Are Expensive PA Speakers Actually Worth The Money? | A Value Conversation

[@noahman27]

Greetings from Boston, MA. Very interesting video. I Dj private events so this conversation is waaaay above my pay grade, but I wanted to chime in here after hearing you mention Adamson speakers. About 30 years ago a DJ'ed an event for about 3500 people and the sound company brought in an Adamson rig. And it sounded Awwwwesome!. Absolutely wonderful!! Other than THAT ONE TIME, this is the only other time I have ran into somebody who knows the name Adamson. And I was really glad to hear it.

[@blznsaddles]

Higher end stuff allows you to fulfill rider requirements for larger acts. Some of the PA companies have rental networks through the company itself as well. Being able to harness that network if you are in a city and you need more boxes, amps, whatever can be a huge plus. Rental availability from the big players to help supplement a system is big. Having a PA that a large freelance pool knows how to use is a big one.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, all great value additions, for sure.

[@Ewsound]

I get to use a wide variety of Martin Audio when working for RMB Audio: MLA Mini, MLA Compact, WPS and even the older W8LM series. Very impressed with consistency of coverage, tonality and their tech support/training personnel. Enjoy your channel and glad to hear you mention Martin Audio in this video.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

So glad to hear that! I'm hopefully going to be able to use their stuff for an upcoming project.

[@maslrockt]

What I noticed over the time, and here in the company I work for we have the whole product range from L-Acoustic und some series of d&b: Its not only the sound that matters if you work with the systems in a daily basis. There are a lot of excellent sounding speakers in the market from smaller brands and they are way cheaper than D&B (ok... everything is cheaper than d&b...) or L-Acoustics. But there mostly not so good at the rigging hardware, the accessories and or software. And if i would invest in a PA system I would also take at look at some points for example: how fast I can rig them, have the spare parts in 10 years the same quality, are software updates for the amps available after 10 years and so on.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Great points! All things to consider.

[@maslrockt]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio Yeah. And another point is (specially if you or your company plays in the major league): you need gear whats compatible with the rider or tech requirements from the artists your customer works with. we had a good sounding (but shitty to rig) system from a french manucature starts with a N - and had a lot of discussions with the production manager withs bands. even if they didnt hear it. and thats only because it was no system from L-Acoustics, d&b or Meyer.

[@johanneshofmann9192]

One thing to consider is the system as a whole. If you buy lacousics oder d&b, you only need one type of amp. maybe two that are compatible with all the speaker. Also you can mix and match inbetween the series pretty easily for combinations of fill, delay and main speakers. They are going to sound very similar.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Great point!

[@soundshopvlogs]

I agree, but as far as sound quality improvement, price is definetly not worth the difference between the high end D&b or L'Acoustics rig as apposed to, for example the JBL VTX A series. The difference comes in if you have the higher end rig, the work will come to you in droves. Those companies have done great in marketing over the past few decades to create the illusion that they're actually that much better. My opinion. Haha

[@BazSoundVenueTech]

Dude! you just described the exact issue i have with 1 venues system, which has bothered me for years. Ive recently started learning system tuning (thanks for all your videos Ive been able t get some decent results as well as being able to align a multidriver system). the system is a diy homebuilt system, 3 way system , double 18" subs, 2 12" mids and a 2" jbl compression driver, its always sounded hard and abrissive when turned up especially in the 2khz to 5khz range, i setup the system with open sound meter recently . it still sounded sharp and abrassive. I used rew and theres a fair amount of distortion in the system, particularly in the compression drivers... the only options have been to sacrifice some mid/hi end response as its too painfull to listen to especially at metal band volume in a small room

[@Zamsky39]

I feel like there's a point beyond which you need to spend 2-3x as much per box in order to get an improvement in the range of 10%

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, the investment amount to performance gained ratio isn't a linear scale, that's for sure.

[@MaxSplVideos]

"Trust manufacturers who ethically show their work" has become a much bigger issue as companies have gotten even worse about competing on the spec sheet, especially in the low-mid end market that I tend to deal in. I have a speaker in the showroom with "1000watts peak", written on it that is likely running at 200. At 200watts it would be a fine speaker for the price, but customers expect more out of a "1000watt" speaker so it ends up just disappointing them when they do hear it. I know inflated wattage has always been an issue, but even comparing the manuals from the SMR450 v1 compared to the v3 you can see a stark difference in the quality of information given to the consumer. Even QSC has fallen into this. Their spec sheets for the K series pull all the tricks (+/-6 for frequency response instead of the more standard 3 that they used for years, only showing peak wattage, wattage being calculated with speaker/amp protections bypassed), and I say this as someone who has used their speakers for about 15 years (HPR112i still going strong).

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, you're absolutely right. That's why I brought up the M-Noise/AES75 test. But it's often hard to get your hands on a demo unit before purchasing to really put it through its paces. Some manufacturers take many liberties in skewing their data to make their product more competitive. I've been a longtime QSC user as well and it does disappoint me to see them listing their specs like you mentioned.

[@eddrojas6851]

For major AV rental companies, it is well worth the investment in the make and brand of a particular PA, as it will be marketed and pushed to do headliner gigs that suits the required spec's to match what it in the tech' rider of the client/production. Also, there is the "industry standard" amongst competing hi-roller companies, to have the "upscale" kits... On the other hand, startup companies that do community level (weddings and birthdays) gigs do well investing in generic make and least branded PA's... Doing so will make sure they get the ROI sooner with the type of gigs they do with what they make in that kind of work...

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Makes sense!

[@soundman1402]

As someone who started out doing DJ and very small events, I made the decision to buy EV ETX speakers, and I don't regret it at all. I bought them all B-stock, so I saved a bit of money that way, but the sound quality of the ETX blows away everything else I've used in the music-store-grade segment. It's worth it, too, because my clients always notice. Even attendees at weddings comment to me on the sound! The smooth sound of a high-quality box means such conveniences as reduced possibility of feedback from lavaliere mics, for example.

[@tfj6392]

I like what you are doing Michael Curtis, great questions to consider when making a decision to buy PA systems.

[@langyampsdmb]

I had a 12” 2000 watt speaker that is okay but it always sounded cold and harsh. I could clean it up with EQ but didn’t want to. I grabbed a pair of 12” PRX812 and they sound killer so far in my basement ha.

[@eddiegutierrezjr6226]

I won’t say whether you should get the cream of the crop from a specific brand, but one thing that you do gain when choosing a brand like L’Acoustics and D&B is saving time with pre-pro. Ease of use in prediction software and amp control pays dividends for production companies who churn out show after show. You also want to remember to satisfy raiders if you do more music than corporate.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, brand recognition and ease of workflow in those situations does carry some weight, for sure.

[@adrianbarac3063]

What a shame that the incredible PreSonus StudioLive 315ai were ignored and discontinued. Studio monitor accuracy is their claim, and they DON'T disappoint. Bought 3 for an HT setup and will die with them... Kudos to the designer Dave Gunness.

[@uzefulvideos3440]

I really wish there was more data on directivity performance out there, would make buying decisions so much easier. On-axis performance is great anyway nowadays. And especially in rooms, with all the room reflections, very uneven off-axis frequency response, like strong resonances, can highly negatively impact the sound.

[@ChrisCebelenski]

As a small independent operator, I'm limited not only by budget, but by access - often I never see the major vendors systems, so I have no experience in how they sound or perform. Also systems management tools are a myth at my level - speaker placement and choices are often of the form of "Yeah, put that there because that's the only space". It's one step up from DJ setups, but actually not that much more. I've used JBL Vertex and EV, and have owned systems from them, but Db or Meyer or L-Accoustics are way out of reach for client budgets. Systems processing may be a Driverack, or even nothing. I think there's a huge gap there between "Some guy with speakers", and "A Production Company with Claire Audio" that isn't being filled by the vendors.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, there's another part of this conversation to be had about purchasing gear that makes sense for your own as well as your client's budgets.

[@soundman1402]

I agree on this! The jump from a music store cab to any sort of production-grade cab is huge. I've about out-grown my EV ETX system, but I'm not sure where to go from here without spending 100 grand. Same with consoles, for that matter.

[@mitas3484]

@@soundman1402 I’m in the same boat, I feel like once point source is no longer enough, it’s very quickly thousands of dollars and when to stop? Personally I go by the 80/20 rule, while I would love to own all of my gear, I only purchase stuff that I know represents a large portion of sales moving forward. I want to buy 80% and rent/subcontract 20%, as buying that last 20% could take years to pay back.

[@14990daniel]

Would love to see a video understanding DSP’s especially when it comes to gains either from the mixing board or the DSP.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

To clarify, how to set proper gain structure from the mixing desk as well as into the DSP?

[@bigtimeeventsdj]

I'm not obsessed with having the best, but I recently changed brands because of failures I had during events, even after factory service.

[@MakesBadNoise]

I’d really like to see measurements to back up your claim about VRX. I don’t like the box as much as the next guy, but non-linearity over volume is a pretty easy thing to verify with an analyzer

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Next time I get my hands on one I can get out REW and run some tests. Great idea.

[@TheMessiah91]

My Peavey PV15s with a DSP and some analog processing people are coming up asking about what kind of speakers im using sound awsome.

[@infohole9880]

I'd rather put a pair of my Renkus Heinz TRX in my listening room than a pair of Peavey SPs. The difference in sound quality is audible; the Renkus boxes are very hi-fi, while the Peavey SPs are constructed to make bar band patrons deaf.

[@cavatche]

i look for the makie thumb 215xt for practice whith my band in my basement, and he told me that there were good in 2000 but not now

[@atcordice]

you pull a great topic to talk about....

[@alexdefrancisco3066]

Brother the way you display information is awesome . I wanted to ask you a random question. What do you think about the Rcf 945a. These serve as point systems. I think they are very powerful and sound clear even at very loud volumes. But wanted to see what your opinion is. Thanks

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Thank you so much! I've never used the RCF 945a, but I've had great experiences with other RCF products.

[@johnanderson2743]

KZbin is a worldwide platforms and as with many US based the brands covers at not always widely available in other markets. In addition some of the best speakers are not made in the USA. In Europe, certainly bands such as RCF are more common and highly respected than many US brands mentioned. It is a good idea to speak more generically about requirements and avoid specific brands and models.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, KZbin is a worldwide platform, but I’m simply speaking from my own experience. I’ve actually used RCF quite a bit and think they make great stuff. Like I said at the top, there’s plenty of great brands out there.

[@adamreece5287]

I am about to purchase some RCF ttw 4a tops would you back that ?? I am building a small to mid range live sound set up. I already have Rcf subs but I am split on the tops.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

@@adamreece5287 I haven't used those specific speakers before, but having used other RCF gear those TTW 4-A's look like a good speaker for your application.

[@tulih8065]

I wanna hear more about the SRX900s, pros and cons. And is there any other model that you can match them with to expand the system.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I still haven't heard them in person yet, but my client is very happy so far. I like that each box has its own DSP, but there still are a few limitations on how much individual control I have over each box as far as EQ overlays. And are you asking about another JBL model or a different brand?

[@stewartscreekaudio8105]

I am very interested in the SRX906 too. I am supposed to hear a demo of 12 box demo.

[@tristancuene9973]

I've heard 'em and I'm not impressed. IMO the 906 sounds better than the 910.

[@JohnSotomusic]

Michae I've watched many of your videos and all of them are awesome. Question: how do I define the target trace? If you can make a video on that, it would. be awesome. The more videos i watch, the more I want to buy your course.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Thanks, John! Are you asking how to import a pre-defined one or make one on your own?

[@will8649]

Another subject might be marketability, a strong brandname like Lacoustics, adamson etc. is way easier to sell than unknown brand X. In Europe we see that artists do like known brands and eventplanners are aware of good quality equipment. Finding a brand that suits you as a company should also be targeted to the stuff that you do. With live music you have totally different demands than just a simple corporate event. One you need a quality brand and the other you can get away with a few EV speakers. Two different worlds and two different price tags.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Yes, absolutely! Great points. That's a whole other half of the conversation I'd like to have in the future. I focused the on the "technical" gains here, but then there's also the social/marketing aspects, for sure.

[@mosermichael4404]

lambda laps QX serie and hd18 sub is a hornloaded horizontal clusterabeel array on of the beat sounding PA .. die pa is incredible ... I have many year work with d&b is very good Pa system are the lambda laps blow me a way!👊😉🤘

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I haven't heard those!

[@henryvanschalkwyk2133]

Please talk about and compare some some brands.

[@montelcarlos143]

Thanks Man,top content as always

[@michaelanderson4265]

Awesome video!! Thanks

[@SalvadorEguiarteDG]

You blew me away! Wow

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Thanks, Salvador!

[@MurrayWilliams]

Question: I’ve noticed the Bass is hyped in the target traces. Is that a perception thing or a taste thing driven by current tastes in live sound? Or is it something else?

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Great question! If I were to tune a PA perfectly "flat" in a live environment, to my ear it sounds thin. The increase is to bring out the body and punch I expect out of a large scale system, up to +15dB or so. However, in my studio, those monitors are tuned flat and sound "correct". It's ultimately up to the environment and expectations.

[@micahmuth4256]

if you ever want to come listen to martin MLAC or WPM, I have both installed at my venue, hit me up.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Great to know! Where's your venue located? Feel free to shoot me an email offline if you prefer communicating that way.

[@micahmuth4256]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio the vineyard church of central IL in Urbana IL.

[@LarryTCable]

Harbinger, and kustom are the most under rated “cheap” brands. Waiting for the day either one does an array.

[@johnmcquay82]

Bishopsound in the UK are a low-cost brand and started doing line arrays in the last couple of years. I'll keep my view of their equipment to myself (all I will say is, I'm not a fan) but there are some low-end and budget brands looking into arrays.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I haven't worked with any of those brands (other than playing through a Kustom guitar amp), but will keep a lookout.

[@jorgec112]

Soundtown is probably your closest thing to fall around the harbinger/Kustom of that price range that offers linearrays.

[@infohole9880]

Expensive PA speakers are definitely worth the money if your clients are demanding them. If you don't know what you're doing, a bad mix will sound bad anywhere, but the bad local bands usually can't afford Meyer, Martin, or Renkus. The price becomes the product by excluding less successful companies from becoming owners.

[@MichaelNatrin]

Great video.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Thank, Michael!

[@isaiahalexander6021]

What’s up I had a question what microphone for system tuning you would suggest for me to get because right now the two you recommend are both on backorder

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Hey, Isaiah! It looks like the Behringer ECM8000 is in stock at sweetwater. It's not the "best" quality mic, but will definitely do the job, especially for $35. Once the others come back in stock I'd snag a EMX-7150, then keep the Behringer in your backpack as a spare or your "cheap mic" that you can take on dusty outdoor gigs.

[@peevonb7070]

You covered many bases. Very nice! I have a few questions regarding other topics. What is most comfortable for you to receive those?

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Thank you! You can find my email address at the bottom of my home page on my website.

[@CarlosLerma-dn3lq]

Great 😊

[@CarlosLerma-dn3lq]

Great chanal bass

[@Baxtersbrain101]

Is meyer sound worth the money?

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

That honestly depends on use case, expected ROI, the type of shows you're putting on, etc.

[@murrayriverentertainment3426]

In my opinion they're great I've a heap of old Meyer from the 90's all still perfect and on original drivers, the processor's they designed, worked also on the front of protection and over excursion. People are generally scratching their head in regards to the output of my MSL2's from some old smallish black boxes.

[@joshhoevelmann6498]

Meyer are great! Do the shows you do and the money you make off of them justify the cost? Will you miss out on gigs or have to charge less for not having Meyer or any other high dollar box?

[@joelbouyea8269]

I believe it honestly will come down to the tour money rider lists... Those lists are built from sales teams... Not necessarily about sound quality but rather the purchase budget kickbacks... relationship

[@melodythomason5216]

Way above my pay grade . I'm just a musician .

[@k.s.8959]

*cries in Funktion-One budget*

[@wienerstein2817]

Those can sound good with the right system technician

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

I've never heard of those!

[@k.s.8959]

@@MichaelCurtisAudio Ok wow i thought Funktion-One is quite well known but i think it's more known in europe. It's founder Tony Andrews worked for Turbosound in the early days thats why Turbosound Floodlight look very similar to F1 stuff.

[@derekrushe]

Is a 100$ guitar the same as a 5000$ guitar?

[@DJLEOdamadprofessor]

Both play EADGbe

[@Zamsky39]

No, but it's not 50x better

[@MurrayWilliams]

It depends.

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

To answer your question succinctly, no : )

[@joshhoevelmann6498]

I would add that if you have someone adjust the $100 guitar correctly, put nice strings on it and a few pedals, then put an awesome guitar player on it, it will sound very good.

[@srendyhr5844]

It shouldn't be ignored, that lack of talent at stage is much worse, than making a mediocre setup sound decent. Sometimes is simplicity the only cure really working ... stepping away from liturgical "recipes" that only fully measured and documented can makes the wonders, There is a danger in confirmation bias here!!!!

[@MichaelCurtisAudio]

Great point! Our system and mix is only as good as the source material.