AMD 7950X vs Intel 13900K for Music Production: The Result

[@damienlobb85]

I think it's important to note that the Intel board that supports the 13th/14th gen is at the end of it's upgrade path. 14th gen is literally just 13th gen with some higher clocks tho.

[@JFrameMan]

We'll probably find that 7950x allows you fewer but more complex tracks, but i9-13900k allows for more less complex tracks, since the limit per track is what an e-core can handle. It's a pretty tough decision for me when I factor in the ability to have faster RAM on intel. I would love to run a huge orchestral template and I'm sure faster RAM helps with that, but I keep worrying about e-cores limiting something.

[@bjornark]

As far as I understand the e-cores didnt really affect it that much, but I can have read/analyzed it wrong. Only way is to test it myself..

[@QuantizStudioRecords]

But you can boost E-cores about 4,3 Ghz...P-Cores 5,8 Ghz

[@ChristianoRodríguez-h3k]

​@@QuantizStudioRecords Yes and good to have water cooling ;) Important is to setting up system righlty for music production It is good to install Park Control and Lasso on Windows or Mac and turn off all applications that consume power from the processor unnecessarily.Greetings from UK London ! 😎

[@saricubra2867]

I have an i7-12700K. The one core overload is significantly reduced thanks to great scheduling on the cores for Intel's Big-Little chips.

[@damienlobb85]

The same can be said for the 16 cores of the 7950x, except all cores are of comparable high performance vs the lower performance cores of the Intel. What Image Line said, is still true regardless of the Big Little layout, as it's how DAW's work. You can't spread processing load of a plugin grainually. So once 1 core fills up with a certain task, the others need to wait for it to keep everything in sync in the session when playing back.

[@andivax]

@@damienlobb85so amd 7959 is better than 14900 in terms of single core performance in music production?

[@teddym2808]

I spoke to Vin(TAFKAT) the other day on the phone, as I wanted him to build me a desktop, but I also wanted it for gaming so he referred me elsewhere as he doesn't do gaming GPU's, liquid cooling, super custom builds, etc. BTW though as a quick plug, he is a great guy and if you want a desktop built just for DAW use, you won't do much better as he uses motherboards with the lowest DPC latency and he has been building them for decades now. But onto the Intel vs AMD.... I was hinting to him that I was considering an all AMD build, 7950X with 7900XTX.. and one thing I will say he did tell me.. Now remember, this is what the guy does for a living and builds and benchmarks systems, and what he told me, although the AMD performance is now great, there can still be compatibility niggles that just don't happen with Intel. I am talking about audio interfaces. Sure, it might work, but he was saying for example how there was an AMD system and the RME interface just wouldn't work, and drivers don't get much better than RME. With Intel chipsets and Intel USB chipsets, things "just work". So for the most hassle free experience, it was suggested I stick with Intel. My issue with Intel is that I DESPISE this P and E core structure. Just give me 16 cores at the same speed and performance please. This is why I was looking at AMD. Plus, I am a little worried with the Intel/Nvidia combo and DPC latency, but it seems with a desktop, the motherboard is key there. I am not surprised that the AMD is doing better on FX count, cause it has 16 real P cores. However, I also find it interesting that for VI sampler use, the Intel was ahead, and especially so at higher buffer. Considering once we have recorded our midi and put the tracks in playback mode that the VI's go onto higher playback buffers in most DAWs anyway (1024 for example), tells me the Intel will do better for massive orchestral scores with lots of voices. Still, they both perform great. I wish Intel didn't stop the X299 after the flagship 10908xe, but it is what it is.

[@Vaxter701]

I've been running amd cpus without any of these issues for years, on multiple boards and cpus. Thats the most old out of date advice anyones ever been given. I'm sure he means well but what he is saying simply is not true.

[@teddym2808]

@@Vaxter701 It was literally just when I wrote the comment on a brand new AMD 7000 system. The RME USB simply would not work on it but was fine on Intel. I'd trust someone that's been building music computers for 30 years every day of their life over some random youtube post. Never said it can't work, and likely it will. But all he, and I was saying, is that IF there is going to be a driver compatibility issue, it's more likely with an all AMD based system.

[@billt3031]

@@teddym2808 For real? I was planning to buy the upcoming Amd 9950x and later buy a rme audio interface. have you tried that and saw that they dont work?

[@teddym2808]

@@billt3031 They will likely work, I am just saying that if there's going to be a fussy system with audio drivers, there's a bigger chance it will be AMD - but likely you'll buy it and all will be just great!

[@williamtopping]

Those drivers is an OEM issue or a Microsoft Issue. Just because a guy does something for a living, does not automatically make them correct. Just look at Politicians for an example of what I'm talking about

[@richardgordon9939]

i contacted sound on sound magazine. they said they are planning to do a review of both cpu's in march. their daw test should be interesting

[@bjornark]

Interesting, thanks for letting us know.

[@richardgordon9939]

@@bjornark sound on sound magazine is out now. i picked it up today. very interesting

[@diadsoul1]

thank you so much..i spent two months by searching which one is better for music production)

[@bjornark]

Awesome. Glad it helps!

[@JakkoTB]

When it comes to stability on AMD, there still seem to be problems with AMD's USB implementation, causing problems for those that want to use professional sound interfaces. As AMD fanboy I had two AMD systems for both my homestudio PC and my laptop that I use for DJing. Sadly, after almost a year of troubleshooting, I sold the AMD laptop and bought an Intel one, because the AMD laptop kept stuttering for +- half a second every 3-4 hours, which, in a full club, playing loud music, is pretty obvious. Also it seemed to me whenever a second or third USB device is connected, the already connected devices glitch and reconnect randomly, which is also not ideal in a live performance or recording situation. With pain in my heart really, I usually avoid Intel.

[@bjornark]

I do not DJ, so I cant say anything about that. However the RME Fireface UCX I use works really good on the AMD system. I know joel zimmerman (deadmau5) use Macs when he is touring. Although he is mainly a PC guy as far as I know. But Macs... they are stable.

[@JakkoTB]

@@bjornark RME is an awesome company with great drivers. I DJ using rekordbox, with Universal Audio hardware. Keeping everything stable has ment no windows 11, and now as I sadly discovered, no AMD. I realize that a 0,5 second freeze/stutter in audio once per 4 hours is really not a deal-breaker for most people, maybe that's also why it hasn't been fixed yet.

[@clipz1]

@@bjornark agreed thats almost THEE rule when djing id say never eve bother using a pc the macs run real well especially the old 2015 ones

[@wasabi333]

@@clipz1 fuck 2015?! LOL

[@nth7485]

@@bjornarkReally? That was a suprise. He has used pc on stage, but he has also suffered from crashes on live sets.

[@zaffindo6359]

I have a live setup playing guitar and keyboard through mixcraft 10 with kontakt, amplitube, IK-multimedia, etc plugins, still on a 7500T mini itx. Only with 20+ vst's I get in some trouble. Latency is 8ms, some people can hear it but most don't. Just bought a surface pro 8 and with that I can go to 4ms. Things are getting better!

[@hamsandwhich3378]

This is super crazy finding this out. Because I followed you through finding your moog trance presets and just got to a new build and found you dive deep into pcs as well! Subbed :)

[@bjornark]

Thanks :)

[@reptilespantoso]

Hi, thanks for the video. I'm also posting in that thread you mentioned. 🙂 I'm still waiting to buy my next computer, replacing an aging Apple. A couple of things, that are on my mind: 1. The Ryzen are overprized. Should be 50 eurodollars lower. The 7700x at 360 euros (ex.VAT) and the 7600x at 260 euros. The 7700x should be compared to the 13600K. Then it makes sense. Both processor families have a different way of achieving higher performance: 5 nM die or extra E-Cores, but roughly equal. 2. In my country there's now a reverse trend: The retailers are selling the Z690 Z790 motherboards for the Intel CPUs at much higher prices than this summer. Instead of lowering Zen 4 motherboard prices, they raised the Intel ones. 3. Both the X670e and some Z690 (and Z790) are priced 30-40% too high. The B650 is priced 20% too high. I expect these to come down in price, but the euro to inflate. 4. What people should do is compare the Zen 4 and Intel 13th gen at undervolted state and at an 85% power cap limit. That is how these should be run for a daily workstation use! Both AMD and Intel overclocked these chips to win peak performance benchmarks. See here for the Ryzen kzbin.info/www/bejne/fJKyiox-g6yfgtU and here for the Intel kzbin.info/www/bejne/fmWlnmONp5uCe7M 5. The Intel CPUs have a better memory management system that allows for much higher DDR5 memory speed. This is a weakness of the AMD processors. 6. I'm also partial to the Ryzen. The Intel chips with P and E-Cores are a complicated design. I go with the KISS principle. Both are very capable. I expect the 13600K will win in raw processing speed, compared to the 7700x. I expect it to tie at the same power consumption (target 85 Watt).

[@bjornark]

Awesome insights thank you. I agree with the KISS principle for sure.

[@andivax]

Is it worth to upgrade 9900 to 13900/14900 in terms of single core performance for music production? Thanks

[@whittymusic]

is there any way to test whether multiple instances of Kontakt can use more than 16 cores? For example a 64 core threadripper does Kontakt use all the cores or jam everything into the first 16 on ALL instances? Thanks for the videos

[@selwynsivagumar]

Ryzen 9 7900. Lower wattage matters to me. I am happy with the set and forget mentality and this 65W chip with 12 cores and 24 threads will do just that. I'm upgrading from an i7 4790k so I am constantly freezing tracks and stuttering!

[@bjornark]

Yeah many people run the chips on a lower watt and downclock, to get it as silent as possible.

[@lucien9183]

Hello Bjornar! May I ask you a question? My biggest concern is if Ableton is able to balance P-core and E-core on Intel CPUs. For example, I have some heavy duty tracks like synths or other midi-sims, and some light duty tracks like .wav clips or just 1 or 2 plugins. Does Ableton have the ability to let the heavy tracks run by P-cores and the rest ones run by E-cores? (If the question is No, I may probably buy an AMD) Thank you !!!!!♥

[@bjornark]

As far as I know Ableton currently uses P-cores. They are working on it tho, apparently. So things might change in the future.

[@lucien9183]

@@bjornark Thank you!!!! Probably I’ll buy a 9950X for now! 🙆🏻‍♀️

[@karymwillemsen5564]

i love my amd 3900x system and i mix really big projects. The only issue i have is the conflict between amd and universal audio over thunderbolt. this seems to be a issue that just can't be fixed i have the aorus x570 master board v1.1 with a titan ridge expansion card. But if I power the apollo on before the pc I will get a blue screen. But if i let the pc load windows first and then turn on the apollo everything stays super stable. This is still anoying with restarts. So I am thinking of switching to intel or completely to apple. Because Universal audio told me they are not planing on fixing the issue for amd.

[@bjornark]

Yeah, I hear most people use Intel for music production when we talk about the Windows/PC world. I have used AMD without any issues, but I dont have any special needs so it usually works fine.

[@MsSdsd12]

Is it possible for you to get info about benches for 9800x3d (amd) vs 265k ultra (intc)?

[@bjornark]

Would love to, but I think not unfortunately.

[@carstenbecker8104]

Is there a big difference between i7 and I9 in Ableton performance? Make it sense to change from i7 to I9? Or are other components more important 32gb ram upgrade to 64gb)?

[@boloovereem5448]

I'm still a bit confused why they recommend 7950x over 13900k, because the 13900k has an almost 10% faster single core than 7950x, which is usually the most important info when buying the best cpu for music production. I'm about to buy myself a new 7950x or 13900k system next year in spring when I think this new platforms will be a lot more tested. The biggest downfall for 13900k I currently see is the max temperature the cpu can reach if you don't enable the motherboard max watt limit + both cpus probably need high-end AIO coolers, which could also mean more fan noise in the studio.

[@nedegt1877]

I don't agree, single core performance is a bit misleading because it rarely represent real world situations. It was very important once because it was the only advantage intel CPUs had. That's why peoples made it a big deal, but in reality, it doesn't matter that much, only for benchmarks but not for real world situations, especially not with Workstation (DAW) situations. Nobody is going to render a scene with just 1 core while you can have 16 cores. But for some reasons single core Cinebench is important? Doesn't make much sense other than marketing purposes. Try running multiple heavy software and see which one is better in handling them is my recommendation.

[@retrotrollet]

@@nedegt1877 i have the 13900k and it can handle 50% more tracks, than 12900k. That is a heavy upgrade from previous version. And as i can see Amd 5950 16core, was as fast as 12900k so 50% up is massive.

[@nedegt1877]

@@retrotrollet Sure but that 13900K gets very hot when utilized at its max. That means its performance will not be optimal because of throttling. And all that effort doesn't make it a lot faster than the 7950X which runs much cooler and no throttling when running the same test. The performance difference is neglectable. But power consumption / heat / cooling does matter to me.

[@ChatGTA345]

Take a look at @der8auer channel, he’s the world’s expert on CPUs and under/overclocking, and he showed in a recent video how power-limiting 13900K to just 90W preserves something like 95% of its performance, while still beating 7950X at that or higher power level in most tasks. In addition, at stock it only went to that danger-zone 300W+ level when running very heavy multicore tasks. While in more regular use or idle it runs a slightly lower power than Ryzen. So I think he showed that this argument about power-inefficiency of 13900K doesn’t make much sense.

[@nedegt1877]

@@ChatGTA345 Well you can always handpick situations and try to make a point. But in reality, I doubt if it's representative. If intel was really able to beat the Ryzen with only 90W they would have done so. Besides undervolting only works in certain situations. When you're doing real work on a workstation you can easily get errors and an unstable system. And you need to know what you're doing. Last but not least, why spend so much money on a fast CPU to downgrade it so it doesn't consume so much power? Buy something else then. It's not a good argument to justify the power inefficiency of the 13900K. A bit unrealistic actually.

[@rockawayjah]

hello, I'm very impressed by your knowledge I have a question maybe you can help me..... I run a 5900x with 64gigs of ram on a b550-f motherboard Ableton runs good I can duplicate my complete session up to at least 100 tracks before audio crackling but when I do something as simple as duplicating or deleting a single track it seems to take a second longer then i believe it should to accomplish. I don't know how to fix I've even did a reinstall of Ableton.

[@bjornark]

Thanks! Well, that has also been a bit slow for me as well. Duplicating tracks, or importing tracks from other tracks. I guess its because Ableton needs to re-load the effects and instruments and that takes a while with bigger projects. Just my thoughts.

[@retrotrollet]

Hi, Replaced my 12900k with a 13900k. Using z690, DDR5 and custom Watercooling and debloated OS for DAW use. In cubase benchmark at 32 buffer : Intel 12900k, 100 tracks. Intel 13900k, 150 tracks. So its massive 50% more tracks from top notch 12900k to 13900k. That is really good.

[@bjornark]

That are some huge improvments! What do you use to de-bloat your OS?

[@retrotrollet]

@@bjornark Hi Bjornar ! Am using Chris Titus debloat script/Program for win 11/10 when all my stuff is installed i have 180-190 processes after debloating around 60 processes. So 120 processes that cpu dont need to run = lower latency for system. Intel 13900k also have lower internal latency than 12900k, so my 50% more tracks probably is a combination of the lower Cpu Latency, faster cores and faster cache.

[@retrotrollet]

[@DK-qf6pr]

Your name suggest you are a troll? Are you sure you tested them?

[@NatLifeSounds]

the mosty stupid upgrade i ever saw🤣

[@frascar]

I have a question for all of you. I have been running kontakt on ableton in two different built: one with an old i7 and one ryzen 7. The one with intel runs kontakt in way much shorter time when compared to ryzen. I don't know if it depends from compatibility with ableton or not. Anyone with an answer?

[@misterringer]

Depending on your DAW, thread scheduling could be a struggle on the intel platform with the hybrid architecture. (looking at you Cubase haha). Even some plugins don't spread their workloads around very well, which is crazy in this day and age (BIAS FX 2 was really bad for this when it launched. Not sure where it's at now). That said, either one should be sufficient for 95% of users. The lower level offerings should also be sufficient, as you'd mentioned.

[@bjornark]

For sure, and if plugin developers use the new "CLAP" format, it should perform better as well.

[@saricubra2867]

You have to execute the program with administrator rights. I have 0 issues with my i7-12700K on FL Studio.

[@misterringer]

@@saricubra2867 Doesn't always make a difference. FL Studio handles multithreading quite well though, so not surprised it's working for you :)

[@misterringer]

@@verstecktsein5639 They improved it a bit, but I wouldn't call it fixed. I have the newest version and a high quality interface (RME) and it still underperforms Studio 1 and Reaper.

[@mojito6629]

hi Bjonar (sorry I don't have that proper O letter to write your name in my pc).. I listen to your song in Spotify and it's good,I like it. Hope to see more good music and youtube content from you

[@bjornark]

Thanks for listening, appreciate it :)

[@iseeu-fp9po]

Thank you for this video, Bjørnar. Do you know where one would be able to find test results relating to audio production for the 7700X?

[@bjornark]

Have to search forums (gearspace / steinberg) and see if someone have tested the CPU. I havent seen any myself yet.

[@iggswanna1248]

can i ask yyou, if money is no object what is the absolute fastest CPU for using large orchestral music with lots of tracks a lots of plugins?

[@bjornark]

Good question. I would look at maybe AMD Threadripper, however I havent tested those in music production. Apple M4 should also be right around the corner.

[@mothretramusic]

Great video. Thank you. But I believe you left out what what Ableton recommended?

[@FlashRayLaser]

Ableton recommends core count over core speed. In Ableton Live, core speed only shines in how well one act of real time processing works. As soon as you're using multiple plugins and/or tracks, core count is way more valuable.

[@bjornark]

@flashraylaser157 ideally both.

[@KetogenicGuitars]

I would go for 7950x3d for Cubase. If I can pay it with cash. This is because the AM5 socket allows to purchase spare motherboard which will be better later. I could wait like 3 years for that higher end spare mobo. Mobos and power sources will break but processor and memory never. But I don't know if is this solid logic. here is the tip: search for "Passmark 7950x3d" and then check out that physics score. It is huge with both 7900x3d and 7950x3d compared to any other CPUs. That benchmark can obviously utilize 3d cache. I can easily imagine VST plugins would run better closer to CPU i.e if guided to use 3d cache. Well I don't know if it possible though.

[@KetogenicGuitars]

I would add to that scenario the possibility when buying higher specs chipset motherboard say X860E having all the 5 NVME slots pcie 5.0 and proper cooling for nvmes in pcie 5.0 solved by then. If I cannot do it with 13900K as there might not be decent priced motherboards available due to different socket that is the dead end. Intel keeps it very confusing which also feels bad. But is (50%) possible that Intel comes to their senses and will continue LGA1700 socket. That is too little of probability right now. On the other hand intel is in the position they have squeezed out all the power out of 13th gen and they need to change to 5nm or 3nm tech just to be able to compete with AMD 5nm. One positive for Intel is faster synthetic memory bechmark but a negative thing is IOH(Input/Output Hub) ousted from the CPU chip creating latency(check out TECH City yes video on the matter). The addition of 3d cache on AMD CPU itself puts up a very good fight with overall memory related performance. In Cubase DAW context It is all about how many VST-plugin hits that 3d cache would generate or hold.

[@chills_tiny_mom]

How does AMD bear when using audio interfaces compared to Intel? Is there are any issues with latency AMD particularly?

[@bjornark]

I have not in depth tested latency with AMD CPUs. That said Intel CPUs seems to have some stability issues at the moment.

[@alvesdeejay]

Can you suggest a desktop pc configuration for ableton?

[@MrGreekBlade]

After watching all video i am not sure what i need so any help will be great I am film composer and working big templates with many kontakts for my orchestral. At the moment working with cubase 11 on 5950x with 64gb ram. Not problem for me if my buffer is 256 or 2048. So what is best for my needs? 7950x3d or 13900ks?

[@bjornark]

Its not so easy to answer i am afraid. I have little experience with orchestral libraries and Cubase. But I hear that they need fast storage (because of huge sample libraries), and memory. Other than that its just about getting the fastest CPU you can afford at the time. I am however leaning perhaps a tiny bit more to Intel now. Just because they seem to be a more stable plattform in some cases.

[@MrGreekBlade]

@@bjornark My ssds and memory is fast...i am looking for the faster single core cpu on the market

[@Metalpazallteway]

Have you done anything for threadripper pro and the new intel xeon w9 3475 / 36cores? For comparison.. many thanks

[@bjornark]

I have not done comparisons of that

[@Metalpazallteway]

@@bjornark There's a new threadripper pro 7000 coming up on the 18th that would be nice to see 🙈

[@bjornark]

Agree, but my bank account says no :D

[@Metalpazallteway]

​​@@bjornarkOh ok. I understand. Maybe ask for a review only and send it back? I want to buy a computer but I want something for video rendering, 3d rendering, and music simultaneously. Not sure what exact build to get. I have software interests in: Studio One 6 pro Davinci Resolve Houdini AutoCAD Blender Z brush Unreal Engine

[@Metalpazallteway]

Also the i9 4900 came out but I've been seeing reviews and not so much of a jump from i9 3900 or i9 3900ks to the new chip

[@DJ-aleks80]

Hi. i9 14900k or Ryzen 9 7950x3d ?? I use Ableton and Cubase..

[@bjornark]

I would go Intel.

[@DJ-aleks80]

@@bjornark ok, thank You 😊

[@worldparfum8564]

14700 is better then a 950x3d? Ty

[@oggfish]

Would the massive L3 cache in the upcoming 7950x3D model have a possitive impact for DAW software or is this only utilized in games? It's advertised as the ultimate gaming cpu but i try to figure out if waiting for the 3d model is worth it for a high-end audio build? The base clockspeed is 300mhz lower then the 7950x cpu, power consumption lower but boostclock similar (5.7ghz). The upcoming Intel KS will hit 6Ghz out of the box most likely but the energy consumption will probably be sky high.

[@bjornark]

Perhaps, I got the 7950X now, going to do a video about it soon with some comparsions. I am a little worried about the 300mhz lower clock speed. Since single core clock speed still is important in a music production PC build.

[@oggfish]

@@bjornark That would be awesome if you can test it!

[@ericdeleplanque5673]

yes the ryzen 9 7950x3d test is necessary.

[@JohnSmith-pn2vl]

from what i read the x3d is worse for music production because lower single core, its excellent for gaming.

[@xfghffhfg]

according to scan pro test it's best for vsti ( vst instruments, i think they use kontakt samplers) only at low latency 128-256 and for less than half the 13900k power consumption. so... interesting

[@Oakich]

How the tides have turned. ..

[@bjornark]

For sure

[@clipz1]

had to sub can tell when im gona get the info i need from you channel .. im gettig a friend to build me a pc and he actually sent a link to buy the amd mentioned but listening to this im wondering if the intel might be a better fit seems both are a win win but stil thinking about it .. i use fl studio and might switch to a different daw but currently i just want to move everything from my old pc to the new one once its built ..

[@bjornark]

Not easy to decide, as far as I understand. Most people that are mainly going to use their PC for music production lean towards Intel. But that doesnt mean AMD is bad in any way. It all depends.

[@clipz1]

@@bjornark thanks man its soo mind boggleing when pcs or computers in general is not your strong field ... this is going to be a silly question but will i have issues migrating all my old stuff to my new pc if i choose amd coming from a intel device .. and i feel to ask which one you'd go for but i feel we got that answer in the vid :D

[@bjornark]

Hehe right now I use Mac, but no. Wont be any problems going from AMD to Intel or vice versa. Just make sure you backup and do a clean install with the correct drivers and you should be good. :)

[@mattsmith1440]

Very useful video, thanks!

[@mianregan3197]

which one run acustica audio plugin better ?

[@alinbate4580]

how about Threadripper 1920X? I want it and i want to use pro tools with it.

[@bjornark]

Depends on your workflow. I would probably try to go for something with a little higher clock speed.

[@Newschoolcovers]

Just got the 14700k for FL Studio

[@chemaalonso7931]

HAHAAHHAHA AND THE NEXT GEN YOU HAVE TO CHANGE THE MOTHERBOARD! IT NERD HERE PICK 7950X IF YOU ARE GOING TO BUY IT NOW CAUSE NEXT GEN YOU CAN UPGRADE AND INTEL SUCKS!

[@Newschoolcovers]

@@chemaalonso7931 I used my last computer for 8 years, I don't have time to deal with this every year.

[@chills_tiny_mom]

@@chemaalonso7931bro thinks everyone changes cpu every year 💀

[@chemaalonso7931]

@@chills_tiny_mom no every year but 10 years

[@coltonfears1604]

@@chemaalonso7931if you can't afford a new motherboard in ten years then idk what to tell you.

[@AJDOLDCHANNELARCHIVE]

Great video! Waiting to see what the prices of the new Intel HEDT W2400 chips are going to be before I decide what to get (hoping the 16 core is reasonably priced) otherwise might just get a 13700K since it's rather good value for the performance and DDR5 is finally getting more affordable. Cheers from rainy old England!

[@bjornark]

Cheers! :)

[@AJDOLDCHANNELARCHIVE]

@@bjornark If the unlocked 16 core is

[@MisterTrayser]

5800x enough or better 5900x for soundtrack production?

[@bjornark]

Havent tested it myself, more cores on the 5900x though.

[@SoundRemains]

- Ryzen 7900 (non X version with PBO enabled =7900X) / 13900k - power: 142W / 253W (+44%) - Cinebench R23 (Single-Core) : 2030 / 2086 (+3 %) - Cinebench R23 (Multi-Core) : 29306 / 37541 (28%) - Price : 360 euros / 520 (43%) - Data : nanoreviews it seems Ryzen 7900 is the sweet spot for more budget friendly builds.

[@bjornark]

Awesome, Thanks for sharing!

[@eaglepass5170]

Great summary!!

[@bjornark]

Thanks :)

[@Barncore]

Useful video, thanks

[@bjornark]

Thanks!

[@Barncore]

I ended up buying the 7950x! A couple of months of research, and some build time, i'm up and running. It is SNAPPY! Big step up from my previous i7-8700 @@bjornark

[@BasSine_Studio]

Hey, I’m surprised you didn’t mention memory with this because there are some differences. Intel can use 128gb DDR5 and run it at DDR5 speeds, albeit reduced to 4800mhz. AMD using 128gb DDR5 have to drop to 3600/3800mhz, which is terrible If you want 128gb ram it seems Intel is still the way to go. 64gb all is equal however. But if you want 128gb memory, you’ll really suffer on AMD until they iron out the kinks

[@bjornark]

Thanks for contributing good info. 👍😊

[@BasSine_Studio]

@Free R Kelly you mean you only need 32gb. There are definitely use cases where that wouldn’t be enough for many, I.e. orchestral scoring. Some people use multiple networked machines to handle the load and even exceed 256gb. What may be true for you is not necessarily true for others. Cheers

[@ChatGTA345]

What bothers me most about the current gen on either platform is their lackluster DDR5 support. Previously, with 5950x I’ve benefited from 128GB of pretty fast DDR4, but now both platforms can run 128GB only at roughly the same speeds or worse latencies than DDR4. Having more RAM may or may not be that important depending on the task, but it sure doesn’t feel good to have a downgrade in our options here.

[@Felix00007]

7950x vs 7900x? Does extra money pays for?

[@saricubra2867]

More cores and lower memory latency.

[@bjornark]

TL DW (as of 29oct-2022, Ableton did not answer): On a budget = Intel, budget no issue, go for AMD (but make sure to check the Kontakt 6 results on Intel!)

[@danielweiss4498]

is a 16 core CPU good for VST instruments? Or are eight cores enough? and the CPU can be fully utilized by the VST instrument with 16 cores on all cores

[@bjornark]

If you have to choose, i would choose clock speed. Ideally you want clock speed AND cores. Unless you have a specific use that absolutely need more cores.

[@wazmand]

AMD Ryzen 9 7900X ?

[@fankey8996]

thx for sharing

[@Wren_The_Ten]

Do you think a ryzen 7800x3d with 7900xtx will be ok for fl studio anyone???

[@db4ks]

took me a minute to realize this video was made before intel 14th and 13th gen chips started dying at alarming rates

[@bjornark]

That is true..

[@hartox76]

7950X is a monster but I have a problem; the UAD2 card is not working at the moment. :(

[@bjornark]

Not good, maybe give it a while and see if they update the drivers. Or make sure the mobo has latest BIOS etc.

[@sansanych6163]

have you fixed it?

[@ar_s8]

I9 12900k or i9 13900k for music production?

[@snubdawg1386]

yes

[@NatLifeSounds]

12th more stables, 12th had alot of cpu dies

[@sansanych6163]

@@NatLifeSounds 13th)

[@NatLifeSounds]

@@sansanych6163 yeah, sorry, I meant 13th and 14th dies much. I think 12th now is something like the last powerfull stable Intel CPUs

[@christianf.7223]

Great Videos !!! Rock on ;-)

[@bjornark]

Thanks!

[@JamieR]

Stability vary so much between platform, chips, drivers and so many other variables. So I'd take J2C's anecdote with a bit of salt. I've had maaany macs, intel and amd rigs over past 20 years. It's been a massively mixed bag. I.e, mac used to be flawless. The current M2 Mac Mini I have is having tons of usb issues. Previous AMD rig had a ton of issues with GPU stability. Rig before that was an intel rig that ran flawlessly, same GPU. Just figured I'd drop my 2 cents. Also, audio buffer on audio interfaces can only handle so much. So that is (was?) more of a limiting factor for music production than CPU. Though, this might have changed since I did research this. I found this video previously very insightful > kzbin.info/www/bejne/fYbWfX97oNiqsKc

[@bjornark]

No system is fault-proof, thats true. In the end its up to what you like working on.

[@JamieR]

@@bjornark Yeah you're completely right. I'm curious if you have any experience with 13600K and how it performs with Kontakt heavy project for scoring. There's always benchmarks done with the high-end, but never mid tier 😊

[@clothes4060]

The most thing with intel have 2 type core P and E core, it make daw must utilize to use that (this really hard for almost of software in general and with daw in specific), and AMD always have 1 type core so you can assume that daw doesnt need compatible and can fully run at full speed of CPU. Although along time ago, AMD has some scandal compatible but it's just the past. So you can trust AMD can fully use most of the power of CPU because of 1 type core, intel have 2 type sometimes I doubt the E core doesnt fully optimize to run in daw (because I use the laptop gen 12 I5 and it's seem the E core doesnt running just only the P core so I kinda afraid of the compatible of intel 2 type core P/e ) but the barrier of the consumer to go with AMD is the price, the price of amd with the same years or nearly time new gen intel release is always higher about 30%. but when you use $ for amd, you can fully use all of money to get best performance, (judge from the laptop I use) it seem I have the product with lower price but the software doesnt fully use it, it's a waste and sometimes feelling like it's actually price higher (I think)

[@StrudlePie]

I got the i9 13900K... and its literally been the worst experience of my Computing LIFE! DO NOT BUY 13th/14th Gen Intel! I add 3 Guitar tracks(Neural DSP) on my Studio One and its crackling already... My Old Ryzen 5800x Could handle easy 20 plus Low latency tracks - No crackling. Trying to RMA for the past few Months and been pushed about between Intel and Distributor... Very Horrible please save yourself these problems as the flaw is inherent in the Raptor Lake architecture. Much Love

[@NatLifeSounds]

just look at comment higher where someone advice to buy 13900k😅

[@nedegt1877]

Nobody needs "efficiency" cores in a workstation. You want to have some serious processing power. The 7950X looks like a good investment to me. And that is because I use multiple software at the same time, including lots of plugins and of course tons of I/O and very fast SSDs. It's a bit more expensive but definitely worth it.

[@astralboy]

in that case what are you thoughts about threadripper pro 5975WX ?

[@nedegt1877]

@@astralboy That's my dream! But a bit above my budget atm, otherwise that's what I'd be working on. It's the ultimate workstation CPU. It has everything every power user need! I/O king / Cores King, Memory King, Everything King! 🙂 But If I'm lucky, I might be able to get the 7000 series of ThreadRipper in 14 months or so. That will be brutal!

[@astralboy]

@@nedegt1877 I am half way leaning on the threadripper, its the clock speeds that holding me off. On one hand we have the consumer CPU's with higher clock speeds but poor PCIE bandwidth for NVME expansion + PCIE sound card Vs Threadripper CPU + pro mobos but lower base/turbo clock speeds......I wonder if synths like Diva, Sines, Diversion would work ok with extra linear phase EQ's + oversampling added on each mixer channel......that is my worry.

[@nedegt1877]

@@astralboy I understand you, well I've seen the latest Epyc CPU's and they are promising. It means next Gen Threadrippers are going to be lit. But for current gen. I'd go for Consumer CPU. The high-end mainboards have plenty of PCI-E lanes. Especially the 670-E version of AMD's new platform. Those will be faster than current Threadrippers, unless you need 64 cores.

[@ChatGTA345]

From what I understand, AMD is not planning for another consumer Threadripper, unfortunately they’ve decided to only make the highly expensive Pro line for servers. Although of course, we don’t know what they might be planning secretly 😅

[@PostRave.]

AMD Ryzen 9-7845HX 16GB RAM 1TB SSD RTX 4060 ???

[@bobafruti]

Should they not diversify the test? Does Kontakt actually represent all VST instruments that well? Ah well, if I was going for a brand new system right now I'd get the 7950x because AMD does better at keeping high performance at lower wattage, and I'd want to run the machine quiet... but also because if I want to upgrade in 2-3 years they'll still be supporting my motherboard. Obviously if you have an intel system and can just drop in a new CPU, you'd be foolish to go with AMD. Also if you just want a good system and there's no chance that you'll upgrade the CPU, I don't see that AMD is providing the best value this time around.

[@bjornark]

I am not sure, but the Kontakt test show how sample-based instruments would work. I assume, could be wrong here. I would probably get a 7950X as well, maybe undervolt it a little and make it a quiet system.

[@abaj006]

Intel is on a dead platform, while Ryzen has another 5 years of CPU upgrades ahead. So its a no brainer.

[@v3zMedia]

If you shop at Microcenter and buy the 2 or 3 year replacement none of this matters. Just trade in the MB, CPU, and RAM and upgrade within that window.

[@retrotrollet]

Intel is the top of the line for DAW, people taking about heat, just keep the 13900k cool and it delivers amazing. 6200mhz. 13900ks delivers 6000mhz on original settings. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jYjKd36of9ZqpaM

[@drewg3087]

Lmao

[@cloud9photography126]

What about the 7900x3d? Is that good for music production?

[@bjornark]

I would think so, I havent tried it.

[@catnip4life343]

Takk! 😊

[@ronmartyn]

Great review Bjørnar. Do you happen to know what Ableton Live recommends? Also maybe the threadripper CPU might be overkill? Dom from Cubase recommends AMD kzbin.info/www/bejne/d4eWfJ6jjZuAmJY

[@bjornark]

Maybe this video may answer some of your question: kzbin.info/www/bejne/eaSuf2t9h7lkias

[@chemaalonso7931]

The benchmarks are so bad, AMD cpu depends so much on a good DDR5 RAM in dual channel I bet the ddr5 on the benchmark was 5200MT/s CL36 and not 6000MT/s CL 30

[@omnidescriptivecacophone]

Dirty Norwegian oil money 🤣🤣🤣🤣 Thank you for sharing!

[@bjornark]

You are welcome :D

[@worldparfum8564]

So you dont know

[@choppergirl]

Pff, you don't even need an old quad core for music prodcution. I did all my music prodcution on a 1.3ghz single core Dell laptop. Video on the other hand, you need as much bloody power as you can get.

[@bjornark]

True, people made awesome music with 4 tracks back in the day. :)

[@tuantranproduction]

7950x3D is alot better than these CPUs.

[@Saveliyko]

Yo dudes, are you really arguing about which of these super fast CPUs will perform better in rap projects in which there are two or three audio roads? Well, some of you also mix music, well, a maximum of 10 channels working at the same time, but still these debates are meaningless. Yes, there are sound engineers who work on projects with 100 channels working simultaneously, but they probably already work at studios that all work on macs, and these people who use these studios almost certainly do not know about computer terms more than sampling rate and bit depth. Which CPUs, computers, and other equipment should be in the studio are decided by the people who build them. The main question that interests you sounds something like "how will my gaming computer show itself in a DAW?". Just make music and don't compare yourself to anyone or anything. And don't fill your head with useless information.

[@Crossfire2003]

As I see it, not AMD's Ryzen 9 7950X is the best music production CPU, but Intel's i9-13900K, or the newer: i9-14900K.

[@nivea878]

Intel brah, Ryzens can be used as seatheather they burn man😨

[@bjornark]

Yeah, didnt know that when the video was shot though. But AMD have always burned up a little. :D

[@nivea878]

@@bjornark hahahah, so do you buy an Intel now?

[@mircomputers]

You are mixing temperature with heating. AMD CPUs run hotter as temperature but use way less watts thus they produce a lot less heat.

[@nivea878]

​@@mircomputersi didt know that , thanks for informing me 😘

[@williamtopping]

My advice, for what it's worth, is to go on the second hand market, and buy server gear. Dedicate each VST to it's own core, and the FX chain along with it. Then you control this via one of the many third party programs that allows you to load up VST's via Ethernet. You can use consumer grade processors for this. But ideally you want as many cores as you can get. 64/96/128 cores. x 2 on the same board. Along with 128GB memory... For not much money really. You can then load up a full 128GB orchestra on a template that has them all organised on whatever daw you choose, sat back on your couch with just a lowly MacBook Air with 8gb... There is no noise issue, as you can put the server in a completely separate room. All you're sending over Ethernet is basic MIDI information and few control parameters. So latency is not a problem. And you won't be getting DPC issues, because you're dedicating a full core to one VST!!! Also sever grade gear is built with minimal latency in mind. There's also a benefit that if you eventually do NEED more than a 128GB of orchestra. You can simply add another 128GB machine. And add that to the network. If you still need more... Well, you get the idea. I only suggest this, as I see a lot of people buy a machine, and then get frustrated by its limitations. Where this approach, you don't 'upgrade' anything. You just add more horsepower to the mix as and when it's needed. Which also means all your old projects still load, because you're never upgrading. Just adding to!! :D

[@bjornark]

Interesting concept, thanks for sharing.

[@joeymc5272]

I am not an expert in pcs at all but i just know that switching from intel to ryzen i have had nothing but problems with my gear working properly including hardware and vsts. Maybe its my lack of techiness but i know with intel i had no issues with crashes, if this is the right word conformitys with software and cpu, and my latest problem is really bad issues with audient interfaces and ryzen cpus. Their software just plain and simple has so many issues with ryzen cpus. I just got a id44 mkii and Their customer service even verified this issue. Their firmware does not fix the issues. I will be building a 13900k pc soon regardless of benchmarks. Intel is true and tried and id much rather have my pc working properly with projects than having better efficiency and faster processing with ryzen. Never will use ryzen cpus again. Again this is my opinion and im not knocking anybody that loves them because they are great cpus just not for me. Also i am not writing an orchestra or am a mastering engineer so my opinion is nowhere near as warranted as others here.

[@bjornark]

Thank you for your insights and you wont go wrong with the 13900k at all! Hope your system will work good. Make sure to use the latest drivers/BIOS to everything so its as stable as possible. :)

[@joeymc5272]

@@bjornark no problem. Like i said I’m not a pro techy so that may be part of the problem but at the same time ive gone through everything to fix things and it still continues to present issues for me with ryzen regardless of benchmarks. Intel i can’t wait to get back to you lol.

[@joeymc5272]

@@bjornark hey bjornar, if you dont mind with you testing can you recommend a proper cooler for the 13900k. I dont know necessarily if i will be overclocking but id like to have a cooler that will do the job if i decide to. Heard air cooling has not been completely sufficient and more reading is showing definitely aio or a custom water loop. Is a custom loop necessary though? I know this cpu gets hot but still? Thank you and keep making videos. Great stuff!

[@michael_bane_official]

What’s with the constant fades in your video? It looks so tacky like it’s ai. Not gonna watch