Are YOU getting your SUB’S WORTH? | Zepla reads PCGamer’s Article on FFXIV & WoW Subscription Value

[@ben9090210]

No im not. The only reason they keep me hooked is for my house. Im pissed off with the lack of content. (my direct reply to the title)

[@cutejustice]

SAMEEE 🙄 I hate owning a house so much but god damn I love my lavender plot… Maybe I should get into RP 💀

[@Daryl90]

Why I much prefer apartment

[@FrankWest-py2se]

I learned to let go and let my FC and personal house lapse after 6.55 and by the looks of things I made the right choice. It does stink though, me and my wife have been playing since ARR but after the story begun to feel like it was secondary, the two minute meta, feeling like we had to keep our sub a dub dub up to keep our house, and the modern player base that cares more about clear times over actually clearing the content, it was too much to justify paying 30 a month (plus mogshop and extra retainers). Sorry yoshida, I seriously doubt we will come back. At least we still have the set of encyclopedias to get our XIV lore fix. :D

[@xviii5780]

@@Daryl90 I managed to make two floors in my apartment with the help of a cousin 👀

[@ashtorith]

I am feeling the exact same. This expansion was mediocre at best and the lack of updates is disheartening. They better make some noteworthy updates in 7.1

[@GotekSC]

Looking at gw2 and wow, its a desaster how ffxiv launches an xpac almost completely devoid of open world content.

[@UmbraWeiss]

I'm surprised I had more fun in Throne and liberty so far than in Ff14 the last 3 years, and probably will go to play GW2 after I had enough with Throne, Ff14 is on life support for 3-4 years now, and the team only does the bare minimum with a lot of copy paste shit and nothing new on any department, being it the gear design, that is always the same... I literally sick of Healer robes and long coats for Bard in this game... And they only do those all the f ing time.... And let's not start on the Hats... They literally cut 10%of the gear from me being a Viera and you need to pay for it like a dumb F.

[@jeremywright9511]

Yeah they have zero clue as to how to do open world stuff. I swear at a certain point ff14 is just going to be a visual novel with dress up on the side.

[@leonvschris1]

THIS

[@MarkusZawodowiec]

Subscription to play? Lol i pay rent for medium house

[@Muppemania]

Same here.

[@amandagray825]

Yup, my sub is just rent for my house at this point - lots more to do in WoW at the moment.

[@MurakamiTenshi]

Same!!! Basically paying 20 USD/month for a house and retainers

[@TheAngryCleric]

Yep, I am trapped in a mortgage.

[@MarkusZawodowiec]

@@Haiyuna22 i guess i will do the same next month XD

[@itsspookie]

The FFXIV community should have listened to the players who had major concerns with the direction of FFXIV. Instead, they ridiculed and criticized these players. Fast forward, and here we are now. Current players complaining about the same thing people spoke about back at the end of Shadowbringers.

[@WanderVerse-p3q]

This is actually a huge problem. WoW players know that their game is downright awful (and it still is, even though there’s always a handful of people who are high on copium every once in a a while). What’s going on there is just embarrassing. But you have to give it to WoW players-most of them openly admit the game is bad and that they only stay because of their addiction. In contrast, in FF14, there's this toxic positivity that makes many players become very aggressive toward anyone who dares to criticize FF. That’s not good either, because only through criticism can the game improve, assuming the devs actually address it.

[@UmbraWeiss]

I say this for years now... I always get shit talking about the game and it's problems, now the Ff warriors can play their game because a lot of people are quitting, and this time probably forever... My Fc was full with people from 1.0, this expansion made them quit... I didn't saw anyone logging in for months, and I think this time it's a permanent thing.

[@SemekiIzuio]

All ill say is I hate what has become of FFXIV after catering to casuals and solo players when the game was fine for solo players and gamers alike. Although I do like that they added support for earlier dungeons but the fact that they had to dumb down already dumb arr hw dungeons is crazy just because ethe npc ai couldn't follow.

[@MrSpiderspider12]

In my opinion, and had this realization and belief for a year, all of FFXIV shortcomings can be boiled down on SE intentional/unintentional poor management SE is a corporation, and the corporation's first goal is to make the most amount of profit with the least amount of cost that results in the budget issue of devs resources The second goal of a corporation is to make sure to not having any roadblocks in the profit flow, and that also means making the least amount of unnecessary risk( in the eyes or SE) I think FFXIV reached this point because SE sees the property in a financial comfort zone, so SE thinks that as long as their "money printing machine" prints money, it only needs the minimum amount of maintainance.

[@maerto]

FFXIV is used to fund money on their failed projects

[@williamhazlett6724]

way too much time between patchs now just telling us to play somthing else only works for so long and we forget about ffxiv

[@connerlarvan8662]

It feels strange that a subscription game would have these content gaps especially for those that don't do high-end raiding, and the reason given is "respecting players' time" and encouraging them to "play something else." But shouldn't a subscription keep me engaged with enough content to justify staying? Right now, it just doesn’t feel like it offers enough to make keeping the sub worthwhile you’re honestly better off playing something else. It's a weird relationship with the game either you're in for a moment and the next your kicked out, I might just quit altogether at this point. Forget waiting, when I know I will just be bummed out again because of this structure currently.

[@Electric_Doodie]

And yet, everyone that has a house gets hold hostage in their sub, even if they don't want to play, because there is literally no content. Even Eureka and Bozja, as much content as it can be, unless you really wanted the relic gear, it's just a few weeks of side content at best (and for many, that's also type of content they don't actually like).

[@toychristopher]

It's not strange if you realize that things take time to create.

[@shigeminotoge4514]

28:30 Did YoshiP really just "small indie company, please understand" his own game?

[@HikariVictor]

Sadly it's kind of reality... At this point Yoshi-P should be Square Enix CEO and not the suit guy who's there right now. XIV's team should have like unlimited resources right now... Yet, that CEO it's a literal crypto bro trying to find a new way to scam people. For the resources they actually have right now, being the game this good it's basically a manage miracle.

[@RicardoSantos-oz3uj]

FF14 generates a lot of money. But that money is not invested back into the game. The company has wasted billions due to incompetent executives.

[@UmbraWeiss]

@@RicardoSantos-oz3uj And the biggest waste was not even the crypto garbage :)) That was just a side project compared to the shot they do lately.

[@Gortash]

2~3 months after the expansion release and my friend list is already gray, no one is online, if you check the new cities they're a desert, that's so disappointing

[@zeening]

erm... it's 8 months and you posted this 2 months ago.... that would've been 6 months lol

[@Gortash]

@zeening thank you calendar

[@Muppemania]

Answer to the question is NO. Perhaps this is because I decided to not raid this expansion, however I should not have to raid in order to have things to do for the first months of a new expansion. If the first quest of the patch is "Speak with Wuk Lamat" I am done.

[@kenallsop7502]

Jokes aside it almost certainly will be, because they normally start the new patch where the previous MSQ ended (for continuity purposes when people are playing through it in sequence). Often they then almost immediately send you elsewhere, though.

[@kincem96]

Yoshi-p already announced in an interview, they will put Wuk-Lamat even more into spot-light just to explain her character even more and for us to understand her better, after all the critism towards her boring start..🥲

[@Muppemania]

@@kincem96 I have but one thing to say about that, it will be quite short, an emote will do: /cry

[@booblaa9734]

​@@kincem96Yea that should help LOL

[@ezequielalves879]

I feel that the game has become a huge “more of the same” all the time

[@selpharessecret3899]

Way to true. Always the same slug and not even even a good story this time.

[@jannemakela8107]

As hardcore casual the repetetiveness is getting unbearable. When they release new combat content for casuals, all it is just press 1 2 3 AOE combo all over and over again. dungeons are exact same after first clear.

[@1337penguinman]

That's my main issue with WoW these days. I think every MMO has a tendency to fall into that trap. The first couple expansions you have radical changes and weirdness because they haven't figured out the formula yet. Then around 3 or 4 expansions in, you get one that's a huge hit and they just stick to that formua. Where they're too scared to make any major changes for fear of losing players and end up losing players because of boredom. This happened to WoW with Legion and I'm worried FF is falling into the same trap using ShB as the model. I'll probably stay subbed through 8.0 but if it doesn't drastically improve by then I might end up dropping the game altogether.

[@booblaa9734]

Been the same content for last like 5-6 years. It's actually impressive to me how little they add each expansion.

[@sadi5713]

if I could keep all my lvl 100 skills I think I woudl enjoy roulettes and gameplay more. they need to rework downscaling

[@Gortash]

Also people would get the chance to actually practice their rotation even on low lvl duties, which XIV's community REALLY needs to

[@JonborgVA]

Thats actually genius nothing worse then doing a low level dungeon as like a Machinist and only having two buttons

[@dannyVulture]

I actually like having less skills for capped content as it creates a need for strategy- however it is not the general view for sure. I can see how weaker skills, but a full kit would make people tolerate the content more I would like to see them rework the skills so that every 10 levels, after 50, there is a full rotation, an AoE, and relevant support skills to match available fights

[@MoxieNeon]

The apathy towards XIV really does feel like a cancer that's killing the community feel of the game. I used to log and there was always tons of people to greet me, do content with, share stories - every day was an adventure and you made real genuine friendships. Now my friendslist is dead, i've switched FCs trying to find new social environments but each one has the same problem. The only time you see people talk to each other is when they lost someone from their duty and need an emergency fill. It's lonely. It feels super bad to see my friend I've not seen in weeks in, log in, say hi, save their house and log out.

[@benoitrousseau4137]

That has been the case since mid Endwalker. SE more or less erased the community from the entire new player experience with their "wonderful" duty support system because they wanted to sell an MMORPG to players who hate MMORPGs. Today, people who make it through the MSQ have more or less played alone for 600 hours and are not typical MMO players anymore. There used to be a reason to join an FC as a new player, and as veterans that gave us a chance to play with our FC sprouts and integrate them, but now everyone just plays alone. The community as a whole also became worse as a result of this, players are more selfish and anti-social now. I'm worried what this might mean for Eureka 2.0, because what made Eureka work was the community. I recently returned to Eureka and within 5 minutes there was a colossal dipshit bragging about griefing Cassie. I did 2 Eureka weapon during Stormblood and I never saw players being so outspokenly rude... And the instances were full back then.

[@thebigandlazyguy246]

Sadly this is what happens when everything is geared towards solo play except for the highest tier of content. I used to wait for friends to run roulette because it was just THAT much faster to run them all with friends. There is zero reason to interact with anyone unless you raid. If you interact, you do it for the pleasure of it.

[@KotMatroskin]

The solution is simple: FF14 needs to add more fish with each patch. Many. More. Fish.

[@chompy1311]

No, which is why I unsubbed. Dawntrail was so disappointing and honestly, more of the same? No thanks. Corporate greed getting in the way of player satisfaction again. Yes, there are an army of toxic positivity people out there - another reason to quit - but the game is stale and needed innovation and it got nothing bar a lame graphics update.

[@wtfdidijustwatch1017]

Don’t worry, the game isn’t crying because it lost a whiny customer

[@chompy1311]

@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 You are just proving my point about a toxic player base - when I give my opinion, you can't handle it because it doesn't align with yours. Go outside and get a life mate. Honestly, such a fucking bitter cunt its funny XD

[@leafie173]

@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 You just proved their point. Please stop being so toxic. It becomes more and more embarrassing to be part of this community with people like you.

[@zeening]

@@wtfdidijustwatch1017 LMAO yes it is, and the devs will be crying alot more when they realize they're back down to PRE-SHB NUMBERS AND PISSED AWAY 3 YEARS OF HARD WORK AND GOOD WILL

[@Zantetsudex]

For a newer player it's absolutely worth it. A veteran? Not so much. Me, after I got done with the savage early and got BiS by week 5 or so? I do a daily frontline and log out.

[@janekgaganek3871]

can always try deep dungeon scoring :) But bit of joking aside, you cant really have raiding be your main thing in this game, as you mentioned, after ur done with prog its 1 day worth of content a week. I myself found mentioned deep dungeons to be very nice as my primary content, pushing the score to get on the leaderboards is cool, but aside from that i dont see many ways people can have 'primary content' outside of like RP. Technicly there is always something you can do, but more often than not it's not that attractive or straight up is just a grind (like idk getting relics or whatever)

[@gagec6390]

Yeah it's kind of like going to a buffet when all you want is mac n' cheese. Even if it's pretty good mac n' cheese, you'll tire of it quickly. Personally, I started playing at the end of shadowbringers and while I don't play 40+ hours a week very often, I am still overwhelmed with things I want to do and I have an actual priority list of content that'll still take me months or even years to clear out in some cases. On top of that I've got 3-4 community events to attend each month.

[@burtwonk]

I agree with the article. The content has been pretty disappointing for the last two years at this point. I’m unsubbing for the first time after I do the alliance raid a couple times.

[@25xxfrostxx]

I log in for less than 5 minutes per day to check my retainer and for 1 hour three days per week to do a quick farm for items to sell. Aside from 2 hours of MSQ and the 1 night of alliance raid, I have no content presented until April of 2025. They went from 3.5 months between patches to 4 months in 2022. Now they silently went to 4.5 months. No, I am not getting my moneys worth. Meanwhile the Square mismanagement continues with failure after failure and confusion as to why console exclusives on a single platform aren't big sellers. They also censored Dragon Quest so that's going to vanish like a fart in the wind. They prop themselves up with 14 being their only stable revenue and put less and less into the game over time.

[@Aoi-mirror]

This video was made before Chaotic. Chaotic blows most of these arguments out of the water. THEY HAVE THE RESOURCES. THEY CHOSE TO GIVE HIGH SAVAGE RAIDERS MORE HIGH SAVAGE. There was no excuse for that. Casual/mid-core have been staving since half way through endwalker. Its a waste and a slap in the face. They have the resources, they are wasting them.This wasn't a 'well we took a risk', this was 'we're gonna burn your sub money in your face, now go play another game'. They'd have had me for 3 months if Chaotic had been Hard normal to hard extreme. Chaotic in the 'commitment' required, is not Extreeme. I can put a blind beginners prog up for Extreme and make useful prog where people stay happy and are fun to be with.

[@NotTheWheel]

I was very demoralized when I learned 7.1 would have virtually none of the really cool stuff. I'm still raiding but raid logging sort of feels more like an obligation than enjoyable. 7.1's content doesn't even feel like a lot of content to sustain 4 months so I don't know why this is all we're getting. All the 7.1 content that isn't timegated by beast tribes I'll have done in a day. It's not enough.

[@heronoverdose]

Assuming people at end game who subscribe monthly basically pay $20 per patch is such as it stands is such a bad deal.

[@NotTheWheel]

@@heronoverdose I just stop giving them money when I don't play and there have been periods where I've stopped playing for months at a time. Raid Logging never feels good - but at least for me it gives me a reason to play. Many years back in HW coming up as a sprout I'd take breaks from playing through the story. It was so long and at the time nobody wanted to run old content with me so I was stuck as a whitemage main with new player healer anxiety - I'd sooner try to do a dungeon solo than with a group of randoms. Anyways I took breaks during those times and it took me till Shadowbringers to finally catch up... and then in EW because of the log in queues I started the first week then was like "I'll wait for the queues to go down" didn't comeback until like 6.1 THEN this expansion, I sat myself down and beat DT in two days of Early Access, did the EXs, doing the Raids now. Raid logging is enough to keep me invested. There's a bunch of other things I could do like level other jobs to 100 or Eureka/Bozja - I simply got no interest in those things.

[@genome1131]

they need to get rid of the subscription bs.

[@UmbraWeiss]

At this point yes.... They don't deserve the sub and it's not worth it at all...

[@chaoticcreations1184]

FF14 needs a massive revamp of its open world, adding casual content that will be evergreen.

[@jeremywright9511]

8.0 needs open world revamp and midcore content or it is going to lose all but the most extreme casual players.

[@lyrrviva]

Talk with Wuk Lamat for new content

[@Daniikar]

I just deleted Final Fantasy 14 off my computer. It's nearly been 3 months of NOTHING! They are really leaving all this content too late.! I'm already bored of waiting. Alliance raid is like once a week content! But we pay for the expansion! Which covers the story content. That article hit the nail on the head.

[@leafie173]

The final battle with our best friend at the edge of the universe was a nice ending. For me it will be the canon end of ff14 until they improve their game. If not... it is still a nice ending to the game. :)

[@Enclave.]

Gonna be real, I'm getting close to abandoning my medium house and just subbing once per year. Fewer and fewer of my friends are around, the FC I'm in is so quiet nowadays.

[@aceandrews7778]

The answer is it depends on the type of player you are, if you savage raid and ultimate raid while leveling your classes and grinding fates, you are probably getting your subs worth..

[@FuyuYuki92]

Would you consider posting topics like this on the main channel? Afaik, the devs do keep an eye on your main channel and feedbacks like this and I really would like them to see it. However, I will say that apparently in a recent live event, Yoshi-P apparently said something along the lines of "it takes time to develop this type of content, please don't retire", which makes it seem like he's aware. SE's development cycles are extremely long, which is probably a side effect of Yoshi-P's planning, and seems like we're still in the Endwalker lull aftermath. That being said, I'm one of these rare players who enjoy PvP even after the rewards have been collected, so yes I do find things to do, but I miss some meaningfull account progression as a non-raider.

[@light18pl]

I think if we had glam collection like in wow, that would revitilize a lot of aspects of the game. I know I would go back to do a lot of stuff to farm it.

[@Nr4747]

1:05 the subscription model is actually genius because players essentially have to pay rent to not lose their houses. SE doesn't even have to release any new content, they could just let the sunk cost fallacy do its work and collect subscriptions for the next 30+ years on houses alone.

[@Shadic67]

MMO tribalism is stupid, it's like people don't realise you can play and compare multiple games I saw some XIV players get upset on the discussion subreddit because there was too much WoW praising

[@cl7991]

This is first expansion I've just quit playing, i keep saying this is FF14's Shadowlands. I have completely gone back to fulling playing WOW instead. I log into FF to enter and exit my house and log off for 30 more days lol.

[@Duckman8213]

Given that I’ve played the game for 185 hours this month and it’s my first time playing it I would say it’s worth my money. Just finished Coils and about to start 2.1-2.5 MSQ then Heavensward. Also did the Savage Second Coil of Bahamut.

[@Mrlaged]

Yeah you're in the I've got a ton of stuff to do and explore and oh God what side around the corner phase. We envy you and remember when we were you.. if you stick with it eventually you will be one of us and you will know why this conversation is happening.

[@Duckman8213]

@ I started the game 30 days ago on October 1st. Loving it.

[@gyderian9435]

Pro tip, don't rush the experience and do the side stuffs when they unlock

[@Duckman8213]

@ I’ve done every single blue quest in ARR before continuing on with the 2.1-2.5 MSQ. I do everything when I play game. I’m doing all trials and extremes. I also already did all the raids I have available.

[@Duckman8213]

@ I don’t mind finishing the entire game and having to wait for content. I play new games all the time and have 180 platinum trophies on the PS. Between expansions I’ll be playing different games. Once I finish ARR I’ll be fininshing my Metaphor ReFantazio playthrough. After Heavensward I’ll play maybe Dragon Quest 3 Remake or Fantasian Neo Dimension (game by creator of FF and Nobuo Uematsu) so I’m very excited for that game.

[@vexxiv]

iirc didnt zepla say she was gonna post a video reviewing dawntrail? is there any updates on this?

[@taksangre]

Currently in the editing phase

[@bigfoxki]

I have thousands of play hours, but now I don't even bother to login to afk. The SMN design in DT left me such a sour taste it completely broke all my strength to play the game. Maybe I am petty.

[@rare8567]

smn was complete trash in EW too.

[@bigfoxki]

@@rare8567 At least the style was cool in EW. Many including me was expecting they giving us Leviathen, Ramuh, and Shiva, not some Bahamut-want-to-be.

[@mranere]

I guess it depends on what's important to you in the game. I enjoy spending time with the people in my FC and doing things together, no matter what it is. For me, I am definitely getting my money's worth. It helps that I am a Legacy account so, even with the extra retainers for all my junk, it's less than 2 lunches at Chick-fila-A or McD. I don't see where I get a better value on money spent vs time spent. I spend about $15 a month on the game, including retainers, so - that's $.50 a day. Where else are you going to get that kind of value for your money? So, if you don't agree with that, sub - play the new stuff, unsub, play something else for a while, lather rinse and repeat...

[@Asura.Slothingway]

I usually let patches pile up a lot, im never gonna leave the sub going since there is really no content to do.

[@ShadowPrower]

Came for the story and stayed so i don't lose my medium house xD

[@marcuscorvin9998]

What were your plans for your medium house when you first got it? Legit asking.

[@SemekiIzuio]

There is absolute zero reason to own a house at this point that isnt FC because at least the FC type houses generate gil bot from submarines airships, to using the garden. Aside from that again absolutely zero reason.

[@Sephvion]

Exploration zone/Field Operation is the only thing giving me some hope to come back and enjoy some time in that world again. Something about a group of players, all roaming a zone with a purpose, has always been something I've been drawn to. Even if it's quiet, the group has a task and are working towards it. I do wonder what ideas they have to make evergreen content, in 8.0 and beyond. If they can't or aren't being funded enough, then there will be a sub depression for a while. If they only took even a quarter of the money they used to build and quickly axe live service titles and gave it to FFXIV...

[@hayalmatnu9919]

The exploration zone should come out with the .1x patch; given how these zones tend die out after the new expansion releases, the sooner you release these zones, the more people get to enjoy them.

[@arthurdowney2846]

I recently fell down the pvp rabbit hole. I wish they'd put more time and money into that part of the game!

[@esko911]

im only paying 13usd to RENT the FC house. . . if i could log out, and let someone not let the FC house we worked a year and a half to WIN, id already had unsubbed because 4 months has been incredibly boring already. so, im sure ALOT of us pay IRL money rent, for a fake virtual house ingame.

[@marcuscorvin9998]

😂 how many people are in your fc? 2?

[@ayukuro1019]

Personally I only raidlog into FFXIV raiding 1-3 days a week. 3 days when prog 1 day when reclears. So that is 2-6 hours a week. (I dont count the hour-ish weekly for chores like tomes...) Well, I kinda do feel bad about paying my sub just for that, but as long as it was fun I was doing it, but not gonna do it anymore next patch. On wow the other hand I sub when I actually want to play the game at the start of the season and in one month of my sub on WoW i definitely play more than what I play for in FFXIV in half a year. So yea, even as a raider I dont have enough stuff to do cause i dont enjoy anything else in the game anymore and even the raids stopped bein fun. I used to enjoy extremes even experts or normal raids, but that time is long gone. Just gets really stale and way too easy once you play the harder content

[@LadyOhEvans]

i was so bored, I let them take my house and everything inside that I grinded so much for. I loved my house but I know there won't be any content worth keeping sub over and over again just to keep my house.

[@nyrahl593]

That is the problem with theme park MMOs like FFXIV. Unless there is a core community to support older content like Eureka/BA, it is dead content and nowhere near as fun as it was when it was new. Bozja, was a step in the right direction, but still suffers from a player count issue. The new exploration zones will eventually be packed with players, but unless there is a longer term plan with the zone. In 8.0, the zone(s) will be ghost towns. The ONLY content I can recall that SE has supported more than one expansion is freaking submersibles. They abandoned airships in HW, when OG Diadem was a thing. Subs, at least have been around since 4.x, and actually got NEW content with 7.0.

[@PapiKamikaze]

I’ve been playing for more than 4 years and this is the first time I’m actually thinking on start playing another mmo and just leave FFXIV, which sucks because I love this game, but I feel like they cater to story mode difficulty or super hard content, no in between. I don’t like schedules while I game, so I don’t do savage, ultimate or extreme (I do all that an expansion later when you can unsync it) So there’s little to nothing to do for players like me, which is the grand majority of FFXIV players. They need to get better or they will lose millions of players.

[@hallo-mt5tx]

i realized that if you dont raid, you can just use the 4 free day periods to do the MSQ and new content you dont have to subscribe at all

[@Chaptrap]

At this point, my sub is essentially the equivalent of paying rent for my housing plots :D

[@Raika63]

Ultimate is great, but if we're going to look at it as marketing then it would make a lot of sense to have something like the exploration content ready to keep people hooked who are going to come back from the residual world first hype. They need more resources, but that is something that you can't do too quickly without causing quality problems and delays... I just hope they are actively working on it.

[@MahalGC]

I am because I am part of a raid static that's both reclearing the current savage tier and clearing all the old savage content synced for fun, and I've been working on deep dungeon solos outside of that time. The midcore players will get their dues in march as there will be a new field operation, though if I were to change anything about the current gearing system it'd be to remove the penalty for bringing someone into a savage party that has already cleared for the week that removes the loot you would've gotten, as all it's currently doing is restricting the people I can help and play with every week and it makes me sad. Not to mention making gearing alt jobs faster so I have more options during a patch cycle to play around with, like say being able to get 2 books per encounter per week after looting the first 4.

[@spetsu1]

I think I'm getting my subs worth. Between the savage raids, still gambling for those stupid ex wings. Decorating my house, collecting glamors for alt jobs, leveling, playing the market board, and all the other things I do. It feels like I'm running out of time for the things i want to get done before the next patch.

[@Orih9]

Personally, I haven't even touched DT yet because I'm waiting for job design to change in the next expansion. It's a shame really, because there are a lot of qualities to DT that I really wish I could be a part of, but the PVE job design is just unplayable for me, and I can't justify paying a sub just to play PVP. At the same time though, perhaps this is also a good thing. When 8.0 eventually comes, and it also likely suffers a year-long content drought, I'll have all of DT's content to explore before the real 8.0 content drops.

[@大-g4b5]

Hell nah. Sub hasn't been worth it for a long while. However, I've had my medium house for 10 years and I ain't giving it up to anyone.

[@artaizen1613]

what is that song playing in the background? around 0:20 - 0:30 ish

[@Veechii]

Old Sharlayan Day Theme "The Ewer Brimmeth" around 2 minutes in

[@mrbinxkitty]

what is the song that plays at the very start of the video?? ive been trying to find it but ffxiv has so many tracks

[@looots1320]

This is sometimes I prefer gacha, cause you can choose to sub like 5-10$ a month or not and still be able to play

[@bunnifer6585]

Ironically enough, as much of a shitty business practice gachas can be, at least you're given the option to NOT pay - it's all up to whether you're responsible with your money or not.

[@looots1320]

@bunnifer6585 Gacha was frowned upon pre Genshin because you cannot progress like even do a map exploration if you don't have stamina, Genshin changed it by stamina not a mandatory for exploration

[@siocdenarf1010]

No we aren't. We are waiting for things promised years ago. QoL is not getting that better. No Vierra hats (not even all new one are working), no additional slot in houses, glamour plates are still 20 (but they found space in db for dual dye channel so stop with fake reasons), and last patch content is mostly dual-color farming. So no the money is coming back from player subs to the game. And making Grinding content because it is the only way to hide the lack of content doesn't make us feel we have sub worth its value.

[@RicardoSantos-oz3uj]

I am not getting my money worth. Instead I have an stockolmn syndrome with my house.

[@joejak5841]

I think it got worse as a single player RPG because we were promised Krile and instead got wuklamt shoved down our throats.

[@SemekiIzuio]

Omg yes!! I am a huge Kryile support er since the day she appeared . I absolutely love her!! I was excited to see in DT she finally was getting her spotlight and a revamp to her character just as every other scion has changed from their initial versions but nope they completely tossed her aside, its terrible!! She deserved so much more and I wish they touch more on her version of Echo as well and meeting others who possessed the Echo outside of Erozea, hell what if Hydalyn had other WoL our WoL meets who she was guiding not just us and we get to meet them insq not like adventure WoL for dungeons reason. Idk I feel like there so much more story they could have given

[@jonno.alexander]

I'm a returner WoL, paying my sub again. I never got the DT expansion. I decided to do all side content I ignored up to Endwalker. Somehow paying $ for DT just doesn't sit right with me yet.

[@rikiba851]

This is an Endwalker problem bleeding in to the early patches of Dawntrail. Sounds weird to say that but Endwalker struggled with sufficient content for obvious reasons, and players don't have the backlog of things they want to do that would usually fill up the early barebones part of a new xpac. Even without this, there is an enormous amount of stuff to do if you want to engage in EVERYTHING, which most people don't, but this game is also very much designed to allow a break from it whenever you want. I don't want to engage in everything, and I'm still months away from finishing the content I do want to do, although it helps that I only started playing during Stormblood. 6 years ago. My god, the amount of content in this game is insane. If you're jealous of WoW (as per the article title) then drop the sub for FF14 for now and go play WoW. Theres nothing wrong with that, its no betrayal.

[@SemekiIzuio]

This is 100% true, I've noticed there is a large amount of players who log in and don't do _anything_ no deep dungeons (PotD HoH EO) no field operations (Eureka Bozja) Both are large contents to do with rewards that are exclusive to them. There are FC who do Maps and Trials Ex but rarely do they manages Savage or Ultimate content. Rarely have I seen an active FC that offers to do everything or as much as it can. Of the many FC I've tried in one Data Center majority have been standing in limsa doing nothing but dailies and mare or whatever rping and socializing. Normally I wouldnt care but its because of _these_ people that FFXIV has become to what it is now because devs catered to them these past few years with the rpers spike. I didnt even bring up Hunts, Blu weeklies, WT that are easier content to do and get into, these same people don't bother to play with. That's the answer they don't play

[@sammiethemoogle]

I'm seeing a lot of comments of "I'm only sub for my house" and those people just need to let the house go. If you are only paying a sub for a house than it's a waste. It will open up housing for people who consistently plays. If people who don't want to play anymore should give up their imaginary house and move on to another game. If you are dissatisfied, post in the forums and please do but don't keep playing a game you are not happy with. I don't care how much you love it, it just seems like a waste of time and money.

[@heronoverdose]

I was playing almost every day from 5.4 to 6.55 but now I think it's time to let go of my house until the next big thing.

[@JonborgVA]

it does suck when the servers get DDOS and aren't able to play when you pay to play

[@KaiserDragonTV]

We need 1. A better bulk storage system like WOW and GW and other games already have pull from it to craft and hold mass tabs of crafting resources... We need Instanced housing so its a more obtainable thing giving us something to invest time and resources into and make some amazing obtain only by crafting it items lureing people to level the professions up.. I am currently eyeballing pantheon earlyaccess..

[@MadamePianissima]

Raiding in this game isnt what people talk about when they talk about ff14. Its the story and characters. Even during the WoW exodus, the big selling point was the story and how your character plays a more active role.

[@justerfot506]

I dont log in every day anymore, but when I do its to play a Frontlines match to get decent exp on jobs i don't otherwise play and some rewards, *maybe* an alliance roulette, then an occasional FC map run on the weekends. The other content just hasn't been engaging enough for me since the end of Endwalker sadly

[@bogerdank]

I went from new raider during 6.0 to raiding on every role during 6.2 and almost quit during 6.3 until I started achievement hunting from 6.4 onwards. Recently got Final Fish so thanks to the giant backlog I'm getting my money's worth. However, if I wasn't, I most likely would've either took extensive breaks between releases or quit entirely. For all it's worth I'm worried for when I'm done with achievements and truly reach the end that I'll log off for last time deeming the trajectory of the game not worth continuing.

[@ReveredDead]

Funny how WoW players flocked to FF14 in Endwalker. Now the tables turned. Like what?

[@SemekiIzuio]

Theres alot to do for me only because I dont play this every month, I pick it up for a few before dropping it and picking it up again after a year or so. I think that is the intention in which the devs want the player base to be but unfortunately for them many players play everyday every month. Sometimes even if I still have plenty of msq to go through ngl I create new characters just so that I have leveling and goals to get through because as you progress the less content goals activities there is to do.

[@andrewolivetreemixing]

I’m getting a lot out of it because I started late and am still catching up with all the content. I guess that was a good move

[@Vincent_63]

It is 100% the budget

[@SteveDonev]

It usually takes me about 1-2 months to work my way through post game. Even if they released everything all at once, I would still unsub after im done. Now I just don’t do post game until the new expansion comes out. It really changes nothing for me

[@Inseril]

Although I have not heard Square come out public, but someone I know who has knowledge of the of the data behind the scenes, but subscribers only play 1/3 of the content in the game. Many casual players have not touched anything other then MSQ, I was shocked because I have always been a completionist.

[@wargur]

I actually finally got around to cancel my FFXIV subscription when I started listening to this. I've been thinking about it for over a year now and have been so bored of the formula that the only times I've really logged on is to cancel my house demolition timer. I really hope this article and people's reaction to it pushes them to spend resources to innovate and shake things up. I really hope they give me a reason to want to play the game. For me, Dawntrail felt like cementing their stagnation.

[@joshk6929]

It really killed the experience for me as a casual player. I don't do high end contents, I have since stopped the sub after 7.0 is done. If I were to log in daily just for the boring loop of farming tomestone, I rather do something else with the same investment.

[@AnnieMay1]

first off, ffxiv does try to keep you subbed, they almost literally hold a gun to your head, forcing you to keep your sub if you own a house and dont wanna lose it. second, the sync has to be fixed, no one wants to play til lvl 100 just to never use their entire kit in 90% of the duty content. as badass as i feel as a dancer at synced lvl 20, i'd also like to feel badass as a pally, summoner, ninja, etc. at lvl 20.

[@violetbliss4399]

I think job levelling does so heavy duty support for the first year of an exp. I feel like jobs are so polished now that the extra 10 levels are lower value. Also, job quests > role quests in feel and anticipation, even if content may be worse.

[@Tsu_ness]

I decided the house isn't worth it and dropped my sub. Might try again next expansion or something idk.

[@jbinfa7k]

Our fate is to redo everything when 8.0, 9.0, and 10.0 come. So what's the point? Moreover, I keep losing every housing lottery. I think I am ending my sub. soon.

[@KaiKouran]

Micro management saved this game, and now it's killing it.

[@k3stea451]

i hope more people that are unsatisfied with FF14 start unsubbing in droves so either SE can make an effort to make the game better or just let it die. personally i still really like the game but if it's not good enough to survive then it is what it is.

[@deckofcardboard]

No mention of the different customer expectations from TWO DIFFERENT MARKETS? I wonder if Japan's market would be even more resistant to change than the West.

[@Suberi909]

I think they already confirmed exploration zone being in 7.2 series in Korean Fan Fest

[@mx4690]

Not fun for a raider when your savage content every week is sunrise lottery as well

[@dfloriza]

I’ve been playing for four years now and I’m glad I’ve been the ultimate procrastinator 😂 there’s still stuff for me to do because I was just too lazy to do it before haha I still need that ozma mount from Eureka

[@luckyarchery]

Responding to the title: yeah I don’t feel like I’m getting my sub’s worth. After I’m done with 7.1 content, I plan to give up my medium house for an apartment so that I can unsubscribe for a while. My partner is a wow player and tells me about some of the things added recently in terms of content and quality of life. I just find wow so difficult to get into as a new player. I can’t say I’m not envious of the enjoyment he’s been getting.

[@zeening]

1:07:45 YOU CAN LINK GUILD CHATS IN WOW NOW!?!?!

[@cuddlybear781]

My friend always said he'd quit WoW for FFXIV in a heartbeat if they had Mythic Plus (and done better). And I agree that would pull me into FFXIV more often as well.

[@zeening]

the duty support was SUCH a waste of time, i STILL can't get ANYONE ANYONEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE to do trusts or duty support "but why would i do that it takes so much longer? ill still learn from watching other people....." im SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO glad they didn't give us content for an entire expansion to do THAT!

[@Horstveratu]

At this point i will just unsub.. too bad i wanted to make a badass house but it's more important to show them they are lazy and doing all the wrong things no more money from me until they start to shake things up. I'm sick of them being lazy and doing everything by numbers, even the story pacing and dungeons etc. all follow the same pattern since shadowbringers. Post endwalker story was already trash, all of dawntrail was boring and missed the vacation vibe by miles, the patch content is just ass, how is this gonna last for like 5-6 months if you don't grind out ultimate... fk it plenty of other things to do . Gaming turned to sht this year, the best thing to do it vote with your wallet.

[@MrJoyShow]

To answer the question, no.. I haven't felt it's been worth it for a while. I've been more or less used to the content droughts for a while now, and I've been strategically unsubbing just long enough so I don't lose my house. I've usually been able to make my own fun in the downtime in this game over the years with roleplay, bard performances, hanging out with friends etc, but there's been so many factors that have damaged even that. Cross-DC travel being so prominent, it's fragmented friend groups quite a lot in my experience. With the way the friend list works, it's rarely clear where your friends are or if you can even message them at all. The MSQ was not everyone's cup of tea.. and certainly not mine. A lot of loose ends have been tied up to the point where it now feels we're at a very boring, safe dead end of a world state without lasting conflict. This isn't even a Dawntrail-specific thing, nor is it even an Endwalker patch cycle thing. It's the result of so many little conflicts being resolved in the world, to the point where it's made it far less interesting and flawed. I hope I'm proven wrong, but as it stands I'm not excited for 7.1's MSQ at all. This is a matter of taste, of course.. and I don't expect most people to get hung up about this as I do. But when the story is such a huge part of the game, it informs a lot of roleplayers and how they play their characters, and for me it DOES affect my ability to get enjoyment out of the rest of the game. As far as content goes? Yeah, I'm not enthused about doing roulettes every day to very slowly get gear that doesn't really change how the game is played. I welcome the Exploration Zone whenever it releases, but it's so far away I can't get excited for it. I dunno.. XIV's gotten me through some pretty tough times in my life, but this is a continuing low point after the EW patch cycle.

[@botdog78]

I look at the holloween event in throne then i look at the one we got in ffxiv...... i pay for ffxiv 😢

[@connerlarvan8662]

so true

[@RicardoSantos-oz3uj]

Creative Business Studio 3. Needs to remove the Creative from their name as they no longer deserve it.

[@WhoStoleMyRavioli]

No. Im not getting my worth. There are TWO reasons why im still subbed. One being the modding community and two because if i dont stay active i lose my house. Theres just not enough content to keep one satisfied until the next patch.

[@robind.2290]

For those of us FFX14 newbies, we have alot to do and alot to catch up on so ya, our sub is useful! However, I can understand how those veteran players are disappointed and disillusioned with this new expansion's slow progression. The same happened with WoW until the most recent expansion. WoW is now unfolding new developements at a much more rapid rate then previously. SE needs to step up their game!

[@Nyx_Oskurita]

I mean, I’ve been grinding my ass off for some gemstones for both the black wings and new mount while I blast music, I’m still taking care of my Island Sanctuary (I like purchasing rare dyes there) plus I like grinding old relics. Finished all the HW ones and I’m almost done with ShB ones. While simultaneously working on collecting the field notes in Bozja.

[@Destshade]

with the exception of gemstone (aka fatefarm) everything else was added in previous expansions

[@marcuscorvin9998]

@@Destshade We're not even at 7.1 yet and you're comparing this expansion's content to previous full expansion cycles. 😂

[@soluslunares6682]

​@marcuscorvin9998 damn true. I'm glad OP actually still has this though.

[@Destshade]

@@marcuscorvin9998 I am not comparing anything - just stated a fact. Good strawman tho.

[@marcuscorvin9998]

@@Destshade You are comparing. All the extra stuff the OP posted was delivered in the post patches of each expansion. Dawntrail just started and you expect it's content value to be equivalent to that of an entire expansion cycle. "Good strawman", is that what the kids are saying these days? Explains a lot.

[@Logos6]

The only reason i keep my sub up is to keep my house. I might stop to be honest

[@Alurin93]

FF has the difference sources for loot (gear), they just won't let it drop in the other sources

[@TenzieTV]

The problem I think FFXIV has is there is no mid core content, at all. U go from MSQ , extreme trials, to raids , to savage , to ultimates. And unpopular opinion maybe but dungeons and alliance raids just don’t count here IMO. They should come out with some way to progression outside of raiding ( and I am talking as someone who enjoys character progression) if there is an item I can get that will make me stronger that will make getting the next item easier via savage or other. Then there should be some kind of content to do that. Farming tombstones is just boring. I find myself only logging on for raid nights because I just jump around limsa. I also understand that not everyone plays the game the same. But we need somthing. Dungeons plus or even savage extremes or idk something anything.

[@SemekiIzuio]

They had that via Relics but they shot themselves in the foot with EW and just handing poetics. In fact the other day I was looking at the replicas an notice that expansion had 5 versions of it unlike it former relics that every single one had 6 variations and 5 steps while EW only had 4steps with one weapon, the final weapon design not having a non glow version.

[@tahroo4262]

Damn that last bit about FOMO makes me look at Forza Horizon 5 different.. their weekly rotation of rewards is annoying because sometimes I just can't make it on that week... but if there wasn't weekly quests would I even want to be there?