Apartheid Flag | AfriForum approaches Supreme Court of Appeal to legalise display of old flag

AfriForum has argued that the Equality Court's order on the displaying of the old flag set off a series of unintended consequences for the future.
It's told the Supreme Court of Appeal in Bloemfontein that the order was made without meeting the required threshold to declare the act as hate speech. It contends that there should be facts about the act before determining whether something amounts to hate speech.
Representing AfriForum, Advocate Mark Oppenheimer has told the court that the displaying of the flag during the black Monday protests in 2017 was not planned and it is not even known what the intention or reason behind the act was. Let's listen in.
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[@mondlindlovu6093]

These are the consequences of forgiving people who never asked for forgiveness in the first place.Now they are really sticking it to us

[@iambuz9705]

They were not supposed to come here in the 1st place. They cause conflict.We can never acknowledge them as human beings

[@wayzenthefighter6542]

The must be kissed 😘

[@jamludentertainment]

@@wayzenthefighter6542 I agree, kiss the boer!

[@karelgericke3858]

Lol why must we ask for forgiveness your troll, the National Party was the governing party not all white SA citizens, why must all white people ask for forgiveness, if they never supported apartheid, go jump in a river my brother I don't ask for forgiveness for something I didn't do. 🖕and by the way, the SA flag got nothing to do with hate speach, this is a joke.

[@ZomziWeAfrika]

We think that our threat is only African nationals , they are busy operating underground we will realize when it’s too late and we have to go back to apartheid. You are right brother Wam

[@akhonadyi3602]

Afriforum must be banned period!!!

[@ramphaganeseheuandries1473]

Remove this people from our parliament

[@samsongeorge5242]

There can not be two different national flags in the same country.

[@mrs9317]

The Afri forum racists bayadelela. South Africans are too forgiving and too forgetful.

[@mick6310]

Display that flag in your homeland the Netherlands 🇳🇱 clowns 🤡

[@rockrabbit253]

Go back to school and learn about the history of how white people arrived in South Africa. Then go and learn about the history of how black people arrived in South Africa.

[@TheBigThinker944]

These people are something else smh

[@siyabongakoyo238]

I say let them display it, you allow them to sing Die Stem mos so what's the difference, ANC sold us out years ago, this flag and Die Stem go together you can't have one without the other, you even allowed Orania to exist and there is even a talk of Independent Cape so ja stop fooling us this country belongs to Boers always has and always will, even the economic ownership is the evidence to this fact....

[@sidneynorde8626]

You become what you believe.

[@thembanimgenu190]

Afriforum are defending what made them to be who they are today, their flag. They have their Anthem sung aloud so why can't they have their flag is their flag, I would imagine. However the big question is the so called democracy is supposed to make me human again, and therefore am supposedly having something to celebrate and be willing to defend with all I got, question is what is that actually I don't have any. Lastly the courts of law are open to any arrangement anyone might have. Racism and Corruption are similar to me, no better devil, they all steal from black people or the poor either dignity or resources. But one thing for sure Ngcukaithobi is a brilliant legal mind, full stop 🛑

[@njabuloterrence]

My perception of Afri Forum has changed and I’m really disappointed, a lot of people were accusing them of being racists and I actually chose to believe otherwise because I genuinely feel that you cannot disregard one’s pain, when they were crying for farm murders to stop I supported that, they wanted the dubuli bhunu chant to stop I definitely do support that as well because it’s thier pain, but noooooo clearly they just care about themselves, playing victims while victimizing black people, this is a very pain point to a lot of us, and yet they just don’t mind supporting such a dark part of the South African history that persists till this day, clearly these racial tensions will be around for some time 😢

[@mlungisimasinda7117]

U are late u think slow that your problem use your mind next time not your heart then u will see the reality of this world

[@Sillylittleworld1]

Afriforum is a problematic organisation, it's going to take a while to unlearn all that hate. Thanks for giving them the space to say their bit even if they're not as compassionate. I always thought they were a bit dodgy and avoided their stuff, I don't like associating with conservative afrikaners because there is usually a racist hiding somewhere. I know because I was born into an afrikaans family.

[@adelbom-o]

You're so naïve because the agenda of afriforum from day 1 has always been to bring back apartheid 😮😮😮😮

[@duckmansam5046]

It’s their history and culture. Calling it racist doesn’t mean anything.

[@siyandangxangane4909]

AfriForum has lost a plot now.

[@percyshibambo2690]

Is signs of desperation of holding on to most important thing which is our land, they are aware that the wheels are coming off and we will take our land either constitutional or unconstitutional but land will be returned to it rightful owners.

[@omo708]

AfriForum loves court

[@christinevandermerwe5660]

Now that is stupid!!!

[@tlawengmophosho4848]

I going to fly it up side down. Own their foolishness. Gesture politics display weakness

[@sanelekhulaphi1007]

AfriForum does not deserve to argue with the organisation with Tata Nelson Mandela tag on it. I do hope in future, the Nelson Mandela Foundation can encourage EFF to face off with AfriForum.

[@angelabaxter6298]

I don't support AfriForum in this matter, but why was the Nelson Mandela Fondation quite when freedom fighters became looters.

[@thembelihleinnocent3034]

We don't even want to discuss the issue of that evil 😈 Flag these people are ungrateful, where have you seen anywhere in the world where a person would still from your forefathers and you're still civil towards them, they must stop testing us😠😠

[@gawd6gaw443]

Bayanya laba be Afriforum,we need to kiss them

[@mduduzihadebe3519]

Not under ZUMA YEARS

[@himeshmothi1605]

I do think it should be in museums and perhaps for educational purposes....but it should be illegal, it's part of a collective crime against humanity

[@rockrabbit253]

The flag committed no crime.

[@himeshmothi1605]

@@rockrabbit253 it's what the flag represents, I understand to a white individual it's part of thier history, but you cant ignore what that history represents, if settlers came here, with honest and moral intentions , enriched the indeginous inhabitants along with themselves , built infrastructure to uplift all, then the flag represents the period it was flown in.... but we all know the reality we came from, the brutality oppression and inhumanity we non whites faced, and the flag is a representation of that period...a south africa that wasn't a land for all the people in it...

[@notnotadev]

certainly when used in an offensive context it shouldn’t be allowed, but a complete ban seems unwise

[@rockrabbit253]

@@himeshmothi1605 I understand that you find it offensive but do you think that every piece of history that some people find offensive should be suppressed ?

[@EugenevanWyk]

If you can judge all white because of a flag,....then I can judge all Africans based on your stupid comment. Apparently you're all idiots

[@robs9987]

It is their rights as South Africa is a free country.Today this country is a mess because of current government.

[@marumokitime3771]

They should go to the UNHRC to overturn the declaration that the Apartheid is crime against Humanity and the flag is a symbol of that crime.

[@Whoo_shem]

What is their right? To display a flag of superiority over the disenfranchised?

[@rubberbulletza]

@robs do you hear yourself... don't be ignorent

[@visionfhulufhelo8230]

You benefited from Apartheid not blacks

[@visionfhulufhelo8230]

Attention seekers 😂😂

[@Bianca-sw5id]

The old flag represents who got us freedom from colonialism too , so get with what would have happened had it not , stop whining

[@elizabethnadrau195]

people are hungry talking about Flags of Apartheid.Do You believe that people have interest of flags when they don't have even clean water to drink and lights to see. (All this on an empty stomachs.)

[@thetad1242]

People are capable of chewing gum and walk at the same time.

[@g0pher2]

They are hungry and poor precisely because of Apartheid, this flag just twists the knife in the wound

[@trustingnobody628]

@@g0pher2 Are we hungry and poor because of Apartheid? If so, what is the purpose of Zondo Commission?

[@TheFanta111]

Democracy allows for some sort of transparency and accountability. Hence the Zondo Commission. Its quite obvious that the apartheid system was a exclusive preserve for white people dont compare the incomparable.

[@g0pher2]

@@trustingnobody628 I don't understand your question are you denying that Apartheid engineered SA to become the most unequal society on Earth? Or are you saying the ANC government is why there is poverty in SA

[@crudabex2437]

Anc sold out

[@molatelofelix7084]

They are used to hate that they don't feel or know the difference.

[@ZomziWeAfrika]

They should go back home we don’t appreciate that and they wonder why we haven’t healed . They hate us these people

[@solomontshiping6085]

Maburu a tlwaela, they want to bring old memories to black people

[@blessingdiale4207]

Afriforum must stand for the provocations they are initiating on those realy harmed by apertheid

[@Bianca-sw5id]

Can't even spell apartheid so what is your point?

[@thabisomabiletsa594]

We are not our forefathers!! Bazonya straight ke manje!!!!

[@gawd6gaw443]

Yizo,az'khale

[@youngeconomist3125]

Bayanya labo they want to open up old wounds mxm its not happening otherwise we joining operation Dudula to take the flag down

[@cozaneo3153]

Commander morning 💯💥❤️

[@mzozukofuba29]

No dudula is for black skin don't be confused

[@youngeconomist3125]

Morning my commanders Dudula ts for everyone that needs it color doesn't matter baba. Don't be silly we fight for justice thats the important thing ngwenya

[@ngcali9005]

operation dudula cannot fight this leave to EFF

[@deborahramaphala9056]

Afrkaaners they never took accountability for what they did arrogant ANC IS BUSY SLEEPING WHAT DOES DA SAY ABOUT IT

[@boitumeloboitumelo2451]

Bayazenzel bayabon silwa sodwa

[@africa1st737]

Nantsoke iReconciliation yobubhanxa !

[@ben16510]

And certain struggle songs cannot be sung the likes of EFF 🤔

[@StephGrobler1]

Because a flag isn't the same as calling for the murder of people, which under the constitution is a crime.

[@Mooks689]

@@StephGrobler1 the flag represent genocides.

[@siyolisemgijima4057]

@@StephGrobler1 doesn't represent us south africans it only represent white supremercy

[@StephGrobler1]

@@siyolisemgijima4057 Still freedom of speech, unlike calling for murder, which is a crime, hatespeech, under the constitution.

[@marumokitime3771]

@@StephGrobler1 Erm… one of those forms of speech represents apartheid which was declared crime against Humanity by the UNHRC, the other is not. There's no other declaration on the contrary…

[@vume7722]

Afriforum must approach Con-Court to bring back the apartheid system instead of using the stupid old flag gimmick. racists shame on you.

[@omo708]

🤣🤣🤣They trying to go back to apartheid slowly though the back doors

[@jimmysteinberg1114]

Every South African is, black& white. Democracy failed when Mandela broke the agreement and instituted 100 anti white laws. The federal republic system was far better, and the new flag is offensive to South Africans.

[@vume7722]

😂😂@@omo708 When racists have too much money on their hands, to waste it on foolish cases instead of real human rights issues.

[@vume7722]

@@jimmysteinberg1114 100 laws to try and uplift other black races from systematic poverty created by the colonial and apartheid system. It seems racist white people are happier when other races languish in poverty and they get all the white privileges of the apartheid system and colonial rule. The entire historic legal system was built to oppress other races, how was that supposed to be corrected, tell me 🤔

[@moragbell]

Brilliant Tobi!

[@deborahramaphala9056]

Afriforum take to court how7 to eradicate poverty and distribute wealth and eradicate unemployment. No empathy or sympathy

[@wayzenthefighter6542]

Black South Africans kiss😘 this people they will stop this nonsense🙂

[@frankdiketv5203]

They can pls go to oraina and display them flag

[@johnroach1101]

No go to Europeband display the flag ,oriana anyone living there should be repatriated to Europe

[@rijnvanessen7359]

As a student of History I say leave the past in the past, You may own the flag but don't display it in public.

[@AnthonyD-yy2in]

It's really embarrassing that the old South African flag has a British flag on it. Who could ever forget that.

[@stlouisix3]

@@AnthonyD-yy2in the British Union Jack Flag is a beautiful Christian symbol☦️🇻🇦🏴󠁧󠁢󠁳󠁣󠁴󠁿🏴󠁧󠁢󠁥󠁮󠁧󠁿🇯🇪🇬🇬🇬🇪✝️

[@rijnvanessen7359]

@@stlouisix3 Iam also of British ancestry as well as Dutch.

[@malast657]

@@stlouisix3 Constantine legalised sunday worship due to his pagan rome believes. Leading to the dark ages and getting many Chrisitians killed. These whites must not under any circumstance claim anything relating to Christianity. Now they even paint Jesus white. Amen. We now see the light. Europeans colonised Christianity too, it needs to be decolonised if 1 is to view it from a legit angle

[@himeshmothi1605]

@@stlouisix3 a symbol that oversaw countless genocides ...beautifully indeed

[@Itsnotcomplicatedreally]

And yet it's the Zimbabweans that are the problem🤷🏿‍♀️

[@terrallll3068]

We need specially military operation here as well. Ezizinto zinukayo ziyasiqhela ngoku.how can we be bullied by less than 6 million people,while we 50 plus million

[@sibongilemgoduka8538]

Ngenxa yezizinto zisikhokelayo qhawe sithengiswa ngabo ngonongqawuse ...

[@lebogangdenis3777]

#Hashtag No to apartheid flag

[@africa1st737]

They must go home to Europe , this is simple !

[@MrRastafari01]

Do you see any Rhodesian flag flying across the border, wake up Azania wake up

[@mphojeanettemosala4360]

Are you afraid that they will Deport you and you won't see South Africa anymore!

[@daliwongabidi7681]

Sinyelwa ngoku

[@loverespecthumbleness7187]

There is only one way to get this right.....fighting one another the best we know...Amandla.

[@mzozukofuba29]

The same afrikaners who took Malema to court for singing struggle songs heee hayi south africans need to stat a u new struggle for our freedom coz this is not the freedom we deserve

[@annahkhechane5239]

True

[@dumisaninxumalo7574]

What was the meaning of the flag when it was use under the government of national unity in 1996?

[@Enoch940]

Relax, 99.99 % of white South Africans also don't want to see this flag arround. Most of us haven't seen one in many years and couldn't care less.

[@sidneynorde8626]

If that's the case ,why dont they voice their view of opposition? Why dont they speak out. If more whites will speak against racist whites. We will not have such court cases .

[@EugenevanWyk]

Speak for yourself commie

[@sandisonjova8053]

Black people relise now that ANC is the statue that that can't move to anywhere becouse is full of zombies

[@ivanmark9525]

They already have Orania. And now this??? What's next

[@tatane3243]

Weak Jesus shame Oppenheimer lawyer doesn't stand a chance arguing with black excellence SC Ngcukaitobi.

[@gordenmg4966]

Hw doesn't stand a chance at all 🤣🤣🤣

[@salieujallow9112]

afriforum must to be banned in South Africa

[@philshongwe8835]

Solution....ONE AFRICA

[@thabangmatobako4379]

AZAPO warned...the route towards a genuinely free South Africa is through pursuing an anti-racist approach rather than a non-racist one. Think again and always see virtue in AZAPO!!! Had we done so, such pursuits by Afriforum would have been criminalised

[@seanlawton1977]

Give them they flag its they history dont act like kids

[@dikeledijane8186]

Thet They are running mad not here maybe in their country of origin

[@seanlawton1977]

@@dikeledijane8186 moat of them born here you cant denie that you have to go back to the past and join your great grandfathers to do this ludicrous mind set you have

[@visionfhulufhelo8230]

They can display it in Europe not here

[@seanlawton1977]

@@visionfhulufhelo8230 they born in South Africa

[@eloisnaraidoo7339]

Every single white person does not belong to this country and the entire African continent. They are visitors, their forefathers came and colonize this country. South Africa and Africa belongs to the Koi and black Africans. There was never a reconciliation after Mandela came into power. It is time for every single black person in this country to do what Madiba never did, to put this white people in their place. We have to take every part of our land back from these people. Whether black people like it or not Julius is the answer to this problem. Time to stand behind Julius#EFF. The ANC regime failed our black people. We should NEVER EVER be victimise in our land. We must NEVER EVER allow these white people to disrespect us on our own land like this, they can take their flag with them overseas where they belong.

[@rockrabbit253]

Cry baby. People that are born and raised in a country , belong in that country.

[@julirose5078]

Wait tell me u are one of those that have khio/San ancestry. I just hate how some of u guys are always making a mockery of my ancestors. I've seen arab/white, indian/white asian/other mixcall themselves khoi/San descendents. And for your info majority of South African bantus have khoi/San ancestry. Is it just because the don't call themselves coloured that it's assumed otherwise!! All of us in this country needs to do ancestry test and be shocked!! 😎😎😎

[@rockrabbit253]

@@julirose5078 Most Afrikaners have a Khoi San ancestor. In the 1700's there weren't many white woman in SA so the white men in the Cape took wives from the local population.

[@EugenevanWyk]

Hello Racist

[@Macedonia270]

Get out while you can....If you cannot, be prepared to suffer....It is going to get much worse before it gets...even worse... Rwanda 2.0 is imminent.... BBBEE afraid....BBBEE very, very afraid....

[@tlawengmophosho4848]

Let them be them , Next stop hague, holland

[@sandisonjova8053]

If these people can choose who they want to be the president in this country there is no way that they can respect us.

[@sambanelly4219]

Mxm if they want to wave that flag of theirs then they should go to Orania.😤

[@lufunomulaudzi5228]

Can someone explain to me why do we still have Paul Kruger statue in so called New South Africa?

[@vume7722]

Ubuntu my brother, we will never be like the racist afriforum extremist right-wing group.

[@rockrabbit253]

Do you want to re-write history ? Why do we have a statue of mass murderer Shaka ?

[@kingelizabeth7361]

@@rockrabbit253 who did Shaka kill wena?

[@rockrabbit253]

@@kingelizabeth7361 You skipped history lessons at school but you can google it and catch up.

[@kingelizabeth7361]

@@rockrabbit253 I will never & ever again read those distorted facts fabricated to denigrate us people of peace from ancient times. We are waking generation that uphold to the history of pre-colonilism in Mapungubwe, The Moors & Maghreb when blacks ruled Europe for over 7 centuries, the history of Mansa Musa - the ever existed rich man in the world. Tell me about Timbuktu University, first in the world here in Africa. I'm learning about Muamar Gaddafi, Julius Malema, Thomas Sankara, Robert Mugabe. True version of Shaka history narrated by the likes of Vusamazulu (Reviving of Heaven). We are connecting the dots, now that the losers are scare. Rise Africa for the enemy is been defeated. No more lies ever

[@ntokozonzama2844]

Bayasibhedela laba manje kwakufane bahambe kwasekuqaleni

[@africa1st737]

BAYASINYELA LIVE !!!

[@willphillips2168]

As this case is going on, there is a coloured guy, im also, on tiktok displaying the flag with the stem. what happens in that case. i know if it was a white person there would be alot said.

[@julirose5078]

The person is probably doing it in support of u guys! 😎😎😎

[@mxhosamesiya5117]

You wil be kissed too u bushman

[@tinachikane1345]

There are many coloureds that associate themselves with whites rather than blacks.

[@portiamunkuli5902]

Nizoyilwela kanjani iflag yabelungu nishisa umuntu omnyama yizwe labelungu leli

[@japrosper1258]

You also here

[@trustingnobody628]

Black people have their own different countries where they are supposed to build into better countries. So it's totally wrong and disgusting to flood our country South Africa like cockroaches. We are busy in South Africa with our affairs and attempting to address them peacefully and in terms of our law. Meaning that foreign nationals must go back to their different countries and address their challenges and problems in their own ways.

[@mlungisishange3422]

Dakiwe nawe

[@nasir_esco]

Section 5 of the Constitution recognises the current flag and lists its colours, not the old flag (which the 1927 Act that brought about such flag was repealed in 1994)

[@africanqueen1655]

Afriforum can fly their Colonial Barbaric Flag in the Netherlands’s where they came from! You can’t wave your flag on Our Land that you were invited to! Viva EFF Viva! 🙏🏿🤴🏾👸🏾❤️

[@Sillylittleworld1]

They shouldn't fly it there either. It's like flying a swastika and I'm pretty sure that's illegal there, most European governments don't want racism there and punish it severely.

[@africanqueen1655]

@@Sillylittleworld1 They shouldn’t, but they are German’s right? 🧐😵‍💫

[@Sillylittleworld1]

The germans are very strict and people will probably beat you if you show a swastika there. The same should go for the apartheid flag, I'm glad it's illegal. Afriforum should be ashamed

[@africanqueen1655]

@@Sillylittleworld1 The Afrikaner’s are German’s right?

[@Sillylittleworld1]

@@africanqueen1655Mix of Dutch, French, English, Scottish, Irish, German, even Russian and Malaysians.

[@marblemaselo2540]

Afriforum must take their flag to their own Country

[@sinosaffer8015]

The flag predates apartheid and the banning of any image because it hurts someone's feels leads to the destruction of freespeech.

[@phelelanimafuleka3854]

How does it leads to destruction of freespeech? The banning of Apartheid flag?

[@Psciyentist]

It hurts the feelings of the majority and democracy tends to lean towards the majority.

[@thetad1242]

Hahaha free speech. You need to read a bit about the flag. It was English and Afrikaans people smoked a peace pipe at the expense of black people

[@molatelofelix7084]

This free speech thing has eyes. What's free speech for racists. A racist has nothing to do with people 's freedoms but he'll on earth.

[@sinosaffer8015]

@@phelelanimafuleka3854 Any limitation on the ability to express oneself is anti-free speech

[@sandisonjova8053]

I don't want to liar I still hava high hopes the spirity of our ancestors is with us the days of devil are over.

[@languageEnthusiast_sjm]

It's is just a flag.🏳 let them raise their flag , it's not killing anyone.

[@mlungisishange3422]

Dakiwe nawe

[@johnroach1101]

The flag is there Symbol of white supremacy, just like the southern flag of the usa