloated at all. I am about to get 108 of 310Ah cells now. I am having a second thought after watching your videos, whether I should stick with 280Ah. I agree with you, swelling is telling. How can a brand new cell be bloated like this? It’s not even practical to apply any pressure to these, since it’s hard to tell how they will behave after a couple of cycles. Last thing we need, is to damage the blue wrapping when they are compressed - BOOM! My guess is, they had to test these cells at very high C rates at the factory, although I might be wrong. But this is new, and someone saying that it’s natural for grade A 300Ah to look like this, it’s hard to believe. The SEI layer did not have a chance to form yet, it needs a couple of charge cycles first, right? I can’t complain about my 280Ah cells. They are not that far apart. Thanks,

[@GoGadgetsLife]

Hello ,Adam ,we have 100% Real original Brand new Grade A 280AH and 310AH .If you need,reply me ,thanks

[@cenariusbg]

Hi, 10 months later what happened? Did you buy the 280A cells? How are your initial 280A cells holding? What do you use them for?

[@randybobandy9828]

You can put a layer of fish paper between the cells if you're concerned about damaging under compression. These cells should absolutely be compressed.

[@djstraylight]

Great testing! And I agree they should not be swollen. Most people are buying LiFePO4 cells for long-term use and LFP batteries have great cycle life. Why overpay for grade B cells and get cheated out of cycles & capacity.

[@lckoolg622]

Will is living the dream, literally.

[@spittingfacts4662]

Chinese companies ALWAYS LIES AND OPERATE UNETHICALLY. They are the absolute worstttt

[@AFlyingCookieLOL]

@@spittingfacts4662 Why are you spamming the chat here? You copied and paste your hate here too.

[@__WJK__]

With all his in-depth knowledge of low voltage solar systems, etc... Will's becoming clairvoyant :^)

[@fauxxuaf]

Good one

[@spittingfacts4662]

@@AFlyingCookieLOL just spitting facts that everyone is already thinking. Don’t worry about it little guy.

[@Jon-ie8kk]

This channel is pure gold.

[@sevans66]

Will, can you have a dream of the winning lottery numbers and share them with me?

[@spittingfacts4662]

Chinese companies ALWAYS LIES AND OPERATE UNETHICALLY. They are the absolute worstttt

[@williammeek4078]

@@spittingfacts4662 Except not.

[@__WJK__]

@Shawn Evans - Will's newly discovered clairvoyance is not to be used for personal gain (jk) :^)

[@AFlyingCookieLOL]

@@spittingfacts4662 **Chinese companies ALWAYS LIES AND OPERATE UNETHICALLY. They are the absolute worstttt** Just admit it that you are a racist. That is one broad brush you are using.

[@jamesmatthews4840]

@@AFlyingCookieLOL Lol are you Chinese? He has a valid point. Their QC is non existent.

[@Me-yw9mi]

False advertising and/or defective if they can’t pull rated capacity. In either case you should not have to pay for return shipping. That’s a scam in my books !

[@udisami9856]

I have a strong feeling telling me that those cells are not gonna last for the advertised 3000 cycles, not even for half of them. Bloating and debloating will cause physical internal conductor fatigue and eventual breakdown. They will be gone way ahead of their time.

[@terrypampin8426]

P

[@morkovija]

monday starting strong! thanks Will

[@Chris-hy6jy]

A capacity test on that single cell would be interesting.

[@geraldgrogan]

Agreed - a single cell capacity test would be very helpful

[@spittingfacts4662]

Chinese companies ALWAYS LIES AND OPERATE UNETHICALLY. They are the absolute worstttt

[@veganpotterthevegan]

@@spittingfacts4662 Stop spamming that nonsense.

[@spittingfacts4662]

@@veganpotterthevegan Chinese companies are 100x worse hands down

[@veganpotterthevegan]

@@spittingfacts4662 Like US companies, there's a ton of variation. And at least every Chinese worker gets healthcare. Can't say the same in the US.

[@egnegn123]

Look at the last video of Andy from off-grid garage. He had ordered 304 Ah cells from a much better supplier and got actually 308 - 312 Ah out of each cell for about 110 USD per cell.

[@thomasbarlow4223]

Just finally tested my 280ah cells off amazon which ive been using for the last 6 months and they actually pulled the full 3.5kw. i was so surprised being that they were slightly bulged.

[@tomwilliam5118]

I have dreams like that myself. I was a technician in a Mainframe computer company back in the 70s and 80s. I was working on this system for days and could not figure out what was wrong. One night I had a dream which IC was the problem. I went into work the next day change that IC and the system started working.

[@fredc3543]

Too Good To Be True: For the price, no company is going to spend 8 hours and the watts required to perform that test. They probably just charge them to capacity and push them out the door. Clearly, the low cell wouldn't pass that test.

[@lavenderlilacproductions]

The willingness of Chinese manufacturers to flat out lie about their products amazes.

[@therealsparkman]

@@lavenderlilacproductions The willingness of people to buy them is equally amazing. Do you think that they have any kind of quality assurance department? I don't f'ing think so.

[@mikemotorbike4283]

@@lavenderlilacproductions its not the manu, its a used battery auction reseller, aka a yard sale

[@trevornelmes9331]

Everybody I know who has purchased (and received) cells at 300-320Ah have all said the cells they got, most were bloated to an extent, but none as bad as the one you showed. But, those who purchased the Eve 280Ah have said that they universally were nice and flat and always pulled more than 280Ah. So, for now, I would say 280Ah Eve are the way to go (not welded lugs though). They appear reliable and better made. If you look at the dimensions, something doesn't add up. Start with the Eve and do kWh per volume and per weight. The other brand 300-320Ah cells appear to have higher energy densities. Are they trying to squeeze too much in to the space, and cost cutting on the cell construction materials (thickness)?

[@alex-w8p2e]

May I ask why you don't recommend welded studs?

[@trevornelmes9331]

@@alex-w8p2e If you apply more than a very low torque, the weld can fracture, causing micro-arcing, which you won't see. If you want a welded connection, it is better as a plate, not a stud. Like the ones Will Prowse saw when he opened up an EG4 Server Rack Battery.

[@alex-w8p2e]

@@trevornelmes9331 ok, thanks , I bought lf280k which Is only available with welded studs, so I won't tighten it too much

[@trevornelmes9331]

@@alex-w8p2e I seem to recall maybe 6-8 ftlbs max, but I don't have a datasheet to hand. That is less than my 'hand' tight.

[@BrlU]

Dont forget to place a review! for future buyers that they know to look out when buying!

[@dr.mithunmuralikrishna]

"Will Prowse dreams of Amp hours" should be the name of the docu on him

[@fantasticOne]

it's obvious those cells will not last long... there are some proper ways to just balanced those cells overnight. and after that it needs 3x charge/discharge cycle in low current. then you're done and ready to go for higher current application without damaging cell and it will increase performance.👍🏻 Thanks for the video 😊

[@__WJK__]

Much as I like the LiFePO4 tests... I'm equally excited to see if Will can find a legit balancer.

[@gmeast]

well, Will ... let's just wait for the 'next' GREAT storage breakthrough, and start over.

[@SolarWebsite]

This is a nicely "balanced" review 😋

[@Sheetbender]

These cells are hit or miss. My first batch of 4 Supposed Catyl 320ah cells tested 295 and were perfectly flat when half charged and fully charged. My second batch of 4 arrived bloated but tested 321ah. They bloated more when top balanced to 3.58v. I've since restricted their expansion by about 50%. With no apparent problem. I used 1/4" aluminum plate and 4 threaded rods, 2 each side. The rods never get tight from expansion. If I think limiting expansion is better than allowing excessive internal movement. Why else would manufacturers reccomend compression? I'm sure it is because limiting expansion is good for the cells. That's my theory and I'm sticking to it! P.S. I'm charging only to 13.6(pack of 4) and discharging to 12 volts, expansion is much less this way, still getting 306ah.

[@thomasbarlow4223]

What I used to top balance my cells was by burning off power from the highest voltage cell. I used a long spool of copper wire with a thinner piece of wire at the very end shorting out each side. It's nice being able to burn off 25 amps at a time from each cell

[@calmeilles]

When you're dreaming cell capacities… it may be time for a holiday. 😀

[@MsLincos]

😂

[@saad128red]

Always have same issues, we just make a pack with similar cells and got more swell after few days of charge and discharge.

[@DVLITTLEPILOT]

Will Looking for the video you made about people going to the library not to read and learn but use the WI FI and China It was one of your best videos I have ever seen you make !

[@derekbunker2577]

I purchased 20 CATL 310Ah "Grade A" batteries from Alibaba which look exactly like these ones. Most had no swelling while a couple of them had slight swelling.

[@SammieDavis707]

Thanks for sharing all your research Will! I'm saving up for a system like yours while I wait on a better house buying market. Solar is going up day one and I'm so exited!

[@user-qm6ti9vm5c]

Maybe 270-280ah is the sweet spot based on cell size and the limits of the aluminum sleeves versus bloating etc… battleborns new battery is 270ah . Going past that may get into more bloating , shortened life, based on current designs of the prismatic cells

[@DissatisfiedCitizen]

I don't know much but I've been looking into these types of cells to replace my Nissan Leaf G2 cells I got last year. I have seen a guy not compress them and they all were flat against each other till he charged them then they all bulged so I'd say some bloating is natural on these type of cells but you got a bad cell. Really appreciate the videos I learn a lot.

[@leonclose7823]

I'd love to see the structure that holds these cells under compression in commercial EV applications. I wonder how complicated it would be to replicate.

[@Nicksperiments]

I usually use a piece of plywood on each side and 2 ratchet straps to compress them

[@volvo09]

I think it's just an aluminum case they are placed in that fits snugly. While these aren't the same chemistry cells, pouch LiPo cells in ev's are also held under compression. People are making their own gadgets with springs and whatnot, but i don't believe it truly has to be that complicated. Just a rigid rack to keep the individual layers in the cell compacted and in contact with each other.

[@clasico2.044]

commercial banding (metal, insulated well particularly the corners. It's the same used for palletizing cargo.

[@randybobandy9828]

@@volvo09 snuggly fit doesn't = compression

[@JonathanAdami]

"What are the chances?" Well... you know you're aiming from 280 to 320 so 1 out of 40? 2.5% that's the chances, not negligeable! Especially since you know... you have experience so intuition and all :) But yeah good video aye, cheers for making it!

[@l0gic23]

Agree fully, theft is theft and people need to hold corporations accountable. It's amazing to me how much latitude, benefit of don't and blind forgiveness is given to corporate personage. Return it yes. Because you bought it on Amazon, the return should be "easy", but if not, file an A-Z Claim and Amazon will set things right. If Amazon fails to make things right, issue a Credit Card charge back against Amazon as they also need to be held accountable. Your customer review on Amazon would also help others who have yet to find your vids (and hopefully will, because of your review).

[@ytSuns26]

When you stop to think how many cells fit into a 20 x 8 x 8 space it’s easy to see a couple companies sharing a container.decades ago now I sold carbon filters for water . The Home Depot pricing was about 12.00 I offered them on eBay for six dollars sold none . I raised the price to 9.25 sold like crazy perceived value. My bet the higher price guy sells more cells than the cheaper guy.

[@Austin1990]

Apart from perceived value, there are too many scams, now. If something is “too” cheap, it is usually a scam.

[@TheDraconiuslives]

I bought from this EXACT company via AliExpress, US shipp. 120ah for $440. I had some swelling as well. Compressed them and are now in my van.

[@michaelbouckley4455]

You shouldn’t try to compress already bloated cells

[@user-yh7fc7wt6v]

I have been useing 280ah cells for over a year Not swelled , new or used New tested 289 They stay within .oo4 on every day charging I charge to 13.5v each , 2 batteries both run the over kill 120a hooked in parallel Cells are flat as can be , new n still I run a older camper , make a cpl pots of coffee n run power tools with this setup Every cell that iv had that pulls what stated is not swelled, seems if it's swelled they won't pull what should

[@WillProwse]

Good to know! Thanks for the input Charlie

[@poet-tramp825]

I’ve been subscribed and watching your channel for awhile. Always great info and product breakdown. I was hoping that in the near future(if possible and time allows) that you might do a video on how to set up a 24 volt system and then connect it to your homes electrical panel so that you could operate your entire home from the solar all in one 24 volt system. I’m building an off grid home and I’m confused on how to directly connect the solar power to an electrical breaker box so that you can easily just plug in your appliances directly to wall outlets or turn on lights from switches as if you’re tied directly to grid power. I understand I’ll need to wire home while building as if I’m doing conventional tie to grid power. Thank you so much for your help sir. Keep up the great content 🤙🏻 I’ve watched tons of KZbin but I’ve yet to see anyone explain the process like you and no one has ever actually shown how to wire in for example a 24 volt Mpp solar all in one directly into an electrical fuse box in home so that you could easily just plug in your homes appliances to wall outlets as if tied directly to grid.

[@terajarvie4368]

Love watching your videos. Even if it's not one that I really needed to watch. You make everything more interesting. Lol

[@eggshellgoesgaming]

In China-speak, 310AH is the model number. I also wondered if they test with a different upper/lower cutoff limit. Drain it till it melts and yup you got 320.

[@randybobandy9828]

That's not how it works.. There is next to no capacity under a certain voltage

[@davidadams421]

I've never heard of 'cell bloating' being a 'feature' of LFP cells. I'm calling bunkum on that. Imagine if the cells were in an ungiving enclosure - that's why pipes crack in winter. You say you paid relatively more but your argument still holds: you get what you pay for, and these, by your own admission, were 'a good deal'. Great video and what you're doing here for the community is admirable.

[@nainabla]

Prismatic cells usually expand for 2 mm when fully charged and go back to normal when discharged

[@bradley3549]

Expansion is completely normal for lithium battery chemistries. These budget basement cells probably have the thinnest possible cases, and they just can't contain it without significant deformation. I wouldn't discount them on that basis alone. Still pretty hard to beat for the money. But I think I'd be inclined to constrain them to keep the movement down.

[@davidadams421]

Physically restraining expansion doesn't sound like a very good idea. Just ask the water pipe.

[@bradley3549]

@@davidadams421 I totally get the analogy. But I'd counter that by pointing out that plumbing does expand and contract within the normal range of water pressures encountered in a residential environment. Consider that the normal lithium cell. Of course when water freezes, all bets are off. Consider that the worn or damaged cell. Sure, compression/constraint remains controversial. Some cell manufacturers call out specifications for it. Cylindrical cells do it naturally. Some research papers I've read demonstrate a sweet spot where increased cell pressure improves life to a certain point. Really, Will has a fantastic opportunity here to collect real world data. Take his new 16s pack - constrain half the cells with a really rigid clamping configuration - and leave the other unconstrained. I'd love to see that data after a few years of full capacity daily cycles.

[@davidadams421]

I would not advocate any action that increases the pressure within an enclosed vessel that is not designed for that pressure. It's simply not a safe behaviour. There is a pressure relief valve on all LFP cells for exactly this purpose i.e. to reduce the risk of explosive failure due to pressure increase, the inference being that pressure increases are not part of the design. Furthermore, most installation guides I have seen recommend spacers between cells, this is not to accommodate bulging but to provide for more efficient dissipation of heat (i.e. a safety feature); a bulging cell would reduce this air-flow / heat dissipation and, thus, reduce the inherent safety of the product design. I don't claim to be a battery expert but, from a layman's perspective, I would be critical of any battery manufacturer that says 'bulging LFP cells are fine'.

[@Dutch_off_grid_homesteading]

Heya, yes my cell's are bolding aswell it's the chemistrie inside as fare as I untherstand

[@charleschristianson1439]

It is grade "A".....A.. Hole Company..great work bro....

[@swsuwave]

China has 4 "A" grades. A++, A+, A, A-, then they drop to B grade, which is equivalent to F grade in the USA. China A=C grade. Look at the blue wrap on top, I can see on video those came out of energy storage, which was a common use for 302 cells.

[@robert4027]

I would send it back for sure. All 4 cells

[@gobfranklin6759]

Great information. Thank you for proving out this test.

[@cyblue2846]

I paid about $100 each for 8x 280Ah so I was ok with the 246Ah they tested at.

[@chrisp7652]

I bought 8 280ah cells from Aliexpress that were “grade A” cells. Six were swollen and one cell always charged faster than the others and it was an end cell as well. Not so sure it is not the BMS that isn’t the problem. Swap your end cell and check for yourself. With these BMS’ it seems to happen this way and I am not so sure if the BMS is having a negative effect on the end cell.

[@jameschristie4596]

Not what I want to hear. I ordered 8 - 280ah cells from Aliexpress that are also supposed to be Grade A. Supposed to arrive in October,...looks like I am not going to be happy

[@chrisp7652]

@@jameschristie4596 You will not be happy to know it will cost more to ship them back than buy new ones. Do NOT buy the overkill BMS. They guy buys them from Aliexpress, sticks a sticker on it and marks it up 100%. But the same BMS on Aliexpress. You may have to work hard to get the cells to take a full charge. I could not get my cells to take a charge up to 3.65 volts until I let them set for weeks at 3.3 volts. Still, they are a better value than buying Battleborn batteries. You may get only 250ah but that is still remarkable for the price. Good luck.

[@Tumbleweed5150]

@@chrisp7652 At least with Battleborns one gets a 10 year warrantee, plus since they are in the US, if one has problems, it won't take months to replace a bad battery.

[@chrisp7652]

@@Tumbleweed5150 true. If you build your own you save loads of cash and if you do not abuse your cells, you can get over 10 years. My 8 cells and BMS cost less than $1000 and at worst I have 500ah which is 5 BB batteries or $5000. Do the math.

[@Tumbleweed5150]

@@chrisp7652 Good point.

[@FlugPoP]

LOL. Will your dreams come true! Congratulations 👏

[@sailme2day]

Thanks for the honesty will, as always :)

[@gregyohngy]

Bloated cells are not appropriate or you'd find all "A" grade cells were bloated! 🤔

[@raven4k998]

to bloat or not to bloat I am pretty sure bloating is a bad sign for battery's specially when they say they are balanced and matched and will prove that one wrong

[@RR-or5ip]

Dude you have saved me so much time and money because of your reviews and this channel....when the pandemic is over you should try to go to China and get a tour of the facilities that make these batteries....I think that would be so interesting.

[@MjrNiGhTmArE]

Bad idea. Don’t trust China one bit.

[@RR-or5ip]

@@MjrNiGhTmArE Me either but everything is made there :-(

[@zonta71]

If the price looks too good, then you end up pay twice or more. Thanx for the videos 1luv

[@holgerj7520]

I just got 8 grade a eve 280ah cells. They were not really swollen but I have a weak cell. Probably a few ah short of 280 ah. Overall still impressed with my batch (1500$ shipped)

[@Dreadlk]

The never ending search for Grade A batteries at Grade B Prices. I remember in my youth it was finding Chinese and Russian Tubes that could handle the same power as American made Eimac Tubes. Even when we found the a cheap tube that actually delivered the same power to the amplifier as the Eimact, it would fail in a year or two as opposed to the Eimac made tube that would last 20 years.

[@kenjohnson5498]

What a bummer you would think being a US distributor they would be what you expected and free of defects. I think you should start a distributorship at least we would know we were buying from an honest company. "Amped Up" would be a good name :P

[@ArcticSeaCamel]

Great content as always. I don't remember you testing pouch cells. I believe they're cheapest option to buy, but need some work to make decent pack. You could check those some day as well. Thanks!

[@djrrmml7514]

Nice Sunpower panels! @ 3:28

[@WiSeNhEiMeR-1369]

HOWdy W-P, ... Thanks for the DATA & REVIEWS COOP the WiSeNhEiMeR from Richmond, INDIANA ...

[@howardsmith6294]

Thanx for all the great videos and tutorials.

[@berthaduniverse]

Hey Will, buy a few sheets of 1/4"+ poly off eBay and cover those shelves...

[@DIYwithBatteries]

I want to buy these cells, lot of people are using these cell and I'm on my 18650's ;)

[@randypierce9485]

Will, can you do a video for disposal and recycling of lithium ion batteries?

[@PrescottCaliberClub]

I’ve got my 280ah LifePO4 on the way. I can’t wait for them to arrive. Supposed to be brand new grade A. 🤞🏼

[@xrpbelieverxrpbeliever5093]

Love all your videos

[@tomnoyb8301]

Am certain your assessment is correct... Manual top-balanced only three of four cells? The one not balanced was the bad cell? Coincidence? Procedure might be uniform for all four cells? 2) There's a difference between cells connected to power-supply and disconnected, especially after a few minutes to settle. 3) Those automatic-balancers seem unreliable, especially on end cells? 4) Maybe move the bad cell into middle and rebalance? (more...) 5) Voltage isn't a great way to balance, especially at the top-end of charge-state. Unfortunately, the only better way might be to run full discharge curves on each cell individually and overlay the curves? See what each cell's total capacity? Measure possible differences in top-end voltages vs total capacity? Not recommending it, because it's a lot of work and unlikely to answer the question, just something to think about? 6) Comment about first-cell being first to under-voltage is a poor-man's way of estimating capacity and may well prove the first cell is bad. However, cells at the ends-of-stacks often exhibit anomalies (e.g. lead-acid ends-of-stack cells often require more water?)? Easy enough to swap cell-1 into the middle (as suggested in #4 above)? 7) Not sure how disconnected the load is? Is there backward diode leakage? Best to just disconnect it during manual balancing, just to be sure? 8) Even if somewhat unreliable, auto-balancer anomalies support both #6 and #7 possibilities?

[@prophotoservices]

Please publish who you return to and if they are working with you and providing service

[@garfish307]

I had a dream that I watched this video in which you had a dream. There was a spinning top involved.

[@pmacgowan]

Thanks Will

[@heathroush5343]

If the batteries aren't hitting their rating, even if it slightly low, then they should be considered bad and be returned. We need to fight back against this false advertising.

[@raven4k998]

yes we should fight back fight the power!

[@lachlanbird9688]

Thank you for the video report.

[@jeffreygraves4964]

You kick ASS, in every way!!!

[@whateverthisis3929]

The lies about capacity don't bother me as much as the swelling. I would be concerned about how long a swollen cell will actually last.

[@darksilverrayleigh8047]

hi will,can you make a video about ac and dc protective devices?,😁🤗☺️

[@howardschlunder9754]

You should squeeze bloated cells with your hands. If they are solid, an oversize jelly roll inside is pushing back on you. If they give slightly, only then suspect internal decomposition gasses. Alternatively, you should not buy such large cells. LiFePO4 cells are made by spraying graphite and LiFePO4 powders suspended in a volatile solvent onto miles of aluminum and copper foils. After the solvent evaporates, the coated foils are rolled and compressed into the jelly roll. You can't perfectly control the layer thickness over hundreds of linear feet with this process, so some cells naturally are thicker than their cell design size and bulge. Lower capacity cells are less subject to being oversize since they have fewer linear feet in them, thus, sprayed film thickness variation is smaller as a percentage of the constant thicknesses parts of the cell, such as the metal foils, ion transfer membrane, and aluminum cell walls. While I agree that overrating cell capacity sucks, I think your rant about lazy, fat Americans complaining about stuff applies here. US companies do not make LiFePO4 cells, so you should be thankful that China still does and is willing to ship them to the US. Since it is standard practice in China to overrate their batteries, it is your expectation that is wrong and if you don't like it, you should start a company that manufactures LiFePO4 cells in Las Vegas. I need. Mine from China are taking way too many months to arrive. I'm not even sure that they've even shipped given how awful the sea shipping industry is backlogged.

[@WillProwse]

I have a friend who assembles lifepo4 packs here in the states, and he can fund his own manufacturing plant (he owns the company), but he says he cannot possibly compete with china. I will ask him again and see what he thinks these days. He told me that two years ago. But agreed, you are right.

[@WillProwse]

I am surprised that Tesla is not making their own lifepo4. What makes it so difficult? I know the ovens cost a lot, but they can't be that difficult to make.

[@donbaker8252]

Howard let me get this straight it's the buyers fault when the seller lies it's the buyers fault when the seller builds defective products. I guess the Chinese gonna do no wrong in your mind. I'll give you one thing those communist in China sure are good at making viruses

[@AFlyingCookieLOL]

@@donbaker8252 **I'll give you one thing those communist in China sure are good at making viruses** 1. There is NO scientific evidence the China made the virus. 2. The place of discovery is rarely the origin 3. What does communism have anything to do with it? 4. While your democracy goes and bombs muslim countries why do you give a crap about China's Muslims who are treated better and NOT being bombed? Hypocrite 5. China government isn't really communist. 6. What you see on the western media is a lot of lie. Much of BBCs lies has actually been debunked, the rest of it busted by real expats. 7. US didn't even investigate Fort Detrick. 8. Stop bombing other countries and killing people and build your infrastructure first. Your traffic alone cost your country billions. And here you are blaming China when China got it under control even with the new variants. If you want to be racist, this isn't the place and at least get your facts straight. Or do you you want to be so ignorant just like the anti Chinese group that calls everyone else a "wumao or 50c" that disagrees with you? **I guess the Chinese gonna do no wrong in your mind.** 1. Are you implying that Americans do no wrong in your mind? **Howard let me get this straight it's the buyers fault when the seller lies it's the buyers fault when the seller builds defective products.** 1. The buyer is responsible for the research before buying. 2. Many companies including AMERICAN companies have under performing products. Tesla range has been known to have lesser range by % to their claimed range in comparison to some other brands like Kia and Hyandai.

[@AFlyingCookieLOL]

@@WillProwse I'm guessing it could be patents? Li Ion patents is generally a very crowded place which is also why I think more research has been shifted to sodium ion and iirc, this is since 2010. CATL did mention about their own sodium ion for commercial use.

[@johnshaw359]

I suppose what you really need for grade B cells especially is a programmable BMS to stop the BMS trying the impossible task. Just set it to a slightly less battery capacity or lower the cell voltages to the lowest cell maximum voltage after charging them and letting them settle. That's the reason for being able to adjust cell parameters, I would guess.

[@bnk28zfp]

Honest review!!!

[@olemissjim]

As you were unboxing I thought you had ordered a Model 3 SR+ “build yourself” kit MIC

[@chasingcapsaicin]

Well not calculating losses in your not coaxial cables, fair assumptions. Good work

[@CherishtheJourneyy]

These are probably someone that bought the same batteries from ail express that you bought and now selling them on Amazon to try and make a profit

[@frankcherry3810]

Just proves, If you want the best, be ready to pay for it. Battleborn

[@mikemiles3068]

Good video as always❗️ Have you done any video on Bioennos❓

[@willarddevoe5893]

I'm kind of spooked about taking bulging blue batteries in a house and putting them to work.

[@randybobandy9828]

Has anyone ever seen a Bulged cell catch fire? Lifepo4 cells are supposed to be incredible safe and stable compared to all other Lithium chemesty. I personally wouldnt have a power bank of batteries in my house. It's smarter to build a storage shed to have you batteries and inverters in. That way you won't have a potential fire that can burn your house and insurance won't cover. Ideally a 20ft shipping contaner would be best since its metal and won't burn, or a cinderblock shed.

[@willarddevoe5893]

@@randybobandy9828 I'll pass.

[@RolandW_DIYEnergyandMore]

They even have a supplier on AliExpress saying those same cells having 420Ah :)))

[@Trevor7727]

There is some advertising around which tells us that batteries are made locally, but when you investigate you find the actual lithium cell is from China. It’s just been assembled locally

[@Austin1990]

Are USA-made LiFePO4 cells even made in the US?

[@HBFTimmahh]

LiFe shouldnt really swell because Lift (Lithium Metal Ferride) is a fairly hard substance unlike Lithium Polymer which is gell like in its formulation of electrolite.

[@saidt.8200]

A top balancing cells connected in parallel and again bottom balancing by connection the cells in parallel for few days each time should put these cells in sync.

[@WillProwse]

That are in sync but the 4th cell is garbage. Fourth cell was first to rise and first to fall.

[@john_in_phoenix]

Excellent review. I am going to order some 302AH grade A cells from Amy just to see if they arrive swollen. Judging by the 280AH cells, they won't. Thanks for the honest review. BTW, you should check out Sandy Munro on KZbin tearing down electric vehicles. The inverter design on the Ford Mach E is "interesting". Edit to add "Munro Live" is his channel, and his interview with Elon Musk is good. Lots of synergy there.

[@WillProwse]

Will check that out. Sandy is great. Thanks John!

[@gemajams]

Appreciate your educational videos, learn something different each time! Stay safe

[@upnorthandpersonal]

Bloated is not normal - they can expand and contract for about 0.5mm to 1mm or so between low and high state of charge, but not bloat like that.

[@rudolfvalacegerna9184]

sir will try to review the difference between Gyll and Selpos.

[@justinjja2]

I'd be curious to see what the 3 good cells do, not that it helps you... But interesting to know if those 3 hit 310 or still fall short.

[@mariamjjackson9297]

This is so interesting.......great video

[@Jimdandy1958]

they are expanded because the seller blew them full of some of his hot air advertising..

[@JB007Rules2]

Will, I am currently sitting on 20 of what appears to be the exact same cells that you have here (and tour last video) and they all are grade-a and have the QR codes on the sides of the packs and they are all advertised as 280AH. I'm in the process of doing an analysis on an eight-cell configuration in 4S and it is going well with the West Mountain radio battery analyzer but takes quite some time as 560AH is what it is 12 12.8V nominal. I will let you know what comes of this test and I wish I could post a picture here because I have so many of these things it's insane lol.

[@n6nvr]

OTOH, If they are BS'g about things, a fake QC stamp isn't going to be hard to do either.

[@michaelbouckley4455]

280’s are not the same as 304/310/320, which are 3mm taller