ARE YOUR Masters Being DESTROYED When You Limit Like THIS?

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Hello, I'm Nicholas Di Lorenzo, Studio Owner, Mixing and Mastering engineer at Panorama Studios.
I'm an Italian-Australian born and raised in Melbourne. I've been a creative professional for 10 years managing some pretty awesome projects for artists, labels and producers all around the globe.
What motivates and drives me?
My family,
Good food,
Great coffee.
You can find me on many platforms:
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Kit: kit.co/Panoram...

[@Nathankaye]

Here is the main problem with the notion of mastering for each different streaming service; most music distributors do not give you the option to provide different masters for the different streaming services. Meaning, that you provide them with one file, usually a wav file. And they upload to all 150+ stores. So your master must adhere to what will work best for all of them, which is an averaging. In other words, you can’t do a separate master uploads for Apple, than from Spotify. This myth needs to be busted.

[@panorama_mastering]

Nothing I disagree with here at all! I hope my messaging isn't misinterpreted for people to think that's the point of this excersize? The idea is to AUDITION your master as a "worst-case" scenario using a 96kbps codec; not to create a seperate master as a result; just THE master

[@kellsmadeit]

Thank you for these videos & touching on topics such as these. Music can come out insanely loud, punchy and translateable on even the worst & most realistic poor DA systems like smaller flat screen TV's, with True Peak ON and out ceiling of anything like - 0.5 to - 0.3. If the mix is right and loudness acheived within, TP and out ceiling should make basically no difference, and will still compete with the absolute loudest and best. This can be dependent on the quality of your limiter as well, I am using and referencing the Pro-L 2. Also anyone who is not checking their finals on poor yet realistic DA systems like smaller flat screen TV's may be in for a slightly rude awakening, though hopefully not! Modern Cell phones don't count, their speakers and DA conversion are actually quite decent.

[@panorama_mastering]

Bang on!

[@davidasher22]

Didn’t you do a blind test between TP limiting and (not TP) limiting where you couldn’t tell the difference? Curious as to why you still have such a strong opinion about it. Maybe there’s more to the story? Definitely would like to see you explore that topic some more. Thank you for the wonderful content!

[@panorama_mastering]

Yes I did! But I'm going with my gut; and I don't know if that's a good thing; So rest assured; i've reached out to some contacts I have in the programming and DSP development space to help me understand how TP limiting is programmed and what it is doing; I'm also planning to do much larger scale blind tests with the community; and then I'm going to aim to draw some objective conclusions we can use in our practices!

[@davidasher22]

@@panorama_mastering beautiful! That’s actually quite exciting. Looking forward to that indeed.

[@ryde2012]

Please do a video on why you don’t like true peak limiters

[@Limit5482]

In a 🥜 shell, It just sucks the life out of transients so dynamically it doesn’t sound the same Some like it some don’t I agree and I only use it once and awhile

[@ryde2012]

@@Limit5482 Thanks, quick question does the transient recovery on the ozone maximiser help with the transients when using true peak?

[@Limit5482]

@@ryde2012 I have never used Ozone can’t say. Ask the “ozone sponsored” guys for that

[@ryde2012]

@@Limit5482 thanks 👍🏾

[@hithere4289]

@@ryde2012 ozone is great and i wish i were sponsored by them 😢

[@entity9588]

I hate the way TP limiting sounds as well. I think Sonible's Smart Limit has the best sound of all TP limiters but I still prefer no TP limiting.

[@panorama_mastering]

I really want to take an objective the whole TP; in previous video's I've done a few blind tests but nothing absolute/conclusive to see how it all pieces together;

[@leckel1996]

I use limiters and clippers with no oversampling and no ISP limiting. I’ll usually MONITOR ISPs and adjust the output trim accordingly, but that’s all.

[@panorama_mastering]

oversampling is probably not a bad bet to have on; aliaising distortion is irreversible and can't be negated by an output trim;

[@panorama_mastering]

​@@TheJohnsofDoes are you refering to minimum phase oversampling?

[@CLdwyer]

@@TheJohnsofDoes ​ All he asked is a clarifying question. I would further ask, have you actually tested for yourself which plugins or processing provides you with this “minimum phase” over sampling? I’m sure developers may vary on the use of those. But my follow up question for the convo is this, in eq, minimum phase actually helps retain the transient integrity whereas linear phase has ringing that can smear a transient. What part of the frequency spectrum or time domain is being negatively impacted by minimum phase oversampling? I’m unaware of this particular concern.

[@EpithetMusicTV]

from my rudimentary understanding, when done right, the aliasing from oversampling filters shouldn’t impact the audible range. if they’re impacting transients the filter probably isn’t steep enough. this is more likely to occur when working at 44.1 as nyquist and therefore the filter would be significantly closer to 20k. when working at 96, with nyquist being at 48k there shouldn’t be any audible impact from anti-aliasing filters. if i remember correctly, fabian from tokyo dawn records (makers of plugins such as kotelnikov) has some good insights into filter steepness and aliasing in some posts on gearspace.

[@kellsmadeit]

Check your mixes on speakers like smaller flat screen TV's. They tell the truth in the worst & most realistic case.

[@vinylmastersgr1036]

Many new greek digital songs have True Peak over +3 and distort awfully. Integrated LUFS are around -9 to -8 in Greek commercial music but since 2019 true peak was not surpassed +1, usually it was 0.5. The other problem is the hard bass and hard drums and no high end because here also they follow the tempates of Taylor Swift and Billie Eilish.

[@substance90]

Modern neurofunk tracks with inter-sample peaks of 1.5dB in the WAV and over 3dB in the 320kbps mp3: HOLD MY BEER 😅

[@6ense]

0:20 gave me mad VSauce vibes 🤓

[@panorama_mastering]

Awesome! I'm doing my job ;)

[@diezdoce.mastering]

Can you do a video of your workflow with Izotope RX when mastering? That would be really interesting

[@panorama_mastering]

I might have to ! Too many people asking

[@diezdoce.mastering]

@@panorama_mastering will wait for it patiently, there isn’t any tutorial on how to manage the peaks of the audio like you do on the videos yet

[@deadislander]

i also hate true peak limiting, as soon as i turn that button on, my kicks are trash

[@panorama_mastering]

Spot on!

[@OZKitchen]

How much gain reduction are you seeing when this trash happens?

[@LOHT369]

Great video

[@panorama_mastering]

Thanks mate!

[@oscarpatxot659]

Even myself, that mastering is not my stronger skill, I also hate the sound of TP

[@panorama_mastering]

EVERYONE seems to!

[@LGDCexode]

Great video! I was wondering if you had tried the stealth limiter from Ik multimedia that tries to reduce Iintersample peaks?

[@panorama_mastering]

NO I haven't I'm curios how it would try to reduce the ISP's....

[@RobMitshi]

If anyone here is into making electronic music, feel free to ask me some questions lol, I'm not offering courses, just looking for friends/good music and can offer some good feedback, cheers, keep producing.

[@panorama_mastering]

Great offer! Good vibes! Which producers are you most inspired by?

[@RobMitshi]

@@panorama_mastering Dave Clarcke, Marko Bailey, Egbert, Technasia, Umek, The Blaze, oh soo many...

[@trevorellis-guice5794]

I’ve been using adptr stream liner to check for this. Are you trying to not clip at all?

[@panorama_mastering]

Nice! My aim isn't to whether or not I clip, the aim is to monitor that clipping and make an asessment on how to move forward;

[@NoQualmsTheArtist]

That's because true peak sounds like crap, I don't know why it just does 🤷🏾‍♂️ I'm sure someone smarter than me will let me know in the comments 🤣

[@Ruffilicious]

4:20 UwU

[@kromanoidx]

LMAO

[@isc4915]

Just leave 1 db of headroom and move on

[@panorama_mastering]

Possibly so; but in my latest video; I go deeper on some of the flaws in normal PCM encoded limiting;

[@guthhalf5484]

If your song have to be louder to be better, you need a new song.

[@panorama_mastering]

I'm not at liberty to verify this ;)

[@Limit5482]

Yay let’s start making masters sound good at 96kbits How about next we start developing an iPhone limiter that helps negate limiting for those last 2 notches of volume 🤦‍♂️ Good luck out there

[@panorama_mastering]

If we don’t do our best to make our masters sound good at 96kbps then we’re neglecting 90% of the streams which people will consume…

[@Limit5482]

@@panorama_mastering is there actual data to support this? What bandwidth data is streamed at 90% of the time? Because if it’s at 96k 90% of the time then might as well just set all limiters at -1 and be done with it Won’t make much of a difference at that point

[@NoQualmsTheArtist]

@@Limit5482 this is literally industry standard. Our jobs as professionals is to make sure the song sounds good in all formats, not just the ones you think are relevant. That is in our job description, it's not a choice if you are a professional and do this for a living.

[@Limit5482]

@@NoQualmsTheArtist good luck with that boss Keep doing your thing

[@panorama_mastering]

You’re correct to question the 90% because that’s a figure pulled out of my ass, but one can assume an overwhelming majority would be streaming spotify on a desktop, mobile or tablet, which nominall6 plays back at 96kbps. I don’t think there is anything wrong in that assumption and accepting thats the reality of majority consumer playback for the platform at the moment. And also nothing wrong either in professionally taking into account the limitations of the media in which it is transcoded to from the production masters we’re responsible for.

[@BurningBushPedagogy]

Rocket science, why people like to teach like they are talking about rocket science, nothing complex that can't that can't be simplified, I been avoiding your videos because of this pattern of yours, but I clicked bc of the interesting title, then started hearing someone speaking very fast as if they are more interested in showing off how well versed they are than care if people will actually clearly understand what they trying to get across. Jezzzz bro calm down, even the multi Grammy winners won't sound like this. This is feedback for your channel, take it or just think we are haters, your choices, but I won't anyone who teaches the way you do, calm down, its not quantum physics.