Asian Honor - Hollywood's Gross Misrepresentation and WHY They Do It

Despite Hollywood's common portrayal, Asians don't go running around yelling "Honor". This time, I'll set the record straight and tell you all what they got wrong. The source of this misunderstanding comes from wartime propaganda.
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[@CoolHistoryBros]

Contrary to popular beliefs, Asians don't try to slip "honor" into every conversation like vegans do with veganism.

[@anasevi9456]

Yeah this hollywood trope has bothered me since I was a kid, i mean never assume malice where stupidity could be the cause. But it has made me angry at times. Funny thing is the devolution of hollywood, where most of it has troubles writing actual people and not just lifeless tropes in any context now, makes it not sting so bad.

[@ihatenwo]

lol bro im dying XD

[@Tsukiakari-qb3tk]

being vegan gives you superpowers

[@michaelrichman3135]

Well, since your brought it up, do you know how many more times in life I've had people make fun of veganism or have seen other vegans bullied for their beliefs vs how many times I've brought up veganism? You yourself decided to bring up veganism in a negative context unprompted and I bet as a reaction to me typing this, I'll likely get more attack comments than you will.

[@inotaishu1]

No, but in older times it was constantly present as a concept and "losing face" (or the fear of it) could have dramatic consequences, people were murdered for it.

[@personanongrata7862]

Asians : Confucianism Hollywood : Confusionism

[@R_t-99]

😂

[@rockinrollinntrollin616]

Connfinancialism

[@derangedgod4440]

Incomefucianism

[@darthXreven]

Vatican city: Confessionalism

[@darthXreven]

@V. N. ugh, wom wom wom wom

[@thienphucn1]

"Asians are people too" Hollywood: surprised Pikachu face

[@inotaishu1]

Hollywood is surprised, or you are surprised?

[@legoworksstudios1]

Right! And people have feelings, emotions, desires; without those qualities you might as well have a character so wooden you could call them "Mokujin" 「木人」and that's not fair to Mokujin from Tekken. What an endearing character!

[@MarcosVinicius-hg4uz]

kkkkk

[@FezFindie]

*Cue the same reaction to the minorities they claim to represent with quotas or for woke reasons, then someone saying that too*

[@MLD.Ltd.]

More like the minion "whaaaaat" face smh

[@SM-gd2rn]

Hollywood talks about honor like only eastern asians had it lol

[@kentam6891]

Yep mongols had honor conquering the world ;)

[@bosbanon3452]

@@kentam6891 beware the kara khitao they're without honor🤣

[@cdsworkshop2855]

Honor isn't a cultural trait specific to Asia anymore than it is to the West or any other part of the world. Remember that "honor" was technically supposed to be a core piece of a Western Medieval knight's code (although in the real world, many actual knights were far from honorable).

[@bxyhxyh]

@Michal Blaszczak What comrade were commonly used lot for officials.

[@-haclong2366]

@@cdsworkshop2855 Same applies to Samurai. Today's societies glorify the ancient aristocracy, but most of our ancestors were oppressed by these aristocrats.

[@emikosage6545]

I’m glad you brought up Zuko. He was obsessed with his honor because of his father and wanting to be accepted. He had amazing character development and it was made clear about his twisted view of honor affected his life and actions.

[@nhienleminhhue6605]

He is the luckiest, he got his uncle Iroh with him whereas others don't

[@sacta]

And even the series mocked it. In the 'recap' play of Ember Island it is used as a joke. No one else is as obsessed with 'honor' as Zuko is. And even the series knows and points it out. When his character 'dies' in the play, his death cry is 'HONOOOOOORRRR....'.

[@emikosage6545]

Cassian I forgot about that lol

[@tr1bes]

There are things that are wrong with Avatar. Zuko 's father has 2 kids. One a female and the other is Zuko. In the Oriental, the father will put the male heir to uphold the family name and take his place. Never a daughter. The mother is a temporary head if the husband die and nurture the son to take the head later on. Why would the father cast him out? The only way, he is out is to be trained. Even if there is a single female child for that family, the son in law will be the head. 2nd, Ain is a monk. Celibacy. There are no female relationship for monks that were taught when young.

[@LongTran-yv2nq]

@@tr1bes Yeah, I also find it creepy that Ain, as a monk, lusting after the other girl all the time, and they don't really have any "real" development until they kiss at the very end of the series...

[@manuelyausaz2976]

“We are the knights who saaay hoonor...”

[@g.strobl4458]

@NICK GRRR, I think you missed the Monty Python allusion?

[@tr1bes]

Yeah, look at how the West treat the elderly.

[@showjaymayhem]

Yee

[@EpochUnlocked]

Nicht

[@leeweesquee]

As opposed to the knights who say ni

[@iwasjustfollowingorders8068]

I think it is like being humble. If you have to say "I'm so humble", you loose it. It feels awkward saying "honor", even if you act accordingly. You do it and don't talk about it.

[@g.strobl4458]

Good point.

[@suakeli]

"I think I'm much more humble than you would understand"

[@KOTEBANAROT]

@@suakeli well im a thousand times humbler than thou art

[@nigglebit]

Impressive. I too am extraordinarily humble.

[@namekman01]

thats why we invented 'humblebrag', that way we can do non-humble things, but still claim to be humble. just dont apply logic to it please. lol

[@NoverMaC]

hollywood films on asians: honour honour chi chi chi honour...

[@animelovergirl8461]

True!

[@Iron-Bridge]

LOL yes. The boring inoffensive stereotype. 😄

[@auradzrts691]

We are the knights who say Chi!

[@justsayingmyopinion6275]

Glad it wasn't just me who thought so :P It gets pretty cringey

[@straypaper]

You forgot auspicious and ancestor somewhere in there

[@lalakuma9]

As an Asian, I have never heard my parents mention the concept of "honor" even once. What I do know is their passive-aggressive, stubborn pride and shame for doing anything even slightly nonconforming or "negative". I think they're more similar to British Victorians than Hollywood's interpretation of Asians.

[@jacobnoelle8428]

Mabye that too close to home for hollywood.🤔

[@nhienleminhhue6605]

In Vietnam, honor's obtained after winning the whole war not die fighting one skirmish.

[@SerBallister]

;)

[@diablorojo3887]

the thinking man honor

[@derangedgod4440]

At the very end, only ancestors deserve honor.

[@reyllantenefrancia5693]

Victory wipes away all dishonor.

[@mr6943]

Vietnam is not eastasia

[@diegonatan6301]

"Asians are people too" - Cool History Bros "The only people that I care are in Twitter" - Hollywood

[@Ramsey276one]

Painfully accurate

[@Ragnarosable]

Hello CJ, I'm a master's degree student currently studying Sinology and Chinese archaeology and having found your channel was a fresh breeze among other creators of historical contents. It is well-researched, reliant on the historical sources, wonderfully animated, critical with the information it delivers, loaded with humour and I won't lie about the fact that I binge-watched all of it in one day. It has turned into my favourite KZbin channel lately and I can't thank you enough for drawing attention to a part of the world that is criminally underrepresented or treated in an overgeneralized manner in most instances. 谢谢老师！

[@DinggisKhaaniMagtaal]

You wrote this 2 years ago so I hope your masters went well! I took two courses in undergrad for Chinese Bronze Age archaeology, so I’d like to know what you specialize in! I myself am moving from anthropology to public policy with a focus on Mongolian and indigenous stufies

[@Dewkeeper]

"this is just a gross oversimplification" Sooo Hollywood's bread and butter these days?

[@fruitygarlic3601]

These days? The Hollywood machine has always profited off of simplifying everything for their audiences. As bad as it is today, there was much worse stuff in the previous films.

[@sudonim7552]

People running around saying "for Greco-Judeo-Christian values!" just sounds like Ben Shapiro and PragerU lmao.

[@meferswift]

Well thats classic religious conservative part. But "For god" is better

[@EviusPistachio]

Lmao

[@Lymmar]

Yes oh course. Of course! Now let's just say that you have five honors ok? So that's 365 days in a year minus 5. There can't be 360 days in a year. That's just math.

[@19ars92]

NEXT VIDEO: Ben Shapiro destroys Goku's honor with facts

[@mysticnovelbro]

@@meferswift no, that's just Yiddish plebbery trying to slide in with the Christians, not realizing our scripture actually detests them for what they did to Jesus.

[@Mandragara]

You bring great honour to your family and lord by making this video.

[@lordkent8143]

Would say that at least in the animated Mulan, Mulan's dad was more likeable. He was understanding when she failed the matchmaker. He didn't react right away when Mulan disagreed with him fighting for China again. The new Mulan, respect to Tzi Ma, the actor, sort of portrayed the father as quite bipolar. And you see her going to war just to earn his love. In the animated, with the use of "honor" aside, you do see the characters being more than just East Asian stereotypes.

[@mazadancoseben4818]

Deep

[@ravenmadison2206]

Ugh don’t even mention the live action, it was terrible. That was anything but a representation of the Chinese culture

[@MiketheTzar]

I'm now going to start running around yelling "For Roman-Greco-Christian Values!"

[@businessproyects2615]

RGCV!

[@justalurker3489]

Probably don't do that, the guys who do that tend to have some terrible ideologies. Also it's ahistorical to group those 3 together, seeing as the Greeks had been conquered by the Romans (including Alexandria in Egypt in 30 BCE) and Christianity didn't take official hold by Rome as a whole until 380 CE (so 410 years after the fall of what would be Classical Greece). Obviously that's a lot of time for values to change or get muddied, and that connection was more established by the Catholic Church due to the fact Aristotle in particular didn't have a whole lot of things that contradicted church doctrine at that time, so he was adopted as a great thinker by them despite dying long before Christianity (let alone the Catholic church) existed.

[@7ylerD]

@@justalurker3489 For post-Artistolic semi-Catholic general Western moral values!!

[@ErikNilsen1337]

@@7ylerD Deus vult!

[@S_T_fania]

you shouldn't say that. not only is it incorrect since Roman were not that pro Christian but also because this phrase is used by white supremacist

[@hyugaassassin192]

I was surprised that Westerners thought that Easterners did not believe in hell. In fact we are very afraid of hell, we even divide hell into 18 floors lol

[@Magnulus76]

Yeah... well, western people were even more afraid of Hell. And you could go there for the most absurd reasons, and it lasts forever. So I would argue, it's not really analogous.

[@ninjaluc79]

Western hell is only 9 floors according to Dante Alighieri, and here is Eastern hell with 18. Wow!

[@eleethtahgra7182]

@@ninjaluc79 Thats china, korea n japan. India is different. Indochina got it from mix of india n china. At any rate....its like specific floor for specific group of sins. At least in china's hell, its more like a prison. You go there, you do your time, you get reincarnated into mortal world...not necessarily as human. Also, for the heaviest sin, theres no reincarnation. Again, like prison. In abrahamic-hell, its eternal torture.

[@ProtoIndoEuropean88]

The notion of Hell is not originally Japanese but chinese, it was introduced into Japan via buddhism and some taoistic influences. In shinto there is no hell but only the world of the dead which is Yomi no Kuni (world of yellow springs)

[@Cerebrum123]

I don't know of any Westerner that thinks that today. In fact as someone who watches anime it is clear that the concept of hell exists in the East. Although they will sometimes name it something else to lower the ratings. Like HFIL in Dragon Ball Z dub.

[@kuroshinko427]

It's weird that the Japanese has a word for hell yet an author thinks that the Japanese don't believe in hell. Some authors are plain lazy in understanding the nuance of Asian cultures.

[@Rakaziel]

It's wartime propaganda - it STARTS with portraiting the enemy as amoral, then as incapable of morality, then as incapable of humanity

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

@@Rakaziel it’s called dehumanization. US WW2 propaganda saw some dehumanization against the Japanese. And when the Chinese (fellow allies with the US in WW2) got into trouble by people mistaking them as Japanese, they even made propaganda to show the difference between a Chinese and a Japanese.

[@MustacheDLuffy]

@@Rakaziel I think I has less to do with that and more to do with them not being Christians since they believe in hell

[@mochardiansah7452]

Asians according to westerners: Chinese, Japanese, and Korean

[@SerBallister]

Westerners according to Asians: Westerners

[@lolsmo395]

its weird how in the west, other asians like indians and filipinos are simply called.. indians and filipinos

[@christiandaugherty6339]

That's an American thing, not western.

[@mochardiansah7452]

@@SerBallister westerners according to me: Dutch. LOL

[@joshuakusuma5953]

@@lolsmo395 I've seen some Asians get called Middle Eastern though. Even though Pakistan and Kazakhstan are Asian countries.

[@powerist209]

Hilarious about Mulan (the animate movie) is that Chinese--at least in Northern Wei--doesn't view military as honor or prestigious, even officers, which I am glad that you covered. Also he can apply as staff officers or rear-line duties (also the system is corvee, so he can be jailer or supervisors).

[@caniblmolstr4503]

Mulan was likely not chinese

[@caniblmolstr4503]

@@Goose-fafo Xianbei are the ancestors of the Mongols. Thanks for the confirmation

[@kandade4563]

@@caniblmolstr4503 It depends on what you consider Chinese. I think over time they came together with the dynasty. So over time they are considered Chinese. Also culturally, Mulan's family is very "Chinese".

[@caniblmolstr4503]

@@kandade4563 Dude Mulan's family were Xianbei and Xianbei are the ancestors of the Mongols. Xiongnu are the ancestors of the Huns. Yuezhi of the Turks. Need i say more?

[@max7820]

@@caniblmolstr4503 I think it depends on how you define Chinese. If you don't think mongols are Chinese, then naturally Xianbei weren't. However, PRC includes mongols as a part of Chinese; in fact China has indeed the most mongolic population in the world today( even more than Mongolia).

[@kueapel911]

how asian parents appear to western people: *Naggy and demanding, put their kids through so much education to stress them out* how asian parents actually are: *Naggy and demanding, put their kids through so much education using the majority of their own personal income so that their kids grow up into the best person they could ever be. They pay little regards to their own wellbeing when they spend most of their income for their kids*

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

Yeah, that’s true. There are some Westerners who understand, though. But for the most part, that last bit seems to not be very well understood. Also, the kids felt the pressure from their naggy parents, but given their age, they don’t understand it very well. I know because that was my experience growing up. I don’t know the experience of my parents who grew up poor and not having high education, but having found success and managed to give me and my brother a comfy life. Asian kids relate it to other kids, who also don’t know that experience as well. Thus the stereotype was born. Only in recent years did I began to appreciate their sacrifice and demanding attitude.

[@MustacheDLuffy]

Pretty sure they both have the same idea down for it. I guess you don’t like it when the child develops independence from their Nagy parents?

[@kueapel911]

​@@MustacheDLuffy *"I guess you don’t like it when the child develops independence from their Nagy parents?"* how do you get this unhinged idea from? Which statement of mine claim such thing? Your own assumption? If you could came up with such ridiculous assumption out of thin air, then can I too assume that you are an avid follower and practitioner of human cannibalism? I guess you don't like it when the child's flesh doesn't get eaten by their parents?

[@poorvivijay]

@@MustacheDLuffy I don't understand your comment-

[@MustacheDLuffy]

@@kueapel911 don’t eat humans? Is that the moral

[@lemesindong]

Chinese & Japanese: Confucius Confucian Western countries: Confused confusion

[@simple3359]

Lol I find it amusing that China knows as much as we do about each other but can't even find us on the map. Hence why we are all called westerns because we're somewhere over there lol

[@user-gw4kl8ft9u]

​@@simple3359 "Oriental" 💀💀💀

[@user-gw4kl8ft9u]

What was blud even yapping about? "China" didn't invent the seperation of East and West. 💀

[@goldiegolderman1842]

As a Klingon I am deeply offended that you do not honor honor!

[@jhen7056]

We see this with knights and such. In this case, I remember spiralling misconceptions regarding Asian combatants in general. One of them being that using firearms is completely dishonorable. I even see this trope being played within a few Asian media. Yeah...nope. Bruce Lee, for example, prefers using firearms.

[@mnbr6884]

Ancient Chinese used cannons, crossbows, and bows and arrows. You'd have to be completely ignorant to believe they considered firearms dishonourable.

[@TheGuzeinbuick]

Asian stereotype: Firearms are a coward's weapon without honour! Real Asians: invents gunpowder

[@muhamadsayyidabidin3906]

@@TheGuzeinbuick the funniest things that gunpowder weapon are widely used throughout the entire asia nation, sometimes before the European even visited them before. There's no such thing as dishonourable gun. Even samurai like guns. I heard that at the end of the sengoku period, and the preparation for invasion to korea, two third of japanese troops are armed with guns lol.

[@albertchan8798]

Yeah like samurais were some of the people that widely used arquebus during the sengoku jidai

[@user-pj1ec5om5g]

Holywood samurai: eew guns!? Actual samurai: *BOOM STICK GO BANG*

[@bazzfromthebackground3696]

They do have something for "Greco-Judeo-Christian values" in Hollywood. They call it Glory. Means the same as Honor in most cases.

[@GnosticAtheist]

Every culture has this honor issue. In my history (Norse) "honor" was important, but the word and meaning has been lost and westernized to the point where chivalry and honor basically becomes the same. Thus when people think of honor they now either think chivalry (if good) or honor killings of your own family (if bad). Nuance is dead.

[@justinwyllie3359]

Chivalry itself has been butchered. Knights didn't really live by a strict code. As long as your lord didn't object to what you were doing you were chivalrous.

[@ProtoIndoEuropean88]

@@justinwyllie3359 complete nonsense.

[@Fernandanatac]

What’s the true meaning of chivalry? (English is not my first language, so I looked it up the translations, but it seems kinda off.)

[@justinwyllie3359]

There's a good couple theories but the word chivalry originally was somewhat analogous to horse warfare so to be called chivalrous would be mean that you were good at fighting on horse which was the main job of a knight as they were mostly mounted warriors. It eventually evolved later in the medival period largely influenced by the crusades to be a more abstract term encompassing a vague idea of a knight being noble. Still this was not any form of strict moral code and was largely informal. As long as the knight's lord did not object to what they were doing they were considered chivalrous. So i guess you could say there technically was a chivalrous code but it really just boiled down to be a good fighter and be obedient to your lord.

[@Rakaziel]

@@justinwyllie3359 "Don't piss off the peasants (too much), don't piss off the visitors (nobles), accept surrender in duels (you may have a personal grudge, but if you get maimed or killed I have no knight until your kids have finished their training)" sounds reasonable to me

[@TheBronzeDog]

Thinking of all the times I cringed at American weebs who this honor stuff is marketed to. I knew there was more nuance to it than Hollywood had shown, so thanks for giving the context. On the guilt-shame divide described in the propaganda, let's just say I don't have their rosy a view about Americans.

[@anasevi9456]

"On the guilt-shame divide described in the propaganda, let's just say I don't have their rosy a view about Americans." You are ignorant or a willfull bigot if you think the yanks had a monopoly on dehumanising propaganda over the Japanese in WW2. Hollywood is just stupid and lazy, and uses lazy old tropes to try and cast the widest net.

[@TheBronzeDog]

@@anasevi9456 I meant I don't have her rosy view that typical Americans feel guilt. Or shame. And yeah, America is not alone in being racist. I try to avoid going with notions of American exceptionalism in either direction.

[@LarryWater]

As an American, for some reason I don’t feel any guilt or shame for what my country did in the past. I don’t know why I feel that way.

[@tiernand4161]

@@LarryWater I don't either, probably because as I get more and more into history nobody really does. No one is lining up to apologize to all of the dead peoples, such as the Goths, all of the steppe tribal confederations grounded to dust by the Chinese and fellow step people, the extinct Russian tribes like the Chud and we haven't even spoken of the Americas. People lose, and when they lose they are often driven off, assimilated or killed and while that's shitty and shouldn't happen people only care about it in Americas case because we didn't kill them all. If we had, they would be mostly forgotten, just another pile of bones from another fledgling nations ascend to power. People can argue otherwise, but plenty of people have heard of the Crow, Navaho and Apache. But who has heard of the Pohoy? Timucua or Beothuk? Ultimate point is, you shouldn't feel bad because you'd be the only one.

[@MustacheDLuffy]

This content is not for American weebs LMAO. Weebs are looked down upon and despised in northern American. Nobody would make movies for them. This is the woke SJW twitter crowd. Very much against anime

[@sgcl10658]

In East Asian culture, we usually say "not to lose face" or "not bring shame to the family's name" instead of saying "to gain honor".

[@AQuietNight]

I didn't see your comment before I posted a response but it does seem you are correct. Generally Americans do not use the phrase "to lose face", honor is used instead.

[@derangedgod4440]

Everything is avoidable, but not everything is affordable.

[@laobok]

@@AQuietNight For some reason, the phrase "to save face" is more common, but not the opposite.

[@AQuietNight]

@@laobok Americans are more likely to say: "He/she looks like an idiot". Honor would be used more than saving face but compared to the menu of insults or observations on one's values or mental capacity, other phrases are used. You are a rat or a sneak just doesn't sound very Asian. If you are doing some epic film on an Asian subject you wouldn't want the main character calling someone a dumbazz. It just wouldn't ring true.

[@laobok]

@@AQuietNight A more apt synonym would be something "he/she's making a spectacle of him/herself".

[@MadErageS]

"FOR GRECO-JUDEAN CHRISTIAN VALUUUUES" That's a damn good one.

[@powerist209]

I found it hilarious when they inspired "Honor" based Samurais and Kung Fu from Asian movies that are actually deconstruction of such notions. I mean Seven Samurai? Entire movie was about how awful Samurais are (one of the characters pointed out how Samurai's tendency to pillage caused enmity with villages, and all of them are unemployed) and how hollow "Bushido Honor" is (not to mention that almost everyone did "dishonorable" thing just to get things done, like posing as a monk to save a child to launching sneak attacks to soften the bandits) and Wu Xia are basically chaotic good fighters, aka the one who would not take a serious take on "honor" (not to mention, nobles who accept it are portrayed as stuck ups). Interesting that you put Ghost of Tsushima there since the entire premise is about bending Samurai-archetype after it was futile against brutal enemies and Jin's uncle wasn't portrayed as someone to be emulated (even cutscenes pointed out that he was an out-of-touch aristocrat whose stringent warrior code off-putting to samurais who actually fought before).

[@qus.9617]

Water Margin but with the budget of 'Longest Day in Chang'an' would be quite surreal if introduced to audiences outside China.

[@FezFindie]

You know very well that one of the most favorite hobbies of people is missing the point.

[@MrRemicas]

Jin's uncle insistance on doing stuff the honorable warrior way wasn't just out of touch with what's needed to drive off an army that does not care with such notions, but also to preserve his social hierarchy and order. In his eyes, the warrior-class needs to be seen by the populace as the one driving the invaders off. Because if the warriors can't perform their one job and protect the people, then why should the people just accept their social and political dominance? That's why the Sogun and the uncle turn on Jin for using dishonorable methods. Because while they're effective, they put a threat to the social order they benefit from.

[@MrRemicas]

@B J Not really. Going to your enemy, declare your ancestry and boast how great a warrior you are, before throwing insults and/or arrow to get an individual fight is also the kind of stuff they did back then at the time of the first Mongol invasion. Because Japan at the time was relatively peaceful and war a somewhat ritualized affair with that kind of formalities. Which against Mongols wouldn't work, they'd just see a guy advancing alone, scream some stuff in a language they wouldn't understand, and they'd just shot him down with arrows or just rush him while he's isolated. You can look it up, it has been reported notably by Takezaki Suenaga, who fought during the first invasion. Now they would use other means of course, the game isn't really aiming at being 100% historical (armor and weapons are often anachonistic, the Mongol didn't stayed that long on Tsushima, and so on and so forth).

[@FezFindie]

@@MrRemicas With those methods being "Dishonorable" being just the cover story or "Official" reason?

[@mechadonia]

“Asians are people too!” My Vietnamese grandma: “except the Chinese”

[@CoolHistoryBros]

😆😆😆

[@mjolninja9358]

Filipino parents: “Except the Chinese”

[@redcannonbusterxl411]

😂😂😂😂

[@kamikazefilmproductions]

MY JAPANESE GRANDMA SAYS THE SAME THING TOO

[@ChaBox998]

Your grandma sounds like a typical Chinese lol. Chinese to the bone.

[@hunterkiller1440]

"We can't understand a culture by watching a movie and a few anime series." Weeaboos: Y-yes, you can. *speaks in terrible Japanese they learned from anime and Rosetta Stone*

[@Ryokan76]

On a video attacking stereotyping, why do you bring more insulting stereotypes? That's funny to you?

[@T3tjamie]

I’m sensing a filthy frank reference

[@T3tjamie]

@@Ryokan76 because weeaboos deserve to be criticized. Theyre people who literally fetishized Asian culture through a narrow lenses of anime and Hollywood and literally wanna be Asian. You can have appreciation, speak an Asian language, and love Asian culture without being a weeaboo. It’s just respecting a culture and not claiming a culture as your own.

[@Eclipsing_SUN]

@@T3tjamie So what is you're take on Asian Weeaboos than?

[@ukeyaoitrash2618]

@@T3tjamie here weeb is just used for a hardcore anime fan lol. I have been a huuuuuuge anime fan since 2008, like I live for conventions and cosplay, have all my friends in the fandom, spend 1500 euros on bl manga and visual novels and merch and costumes etc, but I'm also a university educated japanologist 😌 So yeah, not necessarily 😉 But I'll fight anyone who tries to take my fandom, hobbies, and anime conventions away from me to the literal death though 😇 I live for them and will forever 😍 Anime etc is my favorite thing in life 😌

[@Drownedinblood]

Yes...Orientalism is alive and well and won't be going anywhere soon in western perspective. It's not that people can't understand Asian cultures, it's that they don't want to. There are people who think being able to say "samurai" is being cultured. If people want to actually understand Asian cultures, they should watch media made over there. Sad to say that Asians born abroad aren't exactly experts on their own respective culture they are descended from, and some default to the Hollywood depictions as "my culture". That's extremely depressing that Japanese right wing pushed a caricature depiction of their culture created during wartime as something genuine and worthy of praise.

[@FOLIPE]

Orientalism is a particular instance of the more universal phenomenon of two cultures interacting in an hierarchical setting. Sure it continues alive and well, we have been able criticise it but not find other ways for cultures to fully dialogue even when there isn't a power imbalance, let alone when it does.

[@lordofd7111]

Considering the right wing values simplicity of order over complex diversity, it's not surprising - despite the fact that systems of order are in fact quite complex whereas diversity is simply, literally, the mold in which the world is cast and thus far more simple to observe - as it paints an idealized picture for oneself to aspire to. The mind is easily distracted, but also easily stimulated - and thus easily manipulated. If you can point yourself toward something, there's not much that can prevent you from attaining it other than your own emotionality, which in the pursuit of an ideal must either be harnessed towards it or cast aside as "ego". The Japanese surrendered their pride and direction to America at the end of World War II - it's only fitting, if in a twisted way, that the right wing derive some form of it from the American understanding of their culture, especially in this age of homogenized Capitalist decadence. The preservation of culture always involves the caricature and hyper idealization of it. The nuance can be worked out later.

[@Drownedinblood]

@@lordofd7111 But isn't it against right wing principles to take such a subservient role and to allow others define you? It's just very ironic because right wing nationalists apparently act so pridefully but are ultimately subservient.

[@lordofd7111]

@@Drownedinblood Yes and no. So long as you can use those definitions to your advantage. The Nazis referred to themselves as Aryans... which was the ancient self-designation of the Indo-Iranian people. They adopted the swastika from Indian religions in which it was a benevolent symbol. I'm sure the Nazis meant the same for it, but only for themselves. The right wing quietly takes what is significant from others to aggrandize themselves. They're subservient to concepts while also enforcing them.

[@mnbr6884]

Race supremacists are self-haters deep down

[@reybladen3068]

According to my experience as an asian, Asians are more about "family, loyalty, and reciprocity" more than anything else. And financial success too.

[@CBRN-115]

You become honorable by gaining wealth and power. Being honorable gets you nowhere

[@reybladen3068]

@@CBRN-115 yeah, that's pretty much it. People will only respect you if you're rich, it sucks i know.

[@abnerdoon4902]

In my country, the concept of honor is more concerned with earning an honest living and supporting your family. That's probably because our warrior culture was stamped out by our colonizers.

[@ProtoIndoEuropean88]

@@CBRN-115 you know nothing about honor again

[@CarrotConsumer]

Good job guys, you all just discovered that the concept of honor is ill-defined.

[@iordanchis2437]

"We are Mo no no fu!" would've been soo much more impactful. It would've awakened my interest in finding out what the word actually means and in that process i would've learned more about the culture of the samurai.

[@FezFindie]

Too bad execs think the "dumbass consumers" are phobic of learning too much.

[@327legoman]

Played the entire game in Japanese, the only time I heard the word Samauri was when peasants would say osamauri-sama, even then it was usually sakai-sama. But these are the same kinda people who think tediously liberating the same outposts, finding every cemetery to collect a cricket and playing hide and seek with banners is 'fun' instead of like, y'know... actually creating a gorilla resistance movement loyal to your name instead of just suggesting it in custscenes and seeing mongol patrols slowly being replaced by 日本の武士 as you moved up the island, with plenty of open battles, perhaps even sieges. Oh! and the same devs who added a fantastic screenshot camera mode, without including an animation menu to sit down, sleep, drink so Jin doesn't constantly look like he's on edge. Okay rant over.

[@jonhanson8925]

Maybe for you, but for most people it would have been bad. I guess it could work if it was set up in the story, but otherwise it just seems like "all according to keikaku" "We are warriors" is probably the more "accurate" translation. Whether it would have been more impactful is up to individual discretion.

[@computair6920]

I'm studying translation, and I think what you mention about Gosht of Tsushima is due to them thinking that English speakers would not get the subtlety of the whole "samurai is a class and not a job" thing. Even though the West had a somewhat equivalent with knights. I'm NOT saying that samurai and knights were the same, but they can be a useful example for the sake of cultural understanding

[@GarrettPetersen]

The annoying thing is that, if they did it more accurately, game players would have been happy to learn more about Japanese culture and language. When you buy a game you often spend over 100 hours playing it. Plenty of time to inject some nuance. It's more understandable in a 2-hour movie.

[@Fear_the_Nog]

As an Asian person, agreed. I would say it's more important to be pious for us than some nebulous idea of "honor."

[@DungeonerHarold]

I grew up watching actually japanese produced movies; yeah, some of them were pretty cheesy, but they were real 3d characters, real humans, not one dimensional stereotypes. I appreciate the vid, CJ!

[@jackz4149]

My favorite Japanese film is always going to be Harakiri, nothing not even Hideo Gosha or Kurosawa’s films can top samurai rebellion, harakiri and human condition in my opinion

[@MustacheDLuffy]

The characters were however not in 3D

[@vmast_vids]

I hate honor in films also. But there’s this game called Ghost of Tsushima, it’s about an ancient samurai being forced over and over to break his code and traditions in order to save his home. “Honor” in the game, is sort of the enemy. Jin (the protagonist) has to move past it and fight dirty, and even as the game progresses becomes less of a stoic warrior, and more of a passionate swordsman. I love it so much, because HIS actions bring people hope, not the actions of the “true” samurai.

[@user-gw4kl8ft9u]

You failed to see the problem here. The "samurais" in the game were depicted as a bunch of idiots for believing in something Hollywood made up that was the opposite of what they actually believed in. Jin is just some westerners' "I'm different from the other girls" self-insert.

[@user-gw4kl8ft9u]

Jin's actions were depicted as brave and progressive meanwhile the REAL samurais would laugh/yawn at how primitive and unimaginative his tricks was as they can do way better.

[@LunDruid]

From what I've seen of Japanese culture in particular, it doesn't really look like "honor" is any more or less important for them, than it is in the Anglosphere of modern Western culture. I don't know as much about other East Asian cultures, but I can't imagine it'd be much different. Because, again, people are people. Anyway, great video. Gives even more reason to skip on the new Mulan movie and just stick to Hong Kong's version from a while ago. New subscriber here.

[@327legoman]

People are people, but what infuriated me about this video is that the origins of honour is obvious! The time in which East Asia, Japan and China included primarily were opened up by force to the west, was also the time that westerns were ALSO obsessed with HONOUR. Thus, when translating things, especially acts like suppuku, it made sense to those westerners to, when interpreting such highly ritualistic societies with respect, attach the word honour to explain actions like ritual suicide in a way that would make sense.

[@BenCaesar]

Its so important for people to clarify and speak on their own culture! I'm shocked how hard it is to find cultural and historical insights by Asians on youtube. Thank you

[@golvic1436]

Hollywood? Boiling down an entire culture to a single theme? Never! Knights, Vikings, Cowboys and medieval peasants feel the pain.

[@KanemiX3]

oh my god, I've been talking about this all years and I couldn't get it across my friend as coherently as you do. Thank you for giving me a peace of mind now that can I put together my thoughts about this topic.

[@LongTran-yv2nq]

I have been watching many of your videos lately, and I have to say that I enjoy them a lot! Thank you for your effort and research into these topics, and especially this video where you address a sensitive topic with clear narrative, strong evidences and still make it entertaining! Keep up the good work! I just subscribed and turn the notification on!

[@wastehazey6468]

Pfft! Next you're going to tell me that Vikings weren't obsessed with dying in battle..

[@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec]

They are pirate/settler/explorer and ummm....That’s all I got

[@parthaprotimbarua603]

Man, you deserve so many more subscribers. I hope this channel booms within this year.

[@johnhu3890]

you are really doing something positive to increase the understanding of each other between the west and the east, great videos!

[@tamorakowalski6255]

I am so glad I found you guys!

[@chouyi007]

This is such a refreshing video! It reminds me very much of what I came to understand about the concept of "face," "saving face," and "losing face." People in the U.S. see that as being such a unique, different, and sui generis comcept, whereas it is literally just a different word for reputation, social standing, embarrassment, etc.

[@KalecgosMagic]

I'm so impressed by your in depth research & detailed understanding of Asian culture. Another great educational video 👏👏👏

[@annalston1653]

Thank you for this. I've been watching a lot of c-dramas recently, and it can be a little confusing to understand the difference between face, filial piety, loyalty, and other concepts.

[@SnakeAndTurtleQigong]

This was amazingly eye-opening! Thank you so much for helping to dispel some of my stereotypes. 🙏

[@jungleng]

I grew up speaking chinese. Only just realised I have no idea how to say honour is in chinese.

[@bluehippofilms]

I grew up in America but watched tons of Chinese movies/dramas with my parents growing up. Same problem, lol

[@HighPriestFuneral]

I just looked it up in my Chinese dictionary... oh boy... it's about (no joke) 30 different unique and varied concepts in Chinese that can be reduced into English as "honor".

[@GS9Creations]

I'm a fan of your Don't Stop Thinking Channel so I was delighted to find this one as well! You hit on a lot of great points about how western audiences tend to view the Asia and Japan, as well as many eastern cultures as a whole. I think a lot of this is yet another example of orientalism, where eastern cultures have been exoticized and fetishized as strange, exotic, and mysterious instead of, as you said, actual human beings. It's unfortunate to see so much of it still engrained in western media today and your video did a great job at pointing out parts of it!

[@robisvalton4286]

Your videos are amazing! Really enjoy them!

[@javaddjames3217]

*I WILL REGAIN MY LOST HONOR!* Iroh: Let's take our minds off of the Avatar and go to the spa. Zuko: HOW COULD YOU SAY THAT?!

[@rommellamadrid6794]

"For Greko-Judeo Christian values!" me: ... isn't that just deus vult?

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

Well, they only say that during the Crusades only. It became the Crusade battle cry after Pope Urban II’s speech. So, when marching to fight the Muslims, they say that. When the English are bashing French knights at Agincourt, they say something else.

[@kushastea3961]

exactly. Deus vult is religious chant, of a brainwashing extremist monotheistic religion. Giving east asians, particularly Chinese&Japanese this kind of dialogue, reinforces the notion that they are just robots operating as a mass entity in the command of some godlike being, which is ridiculous. They are robbed of their culture, their identity, and their validation as an entity capable of choice.

[@jakefitzsimmons1213]

@@kushastea3961 are you joking

[@kushastea3961]

@@jakefitzsimmons1213 huh, KZbin keeps deleting my comments. Unfortunately no. This for honour is not due to ignorance, but to indoctrinate. The Chinese exclusion act, coupled with ww2, meant it was beneficial for Westerners to see east Asians as a homogenous enemy entity that needs to be defeated/subjugated. I've been taught to be ashamed of my home country and my identity my whole life. Good thing I am suspicious by nature.

[@pooman5380]

@@kushastea3961 brainwashing extremists ? Maybe some of them. But Have you not research anything about the crusades the first one started because the Turks invaded the byzantines and the Byzantine leader ask the pope for help and the Baltic one started because the pagans where attacking and enslaving Christian missionaries and settlements

[@CliosPaintingBench]

I need to say, I love your videos, they're so accessible and present history in a very fun format.

[@phillipA123]

All humans care about personal honor, respect, loyalty, glory. You did a good job explaining how we in the west vastly over simplify these concepts with a term like 'honor'. Still I read a lot of chinese web novels...like A LOT...and the concept of "Saving Face" is significantly more prevalent than in western fantasy. It is not that it doesn't exist! Of course, all humans will care if they are 'disrespected' and people in positions of power and authority even more so! Still within the context of ancient stories it seems both the Western Knights care a lot about 'honor' and the Eastern Warriors care a lot about 'face'. Its mostly the same tho.

[@Moses_VII]

Imagine if European films shouted "chivalry" in every film.

[@life_is_a_myth]

Deus Vult

[@pi8chyt]

As a Westener who was always fascinated by East-Asian history, tropes and Martial Arts stuff I really like and appreciate your videos. I have the feeling of learning a lot and broaden my horizon. Its amazing how many cliches and tropes about East-Asian culture sticks here and is never challenged or revised - like many other non-european-cultural-tropes have been in the last years. My theory - can be completely wrong - is that the tropes like honor, ambition, correctness but also ruthlessness and brutal if necessary - are seen as "positive" or at least "strong" in european culture. Thus many of the tropes are not perceived as pejorative. Mabye thats the reason why there is less focus on correcting them?

[@tr1bes]

Honor and respect come in handy with each other. That is something the West have a hard time understanding. I give you an example. When I visit my uncle, aunt and unrelated elders, I go straight to them and pay my respect. That way, they can say I was taught correctly by my parents and have honor in doing so. When my grand niece and nephew visit me, they go straight to the couch and my video game room. I was simply a facade. I, then have a little conversation with the parents about proper Oriental ways. Most of the newer Asian Americans that were raise in the West have not been taught to do so. I have taught my daughter to bow to any aunts, uncles, and elders. That way, these folks can say I have taught her the traditional value of being an Oriental.

[@pi8chyt]

@@tr1bes really interesting. Having to bow to anybody would be considered extremely humiliating and submisive to an Westerner. We only bow to voluntary show respect or over-the-top appreciation and even then it's only a nod. It's really a completely different concept.

[@tr1bes]

@@pi8chyt Try to do that to Royalty. A nod to meet the Queen of England instead of bowing would be very improper. Remember how Republicans bashed Obama for bowing down to the Japanese Emperor. That is to show respect and honor. A commoner meeting royalty. The differences between West and East is that it's been taught at an early age to bow. It is tradition. There are 3 prime principles in the East. 1. Honor. One must keep the family name up in status. Fight to keep the last name respectful. 2.Respect. respect all individual above you and equal. Must try to call by rank only. No name calling. If calling an uncle by name Bob is a sign of disrespectful. Only call uncle, aunt, big brother, big sister and so on. Also meet them when entering the house. Bow to Royalty which is rare nowadays. 3. Discipline. This one is mostly on studies, education and follow the rules. Doing otherwise would have harsh punishments. I got hit by a metal ruler for not learning and getting a wrong answer. So it's best to study. All of these are probably very hard for Westerners. It can be achieved if one wants to do so.

[@ceoanw]

Thanks for the video, it changed a perspective for me. I'm doing some writing in ancient China and this was a big help wrapping my mind around the era.

[@khankhomrad8855]

Regarding Ghosts of Tsushima, here is my theory. When it comes to translating videogames from one language to another, translators often times prefer to adapt the work as to make it more approachable to those that speak the target language. It isn't as much translating the words from one language to another as it is translating the meaning of the words so that it fits the culture. How this apply to this game in particular is that when whoever did the translation went through the original script and started translating it, they had two options: 1) Keep the original meaning -- which would be more in-line with the original script but would probably sound weird to an American audience; 2) Put all of those references to samurai that people are expecting -- which would be more a less direct translation and a more loose adaptation, but would fit better what the general expectation is. So in the end they/them (most likely there was a team of translators behind it) decided to go with option 2 as to make the game more approachable to a general English-speaking audience. I can't speak for anyone else but I know that if I saw that cinematic and the protagonist said 'we are warriors' instead of 'we are samurais' I would have instinctively raised an eyebrow as it would stand out as it breaks from the cultural tradition of the west.

[@KayKay-dq5gm]

Me waiting for Zuko to appear yelling abt his honor: 👁️👄👁️

[@chopsticksjp]

I never recognize how many times “honor “ was spell out lol

[@m.s.e.4192]

As someone who is watching this from east africa...this was an actual eye opener. I love your channel btw. Makes my evenings quite enjoyable.

[@CourtneySchwartz]

I’m still waiting for Hollywood to realize Vikings had an honor culture…

[@salamangkali-allmartialart4836]

Me as an Asian: We have feelings? We are people too?! 😱🤯

[@seanMmaguire1]

In the case of Ghosts of Tsushima I don't think there would be a way to translate the Mononofu/Bushi thing into English because it is something that is unique to the Japanese language. Literal translations would just be "we are Warriors". It loses all context.

[@Rakaziel]

You could translate it with "we are ancient warriors"

[@seanMmaguire1]

@@Rakaziel I don't think the Samurai could call themselves ancient during the mongol invasions.

[@CriticalThought09]

@@Rakaziel Well the speaker wouldn't regard himself as particularly ancient. Would be a little jarring for the character to say something like "I am a 12th century warrior of the samurai class". Full context, very little dramatic impact.

[@zhixci958]

Why would it lose context? It would still be a better translation than we are samurai.

[@seanMmaguire1]

@@zhixci958 Because Mononofu is a traditional Japanese way of saying warrior and Bushi was a later adopted chinese word. Theres simply no way to translate that into English, hence it loses the patriotic context.

[@twelvethousandths1698]

Very well made video, refreshing content! subbed

[@ThatChineseHistoryGuy]

I laughed a few times when I watched this.... Very nicely done dude!! Come to think about it, I don't think I've even used the word 'Honor' in writing the videos for my channel... Loyalty, Dignity, Integrity... etc etc etc... But never used the term 'honor' once. Never really realized or thought about it until you brought it up.

[@therealGibralter]

See now I am wondering about the flipside of this. How do China and Japan view the "West". Are we all seen as loud narcissists that eat nothing but fast food?

[@powerist209]

Well, I think anime had a few of them. But also with a comically large nose.

[@MisterCynic18]

this is at least 50% true though

[@Konoronn]

That's America, not the West.

[@heindrich1988]

This is an interesting question... I'll answer it from the perspective of somebody living between the Chinese and Western (British) worlds. I can't really speak for the Japanese since I'm not Japanese and I don't have any close Japanese friends. They are also a very "polite" culture, so they rarely speak their minds with people they are not close with, for fear of causing offense. But for the Chinese... there was an almost blind worship of Western things as recent as maybe 5 years ago. China is the largest market in the world for Italian designer clothes, German luxury cars and American pop culture (Hollywood movies, Apple products, NBA etc). This is because on an official level (I mean Chinese institutions), China also maintains a culture of politeness. So, almost all coverage of the West in the Chinese media was positive. So, when Chinese journalists produce a piece about London, they focus on the lovely neighbourhoods of Chelsea, the landmarks like the Houses of Parliament and the beautiful parks and stately homes, instead of showing the homeless on every city centre street and the crime-infested council estates. In short, for each Western country, think of the positive stereotypes associated with that country, and that's how the Chinese used to view said country. The Chinese media was very positive, but it wasn't nuanced either. Then Trump became the US president and the thin veil of American values was ripped off and Chinese people were unavoidably exposed to just how bellicose, arrogant and frankly racist, Americans are. Now, with the pandemic and the contrast between how it's been handled in China and the US, the illusion of American superiority has well and truly been shattered. Unfortunately, resentment and anti-foreign feeling is on the rise. More and more Chinese people think of Westerners (Americans mostly) as incompetent, ignorant, angry, greedy, racist and shameless. It's probably more nuanced for countries outside of US, UK and Australia, which have been the most vocal in hostility towards China. Sadly, the gulf of mistrust and hostility is only growing, because like in the rest of the world, the rise of social media is allowing more extreme and often false views to spread and gain traction. Just as a huge proportion of Americans believe conspiracy theories about China deliberately releasing COVID-19, a significant proportion of Chinese also believe conspiracy theories that American soldiers brought COVID-19 to Wuhan.

[@yurisakamaki7469]

What I've seen in chinese and japanese animes is that europeans/americans are ALWAYS blonde-haired and blue-eyed, and they're always very touchy, which sometimes is borderline sexual harassment 😅 I've seen chinese dramas where Italians and Julius Caesar (for some reason, Caesar was in ancient China in that drama) were platinum blonde and had blue eyes, and for some reason, loved hugging and touching people (sometimes even inappropriately)

[@ZhongliAcross7NationsOfTeyvat]

Those medieval knight not saying : "for the greco christian value" But they shouted : "Deus Vult"

[@JaxVassindia]

It projection, we do crazy shit, therefore they do it as well.

[@dyingember8661]

@@JaxVassindia We Asians sure do crazy shits, but not about the honor of the western view.

[@charloteauxvalerian3875]

Well, that an over statement : European knight where far from being all those pious warriors. Even Charles Martel, who's lauded in history for having allegedly saved France and Europe from the Sarrasin was quite at odd with the church, and there's the case where some french king just tossed a pope so much that the pope died shortly after, probably from a bad concussion. Knight, especially second or third son without a lot of expectation about their future, where often little better than thug.

[@abnerdoon4902]

Dude just went up and described all knights as being the crusader stereotype.

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

@@abnerdoon4902 his argument is more like pointing out how ridiculous it is to paint all knights as Crusaders. Kinda like how ridiculous it is to paint all Asians with the honor stereotype.

[@andrewwaite3619]

Love your content as always.

[@secondexodus9105]

You have brought honor to all of us for making this video, thank you

[@bxyhxyh]

You deserve much more views and subs.

[@SUpersaiyajinjerkbag]

You know, Japanese may not use the word "honor" a lot; but they sure as heck use a lot of honorifics

[@sgcl10658]

Koreans too.

[@oldcowbb]

it has nothing to do with honor in the hollywood sense, it's for politeness and social hierarchy

[@tonyiommisg]

I am so glad I discovered your channel!

[@objectjon9015]

This is very insightful in many ways and ironically continues to resound the message that so many movie producers seem to misunderstand nowadays; that even other cultures with all their nuances still tell their stories with characters that are Human and are therefore not completely defined by any set code of ethics. By nature, they are complicated.

[@alainkhoanguyen3098]

Back in the early 1800s, the Old Europe's concept of chivalry and honour would not that much different from their Asian counterpart. Duty, country, family, and all that jazz, rite? Remember way back when people still commit suicide over shame and loss of honour? It's not that Asian cultures care too much. It's that "modern" -American- culture care too little. Anyone ever seen American people as a beacons of class and honor? No wonder Hollywood is overwhelmingly obsessed with honour. or lack thereof. It's kinda an old trope by now, just like how Tacitus contrasted the "noble savage" Celts against his own -supposedly- corrupted Roman contemporaries. ^^

[@jsagers2008]

The knights yell "Chivalry!" instead.

[@KhanhNguyen-mh5ec]

Or DEUS VAULT!

[@tcosmos]

This is a great video and more people need to watch it 👍🏾 Until I began studying Mandarin I didn't realize how much misperception and nonsense is pushed by Hollywood and mainstream media about Asian people.

[@GarrettPetersen]

You know what's cringeworthy? Whenever a board game is set in Asia, they replace "Victory Points" with "Honour." Pretty weird to move a cube up the "honour track" as a generic way of winning a game.

[@brunopereira2281]

"Honor: if you need it defined, you don't have it" - Ron Swanson.

[@-haclong2366]

03:10 I can tell you are not European, because Hollywood depictions of medieval Europe is equally obsessive about "Honour".

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

Thing is, with Hollywood, their idea of go out being spoken about every 20 seconds stopped in the Medieval genre. Then again, there are some medieval movies who don’t adhere to that as well. Movies about Robin Hood pictures the landed lords (the barons and knights) as without honor, and Game of Thrones basically insults those with honor. Then there’s the whole fantasy genre that is while set in a medieval-sequence society, the whole theme is more of good vs evil rather than honor. But Hollywood depiction of Asian and honor? Almost everywhere and any time period.

[@powerist209]

@@alexanderchristopher6237 Would find it funny if they try that with Three Kingdoms, but they've already done that with Wu Xia. Entire Wu Xia didn't show honor as mandatory and most characters are down-to-Earth or had their notions of "honor" corrected if they are aristocrats. Even Three Kingdoms doesn't shy away by the fact that even good and "honorable" characters are maintaining that facade while conscripting peasants and pillaging villages. Liu Bei being a prime example. In fact, it ended with all Kingdoms turning to ambitious, decadent, and feuding warlords.

[@alexanderchristopher6237]

@@powerist209 If anything, Romance of the Three Kingdoms is more of insulting the idea of honor, akin in the same vein as GoT. Cao Cao’s “I would rather betray the world rather than the world betray me”, Liu Bei’s portraying honor and virtue but being a snake, Zhuge Liang claiming to follow an honorable lord to restore the Han but advises Liu Bei to overthrow his own clan member in Shu, and Zhou Yu and Sun Quan’s plot of marrying Sun Quan’s sister. Not to mention the outcome as well: Cao Wei usurped the Han. The “virtuous” Shu-Han lost to “treasonous” Wei, which later fell to Jin who are deceitful. The Three Kingdoms were reunited by Jin and their deceitful tactics to usurp power. Very similar to GoT where many of the honorable characters were quickly killed off (partly due to their honorable deeds).

[@alehaim]

I've been building/coming up with ideas for a philosophy for my worldbuilding based around viewing the world through the lense of honor, and this video has given me a wonderful new perspective on the very concept of "honor".

[@marimurdock7766]

This is a fantastic video. Thank you!

[@moisesmunoz3844]

You need more likes.

[@mitonaarea5856]

He needs more subs.

[@deadby15]

Kikuchiyo from Seven Samurai is one character who never talks about Honor...

[@thejoydecision724]

Great rant. Appreciate the channel for helping me expand my knowledge beyond the Greco-Roman tradition.

[@zareefhuda3430]

Thanks for the context. Wonderfully explained

[@Marvin-ey4sq]

This video has dishonored my family. The Bushido code dictates we duel.

[@strider4life696]

Me: *sees thumbnail* *Prince Zuko intensifies*

[@madmoonrabbit]

This was very well presented! Well said.

[@jimmyshaffer6613]

Interesting video. I'm curious if this video has been made with Chinese or Japanese audio to get their opinions?

[@ShredST]

In college, I had to read a book about China written by a British guy that also used the whole guilt vs shame culture thing.

[@sl1003]

As an Asian, I can confirm that I've dueled people to the death for my honour. Not that I've ever won.

[@davidharper238]

Nice! Super informative. Thanks!

[@113-M]

Ever since I was a kid watching Hollywood films, I never understood why the word "Honor" was said so much. It's like having the word, "Exceptional," constantly be used. It diminish the word's meaning and this overuse would not fit the context of a situation. Finally, I realized the overuse of the word "Honor," is an example of cheap and/or bad writing by individuals in Hollywood. Even the character of Zuko is teased for his excessive use of the word "Honor." Yet, I feel that it would have been more interesting if Zuko said that he was doing the things he was doing for his uncle, his hardworking crew, including that of Mai (his possible betrothed?) and her family. Seeing how his actions caused their misfortune, it would make sense why Zuko was obsessed with making things right and the idea of 'restoring their honor'. I loved the explanation, examples, and the in-depth analysis in your video!