Are Suburbs Bankrupting Our Cities? Can We Fix It?

[@TransitTangents]

Do you live in the suburbs? Are you seeing this type of design occurring near where you live? Let us know! We read and respond to as many comments as we can! Thanks for watching 🙌

[@Streetcraft]

The Grove is such a cool example. Love to hear the whole transit potential of better suburbs too!

[@therylz]

The Grove is a solid example of thoughtful infill, but it's sadly still lacking on connectivity. It's small enough that Bull Creek Rd is walkable from most of it... But there was originally a proposal to connect Jefferson through to 45th, which would have made it more thoroughly linked into the surrounding neighborhoods instead of having three sides of it disconnected from their surroundings. I think this particular issue - that a developer of a new subdivision often ignores the grid from a prior developer right next to them and abuts backyards to backyards - is the crux of many of the things people dislike about suburbs.

[@TransitTangents]

Good point! They did make a little connection through to 45th, but connecting into the neighborhood would have made tons of sense. Maybe it is still possible near the new bridge when it opens? I'm not sure. -Louis

[@joachimwalewski2472]

Among many things I like the abundance of trees in this neighborhood. Both psychologically southing and a great natural air conditioning.

[@TransitTangents]

Yes! They did a pretty good job of putting trees throughout the entire area. Thanks for watching 🙌 -Louis

[@F4URGranted]

I get what you guys are talking about, with the Idea that suburbs can't improve that much. I grew up in a far out exurb of Chicago where walking just isn't an option- but many of these places have an old downtown. They can start there, and maybe add a few mixed use buildings or two close by on old strip mall property. My town shot down a recent 3 story mixed use proposal on close in green space to downtown, but that shows it's possible

[@TransitTangents]

In Austin we are definitely seeing more and more proposals for repurposing old strip malls. Some of them are already approved I believe (or likely will be given the politics of city leaders at the moment). But yes, "fixing" the areas built already is going to be a bit of a problem in some places. Thanks for watching and leaving a comment 👍 -Louis

[@Plutonix_5]

I live in the south central suburbs of Chicago and unfortunately there doesn't seem to be much energy to move away from car dependency. Most areas are very hostile to non drivers and with roads that lack sidewalks. I hope we are able to change this though.

[@theevilmoppet]

Chicago proper, on the other hand, seems to have a lot of energy around improving its roads and expanding bike infrastructure. I think Chicago has one of the largest gaps in desire to improve itself between the city proper and the suburbs in the country - most cities are either a DC/Seattle/San Francisco (energy for moving away from cars, transit and bike projects even in the suburbs, maybe big TOD projects like in DC) or there's just very little change or push for change at all, central city or suburbs. Another example is the Twin Cities where, though the suburbs aren't exactly great or improving at light speed, the current Metro Transit projects include light rail extensions into suburban areas, TOD around the light rail, and BRT projects connecting areas both of the central two cities and of their suburbs together. In Chicago, on the other hand, the suburbs actively handicap what we want to do to make the city better, and they fucking HATE our bike lanes. Everywhere I've been in the Chicago suburbs, except Evanston, who should get credit as a genuinely lovely city in their own right that, by virtue of being very very similar to other lovely historic north side areas and being directly connected to the CTA, does somewhat end up feeling more like "Chicago's far far north" than "a separate suburb of Chicago," is just a continuous expanse of parking lots with the very very occasional neglected Metra stop.

[@theevilmoppet]

I'm sure suburbs elsewhere are equally pissed about any attempts to improve the city or the suburbs, but at least among places I've encountered it really feels to me like nowhere is the gap greater between what the central city wants to do and what the suburbs want them to do.

[@mic1240]

@@theevilmoppetthe four most densely populated municipalities in Illinois are all near Western suburbs (Chicago is #5 in density). Like most metro areas, the suburbs are exponentially more populated. Not all are the same, there are hundreds of train stops in Chicago suburbs between CTA, Metra, South Shore trains, just as there are areas of Chicago proper with very suburban feel. Is total misnomer all suburbs are far flung, sprawl only places. Many are very walkable with transit options.

[@scpatl4now]

I swear urbanist KZbin is all connected in one psychic link. This is the 3rd video on this subject I've watched this week. I made this exact comment on how suburbs are not sustainable on @CityGlowUp and @NotJustBikes did it a couple of years ago. It's something most people don't understand.

[@TransitTangents]

I'll have to check out @CityGlowUp! Haven't seen them before. Thanks for watching!

[@leonasm6503]

I do think the big Problem is the separazing of the live work and retail seperation.

[@TransitTangents]

Agreed! In the last year I just moved to a part of Austin where I can walk to a convenience store, a small grocery store, several restaurants, an ice cream shop, a community garden, etc.... My partner can bike to work. It is so convenient. We still drive occasionally for our weekly grocery trip, going to further destinations, when the weather is bad, etc... but we do it WAY less, mostly just because it is so convenient not to. Having these different uses close by is a plus, not a negative. Previously none of these things were walkable. We didn't know any of our neighbors, we had to drive almost everywhere. If we needed one thing at the store we had to drive there, where as now we walk across the street to the convenience store, etc.... Thanks for the comment and for watching 🙌 -Louis

[@jackbates7467]

Can't believe I didn't already know about the Grove, would have toured an apartment there if I'd known. Though looking at it now, pretty expensive with barely half decent transit.

[@andrewh88]

theres a new neightboorhood in my county called Alton Palm beach Gardens, is built somewhat similar, doesnt have apartments but still a better suburb than older ones built in my county

[@TransitTangents]

Thanks for sharing! We'll have to check it out. Thanks for watching 🙌

[@mmrw]

Suburbs were never a problem, just the car dependent planned ones that we built after WW2 are. Here in New York, especially in Westchester County north of the city, there are lots of older suburban towns, some dating all the way back to the colonial era. They developed all those elements of “good” suburbs completely naturally as they grew over the centuries. Point really being: this is not a new concept at all, meaning it can definitely be emulated elsewhere.

[@TransitTangents]

Totally agree! I hope it is emulated elsewhere. But the areas that have already been developed to be very car dependent will be an issue moving forward for sure. Cities like Houston will have a tough time sorting that out... Thanks for the comment 🙌 -Louis

[@kylespencer2192]

One thing I had thought about was if you, (as a city government) could give people an option to change the zoning laws for their specific suburban lot/house For example, allowing someone to open a completely legal barbershop by renovating their garage

[@andrewh88]

13:49 amazing

[@hairypotter259]

Yes

[@TransitTangents]

Indeed.

[@Rahshu]

Honestly, these developments just look like pockets of fake urbanity. I"d feel like I was cosplaying as a city dweller if I lived there. They're disconnected from actual urbanity and surrounded by standard suburbia. Not only that, they're expensive. I don't honestly see how most suburbs can ever improve without massive redesign and redevelopment that structurally changes them. Even then, why bother when you have an actual city at the core that has some bones that can be built on? It's just easier, more natural. Besides, these still focus too much on middle class people. Those of us in the working class just can't afford this stuff, and the additional car costs make it even worse. Living in suburbia requires a car whereas a decent city can be done with just the bus. It may not be ideal, but it can be done. When you're poor, you usually have to make do. I don't know how I'd make do in these kind of developments.