How Stoicism Became The World's Greatest Scam

[@Cheshirekat.]

people will do anything to not read a book, a free, public domain book.

[@quietprofessional4557]

Reading the original books is the only way to understand Stoicism. Seneca, Epictetus, and Aurelius.

[@ApertureThinking]

fr

[@dracula7779]

@@ApertureThinking side-note: at 48:16 in the video the person says they'll be leaving links on free sources of stoicism learning in the description. but sadly it was probably forgotten, i hope you'll add some if you had them saved. I'm personally using an audio book of Aurelius's meditations through youtube.

[@angelrosas6158]

@@dracula7779 Yes. Please provide.

[@Cheshirekat.]

(because putting links in youtube comments has its own system of problems) Google: Marcus Aurelius Meditations free online you can copy/paste what i just wrote. Also, it's actually pretty short, all things considered, you can read the whole-ass thing in under 5-7hrs

[@PugilPixels]

It kills me to see Stoicism butchered like this. It used to be about finding inner peace and strength, not this hustler bullshit we see today. The ancients taught us to look inward, to build character - now it's just feel-good quotes and "productivity hacks." What happened to actually growing as a person? I worry about folks buying into this watered-down crap, thinking it'll give their lives meaning. We've lost something real here, and it hurts.

[@blondequijote]

Doesn’t hurt me. Stoicism says don’t let that hurt you. The magical new religion of Tadaism says don’t just suck it up when you should be buuilding up something else. Harry Potter had to Live Free or Die from an early age and wasn’t always stoic about it, but he is victory over Voldmort won scholarships to a Hogwarts for all who believe in him like Good Wizard (G-d for short) believes in all of us and The Bill of Rights. Which brings me to another point. If the founding fathers were stoic and deemed kings an inevitability, there’d be no America.

[@nonyadamnbusiness9887]

@@blondequijote You obviously don't know stoicism.

[@blondequijote]

@@nonyadamnbusiness9887 Or I read that shit at like 14, thought I'm 14 and this is deep, went out in the real world, and eventually ran out of the energy to get pissed at everything so I guess stoicism really can be a trait as much as it is a philosophy. Maybe the power it has is unlike Buddhism, it doesn't try too hard to be profound.

[@idicula1979]

I couldn’t agree more.

[@idicula1979]

Stoicism is not some Fight Club bullshit.

[@justinevernera2418]

Thank you for the video! This was something I myself, as a woman, started to notice a year ago or so: mundane men on dating apps claiming they were interested in "philosophy" and, especially, "stoicism". Upon meeting them, it became obvious they are not much into reading books (can't blame them, I find it difficult to read philosophers as well), moreover, it seemed that their knowledge consisted solely of what they've read online. They were really into quoting some memes I had never heard of. So it seems you get this odd generation of 30-year olds building their world-view about just about everything (be it relationships, money, politics etc.) from Joe Rogan podcasts, rather than to focus on the small bits of reality going on around them. This is when I raised a private concern about stoicism being used as a tool to justify not receiving mental / relationships counselling. So once more, thank you! This clarifies a lot.

[@T-id8cs]

maybe you are the problem? you sound like youre shopping men and had far too many. its not that hard to get a man as a woman, there should be zero need for this shopping around youre doing. look in the mirror. the problem aint around you.

[@roveradamus]

​@@T-id8cslol your comprehension skills are worse than my toddlers

[@Itcouldbebunnies]

​@@T-id8cs "It's not that hard to get a man as a woman" I'm sure it isn't. *IF* women would be willing to settle for a shallow misogynist who refuses to do anything for them and who thinks wiping his bum will make him gay, that is.

[@jacobD643]

about when you said: "building their world-view about just about everything [...] from Joe Rogan podcasts, rather than to focus on the small bits of reality going on around them." isn't focusing on reality going on around us makes us biased to our perspective, or unaware of other people's problem because it's far from us? In which case, would be useful to have an outside perspective on things to have a better reach and see problems from different perspectives? I understand that by only looking at the world through some influencer's opinion such as Joe Rogan, we get biased from his perspective instead, but I'm not sure focusing on things that affects us is the best option either.

[@whatsupbudbud]

I'm guilty of consuming infotainment as much as the next guy but, indeed, this self-deception is getting out of control, especially since the results of politics are influenced by well spoken but dishonest or plain ignorant content creators. Who knows what the future holds but let's write today down because down the line all that's happening right now might just sound bizarre and unreal. Maybe someone will read in the future. :)

[@AaronCano-lm6xs]

“Waste no time arguing what a good man should be. Be one.”-Marcus Aurelius This philosophy is thousands of years old, we must keep it pure and true.

[@BlackJesus8463]

You do you.

[@LulJey]

That’s not even stoicism.. it’s just common sense.

[@LimboxBruv]

​@LulJey we have gained the ability to comprehend complexity for the ability to comprehend simplicity. Often we forget to factor is just common sense due to our nature of over complicating stuff and forgetting the simple but rudimentary ideas.

[@LucyTheGreat]

I kinda disagree? Things should evolve as society evolves, there's no way something from 1900 years ago will be as relevant today as it was before. So of course every idea should transform, and we should make mistakes and learn from them. It's just that we hear too many opinions now and get that Dunning-Kruger effect.

[@doornumb]

Real.

[@darth-gerry6659]

I think Marcus Aurelius would hate what stoicism has become

[@A3rdWorlderWhosBetterThanYou]

Stoicism hasn't changed, it's people like Tate selling their bs in the name of stoicism.

[@Crymeareva]

Aurelius stole stoicism from Buddhists

[@angleth]

@@Crymearevawhat? He didn’t even make stoicism himself, simply adopted it. Ignorance is bliss

[@momgo6533]

@@Crymearevahow does one "steal" a philosophy????

[@blackarot6295]

Stoicism is for dummies

[@lawcat65]

This was very interesting. I am vaguely aware of manosphere versions of stoic thought as these periodically appear in my YT stream, though I haven’t paid much attention to them. I’m an old lady, and not an “alpha” or particularly successful at anything; however, stoicism got me through a difficult time starting 20-odd years ago. I was losing everything in career and personal life and facing potential homelessness. Stoicism and Buddhism studies helped me to think through and discard some old values and focus on choosing a virtuous path and brought me peace regarding those events outside of my control. I learned simple living brought me contentedness. I did take an online course provided by Donald Robertson about a decade ago, which deepened my understanding and appreciation. I still have the course materials on my laptop and think I’ll revisit those.

[@jbizzle4922]

"He who is richest is content with least." Epictetus. Don't see any of these shills giving up their wealth and material pleasures to become richer in spirit, do you?

[@HexxuSz]

that would make no sense

[@ThatBalkanGuy.]

What's the point of giving up your money...💀

[@mugnuz]

@@ThatBalkanGuy. the point is not being rich but also not forcing and trafficing women to have and make content! uh sorry i mean to have a lot of content in your soul... uh i mean to be content without needing money. this is weird in english and im confused if andrew tate said epic-titties, socrates, seneca, democles, or plato or everyone said that!

[@stop8738]

@@mugnuzIf that’s the case why aren’t all the CEOs and owners of webcam companies in prison for trafficking?

[@mugnuz]

@@stop8738 isnt tate still in jail?!

[@Gullyfoyle2316]

They confuse stoicism with narcissism. That's all. Poor gnomes

[@alexanderbertisch1006]

Modern definition of narcissism is so out of proportion. Perhaps a dash of indifference is the way to a fulfilled life, and that is the essence of modern-day stoicism. The marketing is juat weird and maybe arguably wrong, but this whole video felt more like someone getting mad that his favourite underground band went mainstream, rather than a genuine concern for the rise of problematic values.

[@insensitive919]

Narcissism is also an abused word, tbh. The definition is pretty specific. Although it probably applies to a lot of celebrities, especially the grifting conservatives.

[@JENNerationX]

Exactly 😂

[@JENNerationX]

@@insensitive919When you experience it first hand you KNOW the difference.

[@REO_Speedweed]

@@insensitive919 Hassan Piker is the Andrew Tate of the left and the left has a lot more people like that. Not trying to shit-fling here, but I think the grifting modern leftists are a much better example of narcissists. Especially with their obsession with control, gaslighting, manipulation, and the fact that they're everything they accuse the right of being. Trusting a narcissist will only get you hurt no matter what political side you're on. They're both the same thing pretending to be the opposite.

[@ervinmiracle]

I'm gonna stand up for Ryan Holliday here - All the content I've seen from him does promote stoic values. That being said, I've never been to his store and never will.

[@edwinwise6751]

He strikes as way more sincere than 99% of influencers . His behavior suggests that he is a true believer and not a grifter

[@samsebastine1295]

Stoicism has intricate values, and depending on what you learn, it can turn you into a wise man, but when you go to a clown for information, don't be expecting anything but a circus.

[@sullyschwartz2365]

Yep. Had a coworker who talked about how he read meditations, was excited. He never actually talked about it much, though, but then he started Epictetus... only to not finish it. Instead, when I asked how it was going, he said he'd stopped and started reading one of those stereotypical "self-help, organize time, make people LIKE *YOU*!" 'succesful' people BS books. I think he, and many other people, buy translated versions meant for reading through quickly and with clarity. The points are simple. Concise. It makes it feel like a self-help book where you just think the statements to yourself on a surface level and never actually question what it means, what it says about your past actions, current views, and etc. Then he goes to Epictetus where he doesn't get a happy, easy reading and there's retorts that can raise questions that add to or challenge values that he and others never really thought on with reading Meditations.

[@samsebastine1295]

@sullyschwartz2365 Ye, I think that people should do their own research before getting into stoicism from some guy online. That goes with most information from the internet.

[@Deuce7Off]

No Stoicism has no scientific basis and that's why it's able to be sold as snake oil today. It's the anti thesis to our over technologized world. Every stoic points at Marcus Aurelius, a failed Roman emperor and ignores years of actual slow painful philosophical progress made by Kant, Schopenhaur, etc. Stoicism has been a step backwards for centuries.

[@penburger]

I don't think stoicism can be taught. It can only be mastered through practice. It's not about never smiling or being untouchable. It's about exercising patience and having self discipline. You may not laugh at every joke, you may not agree with what people say and a lot of the time you may have nothing to say. In order for this to work you need to ensure that when you do speak it's something valuable and thought provoking. There's an irony in this, I say you can't learn stoicism then attempt to teach it... I dunno. It's a state of mind, I'll leave it at that

[@ObtuseGoose2]

This a fantastic quote “when you go to a clown for information, don't be expecting anything but a circus.”

[@dantiel92]

For Tate, you need to show cars and luxury houses in order to show their success. For stoics, what makes you strong are things that build character, and don't build your life around having luxury houses because when you lose material things that were your goals in life, you lose your purpose.

[@Paugose]

Maybe it's a hot take, but Ultimate Warrior was way more stoic that Tate can ever hope? Tate is about "bngin' them bitches and making money and being sucesssful and shit" when Warrior would say "be sucessful in the way you define it, be it becoming a CEO or just having a mom and pops to make your family eat something at night, or just being happy with who you are, do the work of your life, and don't listen to the fears and doubts."

[@MultiSciGeek]

This is so true. Andrew Tate seems so insecure of himself, and bases his success... his whole identity, on material wealth that can easily be seized by Romanian police. Rationally speaking, this is a very poor investment indeed. And at the end of the day, who are you doing this for? For yourself or for the sake of others? Because if the only sense of purpose and validation comes from outside, that too at such a high cost, that's an issue. Imagine being as happy, as content, as driven, as satisfied as Tate is with his billion cars and mansions when going for a coffee. Now that's a real winner in life. Because ultimately - all of that will be gone. You won't live forever. And it's in that moment that you realize - you gotta live for yourself!

[@hiramcrespo734]

If he had studied Epicurus instead of Stoicism, Epicurus' Principal Doctrine 35 would've reminded him that if he breaks the law, he will never have true peace of mind. He broke the law and now has to deal with all the entanglements he created from that.

[@TorianTammas]

​@Paugose Stoicism has nothing to do with sucess

[@kresimirzex2720]

what is ur purpose now?

[@pynkfreud]

As a psychologist of 35+ years, I really appreciate this video. I have worked primarily with young men and see them struggling to find good dads, role models who encourage strength but also compassion. I would even say that CBT falls short as is revealed its name: Cognitive Behavioral. It leaves our Relational or Emotional. We are not thinking machines and should not try to be. So glad you presented the true essence of Stoicism.

[@uberLejoe]

I feel like CBT follows a lot of Stoic ideals, like thinking about the cause of your emotions and preparing yourself to deal with situations you may not like ahead of time. Do you think that's problematic because it's too analytical? A therapist friend of mine told me about the concepts of CBT and I thought it was really interesting because it was like some of the exercises Epictetus mentioned in his "Enchiridion". It also appears very standard. A lot of veteran friends of mine are going through CBT at the VA.

[@pynkfreud]

@@uberLejoe It's just that it's incomplete, as is seen in the name. CBT does not effectively treat PTSD (almost nothing does). Treating the body directly (somatic therapies, hallucinogens) and understanding that feelings precede and are more powerful than thoughts are crucial aspects of psychotherapy. Correct thinking is of course important but is best for mild to moderate disorders.

[@no-dogma]

Tate being a stoic is the joke of the century

[@RR_theproahole]

Bro has 0 self control, he's exact opposite of what a stoic is supposed to be

[@AliKhan04]

Yep he's no stoic

[@blondecaveman9100]

He just said he is Muslim the other day, the guy is just following trends lol

[@listoh]

No self control, too emotional when he speaks

[@prestoncuteherb3998]

😂 he's loud

[@kafikir]

I had already seen Hamza and Tate's Stoicism videos on KZbin. What I liked most about it was how the comments strongly disagreed with their understanding of Stoicism.

[@BlackJesus8463]

That must be why AT is a Muslim now.

[@revengance4149]

@@BlackJesus8463 incert "I don't want to play with you anymore" meme

[@Creym464]

I dont watch their video Well it different now compare to then after i read a begginer guide of stoicism and i see alot of fault but i digress and decide them as indifferent and possibly left

[@samsebastine1295]

I used to watch there videos at first it was good then a few weeks of those type of videos it's just the same information then he adds his own things about women and making money which are completely off topic from stoicism

[@Damesanglante]

He became muslim because there are lots of muslim customers and since they already are naive enough to beleive in fairy tales, they are naive enough for his sells.

[@connorhopson7024]

Aperture, I don’t know if you’ll ever see this, but I wanted to thank you. I watched your original video on stoicism about 3 years ago and it genuinely changed my life. My journey with stoicism started me down the path that led me to sobriety and a genuine passion for philosophy as a whole. I’m so grateful that it was you who introduced me to this philosophy for life instead of one of the many grifters you cover in this video. I too have noticed this trend in “broicism,” and the cringiness actually led me to reading a lot of existentialism, which is something that deeply resonated with me after my fiancé left a year ago. Philosophy has gotten me through many hard times these past few years, and you were the catalyst for all of that.

[@Dianimations_]

That's great man! congratulations on your sobriety!

[@akamatsuken]

Stoicism is about understanding and accepting our place in the universe. Stoicism is not meant to make you though, rich or popular, it is meant to make you happy with what you have in your reach.

[@Diamonddogusa]

I like how you explained stoicism. The word that comes to my mind reading that is 'acceptance'.

[@amazinggrapes3045]

Yeah, complacence.

[@xCestLaVie1]

I don't think anyone has thought of stoicism as a means to an end. It's intellectually dishonest to even imply that Tate or any other influencer has suggested this unless you only know them through BBC headlines and other clickbait news sources.

[@1ManNamedDan]

@@amazinggrapes3045 No it's objectivity and a calm recognition of what is and what isn't possible. Complacency requires no effort, thought or action, stoicism is a tool to recognize what is possible or how to make peace with that which is unacceptable for example I like all before me will die and remembering this I choose to enjoy the things and people in my life more and forgive flaws that make one overly critical and unhappy.

[@TorianTammas]

​@xCestLaVie1 Influencer sell products and market themselves. So they turn everything in a product they make money from.

[@michaelralph5472]

The problem in my opinion is that we have created such a consumeristic society. That is fueld by greed and fomo. That we neglect the internal/spiritual nature of stoicism and other schools of thought. We have put financial gains before anything of any actual value that we are willing to sacrifice the majority of our lives chasing a number on a screen. Or we whore out our virtue and dignity for a paycheck.

[@riaanvanniekerk1567]

Probably the best comment on here.

[@PieterJellesTroelstra60]

As a Trotskyist I can't agree more. The goal of today's ideology is to destroy hope. The capitalist machine seems to reproduce itself not only in the material reality, but also in our minds. It turns everything in a commercial product. Working class people can't control the means of production today. And the government is defending the capitalist systems. The only solution could be if the people work together to achieve the common goal.

[@Iuripiotrowskidarosa]

@@riaanvanniekerk1567 I second that

[@NovemberXXVII]

The only part I disagree with here is "We." The socioeconomic reality for the average guy consuming this content is so, so different from anything Zeno could've experienced as a well-situated person in a world with WAY less baseline wealth inequality. OG Stoicism really doesn't have an answer for large-scale social inequality because those largely ARE in our control. That's WHY a certain subset of dudes go wild for it: inequality isn't really a problem for them, so a philosophy that doesn't address it suits them *great*.

[@CMA418]

I found Stoocism by accident(or divine fate) long before it was cool or before social media.

[@afkwafflegamer7560]

Right before this amazing video, I was watching a video on how to kill emotions and all that nonsense because I've been very stressed out an emotional person. I am really glad I found your video because it really did, in fact, save me from the loop of broism. Thank you so much for this inspirational video.

[@Farmingforskills247]

For real, people need to start realising this. While stoicism is great, it's not everything. It's not "going into monk mode" all the time. Influencers these days created so much content related to that, that a great fraction of youngsters get obsessed with "grind" "stoicism" "monk mode". While all these started as great concepts as taken on Aperture's previous video's, now it's just honestly toxic.

[@samsebastine1295]

I would say some of it is toxic it but the core principles is helpful it's just that some people took advantage of it like the utuber hamza and many others who now sell a course about it and claiming you'll be financially free

[@Farmingforskills247]

@samsebastine1295 True. Anything to be taken for more than what it is will become toxic. Moderation is the key. But honestly, sometimes we need to enjoy the luxury of having to not think about anything and let our minds space out a little. All the grind, work, self improvement aside.

[@kshitijmehta876]

Ideology is not reality...its time we realize that.

[@GulagMoosefeller]

Stoicism has become toxic because some grifters are making money off of selling courses? Suckers are everywhere and millions of people desire direction. Virtue signal much?

[@gigazer]

I mean, any school of thought can be both valid and invalid, the problem is that not only people misinterpret it but they also try to use it as an answer to life. Which fundamentally it is never a good idea to follow a singular belief, but to extract different lessons from different sources to better your sense of self. Also, one of the four cardinal virtues of Stoicism is Temperance (Moderation), a simple fruit of information, nothing to change or add.

[@muhammadrazashahhash]

this always happends when an idea goes mainstream. this is usually the thing that kills a meme

[@noahduffin5492]

Very true

[@disgruntleddev]

This is so on point it hurts

[@mugnuz]

alternate title: "how capitalism became the world's biggest scam" sorry its always my invisible hand writing this!

[@brandonmiles3025]

Like "red pill"..

[@dimbe4122]

it with everything trendy. people use it to get money without believing gin the idea itself. plain greed, a vice.

[@tenkarabadger5244]

I think the Ryan Holiday criticism is a little harsh. Ryan continually encourages his followers to read and re-read the primary sources. He hammers home following the stoic virtues of courage, justice, temperance and wisdom. Lately, he has been speaking out against the corruption of Stoicism and the "bro-icism" movement. I actually did his "tame your temper" course and found the exercises useful. Is he trying to make a buck? Absolutely. Do I think the coins are dumb? Yep. But, on the whole, I think he is a net positive in the world. Now, excuse me while I do my Daily Stoic journal.

[@omerugurlu3403]

Well said man! I also get the monetization criticism, however I think he truly gets the essence of Stoicism. Often in his videos he tells his viewers to stop the video and do the real work or thinking instead. His way of marketing the philosophy may not be ideal, but he manages to get the attention of thousands of people towards an ancient philosophy, while openly criticizing the likes of Tate.

[@Kryptic_Karma]

I agree. I feel like this documentary makes it seem as though Ryan is a part of the manosphere and no different than the other "Stoics" he is 100% not like them at all. Lol I can honestly say when I was in the military, reading Ryan's books, Meditations , and books on Buddhist philosophy were so enlightening. This video acted like "The Obstacle is the Way " is a "Suck it up, pansy" type of book, but it really isn't. Lol

[@KJ-pu8dw]

Rather than listening to all the BS on the internet people just need to read Seneca, Marcus Aurelius and Epictitus.

[@TomiJedno]

no, thanks... Plotinus, Plato are far better

[@kyrerymmukk7446]

​@@TomiJednoit's not a contest. You can actually read things that contradict each other, or seem wildly unrelated and still draw your own conclusions.

[@TomiJedno]

@@kyrerymmukk7446 huh? whats the point of reading that book then? if you want to learn something learn from the best.

[@trannguyennamtrung5340]

​@@TomiJednothe best ??? You haven't even read it and already tell that someone is the best ? Dude you are a clown

[@craiginith]

@@TomiJedno What ideas/teachings make Plotinus and Plato far better? Why not broaden your knowledge and learn other perspectives?

[@glennrinehart3336]

Rule number 1, it's free. Stop wasting money on courses and all this nonsense.

[@Mick-f4e]

Which is the core of the scam, because these people push 'spending money on courses' as the ultimate investment in yourself.

[@sick1mind1]

"What is the colour of your chariot?" Marcus Aurelius, probably

[@Xenozillex]

Magenta Sublime

[@MrRigel_07]

Stoicism is about being successful by being content with one's each life, not being successful through overachieving.

[@rabidspatula1013]

Nailed it

[@sofuckinbrutal]

This is false. Stoicism is never been about pursuing success . This is modern misconception, abused by those, who makes money from it. In a nutshell ,Stoicism is all about ,form right judgment about things ,that moderation help reduce overwhelming passions ,it is also about, how to avoid not necessary suffering or if it inevitable, to face it gracefully . Not such pleasent representation set of idiaes for selling one of the most popular philosophies to young individuals to live by , isn't it?

[@inkubatorius]

yeah, except its coming from someone who achieved the highest office in the most powerful country at the time.

[@BernhardtBauer]

@@inkubatorius Does that mean only Roman emperors may implement stoicism in their lives? I do not see why the source of such ideals matter as far as implementation is concerned. The more one thinks about what you just said the less relevant it becomes to the topic.

[@Talisman23568]

I like aristotle's golden mean more. Balance is the universal constant

[@nomad1517]

I cant take anybody in their 20s-30s wearing a broccoli haircut and gold chain seriously giving me life advice.

[@TheEvolver311]

Then you have an issue with judging based on external appearance

[@DirtyMike124x]

​@@TheEvolver311🤣 care to refer us to any examples we might all benefit from? Or is it only IRL

[@spawel1]

@@TheEvolver311 at times to judge based on external appearance, a book by it's cover proves to be the most clear path. After all the appearance of a thing represents it in some capacity.

[@Egalitarianism_Secularism]

When a tall dread head speaks Ebonics and works towards your car you lock the door and try to get out of there TOO!!!

[@jonescity]

@@Egalitarianism_Secularism I have family who are both of those things yet they are college educated, successful in life and aren't freakin' gangsters...jeez.

[@JohnSilverHawkins]

The commercialisation and commodification of stoicism reminds me a lot of how the business world embraced Sun Tzu and The Art of War.

[@trakkaton]

What exactly didn't "the business world" (capitalism) "embrace"? Esoteric thinking? Meditation? Mindfulness? Greenwashing? Astroturfing? Activism? "Ethical conduct"? "Compliance"? Etc.?

[@leviadragon99]

@@trakkaton Aesthetics. Whenever superficial individuals co-opt philosophical frameworks, it is purely to borrow the appearance of importance, as such the result bears a closer resemblance to sophistry.

[@trakkaton]

@@leviadragon99 Is that honestly your try to give an answer? The business didn't embrace "aesthetics"? They don't buy up art to make their corporate centers more pretty? Or are you not even answering the question, and instead answer a question that wasn't even asked? Are you sure yu understand what the term "sophistry" means?

[@leviadragon99]

@@trakkaton Okay, allow me to clarify. Business culture embraced the *surface level aesthetics* of Sun Tzu's work, rather than its meaning, as such, them pretending that they possess greater intellectual or philosophical depths is indeed sophistry, a great deal of disingenuous waffle that signifies nothing.

[@trakkaton]

@@leviadragon99 That's besides my point and my question. And it's a bit like saying "making cola is all about the money these days." or "the politicians aren't REALLY looking out for my best interests.". And sophistry is a practice in which you try to defend a position that is not your own in order to understand the position of others.

[@andresaponte1164]

The only thing missing from this video was mentioning that many KZbin channels discussing Stoicism, in English as well as in Portuguese and Spanish, are made SOLELY and EXCLUSIVELY to access the KZbin Partner Program and generate revenue through AdSense. In fact, there are videos online that teach you step-by-step how to create these videos with Greek statues, and the owners of these channels copy each other’s ideas. That’s why it only works for those who execute the idea first; those who come after to make these videos end up with channels that have thousands of videos uploaded... but few views and subscribers. Excellent documentary, thank you for sharing.

[@eliseotorres2389]

Man stoicism literally save my life (Epictetus, Seneca, Marcus Aurelius, Musonius Rufus) and every time I heard this kind of of people using that philosophy to profit or hide their misogynistic thinking is just frustrating.

[@ckminty603]

why? if you understand "stoicism" you would realize that how others misconceive, misuse, or deliberately subvert the word "stoic" is not something you control. It's an external, thus original stoicism calls for one to be indifferent to it. This video is just clickbait with little relevance. There will always be con artists looking to exploit popular brands of anything. Unless it's something you own the patent on or bought the knockoff, why let yourself be unduly affected? This channel wants you to get emotional about something tangential so they get more clicks, not very stoic either.

[@frillsjane7753]

​@@ckminty603 what are you talking about? being indiffirent is just a small part of stoicism. And stoicism never invalidates your feelings. You can cry, wallow and be angry about but Stoicism promotes to not let those emotions occupy you the whole day and do the more important things as soon as you can. Stoicism doesnt promote being detached from your feelings, in fact it encourages acceptance and clarity. That for example, your brother made you angry because of a silly stuff he did to you, being angry - acceptance, but then you should start asking yourself is this worth getting mad about- clarity. That's how stoicism is. It's not being indifferent about everything and be 'oh I'm invincible nothing can hurt me' type of attitude. Especially the op has the right to be sad about this because it involves his values and the philosophy he cares about. From what I learn from Dichotomy of Control, the op cant indeed control others of how Stoicism is deemed right now but he has the right to defend or protect it as it is part of his belief system. Stoicism gives great emphasis on honing the correct values and virtues and be a good person than being indifferent.

[@Sakuna451]

@@ckminty603 Bro really has no idea what stoicism is about

[@Zack-xz1ph]

these people are not Stoics, they are hucksters and should be given no attention

[@rouvenbeland716]

​@@ckminty603 Did you actually read a book from Seneca oder Marc Aurel or just watched some youtube Videos to now be an expert? The goal of beeing a stoic is to become the "wise man". Not just endure everything without complaining...

[@vectorialforce3173]

Bros: stoicism is about suppressing your feelings Meanwhile Seneca: *writes an angry letter complaining about how noisy is the gym below his apartment*

[@joshlewis5065]

I am someone who tries to live a Stoic life. Stoicism is built on 4 principals: Courage, Temperance, Wisdom, and Justice. People like Andrew Tate really struggle with Temperance. Temperance involves self restraint, ake being chill. Andrew Tate has zero chill factor.

[@CodyPease]

I doubt justice matters to him.

[@redclover5460]

I thought those were the four cardinal virtues of Catholicism. I'm not too familiar with stoicism; is there a difference?

[@brownzoomer]

You know Tate was a kickboxer right? He has been in the ring and faced death many times. He had to have built an incredible fortitude of stoic character to achieve what he did

[@IainFrame]

Tate is just an obnoxious prick who has found a way to make lonely boys give their money to him. He's a pseudo-intellectual nerd and a complete fraudster.

[@adamschaller8847]

@@brownzoomer Have you ever heard him speak? The guy has no ability to control himself

[@nyutrig]

yea, this is dumb. tate is no stoic.

[@markusblatt7375]

​@@waynealan3067 Taken at face value, it could be. But is it actually the case? Would he still be the exact same without his money, his cars and his publicity? If so why did he acquire it in the first place when it should've made no difference?

[@JarinCOD]

yeah he is a muslim, lmao

[@williamkreth]

​@waynealan3067 Andrew taint is a total show boat that is not stoic at all

[@BlackJesus8463]

Hes not Stoic he's Muslim and you cant be both.

[@goodstuff6006]

​@@waynealan3067 his character says otherwise.

[@eddiem5713]

2:07 a chicken game ad played right after he said "the matrix has attacked me" and i think its so fitting

[@Mr.Showbiz]

Stoicism has been so badly co-opted now we have to put up with books with ridiculous titles like “Business God 2: Unlocking the Money Chakra” and “Principles of Money Grind: The Stoic Billionaire”

[@pantsonfire2216]

😂 Them book titles are insane

[@cherubin7th]

Chakra is Hinduism.

[@leightonpittman]

@@cherubin7th They'll steal from anything trendy for buzz words, combining things that have nothing to do with each other until you get an unrecognizable "philosophy" designed to promote the grindset paradigm

[@andrewwagner8939]

The issue I think is even darker. Most issues that stoic philosophy addresses are generally in line with the guidance a father provides. I think stoicism’s weaponization really targets men who have a less than ideal situation with their fathers. Stoicism is the bandaid on the bullet wound that is absent fathers.

[@cyanide_and_]

THIS. As a woman, I sensed that as I recently started listening to a KZbinr - read the comments and you'll even feel it through them.

[@treasurewuji8740]

Some of these folks target audience of Jordan peterson videos😂

[@spiritualanarchist8162]

That depends on the father. Ironically Aurelius was a father and a stoic philosopher.Just look how his son turned out ! LOL

[@andrewwagner8939]

@@treasurewuji8740 my room’s pretty clean 😉

[@Zack-xz1ph]

My father was never absent but I learned a lot from stoicism, and I often bring up aspects of stoicism with my dad to get his impression

[@edwintepuendikum3527]

Stoicism is just a tool. Stoicism changed my life during and after Covid 19 . It’s all about Perspective If you look at it positively, you get a positive result. If you look at it negatively, you get a negative outcome. I am a better person to myself and to the society. Because now I understand what is under my control and what I can’t control. It’s about the domestication of our Emotions, not about eliminating our emotions. We as humans have to understand and know how to control and manage our emotions correctly in order to live in a healthy society. It’s about being a good human being to yourself and to the society. We might not like the messenger, but the most important thing is the message. I do focus more on the message than the messenger. Thank you so much for sharing your thoughts on stoicism. 🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿🙏🏿

[@AbuOmar95]

Wholeheartedly agree. I appreciate what the video is trying to do , which I think is to demonstrate how stoicism was appropriated. However, there is one good way to look at this exploitive rise of stoicism. It helped a lot of men become more determined and more confident. It helped men overcome tragedies and hardships throughout life. I am also very wary of shitting on anything that helps men feel better.

[@gabe7109]

I first heard of the true Stoicism, and was able to use it to help overcome my anxiety. But now I don't believe I can share Stoicism with others because Broicism has become so mainstream, any time I try sharing it, this mockery of the practice prevents my messages from getting properly conveyed. It's genuinely frustrating.

[@SA-rb5xq]

Have you read Epictetus' Enchiridion?

[@Zen69967]

i have anxiety, too bro like I keep caring about what other thinks of me? What do I do?

[@blondequijote]

FFs all it is is “Is what it is” for ppl who actually might know some history. There’s not much profundity here and that’s actuallly the advantage it has over other life philosophies.

[@morodriguez2840]

I’m not a smart man but I’ve lived by a rule that has served me well throughout my life and that is if anyone is trying to sell you info, knowledge or anything that they claim can help you, It’s bullshit. don’t buy it. If someone truly wants to help you and those people around them then they will ask for nothing in return. No money. No favors. Nothing.

[@BillyJupiter]

While i understand what you trying to point out. There's a difference between altruïsm and integrity. 👍🏽✌🏽

[@williamkreth]

So you don't buy and read books ?

[@jakejanssen4319]

@@williamkreth I read books, but I pirate them lol, keep lining the publishing companies’ pockets

[@williamkreth]

@@jakejanssen4319 books are pretty cheap. I don't mind paying money to people who put in the work

[@davidcraig7771]

@@jakejanssen4319you’re okay being a thief?

[@lttrbox]

Love everything about this. This points the finger directly at why I am uneasy with some online sources on stoicism, and not with others. Highly recommend Pigliucci's books

[@guthrien]

This is a video that I almost can't believe didn't exist already; so timely and well done.

[@FlamingSwordOfWisdom108]

I’m a Buddhist. I’m not gonna hate people for trying to transform their minds through stoicism. The obstacle is the path. We come across this saying in Buddhism. We take our suffering on the path. We recognize suffering as an opportunity to strengthen our resolve and transform our mind. This intention creates the quality of perseverance in the mind. We moved from fearful to fearless. From apathetic to compassionate.

[@BlackJesus8463]

Soicism is Buddhism by another name and without the mistranslations.

[@dampking]

@@BlackJesus8463Its a lot closer to taoism

[@zenscape663]

@@BlackJesus8463 exactly they don't want to give credit where its due and plagiarize everything from the east

[@lawrencemalata1503]

@@FlamingSwordOfWisdom108 wonderfully said

[@adotheginger]

@@BlackJesus8463I don't care what it is As long as it's genuine guidance towards a much content and kinder innerself, it can be called whatever The real problem is people trying to make this "suffering" less suffering in their "path to understanding suffering" And that's just a diluted version of what you could get from that

[@lorenzogumier7646]

It's not stoicism ruining people. It's people ruining stoicism

[@404no57]

Nope

[@MorganEdgy]

@@404no57 yep

[@timothywheeler3517]

One thing I've observed for the past 50yrs...as long as humans are involved in any situation you'll find some kind/form of scamming going on.

[@blondequijote]

Stoicism says it’s inevitable. Guess you shouldn’t get angry and rip out those liars’ and grifters’ tongues, even though it would be less noise to filter out.

[@timfederwitz]

Oof... too true (and therefore slightly disappointing). Too many people are looking for the next big thing to capitalize on through scamming others.

[@windsoft4392]

Scams have been recorded since people could write like Ea-Nasir and his copper. There will always be people trying to abuse others, that's part of human existence. The only way of avoiding a scam is to be aware of it unfortunately.

[@josedelapinio]

Sad to see stoicismn being abused 😢

[@ApertureThinking]

yeah, agreed.

[@thephilosoterikos3789]

Ironical isn't it?

[@janycebrown4071]

I agree 😢

[@nathanielbables8652]

​@@ApertureThinkingthis is only temporary issue

[@ProjectExMachina]

It is natural

[@DetailTherapyPodcastYT]

When they say "being stoic", what they really mean is "being a psychopath".

[@VaxRabbit]

All I know is I discovered stoicism about five years ago. It appealed to me to deal with my regrets. I no longer have regrets. However my blessed mother passed and I attribute the philosophy to my strength and ability to accept what I couldn't change. I'm not offended by anyone else's use or misuse of it. I believe in any way it helps others is worth it.

[@unknownhehe3903]

I’m happy for you my fellow human you are doing great !

[@mbessle5102]

Happy to see a positive comment rather than the long list of ones that seem to be judging, which ironically doesn't seem very Stoic to me. I'm happy it helped you as it has been helping me. I hope others find the same strength and peace from it.

[@Deantrey]

​@@mbessle5102 I think sharing positive posts like this is important but I don't think it needs to be done from a place of disparaging those who are sharing their concerns with some of the stuff that passes for stoicism. I mean if stoicism is going to be more than just some empty platitude about being yourself or whatever than there's got to be something to get right or wrong about it. Which you tacitly acknowledge in your judgment that others are not being very stoic when they are judging other people (if this sounds self-contradictory that's the kind of webs you end up in when you cling to one principle dogmatically, though from my understanding that's not stoicism either). On this point, I think judgment is somewhere very close to the root of probably most of our problems but we can't really avoid it. And any philosophy that tells me that I should simply ignore the evils of this world is probably evil itself, since the only thing evil really requires of us as bystanders is that we ignore it, and if we manage to convince ourselves it is in fact the good, that's even better. So in sum, by all means share your positive experiences but don't look away from the problems of this world for they need tending to. That, at least it seems to me, is part of what it means to live a life of virtue.

[@beatindifuzoare7374]

Well, all that is nice and I'm glad it helped you. But the point here is that it is used as a tool for scammers to make money selling garbage packed as stoicism. Of course, this does not imply that anyone should dismiss stoicism, but I think it's useful to raise awareness about what stoicism is and what it is not

[@mouse9831]

​@@mbessle5102 actually, if something disturbs a community/public good, you are more than allowed to raise concern with it. Perfectly in line with stoicism

[@frankmossa6445]

Tate is far from stoic . A creep grifter definitely!

[@anelcatic6372]

Cope harder

[@BlackJesus8463]

The guy is 100% genuinely honest about everything he says.

[@farfaraway8738]

If someone is stoic, cannot be toxic lol ​@squibbelsmcjohnson

[@bhatkat]

Grifter? Suspect psychopath.

[@revengance4149]

@@farfaraway8738 op said "Tate is far from stoic [...]" squibbel said "He definetly is but he is also just toxic lol". The word "also" means that Tate is toxic AND NOT stoic which isn't contradicting your claim

[@ursinewarrior5573]

I'm so glad I came upon this video. The things you discussed in this video are the things that prompted me to write my own book on Stoicism (The 21st Century Stoic Primer). One of the biggest misunderstandings, or should I say oversights with modern Stoicism is that people only consider the ethics while disregarding the physics and the logic, both of which are equally as important for Stoicism. But overall, I think the biggest lie that's being perpetuated about Stoicism is that resilience is the chief virtue of Stoicism, even though it isn't. Prudence is.

[@Kiarakbm]

I hate that young men are being targeted by this "broicism" subculture. As a 25 yr old woman, I've noticed this ideology is very prevalent amongst guys my age that I've come across. I'm so glad this video popped up on my feed. Awesome work to you all.

[@matthewcaldwell8100]

@@Daxtonsphilosophy But I just bet you're not using your Buddhist beliefs as a marketing niche to tell people about the essential emptiness of the self. In fact you've probably trained yourself to suspect that recourse as one of the most insidious tricks of egoism.

[@Daxtonsphilosophy]

@@matthewcaldwell8100 I’m going to be honest I can’t tell if your being genuine or sarcastic but I’m gonna assume genuine. I make videos on this channel actually. I take people through my personal journey of self growth and that’s probably going to be the toughest challenge but just like Marcus Aurelius I’m gonna have to remain as I am now if I get big online. I don’t use any special effects or anything to give people quick dopamine. Infact my videos are quite boring and designed to give genuine insight and to be natural as to actually help people and not just get people addicted to listening about it but actually doing it

[@Daxtonsphilosophy]

@@matthewcaldwell8100 I’m very passionate about this lifestyle and it’s why I make videos because I wanted to make a career out of it but now I’ve come to the conclusion that success or no success makes no difference to me

[@HangrySaturn]

"Broicism" is the best term I've heard used to describe this. I'm gonna be using this term from now on.

[@TheStoicPath-t9r]

Absolutely, it's concerning how “broicism” can negatively impact young men. It's great to see more awareness around this issue. I often discuss similar topics and explore how media influences perceptions in my content. Keep spreading the awareness! Your insight is valuable.

[@lachlann4335]

I’m gonna say that although Stoicism is still great to practice, be careful who you get the information and motivation from. The teacher matters just as much as the teachings

[@BlackJesus8463]

I feel like that goes against everything Soicism stands for. hate is like taking poison and expecting the other person to die.

[@lachlann4335]

@@BlackJesus8463 Not necessarily. I believe one of the qualities of stoicism and philosophy in general is to question everything you are being told no matter where it comes from. If you don't have a filter for information, especially with misinformation spreading like wildfire in modern society, how can you be sure your opinions are your own and not someone else's? The whole point though I will admit is to be proven wrong so you can be a step closer to truth, so there's that.

[@thewhiteelephant]

Agree 100%. Ryan Holiday is the first one who comes to mind.

[@Tech_Reboot-3me]

Your channel is a hidden gem among the vast libraries of the internet. I was so intrigued by this video that I decided to read about western philosophy. Keep up the good work

[@BetwixtPhilosophy]

Completely agreed; I talk about the ancient philosophies including Stoicism and there's a lot of DMs that I get that have the wrong impression of what it actually is, which is unfortunate really. Things like, again, how to ignore emotion, how to have PURE and RAW discipline - which completely devoids the value Stoicism actually brings...

[@yeloautosports]

Everyone prefers to listen to an influencer or a famous person speak about a book rather than reading it themselves and allowing the philosophy to shape their worldview based on their own judgments. This is the real loss we face today with the overwhelming abundance of content. I’ll be the first to admit that I, too, fall prey to the algorithm, and it takes daily reminders to remain objective and think critically from an outside perspective. Marketing and ultimately capitalism are robbing us of independent thought every day.

[@Stoicismforsuccess86]

In modern life, every philosophy runs the risk of being distorted for profit, and Stoicism is no exception. The most disappointing aspect is that kindness, which lies at the core of this philosophy, is being exploited uncontrollably for monetary gain. Deep spiritual values have been commercialized, turning them into tools to attract wealth while forgetting their true meaning.

[@catalystcomet]

My introduction to stoicism was here on KZbin and at first it seemed like a pretty great thing, but I realized fairly quickly that they weren't actually teaching people how to master their emotions, only to mask them. I'm not a guy, but I lost my brother to suicide and I know that masking emotions is potentially a pretty big contributor to the suicide rate among men (along with societal expectations of usefulness resulting in men typically committing suicide around retirement age). Before too long I was able to find some channels that I felt weren't trying to tell people how to behave, but instead to teach them about different options, perspectives, stuff like that.

[@993LD]

Sorry to hear about your brother, my condolences. Happy to find you on a brighter side of the internet

[@SK-ny5ei]

I assume you mean Tate's brand of faux stoicism. The philosopher Seneca would have agreed with you completely. You cannot heal a wound by pretending you are not wounded. He had a rough period of two years, during which his father and son died, and he was banished from his city. When he got to a safe place, he started to write a letter to his mother, who was sharing this grief with him. "Dearest mother, I have often had the urge to console you and often restrained it. Many things have encouraged me to venture to do so. First, I thought I would be laying aside all my troubles when I had at least wiped away your tears, even if I could not stop them coming. Then, I did not doubt that I would have more power to raise you up if I had first risen myself… Staunching my own cut with my hand I was doing my best to crawl forward to bind up your wounds." He goes on to tell her not to ignore or distract herself from grief, as others would advise her, but to feel it deeply and talk with others about it. He may have been referencing Epictetus here, who advised his readers to write down what they were feeling daily. To reread and think about these feelings later, and to discuss them with others. He advises her to grieve deeply, but no more and no longer than she would wish them to grieve for her, had the situation been reversed. "In a spirit of boldness determine to conquer your grief, not to confine it." "All your sorrows have been wasted on you if you have not yet learned how to be wretched." "Why need we weep over parts of our life? the whole of it calls for tears: new miseries assail us before we have freed ourselves from the old ones. You, therefore, who allow them to trouble you to an unreasonable extent ought especially to restrain yourselves, and to muster all the powers of the human breast to combat your fears and your pains."

[@MrTapout180]

I studied stoicism for years and stoicism isn’t bad at all . But the the mainstream has turned into something else which is not stoic at all. I’m a Buddhist myself and the philosophies are quite similar and I embrace both philosophies.

[@ash31311]

I've often thought that karma and stoicism are essentially the same philosophy.

[@matthewcaldwell8100]

@@ash31311 They're not. Not remotely. They're almost diametrically opposed. Karma is an entire metaphysical system dedicated to apportioning the results of action. The Stoic cosmos has no such order or intricate concern with the intersection of self and world

[@abomaboi1088]

In an age of netflix docu-series that are stretched to the limit in length, a 50 minutes youtube documentary is really refreshing to watch. This was a great watch!

[@SaurianStudios1207]

When a fascinating, ancient philosophy like stoicism, turns from a school of thought that is designed to guide one’s life, actions, ethics, and inspire ideas (with deep historical, cultural, and spiritual context), into an influencer, money making, “all-about-me” scam that aims to prey on people’s vulnerabilities, hopes, insecurities, or miserable states, it ceases to be a philosophy. It becomes more of a trending topic than an exploration that could change one’s life.

[@Dinoslay]

“that aims to prey on people’s vulnerabilities” This right here is exactly why I really don’t like trends very much. They are something that only exists to commit it from a business standpoint.

[@majastaud9705]

Breathing in and out trying to be upper case Stoic™ while watching the ads remembering it's the way to support you for making those AWESOME videos. Honestly, I've always felt so off about how Stoicism was handled but now i feel so validated, like you put the general feeling into actual words

[@bloodlove93]

if you legitimately wish to learn of any philosophy... read the original books, then perhaps not newest but newer from decades ago from similar authors or people who assessed it, at "worst" listen to audio books or ones like......fml i hate my memory, something sawyer,he did art of war and seven military classics of ancient china with his own modern context notes...ralph i wanna say, he's actually gotten hands on with many of the far eastern documents and war philosophy original writings and inspected them for error to make sure it's an accurate translation. screw KZbin, tiktok and the like for taking over primary learning basically.

[@cookieanddabutt2843]

That's not how they make money. It's through sponsorship and merchandising. That's a untruth they spread to get just those things. Google gets paid not them. They know and play along. "Get ready to buy".

[@ApertureThinking]

Thanks a lot

[@a.common.American]

The first man I met who truly embodies Stoicism is my current COO. He's a multi-millionaire who wears a normal watch and drives a used jeep cherokee. He parks where we park, his executive assistants aren't abused as personal assistants, and he respects everyone equally from the brand new 18 year old on the sales floor to the high level directors and executives. I've seen him cool as a cucumber amidst business critical issues.

[@HakuYuki001]

So stoicism is mere presentation then. Wow, he rich but don't act rich. What a great guy. Ok Bateman.

[@iloveowls8748]

Respects everyone equally, but take all the money for himself instead of paying his workers proper salaries. I hate this type of romanticising of the "benevolent CEO" type.

[@bsmlbn]

​@@HakuYuki001 well damn 😂😂😂

[@spawel1]

Remember to thank him for his service

[@a.common.American]

@@HakuYuki001 Shallow thought, consider thinking more on it.

[@FlamingSwordOfWisdom108]

Depth of knowledge is the purpose. You go deeper by practicing every day for the rest of your life. You can’t obtain realizations in seven days…

[@BlackJesus8463]

Epiphany comes in an instant. ✌

[@nasratnasrallah7421]

7 days can mean more than a year in uni

[@dbarker7794]

7 seconds can mean more than a decade in post-grad.​@@nasratnasrallah7421

[@dys699]

If you’re someone who’s worried about how this philosophy is being misconstrued on the internet; just don’t watch any videos related to the topic. Read the books only, you can even read from other schools of thought and contemplate on them yourself. All the videos we see on the internet will just make it feel watered down. At the end of the day, it’s you who will prove if the philosophy works for you by way of practice, not just reading it and agreeing if you find a nice sounding quote but actually applying the wisdom into your life. Once you have done that, you’ll find no need to search any where else but the books and your own perceptions. As Epictetus said: “if you are ever tempted to look for outside approval, realize that you have comprised your integrity. If you need a witness, be your own.”

[@StoicCoffee]

Thank you for this video. I knew that some aspects of Stoicism had been co-opted by some unsavory characters in the "bro" arena, but had no idea how deep it went (mostly because I don't really follow those kind of people). I've been studying Stoicism (big S) for the last nine years, and podcasting about it for the last 7, after hearing about it from Tim Ferriss. Luckily my first intro was A Guide to the Good Life by William Irvine, which is a great primer for Stoicism. It's amazing to see how they've twisted what had been such a life changing philosophy for me personally into something that is almost the complete opposite. Stoicism is about character. It's about wisdom, courage, compassion, and self-discipline. It's about how to face life's challenges in a healthier way and to be a good person in any circumstances. I'm glad to see this video doing well to combat the ignorance and misuse of a philosophy that has the power to really change lives for the better.

[@Torttelini1]

Glad to see a comment from you here.I follow your podcast from time to time and have learned many things. It was a great gateway to open my curiosity looking into Seneca and Marcus Aurelius whileI comparing their similarities with some of my shallow understanding of the concept of Buddhism and acceptance I learned through psychotherapy. Cheers.

[@StoicCoffee]

@@Torttelini1 Yes! I found the Stoicism and Buddhism seem to be cousins. Learning Stoicism helped me to understand some Buddhist concepts that I didn't quite get before. Keep up the work!

[@Torttelini1]

@@StoicCoffee Will do :)

[@Lianne-issa]

This gets a huge thumbs up from me. I’m female and I loved stoicism before it was co-opted. I’m glad you’ve labelled this disingenuous offshoot as broicism! It needs its own label!

[@SooDamGood]

It’s still as useful as it always was, you just have to go into the true meaning of Stoicism and not the modern version of it.

[@bloodlove93]

never loved or hated it, just eventually realized i had always been that way and apparently it had a definition... guess how often i did that throughout life...don't guess i lost count long ago. remember 9/11? i do feel the same now as then, blinked,happened, people did stuff. ohh pretty fire that's my summary of the day,remember watching on tv that morning, almost 8,by that time I'd actually oddly enough physically built a computer by myself... blame my dad for ordering it,leaving it out and trusting a 7yr old...I'm just surprised i plugged everything in right and didn't break anything.... obviously had to wait for dad to actually power it on and put programs in it, i just stuffed the case and plugged in cables...somehow correctly,which is weird because can't exactly say i ever felt particularly smart, but tbh i did find most people rather stupid...so idfk what's with that but hey that's decades ago,this is now.

[@lyndsay80]

Yeah, broicism is just another word for misogyny, plain and simple. That's the only label it deserves.

[@michaeloshea5505]

drink your water from a clean well, you need to make sure the water from your well is clean and uncontaminated. Many people assume that because their water comes from a well or a spring, it is safe to drink. But this is not necessarily the case.

[@marikothecheetah9342]

I enjoyed your video, but please refrain from mixing rapidly moving images or distorted ones - they are very heavy on sight and when you break them with still frames of commentators it hits double. Regarding merit - great job. We need more videos like this.

[@makiav3li10]

Great video. I actually started my stoic readings with Marcus Aurelius' "Meditations" - it's a great book, but it definitely needs some contextualisation to truly get good value from it. So I guess Ryan Holiday's writings (not merchandise) would be helpful with this. Mark Manson said something quite interesting, along the lines of: self-help hasn't really changed in the last 2000 years, only its packaging.

[@denyingdestruction]

The amount of "life hack" ads that I have had to skip through just trying to listen to this video, is beyond ironic.

[@Yessssstttt]

I have ordered lots of books related to Stoic philosophy like ego is the enemy, the obstacle is the way, the daily Stoic,letters from a Stoic and the manual. That's why I'm interested in this video. Let's see !

[@dsmyify]

Those Stoic books are considered business books. Nothing wrong with that; but they are not philosophical.

[@girlofdragon1973]

@@dsmyify They are still rootet in philosophy and largly use philosophers as reference. I believe that makes them philosophical even if less than others or just in a different light.

[@fernandoa589]

Read Epictetus Discourses. I suggest Robin Waterfield’s translation.

[@insiderperson18279]

There are better authors than Ryan Holiday, he doesn't follow what he preaches

[@girlofdragon1973]

@@insiderperson18279 I havent really looked into him, but I think the teachings can be considered on its own. No one is perfect and 100% consistent. I also havent looked much into other authors either tho, so keep that in mind. Can you recommend me some?

[@maximiliangonzalez3915]

The funny thing about the contrast of Stoicism with other philosophies/traditions like Buddhism and Taoism is that they have sooooo much in common

[@JJoy225]

If you don’t engage in critical thinking or try to live by a truly individual philosophy, this is what you get- following “strong men” scammers, new “religions”, etc.

[@3k9k]

This guy gets it

[@MikeListens-g6u]

Tate being a stoic, a christian and a muslim is an actual joke of the century lol.

[@tmadden4951]

Just be a good person (golden rule) no stoicism necessary

[@sumedhhhh]

Feels bad to see what they did to stoicism, absolutely depressing. Thank you for exposing this pretentious trend

[@justsomejojo]

This video reminded me of my early 20s. I was just starting to go into therapy for the first time to fix my bad temper and of course, I tried to some work on my own too. In addition, I had had some bad experiences with women (a really bad feminism class that was more about putting down one gender and a failed relationship). This resulted in me getting pulled into the men self help side of the KZbin algorithm. MRA, MGTOW and (though I didn't know the term at the time) the alt-right. The reason I started and kept watching was because a lot of it seemed healthy and reasonable - being okay with being alone (the MGTOW part, and honestly something that still has some valid points when it's not immediately followed by misogyny), becoming more okay with yourself (this was usually the part where working out came in, because this part usually was more bettering yourself than being okay with who you are in hindsight) and also stoicism. I was really hoping to fix myself, to shed the explosive anger that sometimes would just burst out after enduring enough bad stuff. Suffice to say, it didn't really help. I did mellow out as my life got better and I got to talk through some stuff in therapy, but the bottling up feelings part that leads to my anger - the stuff I thought stoicism could fix - stayed. The kinda depressing thing is that this weird "no emotions" thing didn't actually come from Broicism for me; it was passed down. My father, who learned it from his father, would always shut me up when I was crying or got angry at something or my situation (born disabled). As I know it, that stuff isn't even broicism, it's part of some really outdated (my father is 65 now) image of manliness. It's a shame that if you try to look up stoicism, you get pulled into this maelstrom of unhelpful content. I'm still coming to terms with some of the shit I internalized back then and it's been almost 10 years.

[@kahshah8360]

May God restore you and bless you with the knowledge of Him

[@BProductionServices]

Wowwwwwww. Amazing Video. Like literally life-changing. One hour long, but honestly, I would have liked it to be even longer, mostly the part of the comparisson between "stoicism" and being "stoic" but amaizing Video, you've just gained a new subscriber

[@land3021]

My annoyance at how outdated and normie'ish and counter-meme-culture the term stoicism was, is what saved me from this scam tbh.

[@BlackJesus8463]

Its buddhism bruh (and gold buddhas are neat)

[@briancomforti3890]

Aurelius could have never predicted how g*y the future was going to be

[@ivankatsaklidis1192]

​@@briancomforti3890look up pederastry in ancient Greece and Rome 😂😂😂😂

[@samsebastine1295]

😂 ​@@briancomforti3890

[@mugnuz]

@@BlackJesus8463 christ! that makes absolutely no zen! and i prefer silver or even more preferably platinum ones!

[@christiiesudiscipulus3192]

Aperture, you are certainly an interesting case. I've watched your videos for the past three years now, and I watched as you dove deeper and deeper into the rabbit hole of stoicism as I have to Christianity. It has been interesting to watch you from a distance as you went from covering the topic to following the philosophy and now defending it as it has become 'oversaturated' by false doctrines. In much the same way, I have travelled from Protestantism to Orthodoxy and Catholicism.

[@tristanregincos1735]

I'm curious, but what makes you change your mind about protestantism to Orthodoxy and Catholicism ?

[@christiiesudiscipulus3192]

@@tristanregincos1735 Personally, it was a mix of both personal experience, what I would argue as a divine call, and general theological disputes. I could go more into depth at a later date, if you'd like.

[@tristanregincos1735]

​@@christiiesudiscipulus3192 If that don't bother you I really want to know the profound reasons why - and it is not a problem if you write a lot, I love reading.

[@christiiesudiscipulus3192]

​@@tristanregincos1735 Of course not! I have my reasons, of course, that I will get to shortly. It's a pretty inexplicable thing, to be honest- from an outside view it just seemed like a natural progression, and in many ways it was. I went to a Lutheran church for a while, and when their theology clashed with the theology I had developed (which is inclined towards saintly prayers, mysteries, and inquiries) I became dissatisfied with it and went on to dive headfirst into the old rites. Currently, I'm in the process of learning about becoming a catechumen at a Catholic church nearby, and what all I would need to do so that I could pull this off effectively. This much has been surface-level, though. The church I grew (up) in stopped existing. As for my personal issues, they are as follows: For the first part, the many people who made that church what it was to me left over the span of about two years. Just a few at first; some volunteers for our youth group moved away, some people on the tech side had to take Sunday shifts, etc. Our Chilean translator and friend who came to visit us had to go home on their visa, things like that. Then, some personal issues occurred, and they hit me hard. I won't say what happened, but a dramatic shift happened because somebody near the top of the chain overreacted to a problem of mine and I was sent to a local institution for a few days. I wasn't mentally ill, at least not prior. I struggled with purpose and doubts and I had a really tough week. I still remember that cursed place I was sent to. I didn't go back to church for a few months after that. Several months later, I was invited back by the automatic notification which brought me to go on a church retreat called CIY which I grew particularly fond of. The speakers were great, the food was great, and it all took place on a college campus a few hours away from me. I reconnected with my friends who I hadn't seen for a solid few months, laughed, and generally forgot about my experiences prior. I thought that a bad thing happened for the sake of good, and a solid year of good times and events passed there. I volunteered almost a hundred hours of my time- maybe more, helping develop and bolster a healthy, growing community. I made some of the best friends I've ever had from it. All was good for about two years. We went on the trip again, and it was a great time; we had several youth events come and go, the number of students was thriving, and then the school year was finally out. Two weeks later, our youth director was no longer working at our church. He wasn't dismissed dishonorably, and nothing major had happened outright, he had just taken a new job as a Hospital Chaplain. At that point, the culture of the church shifted. It lost that key figure who held operations together. I see now in retrospect how much stress this placed on his shoulders, keeping an entire portion of our church on his back while balancing family and work. it was probably too much for him to handle for much longer, but we didn't know that when we stayed half an hour late every day talking about our lives with him. He was like our confession booth, councilor, best friend, and mentor all in one. He wasn't the only person with this much stress on his shoulders, but when he left things went downhill rapidly. That CIY trip I mentioned earlier went terribly this year. My roommate woke me up at 4:30 every morning, since his work alarm was then and he refused to turn it off because 'he might forget it' after. I am of the belief that he was in need of mental services and they were not provided; his demeanor was very childish and he was very unwise to the ways of the world while going into his senior year of high school at home. The speakers were (by what I would consider Scriptural Canon) heretical at times, the quality of the service was poor, there was blatant sexism against the young men at the retreat, and deliberately poor communication by the leadership that took over after. I had to spend two hours speaking with the head pastor during the retreat about how preposterous the situation was, and even still little to nothing was done. During this period, I began praying the Rosary, and it was the only solace I got during the period. My best friend, who didn't attend the trip due to his ankle injury, spoke to me about Catholicism several times over the past few months. I reached out to him and he recommended that I look into it. He was born and raised Catholic, but came to this church because of the people who were there. It was during this period that I got the idea that Protestantism isn't for me- it just doesn't work. While praying the Rosary, I imagined a glass pane that split down the middle a long time ago, (symbolizing East and Western Christianity), and each new church that came out of them splitting off into microscopic grains of silica glass- sand. It isn't the best analogy, but I can explain it better. As for the theological reasons behind it, I have to take a step back and discuss why I became interested in Catholicism- memes. I was introduced to funny symbols of John Ward from FAITH: The Unholy Trinity and they clicked with me in some inexplicable and divine way. I learnt what the rosary was, how to pray it, how to pray with saints, how to pray with icons, etc. all from the internet. I am currently that epitome of 'internet tradcath" or "internet Orthobro" because of it. Of course, my inquiries were deeper than just the memes, and I did actual research because of them. I learnt about the Creeds (which we did not explain at my old church), old Christian theology, traditions, eucharistic miracles, et cetera. I learned to practice fasting back in February around the beginning of Lent and during St. Valentine's Day, among many other things. Something within me changed when I discovered an old 90's zine called "Death To The World: The Last True Rebellion." It's a Roman Orthodox Church-sponsored zine that was overseen by some interesting figures, such as Seraphim Rose and a large lot of former punk rockers and gangsters from California. They all converted to Orthodoxy. Why? I'd ask you to Watch Harmony 's video of the namesake and discover so yourself- it's a tear-wrenching experience. As for the God-calling experience, I have shared with you my testimony. My heart was not satiated by the ways of this earthly unity. I was called to something greater. The first Catholic Mass I went to brought me to ecstatic joy, and I felt at home as if a warm blanket had descended upon the could shoulders of my soul. The week after, I went to an Orthodox Mass and wept tears of joy and wonder peering up at the icons that adorned the walls, ceiling, columns, and altar of the church. In both places, I felt closer to God than I ever had in the old church. I cannot use this as a good pillar of my argument, but the spirit of an old church is simply stronger. I felt more at peace in the heritage chapel at my old church than I ever did in the new contemporary hall. I most certainly enjoyed my time there in that new basketball-court-turned-chapel, but it was like you would enjoy a concert with its flashing lights, smoke machines, guitars, drums, and keys. Such things make a man celebrate earthliness, such things are not fit for praising God. Music is its own thing- I dislike three points, so here's one more: The music that is sang (or played) at a church defines the tone of its service. If a church degrades itself, denies itself its sacred nature, can it be called a House of God? For a Protestant church, we sang songs about things that we do in relation to God, not chant hymns of what God has already done for us and what God is going to do for us and to us. There is no goodness in self-worship, there is no God in selfish behavior. We take the time out of our Sunday mornings to Praise our Creator and rest in his presence, not party and celebrate folly! I lost my faith in protestantism because I felt like the church I was home to was blowing away in the wind. Like I had hold of it, and it ran out between my fingers like sand. What is Protestantism built off of but a man's interpretation of the scriptures? Have we not proven, conclusively, time and time again through countless wars and Councils and Creeds that such is a dangerous thing? There are centuries of bloodshed spilled for the sake of these arguments of theology gone so freakishly wrong. It's a dangerous thing to give the layman a bible and say "figure it out on your own." By the time they finish Genesis, they may well have convinced themselves to be an Israelite, and we all know the consequences of poor descriptions of baptisms as they have been transliterated over many languages. By no means am I saying that disagreeing is bad, but I am saying that there is a definitive truth and there is a distortion of the truth. Whichever a man pursues is how he will live his life. Will he be disillusioned by the broken ways of the world, or enticed by the ebbs and flows of time? More can be said, but such would be tedious. May peace be with you brother, and may the Saints and the Spirit guide you on your journeys wherever they may take you.

[@tristanregincos1735]

@@christiiesudiscipulus3192 Thank you so much for sharing your experience, and I apologize if it brought back painful memories. Your comment has helped me learn a lot more about Christianity and Catholicism, and I will continue to explore these topics further. I can sense that the Holy Spirit is with you, and through you, it has brought me enlightenment. May the peace of the LORD Christ be with you, my dear friend, and always remember that the Spirit will be with you in times of trouble. God bless you, your family and friends, and your church community with His wisdom and truth: Into the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit, Amen.

[@deathmagneto-soy]

Fascinating. I had no idea there was so much to stoicism. I'll be checking out some Seneca, Epictetus and Aurelius next time I'm at the library. Thanks for the video.

[@spacevox2584]

Interesting how you have this title for a video while also having video's like ''Stoicism: Become Undefeatable'' ''Master Stoicism in 60 Minutes'' and ''Stoicism: Conquer Your Resolutions''

[@ApertureThinking]

You will have to watch to find out how 🤞

[@anemonana428]

One thing is one thing, and the other thing is other thing. -cochiloco

[@tombyrne1637]

This video is going to be about fake stoics like tate

[@Justin88800]

​@@tombyrne1637Add Ryan Holiday to that list, although he's not anywhere near as cringe

[@sys_key3287]

Why is he fake? He seems good to me ​@@Justin88800

[@oscarvel9189]

This is the tragedy of any belief system, unfortunately. That's why there are like hundreds of Christian denominations out there, including things like the prosperity gospel and fatalistic accounts of free will. And Christianity, of course, is but one popular example among many.

[@Stevie_tha_tooth]

This is a great video. I really appreciate your attention to detail and I found on my own journey; many of the things you’ve pointed out. Thanks for your insight and thank you to your team for all their efforts.

[@solitajre222]

Like all things that become popular, it gets monetized, diluted, misconstrued, perverted and left ruined and forgotten.

[@IzunaSlap]

Stoicism if it was purchased by Disney

[@Lara-xu3yc]

Ok but wasn't it just recently that archeologists came to realise that Marcus Aurelius wasn't the only author of his book Meditations? His philosopher/slave was responsible for many of the teachings.

[@LC-wv7tz]

Man I never knew this was happening, but it makes so much sense. Im a 32 year old man, I became interested in Stoicism almost 20 years ago. I was interested in philosphy in middle and high school. I studied Latin for 5 years in high school and was into Aurelius, Camus, and Wittgenstein. Lately I've seen people I wouldnt have expected mention Marcus Aurelius to me. I thought "good for them for reading more." The fact its become a toxic social media trend makes so much sense with what ive observed and im so saddened to see authors ive found so moving misused in such a way. Ive been on a Thoreau kick this year. I wonder if theyll come for the transcendentalists next.

[@whatwhat9519]

0:10 the direct "translated" txt

[@DanielChardMagic]

All these people don’t understand what stoicism is. They only quote being “stoic” as a virtuous mode of living. And I love stoicism, however it’s a great philosophy and very helpful, but all you need is Marcus Aurelius, Seneca and Epictetus. Some of Ryan’s holidays books are very good supplementations as well. The original texts are the best however :)

[@CodyPease]

are they free? my life currently isn't going well and i don't want to go to these self help channels.

[@Beedle0511]

I have avoided this channel for a while, because KZbin has been recommending me videos about Stoicism, and I'm so sick of the Broicism on the internet. Glad I caved and discovered this channel.

[@ciprianturta2757]

Stoicism tends to give in to the status-quo because in focusing on what is in your control assumes that you already know what is in your control and that assumption typically is fed by the ideological landscape you find yourself in (ex. Capitalism, misoginism, racism, homophobia, etc.). This assumption stops you from facing the creative openness of your situation and advancement in finding out the domains you have control over that you prior thought you hadn't. Stoicism is a conservatory doctrine; it makes you cope with your condition in the world and not seeing that you have influence socially to change and to oppose to the status-quo. So, either you are a slave, or a roman emperor on the battlefield, or a lonely misogynist that is afraid of women, and you accept your condition as not in your control. Some situations demand for such acceptance, but the thought of changing the world you live in with other like-minded people can as much harden you to endure the harsh condition knowing they are harsh and unjust and plotting to change them. Moreover, as Hegel put it in PS, stoicism is the avatar of self-consciousness that sees itself in the form of their thought common in the exterior object. But the stoic misses that which is uncommon (alien) between itself and life and remains just in abstract thought, detached but implicitly an accomplice to the unjustness of the world.

[@AndrewBurrow-albcorp]

Beautifully explained, and also explanatory of why Stoicism is attractive during times in which collective action feels unworkable, such as the Roman times or present late capitalism

[@ciprianturta2757]

@@AndrewBurrow-albcorp Thank you for the acknowledgement! Indeed! Stoicism could be a sign for the approaching fall of an empire

[@bigboi9289]

Awesome documentary bro your insight is definitely needed 👌🏾

[@nathanielbables8652]

He should do this professionally

[@samsonbyte]

I appreciate this video and the effort put into it. I appreciate your perspective on Ryan Holiday, but I consider Ego Is the Enemy an excellent introduction for anyone new to Stoicism. Stoicism is a way of life and mind that is absorbed rather than studied as theoretical philosophy. Stories are the best way to convey the core principles, and Ryan does a fantastic job. I don’t find anything misleading in his books, but I’m open to specific examples if anyone has any for me to consider.

[@ryan99842]

the fact that nobody talks aobut Unveiling Your Hidden Potential by Bruce Thornwood speaks volumes about how people are stuck in trance

[@Dezron]

lol like botted

[@DarkAim]

bot comment dont buy this book

[@unune9069]

Cult bot

[@Zlotyi-7]

Ya remember the 13 apostoles? They were a cult. ​@@unune9069

[@adithya444]

How to know if it's a bot?

[@gyges5495]

Read Seneca, Epictetus, Marcus Aurelius and Cato’s life - they all want you to pursue virtue and virtue isn’t gaining wealth, women or masculinity

[@johnt.mickevich2772]

I wouldn't put Ryan Holliday in the category with many of the people in the "broicism" camp,

[@ppapdddar6159]

[21:58] This is *EXACTLY* the the people I envision doing this video.

[@Utomiyaaa]

💀🙏🏻

[@conwaylai8562]

I didn't even knew stocism was a fab. I had picked up Meditations from a random video, and picked from there. Just read the book, avoid the social networks hypes.

[@lordaeon5636]

Tate encouraging stoicism is like Johnny Sins encouraging chastity

[@ionutcristian9650]

Scams and Tate go hand in hand so you got that right so far.

[@BlackJesus8463]

Sue him then if you got scammed.

[@ionutcristian9650]

@@BlackJesus8463 I didn't. He openly said on interviews that he scammed people. He was proud of it.

[@Youtube9048wjd]

Well from a business pov hes just exploiting a loophole

[@ionutcristian9650]

@@KZbin9048wjd 🤦

[@ionutcristian9650]

​@@KZbin9048wjd🤦

[@stefano8936]

video be like "Mum, they makin money with my idea!" Mum: "that is not your idea, my dear"

[@Marta-zm8oe]

They confuse stoicism with being emotionless/ emotionally detached and lacking empathy