NOOB'S GUIDE to MENELAUS | A TOTAL WAR SAGA: Troy

[@RicardoAlmeidatm]

I did not know Menelaus personally recovered Patroclus' body. Such a bro move for his buddy

[@BarokaiRein]

That part of the story is why some people assume that the pasquino group statue is Menelaus carrying the corpse of Patroclus. There are a lot of theories as to who tge statue depicts including Heracles. However it's more commonly accepted that at least the roman copies depict Ajax and Achilles. The original statue is so broken that the roman copies are what people mostly study.

[@RicardoAlmeidatm]

@@BarokaiRein Cool, I will look that up. Thanx for the info

[@ufukozdes2226]

As far as i remember, it was also Menelaus to shout at Achaeans something like "how could you forget the way Patroklos behaved you when he is alive, as he feed you and offer you wine." etc etc. Cant remember exactly what he said but i remember he fired up the Greeks on that chapter of Iliad.

[@AkatsukiBoss13]

You know it's rather sad that modern depictions of the Trojan War always have Menelaus as some big asshole that didn't deserve Helen so they could play up the 'love' of Paris and Helen.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

If anything it’s Aphrodite’s fault that this shit happened. Instead of just making some beautiful woman for him to marry she decided to give him the wife of a man, who everyone new would kill anyone who tried to take her.

[@Wanderer628]

Its a symptom of the modern perception of cheating that is spread by Hollywood. If a man cheats, its because he's is an arsehole. If a woman cheats, its only because the man made her do it because he wasn't good enough. So Menelaus couldn't possibly have been anything other than a selfish monster.

[@1furious]

Reciting Greek mythology exactly as is for Western audiences is nearly impossible due to the gap in moral perceptions, so characters and narratives have to be entirely re-written to satisfy what the modern audience wants. Unfortunately I sometimes fear this gives people an inaccurate perspective on what the Greek myths are. Truthfully, it's more like Western mythology, just using Greek characters to tell a story that reinforces Western morals. Any depiction of Helen for instance as an individualistic feminist woman with the mindset of someone from the 21st century West is evidently out of its God-damn mind since those ideas didn't even exist in ancient Greece let alone in the mythical Homeric society. I recall Helen in the Iliad outright hating Paris after nine years, and practically wishing for Menelaus to kill him.

[@logan812]

Friendly reminder that Paris was already with the nymph Oenone when Aphrodite offered him Helen, and Paris just straight up ditched Oenone (and their child!) the minute he got offered an upgrade and eloped/adducted Helen. When Paris is mortally wounded he returns to Oenone and begs her to heal him (which she can do), but she spurns him and he dies. Then she too dies by her own hands because Paris has turned her into such an emotional mess and she understandably regretted allowing him to die.

[@1furious]

@@logan812 Paris is honestly the worst character. A coward, a liar, a cheat, no self-control.

[@Rukdug]

Paris: "Don't worry Hector, I'm sure I can beat Menelaus, I mean, look at the kind of shape he's in." Menelaus: "Joke's on you, this is a powerlifter's build." Paris: "Errors have been made."

[@blazer168]

Didnt help that Paris was an archer and not a warrior

[@lucassmith7770]

“I calculated this attack perfectly, but damn, am I bad at math.”

[@Rush2201]

Paris may not like it, but that is what peak performance looks like.

[@nurglehugs7043]

"Aphrodite come pick me up, am scared."

[@Rukdug]

@@lucassmith7770 Hector: *audible facepalming intensifies*

[@THENemesisXX99]

One take I've heard of regarding the capture of Helen is that she didn't even willingly leave in the first place. That it was the goddess Eris who planted a golden apple in Olympus that was engraved. "To the fairest." The goddesses Athena, Hera and Aphrodite argued with one another on who deserves it but couldn't come to a decision so they got Paris to decide for them. They offered Paris bribes to decide on each of them but he took Aphrodite's who proceeded to give him what he wanted. The most beautiful woman in the world which was apparently Helen. Because Aphrodite will ruin lives and burn cities for a shoddy made love story.

[@MaxPwnzer]

I'd argue it was probably consensual, due to the fact that dragging a screaming queen out of her palace without alerting the entire city and having the entire army on your ass is probably among the harder things to do in life

[@THENemesisXX99]

@@MaxPwnzer Well that's where the version I have covers that base. Paris didn't kidnap her, she got whisked away by Aphrodite to fulfill her end of the bargain. Not saying this version is more truthful than any other because trying to find canon in mythology is impossible.

[@davidstenow5055]

The Original Snub, praise Discordia

[@_greenrunner_]

this isn’t a take or version, this is quite literally what the songs describe

[@IoannesG]

That take is pretty explicitly the actual, original one. Helen in the Iliad HATES Paris, and has to be coerced into sleeping with him by Aphrodite. Paris in the Iliad: Kidnapped Helen, ransacked Menelaus' palace and paid off prominent Trojans to argue in favor of letting him keep her when he got back home. The romance and star-crossed lovers crap from modern adaptations is nowhere to be found in the actual Epics.

[@teal_m_101]

Menelaus is an utter chad who loved his wife so much he sent countless others to their death so he can be back with Helen. Paris was a whiny prince who simped so hard he broke the rules of hospitality.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

Yes, and Aphrodite is the biggest b**** in Greek Mythology for starting all this shit.

[@teal_m_101]

@@greenknightofwar7024 Nah, it was all because Eris did a little trolling at Peleus and Thetis' wedding.

[@thenightqueen0]

Oh yeah such a chad "Hey all you thousands of men with families and lives, would you be willing to die because my wife left me? Cool thanks." And then many of them did die and it wasn't even for Helen but for money. And yet Paris was actually willing to fight single combat to end the war, had Aphrodite not intervened. I'm not completely on Paris' side for leaving Oenone and killing his son (unknowingly but still). But Menelaus was far from a chad. Unless you wanna mean the terrible kind, I'll agree to that.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

@@thenightqueen0 hey opportunity is opportunity.

[@AlexWithington]

@@thenightqueen0 then again a lot of them were under a other (for lack of better term i can think of) to protect/defend her of which they agreed to yes no idk at this point i need sleep

[@quintussertorius4447]

“Especially high stakes game of Naked Truth or Dare” I may never refer to the Judgement of Paris as anything else ever again. Bless you sir.

[@walorani5448]

This honestly is the best Noobs Guide to start off with non Warhammer ones!

[@Nisenziart]

except troy is warhammer just without magic and monsters.....oh wait there is troy mythos now so you can play warhammer in troy

[@juwebles4352]

@@Nisenziart and shogun 2 was just medieval 2 with samurais and katanas

[@codybonds]

The tentative schedule is Menelaus, Paris, Agamemnon, Aeneas, Diomedes, Hector, Ajax, Sarpedon, Achilles, Penthesilea and Hippolyta, Odysseus. Each is important to certain parts of the story, and I'm trying to keep their contributions and deaths roughly chronological.

[@FattSpartan]

Can’t wait for big boy Achilles

[@marcus4046]

now here me out. A noobs guide to some of the big guys in attlia total war such as attlia charlamagne flavius stillico and belisaruius. I enjoy your warhammer stuff but these historical or somewhat histocal noob guides are bangers in there own right.

[@codybonds]

@@marcus4046 that's where I want to take the noobs history series

[@alirezaderazgisoo9214]

make dota spotlights pleasw

[@codybonds]

@@alirezaderazgisoo9214 I adore DOTA and would love to! But suspect it will be a while before I have time to try one.

[@IansMentalOmega]

Ronald Regan: "Mr. Gorbychev, TEAR DOWN THIS WALL!" Menelaus: "I don't know who you are, what you are doing, where you have come from, why you dress so strangely, or who this Mr. Gorbychev is, but I, too, wish for this wall to be torn down."

[@DragonballBlack]

This was actually very interesting

[@Gunny55555]

Did not expect you to do a Noobs guide on Troy. For the first one for Troy, I like how you talked about Menalaus, is interesting to hear his mechanics and his history. I also like how you used the greek artwork from the game to better explain joks or explain something better. Overall pretty funny and educational!

[@skomolowski]

10/10 mythos of Troy guide. How about you tackle the chad from the other side, the stereotypical older brother cleaning up his brothers mess? For the Shimmering Helm!

[@bubbasbigblast8563]

Personally, I like to think that Menelaus was only into Tom Boys, and Aphrodite drove Hellen to become more feminine: Menelaus was still a great enough guy to appreciate the effort, but he just wasn't into it.

[@jasonburke1671]

a true man of taste

[@jerellcortese4287]

Tom boys for life

[@greenknightofwar7024]

To each man there own.

[@Mrkabrat]

Aphrodite: Behold, mortal! I have made your wife even more gorgeous by making her femeninity even greater! Menelaus: Thanks, but huh... Aphrodite: I do not like the sound of that "but", mortal Menealus: I'm more of a tomboy guy. But I appreciate the effort

[@ryan1000011]

Honestly as she was a Spartan woman this may be more true than u think

[@pancreasnowork9939]

This is my favorite Noob’s Guide yet, and it’s all about actual history! Mostly actual history. Kind of actual history. More actual than the Elven Triangular Trade. This channel kicks ass.

[@batcat4136]

This could've been "A Noobs Guide to the Trojan War". I knew Menelaus was a cool dude, but I never realized just how much of a bro he was. Makes me want to start another Troy Campaign, but I don't know if I can leave my Khopesh bois behind

[@DerSisch]

I rly hope you keep up with Noobs Guide to Troy. It's such an underrated game imo. Keep up the great content, Cody.

[@conradoccaminha]

This was a very different view of Menelaus than most movies/shows demonstrate. I like it.

[@FridayNightPlayer21]

Fun campaign, surrounded by enemies such as Lybaras, Clan Mors, Grimgor's Boyz, Last Defenders, you name it! Joke aside, good job Cody

[@steffent.6477]

The Achilles-lover-thing is a modern interpretation. Not found in the original sources.

[@ジョンズ心愛]

I just reread the Iliad and you are absolutely correct, thank you for posting bro

[@PikaPWN91]

I'm all for Noob's guides to historical games

[@hades_deathgod9496]

I appreciate the history lessons at the start of your vids. A lot of people dislike spartas gameplay, but I really enjoy it, and the best part about his call to arms mechanic is that if you form an alliance with the Amazon’s, you get access to some of the best archers in the game, which is a weak point for the Greeks (excluding the hunters of Artemis). And his ability to colonise razed settlements without needing an army close by is great, especially early game.

[@johnmoshos2435]

There is also the version in which Menelaus shipwrecks in Egypt, finds out that the Helen who run with Paris was a fake created by Hera and the real one was being held hostage in Egypt. They reunite, fight, make-out, and go back to Sparta. The oldest fanfiction in history.

[@Predator20357]

Maybe Menelaus realized that Helen wasn’t tomboyish enough to actually be Helen.

[@HarryBuddhaPalm]

He uses Troy McClure's fragrance, "Smellin' of Troy".

[@ollaniuspius1211]

All that's missing from Menelaus is a can of Monster in his hand.

[@thejack390]

Thank you for pointing out how awesome Menelaus was!

[@slimfastsubaru2043]

Troy (the movie) did menelaus dirty the man's an absolute Chad, and that thing with patroclus was also not in the movie. Dirty.

[@wimbusbert1249]

Ahhhhh... A Noob's Guide. Classic show. Nothing better to watch after a long day on the road. Just drove up to Nashville from Tampa.

[@olympusgolemoflight7198]

I don’t get any of these jokes or references. It’s all Greek to me.

[@codybonds]

You got me. Take your upvote.

[@olympusgolemoflight7198]

@@codybonds Thank you my good man.

[@Razzrazz90]

I had little interest in actually playing Troy, but Cody's really nudging me in that direction with these lore vids

[@codybonds]

I had little interest in playing Warhammer until I learned about the characters. Context makes all the difference in a game.

[@Razzrazz90]

@@codybonds That's a good point. If you plan on continuing this series, I look forward to the next one! :D

[@theotherbaratheon1895]

Menelaus was such a giga chad

[@randomcenturion7264]

Helen was a damn fool for bailing on him.

[@thrashmarky]

Thank you, please do more troy, I love the game and this series is awesome

[@martinconway8174]

Commenting for the algorithmic boost, this is quality stuff

[@codybonds]

Thank you!

[@aidanterrebonne822]

Coooooooooody, while there have been better and worse days for this series, not one person could deny that the overall quality just keeps going up! Honestly so happy you found tww and joined us, shared with us, and really just found your stride. I love to see good people do well bud, and you're doing damn fine.

[@codybonds]

I'm curious, what do you feel are the best and worst episodes?

[@aidanterrebonne822]

@@codybonds bath salts gelt is probably my favorite, felt like you really nailed his angle. (hate empire btw so you know no bias here) The weakest was probably tiqtaqto due to overreliance on the zwup banging joke. Really all the worst ones were the ones that were too short and didn't convey enough information or strategy about the character. No issue with short vids but if it's short and leaves me feeling like I haven't gleaned anything about them I generally am a little disappointed. I think the best ones involve you using a story from their lore. "'Gor-Rok IS THE BEST"' is much less interesting than "in the year xxxx Gor-Rok led the expedition to retrieve X artifact and fought X monster and was nearly foiled by X wizardry BUT HE HELD THE LINE.' using a story and displaying the traits of the character then enhancing our understanding through your added insight and external contextual knowledge makes for a strong memorable video because you can hold onto the events the character was involved in.

[@ElStupido169]

I like how į turn to see a noobs guide even though my computer cant run it and enter a hipnosis when the history starts

[@amandag.6186]

SPARTANS, WHAT IS YOUR PROFESSION!?!

[@shapshapshapshap2829]

6:43 maybe slight-kinda correction here, but I’m pretty sure Patroclus wasn’t Achilles lover in Homer’s original Iliad. That part was actually only added in centuries later by other Greeks.

[@codybonds]

I know where I fall on it, but I encourage you to decide for yourself. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Achilles_and_Patroclus#Classical_views_in_antiquity

[@shapshapshapshap2829]

@@codybonds just finished reading the article, and wow that is honestly really more than what I thought it was, did not know Plato and others were having full blown trials and debates about it

[@codybonds]

@@shapshapshapshap2829 History is an endless detective story where we can only guess at the truth. And I'm glad you enjoyed the reading!

[@thelordandsaviorgigachadrr888]

Honestly a lot of the problems with the different interpretations of the Iliad, and what was the "true" version started in the mid-7th Century, which was also the time the Homeric epics started spreading west to mainland Greece from the central and southern-central west Coast of Anatolia, as well as the first literature from those areas, so a lot of things get iffy, not to mention man-boy love became a thing almost everywhere a few decades later. There wasn't really much time for people to properly interpret the epics before all these social changes happened.

[@yamahadrag69]

Why is Odysseus the only who gets to use the brain cell?

[@UCeagle79]

I love these videos. Good mix of info, lore and humor. I would add a few more informative features about the topic and how they tie into the lore. What Gods/Research/Army builds should they use. Campaign targets. Friends and foes to worry about. Don't worry about length. If its good people do not care about length. They care about you.

[@Heartstorm423]

Well you'll never convince me to play this Total war since it's just different flavor of human it does have your humor and it was very well put together so good job

[@MrRasta3600]

It's wonderful to see some Troy content

[@agamenmmon7210]

Ive been waiting so long for noobs guides for Troy, thank you daddy I mean Cody Bonds

[@nokay_thefool]

Whenever i watch your channel, i always enjoy that unique irony of the highest order possible

[@s.r.6533]

All of these are S-Tier. Keep it up. Love listening to your explanations

[@LucidWanderer]

Menelaus has the body of a Germanic power lifter in the armor of a Spartan king.

[@Serpentking789]

Question: is Achilles a Legendary Lord or a Hero in TW Troy? Because if not either, he should be added as a playable option with the ability to recruit the Myrmidons of his home kingdom (depicted as literal ant-men in Mythic campaigns)

[@codybonds]

Legendary Lord. And the Ant man thing is a bit overstated, they're rugged dudes in segmented armor with what looks like two pinchers on top of their head. Like Ants.

[@Serpentking789]

@@codybonds to be fair, they are actual ants transformed into men by Zeus (and honestly my first exposure to this myth was through "Weird n' Wild Creatures" so despite everything I can't help but think of them as man-ant monstrosities)

[@codybonds]

@@Serpentking789 well that's even more terrifying! Buncha Jeff Goldblum insect men walking around.

[@Serpentking789]

@@codybonds yeah, but you gotta admit it WOULD look pretty cool in-game as a Mythic-mode unit with four arms, a weapon in each hand, sharp mandibles, and the ability to climb walls

[@robbiemurray2895]

Just subscribed, I enjoyed watching hope you do more, might I advise the next one you make of these be about one of the Trojan heroes? Hector maybe? then keep switching between the Greek and Trojan factions to keep it from being one sided.

[@codybonds]

That's the idea. Next one is Paris. I'm trying to go in the order of their big contributions to the story to keep it somewhat consistent without having to learn every name right off the bat.

[@robbiemurray2895]

@@codybonds by that logic the next one after Paris is Agamemnon, if I'm remembering the stories correctly, I can live with that, hope too see them soon (but no pressure).

[@codybonds]

@@robbiemurray2895 you're bang on!

[@AtheneNocturna]

Love it!! Noobs guide to anything by you is always a blast!

[@MrGamerTrainer]

Wow, brilliant vid man looking forward to the next one!

[@marloyorkrodriguez9975]

Menelaus was about to drag Paris to the Achaean lines and the Trojans were just too happy to let Paris be dragged to the Achaeans if not for Aphrodite, I'm just saying if the gods hadn't bothered it'll be the most shortest war in history, and Paris will be double dead like the idiot he is.

[@Jolsn]

I came here for gameplay but you baited me into an entire history lesson. Props to you I guess

[@lordcypher5889]

I love the more story telling aspect of these videos. Always a pleasure watching.

[@alexjones9233]

Big fan of the noob's guide series. Also much more interesting when looking at historical figures

[@TheDharmaNerd]

Please do Noobs Guides for some of the older Total Wars like Shogun 2. I need a Noob Guide to the Oda clan!

[@codybonds]

Long loooooong Yari man!

[@aqure9]

Never played Troy but I really enjoyed this

[@lkcdarzadix6216]

MENELAUS being hard support is way too perfect

[@ZeDawgear]

Before his death, C.S. Lewis started writing a book about Menelaus looking for Helen. It was an alternative take on the Iliad, the twist being that Helen had fled to Egypt secretly just before the Greeks conquered Troy, leaving Menelaus to pursue her alone now that his allies received their spoils. It’s a shame he didn’t get to finish it; his other novel based on ancient history, ‘Till We Have Faces’, is one of my all time favorites. 🏺

[@codybonds]

The Helen in Egypt storyline comes from Greek Legend as well. It's just one of the less popular narratives as it contradicts all the others.

[@kapitan19969838]

That was awesome! More please!

[@setphaserstostun90]

Fun thought, Menelaus's epithets in the Iliad are "Menelaus, good at shouting" and "Menelaus, the lame spearman" when translated from the Greek. In case you were wondering why Helen left with a younger man.

[@codybonds]

Can you link a source for that? If I can verify them it's going in Paris' video.

[@iansupremo6762]

I'm pretty sure that in the original epic, Menelaus was supposedly the most handsome man in Greece- and the embodiment of the shonen bestboi little brother

[@Psilocybear]

This was great! I'd love to see more noobs guides in historical games

[@chaos1672]

I enjoyed this a lot, some great mythology lessons and a fun video to boot

[@isacc8324]

Honestly this guy sounds like the perfect best friend

[@Ghost3210]

Spartan kings really were a different breed of man.

[@leolinguini260]

Love the video. Would gladly watch more!

[@AlluvianGarald]

Great video! I would love to see one for Ajax.

[@codybonds]

Spoiler. He and the sheep had a history.

[@Ellebeeby]

Probably never gonna play Troy but always gonna watch a Cody Bonds video!

[@dogdoe7002]

Great video, now I feel like starting a new campaign

[@alejandro-bx3rk]

Love your videos, and all the work you do.

[@greenknightofwar7024]

To anyone who reads ASOIAF this guy Menalaus seems like a mix of Rabert and Stannis.

[@Warfrae]

Please oh please do more of these. I love thr lore videos

[@liamryan2093]

Got to love Troy

[@djaneezy2504]

Cody, I felt that outro in my bones so much I even logged into this account to drop you a second subscription. Keep up the good work

[@codybonds]

Thank you. Every sub counts. And yours counted twice!

[@porten1277]

This was very very well done!

[@ianb6828]

keep making these great vids buddy, they always make me laugh

[@drizztfirefly]

Adding a comment for the algorithm. Great video as always. Keep them coming.

[@Lorddacenshadowind]

Lol it's like a biker(menelaus) vs a college bro(paris). Paris thought he was hot shit then gets pasted by menelaus

[@We_Are_Exodus]

More NOOB'S GUIDE to Troy please!

[@happycompy]

I'm a simple man. I see Troy content, I like.

[@brandongarcia7363]

This is a great new type of noob's guides

[@bigpp9978]

Menelaus is a real chad and a real lad I honestly had know idea he was so cool and respectable the movie really did him dirty

[@Corn_DOG]

These are great keep them up!

[@danscga2487]

i like tgis version of Menelaus more than the movie version.

[@CAP198462]

I didn’t see a Diomedes video, do you “not have Captain Diomedes?”

[@danielfagan7088]

So it begins

[@faminh0]

My pleasure, I will always watch your videos Mr Jack Black

[@codybonds]

Skadoosh.

[@sauronmauron6965]

If only my PC could run any Total War,you hooked me when they gave the free pass on the Epic store and seeing they have kept fidelity to the myths makes me drool to play it

[@dalek--ck9oy]

Now I just straight up feel bad for Menelaus he ain't deserve that

[@danielfilson3136]

This is very cool. I would to see more.

[@leonst.7471]

Menlaus is my most favourite Troy Legendary Lord as he has cool mechanics a perfect starting position and yeah like the faction units too

[@duskfall8948]

He do got a dad bod

[@bigles025]

loving these, id love to agammemnon next, menelaus is my boi, so happy to see him go first

[@Killer66hitman]

That's good content! Didn't know he was such a chad

[@AzoiatheCobra]

Menelaus faction is the best faction because of the combos you can make with it

[@BaldricOutremer]

Menelas was significantly less admirable in many Greek tragedies. Possibly because tragedies were written by Athenians, Athens was at war with Sparta, and Menelas had been the king of Sparta.

[@arunasrancevas6095]

Sure took your sweet time. Took nine months of waiting.

[@PedroRodrigues-je6xp]

Helen's story is an example of why some women cannot be philosophers: if they are alone with their thoughts, some dude will come over and see whaat's she's up to.... I'm sympathetic towards them...

[@Burgundychannel]

Man. The 2004 movie really did my manZ dirty.

[@LunetoHa]

Nailed it, as usual! For Menelaus! FOR SPARTA!!

[@josephoram5118]

I wondee if yoy will ever make more of these videos on other trojan war characters. Im sure they dont do as well as the warhammer stuff but they are so much fun

[@codybonds]

I loved making it. I want to do more for Pharaoh and my hope is they will tie Troy in somehow and give me an excuse to make more of them.

[@josephoram5118]

@codybonds that would be awesome! I watched the few for Troy then realized there weren't that many in the playlist. Im sure all the new stuff will be awesome as well.

[@albertoagnello1113]

I assume you'll do every faction in Troy, cause this was pure gold