Animals and Universal Restoration - David Bentley Hart

[@Jordan-hz1wr]

These words are comforting to me today Dr. Hart. We are having to put our beloved dog down tomorrow due to cancer and everything you've said I seem to instinct-fully know to be true.

[@ceh5526]

God bless you. I held my dog 18 months ago for that part of his journey - our journey. I still cry, and I'm really happy that I do. And to know - really know - that our love is eternal and personal and glorious in Christ, has turned my tears into ones of joy.

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblical eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@Ajsirb24]

@@David-Once I'd like to believe that but I can't find scriptural evidence for this. Would you be able to provide a verse or 2?

[@Jordan-hz1wr]

@@Ajsirb24 We need to get out of the habit of requiring a "proof text". There is no proof text for the existence of indoor plumbing, yet none of us would say "indoor plumbing is bad", or "I can't get on board with indoor pluming" simply because we couldn't find a scriptural reference. We know what is good, true and beautiful because His spirit ministers to our spirit. Moses and Abram never had the Bible, but they had Christ. Jesus and the Apostles didn't have the New Testament, they were Christ. We live by the spirit, not the letter. That is the trap of the Pharisaical spirit. All is love, and all is life, all is Christ.

[@Ajsirb24]

@@Jordan-hz1wr I do see your point but this is a new concept to me. I'll definitely meditate upon it. This idea would have been deplorable to me 5 years ago but Jesus has definitely helped me become more gracious over the years. And because of that, I've come to believe that evil is not a reality in and of itself but is in fact the twisting or absence of what's true, good and beautiful. Evil and deception are, at the root, results of ignorance.

[@eduardovalentin9416]

"At the ground of all nature is personal presence." Wow, that is really beautiful stuff.

[@toddfouts]

Brought me to tears. Thanks so much for sharing. I love it when the good news is actually good news.

[@paxonearth]

No doubt! I had to chuckle at your comment. What is normally passed off as the Good News of Christ is the threat of eternal damnation for anyone who doesn't manage to utter the correct statement of faith before dying.

[@TheBlueCream]

@@paxonearth yep.more like awful news for most people

[@77goanywhere]

This is so basic and obviously true that to deny it is to step away from fundamental knowing, and forces one into darkness, no matter how, or what one otherwise "believes".

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblically eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@mariarubinstein581]

I always felt deep down that God would restore to us the animals that we have loved and cherished. God is love, how could He ever deny the love that He created within each of us. That was my feeling before I even realized the truth so plainly stated in the Bible about the restoration of all things. I knew the verse was there but I didn’t understand it. But now I see it as one of the most beautiful verses in the Bible.

[@TheHumbuckerboy]

I love this wonderfully comforting and encouraging message from David !

[@normaodenthal8009]

Another wonderful clip! David Bentley Hart never disappoints. Animals really do have their individual personality traits. Even the wild birds which come to visit me are recognisable by their peculiar quirks more than their appearance. That All Shall Be Saved is a book well worth reading, but David Bentley Hart’s book Roland In Moonlight, featuring conversations with his dog, is an absolute delight.

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblical eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@normaodenthal8009]

@@Ajsirb24 I’d have to agree with you on that; I’d be happy to have the restoration of my cats and dogs, but I could definitely do without the big, venomous snakes, spiders, and other creepy crawlies. Since I am a mozzie magnet, they would have to go too.

[@cherylkopec1625]

​@@Ajsirb24 so the restoration of all things has already occurred?

[@Ajsirb24]

@@cherylkopec1625 Yes because "all things" is a hyperbole. It doesn't include every single atom in the universe. It means all people, angel and human alike, in heaven and earth.

[@cherylkopec1625]

@@Ajsirb24 but we're still waiting for restoration, aren't we?

[@cyranodicorvino8308]

Indeed, "all", really, really, really means "all". All created things and beings(Col 1) Thanks for the book David, very good.

[@TheHumbuckerboy]

Which book please ?

[@cyranodicorvino8308]

@@TheHumbuckerboy "That all shall be saved"

[@TheHumbuckerboy]

@@cyranodicorvino8308 Many thanks ... I intend to get a copy.

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblically eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@TheHumbuckerboy]

" It is clear that when you interact with animals you are interacting with personal beings ... "

[@nikosalexopoulos6542]

If it feels pain and love, then it has a soul and is a person

[@conexionneuronal8820]

I once heard william lane craig say that his dogs, as much as he loved them, lacked consciousness... I felt truly disgusted, no offense to him, when I heard that.

[@christopherconey732]

I think you'll find that he was using the term consciousness in a pretty narrow sense.

[@scottharrison812]

I heard his appalling dismissiveness towards animal suffering and was equally shocked. Frankly it seems to me there are a fair number of people who lack consciousness.

[@jcismyall]

PROFOUND is an understatement! ❤

[@bradensmith5969]

I love animals! They will all be restored!

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblical eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@anthonymaldo3692]

​@@Ajsirb24 hello,my fellow man. I believe I can help you out with this one. Watch martin zender's video called "if it moves,it's saved" in that video he quotes a verse from the concordant version of the bible,which is a proper translation of the Greek language. The verse states "if there's a soulish body,there's a spiritual body also." Anything that moves on its own animal,insect has a spiritual body. Therefore insects are included.

[@Ajsirb24]

@Anthony Maldo Hm, that does not sound like the proper context to of Paul's letter. Scripture is clear that only God's heavenly host and mankind have spirits.

[@anthonymaldo3692]

@@Ajsirb24 are you a believer of the salvation of all? Believers and unbelievers? God will be all in all... Does all mean all?

[@Ajsirb24]

@Anthony Maldo Of course but not every single organism.

[@dianamanwaring4794]

I had to let my cat go over the rainbow bridge two weeks ago. I told God many times before my fur baby died that if he's not going to be in Heaven, that I would refuse to go. I still feel this way. Heaven would be like Hell without him and the other pets that I had over the years.

[@tylerlynch2849]

Beautifully edited video!

[@jenniferweiss4734]

Absolutely beautiful video

[@Zombiejimful]

Thank you so much for this presentation

[@jasonegeland1446]

Well said, David!

[@clovislyme6195]

If this is so, then it is, for some of us a powerful reason to believe, not only because we long to see again animals we have loved, that have enriched our lives and consoled us so very much, but because their innocent suffering throughout the whole of evolution might come to something good for them as well as for us.

[@ceh5526]

Absolutely - thank you so much. It's everything or it's nothing. So it's everything - all time and all the ages, and everything that has its being in Him.

[@loveandideas]

I like short videos like this one.

[@shanechin7242]

is there a full video?

[@LoveUnrelenting]

I interviewed DBH for about an hour and a half. Parts of the interview will be used in a feature length documentary that I hope to release next year. Many of the parts that I don't plan to use in that documentary will be released in short videos like this one.

[@shanechin7242]

@@LoveUnrelenting ok thank you !

[@shanechin7242]

@@LoveUnrelenting looking forward to it

[@taynicole6665]

Im seeing this video 2 years after its posted. A day after my cat got hit by a car. My heart hurts. This gave me some peace..Ive lost pets before and I truly hope my beloved animals are happy and healthy in heaven i hope to see again..

[@ralphstarling6707]

Love That!

[@glenclary3231]

Is there a link to the full interview? Thanks

[@LoveUnrelenting]

I sent the full interview to Dr. Hart to use as he sees fit. He may or may not release it on his Substack. I leave that up to him and do not mind if he decides to use it in any way or not at all.

[@glenclary3231]

@@LoveUnrelenting thanks!

[@rocdajacable]

When your dog dies it's spirit returns to its creative source the dust

[@JD-HatCreekCattleCo]

Yes so true ❤

[@bernhardkarels3251]

I love the fact this video endures 3,16 min.

[@alibongo5545]

💚💚💚✨

[@racheladkins6060]

THIS IS SO SO GOOD. please let it be god?

[@blue62show]

More good news !

[@Chomper750]

I’m sorry Roland.

[@Ajsirb24]

Does this include mosquitoes and other annoying pests? I apologize if I'm being too facetious but I'm not sure if I agree with Dr. Hart on this. My understanding of biblical eschatology and the restoration of all things occurred within the generation of Jesus Christ as was prophesied from His own lips.

[@tommywarren4633]

The true gospel is found in 2nd Corinthians 5:18 and 19 , among other scriptures.

[@hamidtohid6932]

Lamb of God, camel showing Mohammad’s path to and in Medina ,Eagle in North American indigenous people, Earth as Turtle Island, Holy Cow,and three gospels of Mark, Luke and John as Lion, Ox and Eagle ,Buddha as Elephant, on and on...is NOT accidental.

[@Ggb427neo]

Yes and the romain tradition of auguries.

[@markdaniels1730]

DBH locuta, causa finita.

[@Phoenixspin]

So, you're saying that the snake that bit me two years ago will be in heaven to bite me again? Really?

[@lindadevito7363]

I don't agree

[@LynchMobster47]

Are streptococcus pyogenes, one of the bacteria that causes necrotizing fasciitis, going to be restored? What about mosquitoes? Even if the new cosmos has plants and animals (which I wouldn’t immediately rule out), it does not follow that these are numerically the same as the plants and animals we have personal experience with. The biggest concern I have with this video is Dr. Hart’s seeming hand-waving of the traditional notion of personhood. That is, the Boethian definition, “an individual substance of a rational nature”. What is Hart’s definition of personhood? And furthermore, if animals are personal, doesn’t that make anyone who eats a hamburger morally equivalent to Jeffrey Dahmer? That is deeply unsettling and problematic.

[@Mrm1985100]

Animals don't need to be our equals in order to have compassion on them.

[@metalheadhippie8738]

It should be obvious that humans are at the top of the hierarchy and indeed there is a hierarchy. Also eating meat didn't seem to occur until after the flood when God gave us his blessing to do so. In truth the perfection in which God will restore all things is likely beyond our comprehension. So we can speculate but we'll be wrong.

[@youngpilgrim5]

Interesting critique. I personally don't think it is a problem because we do not see such bacteria and mosquitoes manifesting consciousness any more than would a complicated machine. Hart specifically mentions the ability to participate in meaningful, reciprocal relationship, the ability to be known (again, relationally) as distinct from other members. Bacteria and mosquitoes quite simply don't possess the neurological capacity to engage in this kind of interactive consciousness. Not sure if that solves the dilemma, but that's where my mind goes with it.

[@epektasis_shunyata]

The details are probably impossible for us to imagine fully worked out. But scripture does say the lion will lay with the lamb and that's pretty hard to imagine. Also yes eating meat is always bad for human health. We are naturally frugivores. All recent research supports this.

[@Ajsirb24]

@@epektasis_shunyata I'm sorry but it is truly arrogant to say that "all research supports this." And it also points to your ignorance. Forgive me please. I'm not trying to begin a fight but I've done plenty of research myself and found that organic meat and diary products are far more beneficial to our bodies than a vegan diet.

[@mattgrimes8059]

Humans can perceive idiosyncrasies and personalities in animals. Then again you can say the same thing about a car.

[@nickjoseph5258]

my dog ate my breakfast

[@nickjoseph5258]

I love her still

[@nickjoseph5258]

Sasha

[@christopherconey732]

Dear Professor, Do you kill the blowflies and rats in your house? Do you swat the mosquitoes? Just sayin'...