Wyschnegradsky ~ 24 Preludes for Two Quarter-Tone Pianos (FULL)

[@imransyed4790]

Thanks for uploading! I had trouble finding the full work anywhere else. Also, since no one else has done this; 0:00 - Prelude No. 1 0:50 - Prelude No. 2 4:00 - Prelude No. 3 6:20 - Prelude No. 4 7:15 - Prelude No. 5 11:06 - Prelude No. 6 12:49 - Prelude No. 7 15:15 - Prelude No. 8 17:50 - Prelude No. 9 20:58 - Prelude No. 10 22:15 - Prelude No. 11 25:22 - Prelude No. 12 26:53 - Prelude No. 13 29:46 - Prelude No. 14 32:15 - Prelude No. 15 33:41 - Prelude No. 16 37:38 - Prelude No. 17 39:42 - Prelude No. 18 40:38 - Prelude No. 19 42:08 - Prelude No. 20 43:05 - Prelude No. 21 45:35 - Prelude No. 22 46:37 - Prelude No. 23 47:37 - Prelude No. 24

[@MrDarkBoy93]

You are a nice guy

[@imransyed4790]

@@MrDarkBoy93 I do what I can (sometimes)

[@JFDrummerforlife]

Thank you

[@steffen5121]

🙏

[@seiph80]

wanted to thank you very much for uploading; I recently read an interesting yet sad article about him, how he tried to get this quarter-tone experimentation to go mainstream in his lifetime and yet was unsuccessful and died somewhat poor; nevertheless he is known by few of us and can appreciate his work

[@AnAmericanComposer]

I actually created a biographical video that goes into great detail about those things, you should watch it. Thank you for your comment!

[@johnsmith-ch7fg]

Too far ahead for the culture; If he had lasted 4 decades odd more he'd see the first quartertone experiments in rock, metal etc. In fact another problem is perhaps Wyschnegradskys music; now I enjoy it for something alien but it can sound kinda creepy to many and not a lot of hummable in the bath melodies so many people think that's what quartertone sounds like when it can be used in many other styles of music and from varying degree of xenharmonic from none to where our man Ivan was or beyond. Another problem microtonal stuff is it just looks complex and unknown from the outside which seems to put a lot off and there are a lot of technical problems jamming extra notes into the system instrument wise. Another thing is quartertone was only one contender for advancing the west tuning with various camps advocating for things like 19 & 34 TET which are more broadly consonant; now of course with modern microtonal/xenharmonics the idea of a standard tuning or tunings loosens even further I feel

[@Lucius_Chiaraviglio]

@@johnsmith-ch7fg Also rather far ahead for the technology that was widespread at the time. Having 2 or even more players required to play 1 part is awkward (the approach used most, with 1 piano tuned 1 quarter tone sharp relative to the other, or in some cases more pianos tuned offset by smaller amounts). He was eventually able to get a couple of quarter-tone pianos and a quarter-tone harmonium built for him; I haven't seen images of the latter, but I have seen images of at least one of the quarter-tone pianos, and that thing is a MONSTER, and the ergonomics look terrible -- I haven't seen live video footage of it being played, but I _have_ seen footage on KZbin of the mid-1500s-vintage arcicembalo and arciorgano of Nicola Vicentino (actually reproductions thereof) or similar keyboard design (but even more notes) being played, and while having multiple manuals on a harpsichord or an organ is good for changing sound timbre and volume, it is really limiting when you have to do it just to play all the notes of one sound type, and you can tell how limiting it is from the awkward constraints on the musical composition (and it wasn't just the style of the time, because I have seen KZbin videos of music from slightly later that feature much less awkward use of both parts of split flat/sharp keys on 19 or even more note per octave harpsichords that managed to keep all their notes in 1 manual (pote that in principle this would open the possibility of having a second manual for volume/timbre, although I haven't seen that in combination with 19 notes per octave). That said, this video credits just one pianist (Martine Joste) for this recording instead of two, which makes me think that Studios de la Muse en Circuit à Alfortville actually got hold of one of the extremely rare quarter-tone pianos. People started thinking of more ergonomic keyboards (isomorphic/generalized -- Janko, Bosanquet, etc.) for keyboard instruments(*) in the late 1800s, but these did not really catch on until well after polyphonic synthesizers started to catch on -- as far as I can tell, actually in the last decade or so. Lumatone seems to be all the rage right now, but it certainly isn't the only one. (*)Isomorphic layouts developed earlier in the 1800s for accordions and their relatives, but never caught on beyond accordions and their relatives until very recently. Another thing that is evident comparing the photo of the quarter-tone piano to a normal piano is that getting more notes per octave into a piano mechanism is a major engineering challenge (harpsichord technology actually has more breathing room). This greatly increases the expense of manufacture (and maintenance probably becomes a nightmare), and the expense gets even worse for a pipe organ (and you can't even take more space for granted for an organ). Hypothetically, a polyphonic synthesizer taking a reasonable amount of space could have been built in Wyschnegradsky's time using the vacuum tube synthesizer technology of the Hammond Novachord in combination with a Janko/Bosanquet keyboard, but he would have had to know where to look at just the right time to put all of this together, and the Novachord was so hideously expensive (if I calculated correctly, over $400,000 in today's dollars for a 6 octave 12 note per octave instrument) as make it a dead-end instrument (although it is one *awesome* dead end), dropped after only 3 years in favor of their much less advanced and inferior-sounding tonewheel organs (Hammond models B and C, etc.) which were much easier to produce. I also wonder whether the inharmonicity of piano strings is also needed to help glue together Wyschnegradsky's chord progressions -- a Novachord's output has no inharmonicity. Although he did write a small amount of music including or even entirely for violin-family instruments (which also have no inharmonicity when bowed), and judging from the samples I have heard, he got this to work well enough.

[@manus7791]

Today, it's my last day before an art history exam. I was looking for relaxing music such as The Four Seasons of Vivaldi. Then, I looked deepper into your channel and discovered this...What an unknown composer masterpiece !!

[@AnAmericanComposer]

If you like, I could direct you towards more recordings of his. He wrote some incredibly fascinating music. One of his works is for six pianos!

[@manus7791]

I would like it. Thanks. My English is poor and I'm not a musician, but I like exploring things like this

[@AnAmericanComposer]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/d2O3kISZdseHfJY kzbin.info/www/bejne/iHTGe3t5oL6EbLc (a favorite of mine) kzbin.info/www/bejne/n6fWeZ6Ojpp_g80

[@manus7791]

AnAmericanComposer Thank you so much! I wish you were successful in your life!

[@TheCDanger]

Prelude No. 5 is a BANGER

[@brucedavies8154]

First got into Wyschnegradsky after extensive hearing of Late Scriabin, Alexander Mosolov and Leo Ornsteins works. Have to say I was amazed to discover this, and the full set, been dreaming of this for years :) The magic that lies between those 12 sacred tones, I hadn't even considered the thought until Wyschnegradsky. Thank you very much!

[@brucedavies8154]

No.5 is one of the most harrowing, beautiful pieces I'm likely to ever hear. Words fail me to describe the effect it has on me.

[@AnAmericanComposer]

Bruce Davies I'm glad to see another enthusiast! He is certainly not a well-known nor heavily sought-after composer, probably because of the challenge of performing him. He's one of those magnificent composers that seem to just slip through the cracks in music history texts and classes. I was able to get his full 24 Preludes from a website I use often, classical-music-online.net I recommend you check it out!

[@brucedavies8154]

Thank you very much, will check it now. :) It's wonderful to think that people are still working hard to bring his music alive once more :')

[@petretepner8027]

You're so right. In pre-internet days, you would occasionally come across his name in a footnote, but could hardly find anybody who could even tell you whether it was worth going to the trouble of checking him out.

[@MancillasMatthew]

If you have yet to do so, I would highly recommend listening to the Charles Ives Quarter Tone piano duets. They are wonderful pieces, and are among my favorites in the 20th century piano rep.

[@avatar19822]

Really like prelude #3 👍 I bought this on CD 16 years ago

[@amazingbytes7027]

I was reading about arts and the Russian bolchevik revolution and ended up here. These treasures you share with us reminded me of the first time I heard Messiaen and Webern music: Rare moments that change you forever. Thank you.

[@SamuraiSx19]

gosh I was searching for this all my life

[@CutiePie232]

Prelude 3 and 4 are so good!

[@matthewparis1907]

Thanks. Since we hear consonances as stable resolutions and accidentals as notes leading to them we bring to any scale a set of Pythagorean expressive presumptions that are built into us. This is very intelligent assymetrical ad ingenious music.

[@andrewwilliams9599]

Glad to hear that Charles Ives wasn't the only composer writing for quarter-tone pianos in the 1920s.

[@MegaCirse]

il y a ici, non seulement des contours mélodiques connus et appréciés des seuls indous, mais encore un matériel harmonique absolument nouveau, qui nous apporte des prismes, des grappes d'accords, des carillons touffus, d'aériennes guirlandes. Ce qui frappe tout d'abord dans cette musique, c'est d'une part, le charme pénétrant des agrégations harmoniques et d'autre part, la netteté absolue des intervalles! (Messiaen)

[@yearoftheyurt]

This is marvelous, thanks for uploading it!

[@lovaaaa2451]

OMG I've ben looking for this for ages THANK YOU

[@saadhaddadmusic]

One of the unknown masterworks of the 20th century for sure!

[@hiZarki]

I'm glad I've opened up to this kind of music. I feel like somehow I had to change or grow not to cringe at this type of harmony

[@johnappleseed8369]

Thank you again!

[@AnAmericanComposer]

Any time!

[@EmanuelBrusa]

Some singers could go very well with this piano.

[@baloogajones3516]

Ives : Concord Sonata & Songs edit: different sound, but same music theory

[@marimarsh5265]

This is actually two pianos.

[@TheProGamerMC20]

@@marimarsh5265 r/woooosh

[@udomatthiasdrums5322]

wow - love it!! many thanks for good vibrations!

[@metodejhrdlicka]

I tried to find interest in classical music. It was fleeting and hard to sustain. And then I heard this. Mission accomplished.

[@kingconcerto5860]

I get it. You should check out Scriabin and Sorabji. Ignore Mozart and Bach.

[@alejandronarvaez9806]

Perfect to concentrate

[@sebastiansimon7557]

Wow, how is it even possible that 49 minutes and 40 seconds pass by so quickly?

[@ivantoledorosales8811]

es una maravilla poder escuchar esta obra, y ser testigo de cómo la música sigue creciendo y expandiendo las fronteras de la conciencia

[@thefxbip315]

Prelude 5 is so good! chilling!

[@RayzeurRider]

Congratulation, you're now a strange person...

[@dylangerard1480]

:')

[@sanicyouth6540]

I would tell the uploader: "Welcome to the 20th century classical club."

[@CairosNaobum]

Thanks.

[@ivandaza4918]

I would think the same of people whom like nightcore

[@icecreamforcrowhurst]

... and here was me thinking everyone else was strange

[@karimantoniodossantosarauj1031]

Fantástico maravilhoso !

[@nhung.nguyen]

wonderful work !!!!

[@suzannevaret1560]

Cette musique reflète l'âme d'Ivan Wyschnegradsky - il se sentait redevable de chaque note émise - quand il jouait sur son piano , on sentait la lumière incandescente de cette musique qui l'habitait au plus profond de son âme- Il incarnait la musique.

[@hipkiz6126]

Ça marche Suzanne

[@m2460-u1o]

It takes more time to learn the name than all the preludes.

[@mohamedhamza456]

Finally a piano set that we can use to render genuine Arabian music, if only some arab composer would pay attention to it! Thank you M. Wyshngradsky and M Haba for showing us the path.

[@shacharh5470]

Usually quarter-tone music is played on the piano by having 2 pianos, one of which tuned a quarter tone above the other. I don't know that it will work with Arabic music, It doesn't seem like the kind of timbre that Arabic music is concerned with too much (sharp attack, no real vibrato... Is there anything like that in classical Arabic music? I'm genuinely asking, not an expert)

[@authenticbaguette6673]

Shachar H not necessarily classical .. but modern arab composers are using more western instruments nowadays and by extension often find themselves restricted to the "default" 12 notes . In the process , many different scales and harmonies and melodies lost their charm which partially explains why all arab music sounds the same nowadays :P I'm not much of an expert on arab music either but I'm exposed to it regularly enough

[@shacharh5470]

@@authenticbaguette6673 They shouldn't feel restricted to 12TET tuning just because they use western instruments. Many western composers have experimented with microtonal music, including 24TET, for example the Hungarian Lois Haba (check out his concerto in quarter tones for trombones, if I remember the title correctly).

[@authenticbaguette6673]

Shachar H it's more complicated than that .. it's technically possible to tune a piano in a different way but even in the western world altering the piano and tuning it in unconventional ways remain obscure practices . There is also a cultural element , being the westernisation of the world .. I don't mean to sound like a nationalist but globalism is a real thing , and often people who study music and practice it find more validation and financial opportunities in academia which is inherently westernised , and in appealing to western pop standards . It's seen as the pensée moderne to follow the west blindly to put it that way . What remains of arabic music is mostly a desperate and lagging attempt at copying western music .. which is why it will take us a hundred more years to get bored of our equal temprament pianos and start to rediscover quarter tones .

[@shacharh5470]

@@authenticbaguette6673 nitpick: the quarter tone system is also equally tempered. All quarster tone intervals have the ratio of 2^1/24

[@ustadspencertracy7195]

Actually 20th century was not the era when humanity met microtonality. If one is well educated enough to decipher stenography and hymnography, East Rome invented-at least used- a tone system composed of 72 distinctive tones in one octave. Later, Turkish musicians used a 53 tone system with higher velocity in performing. For example, between C and D, there were 9 mid tones. Db in western music considered to be approximately 5 midtones "komas" away from C. Other komas can be dirty our out of tune to a western ear. For instance, if you listen to a "taksim" by Cevdet Çağla, you will hear some peculiar dynamic, deliberately odd notes that even Heifetz wouldn't achieve without further analysis. Because of this, it is quite impossible to invent an accountable polyphony. There are, notwithstanding, curious attempts by outsiders. John Cage, in early 40s, came up with a 43 tone system with the informative consultations of Ekrem Karadeniz. Lastly, if you want to hear a mixture of Bel Canto technique with microtonality, you can listen to Münir nurettin selçuk, who worked as a tenor in Budapest, French and Italy, meetin Tito Schipa from late 1910s to mid 1920s.

[@segmentsAndCurves]

@Felis Skalkotris Sorabjitus You're here lol

[@lauramurillotovar811]

Please don't forget the mexican Julián Carrillo, the real creator of the modern microtonal system. He started with this idea form late1890's. inba.gob.mx/prensa/13693/julian-carrillo-creador-del-sonido-13-uno-de-los-mas-importantes-compositores-de-mexico

[@anaghshetty]

@@segmentsAndCurves You're here lol

[@segmentsAndCurves]

@@anaghshetty no

[@mauriciorocha4038]

Excelent!

[@tristanrush5526]

I quite like this

[@LyubomirIko]

The structure does not seem complex - yet the unique tone values can compensate?

[@martin1024]

Lyubomir Ikonomov its extremely difficult to play on a quarter tone piano.

[@HocDog666]

Moral Dilemma I don't think the difficulty of playing the instrument was being disputed. I think he was asking a good faith question about the structure of the song. Try not to jump down his throat

[@Ivan_1791]

It compensates because the microtonal harmonies Wyschnegradsky gave us could be used by a best composer and then create some incredible music. This preludes aren't quality music because they use basic structures and forms, but they are a great study about harmony and they are good to listen to. They have its own unique feeling, and that should be appreciated.

[@i_am_not_exp2414]

simple is usually better, this music is emotionally complex.

[@josealexandreferreiradacos193]

Wyschnegradsky´s music is quite straight to absorb - The circle of a circle within a circle that is everything than a circle, obviously encircle the sounds automatically defeated by not understanding the real dimension of a circle.

[@annaraudsepp6471]

Amazing.honestly.

[@ninjaKelle]

I remember first hearing microtones being used in music when I was a kid watching wait until dark. I couldn’t tell why it was so beautiful but it always stuck with me. I tried sticking my fingers in the grand piano and playing around with the strings to get a similar effect and was never able fo get it. It’s interesting that just now I’m finding there’s quite a lot of music written using microtones.

[@AnAmericanComposer]

Look up Krk island folk music! They have their own complete folk-theory based on a symmetrical microtonal scale, and their own method of vocal harmonization, too. Jarring but gorgeous. There's an album on KZbin of it

[@glottalstop2080]

в

[@jadams1834]

#3 is like the blues: kzbin.info/www/bejne/qnXVoJRrjLmIaZY Great accessible piece for this tuning, love it. Quarter tones can feel like an approximation of the note-bending so key to blues & jazz. Seems our diatonic mode & its harmonies are built around a basic partial series, though the huge, altered, clusters used in jazz piano get at some of the complex vibration interference. Fascinating this painful piano tuning that gets at colors naturally which extended altered harmonies strive for within the original scale. Thanks for posting this!

[@fergusof]

Pleasantly unusual. Nice break from the 12 tone autocracy. ;)

[@colinhinz8267]

Is this the col legno release?

[@clfm20]

One tries not to but cannot help calling Les Dawson to mind.

[@NeoJinn]

@ 42:10 would be awesome boss music.

[@SaccidanandaSadasiva]

Cool

[@Lucius_Chiaraviglio]

Sounds like the last Prelude got slightly chopped off at the end.

[@tiberiu_nicolae]

2:14 sounds like a train

[@Pavlu6a]

WTF! It' written for 2 pianos, but there's only 1 pianist mentioned in this record! Is 1 pianist playing 2 pianos simultaneously?? I found scores for this, and I can't find second part here as well.. wtf...

[@amazingbytes7027]

I think it is because quarter-tone music for piano requires two pianos. One which is left in its normal tuning and the other sharpened or flattened by a quarter tone. Both pianos are half-tone tuned, but one is a quarter-tone shifted from the other. Hence you get a "super" piano with quarter-tone tuning.

[@freepagan]

How did he produce quarter tones without the aid of a computer? Did he tune his piano differently?

[@TheTsev]

yes

[@fernwehn5925]

Two pianos. One is tuned 1/4 lower.

[@nikolauswilliams3124]

this is Op. 22?

[@Brettorini]

Wondering the same thing. But I think it is.

[@MatheusRosenthal]

Interessante

[@qaave]

no. 24 cuts off half way through. incomplete video.

[@AnAmericanComposer]

+qaave timestamp?

[@qaave]

well the end of the video. the final prelude begins at 47.38 and the video ends half way through.

[@JamesElkins]

Around measure 33 in the score; the last Prelude ends at measure 54.

[@diogoramos4427]

I love this type of music ahahah but I think people that have absolut ear doesn't like this xD

[@zechymahler]

I definitely do not have an absolute ear. I wasn't expecting to 'like' this music. Appreciate it, perhaps, for it's composition. To my surprise I find myself quiet enjoying some parts of it. it tickles my fancy for things out of the ordinary.

[@VianoMusicAcademy]

Not true. I have absolute ear and I like it. Our tuning system is already messed up because of equal temperament (lower distances between fifths, narrower Major 3rds, wider minor 3rds), and I'd say that 99.9% of people aren't complaining. Just because you can identify notes, doesn't mean that notes which don't fit into our already arbitrary definition of pitches are bad. In fact, I think like anybody else, we can appreciate the newly defined sets of (micro)intervals created in this music.

[@ivandaza4918]

I have a really high trained absolute ear on the 12 semitone ambit, but I have to admit that 12 semitones bore me already, no matter if it’s 440, 432, 445, 450, etc. The possibilities on this kind of music are probably as endless as space self, I love it!

[@nixcanpor810]

this is played in Guantanamo bay to torture prisoners

[@かっか-e6w]

20秒しか耐えれんかった笑笑

[@zakky3ackz]

makes us have fear

[@toothlesstoe]

I hear more than 13 tones.

[@MiskyWilkshake]

That'd be because there are 24.

[@toothlesstoe]

...which is why I don't understand why it's called "24 Preludes in 13-Tone Diatonicised Chromaticism in Quarter-Tone System for Two Pianos"

[@TheEddike]

I guess that our system is 7-tone diatonicised? we have 7 tones per diatonic scale (the whole-tone scale, the half-step-whole-step scale, etc. are exceptions) Therefore it makes sense that a quarter-tone system has 13 tones per scale: 7*7=14, and perhaps they both have the same root...? so minus one equals 13. I don't know this, it's a PURE guess. Hope it's understandable, i rarely deal with english music-terms.

[@TheEddike]

Oops, meant 7*2=14 obviously

[@スパーレン]

B no.3

[@janesullivan692]

This is like the audio version of schizophrenia

[@minnedanhieux883]

Cool, but because everything sounds so dissonant, the mood is pretty much always the same. When using the pedals the overtones of sympathetic resonant strings is fueling a lot of the sound. So I really like the instrument and the sound, but I get saturated pretty fast by the way it sounds. I can imagine why this instrument didn't become mainstream. :)

[@mikoajp.5890]

Have a go at Middle Eastern music, then come back here. You got saturated and feel they sound so similar to each other because the quartertones sound foreign to you. It requires, and probably always will, an acquired taste ;) But there is richness in what you now perceive as meddle. Getting more familiar with microtonals is a must to find that richness though. Try folk music that uses microtonality, take a look at the Lizzard Gizzard too. All those spicy dishes will stop just being spicy and you'll learn to find all the nuances and flavours underneath

[@minnedanhieux883]

@@mikoajp.5890 Could be, but it's not my thing, and as we both observed the instrument disappeared as fast as it was invited. So it's more like something that tastes very weird and a small group is loving and craving it anyway. If it needs expensive words to convince it's 'beauty' then it's just not for me. I like the sound but this 50 minutes is just to much of the same thing.

[@billybobthekidiswack]

@@mikoajp.5890 the problem with quartertones isn't the melody it's the harmony. In a traditional sense "Eastern music" has more focus on rhythmic and melodic complexity while "western music" had more focus on complex harmonies. Applying quartertone to chords will always sound like notes are clashing against each other and the timbre of the piano doesn't mesh well with quartertones since it has a fast attack and fast decay.

[@wenqianrudnick4917]

my ears......

[@fan91ful]

:)

[@SeigneurReefShark]

Beautiful! That's really sad you can't play that on a normal piano..

[@petervandenborre1657]

I'm sorry. If I listen to all 24 preludes I'll need to be admitted to an asylum.

[@cooleslaw]

Nice dissonance.

[@CharIie83]

just because you have more tones, doesnt mean you should play them. some interesting tidbits here and there

[@Alvaro-fh5dd]

Like creepy tones.

[@s1earle]

Nice playing but somewhat forgetful music, best left to the specialists of the macabre.

[@mijaba]

not even slightly happy sounding.

[@luizmarcondesmusica]

shit is out of tune

[@SeigneurReefShark]

? Lmfao is that a joke or something like so?

[@segmentsAndCurves]

@@SeigneurReefShark Can you tune shit?

[@luizmarcondesmusica]

@@SeigneurReefShark joke