Atari ST First Look and Repair & Restoration

Ep 37: A look at the history and specifications of the Atari ST, with repair, restoration and retrobright, plus games, demos, and MIDI.
00:00 Introduction
00:31 First Look / History
05:02 Mouse Retrobright
07:41 Nature Break!!!
08:53 Disassembly and Cleaning
15:13 Recap
17:14 Keyboard Reassembly
17:51 Drive Repair
20:52 Retrobright Results
23:14 GEM/TOS
25:43 Games and Demos
31:29 MIDI
32:44 Conclusion
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[@CarnorJast1138]

God I miss my 520ST. I wish I still had my old system from 1987. It had 4 Megs of RAM, 2 SCSI Hard Drives mounted in an XT case, loads of software, both the color and monochrome monitors, an Epson 24 pin dot matrix printer, and various peripherals! It was an amazing computer, during an amazing time in computer history! I would LOVE to get that same system back now, and just enjoy the hell out of it!

[@retrobitstv]

Sounds like an awesome system! Some of those parts sound pretty rare and hard to come by these days, but the base systems are certainly available and not too expensive. The MiSTer FPGA also does a great job of implementing the ST, including STe, 14Mhz processor, HDD support, MIDI, etc.

[@PCFixer]

Oh my god I feel you, man; I had an Atari 520STFM and I gamed on that like nothing else; screw school homework, just GAME ON!

[@wildstar41]

hahaha the cicadas really freaked me out through B&W speakers. I lived in NJ for 1/2 my life and was spared them this year.

[@CheshireNoir]

These days there's one Atari ST variant I still drool over: The Falcon. Much improved video chipset, blitter (Carried over from the STe), MUCH improved sound chip, Motorola DSP, Optional FPU. The list goes on. Of course, there's even '060 upgrades for them. I don't really need a second kidney do I?

[@retrobitstv]

Haha would love to have one of those to play with but they're pretty much unobtanium these days, especially in North America. Might take both kidneys :P

[@CheshireNoir]

@@retrobitstv could be worse. I'm in Australia.

[@TPau65]

The Falcon is a really nice machine! Still got mine, originally bought in 1993. But it has many design flaws and somehow was thrown together with "the hot needle", so to speak. Additional clockpatches needed (which also vary from machine to machine), no practical audio in/outputs (which was corrected later when C-Lab bought the rights on the Falcon and brought the Mk-1 and 2) etc. But still the most "usable" machine of the ST range, mainly because of the latest TOS improvements and brilliant VGA output.

[@AdamChristensen]

I loved the cicadas. They were so loud and friendly. Can't wait for brood X to return. 😍

Small Notes: - Atari ST was not a competitor to Amiga, only Apple Macintosh and it worked very well in this role (in 1985 ST simply had better capabilities than any Mac), - ST (until the time of STE / FAlcon), is basically a "16-bit Spctrum" ;), this computer has nothing but: CPU, memory, I/O, sound chip known from 8-bit Amstrad and Sinclair computers and simple graphics (without any hardware support for scrolling, animations, sprites ... etc.). The Atari STE has some significant improvements (although DMA is still very lame and still the CPU has to do most of the tasks in the system), but it just came out too late. If the Atari STE came out in 1985, it would be an offer that would be hard to beat. In 1989, Falcon 030 should have come out ...

[@alwAudio]

You just took me back to my youth...

[@aqualung2000]

I loved my ST -- had it for years. No question the Amiga was packin' a lot more under the hood, *but*: most (well over 50%) of the 16-bit computer games produced for the Amiga were also produced for the ST. And the vast majority of those Amiga games ended up being ports of the ST version. So if you were a gamer who chose the ST, you weren't missing out on _too_ much (other than the occasional eye-popping Amiga exclusive titles.)

[@dave4shmups]

Excellent video on this retro computer! I really enjoyed watching it!

[@don_n5skt]

One of the big selling points for the ST was that it could act as a Mac clone. The cartridge on the side could be fitted with Mac Roms which were sold by various vendors and it would boot into a quite usable Macintosh. Also, the most amazing game on the ST was Dungeon Master en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dungeon_Master_(video_game). I think I would own another if I could find my old copy of that game. It was flat amazing.

[@retrobitstv]

Cool, it stands to reason the ST could emulate the Mac well. Perhaps even better than the Amiga since those use bitplane graphics and have to perform real-time conversion. I am not sure how the ST implements its graphics memory. I have a copy of Dungeon Master, but I didn't want to use it in the video as it is to the ST as Monkey Island is to the MT-32 :P

[@Great-Documentaries]

No one bought an ST to run Macintosh software. No one. It was not a selling point. Had the St at the time been able to do that reliably with just a cartridge and some hard-to-find Mac ROMs, they would have sold 10 million of them. They didn't, because that was not a reliable option and wasn't an option at all in the early days. And by the way, the Amiga had the similar Fusion card.

[@don_n5skt]

@@Great-Documentaries It was a big deal around the Dallas area where I live. There was a store in Arlington that sold the roms+cartridges. I think because it worked so well. Yes there was an issue with reading Macintosh formated disks but we had an SE 30 already and so that was not a big deal.

[@geraldford6409]

I was THE ST Guru and uber fan circa 1985-1992. The ST and Amiga were at LEAST 7 years ahead of the PC re: video and sound and other tech specs, at least relative to costs for average consumers and technical users. And in many ways, regardless of cost. PC Gamers didn't have decent gaming sound until the SoundBlaster became common and affordable circa early 90s The Amiga was great, but for most of the 80s, the ST was lower cost for a complete system (real computer monitor, printer and 512K min, 1MB better)

[@kevcall]

Still have two in my garage with icd hard drive stuff, color and mono (sm144) monitors, blitz-drive, CD rom interface and so many games and other bits from back in the day. I only wrote and released, one game in the end: STe Bombaman but also used it daily for midi (pro24) with my casio vz1 (also in my garage) and a drum machine (long gone).. Happy days for sure 😊

[@ColdRFusion]

It’s amazing how much faith they had that 1mm of plastic would hold! Great restoration :-)

[@75slaine]

Thanks Matt, that was great.

[@retrobitstv]

Thanks, glad you enjoyed it!

[@DrDavesDiversions]

Nice job, Matt... thanks for diving in - I'd never used one either. Nature Break! :)

[@retrobitstv]

Thanks! I was pleasantly surprised having used it after reading about the shortcomings for years. The demo scene in particular really impressed me with what they could make the thing do!

[@anthonyciantar6015]

Nice video. I used my ST to write hundreds of reports. I have often wondered what WP software other people used. Also I had a version of page plus DTP.

[@minombredepila1580]

Excellent video Matt. Hope one day get one (or two, or three...)

[@retrobitstv]

Thanks! Good luck and I hope you find one!

[@temporarilyoffline]

Great Video... I remember when I was in maryland and the cicadas came last time... the roads were even covered in carcasses.

[@retrobitstv]

Yea it is really a spectacle. Some people can't stand them, but I think it's fascinating. They're completely gone already and I miss them :P

[@TheBookaroo]

Hi, thanks for the video, one thing you can do to strenghten the little tab for the eject button, is to insert a cut to length needle in the middle you just have to heat up the needle, as a kind reinforcement... I have done that on my washing machine door lock and it held for 10 years or so...

[@jamesfmackenzie]

Great video! I had a 1040STFM growing up. Mainly use an STE today which has some extra chips to restore (some) parity with Amiga

[@madigorfkgoogle9349]

some parity with Amiga? Are you kidding? STE is better then A500 in all aspects except hardware sprites and standard mode colours 16 vs 32. It is pity it was never utilized to full extent.

[@10MARC]

Not a bad system at all compared to the Macs and PC's of the day, but she just could not hold a candle to our precious Amiga. I really try to enjoy mine, but I just can't find anything that sweeps me off my feet. I am planning on a show of the productivity programs in the ST, as I understand there were some good ones.

[@retrobitstv]

Yea, it was definitely a great value/price proposition. I was pleasantly surprised with what the demo scene was able to pull off given the gfx/sound limitations too. Looking forward to your productivity video; I haven't tried any myself. Need to get high res mode wired up to something first!

[@profesorbooty]

lots of cicada noises in your garage even before the nature break.

[@TheFrenchy82]

oh my.... My childhood hits my face again !! I used to have an Atari 520 STF. OK it wasn't as good as Amiga 500 , but ... ATARI RULES !!!

[@madigorfkgoogle9349]

well, A500 was a better sprite gaming console the 520STF but Atari was much much better home computer, good luck with Amiga and school work...

[@tankgrrl]

Subscribed! Nice video! Very meticulous. :) re: the plastic repairs, I'd highly recommend using acetone with these ABS parts as the final chemical weld will be as strong as the original piece (or, well, the aged piece as it is now). You can use a small amount and capillary action to get it into cracks like that back piece and create a perfect, seamless join (and no superglue leaking out and making the join more obvious). PS - Speaking of superglue, a tool that most people don't know about is something called un-cure or debonder. It's a cyanoacrylate remover. Bob Smith makes an effective one.

[@retrobitstv]

Thanks and welcome! Interesting, I hadn't heard of using acetone before but I'm willing to give it a try. Yea the superglue did make a mess. Not shown on camera but I did use a damp rag to wipe off the excess because it did goo out everywhere as you saw. Bob Smith's Un-Cure, huh? That's gotta be a riff on the 80s band. Great tip though, thanks!

[@tetsujin_144]

If anything would motivate me to get an ST one day, it's the machine's popularity as a MIDI workstation back in the day. Always kind of fascinates me that it was able to capture this niche, in part just because they were committed enough to make the ports a standard feature.

[@retrobitstv]

I did fire up Cubase and try and figure it out a bit, but it was a cluttered mess on the 240p display. I need to wire up a DIN13->HD15 cable and get the high res monochrome mode working with a VGA monitor. I have heard that the inclusion of MIDI was because they had to make sacrifices with the YM chip in order to ship the machine in time, and this was their way of trying to make up for that.

[@weaselsworld]

Wow, brass rollers in that mouse? That's building for quality right there. I don't think even Microsoft ever used anything other than plastic toothpicks for their mice, even the super heavy-duty original serial mouse!

[@tetsujin_144]

2:18 - "The new Atari has risen like a phoenix from the ashes" Ouch, really conveys how far Atari must have fallen for their go-to metaphor to be "our company was a pile of ashes but we're better now"

[@retrobitstv]

I forget the exact dollar figure, but Atari was in disarray and hemorrhaging money after the 1983 video game crash and Warner was looking to offload them anyway, so I guess it was fitting :)

[@madigorfkgoogle9349]

@@retrobitstv Tramiel got Atari for a bargain, just couple of millions, and we are talking about company making billions before the video game crash, and thats in 1980s Dollar value.

[@gamedoutgamer]

14:32 they are brittle and it being used in a school is probably why it's cracked. Earlier Ataris before Tramiel era were built to much better standards. Yes it seems like it was made as an affordable Mac competitor, not a gaming system. The two million number is surprising! That's not very many.

[@VenturiLife]

Rubicon / Nichicon caps are the way to go for electrolytic. They are Japanese, usually expensive to get a hold of but they work to perfection. Tantalum caps also need to be replaced these days also.

[@madigorfkgoogle9349]

Just one correction to Amiga "fanboy", the TOS has multitasking and it was made as fully GUI operated, so all you ever needed was in GUI so you didnt need the shell as user unlike Amiga where you couldnt see files not having assigned icon for example. There was a possibility to use shell for advanced users on ST in form of a programs, dont remember the names since no one really used shell back then. The Workbench before 3.0 was very ugly, slow and useless especially in floppy era, the preemptive multitasking was more of a gimmick since the A500 HW was too weak to make a use of it, when the A1200 and A3000 came, the situation changed. I also noticed that you didnt like the fact that without floppy inserted the system is waiting "fully" 50 seconds until it shows you desktop, ok so how long takes a A500 without floppy inserted until you can use the desktop then?

[@DarrenHughes-Hybrid]

Firstly, now subscribed! Secondly, good job at pointing out the 520ST’s strengths (and weaknesses). Thirdly, nice video, but, I would like to critique one thing… there are moments in the video you speak too fast AND most times just right. Lastly, I feel you’ve made a good educational video. Without looking at your catalogue YET, please keep making them.

[@retrobitstv]

Thanks for the feedback and welcome aboard!

[@amerigocosta7452]

The ST was not very popular in my country but nonetheless I happened to play 16-bit games first on an ST and, coming from a C64, I was genuinely impressed. It was years before any 16 bit game consoles were available, so, putting this into perspective, it makes sense. It is just me or one of the ST default fonts looks a lot like the C64 basic font?

[@IntoTheVerticalBlank]

You are missing the desk accessories that with the language disk for VT Term emulator and the more advanced cointrol panel. But yes, still not Work Bench for sure =)

[@retrobitstv]

Interesting. I will have to find another language disk. I was wondering why the option to change desktop colors was missing. Thanks for the tip!

[@MrWaalkman]

I love my Hakko! The one thing that I have started doing with it is to let the tip continue to heat up for another five minutes after it comes up to temp. That alone has greatly reduced the number of times that I have had to "rod out" my barrel to just one time since then (and that was because I didn't clean out the collection tube in a timely manner). Prior to the Hakko, I had two Xytronics that were a constant ongoing battle in keeping the nozzles unclogged. I also had trouble with the Hakko until I stumbled across a video that recommended the longer wait time.

[@retrobitstv]

Great "tip", thanks!

[@doktor6495]

Great episode, even it's an ATARI! 😜 Only joking! Greetings, Doc64!

[@ms-ex8em]

do u know about Dragon 32 programming too? what about hard disks? can u fix them? i have a seagate 3tb drive which doesnt spin up can u help me out thanks.....

[@dougjohnson4266]

Love the 68000 but I was not a fan my 1040ST. 68000 is 32bit internal, 16bit interlaced external with a 24bit address bus, just a great processor for that time.

[@dmitriivanov7143]

Atari ST should've had two YM2149 chips for 6 channels in stereo. This would've brought it much closer to Amiga sound-wise with little additional cost in terms of components or R&D.

[@edstar83]

kzbin.info/www/bejne/fZ7bk2icoLqLnrM

[@edstar83]

@@Great-Documentaries kzbin.info/www/bejne/hH2UY2aZrcRmis0

[@tjlazer71]

22:30 acetone would work much better.

[@angrydove4067]

Your final evaluation statement pleased me, but I loved the demo with those white balls.

[@meneerjansen00]

Great informative video, as always. I enjoyed it very much. 😊 P.S. I *do* like you to demonstrate a word processor and a spread sheet. Because back in the day a machine like this could spare you the price of a PC *and* a game console, up to/into the nineties. I remember being very frustrated back in the day: a computer for school/study would eat up all my money. But what I really wanted was a gaming system. I ended up buying neither until a secondhand 386 PC became affordable for both, half way through the nineties. So in hind sight: might I have been better off buying an ST in the late eighties? Was it that far ahead for its time on the Amiga, the PC and Apple price-wise? It sure looks like it...

[@retrobitstv]

Glad you enjoyed it! It was certainly the most cost effective option of the lot. Still too much for me to afford as a kid though. Had to be happy with my 8-bits until I could finally afford a 386 in high school. Re: productivity software, I need to look into building a high res cable for the machine for the next time I feature the ST. Doug indicated he was planning an ST productivity video for 10MARC as well!

[@meneerjansen00]

@@retrobitstv I'll be patient then. :) There are video's on making music on the ST, but hardly any on productivity.

[@JesterEric]

The mono monitor transforms the system. It had a very high refresh rate so it was pleasant to use. Having the OS in ROM was essential as very few people had hard disks or even second drives. Most systems were 512k. DTP software was popular on the ST. Atari produced their own Laser printer that was relatively cheap. I think Calamus was the best software Compared to the standard PC it was much faster using the same software on GEM. The Amiga was basically useless for productivity in the basic a500 512k configuration because of all the disk swapping. It was more a games console. Once you get to the Mac SE with an HD that was lovely but many times the price of an ST

[@ITGuyinaction]

👍🍺

[@mr.painkiller4908]

Which Peroxide percentage are you using? And do you dilute it? Sorry for bad english😞 Also: What are u using for cleaning the Key-caps? Thanks a lot for an aswer!🙂

[@retrobitstv]

For immersion retrobrighting I use 40 Volume stabilized liquid peroxide and dilute it quite a bit, probably 10-to-1. I don't use precise measurements but the more concentrated the peroxide the faster you'll see results. I normally use a small amount of dish soap in warm water to clean keycaps and other plastic parts beforehand.

[@mr.painkiller4908]

@@retrobitstv Thanx a lot for the answer, that helps me qite a bit! Just to get it right 1 part peroxide to 9 parts water? I´ll give it a try 👍

[@GEORGE-jf2vz]

I wish all the systems I have worked on had such a "hard life". That looked almost like new old stock.

[@GORF_EMPIRE]

You did not mention the two other chips...one is the GLUE and the other a Blitter?

[@kevcall]

Blitter not in his STF.. Introduce in STe (and maybe earlier in mega-St.. I forget)

[@SuperVstech]

You probably have a shielded grounded vacuum for cleaning circuit boards, but you should mention to your viewers to NEVER use a normal shop vac or similar vacuum on computers… static discharge will destroy electronics!!!

[@itsyeeoledskoolfurry3208]

What is a 5150 please? And thanks. I do not know what that reference is.

[@retrobitstv]

In addition to being a.model of Dell computer (and also the original IBM PC), in this case I was referring to the Van Halen album :)

[@itsyeeoledskoolfurry3208]

@@retrobitstv Awesome. Thanks muchness.

[@darkwinter6028]

From here, the cicadas sound like a leaking air compressor.

[@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer]

Is it just me, or does Jack Tramiel look like John Madden?

[@stephenkennedy6358]

I always hear how the Atari has a faster clock speed, it doesn't matter. The amiga was still faster because the cpu was not burdened with lackluster custom chips. The custom chips including sound was superior to Atari's and could do its magic without burdening the cpu. Don't get me going about the Atari's lack of a blitter or copper. As far as the price difference you get what you pay for.

[@kevcall]

Amiga better for 2d games, STe shrunk the gap a bit, but too late to make a difference. 3D games on ST faster framerates, but sound better on Amiga; but that has no midi.. So different strengths for each.

[@stephenkennedy6358]

@@kevcall I agree with you on 2D, but neither computer could really be called 3D. You could simulate it somewhat with tricks using perspective. 3D really wasn't a thing that actually worked with good performance until the Voodoo chipset came out for the PC.

[@kevcall]

@@stephenkennedy6358 well I may have to disagree with you there, the 3d games were '3d' using integer maths using many of the methods any GPU does nowadays. I've written 3d routines on 68k platforms and now on current embedded hardware. Of course there were cheats and shortcuts to get the framerates (barely) sensible but there were a fair few decent 3d games available at that time: Battle Command, Starglider 2, No Second Prize & Microprose F1GP jump to mind immediately. But yes my first Voodoo (1) board was a relevation although I was too busy in those years with work (telecoms s/w) to explore what it could do.

[@stephenkennedy6358]

@@kevcall again performance

[@LuisDiaz-uu7xg]

Hello Thanks for your video. If someone wants to play with, I have a very clean Atari 520 stfm to sell

[@P5ychoFox]

Atari ST plastic is getting so brittle it’ll break if you even look at it.

[@kevin34ct]

GFA BASIC is much better than the Atari Basic

[@WyMustIGo]

ST - Still Trash