Are these FAKE motorways? Ax(M) A-explained!

[@BigRiku95]

Excellent video. Would a love a deep dive into some of the stranger AxM roads

[@Andrewjg_89]

Very interesting video. I’ve watched motorway videos including what Auto Shenanigans has done about history of Axxx(M) and Motorways when they were built.

[@Sim0nTrains]

I just want to see a cul-de-sac with motorway regulations now 😂😂 Great video Bryn

[@TheChappers]

Agree they should be scrapped. My favourite ax (m) fact is the A40 (m) was declassified as a motorway when TfL was formed due to the fact they didn’t have powers to preside over motorways. Which I still think is the case.

[@6.tatertots]

I reckon there was never a need to add the (M) on the end - special roads like the A1 & A720 in Edinburgh or A55 in Colwyn Bay function perfectly as essentially motorways in all but name and they don't even have blue signs! Calling the various sections of A1(M) simply A1 (as most regular users of the road actually do) for example and just sticking blue signs and motorway restrictions up wouldn't make any difference to the road and make the numbering so much easier

[@BrynBuck]

The (M) was only really ever brought in because of shortfalls in the original motorway sign set. It's rather redundant now; but we're seemingly stuck with it.

[@freebrickproductions]

"It wasn't invented here" sure seems like a convenient excuse for countries to avoid doing things that are proven to work well elsewhere. I suppose at least over there y'all do at least indicate when a road becomes a motorway/freeway, as, over here in the US, a US or State Route can just become a freeway with little warning and no changes to the designation or signage.

[@EdgyNumber1]

(M) is a very useful signifier to stop you accidentally entering a proper motorway. The Aston Expressway is a good example, and also when a short road off a roundabout leads to a motorway with no opportunity to turn back.

[@BrynBuck]

Do remember that if it has blue signs it is a proper motorway regardless of its number though!

[@walterfillingham]

I’m so surprised the relatively new Aberdeen bypass (AWPR) wasn’t named A90(M) as frankly looks absolutely identical to a few Central Scotland Motorways, including high standard junctions and emergency lay-bys. Even the market posts all along the road.. the AWPR even has same restrictions as on a Motorway, including no farm vehicles, no horse drawn carriages, no cycles , no pedestrians

[@BrynBuck]

I believe it has been designated as a special road so it is a motorway in all but name. Similar situations exist with the A1 east of Edinburgh and parts of the A720 - it's like Scotland is scared of calling these roads motorways 😬

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@BrynBuck honestly, I feel like most of the plentiful elevated A-roads in Glasgow could be motorways as well. IIRC only one "actually" is.

[@april064]

Great video! The Ax(M) designation is very odd, and the UK might be the only country in the world with such a distinction. It's nice to know the reasoning behind it now.

[@Nathan_A_RF]

I feel the Ax(M) routes that provide major links like the A1(M) and A404(M) could be renumbered easily, however for some it may seem a waste of money on patches and signs, particularly when run by councils that are increasingly going broke.

[@niallh8129]

Great video as always! The A66(M) is missing from your list. How many of these AX(M) motorways are under local authority control rather than national highways control? Same could be said for the main motorway network too as small parts of that fall under local authority control too!

[@BrynBuck]

Oh fudge! That list went very wrong didn't it. I'm not editing in a rush again 🤣

[@BrynBuck]

I'll answer the trunk/local question in another video I think!

[@niallh8129]

@@BrynBuck I look forward to it and other road related content you create! 👍

[@JamieEC96]

I was always under the impression that an a(m) motorway was done to stick to the original route of that a road and just give a motorway alternative/ section whereas m designations are for new routes only

[@BrynBuck]

That was the sort of original intention yes although not planned to be for long distance routes.

[@625tvroom]

I think that's why I think they should be kept... The A1 has motorways sections and it makes sense to call them A1(M) rather than invent separate numbers. But I know there are people who thought the A1(M) and the M1 were the same thing 😮

[@BrightonandHoveActually]

Putting up signs in your local town centre three weeks from today calling it High Street (M) would be a great April Fool trick!

[@rogerkearns8094]

I'm happy just to stick with what we're used to. Btw, there used to be an A41(M), but now it's just another bit of the A41.

[@BrynBuck]

Ah yes, the fabled Tring Bypass!

[@MrGreatplum]

Great video, Bryn - you have explained this excellently. They should just make them all full M numbers frankly!

[@AddieDirectsTV]

The UK numbering system seems hard lol. Granted, other than interstate highways, over here US, state, and county roads can be of any type.

[@ncrp]

I never had a problem with Ax(M) before, but now you mention it, they need to go, a start has been made, the A6144 Carrington Spur lost it's (M) a good while ago, and more should follow.

[@webrarian]

I've no strong feelings either way, Bryn. Perhaps because I'm in my sixties now and I've lived with them so long. BUT there must be an agreed style? Either Ax(M) or AxM. Not both. That really annoys me. And (Ax(M)) is just bizarre even though I know what it means.

[@ukroadsandtransport]

Ooh a new one, awesome video and graphics, i find the A8(M) in Northern Ireland should be revoked for obvious reasons, wasn't the A1(M) supposed to become the M100 originally

[@BrynBuck]

The M100 has been used as an administrative number but not sure it referred specifically to the A1(M) as it stands today.

[@ukroadsandtransport]

@@BrynBuck oh so similar to the M6 toll but uses the M600 as the administrative number

[@petejacob2513]

A329M missing from your list?

[@BrynBuck]

Ah balls! Well spotted! It's on the map but not the list. You win the Show Me A Sign Paying Attention Award 😁

[@petejacob2513]

​​@@BrynBuck I used to live in Bracknell, you're excused being a northerner😆, driven it 1000's of times, an interesting history, long awaited but never finished for us. Pathetic Motorways tells part of it, but having seen the original up close and personal I'm not convinced they've got it correct.

[@raphaelnikolaus0486]

What is an A road anyway? To me, a German, that stands for Autobahn. But as I understand, the M for Motorway is the equivalent to Autobahn. Also, this AxM numbering was introduced because of bypass non-main-way roads built to M standards. So, what is the A?

[@BrynBuck]

A and B were originally for major and lesser roads - equivalent would be a Bundestrasse.

[@raphaelnikolaus0486]

Ah, I see. thanks.

[@kaitlyn__L]

Specifically, in my driving theory study information I was told to learn they were mnemonics for "all-access road" and "back road"; but it's very possible those are retroactive justifications. (C-roads were apparently for "country road".)

[@Battismore-Blue]

Part of the A601(M) J35 of M6 has been downgraded not to an A road but a B road , is that unusual ?

[@BrynBuck]

It's the only example thus far I think.

[@ap9970]

You can rename them if you wish, but to me it will always be the A3(M). Especially as we would have to rename the M3 to the M30, as I don't like the idea of the M276. I am now off to drive the length of the A3(M) to show it some love and support. P.S. Great video.

[@VampMiku502]

4:45 i really feel that M181 should be downgraded and become extension of A1077 when development will complete in that area

[@BrynBuck]

Another roundabout is planned for it meaning the whole thing barring the slip roads off the M180 will be downgraded so you're not far off the mark!

[@Cyberbeagle1000]

Thank you for including Northern Ireland! Very often missed out in these vids. Yeah our motorways are daft. Why the M5 hasn't been renamed the M4 Is anyone's guess.

[@BrynBuck]

I need to get back over to NI, not been for a decade. I love the place, definitely not somewhere I want to miss out.

[@Dinoteddi]

I think personally, some Ax(M) roads should just become a Mxxx Motorway (I.e the A404(M) could become the M404), with the urban Ax(M) just becoming normal A roads (I dont think they have much reason to exist with the rise of Clean Air Zones and a wish to discourage urban car Journeys). Though those Ax(M) that act like spurs (i.e A66(M) or A308(M)) should keep the designation as Ax(M)

[@roderickmain9697]

Its stupid and confusing. The A74(M) is clearly just the M74 and the junction numbers reflect that. Its particularly stupid for the A3 and A3(M). What do people need to know? Are they following road numbers or are they following directions to towns/cities? You can also see this dilemma in European directions with some countries preferring names and some preferring the road designation first. In the US it can get to utter chaos as I've driven a road with 8 different road number designations - some claiming its one or more interstates and others saying its a part of this or that local/state road number. No idea where I was going as that was the one thing they failed to provide. So the question for UK roads - what are you trying to tell people? And apply the KISS principal.

[@BrynBuck]

You've hit the nail on the head. Numbering here dates back to 1922 and has been tweaked incrementally since leaving us with a haphazard system now that does not reflect traffic patterns of today but still thinks it's 1936 when the last serious review took place.

[@edf6607]

The A74M is odd. It would make most sense imo to extend the M6 designation all the way up to Glasgow but maybe the bureaucracy would go even more ape than normal if it involves crossing a national border as well..

[@kaitlyn__L]

@@edf6607 yeah honestly, the bizarre "non motorways" in Glasgow (regulated as regular dual or triple carriageways) do make me wonder if that reason you bring up is part of it...

[@ninesquared81]

I have a soft spot for Ax(M) numbers but I can see why they might be confusing. There are some cases where I think the Ax(M) should be replaced (the A74(M) being the obvious example). When all the scetions of the A1(M) south of Hook Moor are linked up (if that ever happens), I suppose it would make sense to give the whole thing an M-number. M10 would be my choice. Of course, north of Hook Moor it would become the M1. Something definitely needs to be done about the A3/A3(M) situation. The easiest thing would probably be to renumber the old A3 as some A3xx or A3xxx number, leaving the A3(M) as is. Another option would be to give the A3(M) an M-number, like M29 or something. Either way, the current situation is just confusing and weird. There are other Ax(M) numbers that were part of larger plans that fell through (for instance the A329(M)). If these plans are ever revisited (doubtful), they should be given an appropriate M-number.

[@sunsetexplorer63936]

Rightfully that section of the A3 should be the A397. That number’s already used on the old route in Cosham.

[@smallsleepyrascalcat]

Come on Bryn, we all know the UK used A because they wanted people to think they're travelling on a good old German Autobahn! 🤣

[@BrynBuck]

You joke but in 1938 the Institute of Civil Engineers sent a delegation to see the Todt autobahns. James Drake came back with his thoughts and the early Preston Bypass designs were heavily influenced by what they'd seen.

[@smallsleepyrascalcat]

@@BrynBuck But your folks didn't built the Motorways to quickly move troops.

[@Rail_Focus]

Great video, thanks for the explanation

[@alexlawrence1337]

Why isn't the A329(M) on that list?

[@alexlawrence1337]

Ah, you answered in another comment

[@sunsetexplorer63936]

Not a huge fan personally. I think that stretch of the A1(M) between Leeds and Newcastle SHOULD be renumbered as the M1, just as the A74(M) and M74 should be the M6. I know there’s restrictions with how the motorways are numbered so I’d have the M11 continue along the A14 to the M1 junction where it continues onto the M6. I really don’t understand the A3(M). They should have just kept it as the A3 and renumbered the route through Waterlooville and Horndean as the A397 just like it is through Cosham. Sticking with that direction I’m surprised the M27 didn’t become the A27(M) while the A27 between Southampton and Portsmouth got downgraded. The M2’s quite similar to this. Rightfully the Medway Bypass should have stayed as the A2, the current route through Gillingham and Chatham be downgraded, and the M20, asserting its significance, be numbered as the true M2. The most pathetic one I can think of would be the A46(M), a small spur from junction 21 of the M1 to what was then the A46 between Leicester and Coventry. It lost its motorway status when the M69 was built, and you wouldn’t think it was a motorway today. It remained as part of the A46 but is now the A5460 when that road began to bypass Leicester.

[@Kevin_Hones]

Thank you for another excellent video. There certainly seems to be very confused legislation (or legislators). But where did the A329(M) go? I know it exists as my house is about 150m from it!

[@BrynBuck]

I cocked up! A disaster! 😭

[@Kevin_Hones]

We all do!@@BrynBuck

[@PeterGrant]

I propose we add another letter, for roads under motorway regulations but which aren't using M numbers for whatever reason. How about N, so it's close to M but not the same? R for Restricted road? We could include some of the odd cases where there's an A road but with special restrictions thus it's a defacto motorway (Baldock bypass), plus roads currently with an M number that really don't live up to what a motorway was supposed to be (eg: have a roundabout half way along them).

[@BrynBuck]

In mainland Europe they use a "car" symbol for such roads. It's a good idea to have a secondary motorway category for those routes and it could work here if the government would actually try it.

[@GryphLane]

Once joined up the M1 could take over the northern half of the A1(M) and the southern half could become the M10. The problem you have here is that that's a massive fudge and you would need to find another route for the A1 since it forms the zone boundary between 1xxx and 6xxx. Far too much work just to rid a route of a few brackets. A3(M) is a bit more simple. Since it's south and east of the M3, give it a vacant M2x number. No zone boundary to worry about there. A74(M) is obvious. Renumber it M6 and remove the coverplates on the signs.

[@BrynBuck]

I've often suggested we introduce a brown signed "historic GNR" tourist route that could function as a boundary. If the Thames is allowed why not this?

[@davidioanhedges]

The only regulated difference between Mx and Ax(M), is that Ax(M) roads can have roundabouts on them ... but most don't ...

[@BrynBuck]

Not quite true - Mx roads can have roundabouts on them too, for example the M271 meets the M27 at a grade separated roundabout and it has traffic lights to contend with. This sums up the problem though, people are convinced Ax(M) roads are different 😄

[@davidioanhedges]

@@BrynBuckAx(M) can have roundabouts when intersecting with Mx ... So Mx can have roundabouts when intersecting with greater ...Mx's ...

[@edwilson5416]

A video on Northern Ireland's motorways would be good.

[@BrynBuck]

I definitely need to get over there again. Been too long.

[@petershillito]

So we've got M roads, Ax(M) roads, but where do A roads with motorway restrictions but without an M come in? Like the weird Colwyn Bay Bypass with the 70 signs. I know they're "special roads", but I'm not sure I understand why they're not just motorways.

[@BrynBuck]

The A55's legal orders allow tractors to use it so whilst it has been created using "special roads" legislation (now part of the Road Traffic Regulation Act), it doesn't meet the legal requirement for blue signs. All motorways are special roads but not all special roads are motorways, it's another layer of complexity just to make life difficult.

[@samonthebus]

Ax(M) numbers, they are fine if a bit quirky. I just wish there was a more rational system for allocating them as the current "system" is a bodge, but renumbering them all to fix it would also be a ball ache... how would one deal with a situation where you can't do a straight "Ax(M)" to "Mx" replacement as there are situations like the A1(M) and M1 as both roads already exist. The A74(M) is the most ridiculous as its parent A-road no longer exists for practical purposes (the only part still extant is a short section in urban Glasgow, the rest has disappeared under other numbers), in my opinion the whole A74 upgrade in Scotland should have been all parts of the M74. As a sidebar, I will point out that the A329(M) and A66(M) are missing from your list and for some reason Google Maps shows the A666(M) despite it being a secret.

[@BrynBuck]

Yep, my mistake on those two missing ones. Don't rush edit videos to keep your viewers hooked 😅

[@TedJM]

I find the AxM route designations to be woefully confusing, I would want to see the longer and disconnected city centre AxM routes get a proper M route number and the shorter spur routes that have no business being on the motorway map to be given back their old A designation on green signs (they are all dual carriageways anyway so no actual real world implications will come from giving back the old signs)

[@CyclingSteve]

Seems pretty simple. I'm more concerned about how ugly Birmingham looks with elevated roads so close to the centre, I've only been there once and must have seen the nice bits, train travel has it's benefits.

[@rogerswift1983]

I THINK... they should all be gotten rid of forever and just re-allocated with proper M numbers and all junctions on every motorway everywhere should be re-numbered from one end to the other to remove the messy 'a' and 'b's.... but that's the autistic kid living in my head. I realise getting the cost of living down is more of priority to normal people ;p

[@rogerswift1983]

ALL THE NUMBERING OVERHAULS I WOULD MAKE: ## *Total overhaul of junction numbers on ALL motorways to be numerically consistent from start to end to remove ALL ‘A’s and ‘B’s and any with missing numbers etc *EACH Axx (M) motorway to be allocated their own new Mxx numbers. *A1 (M) Mickleford to Newcastle re-numbered all as M1 and all junctions renumbered accordingly along whole of the (new) entire M1 stretch. *All the other southern A1(M) stretches EACH given their own unique Mxx numbers *Current M5 to re-numbered entirely as M6 from Exeter to Birmingham AND the A74(M)/M74 renumbered as M6 too. So then M6 becomes one long on epic super length northbound road from Exeter to Glasgow with all junctions then renumbered going south to north. So current M5 J31 in Exeterthen becomes the (new) M6 J1 and the (current) M74 1A at the top becoming M6 J80-something. *Current M6 from rugby to Birmingham re-numbered as the (new) M5 this would make more sense it’s the A5 it effectively runs along side of and by-passing anyway. Junctions 1-7 could be left numbered as is along that tho. *M62 Liverpool to Manchester to be given it’s own new number and junctions all renumbered accordingly. M62 Simister to Hullhave all the numbers re-numbered from the other end accordingly. (38 stone gate becomes J1, 37 now J2 etc etc etc) *Give the M6 Toll it’s own unique number and just add (Toll Road) to all the signs. *Re-number the M42 from where it meets the M40 to the (current) M5 (which will now be the M6, see above) as the M40 and then re-number the junctions accordingly. *and just upgrade the A42 from Appleby Magna to where it meets M1 to motorway and re-number all as M42 (FFS) and re-number the junctions accordingly when finished.