ARP 2600 M // Faithful Modern Reissue or Relic of the Past?

[@ronnie_astro]

I saw a video of Anthony Marinelli who programmed the patch of the famous bassline of Michael Jackson’s Thriller. Where I thought this was probably a Minimoog, I was surprised it was actually programmed with the ARP2600. Just a fun fact. 🍀

[@devinbelangermusic]

That's a super fun fact! Anthony is a legend, I am so happy to see him on youtube these days.

[@DreamscapesMusicCinema]

Amazing presentation Miles! Thanks for the awesome story as well. I have a couple vintage boards an use them alot. I hope your having a great 2024 so far! Mark Bensette Aux Bois 🇨🇦.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Thanks! You too! What current vintage boards are you using, Mark?

[@DreamscapesMusicCinema]

@@devinbelangermusic Your very welcome Miles. I have a KORG TRINITY with custom sounds in Banks C and D. Same withe a Korg MS 2000 and a Yamaha Motif SX7. I like mixing them with new stuff. You may like the new ROLAND GAIA 2 just got that. Pretty cool. I'm Sound hunting though it these days. Well worth the price. I have my eye out for an Alisis Andromeda...lol. Have a great day Miles!

[@devinbelangermusic]

That's a sweet set up. Need to try the Gaia! I too would love an Andromeda one day, such an epic synth.@@DreamscapesMusicCinema

[@DreamscapesMusicCinema]

@@devinbelangermusic yup! The big A is in my list too. What is the King of your set up? Mine has to be the still learning Waldorf Quantum.

[@JeffPalmer83]

I recently got a 2600M and I just find it very fun to experiment with, partly because there’s no patch memory, so it always has to be hands on and creative. Side note: Loopop’s video has a great PWM technique that uses the S&H clock run through the lag processor and then put to PWM patch point for VCO 2, which saves you having to relegate VCO 1 or 3 to being an LFO.

[@devinbelangermusic]

It is great for experimenting! That's a great tip, I didn't even think about using a Slewed S&H as an LFO. Very cool.

[@limbicbits]

Absolutely. I like the Behringer 2600 a lot but personally would choose the Korg Arp 2600 M over it if budget doesn't play a role.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Do you think they sound different? Haven't had the chance to play a BARP yet. But demos online it seems really solid.

[@cougarman8]

@@devinbelangermusicI think they sound different, and have both. I love both, but the korg sounds better. I wish it weren’t the case as the behringer version is so much more affordable. The b2600 really is fantastic, but when I compare them, the korg one definitely sounds better and I’m not sure why. The b2600 has some big advantages though! I’m keeping both:)

[@IanWaugh]

Hey Miles - Nice video, some cool tips and interesting conclusion 😊 The Korg looks great but is significantly over-priced, as most Korg gear has been recently. Behringer;s 2600 doesn't look as good but it has a LFO and is 1/4 the price 😲 Totally agree that 'iconic' instruments are not everyone's instrument. I still lust after a MS-20. Silly, I know...

[@devinbelangermusic]

Thanks for watching Ian! I would really like to check out the Behringer version. I originally had no interest as it doesn't have real spring reverb (which I think is a core part of the 2600 sound), but the new Blue and Orange face B-clones apparently have real springs. And I'm with you, the MS20 is another one I used to covet and still do! Such an iconic synth, the PWM Malevolent scratches that itch for me now. Did you see my video on it?

[@IanWaugh]

@@devinbelangermusic I'm not a big spring fan and prefer the DSP in the brown and orange one. There's a spring in my Grandmother 😊 which is OK but I'd prefer the FX in the Matriarch, Not tempted by the Mal for some reason... 😲

[@devinbelangermusic]

@@IanWaugh fair! I also agree the Stereo Analog BBD in the Matriarch is truly special. If you like that sound but don’t need another synth, watch my video next week on the first True Stereo Analog BBD Delay Pedal. It’s the most beautiful thing I’ve heard if you are drawn to that sound

[@IanWaugh]

@@devinbelangermusic 👍

[@nilsvanderplancken]

@@IanWaughto me that was the biggest difference between the behringer and the 2600 fs. The spring in the behringer is very ugly and ‘springy’, on the 2600 fs it sounds super spatial and useful. Not sure what is used on the 2600m. I agree when going for the behringer the dsp spring version is far better. Wish Behringer wouldn’t use those cheap looking led faders.

[@EvilWaysGaming]

The moog grandmother shares a lot of same sound space. Have a grandmother and amazed how similar they sound.

[@devinbelangermusic]

I can totally see that! I absolutely love the Grandmother. If I didn't have a Matriarch I would 100% buy one. The modern Moog semis are just so good sounding.

[@ObaidliRecords]

what semi modular can replace it ?

[@aquaticborealis4877]

The ARP 2600 is a beast. The umph you get is crazy.

[@devinbelangermusic]

For real it has such a distinct sound. Less buzz and grit than a Moog, a bit more woody-sounding instead, but SO much power and low end on the 2600.

[@Jason_Drums_]

Amazing 😃 just the fact this Incredible Synth was the Voice of #starwars #r2d2 is Amazing 🤩 Incredible history lesson 🙏🏼 Fantastic Video and Demo as Always 👌 🤩 🙌

[@devinbelangermusic]

Thanks Jay!

[@ILoveTeles]

Great explanation. Thank you!

[@devinbelangermusic]

@@ILoveTeles thanks so much!

[@paulfrank9047]

The ARP is a piece of history, but the effort needed to make a sound utilizing its full capacity is much higher than more stripped down subtractive synths that are normalized or require little or no patching. That alone will make casually grabbing one to sketch a whole song somewhat tedious. Which is why I never wanted to buy one. The amount of time necessary in this video just to get PWM with a triangle like wave shows how inefficient it is to use this without really knowing the layout. Also, it’s not like the end result is much different than other analog synths so all that time will really end with is a really nice sounding analog sound with a unique tone but not that is functionally different from other more typical synths.

[@devinbelangermusic]

I couldn't have said it better myself - this is exactly what I was discovering over making this video. It sounds absolutely incredible, but having spent time learning other synths that can do most of the sounds I enjoy much more efficiently, the Arp just didn't resonate with me for making entire songs the same way as say a Matriarch or OB-6 did. However of course there are 2600 masters who can work so quickly on it, they can make any sound they can dream with despite the limitations.

[@klontart]

I respectfully disagree with both of you. ;) If looking for a solid, stripped down analog synth with a quick workflow, the 2600 is imo not a good choice, and there are way better alternatives out there nowadays. If however you’re looking for a great sounding semi modular for sound sculpting and experiments, that also does the classic sounds, the 2600 should be very high on your list. Imo of course. ;)

[@MrCowfood]

Love the gas, you got to experience this iconic beast because of it, and selling it on satiated any fomo you might experience later with a minimum of loss. Cheers!

[@devinbelangermusic]

Well said! Love that mentality. Thanks for watching!

[@ageshero]

Your videos are so helpful, I’d like to see a real deep sound design and relevancy (pros and cons) Prologue video, even how it matches up to the prophet 6

[@devinbelangermusic]

Thanks for the note! I've got a packed video schedule but I still own and love the Prologue, so will consider it if things slow down! I heard Korg might announce a successor to it? Would be curious to see what they do, since the Prologue is a future cult classic now that its discontinued.

[@Iamirxclej]

Beautiful ❤

[@devinbelangermusic]

Thank you for watching!

[@PabloGarcia-sf7bn]

Relevant shmelevant! I love jamming on stuff. I want it all and I know im not alone. Frankly who the f are we making music for anyway? I must make authentic music for people that are nonexistent because reasons! Like gear? Buy it. Don't like it don't. Just because an instrument isn't on every precious piece in no way makes it irrelevant. To an imaginative musician everything is worth acquiring. They have all made players approach ideas in a new creative way. People can send me anything they feel is irrelevant and I'll jam it. Great demo. I want one. Greetings from New Mexico!

[@devinbelangermusic]

Amen! Agreed totally, its a valuable lesson to be able to learn to just make the kind of music with the kind of music gear that speaks to you personally. Thanks for watching!

[@GuitarsAndSynths]

we make music for phantom fans

[@swanofnutella4734]

Thanks Miles. Great dive. Been considering the Evil B version. I have a specific application in mind. Using it as a signal processor to "F-up" vocals. I could use any vst vocoder, but... Ok, here's the thing: R2-D2 is cool and all, but what I really love is those moments in the OG SW trilogy where Ben Burt used his arp to "F-up" com chatter between X-wing pilots. Maybe I'm wrong, but there's something a little extra (a touch of ring mod?) to some of that, that I don't think you can get by just screwing things up with a vst, or even re-recording vox via a walky talky or whatever. What do you think? As always, appreciate your content. Cheers.

[@devinbelangermusic]

That's so cool! I didnt know that the ARP was used in the starfighter chatter as well. Great fact. I could see either ring mod or maybe sample and hold being used there. Thanks for watching and sharing!

[@swanofnutella4734]

@@devinbelangermusic Well - To be fair - I don't know! It's purely a speculative guess. ....or maybe. Gosh. Maybe I did hear that in some obscure Doc with Ben B in it?? My brain is fried today, sorry. But I don't want to spread misinformation. Best to consider it a mere possibility.

[@Zaccyonline]

I have the full size, phenomenal and inspiring.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Lucky you! Enjoy that piece of history!

[@dirckxd]

For me it is quite the inverse: after buying the 2600M, I added the 2600FS. I would never let a classic go.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Fair! We all have that one classic synth that speaks to our soul. For me - I dream to own a Prophet 5 one day. Even though I definitely don't need one, given my OBX8. Classics are so inspiring :)

[@dirckxd]

@@devinbelangermusic Indeed, I get the point. I have also some beasts in the studio but the potential of the 2600 cannot be underestimated. Nine inch nails mostly used it as an effect processor for example - the 2600 keeps surprising me. The videos of Anthony Marinelli (who worked on MJ Thriller) are very educational BTW.

[@RabbitintheMoon]

definitely a blast to use... love mine

[@devinbelangermusic]

Amazing! What kind of sounds do you typically find yourself making on your 2600?

[@RabbitintheMoon]

@@devinbelangermusic been using it a lot with the korg sq-64 to make cool arps and percussive type loops... and running it through things like the west pest wave folder. and the Strega... I don't use it like I would my regular mono or poly synths..Since I come from playing piano,, I perform my music on those regular synths the 2600 is it's own beast... I make a lot of loops and things and just record jams,,, then later take those elements in ableton and use them in tracks... It really is the happy accident machine,,, but don't blink you might just miss it...

[@Matt-Horizon]

Great video! I've owned a Arp Odyssey which I really liked, sold it to get the Behringer 2600 to see how it's bigger (fake) brother works. I really liked the sound but I could never pull out the cables becouse than my patch was gone. I also really miss an octave switch per osc, or just a global one, like on the Odyssey. The sounds that i liked were easier to make on the Odyssey, so i sold it again and bought the Limited edition Odyssey back and it will never ever leave my studio again. But i have to say, i've been eyeing the Arp 2600 again lately and i just love the way it looks, sounds and it's fun to patch soooo... maybe one day

[@devinbelangermusic]

Wow lucky you with the full size Odyssey! I'd love to try one eventually, I've only used the GForce software. I think I am similar to you, in that I love the convenience of ergonomically laid out Monos like the Sub 37, Minimoog, Odyssey etc, even if it means giving up some depth. When it comes to deep sound design, I tend to prefer big flagship polysynths over semi modular. Thanks for watching and sharing !

[@MisAnnThorpe]

I've heard that the keyboard action on the FS Odyssey is inferior to the reduced sized version. How do you find it?

[@synthkingmusic]

I love my 2600m. Tbh I didn’t think it was for me when I first got it too. However, after spending more time with it and comparing it to my other synths, it just has this raw scientific sound lab vibe to it I find really intriguing. Yes, maybe it doesn’t have every feature available on it especially for the price, but what it does it does great. I can see how it’s not for everyone though.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Well said! I totally agree with you, the raw tone of it is genuinely unique and nothing else sounds like it to me. I really think the filter/mixer/spring reverb create something so organic yet precise. I think if I didn't have the Syntrx 2 I would have held onto my 2600M, but the music I make is fairly poppy, so I just wasn't taking advantage of how oddball the 2600M can get, especially since I am more skilled with the Syntrx. And it wasn't worth it for me using the 2600M to make simple plucks, leads and basses, so it had to go.

[@kierenmoore3236]

Played with the Ring Mod, but no R2-D2 impression … 😔. Not easy to replicate?!

[@devinbelangermusic]

You need to plug a mic into the Arp audio input and use it to control modulation with your voice! Tom Noise has a good tutorial on youtube how to do it.

[@meedily]

God I love that sound.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Such a classic sound right! Matriarch/Grandma is the only other modern semi modular that gives these vibes.

[@softbytesunlimited]

That's a lot of stuff to experiment and create a unique sound. 😮

[@devinbelangermusic]

It's definitely a very interesting workflow - it forces you to deeply learn subtractive synthesis to get where you wanna go!

[@raskinlex]

Miles will you make a video on Cobalt 8 (without Argon 8) I need to sell one.. The only problem is that after every video of yours I end up saying to myself that this synthesizer has so much potential, it's a shame to sell something like this, I should keep it for myself 😊

[@devinbelangermusic]

LOL! Sorry my video is stopping you from selling. I have nothing bad to say about the Cobalt, its a great synth. I replaced mine when I got my 3rd Wave but I miss it, so good for classic analog sounds and so fast to make songs with. Did you hear Modal went out of business :( so you might want to keep it as they might get hard to find in a few years.

[@thedarkestrainbow]

To the point that it is more efficient to work on other synths. Yes it is. But I’d argue that a big part of the 2600 experience is the using of it. Its inefficient nature nurtures experimentation that you may not arrive at with more simple curated synths.

[@devinbelangermusic]

I love this comment! Such a good point and good philosophy for using hardware synths in general :)

[@TaklaMakanMusic]

I like the sound of it, but the horizontal sliders for tuning and controlling the filter I find awkward to use. Also the AR envelope is a little sluggish.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Agreed! That's the beauty of these vintage recreations/reissues. They keep all the quirks of the originals to preserve history. Thanks for watching!

[@SPAZZOID100]

The Behringer version has 3 different response modes on both the ADSR & AR.

[@TaklaMakanMusic]

@@SPAZZOID100 There's three different speeds available. Sadly, it doesn't change the overall shape of the AR envelope and that's the problem with it for me. The ADSR is fine, but the attack curve on the AR generator spends way too long at the top end of its travel before reaching its peak. It's part of the original design and charm, but I would have preferred a better attack shape like that on the ADSR.

[@muppetpaster]

6:04 You're kidding me?! Fine tune is used for fine tuning??

[@dreamtekeuphoricmusic]

I’ve got the 2600 FS…..sounds great!

[@devinbelangermusic]

Oh wow! Lucky you. I've never played one. Does the 2600M sound similar to you, or different? I can imagine certain components like the Spring Reverb are bigger and better on the FS.

[@thedarkestrainbow]

I wish they would have made a smaller version of the ARP keyboard to match. The modern controller with the vintage synth is not a pleasing pairing for me.

[@devinbelangermusic]

100% agree

[@kurtlancaster1815]

Hi, could you contact me about permission to use a couple of clips from your ARP 2600 demo? It's for a documentary I'm doing on Steve Roach.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Cool! Email me at supmilesaway@gmail dot com please to chat details

[@ariahrendt6166]

Nice video, but the last part. Are you sure you ever heard a bit crusher and know what it is and how it sounds like? That's by far not similar to what you showed here. Normally you get these sounds when modulate something with a very fast LFO. Can be OSC/LFO 2k-4kHz on Cutoff frequency. But again... never ever this has something to do with the sound of a bit crusher that reduces the bits. I am also quite sure you're confusing bit crusher with sample rate reduction or downsampling.

[@devinbelangermusic]

Late reply but thanks for the correction, I definitely jumbled my words there: Bit crushers I use all have a downsampling parameter in addition to a bit reduction parameter, and you are totally right, I mixed up my lingo there.

[@HeathcliffBlair]

After all that, you sell it! 😄 Oh well, fair enough, but I bet you'll re-buy it in 10 years. 🙂 Cheers for the video.

[@devinbelangermusic]

We shall see... I used to say I never do that, and then I rebought the Matriarch last fall LOL thanks for watching!

[@KvestiOnMovies]

I got BARP 2600 from sale and paid little over quater of ARP 2600 M. I don't understand why they made 2600 M exactly like original. Behringer did changes it should have. No amps and third oscillator has same waveforms as second. Does anyone actually use those amps. I know you should hate Behringer but I can't buy anything made by Korg because of their USB Drivers. My 2600 hasn't got too much usage since I invested in two eurorack cases. Maybe it is relic of the past.

[@devinbelangermusic]

BARP looks super cool. I don't particularly like or dislike Behringer either way, I loved my Neutron, and the Pro800 has been on my gas list for a while. But I will totally agree that the BARP hit the nail on the head by fixing some of these weird limitations of the original! I think if I had a Eurorack case I would prefer it over the 2600 personally too.

[@brucewillis542]

Well, you know what they say about GAS, better in than out.